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Thread: PS3 at 24 million units sold, PSP 57 million

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    drowning in medals Ed Oscuro's Avatar
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    Calling the GameCube bad because it didn't have enough games doesn't fly by me. In the time I had mine (first picked it up when it was bundled with the GameBoy Player for a discount) I never had enough money to even buy all I wanted, so the lack of games is not a credible argument by me. The games I got simply weren't available on the other systems (at least not optimally - Resident Evil 4, REmake, and Zero were all either downgraded or no-shows on other systems). That said, I did feel that I didn't get much value out of it - nowadays I'd almost rather have a PS2 for the (much) larger library.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cloud121 View Post
    Fixed.

    Okay, I wouldn't say the SFC was pitiful, but with the exception of Super Metroid and Demon's Crest, the MegaDrive owned it in every way. Include the Mega CD and 32X, and it's not even close.

    Super Famicom does not deserve all the heaping praise it gets. The GameCube is vastly underrated. I just pretend the Wii doesn't exist (Even though I stood in line on launch day, and dropped $600 for the console and most of the launch titles).
    hurdurrrrr Contra III, Super Castlevania IV, Ninja Warriors Again, Pocky & Rocky 1 & 2, R-Type III, yeah totally not worth it (and that's just non-Capcom, non-first party stuff that's been on my mind lately; with the GC I struggle to list more than that many good games for it period - basically the Zelda games, the Resident Evil games, and Metroid Prime 1 & 2)

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    Kirby (Level 13) j_factor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by duffmanth View Post
    I'm not saying the Wii is tanking right now, or will in the near future, but it's starting to level off and really level off in Japan.
    Have you really looked at Japanese sales numbers? They're just focused on portables. The Wii is still outselling PS3 and 360 in Japan.

    Quote Originally Posted by BetaWolf47 View Post
    If you're going to get every good game, Wii does actually have plenty to offer. When I see people discussing Wii, all they discuss is the shovelware and the Wii _____ series, turning a blind eye to everything else.
    Agreed. I think there's a big "mindset problem", where people are convinced that there's nothing there without really looking at the games available. De Blob is a genuinely great game, and maybe it would've sold better if not for people's attitudes.

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    Quote Originally Posted by j_factor View Post
    ... Agreed. I think there's a big "mindset problem", where people are convinced that there's nothing there without really looking at the games available. De Blob is a genuinely great game, and maybe it would've sold better if not for people's attitudes.
    I agree as well, Wii has plenty of great stuff on it both DLC and at brick & mortar - despite the completely disproportionate amount of garbage shovelware. Certainly enough to classify it as a great system and one worth owning ...

    ... however the "mindset" that you're referring to I think happens, at least in part from the experience of trying to "shop" for software at retail.

    Until retail outlets start sorting the software by shovelware / non shovelware categories (which isn't ever going to happen) it can be a massive fucking headache to sift through the trash to find 3rd party gems ... unless Wii users are ultra vigilant online news/reviews hounds like us, it might be impossible for them to know the difference in quality between a "No More Heroes" and a "Ninjabread Man" (or whatever two games of divergent quality you'd like to compare).

    I personally spend countless hours online reading up on gaming news and more often than not I'm immediately turned off by the experience of even attempting to just browse the "new releases" for Wii at a Gamestop, Best Buy, or whatever retail outlet keeps deep stock on Wii software.
    "And the book says: 'We may be through with the past, but the past ain't through with us.'"


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    Peach (Level 3) duffmanth's Avatar
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    I know the Wii is still outselling the PS3 and 360 in Japan, the PS2 is probably still outselling the 360 over there to, all I'm saying is the Wii isn't selling what it was in Japan either because of market saturation or people are just getting tired of waiting for AAA games to come out for it, who knows?

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    drowning in medals Ed Oscuro's Avatar
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    I guess what it comes down to is whether you're made of money and have lots of time to spend with any given system...the PS3 and 360 certainly have lots of faux-movie third person extravaganzas, but the Wii has:

    - Madworld
    - Contra ReBirth

    Not so sure about Madworld but ReBirth almost makes the system a must-have in my view. That said I'd get a 360 or PS3 first because I like those kinds of games (that said their graphics are looking severely dated to me - PC foreva).

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    There's a lot of fanboyism in this thread. I don't know how it got to SNES vs. MD then back to Wii is bad vs. Wii is awesome.

    PS3 getting to 24 million is nice, but what's really nice for Sony is that the PS2 is that they're working on 150 million PS2s, and the console shows no signs of even getting outsold by the PS3 in a month anytime soon.

    Before this console generation, Sony chased me off the bandwagon with their terrible price points and not seeming to care about innovation, while Nintendo gave us something cheap and innovative, and all about "It's about games, not graphics." So I got a Wii first. Wii isn't *all* shovelware, just mostly. Mario Galaxy is a superb game. Zack and Wiki is a great game. Most of the other games are eh... Granted I haven't yet played Mad World or a couple other high-profile Wii titles.

    I did get a PS3 after they knocked $200 off the price, and for me it is a better system with better games. I still think Sony is way too prude with its prices and business model. The PSP Go for how much? When you can buy an original PSP for $100 less? Inexcusable. But "caring about the fans" aside, PS3 is a beautiful system. Uncharted and Valkyria Chronicles are probably my two favorite new franchises of the past five years.

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    Peach (Level 3) duffmanth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snapple View Post
    There's a lot of fanboyism in this thread. I don't know how it got to SNES vs. MD then back to Wii is bad vs. Wii is awesome.

    PS3 getting to 24 million is nice, but what's really nice for Sony is that the PS2 is that they're working on 150 million PS2s, and the console shows no signs of even getting outsold by the PS3 in a month anytime soon.

    Before this console generation, Sony chased me off the bandwagon with their terrible price points and not seeming to care about innovation, while Nintendo gave us something cheap and innovative, and all about "It's about games, not graphics." So I got a Wii first. Wii isn't *all* shovelware, just mostly. Mario Galaxy is a superb game. Zack and Wiki is a great game. Most of the other games are eh... Granted I haven't yet played Mad World or a couple other high-profile Wii titles.

    I did get a PS3 after they knocked $200 off the price, and for me it is a better system with better games. I still think Sony is way too prude with its prices and business model. The PSP Go for how much? When you can buy an original PSP for $100 less? Inexcusable. But "caring about the fans" aside, PS3 is a beautiful system. Uncharted and Valkyria Chronicles are probably my two favorite new franchises of the past five years.
    I just wish the Nintendo of the mid eighties to the mid nineties existed today. That was the Nintendo that I and many others grew up with. No matter what your gaming tastes were, the NES and SNES had you covered. I know people are going to say that they had a strangle hold on licensing rights back then, and that's one reason why they had so many great games at the time, but they need to start getting back some of those core gamers that they've lost to Sony and MS. Starting with the N64, Nintendo has lost a lot of those fans to Sony, and has made no attempt to get them back. I will always have a soft spot for the Nintendo of old, but what they've turned into the last 10-15 years I just can't get into.

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    Stuck in 1998 Cloud121's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leo_Ames View Post
    Considering the Super Famicom easily outsold the MegaDrive in units sold, and that the MegaDrive wasn't even able to surpass the PC Engine, I have little doubt you're wrong. Worldwide, Nintendo's console also outsold Sega's. Clearly there are plenty of people that disagree with your assessment that manages to somehow dismiss the entire library of a console as only having two titles that aren't pitiful.

    You just have to look at hardware prices for them today to see which has retained greater popularity, Sega's console is much cheaper than Nintendo's on the resell market despite there being 20 million more Super Nintendo/Super Famicom consoles produced.
    So you're basing it on sales? Sales don't constitute a better console, as the Wii has demonstrated (in my eyes), and as several others in this thread have stated.

    There's no way one can be unbiased and like one of the two consoles and not the other. They're very similar in terms of the gaming they provide and both offer different advantages and disadvantages that lead them to complementing each other nicely. It's an impossibility to love the library of one and not find countless examples of excellent titles on the other.
    I very much prefer my MegaDrive over my Super Famicom, but I don't necessarily hate the SFC. Demon's Crest, Super Metroid, Super Castlevania IV, Super Mario World, F-Zero. DKC series, Super Star Wars Trilogy, and Final Fantasy IV are all amazing games, but with the exception of Demon's Crest, and Super Metroid, none of those really truly WOWED me like several MegaDrive games have. Demon's Crest and Super Metroid are amazing, and breathtaking experiences that are EXCLUSIVE to the Super Famicom. Hell, Super Metroid is the single greatest game ever made. I never said I hate the Super Famicom or it's library. I just feel as though the MD's library was vastly superior, and when you factor in the Mega CD and 32X, it;s even better.

    I personally prefer my multi-platform titles on my MegaDrive.

    Yes, I am a Sega fanboy, I will admit. I just think the Super Famicom is Nintendo's "worst" console. I love my NES just as much as my Master System, my N64 just as much as my Saturn, and my GameCube just as much as my Dreamcast. I don't know what it is, but there's just something about the Super Famicom that doesn't appeal to me as much as the other Nintendo consoles. It's a great console, I just prefer my MD/MCD/32X much more. Maybe it's because my MegaDrive was my first console. Maybe it's because my Saturn that really turned me onto Sega back in 2000 (Was a Sony fanboy growing up), or the fact that the 32X is what got me into collecting. I don't know. Again, both consoles are great, I just prefer my Sega products.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ed Oscuro View Post
    with the GC I struggle to list more than that many good games for it period - basically the Zelda games, the Resident Evil games, and Metroid Prime 1 & 2)
    P.N. 03 (My personal favorite game of all-time after Super Metroid), Rogue Squadron II, Rogue Squadron III, Star Fox Assault, Killer7, Wave Race Blue Storm, Fire Emblem: Path of Radiance, Super Monkey Ball, Tales of Symphonia, Baten Kaitos, Baten Kaitos Origins, Odama, Eternal Darkness, Star Fox Adventures.

    I'm not the biggest Super Famicom fan, but I LOVE my GameCube.

    *GASP* I'm a Sega fanboy, but my two all-time favorite games are Nintendo exclusives?!
    Last edited by Cloud121; 08-04-2009 at 04:16 PM.
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    Kirby (Level 13) Leo_A's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mimi Nakamura View Post
    I think you'll find that the Mega Drive outsold the PC Engine. In Europe, the Mega Drive was a huge success.
    He never said Super Nintendo or Sega Genesis, he explicity called Nintendo's 16 bit console the Super Famicom. So unless he's the type that views everything in videogaming that is different internationally than in Japan as automatically inferior (Including something like a console name) and uses a console name that isn't utilized in his region as a result, I made the only assumption I could that he was talking about the Japanese marketplace. The only region where those two console names were both utilized was there.

    So the only logical thing I could assume was he was just talking about the Japanese marketplace, where the MegaDrive was a distant third in the market, millions behind the PC Engine.

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    Quote Originally Posted by duffmanth View Post
    I just wish the Nintendo of the mid eighties to the mid nineties existed today. That was the Nintendo that I and many others grew up with. No matter what your gaming tastes were, the NES and SNES had you covered. I know people are going to say that they had a strangle hold on licensing rights back then, and that's one reason why they had so many great games at the time, but they need to start getting back some of those core gamers that they've lost to Sony and MS. Starting with the N64, Nintendo has lost a lot of those fans to Sony, and has made no attempt to get them back. I will always have a soft spot for the Nintendo of old, but what they've turned into the last 10-15 years I just can't get into.
    I've heard this nostalgia-blinded comment so many times and laughed every time. If Nintendo were the same today, here's how things would be:
    -Companies would only be allowed to release 5 games a year
    -Nintendo would still be stingy with licensing things
    -Nintendo would only allow a certain amount of copies of a 3rd-party game to be manufactured
    -Nintendo would have a monopoly on price points, meaning they could set their own games for $60 and 3rd-party games at $30
    -We'd have considerably below standard hardware (NES was weaker than even average systems like SMS)

    People are too apologetic of the cruel 80's Nintendo company. Their practices rivaled that of a corrupt monarch.

    They let up with their cruelty with N64 and Gamecube and still continued to pump out core, non-casual titles, and like with Sega, the core gaming community abandoned them.
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    I don't know about this vs. that or apples vs. stepladders, but I'm kinda partial to video games. When I see a good game, I'll probably buy it. I could give a rats nutsack who makes it.
    A good game is a good game is a good game.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BetaWolf47 View Post
    I've heard this nostalgia-blinded comment so many times and laughed every time. If Nintendo were the same today, here's how things would be:
    -Companies would only be allowed to release 5 games a year
    -Nintendo would still be stingy with licensing things
    -Nintendo would only allow a certain amount of copies of a 3rd-party game to be manufactured
    -Nintendo would have a monopoly on price points, meaning they could set their own games for $60 and 3rd-party games at $30
    -We'd have considerably below standard hardware (NES was weaker than even average systems like SMS)

    People are too apologetic of the cruel 80's Nintendo company. Their practices rivaled that of a corrupt monarch.

    They let up with their cruelty with N64 and Gamecube and still continued to pump out core, non-casual titles, and like with Sega, the core gaming community abandoned them.
    Those things are all true, but it still doesn't change the fact that, for me at least, Nintendo just isn't the company they used to be, and that may be a bad or a good thing depending on how you look it?

    True Nintendo had some very questionable business practices back then, but it still doesn't change the fact that they just don't have the same appeal for me that they used to.

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    The PSP go and the Psp is better position for overtaking the Nintendo DSi than the PS 3 is for overtaking the Wii.

    The DSi for downloading software appears to very limited in genres and the quality varies. I don't own DSi for that reason besides wanting it to go down in price.

    DSiware basically has Puzzle games, Simulation games, and application programs to download mostly at this time. The application downloads are a joke with the amount of clock and calculator programs to download for the most part based on reviews.

    The DSi is doesn't have a lot 3rd party game releases for DSiware. Currently 22 out of 30 DSiware games or applications were published by Nintendo.
    Last edited by 7th lutz; 08-04-2009 at 06:10 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by duffmanth View Post
    all I'm saying is the Wii isn't selling what it was in Japan either because of market saturation or people are just getting tired of waiting for AAA games to come out for it, who knows?
    Noticed there's a big fat recession going on? People aren't spending what they used to.

    It's become much more of a portables market here anyway as everybody and their dog have a DS or PSP.

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    These sales numbers do not truly reflect how many systems are in homes.

    It does not reflect real sales.

    It also does not reflect how many of the "sales" are due to people who had to return items, or buy it over again due to failure. I work in a game store and see how many people buy and re buy the same system because of poor quality consoles. XBOX 360 infamous RROD, dead pixels/ power problems/ etc. on PSP or the delicate PS2 Slim who likes to circle scratch games (Sometimes right out of the box). Don't forget the BlueRay Disc scratching the LASER in the PS3. There are many problems with many consoles... the Wii appears to be the one with the least problem, aside from the HD burning out in the first run of the systems.

    However I understand why no company would want that information available.

    These numbers are under too many variables to be very accurate.
    Last edited by Typhoon_Timmy; 08-04-2009 at 06:28 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BetaWolf47 View Post
    If you're going to get every good game, Wii does actually have plenty to offer. When I see people discussing Wii, all they discuss is the shovelware and the Wii _____ series, turning a blind eye to everything else.
    The Wii undoubtedly has some great games. The problem with the Wii is the controls. At first they are fun and interesting, but for the most part they are so poorly executed that they wind up ruining the gaming experience. I'm so d*** sick of fighting with the controls and WiiMote detection that I'm on the verge of selling mine (as soon as I can get a decent price...the market is flooded with people getting rid of theirs right now). All it is to me now is an upscalling Gamecube.
    Last edited by backguard; 08-04-2009 at 07:02 PM.
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    Stuck in 1998 Cloud121's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leo_Ames View Post
    So the only logical thing I could assume was he was just talking about the Japanese marketplace, where the MegaDrive was a distant third in the market, millions behind the PC Engine.
    I only own the American consoles, but I still refer to the Genesis, Super Nintendo, and Turbo Grafx by their Japanese names. I just think they sound better (though lately I've been using both PC Engine and Turbo Grafx).

    Back on topic. I've been considering selling my Wii on numerous occasions, but I put a lot of money into Virtual Console shortly after launch, and No More Heroes 2 is coming out, so I can't sell it. Not too mention, it was my first console launch, so there's sentimental value as well.
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    Peach (Level 3) duffmanth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smork View Post
    Noticed there's a big fat recession going on? People aren't spending what they used to.

    It's become much more of a portables market here anyway as everybody and their dog have a DS or PSP.
    Well no shit there's a recession going on, but the Wii has been selling huge during most of that time in Japan, at least from what I read on gaming sites. I still think it's slowing down there more because people are getting tired of waiting for games to come out for it, or the market is saturated with it.

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    Stuck in 1998 Cloud121's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cobra Commander View Post
    I don't know about this vs. that or apples vs. stepladders, but I'm kinda partial to video games. When I see a good game, I'll probably buy it. I could give a rats nutsack who makes it.
    A good game is a good game is a good game.
    This. Though the issue for me is what console to play it on (If it's not exclusive).
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    Reticulating Splines BetaWolf47's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by duffmanth View Post
    Those things are all true, but it still doesn't change the fact that, for me at least, Nintendo just isn't the company they used to be, and that may be a bad or a good thing depending on how you look it?

    True Nintendo had some very questionable business practices back then, but it still doesn't change the fact that they just don't have the same appeal for me that they used to.
    I ask you, why? Could you provide some examples for me? Because when I see these arguments on other boards, they all revolve around nostalgia and double standards. For example:

    -Gamecube sucks because it only sold ~25 million units. Forget that 4/10 of the highest rated games of that generation were on Gamecube.
    -Wii sucks because the games suck. Forget that it's selling like hotcakes.
    -Wii's big launch title was a bunch of shallow sports games. Forget that NES had the same problem. Forget that the highest-rated launch game on NES just took a mere port from a past system, just like Wii.

    Nintendo still has great first-party titles, and the best platformers around.

    Now, I know everyone here is above the fanboys and trolls you see on GameFAQs (the people who caused me to turn into the zealot you see here x_x), including you, duff. Could you just provide a well thought-out response?
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