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Thread: Official Super Retro Trio Review & Preorder Thread

  1. #41
    Key (Level 9) Satoshi_Matrix's Avatar
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    Oh yeah. I guess I should share with you guys.
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    Once this thread rolls over to page 3, I'll start posting the full review.
    check out my classic gaming review site: http://satoshimatrix.wordpress.com/

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    Quote Originally Posted by Satoshi_Matrix View Post
    Once this thread rolls over to page 3, I'll start posting the full review.
    Satoshi, I saw your Genesis video. Pity I have to mod the system to get the Virtua Racing to work. I need to ask, I noticed you had SMS games on your Everdrive MD. Do they work? You did not test them in your video. Also does SMS require the cartirdge port jumper mod? I should be getting a Power Base Mini Converter but it's blocked up in my Retron5 preorder. Be cool if it worked. Even the official Genesis 3 couldn't do that.

    And how the heck did you dismantle the system? The unit I got from DAScheap (which I later had to return) had the controller ports glued down so I couldn't remove the PCB.
    Last edited by stardust4ever; 05-10-2014 at 05:44 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by stardust4ever View Post
    Satoshi, I saw your Genesis video. Pity I have to mod the system to get the Virtua Racing to work. I need to ask, I noticed you had SMS games on your Everdrive MD. Do they work? You did not test them in your video. Also does SMS require the cartirdge port jumper mod? I should be getting a Power Base Mini Converter but it's blocked up in my Retron5 preorder. Be cool if it worked. Even the official Genesis 3 couldn't do that.

    And how the heck did you dismantle the system? The unit I got from DAScheap (which I later had to return) had the controller ports glued down so I couldn't remove the PCB.
    But the mod is as basic as it can possibly get: solder one wire along two pins. Even the RetroDuo audio dampener is more complicated.

    Yes, SMS games do work via the Mega EverDrive on the Super Retro Trio (and so do real SMS games via a pin adapter without any need to mess with anything, but you get slight graphical glitches on TCT-6801 based GOACs due to VDP glitches that interact with the overscan field. You'll get things like black bars and sprite anomalies that don't effect gameplay.

    But even if there were no glitches at all, the Genesis hardware can only run most SMS games, can't run the YM2413, and also, I feel weird using a Genesis controller when playing SMS games. I'm much happier using a real SMS instead.

    Keep in mind the Power base Mini isn't really anything special - all it is is a pin adapter. It doesn't actually contain any SMS hardware or anything. It's up to the Genesis to do that.
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    Cherry (Level 1) stardust4ever's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Satoshi_Matrix View Post
    But the mod is as basic as it can possibly get: solder one wire along two pins. Even the RetroDuo audio dampener is more complicated.
    Believe me, if can I design my own controller schematics, I can solder two pins together with a wire no problem. I'm not that dense. The said pins are on the underside of the PCB but the problem is getting the PCB out of the Super Retro Trio with the controller ports glued down. I haven't opened my second unit yet, but if it's built like the one I recieved from DasCheap, the controller ports will be glued to the front panel.

    I'm taking a brake from this video review crap. When I do it, I tend to ramble too much without getting my point across, plus I'm tired, so I'll let my Super Retro Trio sit for a few days. Satoshi, you do a much better job reviewing it anyway. I look forward to your NES and SNES videos.
    Last edited by stardust4ever; 05-10-2014 at 11:42 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by stardust4ever View Post
    The said pins are on the underside of the PCB but the problem is getting the PCB out of the Super Retro Trio with the controller ports glued down.
    What are you talking about? The SRT is pretty simple to get access to the pcbs. Unscrew, remove the lid, unscrew the SNES controller panel pcb, push back and lift up, then unscrew the NES board, the SNES board, and then the Genesis board. Lift out and place on a non static surface. I've done it several times now. There's nothing to it. No glue or anything, that's just to hold ribbon cables together.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Satoshi_Matrix View Post
    What are you talking about? The SRT is pretty simple to get access to the pcbs. Unscrew, remove the lid, unscrew the SNES controller panel pcb, push back and lift up, then unscrew the NES board, the SNES board, and then the Genesis board. Lift out and place on a non static surface. I've done it several times now. There's nothing to it. No glue or anything, that's just to hold ribbon cables together.
    The unit I received from DAS Cheap had the controller ports glued to the front panel. It sucked.

    Screenshots from my second YouTube video, "NES Controller FAIL". The white goop all over the backs of the controller ports is glue of some sort.
    Click image for larger version. 

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    So far, I haven't opened the second unit yet. Hopefully it's like yours where you claim there's no "glue".

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    huh. mine wasnt like that at all.

    What even is that glue doing? It doesn't appear to be connect to the sockets but to the mounts. Even if there is glue present, that shouldn't effect removal of the pcbs as long as they they don't cover the screwholes.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Satoshi_Matrix View Post
    huh. mine wasnt like that at all.

    What even is that glue doing? It doesn't appear to be connect to the sockets but to the mounts. Even if there is glue present, that shouldn't effect removal of the pcbs as long as they they don't cover the screwholes.
    The controller ports were soldered to the PCB and glued to the front panel. Some of the screws holding the front panel to the bottom of the chassis were blocked by the PCB, so it was impossible to remove the PCB without breaking something. I have a theory that the glue may have interfered with the controller port connection somehow, and may have been what caused the NES controller to go ape ****. Either way, something screwy about that unit I received from Das Cheap, despite the fact it had a better and slightly more compatible NOAC. either way, that particular Super Retro Trio shipped back to Retrobit a few days ago via Fed Ex.

    I'm going to open my new Super Retro Trio when I get around to it; hopefully it will be like yours and I won't have trouble accessing the underbelly of the PCB to add that wire.
    Last edited by stardust4ever; 05-11-2014 at 08:22 PM.

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    Satoshi, why are you waiting for page 3? If you won't post it, somebody else will:

    Originally posted in the Retron5 thread by mistake. Next reply will start page 3.
    Quote Originally Posted by stardust4ever View Post






    Because somebody needed to post it since Satoshi apparently hasn't.

    Cool the Genesis side can be modded to add support for Virtua Racing.

    Amazing that Retrobit actually put an NTSC CIC lockout clone into the SNES daughterboard. This allows the Super Retro Trio to play 100% of NTSC US and JAP games, including all of the SA-1 games, but disallows any PAL games from operating. So, the lockout adds compatibility for like 2% of NTSC/JP games to run but eliminates virtually all PAL games from being playable, as well as most bootlegs.

    Given their emphasis on the region switch for the Genesis, it seems strange that Retrobit did not at least have a toggle switch to disable the NTSC CIC and allow most PAL games at least the opportunity to boot. They basically traded 2% of NTSC games for like 100% of PAL games. But I'm not complaining about the ability to play all SMRPG carts, as well as both Kirbys and a few imports, like Jikkyō Oshaberi Parodius, which I do own and tested working.

    Still sucks for people in PAL land. Seems like somebody needs to mod this puppy for PAL support, z...
    Last edited by stardust4ever; 05-12-2014 at 03:18 AM.

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    No, the middle finger's at you. I do not appreciate you posting my content, especially after I told you what my plans were.

    Anyway, finally at page 3. The NES part I've had the most trouble with, as sadly this NOAC and board configuration appears to be completely identical to Retro-Bit's RetroPort and not their superior Gen-X or even RetroDuo NOAC. I've had to work to fix a few problems, while others there's nothing I can do anything about to fix.

    So here we go! Part 4 is now done.

    Enjoy.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8qMbtjUBeO8
    Last edited by Satoshi_Matrix; 05-12-2014 at 11:23 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Satoshi_Matrix View Post
    No, the middle finger's at you. I do not appreciate you posting my content, especially after I told you what my plans were.
    It's been posted on other forums already. In fact I copied the links from another members post on Atariage.

    BTW, nice bra in the thumbnail!

    I noticed you mention modding the console (like all clones) to get Castlevania III running. Ironically, it's not necessary to mod the console to run Castlevania III from an Everdrive. You should at least footnote that fact for people who may be interested in playing the game using a flashcart, as I demonstrated previously.

    It's also worth noting that a single NPN transistor and two resistors can be substituted for an single inverter, if a 7404 chip isn't available on hand. They don't sell 7404s at Radio Shack, after all. For digital logic, a 100k resistor is connected between the input and the base, and a 10k resistor connected between VCC and the collector. Ground is connected to the emitter and output to the collector. When the voltage on the base is higher than the dropoff voltage (typically 0.6-0.8V for silicone) of the BE junction on the transistor, the transistor conducts and the output is pulled low. When the input voltage is below the 0.6-0.8v, the transistor inhibits any current and the output is held high by the resistor. It's generally desirable for digital switching applications to keep the input resistor no more than 10x larger than the output resistor. This ensures the transistor continues oprating in the hard saturation region (either "on" or "off") which is necessary for digital logic applications.

    I'm also curious if the Castlevania III fix or the Virtua Racing fix break any existing games. Probably not, but it's always a distinct possibility that fixing one thing breaks something else. I plan on doing the Virtua Racing mod because I own that game. Also the NES composite brightness looks fine to me on both my HDTV and CRT, so no need to bridge the surface mount resistor unless you have display issues.
    Last edited by stardust4ever; 05-13-2014 at 01:02 AM.

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    Yeah there are several alternatives, but who the hell would shop at radio shack for electronics parts? Just go to an actual electronics store, or buy online. hex inverters aren't difficult to find.

    and no, the fixes do not break other things. Why would you even think that.

    and as for the composite being "fine", well, you're wrong. again.

    the 750 R83 resister darkens the NES composite output considerably, and also alters the visible NES pallet. To see the difference without actually removing it, unscrew the lid off the srt and insert an NES game and turn it on. remove the composite input and press it against the right side of R83 and look at your tv. As long as you hold it steady, you'll see what the results would be if you removed that. Hold it to the left side for a direct comparison.

    I really am growing tired of your idiotic questions and statements. if you don't know what you're talking about, then don't say anything at all. I'm sorry, but my patience with you really has about run out.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Satoshi_Matrix View Post
    Yeah there are several alternatives, but who the hell would shop at radio shack for electronics parts? Just go to an actual electronics store, or buy online. hex inverters aren't difficult to find.

    I really am growing tired of your idiotic questions and statements. if you don't know what you're talking about, then don't say anything at all. I'm sorry, but my patience with you really has about run out.
    Satoshi, not everyone has an electronics parts store in town. We used to have a place called Southern Electronics in my hometown, but it's out of business. Websites like Mouser, Jameco, Parts Express, and others exist, but it can be a pain to use them. So what if a 7404 is 30 cents at Jameco? I'd have to pay a $5 surcharge for orders below $10, pay $3-something s/h, then wait 3 days for the package to arrive. Options are even more severely limited I assume for Canadians such as yourself. But they're among the few suppliers that don't have minimum orders of say 1000 units, which is useless for hobbiests. Radio Shack is in everyone's back yard, and yes they do have a parts bin selling overpriced components in little baggies, as well as connectors, wire, solder, tools, and other supplies. It's hella more convienient to the hobbiest to drive around the block and pick up parts they can use, than to butcher old electronics or place an order, pay shipping and processing fees, and wait 3-4 days for their parts baggie to arrive. I read in another forum someone attempting to do some hobby mod that needed a spare 7404, so the pulled it from a perfectly functional spare NES they had laying around. I almost wanted to cry for the unneeded death of that poor NES...

    As for the personal attacks, lets tone it down a notch. I too am growing tired of the endless arguements and debates, so let's just agree to disagree. But I do not appreciate your logging into AtariAge just to insult my name. Take a look at the last page or so of this thread. It's a train wreck, and we're both equally responsible for it. So if I agree to lay off the personal attacks, I expect you to do the same. Truce? Other wise, we're just
    Last edited by stardust4ever; 05-13-2014 at 03:58 AM.

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    The fifth and final video in my Super Retro Trio coverage is now up.

    Find out what my overall thoughts on this latest clone from Retro-Bit.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZHXIGETSDU
    check out my classic gaming review site: http://satoshimatrix.wordpress.com/

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    Quote Originally Posted by Satoshi_Matrix View Post
    The fifth and final video in my Super Retro Trio coverage is now up.

    Find out what my overall thoughts on this latest clone from Retro-Bit.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZHXIGETSDU
    Thumbs up on the Master System. I'll be getting use out of that when my Power Base Mini Converter comes (it's currently bundled with my Retron5 preorder).

    Look forward to more dualing reviews when Retron5 comes out!

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    I've been contemplating buying a Power Base Converter, but once you hear SMS games through a YM2413 FM synthesizer, you'll never want to listen to them again through PSG, which is all the Genesis hardware is capable of. Much better off with an actual Master System modded than the Genesis with a pin adapter.

    RetroN5 will be a pain. Overview, NES/Famicom, SNES/SFC, Genesis/MD/SMS, GB/GBC/GBA, and final thoughts. And that's if I don't decide that GBA should be its own video, which for time may happen.

    Also, I'm kinda concerned I've have a lot less to say. Emulation is a totally different beast to hardware clones. The emulation on the Ouya is great, but it's a whole lot less interesting than NOACs, GOACs, SNESOCs, etc.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Satoshi_Matrix View Post
    I've been contemplating buying a Power Base Converter, but once you hear SMS games through a YM2413 FM synthesizer, you'll never want to listen to them again through PSG, which is all the Genesis hardware is capable of. Much better off with an actual Master System modded than the Genesis with a pin adapter.
    Didn't only Japamese Mark III games use the FM synthesis chip, kinda like NES didn't get expansion audio? And like Famicom, Mark III games have a different pinout. I'm not enough into SMS to buy a stand alone console that I'll barely use, but if US/EU games play on an unmodded Genesis 1 without issue the same as they would on an unmodded SMS, then I'll just stick to Genesis with an adapter. Power Base Mini looks a lot cleaner and cheaper than the rare and bulky Power Base Converters.

    Then again, I finally got an AV Famicom because I was sick of dealing with fugly adapters in my Toaster, not to mention the occasional oddly shaped carts that didn't fit, forcing me to use the old Yobo clone with swapped duty cycles. I already had a nice collection of Fami carts before I ever got it though.

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    Quote Originally Posted by stardust4ever View Post
    Didn't only Japamese Mark III games use the FM synthesis chip, kinda like NES didn't get expansion audio? And like Famicom, Mark III games have a different pinout.
    Yes, but the majority of these games retain their FM functionality through to the Master System and will run with FM sound if it's available (modded in). Essentially they two sets of soundtracks - one PSG only, the other FM.

    In addition, there's a bunch of western developed Master System games that also support the chip even though the western Master System never officially got the YM2413.

    Mark III games do have a different pinout yes and require an adapter if you want to run them on a North American or European Master System or run North American or European games on a Japanese Mark III.

    The Genesis does not use the Ym2413 and cannot be modded to run it as it would interfere with it's own FM sound chip which is the successor and better, but can't produce the same sounds, and therefore can only do the PSG crap.

    If you're casual into Master System, the MegaDrive is fine, but just know you're getting an inferior experience doing it that way.
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    I just bought one of those SRT. Sadly I also have one that have glitchy NES/famicom audio. ACE made a small list of games that have the audio glitch, those are only from the games he tried. Maybe it can help people test for the glitch.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ace View Post
    The NOAC is hit-or-miss as some Super Retro Trios don't have NOACs that hit false notes (we're not talking reversed duty cycles here, we're talking outright incorrect notes).

    So here's the list:

    -Contra (very rare, but it can happen)
    -The Hunt for Red October
    -Snake's Revenge
    -Top Gun (may hit random false notes)
    -Side Pocket (this game hits false notes almost non-stop)
    -Image Fight (randomly spews out false notes after an armored ship is hit)
    -Castlevania II
    -Vindicators (emits false notes while shooting)
    -Galaxy 5000 (random false notes during races)
    -Gradius II
    -Castlevania III (although the game is unplayable, the sound test is still functional and A LOT of false notes are hit here)
    -Akumajou Densetsu (this one is playable and while the VRC6 is inaudible due to the lack of expansion audio mixing, you can clearly tell the 2A03 clone is hitting many incorrect notes)
    -Rad Racer II (the game itself has SEVERE graphical errors but is playable, and yes, it hits false notes at times)

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