Why would he say that?
Why would he say that?
"Four o'clock and all is well.....wish I was in bed, Sir."
-- Guard in the Imperial City, Oblivion
Few things.
Am I the only person who has a hard time believing people who say that? The few moments where I actually have had a rather busy life, I was usually too busy living to mention it. Minor quibble. Moving on...Originally Posted by RCM
I don't think this thread should've been locked outright. It was an interesting read, on a few different levels. However, I do think the thread should be locked now, as all meaningful conversation has long since passed, and is now thinning out into banal explanatories. The horse has raced, and now it's done. It's time to put 'er down. Tis just my opinion.
But why lock it? I've seen people in other threads mentioning that they are buying VGC based on my review. With over 1,000 views, this can only be a good thing for them.
Instead of criticizing my criticism, why don't the people who are claiming that it's nothing but an attack post a counter to the points that I made? Have any of you detractors actually read the mag? Even looked at it? No? Yes?
If yes, why don't you point out your own likes and dislikes? If you think it's perfect as is, say that. If nothing else, let's keep this on the positive track and steer it back to the discussion of gaming mags in general.
Manci Games - For the Retro Gamers of the World (RIP)
Home of Manci Games Retrogaming Magazine
www.mancigames.com
Why don't you wait to read #2 and then let us know what you think the answer to that is? I'd be interested to hear your views, Lenny.
Manci Games - For the Retro Gamers of the World (RIP)
Home of Manci Games Retrogaming Magazine
www.mancigames.com
I think at least one sees it my way, this is from meston:You are speculating about motivations. Only the two guys involved know best about innuendos, slight remarks inteneded as late revenges, and the little conflicts of the past. If noone else sees it, how can you, and then there is no justification to lock a thread becasue no harm is done.
I don't care if you or anyone else sees it my way. The world is round.You're not objective, Jaysen. As POG pointed out, considering our ass-ugly history in these forums, absolutely everything you have to say about VGC is biased. Your "review" is nothing but a transparent series of insults.
You speak of "having no beef," but you keep coming back to these forums again and again for no other reason than to keep our "feud" going. In fact, your last post before this thread was nearly three weeks ago, when you injected yourself into a thread where I had mentioned you in passing.
THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM
You caught me! I really DON'T have a life outside of these forums. I sure do hate people like me. Damn me to hell.Few things.
RCM wrote:
I have a life outside of [X].
Am I the only person who has a hard time believing people who say that? The few moments where I actually have had a rather busy life, I was usually too busy living to mention it. Minor quibble. Moving on...
THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM
Okay, just to make things better, I'm not going to post to digitpress.com for the forseeable future. Hopefully, this will take some of the supposed venom out of this "scathing" review.
Manci Games - For the Retro Gamers of the World (RIP)
Home of Manci Games Retrogaming Magazine
www.mancigames.com
Do what you want. I stated my problem in previous posts.RCM wrote:
I don't care if you or anyone else sees it my way. The world is round.
THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM
Okay, just to make things better, I'm not going to post to digitpress.com for the forseeable future. Hopefully, this will take some of the supposed venom out of this "scathing" review.
THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM
MaciGames' position is very reasonable, and loosing a poster who makes good substantial arguments would be a shame! Looking at the posts, the only ones which tried to bring unnecessary heat to a civilized debate are YOURS.
I say it again: there were no insults whatsoever in the original review. You shouldn't speculate about motivations or try to crawl into someones brain, and neither should a moderator. Wait with hysterical calls for locking threads when actually severe insults occur; anticipated insults are ridiculous and make every educational dicatator proud.
Well, the only Q is then: did he do it or is he a paper tiger?Heh! Just check out the issue of PSExtreme from last year where zmweasel wrote that he expected me to punch him in the face when we met at CGE03 for the first time....and if you two bought boxing gloves, then you get the economy running. You see, there is always something positive to report.
About the Q why I coined VGC a retro-mag: You're right, it was more tailored towards ManciGames, and based on the VGC review. Based on the title, it is obvious that the mag is tailored towards collectors, I have the impression it is a mix of both. Which is a great starting point becasue you get collectors and retro-gamers alike.
A rather comprehensive price guide in such a mag still doesn't make sense to me. Prices of games, genres can be included in the mag in a more interesting, lively way. Replications of already existing stuff like price guides become sooner or later an unnecessary appendix. Readers probably already have the two DP guides, or will get it. Minor fluctuations in prices don't justify bi-monthly updates.
Everything which others can make better and more in-depth should be avoided, and everything which a retro-mag can can do better should be stressed.
I'm just a bit passionate about the issue in general becasue I can smell, I can feel that there is a potential market out there. I'm amazed that 20 year old students know and play the first Castlevania or Joust. They don't wanna rekindle childhood experiences, they play it because the games were SIMPLE. Partially it is a fad, but it is also the simplicity of games in stark contrast to the games today. They give me always the same answer: the games are simple!
Last week I picked up at EB games a Culdcept for ten dollars, and the sales kid (probably about twenty) started a conversation about it and we talked about games in general. He has a NES, and a R.O.B., and I asked him if he has Stack UP! He had it complete, and I told him what it is worth today (ebay prices). He had no idea. He plays his NES sometimes, but started out with the Super NES as a kid. I asked him why he plays old NES games, and I got the same answer: they are great, they are so simple.
There is an increased interest in older games in the last couple of years, we all know it; and it makes sense. The game industry is so succesful today, and game development is gradual and slow, it is an invitation to go back to the past. Nintendo does its Classic series for GBA, we get more and more compilation disks of older games, and the little joysticks with built in games from Atari, Midway, Namco and others.
The potential market for retro-mags are there, the big Q is: how to grab and reach the market.
Sorry, I had to do it
We obviously disagree. Let's agree to drop it.MaciGames' position is very reasonable, and loosing a poster who makes good substantial arguments would be a shame! Looking at the posts, the only ones which tried to bring unnecessary heat to a civilized debate are YOURS.
I say it again: there were no insults whatsoever in the original review. You shouldn't speculate about motivations or try to crawl into someones brain, and neither should a moderator. Wait with hysterical calls for locking threads when actually severe insults occur; anticipated insults are ridiculous and make every educational dicatator proud.
THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM
I had a huge response with a more in-depth review of why I'm a subscriber to both GameRoom and PinGame and why I think that a hobby with a smaller potential market (the largest selling pinball game sold 21,700 copies I believe... How many copies of SMB are there?) but my computer crashed out of the site and I lost it. Here's a shorter version of it...
I was not a subscriber to Manci, but I got copies of both mags at the Midwest Gaming Classic and would've become one. I am not a subscriber to VGC but do have the first copy. There are two main differences between the two subsets of mags -- PinGame and GameRoom don't try to be a magazine carried by big stores, they both try to be well-made fan-led magazines. A lot of their content focuses on the hobby. Check out the Web sites and read some of the articles (http://www.pingamejournal.com/ and http://www.gameroommagazine.com/) GameRoom does a very cool feature every month where they focus on one reader's GameRoom and what they do with it including pictures. Probably 50% of the covers are actually people's game rooms or people in their game rooms. There is also a lot of articles on newly developed games or care for games that people have found out.
There is no price guide for either magazine, even though pinball and arcade machines are probably a hobby that could better use one. I know for a fact that I overpaid on one of the two pins that I have by more than $400 and a price guide would've stopped that. But it doesn't make sense. Even coin-ops don't fluctuate enough month to month or quarter to quarter to make a price guide worthwhile. In the last five years, certain games have gotten a little more expensive, but not so much that I feel that a price guide would track it properly. That, and there are so many variables, just like in cartridges. If I pick up a Jurassic Park pinball, I'm going to look at everything from how the playfield is to if all the lights work before making an offer. Same thing with games. If a game has a label that is slightly poor, I would offer more for it than one that was totally missing.
Also, rarity does not always go hand in hand with cost. A great game like Super Mario Brothers 3 may be as common as dirt, but we can't hold onto them at the GOAT Store selling them at $8.00 apiece. There are some games that are R3's and R4's that we've had listed for a few dollars for a long time and haven't moved.
I feel that the DP price/rarity guide is about as good as it can get, and even it has it's share of things that I disagree with. But that's the nature of collecting.
I don't think that a classic gaming centric magazine will fully succeed until the price guide idea has been altered in some way and more content is added. I would also love to see a more independant view of how to run the magazine -- if the pinball / game room hobby can support two different magazines (not including games like Replay and the like that are targeted toward operators), I'm sure that the classic gaming community can support at least one. I just think that things may have to be looked at differently and the overall presentation quality taken down a notch to reduce pressing price and then offer advertising rates much cheaper and include more personal articles about people's collections or stories about games or whatever.
For the classic gaming community, I can pretty much guarantee that no vendors are making so much of a killing that they will want to take out a very expensive ad. If, on the other hand, you can submit an ad for $5.00 a lot of people would probably take advantage of it. There is a "Power Ads" section to game room like this -- $5.00 gets you 100 words. It's great as a way to ask for games, parts or whatever.
RCM, as for your comments you have now made more than 6 comments in the last 20 or so comments. Before you came about, the conversation was full of what I thought was a lot of good constructive criticism and (if people chose to) they could gain a lot from the comments. Why don't you let the moderators be the moderators and if they feel the need to close this, they can... but to this point, it has remained unlocked as all of these suggestions (yes, even Jaysen's) could be taken and used by VGC or any other possible future magazine.
I didn't join this thread to sit here and talk about how great any one magazine is, but I feel that PinGame Journal and GameRoom are the two favorite publications that I get (in that order) and I am hoping that something like them starts for the classic gaming scene. I hope that we can all continue with this and that a positive future comes from this.
Dan Loosen
http://www.goatstore.com/ - http://www.midwestgamingclassic.com/
** Trying to finish up an overly complete Dreamcast collection... want to help? (Updated 5/3/10!) http://www.digitpress.com/forum/showthread.php?t=61333
This is a very interesting point. We've seen that people won't spend money on a gaming mag because it gets in the way of their game playing. I think that if one could sell Manci or VGC for LESS THAN A DOLLAR, then almost every person at these forums would buy it. Less than a dollar. Anything more and you're looking at Goodwill money. That doesn't leave any chance for these mags to actually produce their magazine, of course. The thing that's getting in the way is the belief that one needs to get money out of this, and a fascination with a paper product.
An understandable one, of course, but if you're gonna make a bus reader (ahem), then why waste money on pretty pictures?
The other possibility is that somebody should set up an online-only "magazine" that's got the pretty content but has a voluntary payment system - i.e. you pay for what you think the content's worth, and if you think it's worth $.02 then you pay $.02. Some folks have tried this and found they made MORE money than they did with a fixed payment schedule and fees, and of course saw their readership improve. If people aren't paying even $.01 then you need to do something about your content. If somebody wants to print themselves a copy then can do that, and after you start rolling along with such an idea then you can roll out subscriptions for printed copies. Simple!
Frankly, I'm a bit surprised that as many people subscribe or buy print game mags like CGW, XBN, Tips 'n Tricks, and all the rest. Though I am pleased that this means people haven't given up all faith in reading ;D
cough classicgamermagazine cough
Still Around...Still Gamin'...
I didn't know that's how they did things. Mavelous! :D
Just letting my opinion be known goat. I am not trying to carry this thing on. I stated my opinions. I was late in reading the thread so i responded late and to the orginal post. I also admitted I was late previously by the way. If you and everyone else wants it dropped that's fine by me. I made my point agree with it or not. If people are pissed about my comments and want them to stop stop bringing them back up. Simple as that.RCM, as for your comments you have now made more than 6 comments in the last 20 or so comments. Before you came about, the conversation was full of what I thought was a lot of good constructive criticism and (if people chose to) they could gain a lot from the comments. Why don't you let the moderators be the moderators and if they feel the need to close this, they can... but to this point, it has remained unlocked as all of these suggestions (yes, even Jaysen's) could be taken and used by VGC or any other possible future magazine.
THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM
I say it again, Klaus: Jaysen's "review" is 1,500 words of insults. Not all of the jabs might be immediately obvious without some background on Jaysen's many conflicts with me and VGC, but they're all there.
Jaysen rejected everyone's advice (including my own, based on 15 years of game-journo experience) in creating his zine, and failed about as completely as one can fail. Now he has the temerity to "review" Video Game Collector and expect me to pay attention to his biased opinions, despite the fact that he's been nothing but an enormous asshole in his interactions with me. It's hypocritical, it's pathetic, and it's absurd.
-- Z.
First off, if you don't want things to carry on, STOP POSTING.
Second of all, I sign my real name to my posts. The least you can have is the common decency to use that instead of referring to me as "goat" which was obviously a childish attempt at poking fun of me. I wish that you would grow up. Please, let the good conversation continue and DON'T REPLY.
Dan Loosen
http://www.goatstore.com/ - http://www.midwestgamingclassic.com/
** Trying to finish up an overly complete Dreamcast collection... want to help? (Updated 5/3/10!) http://www.digitpress.com/forum/showthread.php?t=61333
Read Lenny's post again: I expected him to punch ME, not vice versa. Not a long story as to why, but not a good anecdote, either.
-- Z.
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