Ps3 1.80 update (upscaling)

[BHvrd]

It's about time they rolled this one out.

http://www.us.playstation.com/News/PressReleases/400

[roushimsx]

Looking forward to seeing how effective their scaling technique is for PS1/PS2 games. I wonder if they just do a simple upscaling job or if they actually render the output at 1080p.

Guess we'll find out soon enough.

What I'm really looking forward to is being able to transfer saves FROM the PS3, now. Thank. Fucking. God.

[boatofcar]

Anybody tried out the DVD upscsaling? How is it?

[roushimsx]

The update JUST went live
http://images.roushimsx.com/TV2007052322255500.jpg

Updating now. Can't wait to see how the PS2/PS1 upscaling works.

[geneshifter]

The update JUST went live
http://images.roushimsx.com/TV2007052322255500.jpg

Updating now. Can't wait to see how the PS2/PS1 upscaling works.

Yup, downloading now. Hope this works, lol. Booooooooommmmmm!

[agbulls]

d/l right now. im actually suprised at how fast the its going...

[agbulls]

WOW. Just.

WOW


Play GOW 2 with the "full screen" option ON. Do NOT use progressive scan (obviously). Holy shit!!! Consider this new feature the Jaggy Eliminator.

[roushimsx]

Even more impressive:

Pop in Shadow of the Colossus, enable widescreen but do NOT enable progressive. Thank me later.

[walrusmonger]

I tried the full screen option in the PS3 menu with odin sphere and the screen is off center. Have to play letterboxed, but it is soooo sexy- very crisp in 1080i.

[fuchikoma]

Even more impressive:

Pop in Shadow of the Colossus, enable widescreen but do NOT enable progressive. Thank me later.

I'd rather thank you now. :D

[PDorr3]

holy god...just poped in shadow of the colossus with shader, full screen, and 16x9 on and it looks AMAZING! i remember playing this game on an hdtv not long ago with composite cables and it looked so terrible it made me regret ever upgrading to an hdtv, but now on an hdtv with components and these new features...the game looks amazing! it really does look like a HD game...not cheap 480 stuff but Im talking HD 720p quality...

I tried final fantasy 8 on PS1 with the same settings, and it has been a REALLY long time since I played this game, but it looked EXTREMELY jaggy, like really bad I think since I had it in full screen mode and 720p it was a bit much for a ps1 game to handle, so maybe butting it back to 4:3 would fix that problem up...

My question is this, for ps1 games should I use 720p or 1080i? and for PS2 games should I use 720p or 1080i?

[gepeto]

Will this update help people whos older hdmi tv had issues with the ps3 hdmi

[heybtbm]

This is incredible. PS1, PS2, DVD's all upscaled and virtual memory cards aren't a one way street anymore...Thank you Sony!

(I can't believe I just typed that.)

[agbulls]

Will this update help people whos older hdmi tv had issues with the ps3 hdmi

No, this update will not upscale games ps3 games to 1080i.

Also, are you guys using the "smoothing" option for ps1 and ps2 games? I did first on GOW 2 and lost a little bit of the visual "pop" so I turned it off.

It also seems that you have to have the "Full" option on as well to make sure that the game does display in widescreen. In regards to what is better -- 720p or 1080i -- I would just stick with your tv's natural resolution.

How long do you guys give it until we're seeing screenshot comparisons on Kotaku and Destructoid?

[LiquidPolicenaut]

I noticed when i try and play PSOne games in 1080i mode, the music skips. In 720p, everything is peachy :) Honestly though, I really dont see THAT much of a difference in my PSOne and PS2 games. Some difference, yes, but not crazy drastic. I AM using component though, so Im not sure if it'll make a HUGE difference with an HDMI cable. Sucks that my DVDs wont upscale through component though...

[roushimsx]

How long do you guys give it until we're seeing screenshot comparisons on Kotaku and Destructoid?

Game.Watch (http://watch.impress.co.jp/game/docs/20070524/ps3.htm) put up a quick comparison of the character select screen of Tekken 5 (not the best comparison since it's just a bunch of 2D). I'd like to see some quality, clean comparisons of 3d (in particular with PS1 games). That's where a bulk of the difference will be found.

Everytime someone posts a shitty digicam shot of their tv trying to show the difference, god kills a kitten.

[heybtbm]

I downloaded the update tonight after work...and wow. Every PS2 game I've stuck in looks absolutely beautiful. Final Fantasy XII, Shadow of the Colossus, and God of War 2 look like different games. I never thought SotC would be able to look so nice. I'm stunned that this was possible.

Now that was an update.

[LiquidPolicenaut]

I got a quick question for those that may know..if I use an HDMI cable to hook up my PS3, can I also use an optical cable for the sound through my stereo or amI stuck with the sound through my tv speakers via the HDMI cable?

[Trebuken]

The shader really changes your perceptions of the games. I think I am going to need some time with it to come up with an opinion. The cinematic parts of GOW2 is more movie like, but the gameplay in it and other games is really smoothed off, I am not sure if I like it more or less yet.

The DVD upscaling is awesome though. The PS3 may be the best upscaling DVD player around; again I need more time to be sure...

Was not impressed with what it did with PS1 games...

[jonjandran]

I got a quick question for those that may know..if I use an HDMI cable to hook up my PS3, can I also use an optical cable for the sound through my stereo or amI stuck with the sound through my tv speakers via the HDMI cable?


You can still use an optical cable, just enable the optical out in the display setup menu. Set it up for Hdmi but then choose optical audio output instead of Hdmi audio output.

[DreamTR]

There's still gameplay lag with older games with this on HDTVs.

[LiquidPolicenaut]

You can still use an optical cable, just enable the optical out in the display setup menu. Set it up for Hdmi but then choose optical audio output instead of Hdmi audio output.

Great to hear! Now I got another question. I just now remembered that my HDTV does NOT support 1080p (highest is 1080i and also 720p). Is there really a huge difference between having my ps3 connected via component (and it says it displays at 1080i on the XMB and some games push it to down to 720p) and having it connected via HDMI if my tv isnt 1080p capable?

[agbulls]

Great to hear! Now I got another question. I just now remembered that my HDTV does NOT support 1080p (highest is 1080i and also 720p). Is there really a huge difference between having my ps3 connected via component (and it says it displays at 1080i on the XMB and some games push it to down to 720p) and having it connected via HDMI if my tv isnt 1080p capable?

Liquid, we're in the exact same situation. I have a 50" Sony KDF-E50A10 (720p native, 1080i) that my PS3 is hooked up to via component. From what I've read extensively -- here and the avsforums -- the visual difference between 1080p and 720p is almost indistinguishable at close range. For this even to become noticable, you need to be sitting beyond 8-9 ft from your tv.

In regards to will the hdmi cable make a difference for us? This is the question that absolutely no one has been able to really answer. My impression it's really going to be a combination of 1) your tv + 2) how discerning your eyes are. Considering there was no obvious immediate benefit previously to change from component to hdmi, I just never bothered to spend the $8 bucks or so to get the hdmi cable from monoprice. However, with the new upscaling for standard dvd's I really think it's worth it now. One thing is for -- it can't look worse than component, right?

By the way Liquid, I sent you a PS3 friend request. Did you get it?

[jonjandran]

Liquid, we're in the exact same situation. I have a 50" Sony KDF-E50A10 (720p native, 1080i) that my PS3 is hooked up to via component. From what I've read extensively -- here and the avsforums -- the visual difference between 1080p and 720p is almost indistinguishable at close range. For this even to become noticable, you need to be sitting beyond 8-9 ft from your tv.


Actually you have this backwards. The larger the Tv/Projection and the closer you sit the more difference you will notice between 720p and 1080p. The farther you sit away the less you can tell the difference because you start to loose focus and detail.

But with anything less than a 100" projection it will be harder to notice the difference between 720p and 1080p. A videophile will be able to but the average person won't.

[heybtbm]

One more thing about HDMI vs. component. I have my PS3 hooked up to my LCD HDTV in a way where I have component and HDMI. I use HDMI for everything, but I wanted to see if there was a visable difference between the two. By switching back and forth (in the PS3 system menu), I determined that the colors were much brighter and vibrant with HDMI. This was especially apparent with PS1 and PS2 games.

[agbulls]

One more thing about HDMI vs. component. I have my PS3 hooked up to my LCD HDTV in a way where I have component and HDMI. I use HDMI for everything, but I wanted to see if there was a visable difference between the two. By switching back and forth (in the PS3 system menu), I determined that the colors were much brighter and vibrant with HDMI. This was especially apparent with PS1 and PS2 games.

What were you running it on...720p, 1080i or 1080p?

[jonjandran]

One more thing about HDMI vs. component. I have my PS3 hooked up to my LCD HDTV in a way where I have component and HDMI. I use HDMI for everything, but I wanted to see if there was a visable difference between the two. By switching back and forth (in the PS3 system menu), I determined that the colors were much brighter and vibrant with HDMI. This was especially apparent with PS1 and PS2 games.

There is a difference between Component and Hdmi. But the difference will depend on the Tv/Projector you are using. I have a Sony 60" , a Jvc 56" and a Mitsubishi 1080p projector on a 175" screen and they are all different. Some look better Hdmi , some component. One will be brighter with component, another will have better colors with Hdmi. They all have to be adjusted with each input to get the proper colors/contrast etc. but they still have slight differences.

[heybtbm]

There is a difference between Component and Hdmi. But the difference will depend on the Tv/Projector you are using. I have a Sony 60" , a Jvc 56" and a Mitsubishi 1080p projector on a 175" screen and they are all different. Some look better Hdmi , some component. One will be brighter with component, another will have better colors with Hdmi. They all have to be adjusted with each input to get the proper colors/contrast etc. but they still have slight differences.

I've had similar experiences with my various setups over the years. I think the best way to find the ideal setup is simply "trial and error".

To answer Agbulls: I was using 1080i. My TV doesn't have 1080p unfortunately.

[roushimsx]

I'm going through and snapping some comparison shots of smoothing on and off for various games. I just did shots of Sky Odyssey, I'm doing Shadow of the Colossus now, I'll probably do Ico soon, then I'll test out Marvel vs Capcom 2 and Gun.

Can anyone think of any other cases that might be fun to try? My capture card only supports s-video/composite/rf, so no upscaling comparisons here, unfortunately. Still, the difference in some games with the smoothing is quite staggering.

[Oobgarm]

How does Sky Odyssey fare?

[roushimsx]

How does Sky Odyssey fare?

No Smoothing:
http://images.roushimsx.com/ps3smoothing/SkyOdyssey_Banking_01_Original.jpg

Smoothing:
http://images.roushimsx.com/ps3smoothing/SkyOdyssey_Banking_01_Smooth.jpg

I accidentally changed the control panel while fumbling around with the controller, but it's the plane that counts! Pretty damn big difference, and it makes me wish I had a US Copy of Ridge Racer V to test out and see if it's actually playable now. The low res / jaggies killed that sucker :(

[Joker T]

Has anyone tried Resident Evil 4 or the Jak games?

[agbulls]

I think without any question, this new feature is full of incredible irony and is sending Sony home (even with low PS3 sales) laughing their asses off.

Why?

How many times did you opt to buy the Xbox version of a game when it was released on both Xbox and PS2? It often came down to a simple comparison of Xbox version w/ 480p (or even 720p occasionally) vs 480i on PS2. I did these comparisons countless times, and wound up with a good 80% of my multiplatform titles on the Xbox.

Oops.

Not only did a vasy majority of those become non-compatible with the 360, those that do work often have weird emulation glitches. If I were to have bought all the multiplatform stuff on my PS2, I'd be enjoying them all up to 1080p!!!

:yipes:

Haha. Just makes me laugh really. It's the ultimate example of "you can only bet on ONE thing -- CHANGE."

[roushimsx]

It often came down to a simple comparison of Xbox version w/ 480p (or even 720p occasionally) vs 480i on PS2.

I'd always pick up the Xbox version because of the higher framerates (unless the PS2 version was better, such as with Metal Gear Solid 2: Substance). It looks like with the euro 1.80, they've been improving EE+GS emulation to the point where a lot of games actually run smoother (lots of reports of the PAL Shadow of the Colossus running a hell of a lot smoother overall, for instance)....grrr...

and here we all laughed/cried/pitied/mocked the Euro PS3 for its lower PS1/PS2 compatibility...damnit!

Smoothing comparisons of Gun, Killzone, Shadow of the Colossus, Sky Odyssey, and Liberty City Stories (http://roushimsx.livejournal.com/68814.html)

[Emuaust]

Yes it is getting to a stage, looking at the EU emulation of games, That peeps should
be asking WTF? with MS emulation, its getting rather crappy compared tp Sony's.

On the other hand I find it rather ironic the BEST reason to own a PS3 at the moment
is for its excellent Ps2 games, I mean GOW2 is the best game ive played on my PS3.......

[LiquidPolicenaut]

Well, I went ahead and spent the whopping $9.84 for an HDMI cable from monoprice so I'll see for myself too if theres really any big deal between component to HDMI. At the least, my movies will now be up converted :)

I tried out GTA 3 and SA and noticed a tiny difference. Textures just look, overall, a bit nicer. Tried out MGS 3..no discernable difference (though it was already a great looking game)...also tried out Ridge Racer V quickly and, from what I saw, the jaggies are still there :(

[heybtbm]

...also tried out Ridge Racer V quickly and, from what I saw, the jaggies are still there :(

I played RR5 for a while tonight and can assure you...most of the jaggies have been tamed. It's still a damned ugly game though.

[roushimsx]

Sadly, the PS1 games I've tested so far haven't fared remotely as well when run with the "smooth" option enabled.

Bushido Blade (normal):
http://images.roushimsx.com/ps3smoothing/Bushido_Blade_01_Original.jpg

Bushido Blade (Smooth):
http://images.roushimsx.com/ps3smoothing/Bushido_Blade_01_Smooth.jpg

Colony Wars (normal):
http://images.roushimsx.com/ps3smoothing/Colony_Wars_01_Original.jpg

Colony Wars (smooth):
http://images.roushimsx.com/ps3smoothing/Colony_Wars_01_Smooth.jpg

Final Fantasy Tactics (normal):
http://images.roushimsx.com/ps3smoothing/FFT_01_Original.jpg

Final Fantasy Tactics (smooth):
http://images.roushimsx.com/ps3smoothing/FFT_01_Smooth.jpg

In comparison to the PS2 games I tested, PS1 games generally look a bit darker and soft enough to feel "out of focus". Final Fantasy Tactics is probably the worst of the bunch, though I hear upscaling it and smoothing it out actually looks quite nice. Going to have to give that a go later on this evening (just sucks that I can't snap clean shots of it :( ).

I did some shots of Gran Turismo, but the interlacing screwed up most of 'em. Going to play around and snag some more tomorrow-ish. It also doesn't fare too well, but god DAMN do I still love the soundtrack. I have no idea how or why instrumental Cubanate songs wound up being a majority of it, but color me happy as hell that they did.

[slip81]

Okay, but how well do upconverted DVD's look through HDMI?

Cause that's the real question for me. If this thing will do a better job of upconverting than my standard Samsung unconverting player, as well as make the PS2 versions of the Brother's In Arms games look good, and allow me to enjoy GTA IV AND play High Def movies, Sony totally has my $600 this coming January.

[LiquidPolicenaut]

I played RR5 for a while tonight and can assure you...most of the jaggies have been tamed. It's still a damned ugly game though.

Oh ok then. I only got to try out the first board since I dont have my save file on the PS3 and didnt notice anything too different. The one stage I was looking for to see a difference was one board that had a nice orange-ish sunset and the jaggies looked very prominent there in the original. Glad to hear at least SOME of it got tamed....


Sadly, the PS1 games I've tested so far haven't fared remotely as well when run with the "smooth" option enabled..

When I first saw the "smoothing" option, I thought it would be similar to the PS2 smoothing technique for PSOne games but it turned out not to be. I actually prefer playing MGS on the PS2 smoothed out then on the PS3 smoothed out...

[PapaStu]

Sadly, the PS1 games I've tested so far haven't fared remotely as well when run with the "smooth" option enabled.

Much the same has come out in regards to using the Smoothing and Texture options for the PSOne games, and since the PS3 is using the Emotion Engine of the PS2 for the PS1 emulation, the stuff is going to look pretty damn similar overall anyways, be it being played on a PS2 or a PS3.

[TerryBogard22]

Im very happy with this, ps2 games look better, ps1 look same and newer dvds are awsome

[Emuaust]

Much the same has come out in regards to using the Smoothing and Texture options for the PSOne games, and since the PS3 is using the Emotion Engine of the PS2 for the PS1 emulation, the stuff is going to look pretty damn similar overall anyways, be it being played on a PS2 or a PS3.


Well that is if your using a NON EU PS3.

[roushimsx]

Well that is if your using a NON EU PS3.

Yea, I'm hopeful that they merge the EU PS1/2 emulation into the US/JPN firmware. I'd love to see how the smoothing looks then. Maybe they're waiting for compatibility to get higher.

[LiquidPolicenaut]

Much the same has come out in regards to using the Smoothing and Texture options for the PSOne games, and since the PS3 is using the Emotion Engine of the PS2 for the PS1 emulation, the stuff is going to look pretty damn similar overall anyways, be it being played on a PS2 or a PS3.

But this doenst seem to be the exact case, as I noted above. Try out MGS or even Xenogears on a PS2 with the smoothing option and then try it on the PS3 with the smoothing option. They are doing it in two different ways. The PS2s smoothing option, while never being perfect, looks far better than the PS3 smoothing option....at least as far as PSOne games go :)

[PS2Hawk]

I'd always pick up the Xbox version because of the higher framerates (unless the PS2 version was better, such as with Metal Gear Solid 2: Substance). It looks like with the euro 1.80, they've been improving EE+GS emulation to the point where a lot of games actually run smoother (lots of reports of the PAL Shadow of the Colossus running a hell of a lot smoother overall, for instance)....grrr...

and here we all laughed/cried/pitied/mocked the Euro PS3 for its lower PS1/PS2 compatibility...damnit!

Smoothing comparisons of Gun, Killzone, Shadow of the Colossus, Sky Odyssey, and Liberty City Stories (http://roushimsx.livejournal.com/68814.html)

you wanna know something funny ? not a single "game journalist" on sites like 1Up IGN or GameSpot has even mentioned how great the new system update is. I have read people comparing the dvd upscaling of ps3 to a stand alone dvd upscaler and with PS3 coming on top... its pathetic what type of morons are working @ writing reviews ... I guess they just don't want to write anything positive about ps3..

[PS2Hawk]

I'd always pick up the Xbox version because of the higher framerates (unless the PS2 version was better, such as with Metal Gear Solid 2: Substance). It looks like with the euro 1.80, they've been improving EE+GS emulation to the point where a lot of games actually run smoother (lots of reports of the PAL Shadow of the Colossus running a hell of a lot smoother overall, for instance)....grrr...

and here we all laughed/cried/pitied/mocked the Euro PS3 for its lower PS1/PS2 compatibility...damnit!

Smoothing comparisons of Gun, Killzone, Shadow of the Colossus, Sky Odyssey, and Liberty City Stories (http://roushimsx.livejournal.com/68814.html)


But this doenst seem to be the exact case, as I noted above. Try out MGS or even Xenogears on a PS2 with the smoothing option and then try it on the PS3 with the smoothing option. They are doing it in two different ways. The PS2s smoothing option, while never being perfect, looks far better than the PS3 smoothing option....at least as far as PSOne games go :)

I think thats because PS2 was "smoothing" ps1 games and they were still running on SDTV and now they are upscaled and smoothed on an HDTV with ps3!

[roushimsx]

I think thats because PS2 was "smoothing" ps1 games and they were still running on SDTV and now they are upscaled and smoothed on an HDTV with ps3!

The above screenshots were snapped off of a capture card w/ svideo running at 480i...so...I don't know. Maybe the fact that the PS3 upscales all low res sources to at least 480i plays into it somewhat, but I guess I'm going to have to do some direct comparisons of PS2 smoothing + PS3 smoothing to confirm.

Despite the PS3 refusing to output video over HDMI to a non HDCP source, I may still pick up one of these (http://www.blackmagic-design.com/products/intensity/techspecs/) and hooking up via component to do some better screenshots in the future. Getting approval from my wife is going to be tricky, though :\ (I'll need a new motherboard, too)

Hell, I'm going to need new component cables for my PS3 while I'm at it. I have official Sony PS2 component cables and third party multi-system component cables and both generate some extra noise that I don't get when using HDMI (or on other systems). Maybe it's just my TV+the PS3+Component...guess I won't know for sure until I get me an Intensity Pro :(

Oh, and I picked up Ridge Racer V today. Screenshots will be snapped later. :)

edit - it is odd how little press the new update is actually getting. :(

[Lothars]

edit - it is odd how little press the new update is actually getting. :(

not surprising, Something Sony does right is ignored but if it's something Sony does wrong, it's news.

But it's just one of those things because it's just an firmware update though.

[PS2Hawk]

well my ps2 retired right after the update :)

good run .... 2001 to 2007!
SCPH30001R model number, Made in Japan.. THanks again SONY .. now I can finish some games that I was playing on my ps2 in HD....

[Anthony1]

I have a Sony 60" , a Jvc 56" and a Mitsubishi 1080p projector on a 175" screen


175" screen? Wow, that's freaking ridiculously huge. I have a 131", and I already think that maybe I have it a bit too big. Isn't there a point of diminishing returns in relation to screen size? How far back do you sit from that sucker? For about 2 years, I had a 113" screen, and that worked out very well for me, but when I got my new projector, I mounted it in the same exact spot as the other one, but the screen size was much larger, 131 inches. I was going to remount it a bit closer, but I just got lazy, but there are times when I think I'm a bit past the point of diminishing returns in regards to screen size. I think around 120 inches or so would probably be a bit better. I'm just too lazy right now to mess with it, but I couldn't even imagine 175 inches. When I watch regular TV type stuff (basically anything non-high def), it looks pretty damn craptacular blown up to 131 inches, but having that blown up to 175 inches would be god awful, I would imagine. I'm sure very high quality high def sources look good on it, but man, you must have a really huge room to have a screen that huge. I'm sitting like 19 feet from my screen, so to have a 175 inch screen, I would have to sit way farther than that. Hmm. Interesting.

[RugalSizzler]

So now tell me is it about the console that you are using or is it about the television screen that you ownROFL

I am not kidding Rolly Polly why woul you have to buy a certain screen to make your games look a certain way?

It is called features people and features is not what displaying a game on the scren is about.

Your games should be friggin beautiful even without Whatever term for smoothing out graphics they have.

I have been using ePSXe on my PC years to do what this update did and it still displays PSX games way better then any of the pictures above. I mean why oh why am I going to buy something for added features and how long will these updates last?

Can you download a disc or usb update or something like that to use if the update is no longer ready?

[jonjandran]

175" screen? Wow, that's freaking ridiculously huge. I have a 131", and I already think that maybe I have it a bit too big. Isn't there a point of diminishing returns in relation to screen size? How far back do you sit from that sucker? For about 2 years, I had a 113" screen, and that worked out very well for me, but when I got my new projector, I mounted it in the same exact spot as the other one, but the screen size was much larger, 131 inches. I was going to remount it a bit closer, but I just got lazy, but there are times when I think I'm a bit past the point of diminishing returns in regards to screen size. I think around 120 inches or so would probably be a bit better. I'm just too lazy right now to mess with it, but I couldn't even imagine 175 inches. When I watch regular TV type stuff (basically anything non-high def), it looks pretty damn craptacular blown up to 131 inches, but having that blown up to 175 inches would be god awful, I would imagine. I'm sure very high quality high def sources look good on it, but man, you must have a really huge room to have a screen that huge. I'm sitting like 19 feet from my screen, so to have a 175 inch screen, I would have to sit way farther than that. Hmm. Interesting.

I have a 16'x24' room. The seating is stadium with two couches on the back wall, two couches in front of them, a row of 6 theater chairs and another row of 6 theater chairs.

I usually sit in the back, but my kids like to sit in the front. Guests usually pick the second row of couches.

I play mostly HD stuff with the Ps3 and Xbox Hd-dvd and Pc and Local Hd Ota. But I have DishNetwork on it also and it really doesn't look that bad. The Mitsubishi HC5000 does an incredible job upscaling Sd to 1080p. It has one of the best scalers on the market built in.

And needless to say NO-ONE has ever said the screen needs to be smaller. :)

[RugalSizzler]

I just thought about this. What abou the people who imported there PS3. Will the update work with there models?

[roushimsx]

I just thought about this. What abou the people who imported there PS3. Will the update work with there models?

The update rolled out world-wide, not just in the US. UK and JPN PS3s both got their own version of the update.

[RugalSizzler]

Does this mean the Update will be included in newer releases of PS3 consoles????

[roushimsx]

Does this mean the Update will be included in newer releases of PS3 consoles????

Most likely, though the delay between when the update came out and when you'll see it on a console fresh out of the box might be a good while (especially with the surplus of v1.50s out there).

[BHvrd]

Here's an interesting article about superwhite and RGB Full. Along with some kind of test for your TV.

At this point in technology though it's all greek to me. I guess i'm getting old, lol. I just can't keep up with all this shit. Though it sounds cool.

http://www.gameswank.com/content/view/126/1/
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[Nintendo Gamer]

.....

[Knoxximus]

I also hear that the European emulator runs games smoother than the actually EE/GS combo in the NTSC PS3's. If that is true, then there IS no rush to run out and buy one with the chips still in it in the US "before it is too late". This would definitely be a selling point for me if Sony really nails it.

[BHvrd]

I also hear that the European emulator runs games smoother than the actually EE/GS combo in the NTSC PS3's. If that is true, then there IS no rush to run out and buy one with the chips still in it in the US "before it is too late". This would definitely be a selling point for me if Sony really nails it.

Unless they add the software emulation to the existing EE NTSC ps3's. In which case you would be able to play more ps2 games obviously.

We'll see I guess, hopefully they serve both equally, though non-EE seems it would have further to catch up in regards to actual playback of games.

[j_factor]

Sounds like much ado about nothing to me. Oooh, now I can upscale Jumping Flash! to 1080p. Whoopie.

[Anthony1]

Sounds like much ado about nothing to me. Oooh, now I can upscale Jumping Flash! to 1080p. Whoopie.

It is a pretty big deal for watching regular DVD movies though. Well, for anybody that doesn't already have an upscalling dvd player. I didn't have one prior to this firmware upgrade, and after doing the upgrade, I put in Cars by Pixar, and it almost looks HD. At least it almost looked HD until I rented Pirates of the Carribbean on Blu Ray, and saw the actual preview of Cars on Blu Ray (I normally NEVER purchase movies but this will be very, very tempting)


I have a 16'x24' room. The seating is stadium with two couches on the back wall, two couches in front of them, a row of 6 theater chairs and another row of 6 theater chairs.

I usually sit in the back, but my kids like to sit in the front. Guests usually pick the second row of couches.



Hey, could you please take some pics of the room, and the seating arangement? My room is a similar size, and I would be interested in seeing how you did all the seating. Sounds awesome!

[roushimsx]

(I normally NEVER purchase movies but this will be very, very tempting.

I've pretty much quit buying movies since signing up for NetFlix, but I'll still be buying the Pixar movies on BD. Brad Bird and John Lasseter are just so damned awesome :(

[Anthony1]

I've pretty much quit buying movies since signing up for NetFlix, but I'll still be buying the Pixar movies on BD. Brad Bird and John Lasseter are just so damned awesome :(


Yeah, I'm not the type to buy movies either, but I do have two young boys, and they have certain movies that they can watch over and over and over, and I don't mind buying the ones that they love that I can also enjoy. I definitely enjoy all the Pixar movies. I'm not sure they've made a total dud yet. To get those movies in High Def, with the lossless sound, yep, I'm gonna buy em. Eventually, I'll buy them. I don't see myself running out and paying $34.99 plus tax or whatever it is they are going to cost, but once I can get them for under $20 out the door, I will.

[heybtbm]

I also hear that the European emulator runs games smoother than the actually EE/GS combo in the NTSC PS3's. If that is true, then there IS no rush to run out and buy one with the chips still in it in the US "before it is too late". This would definitely be a selling point for me if Sony really nails it.

That's wishful thinking at best. Sony will never get around to emulating even a fraction of their entire PS1/PS2 catalog.

Also...if 360 emulation can be used for comparison, even the "working" titles glitch up all the time. Playing Xbox games on a 360 is not the same as playing Xbox games on a Xbox...not even close. Full emulation of PS2 and Xbox games is much more glamorous is theory than it is in practice.

[veronica_marsfan]

Anybody tried out the DVD upscsaling? How is it? Question:

Why would you want to upscale a DVD (or PS1/2 game). Why not just play them in their original 480-scanline resolution?

(curious)

[Emuaust]

That's wishful thinking at best. Sony will never get around to emulating even a fraction of their entire PS1/PS2 catalog.

Also...if 360 emulation can be used for comparison, even the "working" titles glitch up all the time. Playing Xbox games on a 360 is not the same as playing Xbox games on a Xbox...not even close. Full emulation of PS2 and Xbox games is much more glamorous is theory than it is in practice.


Well that was a load of shit, Im sorry but how do you think they do the BC in the Euro consoles
without the Ps2/PSX chipsets? What, Magic?, yeap Emulation and its a little more then a small FRACTION........

Also dont compare Xbox360 BC to PS3 BC the euro consoles are showing MS up to no end.

[heybtbm]

Well that was a load of shit, Im sorry but how do you think they do the BC in the Euro consoles
without the Ps2/PSX chipsets? What, Magic?, yeap Emulation and its a little more then a small FRACTION.

Can you tell me specifically what I said that was a "load of shit"? Emulation is always glitchy. That's a simple fact.

Don't get angry with me because Sony screwed the European PS3 owners with emulation instead of perfect backwards compatibility right out of the box.


Also dont compare Xbox360 BC to PS3 BC the euro consoles are showing MS up to no end.

?

You lost me there.

[roushimsx]

Why would you want to upscale a DVD (or PS1/2 game). Why not just play them in their original 480-scanline resolution?


It depends on a number of factors, really. Your TV, the original resolution of the source, and the display mode all play a part in it. PS1 games almost always were not 480i (most were much lower, such as 240p) and a bulk of PS1 games were 480i, while most modern HDTVs are 720p, 1080p, or 1080i. You're going to have to stretch the image to fit the pixels for the best look at your TV's native res (unless you like postage stamps), and for most 4:3 PS1/PS2 games, that means scaling them up to ~1436x1080 or 958x720 (whatever your TV's native res it).

Most TV's have built in scaler chips and a lot of DVD players do as well, but the quality of the scaler differs pretty wildly. Imagine breaking out an image in photoshop and playing around with different resizing methods, like bilinear, bicubic, and nearest neighbor...it's a bit like that. You're still bound by the quality of the source material, but depending on the method used for stretching it, you can really make it look a hell of a lot nicer.

It's why sometimes you'll see an HDTV with a normal SD cable signal coming it and it looks like pure poo while othertimes it'll look pretty decent on another model of TV. On lower quality upscaling DVD players the scaler is most likely inferior to the one in your TV already. In comparison, the PS3's scaler seems to be pretty fucking sexcellent, especially as a bonus on what's generally considered, "just an overpriced game console".

[mailman187666]

WOW. Just.

WOW

Play GOW 2 with the "full screen" option ON. Do NOT use progressive scan (obviously). Holy shit!!! Consider this new feature the Jaggy Eliminator.

this may be a dumb question, but why would you leave progressive scan off? is it because it would automatically set it for 480P only?

[Emuaust]

Can you tell me specifically what I said that was a "load of shit"? Emulation is always glitchy. That's a simple fact.

Don't get angry with me because Sony screwed the European PS3 owners with emulation instead of perfect backwards compatibility right out of the box.



?

You lost me there.


How much time have you spent with your EU PS3?
The Emulation is a lot better then what you give it credit for, Im angry at your ignorance
to be honest. The 360 Emulation of Xbox games is a glitchy mess far from what we
see with the PS3.

Im sorry if your offended and I dont really want to start a flame war but the truth of the matter is
us EU gamers Have EU ps3's and have some idea what the software emulation is like

[Cinder6]

Okay, but how well do upconverted DVD's look through HDMI?

Cause that's the real question for me. If this thing will do a better job of upconverting than my standard Samsung unconverting player, as well as make the PS2 versions of the Brother's In Arms games look good, and allow me to enjoy GTA IV AND play High Def movies, Sony totally has my $600 this coming January.

From what I've seen of it (and admittedly, I only tested The Fellowship of the Ring), it looked great. Of course, I don't have an upscaling DVD player to test it with (well, it's not hooked up; this is a new TV), but the difference between what the PS3 outputs now and what it output before the update is night and day. I am now completely satisfied with my purchase.

[roushimsx]

this may be a dumb question, but why would you leave progressive scan off? is it because it would automatically set it for 480P only?

The games will run in whatever resolution they were last configured for, not just what the XMB tells them to run in. Kind of makes sense, because the PS2 had no way of telling the game to run at a set resolution (unlike the Xbox where the dashboard controlled it). So when you enable progressive scan in the game, you're telling it to go from whatever you were upscaling to back down to 480p.

It'd be neat if they found a way to get around that in a future patch for the backwards compatibility, but I'm not getting my hopes up on anything happening before the full software emulation rolls out.

[roushimsx]

I didn't think it deserved its own thread, so I thought I'd bump this one...

IGN Takes on PS3's Upscaling (http://ps3.ign.com/articles/792/792156p1.html)

Three things to note:
1) The writer of the article made zero effort in trying to get the shots to match up worth a damn
2) The full resolution shots are in 640x480 (both original and upscaled). How are you supposed to see how the games look upscaled when they're in the original resolution...?
3) He clearly states that he enabled progressive in God of War 2, oblivious to the fact that this would drop the game down to 480p from whatever else it was run in.

My theory: He snagged all of these shots over svideo with the smoother turned on. You can tell because of how Marvel vs Capcom looks. Pretty sad that a basement dwelling poopsocker can churn out a better blog post (http://roushimsx.livejournal.com/68814.html) than their paid staffers :(

Shoddy, slanted journalism, but to be expected from IGN.

Hopefully they take the article down and replace it with an honest comparison. I'd LOVE to see some native res shot comparisons.

edit - Feel free to digg (http://digg.com/playstation_3/IGN_Takes_on_PS3_s_Upscaling) it if you want to highlight IGN's retardness. If not, that's cool, too. I just get a kick out of watching "professional" sites completely fudge shit like this.