CGE 2008 - What would you like to see?

[CX2K]

I've heard a lot of great ideas on these forums regarding the show over the past several months so I'd like to start this thread to track any events you'd like to see added to the show.

I can't promise we'll be able to implement all of them but we'll definitely evaluate each idea and see what we can do.

Of course we know the obvious stuff like more alumni, more vendors, etc and we work on these each year, but how about stuff like more cosplay? more bands? new events to the show?

Tell us your ideas and post them here...

disclaimer - no matter how much you ask, Sean Kelly will not be wearing his Papa Smurf outfit anytime soon....

John

[Phosphor Dot Fossils]

Damn, the Papa Smurf thing was #1 on my list!

Seriously, we ought to vary up the panels a bit more. I enjoy the Intellivision and Activision and Atari guys who show up year after year, but it seems like we wind up with the same guys discussing the same things time after time. As much as I was looking forward to the Katz/Kunkel/Worley panel that didn't happen this year, the game journalism panel that resulted was timely, interesting, and something we hadn't seen at CGE before. Some more "themed" panels like that would be a great idea and would let us see the same people perhaps talking about stuff they haven't brought up before. Like Steve Woita and the other guys who are into the casual gaming thing now - get them to talk about what they're doing these days, what that market's like, and how it compares to the Atari days.

That's really the only suggestion. I liked someone else's suggestion about more "conversation areas" in another thread too. But mainly varying up the panels a bit - challenge the speakers and the audience. Even some of the speakers this year seemed to be a little bit at a loss of what to say about their respective systems and/or companies and/or products again. Have a panel that mixes up Atari, Activision & INTV guys, talk about the events that made them realize the crash was real and would change everything, something that crosses the traditional system boundaries. Not saying we can't still have the usual panel topics, but throw some curveballs in there, for us and for them.

[Mayhem]

Actually I have to agree with Earl. This year marked the least number of panels I attended (two - Jay Smith and you guys) because I'd been to the others at least once, if not twice in the past events. Of course this left me more time to play, shop and sell. But still, having different sorts of talks and/or different people taking part would certainly be welcome from me :)

[Dan Iacovelli]

glenn and my self noticed the lack of Jaguar at this years show.
I would like to see the return of the jagfest @ CGE,even If I do come to 2008
I prob won't be bringing my stuff,but I know glenn would bring his stuff.
(and if songbird come that would be great)
Re: keynotes: if you need somebody to talk about the histrory of Jagfest I'm sure I'll be happy to talk about it.

[ubersaurus]

A keynote panel on prototypes would be interesting-how they get discovered, the whole proto collecting scene, and so on. Another one I'd be interested in-the art of those games. Not even the box/cabinet art necessarily, but the art and graphics involved in the games themselves. I know that they're largely based around the limitations of the machines, but still, I've seen some pretty nice looking stuff in those old games. And the story about the jingle in Pressure Cooker brought this one to mind.

There's an indy band that does a Mega Man based rock opera called The Protomen. Capcom had them played at Comic Con this year, but they seem like they may fit in at CGE as well.

I think someone mentioned at the con that keynotes about the arcade games and arcade game alumni would be fascinating stuff, and I'm keen to agree.

Stealing a few ideas from the local anime con...a cosplay contest could be a larf...winner gets some sort of prize, with the audience as judges of costumes. I think another good idea may be to set up a room with some empty tvs on it that people could bring in systems and games to play on; sort of a "bring your own console" area. And the venerable high score contest never gets old, although I think something to that effect went on last year with the NWC competition.

[swlovinist]

I thought this show was good, but dont see attendance getting any better unless the show branches out to other types of gamers. More diversity, more products, more forums involved. Atari 2600 and classic systems are great, but it is the tip of the iceburg to what is out there to collect. Getting some of the niche forums involved more could be great for the show to reel in other markets and generes. Classic Classic consoles were covered, how about contacting Cloud 9 productions(TRS 80 freaks?) C64.com to have Commodore represented? Neo Geo.com for the SNK fans? I am sure that there are some crazy Nes forums. How about the Penny Arcade Forums? Cheap Ass Gamer Forums? Even taking surveys at these forums would be a great idea of adding diversity to the show. There are literally hundreds of other forums that could add to the mix. Why limit ourselves? Cosplay could be a good idea, espically if you had people dress up game related. There are so many other panels and speakers that could be done on Commodore 64, Nintendo, Sega, Turbo Grafx, etc. The problem with sticking with the "ol standby" classics is that most everyone that collects those consoles has been doing it for a long time. Time for some new blood, or I fear that the show will be "stuck"

[Sothy]

the Saturday party was cool but there should be a Friday night party too.
I wound up just getting drunk and learning about Dr Who.
maybe not as big as the main after party but something for dp peeps that are there.

Be cool to have one of the DP chicks model the auction stuff.
Crystal was cool but I dont think she was a gamer and She was blanching a little holding up dirty Odyssey boxes and stuff. Maybe Laura would "ahem" do a star wars theme for the event.

Woulda been cool if PDF had his awesome music played during the show.

The trade room was awesome I found more stuff there than the actual cge booths. maybe that could be expanded upon and advertised a little ahead of time. I mean there was awesome stuff at the actual cge booths but one or 2 were priced like its ebay a week before christmas "COUGHATARI2600.COMCOUGH"

I also tried to say Hi to that John Hardie guy but he didnt say anything. I think he dislikes me or something.

[y-bot]

I would like to see some sort of re-working of the swap room. Maybe it should be part of the main room and I definitely think there should be a limit on how long you can have a table or different rates or something. Several people had swap room tables for the whole show! No offenses to those people but we vendors paid $100 for a table (was there just the one in the corner?) or $300 for a booth in advance. I'd love to see a room that size full of tables for $50 each or at least an area like that. Maybe I'm overestimating the amount of vendors that would come to an event like this but it would be awesome to have 50-100 different vendors of varying quality versus 20 quality booths. Some sort of big-time sponsorship would be nice. It's very hard to get your moneys worth in advertising but maybe someone here is in the field and could provide some tips. Free articles in the newspaper and tv news stories are the best advertising you can get but you have to know someone or be lucky. Again not my field but I know if you send out enough promo packages to the media you'll get some bites. I haven't been to this before but look at all the sponsors:

http://www.pennyarcadeexpo.com/

I think that and Comicon should be models for CGE.

Good luck and I'll see you next year!

y-bot

[ubikuberalles]

First of all I really like this thread you started, John. I appreciate it!

- Flack mentioned in another thread a place for people to sit down. I agree. When CGE was at the plaza there was a catering area with a small number of tables. I used those tables not only for lunch but also to sit down, rest and organize my acquisitions. Those tables were also a great place for visitors to meet and show off their stuff. I remember seeing the portable VCS for the first time when Ben Heckendorn sat down at one of the tables with a few of his friends. The retro-gaming couch was nice but we needed a lot more chairs and tables for people.

- Better distribution of the events schedule. I think you posted the schedule in only two places: under the CGE banner and at the entrance to the main floor (it may have been at other locations but those are the only two I remember). I understand that the final schedule isn't set until just before the show starts but it would have been really nice if you made a couple hundred photocopies of the schedule and distributed it with the program. At the very least you could post it at a bunch more locations than you did. Every time I wanted to figure out when the next speaker was scheduled, I had to run to the entrance and look it up.

- More vendor booths would be nice. You had a lot more space on that floor and I think you could have easily handled ten more booths. I don't know how hard it is to get people to buy a booth and so I understand if 30 or even 40 booths would be unrealistic. However, with more booths you could probably charge less per booth, making it more attractive to vendors.

- Man, it was a LONG walk to get something to eat during the show. Pantechnicon mentioned to me that it would be nice if there was some kind of food vending on the main floor. CGE did something like that at the Plaza. Could you have the Riviera do the same or is it too expensive? Anything to reduce the walk to the Riviera food court would be nice.

- PDF's comments about the speakers was dead on. A good balance of topics about the past, present and future of gaming would attract more attendees. I've seen all the talks about gaming past and I avoided the talks that seem to be a repeat of past CGE talks (Atari and Intellivision programmers, for example). I admit I've become a jaded CGE attendee and I wanted to see something new. A talk on the present state of gaming would be cool. A talk on the future of gaming - both modern and retro gaming - would spark my interest greatly. If you lack ideas for topics, just use the various topics that are hot on this very board: violence in gaming, the ethics of distributing the code for rare prototypes, emulators, marketing strategies of various companies and so on. I think a good brainstorming session could bring up all sorts of exciting topics. The hard part, of course, would be finding someone who would be willing to talk about it. :)

- The Friday night before the show I went over to the CGE floor to look for a sign or notice telling me when the show would start. I couldn't find one and had to get on the internet to find out. A simple sign at the entrance noting this fact would have been nice (if there was one then I'm sorry I missed it).

I have yet to attend a bad CGE and I don't want the organizers think I'm bashing the show in any way. CGE is the best gaming show out there and your willingness to listen to new ideas is very encouraging and shows me why you are the best.

[DreamTR]

I think there should be more tournaments...those were not highlighted as much, maybe branch off to more fighting game stuff in the Neo Classic era, which is known to drive in traffic (www.shoryuken.com).

I don't agree with a "minimum" charge for the Swap Room myself, I think it was fine the way it was because some people really only have 10-12 items for sale, and it would make no sense for them to spend $50. The $5 an hour deal is pretty good, and there were definitely wide varieties of vendors in the Swap Room for only a limited amount of time, which made it pretty important to go in there periodically throughout the show.

I know this sounds bizarre, but I think there should be a longer auction per CGE; mainly because there is so much demand/people that want to see it, with the items. This one was 2.5 hours, and I am not too sure John wants to sit up there all night, but it's definitely a great part of the show. As always, I love CGE and will attend and support it again anyway I can next year!

[swlovinist]

I definately see an imbalance between the $100 vendor table fees and the $5 swap room charges. I know of at least one vendor that noticed this and will not be getting a table next year due to this imbalance. I agree with Y-bot on this one. If I was a vendor, then what is my incentive to get a table next year? Hell, if am going to sell games, I should just rent a swap table all day and save money. I think somewhere in the middle needs to be drawn. I think that merging the swap tables the other room might be a good idea. Upping the table fee and promoting the tables would be a great way of bringing in new blood. You might get some more business if this is done that way. Maybe just a cheaper flat fee for tables for everyone. Also I want to second the idea of chairs and food.

[Mayhem]

Indeed, it got mentioned in passing why people were all day in the swap room, because it was a lot cheaper than having a table in the main area. So maybe a limit of two hours maximum per day is required, or something similar?


- Man, it was a LONG walk to get something to eat during the show. Pantechnicon mentioned to me that it would be nice if there was some kind of food vending on the main floor. CGE did something like that at the Plaza. Could you have the Riviera do the same or is it too expensive? Anything to reduce the walk to the Riviera food court would be nice.

That's probably why there wasn't concessions, it would take business away from the food court. But yeah the walk did suck the third time I had to do it...

[CX2K]

Just some thoughts to share on the swap room....

We are aware of the Swap Room scenario and have already looked at changes to the formula. It was actually supposed to be $10 an hour this year but I think we may have inadvertently posted $5 somewhere so we had to honor that. Next year will be at least $15 per hour with the possibility of a 2 hour maximum. Also, the ability to stay when others are waiting to get in will be removed. ie. if there are people waiting for a table and your hour is up, then you'll have to leave and sign up for another opening.

The bottom line is that we want to keep it affordable to the casual person who only has a few items but want to push the all-day sellers into taking a table on the main floor. At $15 an hour, someone would pay $120 for all day on Sat vs. $100 for a table on the main floor for the weekend.

[CX2K]

You guys have some great ideas. Please keep them coming!

Some more thoughts....

We agree closer food would be better. You might think that it would be as simple as telling the Riviera to go ahead and sell food. Actually, they require a minimum amount sold and if that isn't met guess who "eats" the rest (Couldn't resist). That's why we only did food at the Plaza one or two years before we stopped.

Things like seating will be better next year and we can chalk it up to being a growing pain of being in a new hotel. Many of the things we can now implement simply were hard to figure out without ever having been here before with a completely set-up show floor. Very hard to imagine what a room will look like when it's completely empty.

A longer auction would be fun. There seems to be a lot of items coming in and we hate having to limit it to 2 items per person. However it is a bit of a catch-22. I can probably keep going as long as someone keeps the Corona coming. On the other hand, you might get to a point where I just pass out from all the Corona. I felt like I was getting a little punchy at the end of this one.

Your comments on vendors, keynotes, show information, etc. are all valid and will be worked on for next year.

How about some new things? An art contest? Scavenger Hunt? Bring back Videogame Jeopardy which hasn't been seen since roughly 2002 (You ready Sniderman?). Keep those ideas coming.

John

[Sniderman]

Bring back Videogame Jeopardy which hasn't been seen since roughly 2002 (You ready Sniderman?).

Absolutely. :)

[ubikuberalles]

An art contest or art exhibition would be cool. Especially if we could see firsthand some of the cross stitching and bead work that has been posted on this board.

Perhaps, at the show, some of the artists could talk about their work or about gaming artwork in general?

Videogame jeopardy would be great! I remember it from years ago and that was fun to watch.

I liked the T-shirt toss from the skybox. Continuing that tradition would be great. If the skybox could be used for something else during the show, that would be cool. (I can't think of anything at the moment).

[swlovinist]

Great Idea on the swap room changes. Is there any way that items for the auction could be on display for a longer period of time? I think that this would only benifit the auction, as people would be able to observe more in detail things that they are going to bid hundreds(and thousands) of dollars on.

[Lady Jaye]

Videogame Jeopardy is certainly something I'd love to participate to!

And if you need a female volunteer to present the auction prizes... ;)

[ubersaurus]

A couple more keynote ideas...maybe something on handhelds? I'm thinking the old dedicated ones from the 70s and 80s, but getting someone from the early 90s NOA might bring out some interested Game Boy stories.

I'd also be interested in some of the "players" from the genesis era Sega of America, to talk about their experiences there...as well as what went wrong with Saturn.

Or maybe something involved with the marketing of games? There have been some memorable tv and magazine ads over the years, culminating with the ARGs used to sell Halo and Gun. Although I'm not sure how easy it would be to get anyone involved with that particular field, it would be an interesting keynote.

A homebrewers keynote would be a real fascinating listen as well. Homebrewed games, adaptors, accessories, and portable consoles all come to mind.

Art contest would be really cool, I saw some nice craftwork at the last expo.

[evg2000]

First off, I'm not complaining, if I where a vendor paying good money for a table, only to have people selling stuff for 50%-75% cheaper than what I'm selling stuff for I would be upset also.

I don't know that it should be a swap room if the rates are $15+ an hour as there won't be any swapping going on (has there been any i the last few years?)

I personally won't be selling anything at $15+ per hour, based on the prices I sold things for, and what I paid for them I think I cleared about $200, which I then spent on the vendors in the main hall.

Since I do spend about 3 - 4 hours in the swap room between Sat and Sun, if I don't bring things to sell that will be more time for me to have fun! Also, it will be a lot easier to go through the airport.

Maybe do away with the swap room entirely, and make it a room where people can kick back and talk, play games, do whatever. That would take care of the swap room controversy and add a place for people to talk, no don't try and charge $5.00 to go in the room and talk:)

Whatever you guys decide to do, there will be people upset, but no matter what you guys do a great job!

thanks,
Charles

[Dan Iacovelli]

I missed the t-shirt toss? that was prob after the 50.cent bonanza thing.
Also one think I think would be cool for keynotes: is to have people who have been doing fanzines for ages to complient the museum. sort of like what megagaming people do(katz,worely and kunkel) except have the editors of thier each own to doa round table of sorts. I know joe,myself and amybe a few others would be able to do it.
(it was an honnor to see my fanzine in the museum btw, thats a good addition
to the musuem to have fanzines included,not to put down the museum at MGC
but video game fanzines (and magazines) are part of the video game history)

[nationgamesdepot]

1. I was hoping for a few more vendors, but at least the ones there had a nice selection of stuff. I am a NES only collector, and only a few booths had NES stuff. Having 40-50 vendors might provide a better spectrum of stuff to buy. I know NintendoAGE.com will have a booth next year for sure, so there is one more :D

2. If possible plan out the keynotes in advance and post the list online, I missed several of them before I even knew they had started. I assume that some of the speakers had time constraints and that is why it wasn't done. I would also love to see a wider variety of speakers on top of the ones that was already attending.

3. I thought the swap room should have been a bit larger cause it got pretty crapped at times and was hard to navigate with a few bags of stuff.

4. And prob my biggest beef is that some items sold out before the doors were even opened. Al Bailey's Sudoky 2007 was bought up by all the vendors before the expo even started. I waited in line for over an hour + to get one to only be told they were already gone. I heard a few other similar stories as well.

5. My last suggustion was is just a random idea. There should be a PC in the auction room the night of the auction so paypal payments could be made on certain high price items. I had to restain from bidding on a few items I wanted simply cause I ran out of cash. The auction itself might become even more lucrative (if that is possible) for the sellers if the winning bidder could send over the payment via paypal. Just have an extra box on the form you fill out to mark paypal as accepted or not and state it in the auction terms. I know I would have spent more money this way.

Just a few random ideas. I really loved the show and don't want you guys to think otherwise, just a few minor improvement :D Keep up the great work.
~~NGD

[DreamTR]

evg2000: Getting rid of the swap room would be silly. There are tons of people lugging things for trade that go through that room and sell. I think if you just combine the two areas there would be no issue with the vendors. THe Swap Room is one of the most popular parts of CGE.

I understand the main vendors concerns about people staying in the Swap Room all day, but it's not exactly $100 a table in the convention unless you pre-book three months in advance. I would have gotten a table for $100, but no way I would have known there was that much stuff I was going to be selling. Keep this in mind too, the Swap Room is not open the entire duration of the show, there are 4 hours where you are not able to sell items. 10 hrs at $10 an hour is $100 for the weekend if they raised the price. For a buyer and a seller, the Swap Room is a great part of CGE, but the bottom line is the people that made the most money at CGE are the ones that had the best prices, not the ones that sold only in one area of the show. The guy in the corner of the convention cleared 5-6K I think with his stuff.


Nationgamesdepot: Best Way to get 40-50 vendors is to combine the Swap and Convention. There were easily 40 this year with the Swap combined.

[16-bit]

What was the final paid attendance number for 2007?

[Sothy]

i had just a handfull of stuff in the swap room and it was 5 $ for this big table then i got rid of most of it and took off. The guys next to me rented a table i just let them use the excess space on mine. maybe those size tables could be lined into 3rds and each 3rd 5$ an hour. So that way if you are setting up a big like booth type thing you pay the premium but if yer just actually getting rid of some trade stuff its not gonna cost the same.

[mezrabad]

Is there anyway to have it at a place that will allow CGE to count "standard" room-nights towards their room-night quota? The deluxe rooms were nice enough and having a fridge and a view was also nice, but I think I would have rather spent less on lodging and more on videogames.

Does it have to be in Las Vegas? I loved the time I spent at the expo but I wasn't terribly impressed with the city itself. Despite the interesting attractions at the various casinos, by Sunday evening my son and I were quite tired of the noisy casino floors, the smell of ciguarette smoke, the people handing out prostitution advertising cards (collect the set!), the traffic, the heat and the advertising for shows featuring female impersonators (wtf?). Granted, if you're trying to pickup walk-in traffic, I guess I can understand the choice of venue, but for my son and I, Vegas was more of a "con" rather than a "pro".

On a similar note: It was astonishing to me that such a "classy joint" of a hotel charged out the ying-yang for wireless internet when the $50 a night, one- and two-star motels we stayed at going to and from Vegas offered it for free.

CGE on its own was great. The vendors were really great: friendly, interesting and had some great stuff. The swap room was also a great place to go, but I can certainly see, from a vendor perspective, the loophole that needs to be tightened.

I would have liked to see more videogame oriented crafts for sale or on display. It was cool going to the customportables booth just to enjoy the interesting portables the guy had made, as well as the kitchen magnets on sale at y-bots table.

Just my two-bits.

[Dan Iacovelli]

vegas is currently being under conruction with new hotels and attractions being built.
if you are worried about walking the stip you don't have to now with duce $5.00 gives you a 24 hr pass.
they did move the show cali for 2 years and that didn't out well as they did from past shows in vegas.
getting back to swap room: I think that it's a blessing that they have that.
one of these years I might take advantage of it to sell off some stuff from my cafepress shop.

[nationgamesdepot]

It was my first time in Vegas as well and I really wasn't a huge fan. I am not a big time gambler and I did get sick of the casino quickly. I would love to have the expo swap to new cities each year so I would be able to see new places and stuff, but Vegas is a pretty good city for the event. The main perk of swapping cities would be to allow different regional members to attend who can't afford airfare. Planning it in the same city/location each year would make it much easier for the planners each year, and since they aren't making any money off this, I'd say let's keep it as easy as we can ;)
~~NGD

[ianoid]

OK, so it was a fun show, but I would like to see more vendors and sponsors. I think there is a critical mass that you have to reach to get the big time promotion going, or you have to get some momentum. Last year was a momentum losing year in some respects. I can't see why CGE can't go for (not necessarily get) more major corporate sponsors, like Xbox Live Arcade.

I would like to see some contests, but high score contests kind of suck. A few years back we had stuff like a Crazy Jump Crazy Taxi contest. At another show (that was very tiny) they had a speed contest on world 1-1 for the original SMB. I like contests that don't require you to be an <<insert game here>>HEAD to win. Or how about a Warlords arcade tournament? AND a Warlords 2600 tournament. Unfortunately these are things that require more bodies, and I'm not volunteering. Although it would be easier for more folks to help if they had smaller responsibilities, like one contest or another.

I think that the auction was way too long. I think that 2 hours is the limit for most to sit still, no matter the cause. And the MOST IMPORTANT point I can make is that the auction needs to be organized earlier in the day, like items should be out by noon and on display for the rest of the day for observation.

My comments on the swap room. I think that you could make it $10 for the first hour then $20 for the second, $30 for the third and fourth. I think it's great for you guys to be so happy to sell for peanuts, but when you make the step to being a vendor, you have to pay for your space. Whoever is doing the door has to be strict about it. Otherwise, you are going to scare off the real vendors. Another option is to have rotation tables in the mail hall. You could have 6 tables scattered around the place that have 1 hour allotments, 30 minutes apart, and they have to be cleared out every hour. People could sign up for the tables in advance for $20 a table- or at the show starting at a certain time. Or whatever. Just an idea as as substitute for the swap room. Although I do like the Swap Room. I scored a ton of great stuff there this year. Thanks again everyone! BTW I was the haggling prick who insisted on lowering prices for even the most rampant deals, in case you were wondering. "Ten for this you must be mad."

EVG2000 (Charles) no offense, but complaining about paying $15 in the name of selling $200 isn't so bad. Folks at bigger shows pay $1000 for a booth to sell $3000. And DreamTR (Jason) you spent alot of time there and had some awesome stuff that deserved more space. I'm sorry you didn't spring for a table in the main hall- you would have had one of the best spaces. For a guy like DreamTR, it would have been tough to move after just one hour.

Traders have to realize that the show has to be careful about offending the big vendors who spend more to support the show. It would be like a bank offering the same fee waivers to checking account customers who keep balances $500 as the big customers with $5000 average balances. The bigger spenders have to be treated as special, and dumping space at the show for $5 an hour would be considered offensive to most vendors.

Having typed this, I believe that cheap space should remain a part of the show, but with associated drawbacks to make the booth vendors feel better. If anything, the price of the cheap tables should be raised to lower the price on the expensive booths, etc.

Oh yeah- it would be good to see the show coordinated with/against Comicon. You guys have to find out when that megashow is and plan CGE the weekend before or afterward if possible. I'm not into Comics at all, but even I'd consider going, know it's an insanely huge show. I don't think I could sell, since booths are like $1k or whatever. I'm sure there is an overlap of clientele. The sooner you can post a date, the better. Perhaps other shows can watch out for CGE.

It was great to see everyone, and I just wish I could see everyone more often, perhaps under the auspices of a slightly less commerce oriented show. Something like a trade and game thing with some chairs, no tables, lots of monitors, 9am-12am.

[Dan Iacovelli]

ian, were you hinting about my show with the smb speed contest(yes VGS is a small show compared to others and thats what it attended to be, give a few more years the show might grow bigger and relocate to newer location,but for the price I got it was(and still is) worth it).
I would like to see more high score stuff at cge as well(the only high score stuff I saw was twin galaxies sinistar,gorf and donkey kong, I would love to see some console high scores though)
I do know there were couple tourneys going on during the after party,but I wasn't much interested in them since I snuck in around 45min after nine just getting back from freemont.

[evg2000]

EVG2000 (Charles) no offense, but complaining about paying $15 in the name of selling $200 isn't so bad. Folks at bigger shows pay $1000 for a booth to sell $3000. And DreamTR (Jason) you spent alot of time there and had some awesome stuff that deserved more space. I'm sorry you didn't spring for a table in the main hall- you would have had one of the best spaces. For a guy like DreamTR, it would have been tough to move after just one hour.



Ian,
I'm not in the least bit offended, though I want to clear up one thing the $200 was before I paid $20 for the 4 hours I spent, so with the new plan it would be $60, so I would have taken home $140.

Believe it or not, I'm not complaining, and I didn't want to start a big discussion, even before I saw the possible change in policy I had mentioned to my wife that I might not bring anything next year, the reasons I had told her where:
1. Saves us from having to bring 2 extra suitcases at 50 pounds (weight, not money) through the show.
2. Saves us $200 on a rental car.
3. Give me more time to play arcade games, go to talks, haras the other guys in the swap, etc.

Swap meet, no swap meet, $5 an hour, $20 an hour I don't care, I go for the show and people, I need to stop selling (or sell on ebay) and enjoy the show more.

All opions expressed are my own, and agree or disagree it doesn't matter, let's just play games and have fun, and also get this topic back on track!!!!


:):) see smiley faces, I'm not offend.

[DreamTR]

Ian: I actually asked about getting a table the week before the show because I knew I would be bringing a ton of stuff, but no one one ever got back to me about it....I don't mind getting a table for $100, but $300 (after April 30 according to the CGE site) was out of the question for me. That's my only concern, momey is money, and I'll gladly pay $100-150 for a table for the weekend.

[Bojay1997]

and I appreciate the fact that I'm not the only one who feels the auction needs to have a much longer review period and a means of paying besides cash. Besides that, I really feel strongly that the panels need to be shaken up completely. How about some more hobby related panels? I would love to watch a panel made up of 5-6 of the collectors who put together some of the really rare stuff in the museum to hear about how they found what they have and tips for finding and preserving really rare stuff. I'd also like to hear more from the 16-bit developers or 8-bit developers on systems we have never had panels about like the Genesis, Master System or NES. I know many of them are probably in Japan, but there were a handful of US and European developers.

I would love to see more vendors and maybe the best way to do this is to guarantee some level of minimum sales or their booth rental will be waived. I think the swap room is great as-is and charging more to reduce the disparity in rates with the vendors is not the way to go. If you're only making $200 profit (which it really isn't when you factor in your time, effort and transportation), you shouldn't have to pay a 20% or 30% surcharge since you could always sell on Ebay or this forum with a far smaller surcharge.

I'd really like to ask the organizers to please make an effort to resolve whatever differences there are with the other folks who have been involved with the various incarnations of this show. I'd love to see the return of vendors like Best Electronics and top collectors like Curt Vendel and the folks at Atariage. I really don't know what all the problems have stemmed from. I can't imagine that the problems are unresolveable, particularly since almost everyone who attends CGE visits AtariAge and other boards on a regular basis.

Finally, I've suggested this in the past, but the organizing committee really needs to be expanded to make this show grow. There are lots of people here who work in PR, media and television, as well as related creative industries who could really take the show to the next level. All you need to do is give them an opportunity to participate in things like organizing guests, publicity and sponsors and the core CGE organizing group can focus on the basic show logistics. I know it's tough sometimes to delegate, but until you do it, things can never grow.

[CX2K]

Great ideas everyone! Here's some more info.

re: Comic-con - we got stuck this year. These were the only dates we could get and we had no idea about Comic-con. We already know the dates for next years Comic-con and will be planning accordingly.

re: Atariage - There are no problems on our end. As I stated in our keynote, we made a peace offering directly to AA and there was talk of them coming. In the end, it was just not feasible on their end but I would expect them to be there next year.

re: Best Electronics - Best has been invited every year. This past year, Brad told me that he no longer attends shows because of the issues with heightened security and the fact that he brings all his stock to the show in suitcases. Honestly, when was the last time you heard of Best being at a show?

re: Auction & Swap Meet - Not sure what the best solution is for the Swap Room. We'll have to look at our options and make a decision. One of the issues about the auction is that earlier registration would mean finding a volunteer to sit there and register items instead of seeing the show. Also, where would we store the items and who would watch them. Way ahead of you guys on the paypal thing but the wireless service we had in the room didn't work down in the auction room otherwise we would have had it going this year. We'll revisit again next year. As with many things with this show, we don't pay much (= $0) so it's tough to get a lot of volunteers. Anybody want to volunteer give me a shout!

re: media & promotion - this has definitely been a sore spot over the past several years. We tapped someone at the show this year who is in the media industry so I would expect a lot of improvement in this area. Sponsorship - you can be sure we hit all the big names but most of them never follow through.

re: keynotes - great ideas although I didn't think they were that bad this year. You had Jay Smith who hasn't been there in a while, Al Alcorn had a nice Powerpoint presentation, newcomer Steve Wright (2600 Pele Soccer) joined the Atari panel, and there was even a keynote by the three organizers. One of the limiting factors was that alumni in general were a little light, a situation that should be resolved next year.

Any ideas for new events?

Thanks,
John

[swlovinist]

A possible idea for the auction is to have a long table in the same room as the museum that is taped off from people touching with items pre registered for the show. Another idea I had is to possibly contact some current game companies that do reto compliations or have upcoming comp games. I remember when Midway came to the show showing off their reto comp and I thought it was great. It adds diversity. While I think that having Atari Age is great, I think that it will be inportant for future shows to be balanced and not too "classic classic". If too much of the show is dedicated to Atari, this might hurt other collectors who are more interested in other game systems. At this point, any vendors would be helpful to the show. I know that I have rambled on many of these posts, but I am only trying to offer constructive criticism to make the show better. I am passionate about making these shows the best they can be. I consider myself to be one of the bigger "all arounder" collectors who doesnt have my collection focused solely on atari or classic systems. I think that the show left me with much desired for neo classic systems and beyond. Yes there was some Nes, Sega, and more, but it could have been MUCH MUCH more. I think that the show could be MUCH MUCH more. The real question is, does CGE want to reside with just bringing in the same attendance every year or does it want to branch out to new collectors for newer systems? If these things cannot be addressed, then I fear that other shows will pop up that will address them.

[Phosphor Dot Fossils]

Maybe, I don't know who's wheels we'd have to grease to get permission, but maybe we could do an MST3K thing with game-themed movies (Tron, The Wizard, Joy Sticks, etc.) as part of next show's live entertainment.

I'd volunteer my services for this, but only - and this is an absolute ONLY - if Sniderman and Flack were in on it with me. And only if the program/event listing explains ahead of time that we'd be jabbering all through the movie. LOL

[katchoo]

Any ideas for new events?


Since CGE sponsors a charity every year, why don't we do more? There could be a raffle or a wheel spin where folks donate money and have a chance to win various prizes. Maybe the Riv would chip in some from passes to the buffet or the vendors could give some coupons...DP books and t-shirts would be great too.

If we did the wheel spin and had just one or two really awesome prizes - arrange it so if folks landed on "the spot" they get a t-shirt and a chance to win the monster prize (and maybe a 2nd place).

It's a fun way for everyone to have a chance to donate to CGE's charity of choice. :)

[rik1138]

Oh yeah- it would be good to see the show coordinated with/against Comicon. You guys have to find out when that megashow is and plan CGE the weekend before or afterward if possible. I'm not into Comics at all, but even I'd consider going, know it's an insanely huge show.

For those that have never been to Comic-Con, keep in mind that it's not a comic show anymore- It's basically a full entertainment show. It's like E3, a comics convention, an Anime convention and a Sci-Fi/Star Wars/Star Trek con all in one... Hell, the CGE guys could probably do their history of gaming exhibit there since E3 kind of died as a fun event... It would probably fit in...

I was going to mention the idea of a separate table in the museum just for upcoming auction items... I think that would work out well. PayPal is also a definite must (although, in hind-sight, I'm glad it wasn't an option this year... :) )

Rik

[Mayhem]

And San Diego isn't THAT far from Vegas... having next year's CGE the weekend before Comicon would certain suit my desires and wallet :)

I heard there was a plan for Paypal at the auction this year, I guess John just explained why that never transpired. If it had been, I might have been walking away with more than zero ;)

As for the swaproom, I was gonna post this last night and completely forgot about it, so posting now though some of what I wanted to say has been covered by other people anyhow. Put simply, if the room was more than $5-10 then I wouldn't have bothered bringing the measly amount of items I could stuff into my suitcase to try and sell to people, wouldn't be worth my time or the cost.

I did manage to sell about half of what I brought, including all the Retro Survival CDs (knew I should have brought more, thanks to all that took them!) so I did make some decent money for the time I was in the room. But if it was $15 or more per hour it wouldn't be worth it, I'd save the space for anything I bought or bringing more items for the museum.

[BydoEmpire]

Personally I LOVED the keynotes, and I never get tired of hearing from these gaming icons. However, it would be really cool to have a panel of homebrew creators.

[Pantechnicon]

- I second the idea of a sit-down area where people can congregate together to do linked handheld gaming, chat, etc. I saw a few people at 2K7 also playing assorted collectible card games at booths. A sitting area would have been conducive to this as well. Nothing fancy needed. Just set up an area like they had at CGE's past at the Plaza consisting of round tables and chairs.

- (EDIT - Looks like John Hardie already addressed catering, but I'll let my comments stand) Although the Riv had very good options for food, the trade-off was that one had to hike from the show to all the way across the convention facilities and the hotel to get to the food court and restaurants. Would it be possible to get a catering option inside the CGE area? Again, I'm thinking of the Plaza, where they would set up that little area where attendees could buy inexpensive and convenient fare like hot dogs, nachos, sodas (gamers are not necessarily picky eaters) without having to leave the show. A similar setup for CGE2K8 would be nice, assuming it's not too cost prohibitive.

[RetroYoungen]

A homebrewers keynote would be a real fascinating listen as well. Homebrewed games, adaptors, accessories, and portable consoles all come to mind.

QFT. I'm honestly not really big on the keynotes personally, but there are usually a few that comes to mind that when I hear them I get excited. The T&T keynote was fun, and one starring homebrew developers would be absolutely cool. It'd be a bit like talking to the great developers we've sat in on in the past, AS they're developing new games.

Video game Jeopardy!, you say? I'm THERE... probably to humiliate myself, but I'm still there. ^_^

And PDF, I might not be Flack or Sniderman, but I'd help out with something like that... I love to heckle. :D

[vectrexer]

- Again, I'm thinking of the Plaza, where they would set up that little area where attendees could buy inexpensive and convenient fare like hot dogs, nachos, sodas (gamers are not necessarily picky eaters) without having to leave the show. A similar setup for CGE2K8 would be nice, assuming it's not too cost prohibitive.

I have to second and third this one here.

Even if this the facility provided the food in the main area, I do know there is the ability to arrange for the specific restaraunts to bring items to the floor. You just have to make it worth their while to do so.

I hate to say this, maybe a daquiri/beer stand at the next show. We may loose John before the auction starts though. :cheers:

[vectrexer]

Let's have a handheld tournament next time. Both old and new.

If we can get the new platforms (Sony, Nintendo,etc) to donate retroware (Atari Intellivison) mores the better for the gaming being in the style of the show. But either way more tournament action next time.

[TNTPLUST]

I like the Jeopardy game. That was fun a few years ago.

How about a Deal or No Deal. I wanna see someone give away a suitcase with a really rare game over one with an ET or Combat cart.

How about a Lets make a deal. Guess the value of a game (Digital Press guides used as the reference of course).

How about a Raffle? Since I know you guys came up a little short this year all proceeds could go to pay for CGE.

Maybe a cosplay runway show. Prizes for best dressed, most obscure character, sexiest (no middle age fat men please), Best "Worst" Character.

Little excursions like this are fun to participate and watch.

I liked the idea of a homebrew or prototype keynotes.

My two cents on the Swap:
I could see how vendors were threatened by this years swap. Every year you have offered I have taken a table for 1 hour. I sell carts for $1-$3 and only do it because my 9 year old daughter and 14 year old son enjoy it so much. I made about $40 before I paid my $5 fee this year which I give them to split. IMHO if you want to keep the little guy in the swap room but force the bigger dealers to the vendor room put a time limit on it. $15 and hour would probably knock me out from selling as I do it for fun not profit. Finally the
Swap room needs a sign up sheet for those waiting for a table.

I also want to point out that like every year I DID take trades.

4 Vic-20 carts for 1 Apple II Gremlins

1 Space Panic Colecovision for A Cardboard Tank

1 Odyssey II Conquest of the World (Missing two game pieces) for a Mini Remote control Car

3 TI-99 4/a Carts (Dont have a clue of which ones) for a Diet Coke (I was thirsty).

[sidnotcrazy]

Keynotes – More, More, More that is all I can say. This was my first year, and I loved the keynotes. I know for some they may have heard it all before, but I to see and hear the masters speak, its a priceless experience. Mixing it up is a great idea, and bringing in more people, and panels would be fantastic.

Workshops – I think that a couple workshops would work wonders for CGE. Maybe a, how do I get into _______. This could be anything from gaming journalism to homebrewing. I am sure there are lots of show goers that would donate their time, and I bet most people would be interested.

About the Swap Meet room, I understand that some vendors may feel a little sore about this issue. But I think if used properly the Swap Meet fills a void for show goers. For me I brought a couple things from home, and sold almost everything. I was in there less than 45 minutes, and made enough money to spend on other things at the show. I know someone in this thread mentioned something about table space, and I think that might be the best way to go with this, and kick them out when their hour is up.

This year was my first year attending CGE, and I have to say I had a blast. Easily the best convention I have ever had the pleasure of attending.

[digitalpress]

About the Swap Meet room, I understand that some vendors may feel a little sore about this issue. But I think if used properly the Swap Meet fills a void for show goers. For me I brought a couple things from home, and sold almost everything. I was in there less than 45 minutes, and made enough money to spend on other things at the show.

Thanks for the feedback!

YOU are the type of person the swap meet was created for - in, out in an hour, got your goods out there in a busy environment and back to the show you go. We're seriously going to work on keeping people from camping out in that room, one way or another.

Glad you enjoyed the show. We're already brainstorming on 2k8, this is the first time in CGE history the organizing team hasn't slipped into hibernation for a few months after the show :)

[Phosphor Dot Fossils]

Wild-ass panel idea: Tron reunion. Seriously. Boxleitner, Bridges, and...uh ...the guy who played Ram. And Steve Lisberger, the writer/director. The actress who played Yori has done PhillyClassic before, so why not?

The worst they can do is say "What? No! Did that Earl guy put you up to this?"

[Dan Iacovelli]

Wild-ass panel idea: Tron reunion. Seriously. Boxleitner, Bridges, and...uh ...the guy who played Ram. And Steve Lisberger, the writer/director. The actress who played Yori has done PhillyClassic before, so why not?

The worst they can do is say "What? No! Did that Earl guy put you up to this?"

I happen to have the e-mail addy of the person who set that up for philly classic. the thing is they might want $$$$ to do it unless you can talk them to do it for free. (he contacted me about my show,but at the time which was this year,I wasn't doing it this year)

[DreamTR]

The guy that watches the Swap Room can also take in items for the auction so people can see them, that would kill two birds with one stone....

[Mayhem]

That gets a thumbs up from me... I met Cindy at last year's San Diego Comicon (http://farm1.static.flickr.com/72/198085226_7786f35bc3.jpg) and it would be great to somehow get everyone together for a panel and talk. Highly unlikely but you can dream ;)

[MachineGex]

CINDY MORGAN = hot chick from "Caddy Shack" movie. I good with that!

Looks like she does do conventions, golf events and fundraisers. She is in business with some people who sell Caddy Shack merchandise, like "Bushwood" hats, golf balls etc.
http://www.caddyshackevents.com/

[Phosphor Dot Fossils]

I wouldn't expect to see David Warner show up unless he stows away in Mayhem's luggage. He's based out of the UK now and is all but retired, and at any rate, even something like 10 years ago, it was my understanding that one of the best ways to get him to stand up and walk out of an interview was to mention Tron. LOL

And tell them they can charge for autographs. They might be a little more inclined to show up.

[Sniderman]

...it was my understanding that one of the best ways to get [David Warner] to stand up and walk out of an interview was to mention Tron. LOL

Hell, then don't mention Freakazoid.
http://www.internationalhero.co.uk/f/freakzo2.jpg

[swlovinist]

There have been alot of great recommendations so far. I just came back from PAX, which was huge, and awsome(30,000 attendees awsome). I saw alot of things that made the show AWSOME, and thought I would add my additional two cents about what makes any game convention awsome. These additional comments are made to make the show Better(which I will be attending and spending money on).

1. Diversity. Classic gaming expo prides itself on being "the big show of the US." CGE needs to do a much better job at recruiting a wider audience. I just came from a show of thousands of gamers that probably would attend CGE, but think that the show just covers mosly "Atari generation stuff". I am 31, and feel that there are generations younger than me that would come to a show that showcased Snes, Genesis, N64, PSX and more. Sure, our show had some pockets of stuff, but overall the nature of the show is "Atari and Atari related classics".

I think that a detailed survey is in order on what systems people collect. This survey could be generated at survey monkey or another survey site, and could be posted at this site as well as OTHER BIGGER GAME FORUMS. Penny Arcade, 1up.com, C64.com, etc.etc. on what systems and products could be sold to make CGE a better experience, as well as why people would not want to come to the annual show.

2. Merge. I do think that a possibility about CGE being a bigger event is to possibly merge it with a large game event that is happening at the same time.
In this day and age of events, merging with another large game event(Comic.con, California Extreme, etc) might not be a bad idea.

3. Market. I agree with possibly getting a coroportate sponsor to help fund the show, in return for free advertising. If these game companies throw down alot for advertising, then I bet one of them would throw down a little in extange for their name being plastered everywhere. I bet you could get a buyer or two if you tried. Capcom, SNK playmore, Konami, Midway, Microsoft, Nintendo, Sony, hell why not? If there is a little new gaming with the old, it just adds to the diversity, not to mention generates more attendees.

[nationgamesdepot]

Some very interesting points swlovinist. I don't agree with merging with a larger show though, once that happens the show will lose its laid back nature and would prob take part of the fun out of it at least for me. I agree there should be a little bit more diveristy at the show, but there was plenty to keep me happy. I went to meet people more than find stuff, but finding stuff is a great bonus.

Having a corporate sponsor would be great, but they might be to demanding on the CGE staff and expect to much. Then they wouldn't enjoy the show either and what is the point then. But if a sponsor could be found that just wanted to setup a booth and have some demos playable it might help the guys out tremendously. Just my 2 cents.
~~NGD

[swlovinist]

Bottom line: There are alot of retrogamers younger than the 30s and 40 year olds I saw walking around at the CGE show. The truth of the matter is that Nintendo and beyond collectors far superceed the atari collectors, mostly due to Nintendo the company still being around, and still making great products.

Why not tap into that market more? There are many retrogamers are far beyond collecting atari, the atari days, and anything early 80s. Just like how gaming has evolved, so does retrogaming. Either we change with the times or get stuck doing the same thing and watch the attendance stay flat(something I have noticed, not counting the drop I saw in 2005)

I was thinking of just a bigtime vendor showing up at the show, not a coroportate running the show. The Midway booth a couple a years back was a perfect example. Something that fits the theme of retrogaming, but possibly being a product for a current system. I know that I have rambled, something that I am good at.

I just keep thinking that the some of the stubbornness of changing(comes with getting older) is getting in the way of growth.

Yet another recommendation: One thing at PAX that impressed me that CGE could copy would be a portable lounge with big pillows to just hang out at. I nearly saw thousands of DS gamers that were utilizing these big pillow things. What a great idea, that could be used for portable gamers....something of a market that his HUGE.

[Dan Iacovelli]

merging with another show,is bad idea for CGE.
However, why not have like what MGC have been doing
which having a smaller show included (Jagfest was part of CGE 2003,I would like to see that make a return) and maybe add a dreamcon for dremcast games.
CGE did have section at E3 and they did say that wasn't worth it.
the portable lounge is a good idea.

[swlovinist]

Having CGE being part of another classic convention or merging with another classic game convention is a good idea. I vote for one that centers around a newer successful system from the neo-classic period.

[ubersaurus]

You know, a panel about video game comics couldn't be half bad. I don't know how difficult to be to get them, but the Penny Arcade guys certainly would fit that bill-as well as being a vendor in their own right. Probably increase attendance to get someone as high profile as those two.

I can't agree with CGE merging with another convention, simply because it would take away the autonomy of the organizers. Once you change that dynamic, it changes the whole show.

[thegardentool]

I've never been to a CGE so I don't know what all is there but what about a console/computer mod contest? A lot of PC gaming conventions have modding contests.

[ubikuberalles]

I agree that merging CGE with another event would be a bad idea. I remember when VGXPO merged with NBC back in 2005 and that was a mess.

However, CGE could incorporate some non-gaming features into it to mix it up a little and breathe more life into it.

For example:

- Try to encourage more cosplay into CGE? I really liked JeanneRocket's costume and it would be cool to see more. Perhaps a cosplay contest in the show? Or maybe coordinate CGE so that it is next door to a cosplay convention?
- Comic books and anime have a close connection to gaming, classic or modern. There was an anime related booth at CGE this year. Let's see more of that next year. Maybe even a keynote that's anime related?

WORKSHOPS:

One idea I've been kicking around for the past few years is some kind of workshop at CGE. At this workshop the participants could work out a design for a new homebrew game or even a piece of homebrew hardware. The workshop could also be about repair techniques, how to set up MAME boxes or perhaps how to convert a console into a portable system (maybe we could get Ben Heckendorn to show up and participate?).

I use the term workshop instead of keynote because the topics listed above would require a lot more time than the hour or so a keynote would offer. This workshop would require a dedicated room or section of the main floor in order to function well. The workshop may also require participation after CGE. Perhaps a sub-forum or dedicated site would be needed for this after CGE activity. Perhaps this workshop idea is too technical for CGE but I'd like to see some kind of gathering or discussion from those who've already created homebrews, hacked old consoles or just know how to repair the classic systems.

KEYNOTE SPEECH TOPICS:

When it comes to keynotes, I've become a jaded CGE attendee. Most of the topics I've seen before. There is nothing wrong with the topics in this years CGE since there are a lot of new people who haven't seen these talks before. However, as a jaded CGE attendee, I'd like to see some new and exciting topics to liven things up. This years keynote about CGE (a meta-keynote you could say) was really cool and exciting.

Here's some ideas for other topics:

- Emulators. What's out there. The ethics of emulators. Are they good or are they ruining the whole gaming scene?
- I mentioned Ben Heckendorn before. Let's have him talk about his portable conversion projects. I'm sure he has some good stories to tell. At the very least he could use it as a opportunity to promote his book.
- Really controversial stuff: warez, ROMS, etc. Is it wrong for the owner of a rare prototype to keep the code to himself or should he dump the ROM and distribute it freely? There are a lot of other controversial topics we could discuss. Just look at some of the hot threads on the DP forum. Let's not make it too controversial; we don't want fist fights here. :)
- The present and future of gaming. CGE keynotes tend to focus mostly on the past. I think we should also have talks on the present state of gaming and what the future looks like for both retro and modern gaming. This year Bill Kunkel touched briefly on the future of gaming publication. I'd like to see more of this kind of stuff.

I think I'm brainstormed out for the moment.

[Sothy]

Beer vendors on the floor from open to close.

[ubersaurus]

It may be interesting to get some of the folks from Digital Eclipse and/or the Xbox Live Arcade department to talk about their experiences making and releasing games on their service. Lord knows it's become a bastion of high score junkies and quick gameplay(as well as my primary gaming on the 360 at the moment!)

[WizDawg]

I consider myself a classic gamer. I mostly play Atari 2600, 7800, 5200, NES, SNES, TG16, Vectrex, Genesis, and DS(for online Tetris play). So CGE is the place for me. But I'm also a big fan of classic computers. Love the Atari 800 and TI to play games. I wish more computer stuff was for sale and on display. Also it would of been nice to see the Commodore group have their convention as part of CGE since it was happening at the same time.

[rick weis]

first off i want to say Thank you to all of the CGE staff and helpers, it's great that CGE is back! had a blast and spent waaaaay too much money!

as many have said, CGE needs more vendors! (not that i'm complaining) but if you lowered the price for vendors booth/tables (i know you lowered it this year!!! and i don't have a problem with the prices) but still, for most collectors that is a bit too high. there are a lot of collectors out there that have a ton of extra stuff, and you could easily get twice (if not more) as many vendors if you lowered the price of the tables and booths. our NWCGE show last year area was only 3500 sqft and we had 18 vendors. and no offence, but NWCGE has more product for sale then CGE! and we are just a small little show! you need to do better in that area! not just looking for BIG names vendors, but ones that will bring tons of good deals for your show. many good deals=happy buyers and that means i will spend even more money! :P

see ya next year! we will return! :)

Rick

[ubersaurus]

Plutos and Sirius >D

You know a panel on import gaming and collecting may be an interesting subject. Good places to go searching in Japan, good import games, advice for actually playing some if you don't know Japanese. Only problem is I have no idea who'd be in it!

[Mayhem]

Yes, but on the other hand that's why several "dealers" and "sellers" were in the trade room all day both days, because it was a lot cheaper than being in the main room. Prompting complaints from some who had paid for tables.

[rick weis]

Well, that's why we have the trade room. If tables were priced cheap enough for everyone, you'd basically end up with a flea market. If you saw the organizers' keynote, you'd know there's no money to be made from running the show. No offense, but running a show like CGE isn't the same as running NWCGE. With a show that size, you're somewhat limited in what you can (and can't) do. Compared to what VGXPO is charging this year, CGE tables are pretty much free... so maybe they should be raised? ;)

As far as who has more product, there was less this year than in shows past b/c two of the biggest vendors (B&C and Telegames) couldn't make it. But people go to CGE for multiple reasons besides vendors (museum, keynotes, auction, etc.) so having more product doesn't necessarily translate to more attendees.

what's wrong with a flea market? would anyone that goes to CGE be offended to see 100 vendors there? (well maybe a few vendors would) :P not ME!! like that guy CGE had in the corner of the room, if they had 20-40 more like him, i dought any attendees would complain about that! would they?? would you?
trade room is great, but it's in a different room and that's is getting people to leave the main floor room, it would be like having the arcades in the front of the hotel, you don't want to draw people away from the main floor, you want to draw them in. IMO

hey, no offence taken! every show has there special thing they work at more, CGE has a lot of everything, (well except many contests, atari 2600, CV...ect, that would be nice to see) problem is most people that goes to CGE has seen the museum, keynote many times, (not to mention the same old vendors) would love to see the auctions go longer but dought John can last too much longer while drinking doing it. :P

yeah i know most the hotels charge up the ying yang for EVERYTHING now! it's all about nickel and dimeing you to death! even though the nickel and dime is more $50/$100 and more...ect it's a hard balance to have a show break even and still have prices not too high to get more vendors/people in to them.

"having more product doesn't necessarily translate to more attendees" part truth! but it does help keep the ones that go to cge (that are there to buy stuff) a lot more happier. :)

don't get me wrong, i don't mean to be bashing CGE, i would love to see CGE get bigger and better each year! but attendees wise, that is not happening ...so far! at least from my view.

Rick

[DreamTR]

The biggest complaints from NEW attendees is that there just aren't ENOUGH vendors, so I'm not sure why anyone would complain about the Swap Room. That's the best part if you come to spend your money there. The only people upset about the Swap Room are the ones who paid more to have a booth during the show.

I am 100% certain if they had some sort of last minute Vendor thing for a table for $100 for the weekend, people would have taken advantage of it.

[PingvinBlueJeans]

There weren't enough places to chill out...I'd like to see an opium den at CGE next year.

[DreamTR]

It was never intended for people to be table squatters. Joe already covered this here so I'm not going to rehash it again.





Nothing, except that the show wouldn't be in Vegas, and wouldn't attract much in the way of alumni or sponsorship...




It's not as though CGE ever turned away vendors, but then again... do they have ROOM for 100 vendors? Even doubling the number of vendors would be near-impossible, not without majorly inconveniencing everyone (go to a ChillerCon show sometimes, where you're shoulder-to-shoulder with people in an aisle 6 feet wide. Not exactly a fun experience...). And if they offer cheap tables in the main room, that would invariably affect (negatively) how many booths there were. Think about it-you'd have someone paying a few hundred for a booth sitting next to someone who paid $50 for a table. Even ChillerCon doesn't do that.

As for having things in different rooms, I don't see how you can have the museum, auction, or keynotes in the main room, so I'm not sure why having the trade room separate is an issue with anyone. If your show is comprised mostly of vendors (who have 'a' table, or part of a table) along with a few game stations, then having everyone in one room isn't a problem. As I said, CGE is a different show, so trying to apply rules that work for a show like NWCGE is just asking for problems IMO.



Regardless of the rehashing, a lot of the new people come to this convention and save up their cash because they want to buy and sell. There is no other event that comes close in terms of quantity and quality of items that could be sold at one time. If you have over 1,000 in one area, and everyone saves up to come to this, I would not understand a point of not having as many vendors as possible. Swap area should always be there. You take that away and cut the vendors, I guarantee you a lot of people will not come back. The CGE is great for history, keynotes, etc, but there are tons of people that come to buy/sell. Everyone goes for a different reason, but you can't deny the amount of customers wanting to buy buy buy as much as they can. If you have 1,000 people spending an average of $50 at the show, and that money just goes home with them, something is not right. $50 being EXTREMELY conservative. I can't even beging to tell you the amount of people I know that spent at least $1,000.

[DogP]

I can't even beging to tell you the amount of people I know that spent at least $1,000.

Drexel at the auction? :embarrassed:

DogP

[megamaniaman]

I personally think that a good way to solve the Swap Meet room situation is to have a 2 hour time limit. That way we can have even more vendors at the convention because every 2 hours there are fresh new faces.

[swlovinist]

Dream TR, and Rick Weis bring up some great points. The whole keynote speeches are ok, but man they have been done over and over again(same ones). CGE needs new blood badly in reguards to vendors and setup. I also think that the vendor price needs to be addressed. There are alot of vendors that would come and offer more flavor for the show(product) if the price was more reasonable. I know that change is tough, and that some may be resistant to change. The truth speaks though...CGE is having a rough time bringing in new blood.