Well, that was only a matter of time: Wii Passes Xbox 360 in Worldwide Sales (9/14) [Archive]

agbulls

08-22-2007, 09:18 PM

We knew it was coming - although many didn't ever think it was possible just a full year ago.

Does this mean the Wii is the eventual winner in the long term for this gen?

From Kotaku:

http://kotaku.com/gaming/retailed/wii-passes-xbox-360-in-worldwide-sales-292442.php

"It happened. Even with a year headstart, the Xbox 360 has been eclipsed by the Nintendo Wii in sales. According to independant tracker Video Game Chartz, the Wii just passed the 360 this week. Gotta numbers fetish? Here's the breakdown:

Wii: 10.57 Million sold (3.46M Japan, 4.24M America, 2.87M Others)
Xbox 360: 10.51 Million sold (0.43 Japan, 6.75 America, 3.32 Others)
PS3: 4.32 Million sold (1.13M Japan, 1.87 America, 1.32 Others)

Yes, that same info is directly above in handy chart form. So... Japan's a big gapping hole for Microsoft, huh? Always has been!"

July Hardware Figures
Wii: 425,000
DS: 405,000
PlayStation 2: 222,000
PlayStation Portable: 214,000
Xbox 360: 170,000
PlayStation 3: 159,000
Game Boy Advance: 87,000

Still in doubt about the Wii's absolute total dominance? It's looking like a lock to me now. No?

August Hardware Figures
Wii: 403,000
DS: 383,000
Xbox 360: 276,000
PlayStation 2: 201,000
PlayStation 3: 130,000
PSP: 115,000

Wolfrider31

08-22-2007, 09:51 PM

I love my Wii, but I'm definitely in the camp of the 360 being a superior system. Still, I hope Nintendo ends up being the winner in the long run, I just love a good underdog story. :D

alxbly

08-22-2007, 09:59 PM

With Halo 3 and Metroid Prime Corruption coming out soon the only prediction I'd make is that this is gonna be the closest console war in a very long time. Does anyone know how the Wii sales compare to the PS2 in it's first year?

sabre2922

08-22-2007, 11:10 PM

I would like to vote for "none of the above".

Its waaaaay to early to even begin to speculate wich new console will dominate this generation.

In fact Im under the impression that none of the new systems will get anywhere near dominating this gen like the PS2 did last generation.

This generation could turn out like the old 16-bit "wars" with Nintendo being Sega and microsoft possibly being Nintendo and possibly Sony being ummmm the Turbographix16?:?

yea something like that:-/

norkusa

08-22-2007, 11:18 PM

Does anyone know how the Wii sales compare to the PS2 in it's first year?

Yeah, I'd like to know that too. I still haven't seen a single Wii for sale yet. If Nintendo is selling a lot more Wii's than Sony sold PS2's during their first year (I started seeing PS2's 6 months after launch), I might actually believe them when they say they're trying their best to keep stores stocked.

whoisKeel

08-22-2007, 11:25 PM

Meh. I say there will be no clear winner. The market isn't what it was in the 16-bit years. There is now a much larger video game audience, and more clearly defined demographics.

I really don't see the Wii directly competing with the PS3 or the 360. Admit it now, the Halo'ers and Turismo'ers aren't going to commit solely to the Wii. The Wii is just carving out a nice niche for itself, but that niche just happens to be a very large demographic of "casual gamers". There has always been room for two, but now, there's room for three.

I say, between the 360 and the PS3 it will be as close as the SNES/Genesis debate. Nintendo will continue to dominate the market of video games (if you include console and handhelds), but aim for a much different demographic.

otaku

08-23-2007, 12:39 AM

Not surprised that it sold better than 360 in less time the price is significantly lower and the brand is very strong as is the name (it seems parents/kids remember it better than xbox 360) the thing is there are hardly any games for the damn thing and especially good ones. And the machine is underpowered I don't see it lasting long in the end unless they do really well with games etc but its gonna look really dated power wise

swlovinist

08-23-2007, 01:03 AM

There is going to be a battle this season. I think that the Wii will have a larger user base and will continue to dominate as long as the competition is over 100+ dollars more. As I have said before, Nintendo is the leading company for going after the casual gamer and the "non gamer". The wii is awsome, and I feel that Nintendo has a strong lineup coming. The 360 is looking solid with software as well. I think that once the 360 announces an offical hardware revision, it will help them. Also, Halo 3 is gonna drive sales as well. Unless the PS3 can throw a Hail Mary, they will not be a contender. 10 year plan or not, the PS3 has to either 1. Get Cheaper fast so that the non elite public can afford the system. 2. Deliver some exclusive software. Either way, they have their work cut out. I think that the Wii and 360 will be competitive for awhile, with the nod going to the Wii.

Lothars

08-23-2007, 01:21 AM

I think that the battle is far from over but 2 things

1. I think the PS3 will win, I think that the games will be getting better and better and surpass the 360 and Wii plus the PS3 has way better media center abilites than both the 360 and Wii which helps it alot.

2. I also think the Wii and 360 both will end up tie in a neck and neck battle for 2nd place but I don't think both the Wii will win, I see it dropping off in sales majorly especially since the games are really lackluster and even with Mario Galaxy coming out which I think looks really Meh, though SSBB is the game of the system by far.

The 360 is a great system and has a great future with a great online system but I don't trust Microsoft at all, it's quality is horrible and I could see MS dropping the system like they did with the xbox.

all in all especially after owning all three systems I really don't think Nintendo is gonna win, the Wii is such a meh system, The 360 is an amazing system that has horrible quality and I think the PS3 is my favorite system so far except right now they need to step it up with better games. but I think they will.

It's a Great Generation to be a gamer.

Icarus Moonsight

08-23-2007, 02:13 AM

Still too early to call. When Wii sales surpasses 360's in all regions then we'll have a better look at what we are dealing with. Where the PS3 is at that time in game library, cost and install base will also be a factor. I'd expect to see this between the span of just after this holiday season up to next year at this time.

I think Wii and 360 are in great shape to do well. They are after and cater to different markets and are pretty much not in competition. Conversly, Sony has a literal Everest of of a climb and are the worst off by far with a lot of work to be done. They are in direct competition with both MS and Nintendo, the 360 in NA and Euro/Aus regions and Wii/DS vs the PS3/PSP in Japan. Although Japan seems to be a lock for Nintendo at this point.

If you asked me to throw a bet for the winner down now, I'd decline. Will the Wii be able to last in the market the full 4-5 years? (I tend to think so.) Will 360's hardware issues dog the system through-out it's lifespan? Possible. Will Sony finally swallow their pride, discard the arrogance and get a clue? Who knows?! If forced to make a decision at this point I'd pick all three systems to place, being a smartass that favors a sure bet. :p

Anthony1

08-23-2007, 02:21 AM

At e3 wasn't it revealed that MS sold 11.6 million 360's so far and fell short of their goal for 12 million by the end of fiscal 2007? If so, then Video Game Chartz's numbers should be taken with a grain of salt. Still, there isn't any question that the Wii will surpass the 360 in total sales at some point this Holiday. It's going to happen. However, I don't think that's going to be a very significant development. I think the focus should turn away from installed base, and should turn more to the actual # of games sold for particular platforms. Who is dominating the top 10 charts? That will be the more important question going forward.

Icarus Moonsight

08-23-2007, 02:37 AM

Perhaps it's a disparity between shipped units and units through to consumer. I see 360's and PS3's anytime I browse the shelf and I assume nearly everyone else does as well. It's obvious that their shipped numbers will be higher than their through numbers. Wii's shipped numbers are basicly through numbers with the scarcity still in effect.

However, the source doesn't cite whether their data is shipped or through. :hmm:

Regarding taking the emphasis off of install base: How would the razor/blades model work in these conditions? Install base being the vehicle that drives this model, taking the focus off install base could damage the industry as it stands. Or am I off-base with that reasoning? I realize it wouldn't affect the Wii because the hardware is sold above cost and they don't utilize that model to generate profit but, then what of the PS3 and to a lesser extent the 360 if the main focus is shifted? I don't see how it's practical or even possible at this point.

AMG

08-23-2007, 03:07 AM

While the Wii is definitely looking like the odds on favorite, it is still way too early to call a winner.

Anything can still happen in the console race.

swlovinist

08-23-2007, 09:51 AM

Often companies state that they have SHIPPED their goal of XXX amount of systems, not the ones they have actually sold. This is used by everyone, and helps boost numbers. I do believe that video games chartz uses consoles SOLD and not shipped. Sony did this with the PSP when they were getting their ass handed to them by the DS.

Rob2600

08-23-2007, 02:55 PM

Not surprised that it sold better than 360 in less time ... the thing is there are hardly any games for the damn thing and especially good ones.

Who told you there are hardly any games? The Wii launched nine months ago and there are already 74 games available, not counting Virtual Console games. Another 7 will be available within the next week or so. That seems like plenty of games to me.

These are the ten highest rated Wii games as of today, August 23:

The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess
Resident Evil 4: Wii Edition
Super Paper Mario
Wario Ware: Smooth Moves
Madden NFL '08
Trauma Center: Second Opinion
The Godfather: Blackhand Edition
Mario Strikers Charged
Wii Sports
Rayman Raving Rabbids

Also worth checking out:

Excite Truck
Tiger Woods PGA Tour '07
Elebits
SSX Blur
Super Monkey Ball: Banana Blitz
Scarface: The World is Yours
Metal Slug Anthology
Dragon Ball Z: Budokai Tenkaichi 2
Call of Duty 3
Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix
etc.

I'm sure you'd enjoy at least several of those games, plus the dozens of highly rated Virtual Console games.

And the machine is underpowered I don't see it lasting long in the end unless they do really well with games etc but its gonna look really dated power wise

Many people think the most powerful video game console is always the most popular, but that isn't true. The Intellivision and ColecoVision were more powerful than the Atari 2600, but the 2600 still sold more. The Sega Master System was more powerful than the NES, but the NES still sold more. The Nintendo 64 was more powerful than the PlayStation, but the PlayStation still sold more. The GameCube and Xbox were more powerful than the PlayStation 2, but the PlayStation 2 still sold more.

There's no reason why the Wii can't be the most popular console this generation.

Anthony1

08-23-2007, 04:28 PM

Many people think the most powerful video game console is always the most popular, but that isn't true. The Intellivision and ColecoVision were more powerful than the Atari 2600, but the 2600 still sold more. The Sega Master System was more powerful than the NES, but the NES still sold more. The Nintendo 64 was more powerful than the PlayStation, but the PlayStation still sold more. The GameCube and Xbox were more powerful than the PlayStation 2, but the PlayStation 2 still sold more.

There's no reason why the Wii can't be the most popular console this generation.

The only problem with your theory, is that all those consoles were from the same generation power-wise. The Wii is from last generation power-wise. The Wii is using technology from 6 years ago. In none of the above cases was the winning technology 6 years old.

diskoboy

08-23-2007, 04:34 PM

Many people think the most powerful video game console is always the most popular, but that isn't true. The Intellivision and ColecoVision were more powerful than the Atari 2600, but the 2600 still sold more.

Actually, that's not exactly true. In 1982, sales of the Colecovision began to pass the VCS, and pretty much stayed there until the crash, two years later.

ubersaurus

08-23-2007, 04:37 PM

Rob2600

08-23-2007, 04:53 PM

The only problem with your theory, is that all those consoles were from the same generation power-wise. The Wii is from last generation power-wise. The Wii is using technology from 6 years ago. In none of the above cases was the winning technology 6 years old.

The Dreamcast was released four years after the PlayStation and was far more powerful, but the PlayStation still sold more.

Regarding the Wii, some of the games look good so far, but Metroid Prime 3: Corruption and Super Mario Galaxy are supposed to show off what the console can really do. I'm hoping those games will set the standard and inspire other developers to do even better.

sabre2922

08-23-2007, 05:14 PM

Isn't the PS2 still selling really well?

The PS2 is still selling strong in the U.S.

It is still selling steady in places like Japan with a little over 12,000 per week on average.

Rob2600

08-23-2007, 06:03 PM

The PS2 is still selling strong in the U.S.

It is still selling steady in places like Japan with a little over 12,000 per week on average.

Ubersaurus was proving my point. The PlayStation 2, which came out seven years ago, is outselling the newer and more powerful Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3. Again, it seems the most powerful console usually isn't the most popular. The only exception I can think of is the SNES, which ended up outselling the Genesis.

agbulls

08-23-2007, 09:02 PM

July Hardware Figures
Wii 425 k
Nintendo DS 405 k
PlayStation 2 222k
PlayStation Portable 214k
Xbox 360 170k
PlayStation 3 159k
Game Boy Advance 87k

Still don't think the installed base race is already over?

Trumpman

08-23-2007, 11:04 PM

That's pretty impressive. I have a Wii now, but I am planning to get a 360 once they switch to the 65nm process. The Wii is great fun, and I can't wait for Galaxy, SSBB, and especially MP3. MP3 looks like the game of the year to me.

Anthony1

08-23-2007, 11:35 PM

The Dreamcast was released four years after the PlayStation and was far more powerful, but the PlayStation still sold more.

Maybe I'm losing my mind, but I thought the Sega Saturn and Playstation were competitors, not the Dreamcast and Playstation. Saturn was released in May 1995, and the Playstation was released in September 1995.

The Dreamcast was the first system released among the PS2, Xbox and GameCube. Just because it died such a quick death, doesn't mean it was part of the Playstation generation.

The Nintendo 64, Saturn and Playstation all competed against each other. It's just the Saturn didn't fare too well and died pretty early (at least in the US).

Rob2600

08-23-2007, 11:49 PM

Maybe I'm losing my mind, but I thought the Sega Saturn and Playstation were competitors, not the Dreamcast and Playstation. Saturn was released in May 1995, and the Playstation was released in September 1995.

The Dreamcast was the first system released among the PS2, Xbox and GameCube. Just because it died such a quick death, doesn't mean it was part of the Playstation generation.

That's exactly my point. The PlayStation, a console from the previous generation, was outselling the Dreamcast, a new and powerful console, on a consistent basis. As strange as it may seem, graphics aren't the priority for many consumers.

The Wii isn't as powerful as the Xbox 360 and the PlayStation 3, but that won't necessarily prevent it from becoming the most popular console of this generation. Besides, it's not as if the graphics in Wii games are horrible. They're good...just not as good as the other two consoles.

Poofta!

08-24-2007, 12:36 AM

phools!! itll clearly be the phatom! or psp!!!!!

honestly though, im not surprised, but like pple have mentioned, i believe the 360 to be the superior system (for me anyway) but i do own both. and plan to buy a 60gb ps3 before they run out.... gotta have the EE man.

swlovinist

08-24-2007, 01:52 AM

July Hardware Figures
Wii 425 k
Nintendo DS 405 k
PlayStation 2 222k
PlayStation Portable 214k
Xbox 360 170k
PlayStation 3 159k
Game Boy Advance 87k

These sales numbers dont suprise me at all. The Wii is selling itself even with a light software run. I can only imagine how well its gonna do when Mario, Smash, and Metroid come out this year. The 360 is a great system, but dam if they need to do more than have a great software lineup come out. I thought I would never say that, but if I was told that I have a 1 in three or four chance of getting a defective system out of the box, then I am not going to spend $350 plus tax on it. Dammit MS, come out with your 65MM chip, pack in a "good" game, release a stable and non defective unit at $299. The Wii is still selling awsome due to 1. Image that anyone can play it. 2. Price. 3. Quality. On a side note, I am glad to see that the PS2 is still selling awsome. One of favorite systems of all time, it is sad to see Sony screw up on the PS3 so bad.

badinsults

08-24-2007, 02:03 AM

Anthony1

08-24-2007, 02:44 AM

That's exactly my point. The PlayStation, a console from the previous generation, was outselling the Dreamcast, a new and powerful console, on a consistent basis. As strange as it may seem, graphics aren't the priority for many consumers.

The Wii isn't as powerful as the Xbox 360 and the PlayStation 3, but that won't necessarily prevent it from becoming the most popular console of this generation. Besides, it's not as if the graphics in Wii games are horrible. They're good...just not as good as the other two consoles.

But we aren't talking about cross generation comparisons. Sure, the Playstation 1 might have been outselling the Dreamcast at that time, but was the Playstation 1 the dominating platform during the era of the Xbox, PS2, Dreamcast and GameCube? No. The PS2 was.

I'm talking about comparing systems from the same era. The Nintendo Wii is from the era of the Xbox 360 and PS3. It's not a previous era system. So all those comparisons are completely moot. The bottom line is that the Wii is taking us into uncharted territories. Never before, have we had a system, that has released with 6 years old technology, outselling two systems with the latest and greatest technology. It truly is a strange new world. They don't call the Wii "THE GREAT DISRUPTOR" for nothing.

The "GREAT DISRUPTOR" is doing it's job very well. It's disrupting the hell out of the status quo. Normally the system with the best games tends to dominate, but the Wii is definitely breaking this trend.

Icarus Moonsight

08-24-2007, 04:59 AM

Normally the system with the best games tends to dominate, but the Wii is definitely breaking this trend.

You might find it a shocker that some of us find the Wii's library to be the most impressive thusfar. Wow huh? :)

If your not into certain genres of games (GTA sandbox variants, Western-style RPGs, FPS & 3rdPS specificly) the 360's library receives a potent gutting in quality and as a result becomes significantly less impressive in perspective. I'll admit that I haven't given the 360 a thorough examination but, in my own defence, I haven't had a good enough reason to take the plunge and buy one yet. Rings of Death and pay-to-play online being my primary gripes other than the handful of titles that intersest me at the moment.

That's why I say the Wii and 360 are not in competition in the same manner that past game systems have been. Their differences are fairly vast and each attracts a different consumer. Sometimes those lines blur and these folks are the ones who will have both a 360 and a Wii and will enjoy and be served well by both. Besides, two-system households are the norm now are they not?

Regarding sales comparisons, any viable system in the market at the same time are/were in competition until one fizzled from the market. The only trend-bucker of this I can cite is the Wii but, even though the three current systems are not in a mad-dash competition for install base in the traditional sense, they are all in competition for the X amount of dollars being spent on video games at any given time. Sony's model doesn't allow for profit outside of the top market share/game sales position. MS don't seem to care about operating at a loss and continue to do so, thanks to their massive amount of corporate wealth, while smiling about it the whole time. Nintendo continues to print money... Unless something major/unforeseen happens this is unlikely to change anytime soon. Even still, anything can happen... Murphy's Law.

Rob2600

08-24-2007, 12:11 PM

Sure, the Playstation 1 might have been outselling the Dreamcast at that time, but was the Playstation 1 the dominating platform during the era of the Xbox, PS2, Dreamcast and GameCube? No. The PS2 was.

I'm talking about comparing systems from the same era. The Nintendo Wii is from the era of the Xbox 360 and PS3. It's not a previous era system. So all those comparisons are completely moot.

Once again, you have proven my point. As I wrote in a previous post, the GameCube and Xbox were more powerful than the PlayStation 2, but that didn't matter because the PlayStation 2 was more popular. The Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3 are more powerful than the Wii, but that doesn't matter because the Wii has been more popular so far. It seems as though graphics aren't the top priority for millions of consumers.

The "GREAT DISRUPTOR" (Wii) is doing it's job very well. It's disrupting the hell out of the status quo. Normally the system with the best games tends to dominate, but the Wii is definitely breaking this trend.

I disagree with your backhanded compliment and have already pointed out that the Wii has plenty of fun games to choose from.

Rob2600

08-24-2007, 12:30 PM

The fact that the PS2 still outsells the Xbox 360 is proof that the 360 still costs too much. But the fact that the PS3 cannot outsell the 360 even after a price cut shows how much worse off the PS3 is.

I agree. I don't think a home video game console should ever cost more than $299.99, no matter how fancy and powerful it may be. $400, $500, and $600 is more expensive than many TVs and even some computers, which would be fine, but TVs and computers are not perceived as toys by the general public. Video games still are.

I think many parents have a difficult time justifying spending $500 on what they believe is a toy, especially when there's one on the next shelf that costs half as much money and has just as many, if not more, games to chose from.

Eteric Rice

08-24-2007, 12:45 PM

There's some heavy denial going on in here... :sob:

Anthony1

08-24-2007, 04:29 PM

I disagree with your backhanded compliment and have already pointed out that the Wii has plenty of fun games to choose from.

We all have our own takes on what we enjoy playing. I bought a Wii at launch, and ended up selling it about a month or so ago. I enjoyed the Wii (to a degree), during the first couple of months, but after that I rarely used it. The only times I did use it, after the initial honeymoon period, was primarily just to convince myself that I didn't just throw $560 down the drain. Of course, I'm the type of gamer that finds mini-games to be fun for about 15 minutes or so, but then I quickly tire of them.

I'm sure there are others out there that can't get enough of the mini-game fests and waggling around a controller to achieve the same thing that could be done with a simple button press, but I learned that I definitely wasn't one of them. The one positive thing I can say about the Wii, is that there will be a part of me that wishes I could play Metroid, Mario and Zak and Wiki. But not enough to go out and buy a Wii and all the accessories and everything again. I paid a grand total of $560 on everything that I bought for the Wii, and I was extremely lucky to recover about 85 percent of that, after selling everything. I'm definitely going to be a bit saddened by the fact that I won't be playing Mario and Metroid anytime soon, but oh well, that's life. After seeing the e3 show, it appears that Mario, Metroid and Zak and Wiki are about all that I'm going to miss out on. (never had any interest in Smash Brothers, and I prefer Mario Kart on the SNES over all other versions) It's pretty obvious that Nintendo is no longer interested in catering to their hardcore base.

sabre2922

08-24-2007, 05:02 PM

Once again, you have proven my point. As I wrote in a previous post, the GameCube and Xbox were more powerful than the PlayStation 2, but that didn't matter because the PlayStation 2 was more popular.

Looks like our brief period of peaceful existence is at its end Rob26008-)

So here we go again round n round but its all good.

Your STATEMENT NO LONGER HOLDS WATER in that the Gamecube was only SLIGHTLY more powerful than the PS2 and the Xbox 1 was only truly pushed hardware wise by a very select few developers.

for the last time: 90% OF ALL LAST GEN GAMES LOOK THE SAME ON BOTH THE PS2 AND XBOX 1 in fact if there was one console that got the shaft in both the gameplay and graphics department with cross-platform games it was the Gamecube.

Example: I owned all 3 last gen versions of Splinter Cell Pandora Tomorrow and of course the Xbox 1 version looked the best and the PS2 version looked good but the Gamecube version looked worse than the PS2 version by far and the gameplay had glitches galore.
The same applied to MANY multiplatform games when comparing the Gamecube versions to the PS2 and Xbox 1 versions of the same game.
In fact Splinter Cell :Chaos Theory looks damn good on the PS2 with much improved animation and lighting when compared to to the rushed Gamecube port of the same game.

My point is this: developers learned how to push the PS2s capabilities far beyond what was done on the Gamecube and even to a lesser extent the Xbox 1 since the PS2 version of most games were always a top priority with both developers and publishers.

You tell me that GOD OF WAR 2 doesnt look as good or even better than any of the most graphically advanced games on the Gamecube and even the Xbox 1 and I will have to officially declare you a FANBOY my friend.:lovin:

Oh and the whole RE4 GC vs. PS2 thing :deadhorse: yeah I know but here goes anyway:

NONE of my friends or family can tell a REAL DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE PS2 AND GAMECUBE VERSIONS OF RE4 even the ones that are gamers and own Xbox 1s 360s , Gamecube and PS2s.

Also in a strange way MY whole point/response to you downing the PS2 Rob2600 actually HELPS in your support of the Nintendo Wii since it is DEFINITELY the most underpowered console of this generation that doesnt mean that talented and dedicated developers cant make very good to great looking games on it that can look good even when compared to the most graphically advanced games on either the Xbox360 or even the mighty PS3.

btw sorry for highjacking the thread.

sabre2922

08-24-2007, 05:12 PM

But we aren't talking about cross generation comparisons. Sure, the Playstation 1 might have been outselling the Dreamcast at that time

The thing is that the Playstation 1 and the Dreamcast are two completely seperate generations!

The PSone was at the end of its generational reign when the DC was launched in Nov. '99. AND the PSone was ALREADY a success loooong before the Dreamcast was announced.

Not only that but try to remember fellow DPers that the Dreamcast was meant to compete with the Playstation 2 NOT THE PSONE!

That whole part of the argument/debate PSone vs. Dreamcast would be the same as stating that the PS3 is competing with the Xbox 1 it just doesnt add up and isnt viable.

Rob2600

08-24-2007, 05:27 PM

You tell me that GOD OF WAR 2 doesnt look as good or even better than any of the most graphically advanced games on the Gamecube and even the Xbox 1 and I will have to officially declare you a FANBOY my friend.

I'd say games like Star Wars Rogue Squadron II: Rogue Leader, Star Fox Adventures, Resident Evil 4, Metroid Prime, The Legend of Zelda: Wind Waker, F-Zero GX, and Wave Race: Blue Storm had some of the best graphics of last generation.

Regarding cross-platform ports, not every one looked amazing on the GameCube, but some did, like Soulcalibur II and Burnout 2: Point of Impact. Some developers took advantage of the GameCube's power and some developers didn't. The same can be said for every console.

Looks like our brief period of peaceful existence is at its end Rob2600 8-)

Easy come, easy go. :)

gum_drops

08-24-2007, 06:03 PM

Super Mario Fan

08-24-2007, 08:00 PM

That whole part of the argument/debate PSone vs. Dreamcast would be the same as stating that the PS3 is competing with the Xbox 1 it just doesnt add up and isnt viable.

I think it's more like saying that the Wii is competeing with the PS2, which, looks to currently be the case.

Melf

08-24-2007, 08:18 PM

If your not into certain genres of games (GTA sandbox variants, Western-style RPGs, FPS & 3rdPS specificly) the 360's library receives a potent gutting in quality and as a result becomes significantly less impressive in perspective.

You just excluded four genres. I can understand complaining about one, but four? My problem is that if you eliminate mini games and ports with tacked-on motion sensor controls, you're left with almost nothing in the Wii's library.

I don't understand how people can complain about the FPS games on the 360, then go and play one of a hundred mini games compilations on the Wii. Just as there are different types of mini game sets, there are different types of FPS games on the 360. Bioshock plays nothing like Rainbow 6: Vegas, which plays nothing like Call of Duty 2.

I'd say games like Star Wars Rogue Squadron II: Rogue Leader, Star Fox Adventures, Resident Evil 4, Metroid Prime, The Legend of Zelda: Wind Waker, F-Zero GX, and Wave Race: Blue Storm had some of the best graphics of last generation.

All but two of those games are Nintendo titles, and the only 3rd party game there is also the Wii's best 3rd party title so far. That's a disturbing trend from the previous generation that I was hoping to see change with the Wii, but so far it's all Nintendo. The Wii needs more 3rd party love beyond motion sensor-enhanced ports.

swlovinist

08-25-2007, 12:08 AM

The funny part is Nintendo didn't really change much this generation, besides the motion sensory. The same trusted recipe, an affordable system with a fun pack-in game. Couple that with Sony and Microsoft tripping over their own shoelaces and you get a huge sale of wii consoles.

well put. The industry needs a flipping wake up call that consoles need to be priced LOWER. It is not that the Wii is the and all machine, but dang it does not have competition on price. Not to mention a pack-in game that attracts new gamers. When the hell was the last time that happened. The Wii has been compared to pong, and I guess I can see that...a little bit. The Wii is so much more though, and I see it doing some great things in the future. I know that some elitists the "hardcore gaming community" has laughed about the Wii, but overall I think it is the correction the gaming community has needed for a long time. Call me a casual gamer if you want, I am looking forward to what the Wii has to offer in the future. Long live affordable consoles. Long live unique gameplay.

badinsults

08-25-2007, 02:01 AM

You people might poo-poo the Wii, but I know lots of people who don't even like video games, but want a Wii because they really enjoy the motion controls. Despite the lesser graphics, I bet you could create equally good long games on the Wii, and with the coming fall season approaching, you will. It is just that companies know that hardcore gamers are on the Xbox 360, so you see the hardcore games on that system. And that is fine.

j_factor

08-25-2007, 03:30 AM

I thought this was a thread about sales? The quality of a system's library (and especially your personal judgment of it) has very little to do with sales. Personally, I thought the PS2's library was utter shite for a year, and still wasn't actually good for at least another year after that. It still sold great from the beginning.

I suppose if you're rich and have a 72" plasma set, a 6.1 digital surround setup, etc., the differences in tech are probably more grating (and you just might be a tech snob). But for those of us who don't dine on caviar and don't want to pay $60 for a new game, the Wii is a great choice. At least with the Wii, I don't have to plunk hundreds on a high-def set just to make in-game text readable.

kingpong

08-25-2007, 10:51 AM

Hardware sales are so misleading in this generation. Worldwide sales are tough because the Wii is so far ahead in Japan - how much does that impact what happens in the rest of the world? Everyone knows that the 360 won't ever do anything in Japan, the PS3 might, but it hasn't yet, and the Wii obviously is doing well, but how much does that really impact what happens outside of Japan? Due to the differences in the markets, a sale in one region doesn't equal a sale in another region, making worldwide sales figures a potentially misleading indicator.

The biggest problem with looking at system sales is that the Wii is, for lack of a better term, largely a fad system. While it sells to gamers across the board, all the buzz about the system is in the general public, the casual gamers, etc. These are the people who scrambled to buy the system last Christmas and made all the noise about it. So they got their system, they had a ball playing Wii Sports, and then... the system became a dust collector. Lots of people picked up Wii Play for more of the same and the "free" controller, and every now and then a lightweight first party game that appeals to the casual gamer (think Mario Party, Mario Strikers) will sell, but software just isn't moving on the system. We see sales figures for Nintendo's titles because they sell well enough to break into the top 10, but it would be interesting to see hard numbers for 3rd party sales.

What the apparent volume and distribution of software sales indicates is that the overwhelming majority of Wii owners aren't significant video game consumers, just people who enjoy the occasional fun game. Most of those people are already satisfied with their system, they've had their fun, and they're not too worried about getting other games.

What is most disappointing is that while the options presented by the controller are exciting, nobody is taking it beyond a gimmick. The system has been out long enough that we should see complex games with innovative, immersive control schemes, but there's nothing on the radar that really fits the bill. While games like Mario 20: Scavenger Hunt and Legend of Zelda: Even More Wandering Around For No Good Reason will sell to the supposed "hardcore" gamers, they're not going to cause a shift in the habits of the general gamer. If the Wii had games with new control schemes not possible on other systems that were effective, immersive experiences, then there would be something to get excited about. Think of a Star Wars title where you realistically control a light saber not just in limited minigames, but throughout the game. I sure hope that's what the forthcoming SW game will be, but that's just scratching the surface of how the controller needs to be used for the Wii to be taken seriously. As long as Wii games are limited to the mechanics we're currently seeing, the system is nothing more than a glorified Xavix.

Arguments about price and hardware reliability are interesting. It would be great if these systems were all $5, but we need to be realistic about prices. These days people think nothing of spending hundreds on MP3 players and fancy cell phones, yet spending $400 on a game console is too much? It doesn't make sense when you look at the value. Granted, it is a mental hurdle that people just don't want to pay that much, like the way I can't get over arcade games costing more than 25 cents, but it is largely baseless. I could trot out the old argument that games are cheaper than they used to be since systems from the 2600 until the crash typically cost $200 at release, but system prices are reasonable these days given inflation and such. At least, prices are reasonable if you get a $500 60GB PS3 - Sony is killing themselves by pricing the 80GB + Motostorm bundle at $600. That move is seen by consumers as a price increase, as now it costs $100 more than it did, the extra 20GB has trivial value, and pack-in games are expected to come at a large discount, so where's the value?

Reliability-wise, among people I know personally there are no dead 360s, 1 dead Wii (overheating), and no dead PS3s. That sample set contains a few Wiis and PS3s, but a whole bunch of 360s. I have seen more dead PS3 kiosks than working, but those are extreme environments. There were clearly some engineering mistakes made with the 360, but when you hear of cases of people going through 10 systems you know the user must be contributing to the problem somehow, or else failures would be far more widespread than they already are. I've played my 360 for hours upon hours in a 90 degree room with a projector pumping out heat without problems, so I don't see how it would have overheating problems unless in an environment that no electronic device should be operated in (enclosed TV stands, etc.). I've never understood how someone over the age of 5 could manage to scratch a disc, but I'm guessing there is a high correlation between disc scratchers and 360 failures. It would nice if the systems were more resilient, but they're not, so deal with it and don't expect sympathy if one dies. Reliability issues should not be preventing anyone from buying a system.

My vote in the poll was for the 360 to win, at least in the markets that DP is generally concerned. The PS3 has no compelling content, nothing that is going to make it pull out of last place. There will be some good games on it, but is there going to be anything that can't/won't be done on the 360 that makes it worth it? From what I hear from developer friends, they're no fans of working on the PS3, and there are some severe memory constraints in the network play implementation that will likely prevent it from truly competing with XBL. Not a good outlook for the PS3. The Wii is seemingly doing well, but as I said, I think there is too much of a fad aspect, and not enough compelling content for it to be the dominant system. That leaves us with the 360. With the PS3 offering little, and nothing on the Wii truly taking advantage of the control options, the 360 seems to be the clear choice.

ubersaurus

08-25-2007, 12:32 PM

The wii dominating in Japan will be an important factor to anyone who enjoys Japanese games. If it's where all the sales are, and it's cheapest to develop for, why wouldn't all the Japanese game companies make a good chunk of their software for it? PS2 was that system last gen, and it looks like the Wii will take that position this time around.

Nintendo knows people who identify themselves as casual gamers only buy 1 or 2 software titles a year. That's why they only put out one or two a year with them in mind. Mario Strikers definitely doesn't count...it's just like all Nintendo sports games-crazy and fun. Wii Play and Wii Fit are, however, in the same vein as Wii Sports, and that's why I expect Fit to sell like gangbusters. Nintendo's hardcore gaming crowd will likely be scooping up the more "hardcore" first party titles as they come out over the next few months.

Last I heard, 3rd party games are selling fairly well on the wii.

That said if they can keep up their momentum, they have a good shot at dominating this generation. Halo 3 will boost 360 sales, no doubt, but how much?

neuropolitique

08-25-2007, 06:09 PM

I think it's hilarious that all of the sudden total sales are meaningless. Now that Nintendo is back on top the haters have had to devise a new number to base success on.

Lothars

08-26-2007, 04:09 AM

I think it's hilarious that all of the sudden total sales are meaningless. Now that Nintendo is back on top the haters have had to devise a new number to base success on.

That's fine you can think what you want but Nintendo has to step it up alot more than they are doing because even though it's selling, I don't see them keeping their lead especially with the games that they are showing, because other than Smash Brothers and Mario Galaxy, I don't have much faith in the Wii Lineup.

j_factor

08-26-2007, 04:47 AM

Since when do you need a large number of big-name games to sell a console? I don't see how, by any stretch of the imagination, the Wii's library can be considered to be even close to as poor as the PS2's library was when it had been out for the same length of time.

Rob2600

08-26-2007, 04:29 PM

The biggest problem with looking at system sales is that the Wii is, for lack of a better term, largely a fad system.

That's what some people were saying before the Wii launched...and a month after it launched...and two months after that...and three months after that...

People said the DS was a fad and a gimmick too, and that Sony would blow Nintendo out of the portable market with the PSP. Evidently, those people were wrong.

Pessimists keep redefining the definition of "success" and raising expectations, but Nintendo keeps making fools out of them every month when the new sales data is released. 9.7 million units in eight months is amazing and now the Wii is even outselling the DS! When are people going to stop calling it a fad? What will it take?

Go ahead, raise expectations yet again. Nintendo will continue to exceed them, but I'm sure people like you will continue to call the Wii a fad.

We see sales figures for Nintendo's titles because they sell well enough to break into the top 10, but it would be interesting to see hard numbers for 3rd party sales.

Several third-party games have been popular on the Wii. Resident Evil 4: Wii Edition, Madden NFL '08, Boogie, The Godfather: Blackhand Edition, Pirates of the Caribbean: At World's End, Rayman Raving Rabbids, Red Steel, etc. According to IGN.com, Resident Evil 4 already has sales of 250,000 in America alone.

I'm sure third-parties are happy with Virtual Console sales, too. I imagine the profit margin on those titles is very high.

According to wikipedia.org, here are the Wii games that have sold more than one million copies, as of July 25, 2007:

Wii Sports (8.32 million) (packaged with Wii in all regions except Japan)
Wii Play (4.49 million)
The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess (3.61 million)
Wario Ware: Smooth Moves (1.82 million)
Super Paper Mario (1.25 million)
Mario Party 8 (1.03 million)
Rayman Raving Rabbids (1 million)
Red Steel (1 million)

Total Wii games sold as of June 30, 2007: 44.82 million
Total Virtual Console games sold as of July 11, 2007: over 5.6 million

What is most disappointing is that while the options presented by the controller are exciting, nobody is taking it beyond a gimmick.

According to whom? The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess received excellent reviews. Madden NFL '08, Resident Evil 4: Wii Edition, Rayman Raving Rabbids, Elebits, The Godfather: Blackhand Edition, etc. have received positive reviews, too. Of course, there are poorly rated games on the Wii as well, but the same can be said for every other video game console ever created.

Again, it seems as though some people are holding the Wii to higher standards than other consoles, which is unfair.

It would be great if these systems were all $5, but we need to be realistic about prices. These days people think nothing of spending hundreds on MP3 players and fancy cell phones, yet spending $400 on a game console is too much?

Yes, $400 is too much for a video game console because the general public still perceives video games as toys. That's why $400 to $600 isn't too much for a TV, mobile phone, portable MP3 player, or computer. Those products are not perceived as toys.

In addition, I think many parents have a difficult time justifying spending $400 to $600 on what they believe is a toy, especially when there's one on the next shelf that costs about half as much money and has just as many, if not more, games to chose from.

Reliability-wise, among people I know personally there are no dead 360s, 1 dead Wii (overheating), and no dead PS3s. That sample set contains a few Wiis and PS3s, but a whole bunch of 360s. ... There were clearly some engineering mistakes made with the 360, but when you hear of cases of people going through 10 systems you know the user must be contributing to the problem somehow, or else failures would be far more widespread than they already are.

My friend has had to send his Xbox 360 to be repaired twice already. Many members of this message board have had to send their Xbox 360s to be repaired, too. Either 50 percent of Xbox 360 owners are too ignorant to properly operate them or Microsoft has released a shoddy product. You seem to believe it's the users' fault, but I believe it's Microsoft's fault.

Maybe I'm in the minority, but if I spend $370 to $500 on a product, I expect it to work perfectly for many years.

sabre2922

08-26-2007, 06:14 PM

I suppose if you're rich and have a 72" plasma set, a 6.1 digital surround setup, etc., the differences in tech are probably more grating (and you just might be a tech snob). But for those of us who don't dine on caviar and don't want to pay $60 for a new game, the Wii is a great choice. At least with the Wii, I don't have to plunk hundreds on a high-def set just to make in-game text readable.

Agreed on every point!

kingpong

08-26-2007, 10:53 PM

When are people going to stop calling it a fad? What will it take?

Go ahead, raise expectations yet again. Nintendo will continue to exceed them, but I'm sure people like you will continue to call the Wii a fad.

I'll stop calling it a fad when sales to the traditional core console gaming audience are competitive. To make an apples to apples comparison we must exclude sales to people who got a Wii because there was buzz about it. Last Christmas' sales were a textbook case of a fad, and that buzz about the system continues today, albeit lessened. If there were 10 million Wiis in the hands of traditional game consumers, and not in the hands of people who consider the system a novelty, I'd call the Wii a success. If someone gets a Wii and plays nothing but Wii Sports and Wii Play, that's an entirely inconsequential sale to everyone but Nintendo. There's no good way to tell how many system sales are like this (the best you can to with numbers is attach rates, and they're easy to skew), but it seems to me like it is a dangerously high number - dangerous to developers who invest money in Wii products thinking they have a market of 10 million to sell to when the number of realistic potential sales is dramatically lower.

According to whom? The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess received excellent reviews. Madden NFL '08, Resident Evil 4: Wii Edition, Rayman Raving Rabbids, Elebits, The Godfather: Blackhand Edition, etc. have received positive reviews, too. Of course, there are poorly rated games on the Wii as well, but the same can be said for every other video game console ever created.

Whether or not a game is well reviewed doesn't have much to do with whether or not the controller is more than a gimmick. If a game just uses some waggles or implements a few play mechanics with the controller (think Godfather and Madden respectively), the controller isn't being used for more than a gimmick. 1-to-1 movements or pervasive use of simplified movements are needed to make these games more than ones where you wave your hand now and then. This is going to be tough to do. The Table Tennis port sounded like it was on the right track with 1-to-1 movement, but apparently it doesn't work very well. If the Wii can deliver rich experiences like that should be, then it is something that core gamers should take note of. If a game doesn't take advantage of the controller to do something that can't be done elsewhere, what is there to be excited about?

Obviously it sounds like I'm anti-Wii, but honestly, I love the idea of the system. I'm the kind of person who buys just about every game with unique controllers, can't imagine playing a racing game without a wheel, a fighting game without a stick, is trying to figure out how to get a rotary control for Space Giraffe, etc. The Wii should be right up my alley, as it offers possibilities the other systems don't. Sadly we're a year into the system's life and we don't have any titles that offer the rich immersive control scheme that could really differentiate the Wii from the competition. Instead we have a library of mostly some hand waving added to traditional mechanics. Very disappointing so far, and no real signs of that changing.

My friend has had to send his Xbox 360 to be repaired twice already. Many members of this message board have had to send their Xbox 360s to be repaired, too. Either 50 percent of Xbox 360 owners are too ignorant to properly operate them or Microsoft has released a shoddy product. You seem to believe it's the users' fault, but I believe it's Microsoft's fault.

I believe there were some inane design decisions that make the system far more vulnerable to failure than it should be. I also think that people tend to not handle devices like they should, and due to the mistakes made in the 360 design the systems are failing in conditions that typically don't cause problems. It isn't a case of gross negligence on the part of the users, but unknowingly contributing to the failure of a system that operates well under and unacceptably narrow range of conditions.

Melf

08-26-2007, 11:15 PM

That's what some people were saying before the Wii launched...and a month after it launched...and two months after that...and three months after that...

I think the issue is that after almost ten months, only the 1st party games really try to go out of their way to use the sensor control. Considering that the whole schtick of the Wii is its innovative control, you'd expect more games to take advantage of it.

According to wikipedia.org, here are the Wii games that have sold more than one million copies, as of July 25, 2007:

Wii Sports (8.32 million) (packaged with Wii in all regions except Japan)
Wii Play (4.49 million)
The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess (3.61 million)
Wario Ware: Smooth Moves (1.82 million)
Super Paper Mario (1.25 million)
Mario Party 8 (1.03 million)
Rayman Raving Rabbids (1 million)
Red Steel (1 million)

All but two of those games are Nintendo titles, and the other two were launch titles. You don't see something wrong there? 3rd parties, like EA, have already gone on the record about their concerns with Nintendo's software taking the majority of sales. One would think it would prompt them to offer better games, but that hasn't been the case. Heck, the other 3rd party titles you mentioned are all ports. The lack of major 3rd party games announced is disturbing, and I'm still wondering where the Wii's equivalent of Devil May Cry, Assassin's Creed, GTA 4, etc. are. Feel as you may about them, they are major franchises. I've heard many excuses about the lack of major 3rd party games on the Wii, but nothing major has even been announced outside of NIGHTS 2. This is the biggest time of the year, and the only games people are talking about on the Wii are Metroid, Smash Bros., and Mario Galaxy - all Nintendo games.

Again, it seems as though some people are holding the Wii to higher standards than other consoles, which is unfair.

With the sales it's been generating and the whole "innovation" angle, what do you expect? Wii fans love to trot out the latest NPD numbers, but when you question the library, they defend it by saying it was underestimated. You can't have it both ways. There's room for praising the Wii's success, but at the same time that success has made its flaws all the more visible. The same can be said about the 360's appalling failure rate.

Yes, $400 is too much for a video game console because the general public still perceives video games as toys. That's why $400 to $600 isn't too much for a TV, mobile phone, portable MP3 player, or computer. Those products are not perceived as toys.

In addition, I think many parents have a difficult time justifying spending $400 to $600 on what they believe is a toy, especially when there's one on the next shelf that costs about half as much money and has just as many, if not more, games to chose from.

I don't agree with this at all. This isn't 1990. Lots of people who aren't "rich" have HDTVs and Ipods. Considering that the average age of today's gamer is over 25, the whole "video games as toys" excuse no longer holds any water.

And which is the other console on shelves that costs half as much and has more games? I'd assume you're talking about the PS2, which is over 7 years old.

koster

08-28-2007, 12:32 PM

My friend has had to send his Xbox 360 to be repaired twice already. Many members of this message board have had to send their Xbox 360s to be repaired, too. Either 50 percent of Xbox 360 owners are too ignorant to properly operate them or Microsoft has released a shoddy product. You seem to believe it's the users' fault, but I believe it's Microsoft's fault.
I believe there were some inane design decisions that make the system far more vulnerable to failure than it should be. I also think that people tend to not handle devices like they should, and due to the mistakes made in the 360 design the systems are failing in conditions that typically don't cause problems. It isn't a case of gross negligence on the part of the users, but unknowingly contributing to the failure of a system that operates well under and unacceptably narrow range of conditions.
So do you think the reports of smoking Xbox 360 Wireless Racing Wheels in Japan are due in part to people not properly plugging the ac adapter into an outlet? :)

Or is this a(nother) case of shoddy Microsoft hardware design? As if Microsoft needed more bad publicity in the Japanese market...

agbulls

08-28-2007, 07:49 PM

So do you think the reports of smoking Xbox 360 Wireless Racing Wheels in Japan are due in part to people not properly plugging the ac adapter into an outlet? :)

Or is this a(nother) case of shoddy Microsoft hardware design? As if Microsoft needed more bad publicity in the Japanese market...

I think those are all valid questions...for another thread.

Back to the ongoing point here -- and discussion --

Whether you like it or not and whether you understand how this business model works -- the Wii is growing a lead in a market where everyone had already written it off. I've been saying the following for months...

The game console market is the most basic DEFINITION of the razor/razor-blade model. The funny thing is, Sony and Microsoft forgot the basic tenant of the model -- the fucking razor has to be affordable to buy the blades. I really don't see things changing.

Reading is fundamental:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Product_tying

And, until they do, I'm putting my money on the Wii for largest installed base and largest third party support in a few years.

Hep038

08-28-2007, 08:10 PM

Watching the Nintendo people get their panties in a wad is fun. What do you expect with a poll that if you choose the sony option it ends with I love drugs. Then you wonder why people make a stink in your thread. I really do not understand what you guys want. Do you want every one to come in agree? That is hard for me to believe when you bait sony supports with you poll. The way you guys act I really think the Wii target age is 12 and under.LOL

Ed Oscuro

08-28-2007, 08:17 PM

This generation could turn out like the old 16-bit "wars" with Nintendo being Sega and microsoft possibly being Nintendo and possibly Sony being ummmm the Turbographix16?:?
In terms of market share, Microsoft seems to be like the TG-16 in reverse - doing great in the US, but poorly in Japan. Poor packaging does not seem to be the culprit.

I'd also look at whose hardware is getting stranger (the Genesis and the TG-16 had some odd things going on in that area). I have the feeling it's too early to say here - certainly the successor to the PS3 could be odd, but by then perhaps emulation of classic systems will be old hat and well taken care of. Nintendo's systems seem odd but their upgrade path has been fairly unremarkable, compared with the 360 (still wondering about HD-DVD games) and the PS3 (which is another slightly odd system).

Ed Oscuro

08-28-2007, 08:50 PM

I'll stop calling it a fad when sales to the traditional core console gaming audience are competitive. To make an apples to apples comparison we must exclude sales to people who got a Wii because there was buzz about it.
I share the feeling that the Wii and the DS are centered around gimmicks, but more and more games are centered around a remarkable gimmick - the Wii and DS just bring the gimmick out into the physical realm.

What's more relevant to the thread is that sometimes what's "in" but not necessarily better can win the race. Right now, for example, the iPhone seems to be getting tons of market share, with the touchscreen-as-interface getting the lion's share of attention from the media. I like the traditonal cell phone with buttons better, but if I had to sell one or the other I'd probably end up going with the iPhone than the Razr 2 (which incidentally has a touchscreen of its own on the outside screen, although the single iPhone screen has a resolution equivalent to that of the Razr 2's inside and outside screens combined).

Volcanon

08-29-2007, 12:51 PM

Xbox advertises VERY HEAVILY in japan, so I suppose that Microsoft is trying to change the fact that they aren't selling.

Melf

08-29-2007, 08:31 PM

The 360 isn't selling in Japan because it lacks dating sims and tentacle rape. :p

Oh, and it's possible that NIGHTS will be delayed until next year (http://www.gamespot.com/news/show_blog_entry.php?topic_id=25886021&sid=6177872&om_act=convert&om_clk=newstop&tag=newstop;title;3). :(

YoshiM

08-29-2007, 11:10 PM

Tonight I stopped in at a Family Video to try my luck at renting Bioshock and Metroid Prime 3 for a week. Usually with new titles, the suckers are gone instantly but I was in the area. Found one copy of Bioshock available out of eight. Went over to the Wii side and was easily able to snag a copy of MP 3. Out of ten copies, only two were rented. I looked down the rest of the Wii aisle and most of the titles were all in stock. I looked back at the 360 aisle and all the "hot" titles are in low supply or out.

I gave the cases to the clerk and she began ringing me up. She put Bioshock in its case and mentioned the positive things she's heard about it. She then popped open MP 3's case and said "Hey, you got a Wii? Cool!" I asked her if they get a lot of people renting Wii stuff and she said not really. No one she knows has one. In the rare occasion I stop at Blockbuster, it's the same situation: lots of Wii titles in stock (though their selection is meager).

I just find it weird, especially in my town where people are cheap and renting is popular, that high profile Wii titles aren't flying off the shelves. I'm wondering where the majority of Wii systems are sent in the US because I hardly ever see them in my town.

agbulls

09-14-2007, 04:57 PM

Rob2600

09-14-2007, 05:20 PM

August numbers...

Wii: 403,000
DS: 383,000
Xbox 360: 276,000
PlayStation 2: 201,000
PlayStation 3: 130,000
PSP: 115,000

I also posted this information in a new thread called "August 2007 NPD sales data" this morning:

http://www.digitpress.com/forum/showthread.php?t=106426

agbulls

09-14-2007, 05:22 PM

I also posted this information in a new thread this morning:

August 2007 NPD sales data www.digitpress.com/forum/showthread.php?t=106426 (http://www.digitpress.com/forum/showthread.php?t=106426)

*_*

Congrats!

That's great, but you should read the original post in this thread. The NPD data is extremely relevant to the 3+ page conversation and poll we have going.

digdug

09-15-2007, 11:55 AM

August numbers are now in the OP.

Is everyone STILL sure that this isn't over? I know console wars are a marathon. But, the Wii has sprinted out SO far ahead in such a short span of time that I'm convinced it's all but official.

Wii: 403,000
DS: 383,000
Xbox 360: 276,000
PlayStation 2: 201,000
PlayStation 3: 130,000
PSP: 115,000

Wii more than doubled the PS3's sales and slaughtered the 360 by over 100k. With major releases still coming this year, what's to stop this trend? Nothing my friends...nothing.

There isn't enough big titles that are coming out for the Wii to EVER make me want to buy one. I have played Mario and Smash Bros. to death. They are all the same with the occasional update in characters or graphics. Rock Band is about the only game that may make the Wii worth getting it for. Oh wait that's right its not coming out for the Wii. Until Nintendo starts coming out with games that are for adults (like Eternal Darkness or Bioshock) I won't waste my $ on the system. They don't have enough 3rd party support to make me want it.

TheDomesticInstitution

09-15-2007, 12:09 PM

Rob2600

09-15-2007, 02:22 PM

I have played Mario and Smash Bros. to death. They are all the same with the occasional update in characters or graphics.

The same can be said about almost every series and genre. Haven't you played WWII first-person shooters to death? Haven't you played gratuitously violent action games to death? Haven't you played one-on-one tournament fighting games to death? Besides, Super Smash Bros. Brawl features many new characters and new modes of play.

Until Nintendo starts coming out with games that are for adults (like Eternal Darkness or Bioshock) I won't waste my $ on the system.

What is your definition of an adult game? One that features dark colors, explosions, and graphic violence? Or one that involves creative thinking, problem-solving skills, strategy, and restraint?

agbulls

09-15-2007, 03:21 PM

There isn't enough big titles that are coming out for the Wii to EVER make me want to buy one. I have played Mario and Smash Bros. to death. They are all the same with the occasional update in characters or graphics. Rock Band is about the only game that may make the Wii worth getting it for. Oh wait that's right its not coming out for the Wii. Until Nintendo starts coming out with games that are for adults (like Eternal Darkness or Bioshock) I won't waste my $ on the system. They don't have enough 3rd party support to make me want it.

I've said this before to someone else, but will reiterate ...

You DO know what forum and page you're on, right? This is a Classic Gaming fourm. In other words, we don't really care if things are for a specific age group. You know what really matters?

If the game is FUN. Period.

You might want to hang out in the PS3 or 360 forum on gamefaqs if that's how you really feel -- and you're totally entitled to your opinion, don't get me wrong. But you aren't going to find ANY support here with sentiments like that. In fact, you're only going to alienate yourself.

Just a couple words of advice...as you're going to find very few fanboys in here for any specific new console. Although, we do admittedly have classic gaming system fanboys. :p

Buyatari

09-15-2007, 05:18 PM

I've said this before to someone else, but will reiterate ...

You DO know what forum and page you're on, right? This is a Classic Gaming fourm. In other words, we don't really care if things are for a specific age group. You know what really matters?

If the game is FUN. Period.

You might want to hang out in the PS3 or 360 forum on gamefaqs if that's how you really feel -- and you're totally entitled to your opinion, don't get me wrong. But you aren't going to find ANY support here with sentiments like that. In fact, you're only going to alienate yourself.

Just a couple words of advice...as you're going to find very few fanboys in here for any specific new console. Although, we do admittedly have classic gaming system fanboys. :p

Comparing Wii sales to that of the 360 and PS3 is like comparing sales of a disney movie to the latest rambo movie. Ok Nintendo lost more systems than the the other 2 but its not really in the same category.

Rob2600

09-15-2007, 05:41 PM

Comparing Wii sales to that of the 360 and PS3 is like comparing sales of a disney movie to the latest rambo movie. Ok Nintendo lost more systems than the the other 2 but its not really in the same category.

When Sony outsold the competition, that was fine. However, now that Nintendo is outselling the competition, it doesn't count? Why not?

And since when is Nintendo in a different category? What sense does that make? Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo are all in the video game business.

agbulls

09-15-2007, 05:48 PM

Comparing Wii sales to that of the 360 and PS3 is like comparing sales of a disney movie to the latest rambo movie. Ok Nintendo lost more systems than the the other 2 but its not really in the same category.

Buyatari - I'm surpised to see you saying that...I really thought you'd know better.

I started this thread to talk about how and why the Wii has the largest growing install base. I think the reasons behind their success (price, brand name, input device etc.) are all absolutely relevant to the PS3 and 360 discussion. How exactly is the Wii like a Disney movie? That's really ignorant, and frankly flat out wrong.

Are you really trying to support the Nintedo for kids crap that has been going on for years?

That's just fucking laughable.

Buyatari

09-15-2007, 07:45 PM

Nintendo sold alot of systems to kids and this new segment of these non-gamers who rarely if ever play. They put up big numbers for system sales but not by chasing the exisiting needs of gamers. They did it by creating a gimick toy that grandma and aunt Mitilda will end up pulling out once a year.

This will go down as the first time a company sold more systems but fail to sell the most software. Sure they will put out those 5 kiddie blockbuster titles that will sell like they always do but the vast majority of software sales won't be theirs. Many of these systems they sold go unused. If thats winning the contest then they won.

You can't deny the numbers and Nintendo made the right move. Instead of taking on Microsoft and Sony head to head they kept the segment they were strongest with and added a new one no one cared about. So yeah I guess it is frustrating to see. Its like seeing your favorite rock band being outsold by the newest backstreet boys cd. Sure they are both listed in the ROCK category but we are clearly talking about a differnet audience here.

Rob2600

09-15-2007, 10:39 PM

This will go down as the first time a company sold more systems but fail to sell the most software. Sure they will put out those 5 kiddie blockbuster titles that will sell like they always do but the vast majority of software sales won't be theirs. Many of these systems they sold go unused.

You're wrong. Four of the top selling games in August were for the Wii. Metroid Prime 3: Corruption sold 220,000 in four days. Yes, 220,000 in four days. That's 12.5 percent faster sales than Bioshock for the Xbox 360. I'm sure many more were sold during the past two weeks as well.

What about Mario Strikers Charged, The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess, Rayman Raving Rabbids, Red Steel, Madden NFL, Wii Play, Wario Ware: Smooth Moves, The Godfather: Blackhand Edition, Elebits, Mario Party 8, etc. What about the big upcoming games, like Manhunt 2, Guitar Hero 3, Medal of Honor Heroes 2, Resident Evil: Umbrella Chronicles, Link's Crossbow Training, Trauma Center: New Blood, Super Mario Galaxy, Super Smash Bros. Brawl, etc.? What about the millions of Virtual Console downloads since launch? Clearly, the Wii is not and will not be going unused.

According to Wikipedia.org's "List of best-selling video games" entry:

Total Wii games sold as of June 30, 2007: 44.82 million

That means, as of June 30, 2007, Wii owners own an average of 4 or 5 Wii games each (44.82 Wii games sold divided by 9.7 million Wii owners equals 4.6 Wii games per Wii owner). On average, it appears Wii owners buy a new Wii game every six-and-a-half weeks, or eight Wii games a year. To hardcore gamers, that might not seem like much, but I would not categorize that as "going unused."

This was posted a few days ago on IGN.com:

August 2007 NPD software sales data:

Madden NFL 08 (Xbox 360): 900,000
Madden NFL 08 (PlayStation 2): 645,000
Bioshock (Xbox 360): 490,000
Wii Play (Wii): 256,000
Metroid Prime 3: Corruption (Wii): 220,000
Mario Strikers Charged (Wii): 148,000
Madden NFL 08 (Wii): 115,000

"Metroid Prime 3: Corruption, unveiled on August 28, moved about 220,000 units in four days, which is no slouch. Prime 3: Corruption sold better in three or four days than Prime 2: Echoes did in two weeks."

http://wii.ign.com/articles/820/820098p1.html