is HDMI RGB or componant?

[Soviet Conscript]

looked around and i get the feeling it can do both but i wanted to post the question here to clearify

is the signal transmitted through HDMI a digital RGB signal of the same quality as true analog RGB or VGA or is it a componant none true RGB signal?

yes, i know componant is analog and HDMI is digital I just want to know about quality. is it completely uncompressed RGB or slightly compressed componant type quality?

[diskoboy]

HDMI and DVI ports mainly stream uncompressed full-digital data.

The only time they stream compressed data is your HDTV on cable, because of the bandwidth used to broadcast HD content, so they use a Hi-def codec. But video game consoles, HD-DVD/Blu-Ray, and satellite TV is uncompressed.

[ProgrammingAce]

On a similar note, is cheese an animal or is it a mineral?

[Soviet Conscript]

HDMI and DVI ports mainly stream uncompressed full-digital data.

The only time they stream compressed data is your HDTV on cable, because of the bandwidth used to broadcast HD content, so they use a Hi-def codec. But video game consoles, HD-DVD/Blu-Ray, and satellite TV is uncompressed.

so if your useing HDMI on a 360 or a PS3 its basicly RGB and marginally superior to useing the componant cables?

on anouther note i just spent way to much time pondering cheese....

[Sothy]

Anthony1 will murder you in your sleep.

[Ze_ro]

They say if you say his name three times while looking in a mirror, he shows up to burn out the composite inputs on your TV.

--Zero

[Mianrtcv]

Anthony1 will murder you in your sleep.

But the visual will be stunning rgb. Tradeoff...

[Soviet Conscript]

They say if you say his name three times while looking in a mirror, he shows up to burn out the composite inputs on your TV.

--Zero

I hear he was run off the forums by a mob. flayed his skin raw with componant and composite cords. used em like whips and cats o' nine tails. but as he fell into the outer void of the web he screamed out a dreadful curse and swore his revenge......

and some say...on nights like this, when a RGB topic is brought up.....maybe....just maybe he will return to seek his revenge.

but seriously, the question

[Soviet Conscript]

do I have to sacrafice a hundred RF switchboxes to conjour up his spirit on a PVM monitor to answer me?

[smork]

so if your useing HDMI on a 360 or a PS3 its basicly RGB and marginally superior to useing the componant cables?

on anouther note i just spent way to much time pondering cheese....

MS Japan say you only get a 720p output with component but get 1080p on HDMI cables. Don't know if its bullshit or not, but if you look on the back of each package (Japanese packaging, can't say no nothin about the US packaging) that's the claim they make.

[jonjandran]

MS Japan say you only get a 720p output with component but get 1080p on HDMI cables. Don't know if its bullshit or not, but if you look on the back of each package (Japanese packaging, can't say no nothin about the US packaging) that's the claim they make.


Component does 1080p fine. The Xbox 360 just won't upconvert Dvds over component because of HDCP.

[Ed Oscuro]

On a similar note, is cheese an animal or is it a mineral?
:lol: - Gilbert and Sullivan, anyone?

By the way, RGB is component, technically speaking...but in layman's terms, the different words mean things that are different enough that if you have to ask the question you won't be able to get a picture from one format going into another. It's possible to convert, just requires money and/or skill.

Oh yeah, no consumer stuff really uses RGB out here in the West. There's SCART for Europeans, though.

[ProgrammingAce]

Component does 1080p fine. The Xbox 360 just won't upconvert Dvds over component because of HDCP.

But it will upconvert over VGA. Go figure...

[j_factor]

HDMI is simply a type of cable/connecter. Analog RGB and component (YPbPr) are signals. There is no such thing as HDMI signal. HDMI, like SCART, is a multi-compatible connecter. But while SCART is compatible with composite, s-video, and RGB, HDMI only does higher-end, digital forms -- namely, digital RGB and digital component (YCbCr). Technically, an HDMI output/cable is backwards-compatible with analog signals, but it does so with a technical work-around.

I don't know what you mean by compressed/uncompressed. The level of video compression only has to do with how the video data is encoded and stored on whatever format. It is entirely within the data on the disc (or hard drive, whatever) and is dependent on the format it's on. HDMI has nothing to do with it. A cable doesn't compress anything.

[G-Boobie]

On a similar note, is cheese an animal or is it a mineral?

Nice. Twenty points.

[Soviet Conscript]

HDMI is simply a type of cable/connecter. Analog RGB and component (YPbPr) are signals. There is no such thing as HDMI signal. HDMI, like SCART, is a multi-compatible connecter. But while SCART is compatible with composite, s-video, and RGB, HDMI only does higher-end, digital forms -- namely, digital RGB and digital component (YCbCr). Technically, an HDMI output/cable is backwards-compatible with analog signals, but it does so with a technical work-around.

I don't know what you mean by compressed/uncompressed. The level of video compression only has to do with how the video data is encoded and stored on whatever format. It is entirely within the data on the disc (or hard drive, whatever) and is dependent on the format it's on. HDMI has nothing to do with it. A cable doesn't compress anything.

thank you, i knew most of that but i think my question has gotten a bit confused.

but still not totally clear....ok, how about this. if i hook a PS3 up to a TV via a HDMI cable is the picture i'm getting on the screen Componant or RGB?

[j_factor]

thank you, i knew most of that but i think my question has gotten a bit confused.

but still not totally clear....ok, how about this. if i hook a PS3 up to a TV via a HDMI cable is the picture i'm getting on the screen Componant or RGB?

The answer to that is dependent on the Playstation 3, not the HDMI. The Playstation 3 is equipped with an HDMI 1.3a port, and according to Sony, the PS3 fully supports xvYCC and Deep Color. It's not clear whether this is a system-wide standard or on a per-game basis. If it's a system-wide standard, or if it's not but you're playing a game that supports it, then it's neither component nor RGB. xvYCC is a new standard that is above RGB and component. "Deep Color" is just a buzzphrase meaning color depth beyond 24-bit, but it's unknown (at least to me) whether PS3 has 30-, 36-, or 48-bit color.

[Soviet Conscript]

The answer to that is dependent on the Playstation 3, not the HDMI. The Playstation 3 is equipped with an HDMI 1.3a port, and according to Sony, the PS3 fully supports xvYCC and Deep Color. It's not clear whether this is a system-wide standard or on a per-game basis. If it's a system-wide standard, or if it's not but you're playing a game that supports it, then it's neither component nor RGB. xvYCC is a new standard that is above RGB and component. "Deep Color" is just a buzzphrase meaning color depth beyond 24-bit, but it's unknown (at least to me) whether PS3 has 30-, 36-, or 48-bit color.

ahh, thank you again

so HDMI is fully capable of transmitting RGB and/or componant. what signal is sent to the TV depends on the device sending.

though i can't say i understand the idea of something above RGB as i thought it was the
"purest" method that can be used. i mean...is their hidden colors in the world that a new standard is going to magicly allow me to see? but thanks for explaining the HDMI question. I appriciate the help.

[j_factor]

though i can't say i understand the idea of something above RGB as i thought it was the "purest" method that can be used. i mean...is their hidden colors in the world that a new standard is going to magicly allow me to see?

Suddenly I miss Anthony1. ;)

RGB is as good as conventional displays are capable of, but newer technology is capable of better color depth.

In standard RGB a color is defined by three 8-bit values, each representing "how much" of red, blue, and green is in the color. However, the range is slightly limited -- instead of the possible values being between 1 and 254, the possible values are only 16 to 235. It was done that way due to the limitations of analog TV sets. Even though we have digital TVs now, RGB still doesn't go beyond those original limitations. xvYCC adds in those "missing" values. It allows much deeper reds, blues, and greens compared to a conventional RGB signal. So yes, there are "hidden" colors in the world that you can't see with normal RGB.

Now here's where it gets really confusing. With Deep Color you can have 48-bit color depth, meaning 16-bit values for red, blue, and green. You can have Deep Color in standard RGB (or component, which is really just a different way of rendering RGB) or xvYCC, and you can have xvYCC with Deep Color or 24-bit color depth. In practice, so far, it has been generally true that you either have both xvYCC and Deep Color, or neither. But they're still pretty new. The distinction is that xvYCC extends the range of possible color, whereas Deep Color extends the number of definable colors within that range. In other words, Deep Color (without xvYCC) doesn't add the missing parts at the high and low end, but it gives you a larger number of possible shades in between (ie, more exactly defined shades).

[Poofta!]

xbox wont send a 1080p over component.

also, most tvs wont receive a 1080p over component (i know mine wont). only hdmi.

i was always led to believe that hdmi is just a higher bandwith capable stream. which is why 1080p is only available through it (not component) [afaik]

[ProgrammingAce]

i was always led to believe that hdmi is just a higher bandwith capable stream. which is why 1080p is only available through it (not component) [afaik]

You can't send/receive 1080p through component because movie companies don't want to send a "high quality" signal through an unprotected channel. Component itself is more then capable of handling it.

[Soviet Conscript]

thanks j_factor for explaining that.

[rbudrick]

RF, composite, svideo, component, scart (Euro, Japan), vga, dvi/HDMI. That is the order of quality. Some may argue the order of component and scart, and that's fine. Scart is superior for a lot of other reasons, but not nearly universal, so I don't care.

Scart, VGA, and DVI/HDMI are all RGB formats with extra crap thrown in. HDMI is considered by most to be the best and is the onlydigital one of the bunch. Does that answer everything?

-Rob

[jonjandran]

xbox wont send a 1080p over component.

[afaik]

The Xbox 360 will send 1080p over component via upconverting Dvd's and with Games but not with the Hd-Dvd player.

[Graham Mitchell]

On a side note...when hooking up my 360 via HDMI I'm required to come up with some other RCA cables for the "digital sound". Do to space/arrangement constraints, I have to just use the TV's built-in speakers, and I can't hook anything up to an amp. Am I gonna notice any difference than if I just used the stereo cables from the Component cable? Does this digital sound stuff really do anything?

The only game I've got that would test sound performance is Bioshock. Now, there's a lot of dynamic range in the game (gunshots being incredibly loud while speech, ambient sound requires me to crank the volume), and that's cool, but it's most likely a function of how the game was mixed, not of what kind of audio cable I'm using. Other than this, I don't really notice a hell of a whole lot. Should I?

[Sweater Fish Deluxe]

ahh, thank you again

so HDMI is fully capable of transmitting RGB and/or componant. what signal is sent to the TV depends on the device sending.

though i can't say i understand the idea of something above RGB as i thought it was the
"purest" method that can be used. i mean...is their hidden colors in the world that a new standard is going to magicly allow me to see? but thanks for explaining the HDMI question. I appriciate the help.
ProgrammingAce explained everything in his first post, you shouldn't have brushed it off. The type of RGB you're thinking of is an analog signal meant to be displayed on an analog CRT display. xvYCC is a digital standard for displaying digital images on an LCD or other digital display. It is in fact quite impossible to compare analog things to digital things without accounting for such difficult concepts as infinity and God. So stop it.


...word is bondage...

[Soviet Conscript]

ProgrammingAce explained everything in his first post, you shouldn't have brushed it off. The type of RGB you're thinking of is an analog signal meant to be displayed on an analog CRT display. xvYCC is a digital standard for displaying digital images on an LCD or other digital display. It is in fact quite impossible to compare analog things to digital things without accounting for such difficult concepts as infinity and God. So stop it.


...word is bondage...


i was just curious what kind of signal an HDMI cable transmitted. now i thought you guys pretty much answered me but now you've given me more questions.

is digital inherently "better" then an analog signal? does digital RGB look exactly like analog RGB with the only diffrence being on the type of display they are ment for?

[ProgrammingAce]

Alright, alright. Let me put this in simple terms.

Every TV/Game Console/Movie Player combination is going to display differently across different devices. You might have an awesome Sony plasma that displays great over component, but HDMI looks washed out. You might have an HD-DVD player that looks crystal clear using HDMI on that Sony set, but is slightly blurry on an RCA plasma.

To flat out say HDMI is better then VGA or component is impossible. You have to look at the individual devices you're planning to use and see what looks best for you.

As for HDMI itself, it was only created for 2 reasons and higher quality video isn't one of them.

- To create a connection simplifying the number/size of cables needed.
- To create a vehicle to force HDCP down the consumer's throat.

HDCP stands for High-bandwidth Digital Content Protection, but that an issue for another day.