Questions about Sega CD / Saturn memory carts

[Cinder6]

I have just a couple questions about the Sega CD and (official) Saturn memory carts.

Do they work the same? (As in, does the SCD one support direct saving?) Does the SCD one work with all games? Do they use battery backup?

EDIT: Note for people coming into the thread. This topic is almost a year old, and my questions have been answered. There's a new discussion going on at the end, though.

[SnowKitty]

i can confirm that the official saturn memory cart uses flash memory.

[InsaneDavid]

Official Sega CD Backup RAM Cartridge: uses a battery inside, supports direct saving.

Sega Saturn backup cartridges vary, the official Sega one supports direct saving. Some of the third party ones do, some do not. The Pro Action Replay 4M does not support direct saving.

I know I've typed all this out before, I'm sure there are at least a few threads that can / have already explained this better.

[Cinder6]

Alright, thanks, I'll do some searching. My main concern is whether all SCD games support direct saving.

[Dreamc@sting]

David is right, 3rd party carts are the only ones that are really hit or miss

[logsofhod]

i can confirm that the official saturn memory cart uses flash memory.

until recently i believed the same thing, but after almost 10 years, my official memory cart started stuffing up, opening it up revealed a battery!!

did sega produce 2 variants of the cart? 1 being flash and 1 being battery?

[logsofhod]

update, some snappies


http://img172.imageshack.us/img172/9600/memfrontet2.th.jpg (http://img172.imageshack.us/my.php?image=memfrontet2.jpg)
http://img132.imageshack.us/img132/6627/membackfx3.th.jpg (http://img132.imageshack.us/my.php?image=membackfx3.jpg)
http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/9470/pcbfrontlf8.th.jpg (http://img150.imageshack.us/my.php?image=pcbfrontlf8.jpg)
http://img255.imageshack.us/img255/6539/pcbbackas5.th.jpg (http://img255.imageshack.us/my.php?image=pcbbackas5.jpg)

[The 1 2 P]

The Pro Action Replay 4M does not support direct saving.

How do saves for this version work?

[Vlcice]

The Action Reply menu has a memory manager, which allows you to copy saves between the internal memory and the cartridge's memory. The Action Replay's memory isn't visible to the Saturn menu or Saturn games in any way.

[The 1 2 P]

Then I should probably get a better memory card for when I start to actually play my Saturn games because right now the Action Replay 4 in 1 cart is all I have.

[CDiablo]

Not all Sega CD games supported direct saving to the cart....sometimes you had to go to the internal memory manager and transfer the onboard save to the cart, just like the pro action replay for the SS.

[SkiDragon]

update, some snappies


http://img172.imageshack.us/img172/9600/memfrontet2.th.jpg (http://img172.imageshack.us/my.php?image=memfrontet2.jpg)
http://img132.imageshack.us/img132/6627/membackfx3.th.jpg (http://img132.imageshack.us/my.php?image=membackfx3.jpg)
http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/9470/pcbfrontlf8.th.jpg (http://img150.imageshack.us/my.php?image=pcbfrontlf8.jpg)
http://img255.imageshack.us/img255/6539/pcbbackas5.th.jpg (http://img255.imageshack.us/my.php?image=pcbbackas5.jpg)

I have an identical looking cart. I was not able to take it apart completely, but I was able to get a peek at the board. My cart does NOT have a battery, and seems to have fewer chips as well.

[logsofhod]

interesting! so we may have a case of revised design... maybe the earlier ones had batteries or something

[A Black Falcon]

On the Sega CD Backup RAM Carts: Indeed, they have batteries in them. They aren't standard CR-2032s though, from what I've heard...

I did a big console save-types list thing a while ago, found here:
http://www.sega-16.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5965 (I should probably just create a thread somewhere on this forum with a copy of it too...)

... I need to edit in some new Saturn info, now. But anyway, on the Sega CD, this is the only thing I've seen on what's in them: a CR2450. Not one I've heard of other game systems using... Are those batteries indeed in all Sega CD Backup RAM Carts? Source here: http://www.sega-16.com/forum/showpost.php?p=115118&postcount=24

On the Saturn:

Sega actually did release two (technically three) different models of the Saturn memory card in Japan... only one was released in the US and Europe, but Japan got three. I was just wondering what the differences between the models were, and whether one used a battery and the other the flash memory Saturn memory cards were known to have...
Japan
--
HSS-0111 (11/22/94, Japan launch day)
HSS-0138 (7/5/96)
HSS-0513 (9/27/96, "Sakura Wars" label card) -- same as HSS-0138 but with a new label and color?

Europe
--
MK-80300 (first availability?)

US
--
80101 (first availability?)

Later on there was also a US special edition "Dragon Force" labeled card, but like the Japanese "Sakura Wars" one it was almost certainly just a new face on a standard card. There are also other special edition cards, such as a Tamagochi one in Japan; Sega only lists the Sakura Wars one on the Sega Japan Saturn memory card page, though.

So... is that cart official?

The pic in that other thread point out that that board has no "C Sega" logo on it... the cartridge shell looks official, though, but is the board inside a fake? Or did Sega indeed have some battery-backed carts?

It's also interesting that it appears to use a CR2032 in a coin-cell holder. That's all, for a card with 512KB of save memory, while the 64KB Sega CD Backup RAM Cart seems to have had a much bigger one? And if that is a coin-cell holder (and not solder), that's also interesting. Other than the Saturn, older consoles virtually always have soldered batteries, particularly first-party stuff... like how first-party N64 controller paks have soldered batteries like all Nintendo carts with batteries, while Performance's third-party cards actually have coin-cell holders in them, with no solder. Other third parties did solder, but obviously not Performance... but anyway, it is odd that that cart has a battery. It does say Sega on the back of the cart, but that doesn't mean it's definitely real... I would like to know for sure, though.

http://www.digitpress.com/forum/showthread.php?t=117601
http://assemblergames.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3937
http://sega.jp/archive/segahard/ss/memory.html
http://shenmue001.chez-alice.fr/ref_sat.txt

[logsofhod]

So... is that cart official?

The pic in that other thread point out that that board has no "C Sega" logo on it... the cartridge shell looks official, though, but is the board inside a fake? Or did Sega indeed have some battery-backed carts?

It's also interesting that it appears to use a CR2032 in a coin-cell holder. That's all, for a card with 512KB of save memory, while the 64KB Sega CD Backup RAM Cart seems to have had a much bigger one? And if that is a coin-cell holder (and not solder), that's also interesting..
.
.
.
It does say Sega on the back of the cart, but that doesn't mean it's definitely real... I would like to know for sure, though.

hey a black falcon, nice listing on sega-16 btw..

i'll have a rummage in the garage and look for the box to get you the HSS number.. on the surface it appears to be official, but like yourself, i thought i'd find a sega marking on the pcb, but there is none, could be suspicious..

my girlfriend got it for me when she was in hong kong almost 10 years ago, it was brand new and came in the box, the usual sort of matt cardboard with red print on it.

yeah it's definately a coin cell holder, its not soldered in, i replaced the battery a few days back and it appears to be back in operation now.

i'll post pics as soon as i find the box

[duo_r]

does anyone have the official box that came with the Sega Saturn memory cart? I want to repro a custom box for one and need some scans. thanks!

[TheDomesticInstitution]

I found the Sega CD Backup Cart the other day. I took it apart to clean it today, and decided to take a few good pictures in case anyone is interested. There always seems to be a few questions about it every so often, about how it saves and the battery type, so I figured these pictures would help anyone who stumbles across this thread looking for answers (like I did).

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1373/4602357299_82be54bfa7_b.jpg
http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4026/4602362013_1842d39ebd_b.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3408/4602359359_c88a4cdc98_b.jpg

[duo_r]

I wonder when that CR2032 needs to be replaced. Does it look like it is pretty straight forward (like no soldering)?


I found the Sega CD Backup Cart the other day. I took it apart to clean it today, and decided to take a few good pictures in case anyone is interested. There always seems to be a few questions about it every so often, about how it saves and the battery type, so I figured these pictures would help anyone who stumbles across this thread looking for answers (like I did).

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1373/4602357299_82be54bfa7_b.jpg
http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4026/4602362013_1842d39ebd_b.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3408/4602359359_c88a4cdc98_b.jpg

[InsaneDavid]

I wonder when that CR2032 needs to be replaced. Does it look like it is pretty straight forward (like no soldering)?

Um, that's a CR2450 and it's tacked to the leads as most cartridge batteries are. Installing a battery holder in its place when replacing the battery is a pretty common way to do it.

[duo_r]

Ok excuse me, CR2450...now should that be replaced sometime soon?


Um, that's a CR2450 and it's tacked to the leads as most cartridge batteries are. Installing a battery holder in its place when replacing the battery is a pretty common way to do it.

[A Black Falcon]

Ok excuse me, CR2450...now should that be replaced sometime soon?

Cool scans, nice to see confirmation that yes, it definitely is a CR2450 as I had heard. I said it earlier in the thread I think, but the CR2450 isn't exactly used often by game system saves... it's interesting that they chose it.

As for your question, the 2450 is a larger capacity battery than the standard 2032, so most likely it won't die quite as soon as a 2032-backed cart would be, unless it's drawing a lot of power, of course, that would determine how long it lasts (that is, if they used a larger battery because it uses more power). Most of the CD Backup RAM Carts do seem to be still working from what I've heard though, and they're over 15 years old, so maybe those carts really do last longer thanks to the higher-capacity battery...

Anyway, of course they will die sometime, so sure it could be replaced, that would probably keep the cart going for a long time if they last as long as the batteries have so far. You'd just need the correct kind of battery and the skill (or someone with the skill) to replace cart batteries.

[Rogue]

I'm waiting for the confirmation about the Saturn Backup Cartridge too.
(I really don't want to open my white (red box, japanese) one (0138).)

Here's some comparisons of two japanese versions (must be the gray and the white):
http://assemblergames.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18517

Both Sega labeled and without batteries.

[Icarus Moonsight]

I just took a look at my two US Saturn Backup Carts. Both had no coin battery and seemed to be flash based.

Maybe the Japanese launch backup carts were produced with a battery save due to cost constraints at the time. That's just a stab in the dark by me though.

I've always wanted a Sega CD Ram cart... Never could find one though. Back then even. Oh well. Limited system ram just means you have to stay focused on one or a few games at a time or get nowhere with any of them. LOL

[The 1 2 P]

I just got a new Action Replay 4 in 1 to replace the other one I had which didn't save games. This one works perfectly but I hope it stays that way. I still need to get a backup cart for my X-Eye because I don't think theres much room in the system for very many saves.

[alec006]

Since its a CR2450,do yourself a favor and find one with a larger mAh hour rate since it seems CR2450's range from 500mAh to 600mAh,least the ones I have do. The battery will last abit longer depending on usage.