RetroDuo NES/SNES Clone Official Thread. Castlevania III, StarFox WORK, SMRPG WARNING

[lovablechevy]

So she replied back to me and said it says made in Japan on the Super Mario RPG cart. Does this mean it will not work at all on my Retro Duo System?

not necessarily. mine says made in japan and works perfectly. so, you can't judge it by if it says made in japan or made in mexico.

[GrandAmChandler]

Does anyone have a copy of Kirby Superstar or Dreamland 3? Those were the other SA-1 chip games released in the US, but I'm not sure if they had the region/copy protection enabled. Apparently, it's a CAPABILITY of the SA-1, but not required (explains why v1.0 works). V1.1 and 1.2 probably were just the same board with the lockout enabled.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nintendo_SA-1

I have Kirby's Dreamland 3, and it works perfectly on my Black Retro Duo.

-GAC-

[Buns34]

That gives me some hope. Is version 1.0 more rare than the later versions? And will the quick on and off trick work? Or this tape trick: http://nfggames.com/forum2/index.php?topic=1382.0

[lovablechevy]

That gives me some hope. Is version 1.0 more rare than the later versions? And will the quick on and off trick work? Or this tape trick: http://nfggames.com/forum2/index.php?topic=1382.0

sorry, i don't know. version 1.0 would just be the first one sold. it seems there would be more of them... but i'm not sure. as for the on and off trick or the tape... i have no clue... sorry! i've seemed to read more people having success of mario rpg working on the retro duo than those not...

[Buns34]

Thanks, then hopefully my copy will work. If not, i guess i could sell it, and try to find one that does.

[NayusDante]

Neither trick seems to work for me. PAL/US pinout is the same, right? Label facing up, I'm taping the top side of the pins, third pin from the left of the main section.

Funny, Super Mario RPG happened to be the first game where I actually read the "copyright protection" section in the manual about backup copies not being necessary and the like.

[ooXxXoo]

I now have 3 Retro Duo systems, my Super Mario RPG game doesn't work in none of them....It is definately the game revision....All of my other FX games work just fine...still looking for a mod fix though.

[NayusDante]

Just got back from the flea market...

My NES Compatibility Additions:
Advanced Dungeons & Dragons: Heroes of the Lance
Castlevania III: Dracula's Curse (sound was VERY low...)
Faxanadu
Wizardry

[remowilliams]

Castlevania III: Dracula's Curse (sound was VERY low...)
Some of the CVIII music is pretty mangled. The name intro screen in particular has what sounds like white noise instead of musical notes. It also generally seems that on the NES side the RD seems to have a bad habit of overclipping melodic instruments when some types of percussion is played. :|

[NayusDante]

Some of the CVIII music is pretty mangled. The name intro screen in particular has what sounds like white noise instead of musical notes. It also generally seems that on the NES side the RD seems to have a bad habit of overclipping melodic instruments when some types of percussion is played. :|

Odd, it sounded right to me on the TV, but that describes how Castlevania I sounded for me when I recorded it. Still, it sounded fine on the TV. I'll record C3 later.

[remowilliams]

Odd, it sounded right to me on the TV, but that describes how Castlevania I sounded for me when I recorded it. Still, it sounded fine on the TV. I'll record C3 later.
Cool, I'd like to hear a real clean recording of the name entry screen and at least one run through of the main game music loop. Want to ensure that it's not just my RD. ;)

[Frankie_Says_Relax]

Some of the CVIII music is pretty mangled. The name intro screen in particular has what sounds like white noise instead of musical notes. It also generally seems that on the NES side the RD seems to have a bad habit of overclipping melodic instruments when some types of percussion is played. :|

I've definitely noticed some of the synth percussion on the NES side of things sounding a bit "flat" (I made note of that in my initial review) ... but the name entry screen on CV III sounds okay to me on my RD ... nothing as bad as white noise.

[remowilliams]

I've definitely noticed some of the synth percussion on the NES side of things sounding a bit "flat" (I made note of that in my initial review) ... but the name entry screen on CV III sounds okay to me on my RD ... nothing as bad as white noise.
Yeah, this is way more than just a bit off... I should say the melody instruments sound like giant buzzing insects rather than white noise.

Here's recordings from a real NES and the RD

http://rapidshare.com/files/110924033/NES.CV3.EnterName.mp3.html
http://rapidshare.com/files/110924034/RD.CV3.EnterName.mp3.html

[NayusDante]

Yeah, this is way more than just a bit off... I should say the melody instruments sound like giant buzzing insects rather than white noise.

Here's recordings from a real NES and the RD

http://rapidshare.com/files/110924033/NES.CV3.EnterName.mp3.html
http://rapidshare.com/files/110924034/RD.CV3.EnterName.mp3.html

Mine sounds nearly identical to the NES recording. Check your manufacture dates, mine are listed on part 3 of my videos.

[Frankie_Says_Relax]

I think my Retro Duo is also handling the sound on Castlevania III a bit differently / better than yours, but I'll need to check to be sure.

Since "RapidShare.com" only allows me one free download a day, I'll have to wait till tomorrow to check the 1st recording, but in the event that the 2nd is the Retro Duo output for Castlevania III ... I don't think it's THAT bad.

Yes, it's obviously suffering from emulation issues, and the sound synthesis is a bit on the fuzzy side, however, considering that it's only on the name entry screen I don't see it as a huge issue. (Not that you are.)

[remowilliams]

Mine sounds nearly identical to the NES recording. Check your manufacture dates, mine are listed on part 3 of my videos.

Dates appear to be the same. If yours sounds identical to the NES recording, there may be a problem with my RD as they don't sound the same at all. :|

http://img242.imageshack.us/img242/1879/img0720bh3.th.jpg (http://img242.imageshack.us/my.php?image=img0720bh3.jpg)

[ooXxXoo]

Since you guys are talking about sound issues, and by looking at remowilliams board, it remind me about my own findings regarding a crystal....It is very important for you all to take a closer look at your board.....First of, the crystal at the front right next to the power switch and reset button, should read as follow: 21.47727

Next, the crystal located almost at the middle of the SNES side(the one between the TCT-978 and TCT-975 chips ,closer to a capacitor)should be: 24.576 or a higher number,...If you happen to have a 21.47727 there instead,the game play in your SNES games will be running slow, with slow distorded sound emulation, not so close to the original SNES system game and sound play.... It can be replaced to run normal....

And finally, the crystal in the NES side at the end, located right next to the A/V jack connectors should read: 21.47727 or 24.576

It'll be great if you all can check on this, and post your results....Your Retro Duo depends on this...

[NayusDante]

Since you guys are talking about sound issues, and by looking at remowilliams board, it remind me about my own findings regarding the crystal oscillators....It is very important for you all to take a closer look at your board.....First of, the oscillator at the front right next to the power switch and reset button, should read as follow: 21.47727

Next, the oscillator located almost at the middle of the SNES side(the one between the TCT-978 and TCT-975 chips ,closer to a capacitor)should be: 24.576 or a higher number,...If you happen to have a 21.47727 there instead,the game play in your SNES games will be running slow, with slow distorded sound emulation, mnot so close to the original SNES system game and sound play.... It can be replaced to run normal....

And finally, the oscillator in the NES side at the end, located right next to the A/V jack connectors should read: 24.576

It'll be great if you all can check on this, and post your results....Your Retro Duo depends on this...

First two are good, SNES is perfect. Still, do you have any explanation for my colors being grayed in spots when I first got it, then it getting better after a few uses?

NES oscillator is a 21.47727M. Why the M when none of the others have it? Is this easy/recommended to replace? Can I get the part at Radio Shack?

Also, where Remo's board had an Alliance branded chip, mine has an EliteMT branded one. LP61(funny L)1024S-12 9934S N6R05NA

It looks like there's a spot for an oscillator next to that chip, but neither mine nor Remo's has anything in it.

[ooXxXoo]

First two are good, SNES is perfect. Still, do you have any explanation for my colors being grayed in spots when I first got it, then it getting better after a few uses?

NES oscillator is a 21.47727M. Why the M when none of the others have it? Is this easy/recommended to replace? Can I get the part at Radio Shack?

Also, where Remo's board had an Alliance branded chip, mine has an EliteMT branded one. LP61(funny L)1024S-12 9934S N6R05NA

It looks like there's a spot for an oscillator next to that chip, but neither mine nor Remo's has anything in it.

I did further testings, and having a 21.47727 crystal in the NES side is perfectly fine.....There is no improvement when having a higher one.....
I did noticed the missing crystal and different chips brands near the samsung encoder in other revisions.....

The chips appear to be, pin by pin the same,just a clone of each other.....Also,I'm into thinking that the missing crystal could be used for PAL/Secam systems but not for sure....

It is necessary to have a 24.576 in the middle(SNES side) though...If your Retro Duo don't have it and you are not able to find exactly the same, you can always go with a 24.000 instead....You could check for parts at digi-key.com or even at Ebay.

[NayusDante]

Hmmm. So I guess I'm fine then.

What I'd like at this point:
A working Mario RPG workaround
NES S-Video support without flickering rainbow colors

My TV just doesn't have good composite inputs. HDMI and component are teh awesome, but no love for old stuff.

I also noticed some possible polyphony issues in Mega Man 5. Some channels seem to cut out in favor of SE, but it seems a tad off overall. C3 still sounds like an NES though...

I have a feeling that the volume problem is my actual TV and its awful composite inputs. I don't remember the RD sounding low when I tried my retro TV.

[Buns34]

So you guys are saying that some of the Retro Duo's do not run Super NES games properly out of the box? If so, then i better get the right one from Amazon! LOL

[ooXxXoo]

NayusDante, does your tv has some sort of AVC feature enable?.....This controls the volume, especially in regular tv viewing when some commercials seem to have a higher volume than others.....If it is on, the tv inputs will be controlled as well, making video games to sound low at the begining....You could check with your tv setup.

[NayusDante]

So you guys are saying that some of the Retro Duo's do not run Super NES games properly out of the box? If so, then i better get the right one from Amazon! LOL

So far, Mario RPG seems to be the only confirmed iffy title.

I just did a headphones test on my RD, and NES DOES have proper polyphony. So every problem I'm having (Mario RPG aside) is with my setup, not the RD.

HOWEVER, the static is there. It's more noticeable on the NES. When the SNES is booting a game, I can hear a distinct set of squeaks in the static, weird.

[NayusDante]

NayusDante, does your tv has some sort of AVC feature enable?.....This controls the volume, especially in regular tv viewing when some commercials seem to have a higher volume than others.....If it is on, the tv inputs will be controlled as well, making video games to sound low at the begining....You could check with your tv setup.

Nope, it's pretty basic as far as tweaking. I have a user preset for bass and treble, but that's about it. I cranked up both, which seems to help, but NES is still softer than SNES.

[Buns34]

O.K. good. Its just that he mentioned something about some of the Duo's running the SNES games at a slower speed. Do the cartridges from GameReproductions.com work? I would like to buy Dragon Quest V.

[NayusDante]

O.K. good. Its just that he mentioned something about some of the Duo's running the SNES games at a slower speed. Do the cartridges from GameReproductions.com work? I would like to buy Dragon Quest V.

I wouldn't know about repros, but some stuff seems to run a bit faster, but it might just be me.

[remowilliams]

And finally, the oscillator in the NES side at the end, located right next to the A/V jack connectors should read: 24.576
The crystal next to the AV jacks on mine is 21.47727

[ooXxXoo]

The crystal next to the AV jacks on mine is 21.47727

Yes, some revisions I've seen have the 24.576 there, but the 21.47727 crystal is just fine.

[remowilliams]

Cool. I'd like to get one more person confirming the audio, but it seems that my NES audio issues are a fault on my RD. :(

[fog]

Hi all

Just got my Retro Duo through today and thought you might like to hear how it fares on a PAL system.

The version I have is the red and black version 2.0.

First of all - the S-video looks really good and is much better than the normal signal.

all the PAL games run full screen and full speed and the console plugs straight into the mains with an adaptor for the 3 pin plug sockets we have here - no need for a step down converter. EDIT - FALSE - YOU DO NEED A STEP DOWN OR YOU'LL FRY THE CONSOLE :(

I only have a handful of SNES carts to try out at the moment - i'm waiting on some NES and SNES carts from ebay.

here are the games i've tried:

STREET FIGHTER II USA CART - works fine although as someone already pointed out the pads are not very good for the special moves. The sound in some parts sounds a little different to what I remember but nothing to drastic - I could be imagining it.

ZELDA PAL CART - I don't know if the cart is a little dodgy but I seem to have trouble creating a new character - sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't - the cart has seen better days so it might be that. I'll come to the sound in a bit.

WILLIAMS ARCADE CLASSICS PAL CART - works great - these games are sooo tough!

ALIEN III PAL CART - works fine although the game is pants!


My main area of concern is the sound - on WILLIAMS ARCADE CLASSICS the sound is loud and clear but on the others, especially ZELDA the sound is much quieter and there is more of those weird background sounds apparant that I remember from the 16bit consoles. I'm not sure if this is how it would sound on a proper SNES or not. There is some slight distortion to some of the sound on ZELDA in general.


I'll let you know how it works with more games when I get them through.

[ooXxXoo]

After Reading fog's post, I went ahead and did another test...This time,using a 50/Hz PAL system LCD screen that I had in storage and that totally forgot about, since I don't have much use of it living here In the US (NTSC).....These were the results:

The SNES side worked ok with Ntsc SNES/SFC games...They run in full 60/Hz PAL mode...
Fog's description states that PAL system games work with it too....SNES multi-system compatibility perhaps???....

Now, when I tested the NES side with NTSC NES games running in the same PAL system LCD screen, the image was in the very common known incompatible Black & White screen....I don't have any PAL NES games for further testing, but it is quite possible that they'll work in PAL system tv's set ups (duh!...it'll make sense)....
Hopefully, fog or any other PAL user can keep us posted whenever they get to test some PAL NES games..,..

This definately gives the Retro Duo another extra point on my list!.....

[fog]

All the NES games i've ordered are USA carts but I will let you know if I get some PAL ones.

I have a problem!!!

OK - so I have been playing with the Retro Duo for a few hours today on and off. The problems started with the Zelda cartridge which wasn't letting me create a new game - I managed to get it to do so twice after a bit of cleaning of the cart however now the SNES is having trouble booting at all - have I wrecked it? I used some cotton buds sprayed with record cleaner but thinking about it this could have been a really bad idea as it does contain water - now the retro duo struggles to boot and just glitches with the occasional successful boot. Hopefully after a rest it will be OK but I don't know - the other thing is that I am not using a step down converter for the power as the adaptor says it can handle the current here.

[ooXxXoo]

All the NES games i've ordered are USA carts but I will let you know if I get some PAL ones.

I have a problem!!!

OK - so I have been playing with the Retro Duo for a few hours today on and off. The problems started with the Zelda cartridge which wasn't letting me create a new game - I managed to get it to do so twice after a bit of cleaning of the cart however now the SNES is having trouble booting at all - have I wrecked it? I used some cotton buds sprayed with record cleaner but thinking about it this could have been a really bad idea as it does contain water - now the retro duo struggles to boot and just glitches with the occasional successful boot. Hopefully after a rest it will be OK but I don't know - the other thing is that I am not using a step down converter for the power as the adaptor says it can handle the current here.


The power adapter should be fine, the label claims to be 100/240V 50/60Hz compatible....Although,I don't recall the RetroDuo having an internal IC power regulator.....Are you having problems with all of your SNES games to boot up, or just Zelda?......Check the Retro Duo SNES connector, since you used cotton buds, look for lint residue in it...

I was having problems with "Yoshis Island" saves, just to find out that the cartridge internal battery was dead....I Replaced it,and now is fine.

[fog]

It's all of them - what worries me is that I wiped the contacts on the retro duo with a lint cloth after I was having trouble with Zelda - I didn't use hardly any of the spray on the cloth though. I'll try the console again in a while hopefully it will be ok.

I was playing ZELDA - played it for about 20-30 minutes then rebooted the cart after a save to see if it had saved which it had not so then turned off and tried another cart - ever since then 9 out of 10 boots results in either a blank screen or weird glitching.

UPDATE

OK - I just enjoyed 5 minutes on STREET FIGHTER then 5 minutes on WILLIAMS ARCADE and then ziltch - what the heck - it's a real shame as i'm really impressed with this unit when it works.

I can't really think that my little attempts at removing dust could really have caused this - i'm going to have to mail the seller and see if they can replace it I think.



ANOTHER UPDATE

OK - I THINK I'VE WORKED IT OUT - Basically I think I have misunderstood the whole process of why you need to down-convert the voltage - even though the adaptor is capable of handling the power basically the console is not wired to deal with the 240V that the UK mains gives out and I am probably frying the unit - well you live and learn.

I'll have to get a step down converter and cross my fingers that I haven't caused too much damage.

[ooXxXoo]

It's all of them - what worries me is that I wiped the contacts on the retro duo with a lint cloth after I was having trouble with Zelda - I didn't use hardly any of the spray on the cloth though. I'll try the console again in a while hopefully it will be ok.

I was playing ZELDA - played it for about 20-30 minutes then rebooted the cart after a save to see if it had saved which it had not so then turned off and tried another cart - ever since then 9 out of 10 boots results in either a blank screen or weird glitching.

UPDATE

OK - I just enjoyed 5 minutes on STREET FIGHTER then 5 minutes on WILLIAMS ARCADE and then ziltch - what the heck - it's a real shame as i'm really impressed with this unit when it works.

I can't really think that my little attempts at removing dust could really have caused this - i'm going to have to mail the seller and see if they can replace it I think.

I had experienced with a faulty new RetroDuo in the past....Yes, from a brand new sealed box....I'm sure its going to happen to others...(hope not)... managed to fixed it because I didn't wanted to go thru the whole shipping back hassle....Besides, I removed some of the cheap parts and upgraded it with better quality ones while at it....You should take full warranty advantage....Hopefully,retailers will send the word out to who ever is manufacturing them so they can be aware of these problems....
If you've decided to give the converter a try,let us know how it goes...

[NayusDante]

I'm heading out in a few minutes and I'll be at Radio Shack. Would a composite-to-svideo adapter work for NES?

[fog]

Right - I let it cool again and switched it on just for a second or two with 3 different cartridges and they all worked so that kind of suggests that I have overheated the unit and it was smelling a little strange.

What do you reckon are my chances of scraping out of this one with the console intact.

Anyone here have any experiences of blowing or burning out consoles?

[ooXxXoo]

I'm heading out in a few minutes and I'll be at Radio Shack. Would a composite-to-svideo adapter work for NES?

I have a friend who got one of these composite/s-video converters in the past from the shack, according to him, he had paid around $23 bucks.....He wasn't very pleased with it.

Hey, You can always returned it if not happy!

[NayusDante]

I have a friend who got one of these composite/s-video converters in the past from the shack, according to him, he had paid around $23 bucks.....He wasn't very pleased with it.

Hey, You can always returned it if not happy!

Yeah, I saw the price and left it alone. They're much cheaper online. I'd build my own, but I don't have the right capacitor on hand, and the aesthetics of my electronics work isn't exactly pretty.

Just curious, does anyone else get an image like THIS on their LCD? And ONLY on composite connections?

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2037/2452726271_5c0103936f_b.jpg

[Frankie_Says_Relax]

Yeah, I saw the price and left it alone. They're much cheaper online. I'd build my own, but I don't have the right capacitor on hand, and the aesthetics of my electronics work isn't exactly pretty.

Just curious, does anyone else get an image like THIS on their LCD? And ONLY on composite connections?

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2037/2452726271_5c0103936f_b.jpg

I get a tiny bit of artifacting in certain NES games with the components in, but nothing to that degree!

You can see the general smoothness of the system on my Panasoic LCD in my first post.

[NayusDante]

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000V1LX6I/sr=8-24/qid=1209520117/ref=olp_product_details?ie=UTF8&me=&qid=1209520117&sr=8-24&seller=

There's my cheapest option.

[NayusDante]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lStwZyKUZpM

Notice how when something passes over it, it doesn't do anything. When there's movement to the side of it, however, it goes away and comes back. Youtube kills the quality, give it a while and see if the high quality option comes up.

[ooXxXoo]

dude, I don't think that this is normal...Is Megaman the only game with these sort of glitches?

[NayusDante]

dude, I don't think that this is normal...Is Megaman the only game with these sort of glitches?

Nope, it's ANYTHING over composite inputs. SNES did it too, but I get a perfect image over S-Video. It's just this TV too, the RD works perfectly on my retro TV. The only visual flaw it has is the vertical barring over NES, and I got that to go away by changing the contrast settings.

Anything with more detail looks fine, which is understandable. TV makers aren't going to optimize their sets for NES, they're going to optimize for TV and modern gaming.

[remowilliams]

Update on my sound issue - it was the RD unit itself. After swapping it out for another one (thanks Joe! :)) I now have NES sound that sounds like it should.

The RD NES sound is still a bit poppy and percussion heavy but it sounds a hundred times better then it did before. The audio part of the chip must have been somewhat borked.

[Frankie_Says_Relax]

As awesome as the Duo is as a bit of dual clone hardware, it's becoming pretty painfully obvious via this research/report thread that more than a handful of units seem to be facing some issues on the manufacturing side of things.

Non-standardized (as in not every Duo has the same chips/parts) and/or varied components on the board seem to be an issue causing different users/owners to experience varied audio, video and compatibility per system and per game.

My love for the system has not diminished due to this, but it's certainly a warning worth taking into account if you're thinking of picking one up.

[Don Skippy]

Hello all. I recently received my own black RD from an eBay seller. Thanks, everyone, by the way...all your posts helped lead to my purchase. My brother-in-law just ordered one, too, and since the RD world seems to be growing, I thought I'd post my own experiences, some of which confirm issues and compatibilities that others have brought up:

1) I can confirm that the NES Battletoads does freeze in the second level. It's like when you're on your way down in the vertical scroll, the colors seem to go to negatives, and then fade to black as the game freezes (about a minute into the 2nd level).

2) I can also confirm that the NES Paperboy is unusable. It boots fine, but for some reason none of the controller functions work. I can't even navigate in the startup screen to start the game. So since it just idles with no controller input, the game defaults into demo mode, and I just see the kid riding down the street, but I have no control over anything.

3) The sound does seem to reproduce percussion with harsher mid and high tones than an actual NES would. I notice this the most on the original Zelda, which has the anthem continuously looping the whole time. At one point when I was in one of the levels, the sound started quirking altogether, with the frequencies sounding tweaked all around, but the music was still recognizable. However, it went away after I beat the level, and has sounded normal ever since. Probably a one-time glitch. In my experience, the 8-bit NES has always had little quirks here and there anyway, most of them temporary (ie, the proverbial 8-bit slow-down when too many moving objects are in one screen).

4) I found a copy of Burgertime on the NES in pristine condition (and for a great price). Both the cart and the board contacts look brand new, however, it won't even boot on my RD. I took it to back to the store, and they could not get it to boot on an FC Twin, either. Unfortunately, no one has a working NES toaster or official top-loader around here, so we weren't able to try that. In spite of the problem, I wasn't willing to part with the game for store credit, because for all I know, that is a pretty rare find, especially at $5 in such great condition (I could be wrong, I'm no expert, but I thought, what if I eventually get an official top-loader and it works?).

**Does anyone else have this game?**

5) NES games seem to play with washed-out color. I have played them on a high-def CRT TV, and a regular 40" CRT, and both times, the colors seem to be less saturated, kind of like when you increase the brightness of a picture in PhotoShop...the colors look more faded. Maybe adjusting the TV will compensate for this, but it has happened on more than one set. On the other hand, I played the NES Zelda on an FC Twin running through an LCD TV at Play 'N Trade, and the colors were definitely more full, looking more like an actual NES. That being said, on the SNES side of things, everything looks great, both through composites, and the S-Video.

**Can anyone who has both a black RD and a white RD report any color differences between the two units? I wonder if only the black units tend to wash out NES games like this.**

6) For those of you hoping to be able to find a Super Mario RPG that runs in your RD, don't give up. I found a copy of it at my local Video Game Exchange for $20 before my RD even arrived in the mail. I went shopping there a few days later, again, before my RD had arrived, and someone else had happened to trade one in. When I got my RD, my copy of Mario RPG did not work, but the next day I brought the system to the store, and showed the clerk. We then tried his newly arrived copy, and ta-da, it worked perfectly. I explained the known issues with this game on the RD, and he happily made an even trade with me. And the bonus was, the new cart I got is in pristine condition, whereas the first one had a lot of after-market stickers to clean off.

**By the way, both my first non-functioning copy and my new working copy say "Made in Japan," so it looks like the manufacturing location is not a way to tell.**

7) I thought I heard somewhere that DK Country 3 might not work, since it had an SA chip. However, it works fine on my console.

Well, that's it for now. All in all, I'm happy to be able to play my games again. And while not perfect, I appreciate the RD's ability to play SNES games that other clones couldn't. I have never owned an FC Twin, but when I did my comparison shopping, I liked the fact that the RD could play Japanese and European Super Famicon games without any mods. I never ran across any confirmations or denials about the FC Twin's ability to do this...so just so us less educated ones know, can anyone give a word about this?

P.S. I heard that the RD plays the SNES Kirby's Adventure games, but that they might freeze up later in the game due to SA chips. Can anyone give their experiences with these games? Thanks a lot. Be back later.

[NayusDante]

My $3 S-Video adaptor came, and now my NES outputs in full color with a crisp, NON-CORRUPTED picture, heh. Only problem is that it looks exactly the same as the previously shown pictures of NES over S-Video. Most solid colors are filled with diagonal lines, but at least there's no more "shadows."

If we've had reports of Mexican AND Japanese manufactured Mario RPG working, then I think that there's more revisons to this game than we think. For all we know, there could be 1.0s made in both regions. Japan definitely made the later revisions, but Mexico is still unsure. Does anyone have a Mexican NON-WORKING copy?

[remowilliams]

**Does anyone else have this game?**
I don't have the cart itself, though the game loads and works fine on my PowerPak.

[Frankie_Says_Relax]

For the record, my copy of Burgertime works perfectly on my RD.

That cart may be blown. Have you tried it on a real NES?

[Don Skippy]

--I can't get my SNES Castevania IV to work on my RD. Anyone tried this game?

--I saw that user Fog had trouble saving his Zelda games. I'm not sure if he's talking about the NES original, or the SNES one. Anyway, I have a copy of the first NES Zelda, which I recently bought used, and it does not save. I'm guessing my battery is dead. But if anyone else out there has had problems saving with this game, maybe it's a compatibility thing. Just checking...can anyone confirm or deny this problem? (I haven't had any problems saving on Zelda II or other battery games though.)

Frankie: I don't know anyone with a functioning NES, including the local game stores. Good to know your Burgertime works...I'll consider exchanging mine now.

[remowilliams]

--I can't get my SNES Castevania IV to work on my RD. Anyone tried this game?
Yes, it works fine here. Zelda (NES or SNES) also saves without issue.

[Frankie_Says_Relax]

Yes, it works fine here. Zelda (NES or SNES) also saves without issue.

My Zelda also saves (and deletes) games in it's battery backup correctly as well.

[Don Skippy]

Yeah, I figure I just need to replace the battery on my NES Zelda. And I think I got a bad SNES Castlevania IV, as it doesn't work on an FC Twin at Play 'N Trade, either, and remowilliams says his works on the RD.

So, the obsessive side of me really wants to know the trade-offs, the nitty gritty if you will, between the RD and the FC Twin, since I just recently started getting back into my old games, and chose the RD based on an all-nighter of online research.

The obvious benefits of the RD are its ability to play SA-chip SNES games that the FC Twin could not, especially Mario RPG. Also, the NES Castlevania III was a big title that the RD plays, but which the FCT does not. However, with random game incompatibilities cropping up here and there on the RD, I decided to investigate some more. What I'm finding so far is by no means exhaustive, but I think it lends to more of a general idea of the trade-offs we're getting with this console.

Since it's been confirmed that the NES games Battletoads and Paperboy do not work on the RD, I decided to find out if the FCT would play them. In my mind, these are both big titles, as they are really fun to play, and are obviously classics. I took my carts to Play 'N Trade, since they are the only store in town with an FCT set up. Lo and behold, Battletoads freezes at the exact same point in Level 2 as it does on the RD. And Paperboy is also uncontrollable, as it is on the RD, even though it boots up.

That evens the playing field a little bit, since both clones do not play these games right. With that said, since the RD plays many SA-chip games, and Euro/Japanese SuperFC games, it clearly wins big points in compatibility. It has also been proven that the RD plays Power Paks, Game Genies, and the Gameboy Advance adapter. I have not seen any reports that the FCT plays SuperFC imports, or any of the latter game packs/devices. Maybe you guys are already thoroughly familiar with the FCT compatibility list, but I'm trying to find out for myself. If these things also work on an FCT (SA chip games excluded, since we know about those), then the playing field would even back out some more.

**Can anyone report about the above things?**

Lastly on this issue, having played a few games on an FC Twin at Play 'N Trade, to me, this console clearly has better color on NES games than the RD does. The SNES comparison is negligible, with perhaps the FCT having better saturation. But, the RD's color rendering is by all means tolerable, and still enjoyable, so, if I'm going to pick one clone to own, I'd choose broader game compatibility...hence the RD.

**Having proven that certain games (Battletoads and Paperboy) are incompatible on both clones, it would be interesting if they have the same incompatibilities with the other few random titles that have been found not to work (or at least work right), ie, Rolling Thunder, Demon's Crest, and maybe a *licensed* version of the NES Gauntlet. Anyone know anything about this?**

**Also still waiting to hear reports about SNES Kirby games potentially freezing on the RD**

If you've read everything, thanks for keeping up with me. Hope this is all relevant and not just taking up space.

[GrandAmChandler]

**Also still waiting to hear reports about SNES Kirby games potentially freezing on the RD**


I think I briefly mentioned it before, I have played 5 or 6 levels of a US Kirby's Dreamland 3 on my Black Retro Duo, no problems at all.

-GAC-

[ooXxXoo]

In case that any of you guys happen to have a nintendo R.O.B laying around, the Retro Duo system works great with it, although it depends a lot of your TV screen too...(I have heard rumors that R.O.B himself may have issues with some flat screens)....
The Retro Duo controllers comands are compatible:
Select=select, Start=Start, (d-pad)Up=Up, (d-pad)Down=Down, (button)Y=Close(closes R.O.B's arms) and (button) B=Open(you get the idea)....


http://usera.imagecave.com/capcom2000/hpim6217.jpg

Now R.O.B. has an extra allied!
.......
......
These tests were done while playing "Gyromite".

[Don Skippy]

Anyone know anything about the picture quality of the official NES 2 top-loader being inferior to the old original toasters? It does only have an RF...no RCA's :( I found an article that claimed that the RF on the NES 2 was inferior to that of the original toaster, even though it came out later:

http://www.nesplayer.com/Editorials/toploaderfailure.htm

YouTube comparisons at this point are inconclusive. There was a user review on the same web site as above by someone who was happy with the system. Anyway, just wondering if anyone has any experience with this or knows anything. Thanks..................

[remowilliams]

If you've read everything, thanks for keeping up with me. Hope this is all relevant and not just taking up space.
The FCT plays DSP/FX games but has some issues like weird colors in Starfox. The FCT does not work with the PowerPak (neither does any other clone but the RD).

I own both an (older) FCT and the RD, and the RD has just as good color representation on the NES. And the RD SNES s-video blows out the FCT composite.

[Don Skippy]

The FCT plays DSP/FX games but has some issues like weird colors in Starfox. The FCT does not work with the PowerPak (neither does any other clone but the RD).

I own both an (older) FCT and the RD, and the RD has just as good color representation on the NES. And the RD SNES s-video blows out the FCT composite.

Cool...good to know on all of that....I thought that Zelda was looking better on the FCT, but then again, I was on a different TV, not to mention, that's only one game out of hundreds. I'll try tweaking my TV settings to see how that changes things.

[Buns34]

Is there any way to tell which version of Super Mario RPG i have? I will not recieve my Retro Duo until Friday.

[Frankie_Says_Relax]

A BIT off-topic for this thread, but since we're obviously all NES Clone enthusiasts here I thought that you all might be interested in this :

I just got my "FC Mobile" in the mail today.

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b328/FrankieViturello/Photo-0128-1.jpg

The short list of minor frustrations are as follows:

1.) It's old-school Famiclone tech, so, no Castlevania III or any other incompatible games.

2.) Backwards NES button syndrome! I'm really not sure WHEN Hong Kong started making this mistake, but it seems to be RAMPANT in a LOT of current Fami/NES clones coming out of that region lately. The A button is on the LEFT and the B is on the RIGHT. It's not the worst thing in the world, but it makes playing games like Super Mario and Punch-Out kind of difficult.

3.) No AC output. Modern portable devices can usually get by for a good long while on batteries, but I'd like an option.

Other than that, the screen and speakers are pretty damned good, and for what I paid for it (around $30), I'm pretty happy, I'm going to do a full write-up on it soon, so keep an eye out!

[remowilliams]

I just got my "FC Mobile" in the mail today.

1.) It's old-school Famiclone tech, so, no Castlevania III or any other incompatible games.

I actually have one of these too. :) Yeah, it's old school NOAC for sure, and the cart slot is pickier than it should be as well (though firm). The audio is mono, and the screen is pretty good, as is the AV out.

Not for the enthusiast per se, But hey for an affordable portable NES it's not bad.

[Don Skippy]

So, I just got back from my brother-in-law's. He just got the white RD, mine is black. Our other bro-in-law brought his SNES. We compared picture quality and game compatibility, with all of the TV input channels set to the exact same color/picture settings.

As would be expected, the SNES generally had the best picture. But, there were a few screens here and there where we actually preferred the Retro Duo, because the reds were not so harsh (specifically, the title screen of DK Country...I also preferred a few of the indoor level screens on the RD, as well, because I liked how it rendered the colors and pixels of the dirt platforms).

There were early reports of manufacturing and performance inconsistencies between the white RD and the black one. I was pleased to find (and we all agreed) that both units looked and sounded exactly the same. We had two Ninja Gaiden carts, so we were able to pause them at the same place and flip the TV inputs back and forth. We only had one Zelda cart, so it was not as much of a direct comparison for that one, but we all thought it looked and sounded the same on both units. I was also pleased to see that, for some reason, Zelda looked very natural, and a lot closer to the NES's rendering of the game on his TV set than on mine. At least I know the RD is capable of rendering my favorite NES games the way they were meant to be, if not very close. I had also tweaked my own TVs' settings and was able to get similar results at home.

****Here is my big compatibility quandary*****
I mentioned earlier in the thread that I found a Mario RPG that works on my RD. I had brought my RD to the store, popped their cart in, and it worked, so I took it home. At home, I cleaned the Mario RPG, along with all my other newly purchased used games. Since this game has the SA chip, whose silver contact portrudes from the side toward the center of the cart opening, it was a little trickier to reach the Q-tip between it and the gold contacts. I was gentle, but after I was done, the game would not start. My first solution was to simply tilt the cart forward slightly in the RD with one hand, while powering it on with the other. This worked every time, and the game kept playing normally after I let go.

My theory at the time was that I had likely pushed the SA contact back or flattened it slightly when cleaning it, causing it to miss the connection inside the RD. So, in order to avoid having to hold the cart forward every time I wanted to boot it, I pulled the SA contact back out slightly with a mini non-magnetic screwdriver. This worked temporarily, but after about four or five inserts/reinserts, the problem returned. At this point tilting the cart wasn't working anymore, and adjusting it with the screwdriver was only working about half the time. So, by now it was only booting on random attempts, and even then, I had to pull it out each time and put it back. That is, if I got it to work, then shut it off, left it in, and powered it back on a few seconds later, it would never boot back up twice in a row.

I know this is sounding complicated, but please hang with me, because it gets even moreso....But I think this will raise some important questions about the SA games (unless, of course, my experience is a fluke).

There were a couple of times, between my multiple attempts at readjusting the contact and reinserting the game, where the stored games got lost. Before I left for my brother-in-law's, I was finding that the game would boot and reboot more often if I pulled it out and waited a while each time (and I will note that in between those times, all of my non-SA SNES games booted 100% of the time). Also, to my relief, the cart was saving the newly re-created characters/games again. So, it seemed no permanent memory damage was done.

On to my brother-in-law's....The Mario RPG booted inconsistently in both his white RD, and my black one. It would start about 60% of the time, but only after completely reinserting the cart. And, even though it was starting irregularly, the memory was in tact. However, it booted every single time in the real SNES (memory in tact), whether we pulled it out and reinserted, or simply powered off and back on. At that point I had two theories: the SNES has a better physical/mechanical SA connection on board, so it touches the cart's contact more easily and securely, even if it's slightly pushed in; or...maybe the cart was perfect the whole time, and the RDs are simply inconsistent. Either way, I'm guessing that the memory loss was a fluke, maybe caused by my repeated, though gentle, moving of the SA contact. But, I don't know enough about the mechanics of this device to know for sure. Also, when I look inside my RD, I can't see anything that looks like it's supposed to connect with the SA, given it's location in the cart opening.

And if that's not enough...one of my brothers had the SNES Kirby All-Stars, that's right with the SA, and guess what....it booted every time on his SNES, but not once on either of the two RDs. Go figure....At this point, I'm not sure what to think. Maybe I slightly damaged my Mario RPG, or maybe the cart is perfect, and the RD is simply more problematic with SA games than we have seen so far.

**Any and everyone's thoughts/knowledge/experience/research is welcome. Maybe we can reason out what's really going on. Thanks again, everyone.

[Leo_A]

If your concerned about memory loss indicating a problem, don't be. That's normal SuperNes behavior for a battery backup cart when the cart doesn't boot correctly when you start it up or you bump into it during gameplay and cause the game to lose contact temporarily and crash. It's not uncommon at all to have it erase your saved games. I've had had it happen to several carts over the years that have now held their replacement saves for years, indicating it wasn't a battery problem.

I'm not sure what the SA-1 contact looks like, I'm only familiar with the normal pins and the extras on the Super FX titles. Are you saying there's something else in there for the SA-1 titles, or does it just use the side pins like the Super FX titles contain? I need to buy Super Mario RPG, Kirby Super Star, and Kirby's Dream Land 3 someday. I've enjoyed all three under emulation. Any chance of a picture? I'd be curious seeing what it looks like since I've never owned a SA-1 cart, and I can't imagine having to bend a normal pin on a SuperNes cartridge so I'm guessing this has something of a different design on it.

[Don Skippy]

I'm not sure what the SA-1 contact looks like, I'm only familiar with the normal pins and the extras on the Super FX titles. Are you saying there's something else in there for the SA-1 titles, or does it just use the side pins like the Super FX titles contain? I need to buy Super Mario RPG, Kirby Super Star, and Kirby's Dream Land 3 someday. I've enjoyed all three under emulation. Any chance of a picture? I'd be curious seeing what it looks like since I've never owned a SA-1 cart, and I can't imagine having to bend a normal pin on a SuperNes cartridge so I'm guessing this has something of a different design on it.

I attached a pic of the Mario RPG cart opening where the contact is (sorry, I don't have an URL to upload to). I thought this was the SA chip contact. Maybe I'm wrong. Is it part of an FX chip? or both?

I know what you mean about not having to bend any pins in SNES games, because the RPG and the K. All-Stars inserted solidly in the SNES and booted every time (we never touched the Kirby All-Star contact). At this point, I'm thinking the carts are fine, and that the RD has a finicky SA/FX connector (although I can't even see it looking through the slot).

**Has anyone been able to play Kirby All-Stars on their RD?**

**Is it possible that some of the Mario RPG carts that have not worked for other people were not a result of the SA revision, but because of an inconsistent RD connector?**

[remowilliams]

I thought this was the SA chip contact.
That's a ground pin contact. Doom, Starfox and other DSP/SuperFX carts have them. The actual extra pin contacts are the smaller PCB connections on either side of the large main regular one.

What is interesting to note though, is that while a SNES (and the FCTwin) has a metal grounded shield around the cart slot that will make contact with a cart ground pin, the RD does not.

How important that ground contact is, I couldn't say though.

[Buns34]

So i got my Retro Duo today. It is a pretty awesome console. The D-Pad on the controller is pretty bad, but that is why i purchased some SNES controllers. :) My NES games look better on Composite, while my SNES games look better in S-Video. The NES games look kind of washed out with slight distortion in the picture in S-Video. So i pop in Super Mario RPG, and it boots up like normal on the first try. But then i hit reset, and the screen is black. So i power off and then on again, and it is a blank black screen. So i power on again, and the game boots up, but the game saves are all gone? So after screwing around with this, it seems that every other time i power on, the game boots up like normal. I made a new save, and turned it off and on multiple times, and the save is still there, but then i hit reset, which gives you a black screen, then the next time i booted it up, the new save was gone. So it appears that reset does not work on Super Mario RPG, and that it also erases saves. But my game boots up perfectly just about every other time i power off and then on. And so far the save does not erase, unless i hit reset, then power off. Strange Stuff!

[Don Skippy]

Buns: Your experience sounds a lot like the one I talked about above. Leo Ames replied to my post, describing some quirky SNES memory issues he's had over the years related to rebooting. I just put Mario RPG in for the first time in about 13 hours and it booted the first time, memory in tact. I played for about an hour. This is a game I have vague memories of because life got me distracted from gaming around the time this game came out. But it's lots of fun to play for the first time.

(Leo Ames: thanks, by the way, for the memory tip, that sets my mind at ease.)

Remo: cool info about chips. Thanks a lot.

Now that we've established that the silver contact is a ground for DSP/FX chips, and that the RD has no ground contact, I wonder if the inconsistent booting of Mario RPG has to do with static or some leftover charge in the cart that is not getting grounded out on shutdown or reset. Maybe the lack of ground outlet is preventing the game from loading if it was recently turned off. Whereas, the SNES does have a ground contact, hence its ability to reboot this game 100% of the time, as I found out last night on my brother's SNES. Thoughts?

[Buns34]

Yeah, i want to play it, but i need to make sure that as long as i do not reset the game, my save will not get erased, when i have to sometimes power off and on a second time for the game to boot. And hopefully when i recieve Dragon Quest V, i will not even have to worry about this, since those games are long.

[ooXxXoo]

That's a ground pin contact. Doom, Starfox and other DSP/SuperFX carts have them. The actual extra pin contacts are the smaller PCB connections on either side of the large main regular one.

What is interesting to note though, is that while a SNES (and the FCTwin) has a metal grounded shield around the cart slot that will make contact with a cart ground pin, the RD does not.

How important that ground contact is, I couldn't say though.

Fellows,I have a theory......
After reviewing some of you all posts, I decided to take a closer look into the clip metal that provides ground to the game board....
That internal ground point in the cartridge board looks to split and be going to different traces...
And it seems than when it is connected to the original SNES system pin cartridge connector outter ground, every game runs smoothly because ground is present at all times...
And since,the RetroDuo cartridge connector is just plain plastic, that could be the reason of why some games crash or not boot at all....
Does anyone happen to have a SNES broken board with a good cartridge connector?
I'm willing to desolder the native RD connector and attach a metal one to see the results.

[NayusDante]

Fellows,I have a theory......
After reviewing some of you all posts, I decided to take a closer look into the clip metal that provides ground to the game board....
That internal ground point in the cartridge board looks to split and be going to different traces...
And it seems than when it is connected to the original SNES system pin cartridge connector outter ground, every game runs smoothly because ground is present at all times...
And since,the RetroDuo cartridge connector is just plain plastic, that could be the reason of why some games crash or not boot at all....
Does anyone happen to have a SNES broken board with a good cartridge connector?
I'm willing to desolder the native RD connector and attach a metal one to see the results.

I have a broken SNES. If I could open it, I'd take a look.

[remowilliams]

I'm willing to desolder the native RD connector and attach a metal one to see the results.
Since the ground pin contact area is so small, it would probably be easier to use a small piece of metal (tin shielding would be good) in the cart slot contact area. When I get a chance I'll attach a small piece to that area, wire it to the RD's ground plane and check for contact.

[ooXxXoo]

Since the ground pin contact area is so small, it would probably be easier to use a small piece of metal (tin shielding would be good) in the cart slot contact area. When I get a chance I'll attach a small piece to that area, wire it to the RD's ground plane and check for contact.

I'm glad you mention that,
I've already tried it.....it didn't work.....
But I'd like to experiment with a better quality cartridge connector...

[fog]

Hi all

Finally got my down converter for playing US consoles in the UK and unfortunately the RD still crashes on the SNES after being used for a while - It will stay working on one game until I turn it off and try another and then will refuse to work. There's no way of truly telling whether I damaged something by not using the down converter originally or if it was faulty all along but I would feel a little cheeky trying to get a replacement for it now.

With the NES side of things - this is much more stable - maybe because I didn't play any NES games on the console before I got the down converter - HOWEVER - the sound is atrocious on the NES - it's very loud and some games are completely overdriven and distorted such as KIRBY and SILIUS. Also the colours seem a bit washed out as a previous poster said.

BTW - Batman Returns PAL - Does not run on the system, it comes up with the not for use with Super Nes or Famicom title screen.

[remowilliams]

I'm glad you mention that, I've already tried it.....it didn't work.....
Why not? I'd assume as long as the contact piece is of sufficient thickness (I haven't measured it yet) it should work just as well.

For NES side audio issues I highly recommend trying an RCA cable like this http://img49.imageshack.us/img49/9346/rcacombbj5.th.jpg (http://img49.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rcacombbj5.jpg) to combine the two audio channels back into one. Some games sound really odd with the artificial stereo split.

Also for the record - the new Retrousb releases Glider and Airball work fine on the RD. :)