EGM

[Sylentwulf]

what.... have....they....done..... to my magazine?

On a side note, best quote of the magazine:
"We originally had 2 other dungeons in wind waker, but we took them out because it made the game too big, we wanted players of all ages to be able to finish it"

Worst Idea Ever (That goes for the removal of the 2 sungeons AND the revision of EGM Magazine, which is now h4Rd +0 R34d)

[Starcade]

EGM's new look is horrible, I agree, it looks like OSM's revision (which was also a POS)...granted it needed a new look, but damn that's ugly.

[Sylentwulf]

The thing that REALLY hurt were the reviews. I LOVED the way they had it setup before, big transaprent numbers for ratings, with the reviews in the same place, in one neat column, now it's friggin all over the place.

Also, the upcoming/review section looks like Lamepro, we need stupid symbols to tell us what kind of game it is? Oh and BTW, I don't own an xbox, but since you mixed all 3 systems into one big blob, I can't go through and JUST look at one system, now I have to sort through and TRY to ignore all of the xbox games. (Nothing against xbox, but I don't own the system, why would I want to read about the games?!)

Sigh.

[ManekiNeko]

The Atari Age folks are finding themselves rather annoyed with EGM as well, albeit for different reasons. In a Rygar retrospective recently published in the magazine, the editors of EGM referred to the Lynx as a "turd handheld". That ruffled more feathers than a cougar in an aviary!
I'm sorry to hear about the magazine's redesign. I was starting to respect what Ziff-Davis had done with EGM, and now they had to go and ruin it all with a new layout and attitude. It seems like, out of all the video game magazines currently on newsstands, EGM has been the most amorphic... it's never had an especially consistent layout. The one defining characteristic of the magazine, the reviews, was stolen from a Japanese publication... and now I hear even that isn't the same as it used to be.

JR

[Sylentwulf]

Actually, EGM has had a pretty consistant layout, I can't recall it changing much at all in the past 5-6 years (little changes, like the removal of letter artwork :( and other misc things that came and went) but this is a HUGE overhaul IMO

[rbudrick]

I'm really not diggin the new style. First, everything is red and white. BORING!!!!!!

That is so fucking uncreative, I can't even spend another word on it...

Second, the new review system is much harder to read, and there was NOTHING WRONG WITH THE OLD ONE! WTF were they thinking?

"Hey let's make our magazine suck vagina blood farts!"

Also, I noticed that the writers like to randomly bash great movies and actors for no reason. WTF is this, Entertainment Weekly? The Sun? What gives? As if EGM will ever be an authority on such issues. It wouldn't be so bad, but they try to be funny with such jabs, but they aren't, and generally such jabs add NOTHING to the article they randomly throw them in.

Example: One section randomly bashes the movie Star Wars II (out of nowhere). Now, I'm not even a big fan of Star Wars, but there are far better movies to bash. Aside from the horribe acting present in any Star Wars movies, the Episode II I thought was done exceptionally well.

Stick to games, EGM.

Some of their old writers were very very funny and creative. Many of the new writers seem very run-of-the-mill in style. Shit, I might as well be reading any other mag...EGM used to be my favorite.

Ahhh...I long for the days of Ed Semrad and that Shawn (what's his last name?...went to college) writer guy. They rocked.

Ed! Come back!

-Rob

[Charlie]

I haven't gotten my newest issue yet... is the multiple reviewers thing gone? If so, my subscription shall be cancelled. Three different reviewers for the same game was the best system ever... if it's gone, then I'm going to be pissed.

[NE146]

It's funny because after travelling home I had just finished going through my collection of EGM's (being a magazine freak, I pretty much have every single one of them in a couple of heavy-ass boxes LOL) and I was going through their first couple dozen issues and reminiscing about what made them great in the first place.
And although some people diss the old style (I'm talking about the Steve Harris/Ed Semrad years), to me it was a lot more fun to read back then than anything they've put out over the past couple of years. The bottom line is they had such a great enthusiasm for the games that really shined through despite the simplistic nature and crude layout of the magazine at the time.

Anyway, I arrive in Seattle today to find the new issue in my mailbox. I haven't had time to get a complete opinion, but I open it up and what's the first thing I see... the old fucking pic of Ron Jeremy as Mario flipping the bird. Give me a fucking break. Then what else? Some interview with Insane Clown Posse? WTF... Who needs that shit? The only thing that shines through with the new EGM is that the writers and editors are fucking wise-ass kids. Who the fuck knows if they love games or not. All I've managed to deduce is their love of porno and giving bullshit attitude. :roll:


The one defining characteristic of the magazine, the reviews, was stolen from a Japanese publication... and now I hear even that isn't the same as it used to be

If you're talking about the 4 man review crew, even that's not the original style. They had a "On Target" rating system first, then eventually went to the stolen 4-man review crew scheme. Like here's one of their early reviews for Blaster Master :)
http://www.users.uswest.net/~userid946/EGP-57.jpg

[rbudrick]

Touche, NE146.

I've been a huge fan since Issue #1, and I totally forgot about that.

Which issue started the 4 reviewer thing (later 3)?

-Rob

[Neb]

I agree with everyone on this. I don't like the look of the new EGM. I can't find anything that I'm looking for in it anymore. Especially when the reviews are all mixed up and not grouped by systems anymore. I also don't like the style of the new reviews either. The magazine says somewhere in it that the reviews have been made bigger. But now there are far less reviews, and they don't summarize the game enough. Three different people still review the games, but that is it. They don't have the long article before hand that puts the game into a nutshell. And the colors? There is way too much red! >:(
Go back to the way it used to be EGM!

[kainemaxwell]

They try too hard to be funny and "push the limit".

[hamburgler]

Man,I liked the old way EGM used to publish there magazine.The new design is way to confusing for me to understand the reviews at all.

[zmeston]

Ed! Come back!

Ed was an interesting fella. He specialized in taking spy photos of games on display at the Consumer Electronics Show, with giant "DO NOT PHOTOGRAPH" signs above them. Not particularly well-liked for that reason. Surprisingly old by the standards of game journalism; he had to have been in his late 40s or early 50s when I was coming up in my teens and early 20s. I wonder what the hell ever happened to him. (The last I heard of John Stockhausen, another old-timer who used to work for EGM, he was selling cable TV subscriptions.)

-- Z.

[Sylentwulf]

Do you like the EGM Re-design?

Yes, it's great.: 33%

No, it should've stayed the same.: 41%

I don't care one way or the other.: 26%

Total Votes: 370


Go. Vote. Now.

Official EGM site, vote button is in the middle of the page - http://boards.gamers.com/messages/overview.asp?name=egm

[YoshiM]

I got mine in the mail today and kinda skimmed through it before I had to come back to work to do month end stuff. EGM kinda seems like every other mag you find on the newsstand these days. There's not much separating them.

I too liked the style of the color coded grouped reviews. The bigger named games usually got the larger review and everything else got their own little column and you usually got 3 or 4 reviewers rating the game. They also had the little bio section for each reviewer describing what kind of games they were into, which was great so you knew whose reviews you could look to if you were into the same things.

I have to page through it more thoroughly later to get a better impression. So far, it ain't lookin' too hot.

NE146: THAT'S who had that style of review. I couldn't remember. Didn't that issue also have reviews for the Atari 7800 as well? I think Rambo 3 for the SMS was also reviewed, but I can't be sure now.

[NE146]

Didn't that issue also have reviews for the Atari 7800 as well?

Yes. (I actually forget if this was from the same issue.. but I have it scanned so obviously I did 'em at the same time) :)

http://www.users.qwest.net/~userid946/7800_robo.jpg

[EnemyZero]

Yeah i must say i was appalled at the new look, if anything it confused the piss outa me, im gonna have to re-read thru like 10 times to find everything in it, its just all thrown everywhere! >.< bastards

[Gamereviewgod]

Gotta agree here. The review section is awful. I don't mine the new previews section that much, but god damn those reviews suck. And ICP, uh no. I feel like I'm reading Incite all over again. Ugh...

[Charlie]

I must say, even though I haven't seen the new issue yet, I haven't been very happy with the direction of EGM over the past couple years. I think that all the writers for it are too smart-assed and seem more concerned with making themselves 'characters' instead of making a good gaming mag. And it all started with EGM and has spread to every other gaming mag except Nintendo Power (go figure, they're always behind in trends). Ever read Game Informer? Those people seem to think they're super stars or something.

Newsflash for magizine publications: nobody gives a shit about the writers. Nobody buys Game Informer because of their TOTALLY HIP CUSSING AND PICTURES AFTER PICTURES OF THE EDITORS DRESSED UP IN TOTALLY HIP SHIT! or EGM becaues the WRITERS ARE LIKE TOTALLY A BUNCH OF SMART ASSES, YO! THEY ARE SO SARCASTIC THEY MAKE BILLY CRYSTAL AND DAVID LETTERMAN BLUSH IN SHAME, YO!

Fuck both EGM and everyone who tries to copy them... Gamepro had an issue of Lamepro a while back where they made fun of Game Informer because of all the pictures Game Informer loves to put of their editors and writers... yet Gamepro is just as bad. Still, it's a sad day when Gamepro has the best publication. Yeesh, armageddon is here.

[kevincure]

Where is the staff of NextGen? Edge? GamesTM? All were great. Even Play isn't bad.

Do they realize adults play videogames?

The only reason to buy EGM now (even before the new issue) is reviews that are lightyears ahead of anyone else (although they used to give *every* game 4 reviews, which was much, much better). As long as EGM continues to have an average score of like 6 or whatever it works out to, and offer varied opinions, I'll pick it up. Some of the newer guys have bad taste, though; first, I can't remember a single girl reviewer they've had that knew their shit, Chris gives every game high grades, same with Todd. How about 3 unnamed reviews?

As someone said, I don't care who the writers are. And I really, really don't care about reviews with ICP in my videogame mag.

[Sylentwulf]

The reviews still work, and it IS geared towards 16-25 year olds as they like to point out in EVERY issue. But the trying too hard, and lame jokes don't bother me at ALL. I'm sure I would end up doing the same thing if I owned a magazine. To each their own.

The 3-4 person reviews are still there, but they're a LOT harder to read now... just makes no sense Umm... I can't find the head-scratching smileyface :help:

[zmeston]

Where is the staff of NextGen? Edge? GamesTM? All were great. Even Play isn't bad.

Edge is still doing quite well in the UK, last I heard/saw. A few of NextGen's editors shuffled over to other Imagine pubs when the magazine croaked, others went freelance, and others dropped entirely out of sight. Tom Russo, a former NextGen EIC (and a former GamePro editor before that), is now a bigwig at the G4 network, working as a game-company liaison. Presumably, then, he's not responsible for the utter crap that makes up most of G4's programming.

Although Play is run by Dave Halverson (shudder), it is a decent mag, and one of the precious few non-corporate ones left.

-- Z.

[Lady Jaye]

I have to agree that Play is pretty good and that EGM's redesign is certainly not making them new fans. But Play... leggo of the typos!!! I understand that a typo or two might make it through in a mag, but that mag clearly needs a proofreader. That really turned me off!

Now, regarding EGM: Fortunately, Seanbaby's reviews are still in there, although they're no longer right after the regular reviews. However, I do find his style tiring after a while (not enough variation in his reviews, IMO).

[BenT]

I'm going to be a quoting maniac here. No flames intended.

On a side note, best quote of the magazine:
"We originally had 2 other dungeons in wind waker, but we took them out because it made the game too big, we wanted players of all ages to be able to finish it"

Worst Idea EverThat's a glib PR answer. Real answer: the game's launch date was looming and that's all we got in.


The Atari Age folks are finding themselves rather annoyed with EGM as well, albeit for different reasons. In a Rygar retrospective recently published in the magazine, the editors of EGM referred to the Lynx as a "turd handheld".Though "turd" is a bit harsh, I can't totally disagree with that assessment.


Some interview with Insane Clown Posse? WTF... Who needs that shit?Gotta agree there. Celebrity pieces like this are a stupid idea for enthusiast game mags.

Thanks for posting that scan. It reminds me that I need to get crackin' on building my ancient EGM collection. :)


They don't have the long article before hand that puts the game into a nutshellPeople apparently hated writing them, and I can't say I enjoyed reading them. Try it yourself sometime... see if you can write 400 utterly generic and descriptive words about a given game, without adding any obvious critical analysis to your text. Then do it again. And again. It's the worst kind of drudgery and added little to the mag, IMO.

It does, however, set you up nicely for a career in gaming PR.



The new design is way to confusing for me to understand the reviews at all.There are text and score areas, each tagged with the appropriate author's name. What's not to understand? It's not rocket science. ;)



Ed was an interesting fella.Yeah, no kidding. Someone reliable told me that he rarely played the games he wrote about -- he had kids do it instead. Can you imagine an editor doing that today? Unheard of. He was apparently kind of forced out of the magazine when it changed hands back in the mid-90s.



Go. Vote. Now.Why, do you think it would change anything? This redesign was in the works for a very long time. They're not going to just toss it now after seeing the results of an Internet poll.

Although they could make smaller changes, I guess. The redesign is here to stay, though.



(although they used to give *every* game 4 reviews, which was much, much better).I enjoyed the early-90's review crew as well, but do you think each person played each game they reviewed to an acceptable degree? I certainly don't.

And for the record, Play is *very* badly written. Not worth reading at all, much less paying for. At least GamePro doesn't try to be artsy. :P

[Kid Fenris]

I'm not too fond of the new EGM's layout, but my only major gripe is the overhaul of the reviews section. There was something nicely familiar about those columns of collected opinion, all color-coded by system. All the same, I’ll probably get used to the change.

Yet I really hope that the magazine doesn't take OPM's route of giving pages to movie and music reviews. There are already lots of places on any given magazine rack to find that type of opinion.

I have little love for the days when Ed Semrad and Steve Harris were in charge of EGM. Harris' days as the boss were tolerable, but Semrad's term saw the start of the mag's slide into bland writing, confusing layouts, and ugly screenshots. It hit an all-time low during the mid-90s, when EGM looked flat-out pathetic alongside Next Generation's mature focus and GameFan's import coverage.

Oh yeah, Play. It's a good mag provided that you can get past the typos as well as Halverson's love of boobs and his tendency to gush about any game better than Batman: Dark Tomorrow. (At least he lost the mullet.) Fiechter, Hobbs, and Hoffman are capable reviewers, and I liked the mag's recent feature on the decline of difficulty in modern games.

[CrazyImpmon]

I liked the early format of EGM as well and I kinda faded away from EGM scene some years ago when they weren't as good as they used to be. After hearing all this rave and rants, I decided to look up the new issue and I can't find anything worth reading at all. Not that it matters, they aren't easy to read anymore either. Whoever decided to change the formats ought to be hunted down and killed :bad-words:
http://pages.prodigy.net/rogerlori1/emoticons/brick.gif
http://pages.prodigy.net/rogerlori1/emoticons/dead1.gif

::curls up with a stack of vintage EGM magazine::

Whatever happened to those magazines? Older Nintendo Pwer was fun, older EGM was fun, VG&CE was fun, etc. Now the only fun thing left is Tip & Tricks and Gamefaqs.com :P
http://pages.prodigy.net/rogerlori1/emoticons/cry3.gifhttp://pages.prodigy.net/rogerlori1/emoticons/cry3.gifhttp://pages.prodigy.net/rogerlori1/emoticons/cry3.gifhttp://pages.prodigy.net/rogerlori1/emoticons/cry3.gifhttp://pages.prodigy.net/rogerlori1/emoticons/cry3.gif
http://pages.prodigy.net/rogerlori1/emoticons/page1.htmhttp://pages.prodigy.net/rogerlori1/emoticons/page1.htmhttp://pages.prodigy.net/rogerlori1/emoticons/page1.htmhttp://pages.prodigy.net/rogerlori1/emoticons/page1.htmhttp://pages.prodigy.net/rogerlori1/emoticons/page1.htm




I can't find the head-scratching smileyface :help:

Try semi-colon and question mark : ? becomes :?

(if this doesn't show, someone must have retired it without fanfare :P)

[Charlie]

Not to sound like a bigot or anything, but where in the hell does EGM find women to write for them? They don't know the first thing about video games and they all show a bias against Nintendo. Pisses me off... not one of them (Jennifer or the other broad) are objective in the least bit.

[Daniel Thomas]

I will say it again: videogame magazines are indistinguishable from toy cataloges.

As for the comment about GC Zelda at the start of this thread, remember that Nintendo's current policy is to move away from the long, epic games that took weeks to finish. True, Mario and Zelda 64 were masterpieces, but how many players actually saw everything before moving on? And there's a reason those games took five years to come out.

The trade-off with shorter games is that you'll see sequels in far less time. I really don't like waiting 5-8 years for the next Mario, Zelda, and Metroid.

[Sylentwulf]

Oh Charlie STFU.

[Six Switch]

Just got the issue in the mail,and wow!I don't really like it,but that doesn't mean I will stop reading EGM. :/

[Sylentwulf]

I'll run my subscription out, but if I still don't like it at the end of this subscription, then I probly won't renew for the first time in 7-10 years. :(

[portnoyd]

I will say it again: videogame magazines are indistinguishable from toy cataloges.

Ding ding ding! We have a wahinner.

EGM started sucking shit around 1996. Still does. The letters section is full of idiots (or huge idiots that the editor then makes fun of). The reviews are decent at best, and were better in the past. The comic they have is reeeeaalllly dumb. To support the toy catalogue/vid game magazine idea, the previews section will put a overly positive spin on most any game.

And one thing that really bothered me is it took them 5-6 years of publishing to give out a single 10, and they've given out about 20 10s in the past year. Bah!

And why do I still read it? Because I've been getting it for free for the past 1 1/2 years. :D

dave

[Gamereviewgod]

Portnoyd hit it. The whole "10" thing is getting out of hand. It's becoming like Game Pro ever so quickly. Quick! What was the first game to ever get a 10 from EGM?

[NE146]

Was it Zelda ocarina of time? :?

..fuck if I know :P

[rbudrick]

Super Monaco GRand Prix was the first 10, if I remember.

-Rob

[Gamereviewgod]

Mad props to rbudrick for getting that one...

[rbudrick]

Hell's yeah.

-Rob

[NE146]

ooh yeah now I remember that. And a well deserved one it was! Man I LOOOOVVEED Genesis Super Monaco GP. Makes me want to fire it up on the old Xbox today after work and give it a whirl. Go team Minarae! :D

[Kid Fenris]

I will say it again: videogame magazines are indistinguishable from toy cataloges.

Ding ding ding! We have a wahinner.

EGM started sucking shit around 1996. Still does. The letters section is full of idiots (or huge idiots that the editor then makes fun of). The reviews are decent at best, and were better in the past. The comic they have is reeeeaalllly dumb.
dave

Whoa there. Say what you will about EGM, but if you rag on Hsu and Chan, I've got to wonder just how many semi-toxic markers you've recently eaten. I find Norm Scott's comic quite amusing, and it's often more insightful than the output of many game critics and cynical would-be game critics.

For those who like Hsu and Chan, here's the website of their creator:

http://www.ape-law.com/evilmonkey/

And while EGM does seem to award 10s more often than they probably should, it was even more ridiculous when they refused to use the number at all, so that the best scores a game could hope for were straight 9s. What's the point of a rating system if you're never going to use the highest spot?

[Gamereviewgod]

[/quote]What's the point of a rating system if you're never going to use the highest spot?[/quote]

Simple. A 10 means a perfect game according to most scales. No game is absolutely perfect. There's always some type of flaw. Out of all the games I've ever reviewed (for this site and otherwise), I've never given a game straight 10's. 10 in graphics? Yeah. Sound? Yeah. Overall? No.

[Kid Fenris]

Simple. A 10 means a perfect game according to most scales. No game is absolutely perfect. There's always some type of flaw. Out of all the games I've ever reviewed (for this site and otherwise), I've never given a game straight 10's. 10 in graphics? Yeah. Sound? Yeah. Overall? No.

That's my point. Why assign a place to "perfect" games if you never intend to put anything there? Rating a game, movie, or whatever isn’t quantum physics, where you have to allow for things that might not tangibly exist. Ratings are there to be used.

[lionforce]

Oh man, I haven't gotten the new issue yet but from reading these posts it does not sound too promising, I kinda hoped that when the editor said EGM would be going in a "new direction" I had hoped he was talking about expanding the already established reviews section by reviewing every single game that is released from here on out, but I guess it is not to be :/

[portnoyd]

Simple. A 10 means a perfect game according to most scales. No game is absolutely perfect. There's always some type of flaw. Out of all the games I've ever reviewed (for this site and otherwise), I've never given a game straight 10's. 10 in graphics? Yeah. Sound? Yeah. Overall? No.

That's my point. Why assign a place to "perfect" games if you never intend to put anything there? Rating a game, movie, or whatever isn’t quantum physics, where you have to allow for things that might not tangibly exist. Ratings are there to be used.

First off, I just hate that comic. That's just me.

Second, gamereviewgod's point is that no game is "perfect". In my eyes, a perfect game is one that everyone picks up, and everyone likes, and has no flaws. Not very possible. While some triple 10 games like Zelda 64, MGS, and GTA3: Vice City have been top sellers, critically acclaimed, and rarely does anyone have a bad word about them, some people do.

Not using 10s states that any game no matter how well recieved it is will not always find a way into your gaming heart. i.e. shows that all games are flawed in some way.

I just think they should never use 10s, or they should have used them from the start.

And I always thought Super Mario Allstars got the first 10 (just one). *shrug*

dave

[Eternal Champion]

And I always thought Super Mario Allstars got the first 10 (just one). *shrug*

It WAS Super Monaco GP on Genesis! That was, what, 1990? I remember that! (I remember thinking, "a racing game?") I had a subscription to EGM its first year. I remember seeing the first and second issues at Kohl's Dept. Store, of all places, in the electronics section, and seeing photos of the Genesis and Altered Beast, I shit my pants.
I liked the early days of EGM...the reviews were more in-depth, they weren't so obsessed with flashy pictures and ads and what not and the fake "hipness" and "irreverence"...fuckin' puke...very different before Ziff-Davis bought it.

And I knew Ed Semrad from his syndicated newspaper column Video Adventures...it prompted to buy the NES Gauntlet.

[jose.yoshitake]

I used to collect EGM from the one with StarFox in the face until the 4-split South Park (did anybody bought all 4 just by the different frontpage? :P ) special collectors issue.

I always liked the EGM style, specially the first years - Steve Harris/Ed Semrad - even the stolen 4-men Review Crew feature is very cool, but it started to decay perceptibly when Ziff-Davis took the command...

What a pity... I used to pay 10$ per single mag over here... today it doesn't worth that pay....

[Nature Boy]

Example: One section randomly bashes the movie Star Wars II (out of nowhere).

It wasn't totally random dude. They were talking about a newer Lucas Arts game and said George didn't have anything to do with it. Their comment was that maybe that's a good thing since his last plot (SW II) stunk. If you want to see some random bashing try reading the Official Xbox Magazine.

I like the idea of not showing three reviews for the same game - one review is all I want, with maybe a comment on which version they prefer and why. Maybe the GBA version should always be seperate (since it's always a different game). But I agree that they should've kept each console together. I do own all of them and I still find it annoying that it jumps around.

I also agree that the genre related graphics are stupid too. I don't even see them.

I *do* like the Shame of the Month idea. I love reading negative reviews (although I don't buy into their whole "the game companies won'tl love this" crap - nice try though)

[rbudrick]

I think Hsu and Chan are pretty damn funny...and I usually hate videogame magazine comics.

-Rob