XBOX 360 WiiMote.

[DeputyMoniker]

Iwata: Wiimote Clone Not a Threat
Nintendo honcho Satoru Iwata, in an interview meant for an investment audience, says that if a rumored Xbox 360 Wiimote clone in fact becomes a reality, by itself it's not much of a threat to the company's top position in console sales.

Innovating on that console is the key, Iwata explains. And if Nintendo can keep beating others to the punch on new ways to play new games, it will do just fine.


"What matters to us is whether or not we can continue to constantly create and offer new surprises one after another. If we can, then (other company's attempt to launch Wii Remote-like controller) should not be a big threat.
The efforts in this field to try to appeal to a wide variety of customers are something in which we saw potential early on and that we have been working on the longest, so there appears to be no reason whatsoever why we need to be concerned."

Iwata says that the video game space can be a risky place for new entrants — sure, no argument. But Microsoft is hardly some art-house developer looking for a break, and it's shown enormous tolerance for losing money here, too.

Still The $64,000 question here is more for Microsoft than Nintendo. Microsoft probably wants to use an "Xmote" to unify casual and hardcore gamers into buying a 360. Perhaps Sony thought the same thing too, and the SIXAXIS has gotten absolutely nowhere as an innovation on the PS3, where it is optional, not integral, to gaming.

Of course you can use a Wiimote for a driving game more serious than Mario Kart, but gamers have gotten by just fine without one. And there's such an orthdoxy to FPS controls now, I'm not sure it makes much difference. So, yes, a controller by itself means little. The titles that are written specifically for it, that is where the threat lies, and its something no one can estimate just yet.

This is news to me and I like it. A lot.
Imagine if Sony had announced this. "Waaaaaa!!! Sony keeps copying!"

[Press_Start]

So, yes, a controller by itself means little. The titles that are written specifically for it, that is where the threat lies, and its something no one can estimate just yet.

Let's say Sony and Microsoft do come out with Wiimote-clones for their respective consoles. The Wii will still be kicking their butts in sales from here to kingdom come because two things attributing to its success, price and new audience.

Right now the Wii is the cheapest console in the new-gen market at $250 with the Xbox at $350 and PS3 (40 GB with less features) at $400. With a recession looming over and the skyrocketing of gas prices, people are tightening their wallets. I know the recession will have little effect on the video game industry as a whole, but it does says that people will tend to buy games at a more affordable price (a.k.a. cheap).

Here's the real kicker that sets the Wii apart, it appeals to EVERYONE! The video game industry has been making the same mistake as the comic book industry did in the 90's appealing to a small circle of comic fanatics and collectors and made little attempt to get new blood in. Microsoft and Sony are creating the scenario as 95% of their games are targeted towards the small circle of males ages 16-30. This is where Nintendo does a 180 on its competition by broadening its circle by appealing to the casual gamer, or should I say, the casual person. Children, fathers, mothers, grandfathers, grandmothers, uncles, aunts, cousin, nephews, niece, neighbors, they're get profit from people who've never played a game in their life and bringing new blood to an industry that has shut itself from the rest of the world.

[Rob2600]

Here's the real kicker that sets the Wii apart, it appeals to EVERYONE! The video game industry has been making the same mistake as the comic book industry did in the 90's appealing to a small circle of comic fanatics and collectors and made little attempt to get new blood in. Microsoft and Sony are creating the scenario as 95% of their games are targeted towards the small circle of males ages 16-30. This is where Nintendo does a 180 on its competition by broadening its circle by appealing to the casual gamer, or should I say, the casual person. Children, fathers, mothers, grandfathers, grandmothers, uncles, aunts, cousin, nephews, niece, neighbors, they're get profit from people who've never played a game in their life

This is true. My girlfriend, her mother, her sister, and her aunt and uncle have never been interested in video games, but they're all into the Wii and have bought ones for themselves.

In addition, I was at a friend's house a few nights ago and we were playing games on his Xbox 360. A couple of women there who I didn't know said the Xbox 360 was kind of cool, but they were going to buy a Wii this weekend because of the motion-sensing remote and games like Wii Sports and Wii Fit.

Nintendo has finally gotten the attention of a huge gap in the market: adult women! Even Sony couldn't do that with the PlayStation or the PlayStation 2. The Wii just has that intangible iPod "cool factor" to it. Plus, it comes with a great game and, most importantly, is affordable and is 100% non-intimidating.

[JunkTheMagicDragon]

that's what kills me about the new folks who are attracted to the wii.

my coworker wants one for bowling. that's it.

there are great games like no more heroes, super paper mario, okami, et cetera, and all people are interested in is making bobbleheads throw bowling balls.

[MeTmKnice]

that's what kills me about the new folks who are attracted to the wii.

my coworker wants one for bowling. that's it.

there are great games like no more heroes, super paper mario, okami, et cetera, and all people are interested in is making bobbleheads throw bowling balls.

Why does that matter to you? If that is the reason they want something then so be it. The main reason I ever wanted a Wii becuase of SMG (I prefer the cube version of LOZ:TP cuz of the controller, and cuz I can use my PS2 controller (= ), and there are a few current releases that I bought cuz I enjoy them. WiiSports overall is a game that anyone of any age can enjoy.. Not to mention, great to play while intoxicated with friends. For the price, it's not a bad deal considering that you can get hours of enjoyment right out of the box without spending extra money.

Just because you like or enjoy something, doesn't mean that everyone else likes it for the same reason.

[ProgrammingAce]

The problem is that people who just want it for bowling aren't going to buy Activision's next game. Pubishers are starting to realize that the Wii's huge install base aren't buying games, hence more shovelware. Developers are throwing their most junior unexperianced programers at the Wii and telling them to go to town. That's bad for everybody, including nintendo.

[DeputyMoniker]

The problem is that people who just want it for bowling aren't going to buy Activision's next game. Pubishers are starting to realize that the Wii's huge install base aren't buying games, hence more shovelware. Developers are throwing their most junior unexperianced programers at the Wii and telling them to go to town. That's bad for everybody, including nintendo.

Yeah, dude. That's a pretty common opinion and I hope Nintendo is prepared for it. Regardless Nintendo's reaction to it, the 360 remote is a threat to them. Gamers like me will have no problem skipping the Wii and just going for the 360 now that I can have my motion sensing Tiger Woods and a Wii Sports knockoff. If anybody thinks Microsoft can't match the quality of Wii Sports...I disagree. It's a pretty damn simple game. Duplicating and improving upon a game like that isn't exactly rocket surgery. :-P I'm no market analyst so I don't know how this will effect them in the long run...but I will tell you that a 360 remote, and the games that are sure to follow, is a deciding factor for me. I've gone from trying to decide which one I want first to trying to decide when I should buy a 360. They're going to have to do something about that RRoD before I'll buy one. You know what I'm talking about. I'm not paying that price just to have to deal with long ass repairs but that's another opinion that we've heard twenty times this month.

[whoisKeel]

You say duplicating and improving Wii Sports isn't rocket surgery. I agree. But Xbox won't be the ones to do it. I envision something more along the lines of this:

Checking version
Version not updated, you cannot play until you update
Update?
Yes.
OK, updated.
Rebooting.
Checking for downloadable content
Downloadable content available!!!1
Would you like to view downloadeable contents?!
Sure.
Song available for 500 points.
Song available for free!
Ok, free one.
Sweet, downloading. I will play while I download song.
Cancel download?
No, not really, I'd like to download and play at the same time.
Too bads!!!1
Ok, forget the download, play game.
Loading
Ok game loaded.
You are signed in to Xbox, but not Xbox live. Is this what you want.
No, that's my friends, load my profile.
OK!!1
Loaded.
Intro starting.
Start.Start.Start. Skip this intro.
Disclaimer.
Start.Start...dammit. Wait.
Welcome to Xbox Sports!!1
Start game tennis.
Beginner, Intermediate?
Beginner. I think.
WARNING: You cannot unlock Expert mode while playing Beginner. Beginner is for little girls!!1
Do you wish to play beginner?
Umm, yeah?
Loading....
Invoke 30 second demo video that has more to do with watching tennis on TV than playing Xbox tennis.
Start.Start.Start.Start.
Welcome to the tutorial. For the next 15 minutes we will show you.

F#@K this crap, this is why I bought a Wii.

[Rob2600]

Pubishers are starting to realize that the Wii's huge install base aren't buying games

Wii owners aren't buying games? As of January 2008, the three consoles' lifetime software-to-hardware tie ratios are:

PlayStation 3 - 4.24:1
Wii - 4.64:1
Xbox 360 - 7.0:1

Huge difference? Not really.

In addition, the Wii already has 22 games that have sold over one million copies, eight of which were published by third parties. The situation isn't nearly as bad as you think.


(For the record, the Xbox 360 has 27 games that have sold over one million copies.)

[udisi]

Wii owners aren't buying games? As of January 2008, the three consoles' lifetime software-to-hardware tie ratios are:

PlayStation 3 - 4.24:1
Wii - 4.64:1
Xbox 360 - 7.0:1

Huge difference? Not really.

In addition, the Wii already has 22 games that have sold over one million copies, eight of which were published by third parties. The situation isn't nearly as bad as you think.


(For the record, the Xbox 360 has 27 games that have sold over one million copies.)


I was gonna say something like this. What did smash bros brael sell it's first month, like 2.2 million copies. Nintendo is doing what it's always done. Their first party stuff continues to sell ridiculous numbers, and the 3rd party stuff is selling as good as anything on the other 2 systems.

I own all 3 systems, and I by far have more games and play my wii more. My 360 is second in games, but I don't play it much anymore due to the fact that anything pick up and play is a FPS which I'm pretty much burning out on. I'd like to try lost oddyssy, but have to find good blocks of time to get into that. I have one game for my PS3, Rachet and Clank, which is good, but just like any other platformer. I want to try Uncharted, and maybe heavnly Sword, but no much else interests me.

Another thing, I think people miss here with software sales Wii games are price pointed at 49.99 instead of 59.99. Also, may niche titles are much cheaper than that. Zak and Wiki is 19.99 new now, but was only 39.99 when it first came out.

[ProgrammingAce]

Wii owners aren't buying games? As of January 2008, the three consoles' lifetime software-to-hardware tie ratios are:

PlayStation 3 - 4.24:1
Wii - 4.64:1
Xbox 360 - 7.0:1

Huge difference? Not really.

You know the Wii's numbers count both Wii sports and Wii Play right? And remember, buying Wii Play was the "only" way to find extra controllers for a while.

So subtract out those 2 games and wii is sitting on 2.64. We'll bump that up to an even 3 because not everyone bought wii play and whole numbers are easier to work with.

We'll take the console sales figures from www.nextgenwars.com

Take the attach rate multiplied by number of consoles sold multiplied by average price

Wii
3 x 21,243,000 x $40 = $2,549,160,000

Xbox
7 x 18,341,000 x $60 = $7,703,220,000

We're talking a difference in gross sales equal to the GDP of a small country.

An average attach rate of even a single game is huge in this industry. The fact the wii is down by 4 is very bad for nintendo. When the wii stops being a "fad" they're still going to need to push software. First party sales are great, but if 3rd party devs won't even try to port then nintendo is in trouble. The fact that Epic isn't even considering porting Unreal 3 engine is bad for business. They can't sell 2 million systems per month forever.

[Press_Start]

You know the Wii's numbers count both Wii sports and Wii Play right? And remember, buying Wii Play was the "only" way to find extra controllers for a while.

So subtract out those 2 games and wii is sitting on 2.64. We'll bump that up to an even 3 because not everyone bought wii play and whole numbers are easier to work with.

We'll take the console sales figures from www.nextgenwars.com

Take the attach rate multiplied by number of consoles sold multiplied by average price

Wii
3 x 21,243,000 x $40 = $2,549,160,000

Xbox
7 x 18,341,000 x $60 = $7,703,220,000

We're talking a difference in gross sales equal to the GDP of a small country.


Just one flaw in your logic, Programming Ace. The 360 is out of the market for a year longer than the Wii and naturally would have more sales due to longer exposure. To make it fair, let's transform the ratio by dividing the number of years it was released.

Software-to-hardware-ratio-per-year
Wii
3.0 / 1.5 years = 2

Xbox 360
7.0 / 2.5 years = 2.8 -> 3

Wii
2 x 21,243,000 x $40 = $1,699,440,000

Xbox
3 x 18,341,000 x $60 = $2,200,920,000

The new numbers show that, while Microsoft maybe ahead, the gap between the two isn't that big. Also keep in mind, Microsoft has lost at least a billion dollars in repairing and replacing Xbox 360s. Which leads to your second flaws, the software-to-hardware ratio doesn't take into account the Xbox 360s reproduced as replacements for its warrenty. Does anyone know how many replacements were produced?

[ProgrammingAce]

Unfortunately publishers don't really care which console came out first, but which has a better chance of profit.

Add in the fact that Nintendo refuses to share the code for adding Mii's and the jacked up online that only certain publishers get to use (yes, nintendo blocks certain publishers from accessing online components). Results, Wii gets more shovelware...

[Press_Start]

Though that is true, but the technology for the Wii is new to the industry and will take time for companies to adjust to. As for publishers, profit to them is pondering which uninspiring FPS/Military game featuring an unimaginative, unshaven, muscle-bound protagonist clone which require the least amount of effort to concoct and throw to the male 16-30 group.

With the massive exposure from millions of new customers the Wii has brought, I doubt companies can ignore such a great opportunity for very long. Eventually, some third-party developer or publisher will find a way to exploit the new blood, reaping millions in profit. Then, everyone will start jumping on board, bringing a new wave of quality games to fruition.

[Rob2600]

With the massive exposure from millions of new customers the Wii has brought, I doubt companies can ignore such a great opportunity for very long. Eventually, some third-party developer or publisher will find a way to exploit the new blood, reaping millions in profit. Then, everyone will start jumping on board, bringing a new wave of quality games to fruition.

Activision has already reaped millions from Guitar Hero III on the Wii. Next month, we'll see if Rock Band does the same.

There are several dozen great games on the Wii so far...so many, in fact, that I don't have the time or the money to enjoy them all. That's a good thing because it means there's a steady stream of fun, high-quality games being released for the Wii.

[Press_Start]

Activision has already reaped millions from Guitar Hero III on the Wii. Next month, we'll see if Rock Band does the same.

There are several dozen great games on the Wii so far...so many, in fact, that I don't have the time or the money to enjoy them all. That's a good thing because it means there's a steady stream of fun, high-quality games being released for the Wii.

The problem doesn't lie in whether Super Mario Galaxy, Wii Sports, and Smash Brothers Brawl are great sellers or not, the debate is can (I believe it will) third-party companies reap a huge profit by going with the Wii. If you look at the Wii's top selling 10 games, most of them are made by Nintendo themselves. As ProgrammingAce as stated, the Wii can't live on its 2 millions a month hype forever, it needs the success of third-party support to keep the momentum going.

Doubtfull Rockband will make a "big" success as its generally perceived as "Generation X" material and that makes it intimidating to most of the Wii's new customer base.

[Rob2600]

The problem doesn't lie in whether Super Mario Galaxy, Wii Sports, and Smash Brothers Brawl are great sellers or not, the debate is can (I believe it will) third-party companies reap a huge profit by going with the Wii. If you look at the Wii's top selling 10 games, most of them are made by Nintendo themselves. As ProgrammingAce as stated, the Wii can't live on its 2 millions a month hype forever, it needs the success of third-party support to keep the momentum going.

First-party games have been the highest sellers on the NES, SNES, Game Boy, and every other console Nintendo has ever released. The Wii is no different.

That doesn't mean there aren't any third-party million-sellers on the Wii. There are already several:

Mario & Sonic at the Olympic Games (published by Sega in Europe and North America)
Guitar Hero III: Legends of Rock
Resident Evil 4: Wii Edition
Carnival Games
Rayman Raving Rabbids
Sonic and the Secret Rings
Red Steel
Resident Evil: The Umbrella Chronicles

Besides, if Nintendo continues to release awesome, highly-rated games like Wii Sports, Super Mario Galaxy, Mario Kart Wii, Super Smash Bros. Brawl, Mario Strikers Charged, Metroid Prime, and Wii Fit, then why would the Wii's hype die down? People get excited for great games, regardless if they're first-party or third-party.

I think that even if there were no third-party Wii titles at all, the Wii would still be as popular as it is. Again, most customers don't care about which company published which games. They just want interesting, exciting, fun games.


Doubtfull Rockband will make a "big" success as its generally perceived as "Generation X" material and that makes it intimidating to most of the Wii's new customer base.

As I've pointed out, Guitar Hero III has been bought by more than two million Wii owners. There's no reason why Rock Band couldn't be successful, too.

[Press_Start]

I'm not denying the fact there are third-party games that sold over a million copies and made their respective companies tons of money. The fact is most of those games were based off the success from their ports on previous consoles. Take those out and we're left with very few standalone games.

Already, Nintendo has played the Zelda, Mario Galaxy, Paper Mario, Mario Kart, Smash Brothers, Metroid Prime, and Mario Party cards in the Wii's 1.5 years of life, most of its main fire power. Eventually the sales for these games will come to a gradual halt.

What are they going to do for the next 3-4 years? Probably more Wii-_____ games thanks to the predicted success of WiiFit. What else? Starfox hasn't been released on the Wii yet. Mario Galaxy 2 is a potential good idea. Another (more refined) Zelda game prehaps? And that's it.

Maybe I didn't make myself clear, what I want is for Nintendo to bring out more games like No More Heroes that are original, fun, and totally awesome in demonstrating what the Wii is capable of.

[DeputyMoniker]

...the debate is...third-party...profit...Wii.

Actually, the debate regards the possible release of a 360 remote and the effect it will have on both systems. :)