Pac-Man: when monsters became ghosts

[stonic]

Here's a piece of trivia- did you know that the ghosts in Pac-Man weren't always ghosts? Using the original arcade flyers for reference (www.arcadeflyers.com), every arcade Pac-Man game before 1982 referred to them as monsters - Pac-Man (both Monsters and Ghost Monsters), Ms. Pac-Man (which doesn't refer to them at all), Baby Pac-Man, Super Pac-Man, and even the Mr. and Mrs. Pac-Man pinball game. In fact, it actually says "Monsters" on the monitor glass. It appears Namco eventually started referring to the monsters as ghosts, starting with Jr. Pac-Man. I don't know about the Chomp Chomp and Professor Pac-Man videos, but after that, Pac-Mania and Pac-Man 25th Anniversary call them ghosts, as did the board game. As a side note, the TV show referred to them as Ghost Monsters (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oLpr-8LxIJQ&feature=player_embedded)

So why did Namco start calling them ghosts? It started with the Atari VCS/2600 version. Thanks to the limitations of the VCS (and someone in Atari's marketing dept), the manual for the game labeled them ghosts (due to their flickery appearance). As a result of the game's popularity (as well as the 5200 version), people started referring to them as ghosts from then on (although for some reason, the 400/800 manual refers to them as "goblins").

[MachineGex]

My wife is a huge Pacman nut,(We own a Super Pacman cocktail table & multi-pacman cocktail table) I am surprised I never knew this. I will have to dig up some old books/records and thumb threw them.
...I just checked my arcades and both refer to them as Monsters(on the arcade glass instructions)

[Videogamerdaryll]

Ha,I never knew that...Thanks for the Awesome Info!!

Though for some reason I've always called them Monsters..I don't know where I got the term from...MY wife calls them Ghosts

"Ok,Ok...now ..Get the Monsters..........,no you mean get the Ghosts"..

But your right..Sweeet!!
I just checked the glass and it says Monsters..Awesome!!!
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v21/Chris1/Misc%20Pictures/MsPacManCoctail08002.jpg

[Pantechnicon]

It started with the Atari VCS/2600 version. Thanks to the limitations of the VCS (and someone in Atari's marketing dept), the manual for the game labeled them ghosts (due to their flickery appearance). As a result of the game's popularity (as well as the 5200 version), people started referring to them as ghosts from then on (although for some reason, the 400/800 manual refers to them as "goblins").

I think they were thought of as ghosts long before Atari got involved. Do you have a reference that can be cited for this? It sounds plausible, but I can think of a lot of circumstantial reasons as to why the "ghost" conception wasn't necessarily borne out of adopting Atari's nomenclature for the game elements.

For starters, well, they look like ghosts. At the very least their shape conforms to the Western archetypal idea of a ghost. Surely people would have collectively picked up on this conception long before the Atari port.

Secondly, although the cart sold somewhat well, the Atari 2600 port of Pac-Man was not critically well received ("popularity" indeed...), so I have a hard time imagining any sort of collective reinterpretation of monsters into "ghosts" could have had any sort of momentum given the quality of the source material. For that matter, we're talking about a port of the world's most popular game at its peak. How many people in 1982 really needed to bother reading the manual to understand what it was about?

Interestingly, the Pac-Man cartoon refers to the antagonists as "The Ghost Monsters". Development of the cartoon and the 2600 port were probably happening more or less at the same time, but it had to have been Namco, not Atari, doing the creative consultation work with Hanna-Barbera during this period.

It's possible that Namco may have originally called them "monsters" but, regardless of what it says in English, there's no accounting for the possibility of spotty translation work either. Some old Japanese-language promotional flyers for the game would be helpful here to determine the difference between kaiju and kami.

All I'm saying is that I think these ghosts had legs, so to speak, long before Atari got involved.

[diskoboy]

I've always called them "Ghosts".

In all actuality, that's what they look like....

The cartoon came up with the "ghost monster" concept.... I still called 'em ghosts.

[stonic]

I think they were thought of as ghosts long before Atari got involved. Do you have a reference that can be cited for this?

No, do you? If you can find a reference to ghosts outside of Atari that predate the VCS game, please let us know. I've already cited the references I used.


For starters, well, they look like ghosts. At the very least their shape conforms to the Western archetypal idea of a ghost. Surely people would have collectively picked up on this conception long before the Atari port.

Yes, as far as American culture goes they do, but Pac-Man is a Japanese game. Besides, how many old episodes of say, Scooby Doo, had "ghosts" running around, only for the protagonists to pull the sheet off and expose them for the mortal beings they really were? IMO, that's exactly what the 3rd act/intermission in the shows- they're not "ghosts" but "monsters" in disguise. Another way to look at it is, if you can get that far into the game, then you don't have much fear of them :)



Secondly, although the cart sold somewhat well, the Atari 2600 port of Pac-Man was not critically well received ("popularity" indeed...), so I have a hard time imagining any sort of collective reinterpretation of monsters into "ghosts" could have had any sort of momentum given the quality of the source material. For that matter, we're talking about a port of the world's most popular game at its peak. How many people in 1982 really needed to bother reading the manual to understand what it was about?

No, it wasn't a critical success - we all know it was a lousy port. But nearly 8 million carts were sold between 1982-83 (according to Atari's own documentation, which appeared in 'Once Upon Atari'), so from Atari's POV, it was hugely popular, to the point that it's quite possibly the best-selling VCS cart of all time, so surely SOME of those manuals were read ;)



Interestingly, the Pac-Man cartoon refers to the antagonists as "The Ghost Monsters".Development of the cartoon and the 2600 port were probably happening more or less at the same time, but it had to have been Namco, not Atari, doing the creative consultation work with Hanna-Barbera during this period.


This would have been around the time when Namco started calling them ghosts, so that does make some sense. But that's such a minor detail that it could have been changed at almost any point during the show's development - right up until the end (the voice work was likely done after the animation was completed). A similar reference was made by Atari in the July/Aug 1982 issue of Atari Age magazine ("Pac-Man and his ghostly gobblin' friends").

The VCS game was made in 1981 (hence the onscreen copyright date) and released in March 1982. The cartoon show ran from Sept 1982 to Sept 1982, according to Wikipedia.


It's possible that Namco may have originally called them "monsters" but, regardless of what it says in English, there's no accounting for the possibility of spotty translation work either. Some old Japanese-language promotional flyers for the game would be helpful here to determine the difference between kaiju and kami.

I'll see if I can find a photo of the monitor glass from a Puck-Man machine, otherwise the only other persons to ask at this point would be either the creator, Toru Iwatani, or programmer Hideyuki Mokajima. Until then, the facts remain that they were called monsters first, and ghosts later - only after Atari started calling them as such. Even in an early 1982 catalog (before the VCS game was released), Atari called them ghosts. Otherwise aside from a few 'goblin' references, they never called them monsters. Much like how the Space Invaders graphics didn't resemble the arcade version, I'm saying Atari took a little creative licensing with Pac-Man as well, in regards to the monsters (actually, with a few things - vitamins, wafers..). And given the context of the original game, the term "monsters" is more appropriate IMO. Of course, the TV show forever changed that, showing them as floating, sometimes disembodied creatures. But in the original game, they were locked within the maze just like the player, and when they were 'eaten', they had to go back to a safe area to regenerate (much like how some lizards can regenerate damaged or missing parts of their bodies. Perhaps a reference to Godzilla?).

[heybtbm]

My guess: They're monsters that turn into ghosts after Pacman eats the power pellet. Not too hard to figure out.

[jb143]

I always called them "Ghost Mosters". I did watch the cartoon some but just barely remember it. Didn't a lot of things change on Pac-Man early on? Puck-Man and even the ghosts/monsters names?

[Sanriostar]

I've been calling them 'Ghost-Monsters' for as long as I can remember, and is there some recent (I.E. within 2 years) media from Namco themselves that call them Ghosts?

I'd still buy the cartoon if it came out on DVD....:embarrassed:

[jb143]

I remember reading that Pac-Man was very loosly based on an old Japanese legend. Does anyone know anything about that legend and what the ghosts or monsters might be a reference to? That might shed a little light on this as well.

[stonic]

[QUOTE=stonic;1373102]I found an interview done with Toru Iwatani in 1986:
http://programmersatwork.wordpress.com/toru-iwatani-1986-pacman-designer/

In the interview, he refers to them several times as both monsters and ghosts... so that's not much help (and in later interviews he refers to them as simply ghosts) LOL But he initially describes them as "ghost-shaped monsters".

However, the instructions on the monitor glass for the original Puck-Man game also refer to them as monsters:

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=70069.msg742811#msg742811

..and I think this card was for either the table or cabaret version:
http://forums.klov.com/forums-attachments//773833-PuckMan_InstructionCard1.jpg

[Sweater Fish Deluxe]

What are you guys on about? Everyone knows that ghosts are a subset of monsters anyway. Don't make me draw a venn diagram.

EDIT: Hm, I forgot about Casper and other "friendly ghosts." That complicates matters a bit. here's the venn diagram:

http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i135/sweaterfish/monsters.png


...word is bondage...

[FrakAttack]

Interesting. Most people I knew called them either ghosts or ghost monsters before the VCS version came out. There were lots of arguments over what the fruits were called though, particularly the great grapes/pineapple/hand grenade debate. Turns out it's supposed to be a melon. :?

[Videogamerdaryll]

After reading the thread

To wife:
Me>
Babe,what do you call the things that are chasing you around in Ms Pac Man/....>points to the machine.

Wife,"Ghosts'

Me:>
"go read what the machine says"..

Wife>
"Monsters"..............?......."monsters?..but they are Ghosts":

Me>Ahh but is says Monsters on there ..right...:-D

shows her the thread. : )

[Kamisama]

I've always called them Ghosts, most likely because I never heard anything else ;)

Good to know that they might be Monsters or Goblins aswell.