vent: Adventure Games

[James8BitStar]

Hi. Don't mind me, I'm just venting cuz I'm pissed off and I find that usually, after ranting awhile, my head clears and I can solve these damn things.

I love adventure games, but hell if I know why. Well, actually I do, its because I love adventuring and exploring. To me that's what video games are all about.

But Adventure Games are a "no win" genre. You always get to a puzzle which you don't know how to solve, and there's two options:

1. Keep beating at it and checking and double-checking until you've got it figured out.

2. Look at a FAQ or Strategy Guide or ask a friend or whatever.

But the second option sucks, because it makes you feel stupid.

It makes you feel stupid because usually the solution is either:

A) Something you could never have thought of in a million years (actually, this tends to make me pissed off at the designers more than anything).

B) Something you realize you really should've thought of because all the clues made it SO OBVIOUS, but somehow you just didn't see it.

C) Something you DID think of, and might have tried, but which didn't work because you weren't doing it exactly the right way, or there was a step you missed, or something. Or worse, when you tried it so much that you finally decided you must have the wrong idea, only for the FAQ to say no, you were right the first time. UGH!

So I refuse to look up FAQs. But usually all that happens is I get pissed off at the game itself. I dunno which is the worse evil, though at least solving it on your own gives you a sense of satisfaction.

On the whole though, I can understand why this genre isn't very popular. Especially post-Myst, when puzzles became 50% more obtuse and whole games were basically about figuring out complicated mathematical formulae, or learning how to play the Piano, or finding the solution to a Chinese Checkers puzzle (whoever thought putting one of those in a game was a good idea should be dragged out into the street and shot).

And especially I'VE READ THE FREAKING BOOK, WHY CAN'T I FIND THE RIGHT PIANO KEYS? AND WHY THE HELL DID I STICK THIS TUNING FORK IN THIS BOX? ALL IT DOES IS MAKE A DRAWN-OUT "TING" SOUND! WHAT THE HELL IS THIS FOR? WHAT THE HELL AM I SUPPOSED TO BE ***DOING?!!***

Anyone who can guess which game I was ranting in all-caps about, gets a cookie. Don't eat it though. You're going to have to feed it to a bird or something later.

... Okay, I think I'm calmed down now. I'm gonna sleep on it and try the damn game again. Okay, byebye.

P.S. For this post I'm defining "Adventure Game" as games like King's Quest, Zork, Myst, etc. Those kinds. I mention this because I will f***ing kill anybody who comes in and thinks I'm talking about Zelda and tries to start a Genre Dictionary arguement with me.

[Jorpho]

A) Something you could never have thought of in a million years (actually, this tends to make me pissed off at the designers more than anything).

(C would seem to be quite similar to this, actually.)

And why shouldn't you get pissed off at the designers? If you get hopelessly stuck, then they made some bad design decisions. Corollary: it is extremely difficult to design a flawless adventure game. (Even Grim Fandango had the entirely unnecessary distinction between "use" and "give".)

[Wraith Storm]

P.S. For this post I'm defining "Adventure Game" as games like King's Quest, Zork, Myst, etc. Those kinds. I mention this because I will f***ing kill anybody who comes in and thinks I'm talking about Zelda and tries to start a Genre Dictionary arguement with me.

I always thought Zelda as an Action RPG... Certainly not a point and click adventure game, but I degress...

I love the old Kings Quest games. I am currently playing parts 1-3 on my Atari ST. I never got to play the first 3 when I was younger because of the parser, but I am rather enjoying them now. I do feel your pain however.

There was one part on Kings Quest 5 that I could never get past. The solution ended up being something ridiculous like throwing a boot at a cat that was chasing a mouse wayyyy earlier in the game. Then if you got captured and tied up the mouse would chew the ropes and save you. But if you didn't throw the boot hours earlier then you were screwed!!!

They can make you VERY angry, but I never minded it too much. It just goes hand in hand with the genere. Clever game design can avoid these pitfalls, but I always take the plunge expecting them.

[OMF2097]

I always thought Zelda as an Action RPG... Certainly not a point and click adventure game, but I degress...

I love the old Kings Quest games. I am currently playing parts 1-3 on my Atari ST. I never got to play the first 3 when I was younger because of the parser, but I am rather enjoying them now. I do feel your pain however.

There was one part on Kings Quest 5 that I could never get past. The solution ended up being something ridiculous like throwing a boot at a cat that was chasing a mouse wayyyy earlier in the game. Then if you got captured and tied up the mouse would chew the ropes and save you. But if you didn't throw the boot hours earlier then you were screwed!!!

They can make you VERY angry, but I never minded it too much. It just goes hand in hand with the genere. Clever game design can avoid these pitfalls, but I always take the plunge expecting them.


It also didn't help in Kings Quest 6 when the game would glitch out if you used a certain item in a particular area.

[James8BitStar]

Okay, I am now officially pissed.

Okay, no cookie for anyone... the game I was having trouble with was Zork Nemesis (aka Zork done Myst-style). I was at this music hall place and I didn't know what the eff I was supposed to do. I found a few clues talking about playing notes, and I assumed it meant this piano that's in one of the rooms, and I played the keys any number of combinations, then finally swallowed my pride and went to GameFAQs.

It turned out though, I had already solved the piano's puzzle just by sheer coincidence while messing around, so I was wasting my time. Turned out the music notes was something I'll end up doing later on, and the real reason I was stuck was because I had overlooked an item.

Ugh. I am just this far from just throwing the game in the junk pile... but I won't just yet.


And why shouldn't you get pissed off at the designers? If you get hopelessly stuck, then they made some bad design decisions.

First, I don't necessarily believe that. What may be obtuse to me is probably the most obvious thing in the world to someone else (like the above... my first reaction was to mess with the Piano until something happened, and I didn't even bother to sweep the rooms head to toe before deciding on that. That's not the game designer's fault).

Besides that, people whose default mode of thought is "I can't get past this part, its the designer's fault" are, usually, childish and petty, and they'll never aspire to improve. I'd prefer to get better at my games instead of just taking the easy way out. Granted, there are times where a design decision really is flawed, and in those cases I'll acknowledge it (the cat thing in King's Quest V really is stupid). But if I think about it and can see a way where the fault was mine, that's going to be my default position.

[AB Positive]

Funny, I love these games, and I'm usually pretty good with them. Although Myst IV did cause me to have to hit up gamefaqs... that was a tough tough game. Still need to play Myst V... heh.

[c0ldb33r]

P.S. For this post I'm defining "Adventure Game" as games like King's Quest, Zork, Myst, etc. Those kinds. I mention this because I will f***ing kill anybody who comes in and thinks I'm talking about Zelda and tries to start a Genre Dictionary arguement with me.
One thing I've also wondered. I heard the term first person adventure before to described Metroid Prime. What the hell is that?

[James8BitStar]

One thing I've also wondered. I heard the term first person adventure before to described Metroid Prime. What the hell is that?

Something Nintendo's executives made up because they didn't want Metroid Prime associated with the First Person Shooter genre.

[Flack]

As one of the residential FOGs*, I wonder if you know how lucky you are to have something like GameFAQs?

Back when I was a kid** playing these adventures, there was no GameFAQs. When I got stuck in King's Quest 3, that was it. I was usually one of the first kids in my school to get games (one of the few with a computer, actually) so asking around there for help was no use. Theoretically you could post something on a bulletin board and hope someone could help you out but the odds of finding a walk-thru was pretty slim. Your best bet back then was to go to the supermarket once a month and scan the covers, looking for information on the game you were playing. If you couldn't find anything, well, you could always wait until next month I suppose.

* = Fucking Old Guy
** = Every FOG is required to use the phrase "back when I was a kid" somewhere in their posts.

[c0ldb33r]

Back when I was a kid** playing these adventures, there was no GameFAQs. When I got stuck in King's Quest 3, that was it.
It's not your fault - to heir is human :)

[roushimsx]

Adventure games were the reason for the rise in both software piracy and hint book sales in the 80s and early 90s. When someone got a new adventure game, everyone got a new adventure game and during down time at school (between classes, during lunch, etc) and at home on the BBSes, everyone shared their progress. Every now or then someone would break down and pick up a hint book (I did it for Conquest of Camelot because I was fucking sick of getting to the end of the game and dying because I couldn't figure out how to save all of the knights), but normally it was all about pooling our efforts as a group to figuring those fucking annoying games out.

There's about a snowball's chance in hell that I'll ever try to go back and play a bulk of those old adventure games without a walkthrough anymore. Oh, and Codename Iceman? Fuck you for making me pilot a submarine.

[Jorpho]

I love the old Kings Quest games. I am currently playing parts 1-3 on my Atari ST.

You know, at this point there are very nice freeware third-party remakes of the first three King's Quest games available for the PC.

(I wonder if The Silver Lining will get released one of these days?)

[Garry Silljo]

There was one part on Kings Quest 5 that I could never get past. The solution ended up being something ridiculous like throwing a boot at a cat that was chasing a mouse wayyyy earlier in the game. Then if you got captured and tied up the mouse would chew the ropes and save you. But if you didn't throw the boot hours earlier then you were screwed!!!

This pissed me off to no end. I had that same problem. I got to that screen, the cat came out and got the mouse and the game kept going. I had no clue I was supposed to do anything. I played for a few more days until I got stuck at the very part. I asked a friend who had won the game what to do and when he told me I was fuming. I had to start all over. Good thing he warned me to save before that screen, because even when I knew what to do it took me 12 tries to hit the cat and save the mouse (I was playing on the NES that may be why it was hard).

Later I fed a pie to a bird only to find out later I needed that pie to kill a Yeti, so I was screwed again. I eventually just quit the game. I had to give a shell to deaf old guy so he could hear me. I think the NES version was programmed wierd or something because no matter how many different ways I tried I couldn't get the game to let me hand him the shell.

I like adventure games for the most part, but things like this make me incredibly angry.

[Graham Mitchell]

One of my favorite moments of infuriation from adventrue games was in the first Secret of Monkey Island. There's a part where somebody throws you in the water tied to a big statue. Since you're tied, you can't wander too far from it and you can't leave the screen. Just outside of the range you can walk is an assortment of sharp objects that you think you could cut the rope with (they all have names like "Really Sharp Scissors" or "Incredibly Sharp Razor" when you run the cursor over them.) I spent hours but no matter what you do you can't get near those damn scissors.

At some point I was going nuts and I was just trying some random shit. I told the game to pick up the statue I was tied to, and low and behold, Guybrush picks it up, puts it in your inventory, and you're free to go. That was all I had to do the whole time!!!! I was cracking up when I discovered that. That's a level of comedy genius that you can only get in a video game. Ron Gilbert deserves a crack on the head for that one.

[roushimsx]

I told the game to pick up the statue I was tied to, and low and behold, Guybrush picks it up, puts it in your inventory, and you're free to go.

That's one of the things I loved about Lucasarts adventures over Sierra adventures. Sierra games were punishing and loved to set you along dead end paths where you'd waste hours and hours not knowing that you were absolutely fucked with no way out. Lucasarts games never put you in that situation; no matter where you were, you always knew that there was a way out of it. It didn't make the games any easier, but it sure as hell made the more difficult puzzles more tolerable and the games as a whole more enjoyable.

[Garry Silljo]

Lucas Arts made obscure puzzles for the sake of humor, when Sierra did it, they were just dicks.

[Jorpho]

One of my favorite moments of infuriation from adventrue games was in the first Secret of Monkey Island. There's a part where somebody throws you in the water tied to a big statue. Since you're tied, you can't wander too far from it and you can't leave the screen. Just outside of the range you can walk is an assortment of sharp objects that you think you could cut the rope with (they all have names like "Really Sharp Scissors" or "Incredibly Sharp Razor" when you run the cursor over them.) I spent hours but no matter what you do you can't get near those damn scissors.

Heh. That's the part where you can actually drown if you linger for a really, really long time.

[blissfulnoise]

As one of the residential FOGs*, I wonder if you know how lucky you are to have something like GameFAQs?

Back when I was a kid** playing these adventures, there was no GameFAQs. When I got stuck in King's Quest 3, that was it. I was usually one of the first kids in my school to get games (one of the few with a computer, actually) so asking around there for help was no use. Theoretically you could post something on a bulletin board and hope someone could help you out but the odds of finding a walk-thru was pretty slim. Your best bet back then was to go to the supermarket once a month and scan the covers, looking for information on the game you were playing. If you couldn't find anything, well, you could always wait until next month I suppose.

* = Fucking Old Guy
** = Every FOG is required to use the phrase "back when I was a kid" somewhere in their posts.

I was stuck for several years in Police Quest I because I didn't know the term "breathalyzer test" at age 10. Eventually breaking through that wall later felt so damn good.

While some puzzles were very esoteric and strange, I managed to finish King's Quest 1-5, Space Quest 1-IV, Quest for Glory I-III, Police Quest 1 and 2, Code Name Iceman, Leisure Suit Larry I - III & V, Conquests of the Longbow, Conquests of Camelot, Laura Bow II, Monkey Island 1 and 2, Maniac Mansion, Loom, and lots of other adventure games without so much as a hint (except among friends).

You want to talk about impossible puzzles, don't look at adventure games from the past, but every game (especially RPGs) from the "strategy guide" era. Finding hidden rooms and boss monsters, making the ultimate weapons, all of that stuff truly is impossible without outside assistance. It's like they lock away 10% of the game unless you invest the money to find the way to see it all.