Top 5 Hardest RPGs?

[backguard]

I say....

1. Wizardry (NES)
2. Ultima Exodus (NES)
3. Monster Hunter Freedom (PSP)
4. Diablo II (PC)
5. Etrian Odyssey (DS)

[aclbandit]

I totally agree on Wizardy for NES, I have the cart. Ugh! Not just that the game is tough, but the un-intuitive system is tough to get the hang of at first.2

However, don't forget Dragon Quest/Warrior 2, with its random battles which may or may not be reasonably finished in the zone you're currently roaming.

[James8BitStar]

What's "un-intuitive" about Wizardry? It's a pretty bare-bones, straightforward dungeon crawler.

Personally I think Wizardry's challenge level is overrated. Most of the cries that its "hard" are just people thinking in entirely the wrong mindset. I'd put Bard's Tale (PC) in its place personally.

Ultima: Exodus however IS a pretty tough little beast, on the NES anyway.

[vintagegamecrazy]

I'd add 7th Saga for Snes, I liked it and finished it but man were some of those opposing hunters impossible to defeat at times.

[roushimsx]

Remove Wizardry (NES) and cycle in Wizardry IV (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wizardry_IV:_The_Return_of_Werdna). That game is bullshit.

Exile: Wicked Phenomenon gets an honorable mention not so much for being difficult as it does for being fucking bullshit. I guess "hardcore players" would find the allure of endlessly grinding away their levels on short side scrolling segments to get to the point where bosses don't kill them in one or two hits appealing, but I found the game to be a tedious fucking mess of Vic Ireland's bullshit. Apparently the japanese version is a lot more playable, not that I'd ever want to try since it's such a drastic step down in quality from Exile any-damn-way.

But yea. Fuck Wizardry IV. Have fun reading the wikipedia article.

[EX-Soldier]

legend of legaia 2...well not so much on the gameplay side & to be honest i can't really speak on the level grind, shit i never even made it a single boss so naturally it follows that im not really qualified to gauge its difficulty, no, in fact i dont think i ever even made it past the first 15 minutes....


So WTF is so hard about this game you may be asking??


.....not biting through your own tongue and going out in glorious mind-seering agony after trudging through the aforementioned 15 minutes...


FUCK.

THIS.

GAME.

[j_factor]

Ultima: Runes of Virtue II, SNES version. The game autosaves like crazy. It's extremely easy to get into a situation where you're SOL because you're low on health and saved in a bad spot.

[carlcarlson]

I would take out Diablo 2. You can pretty much go straight through that game without having to grind or anything. I suppose if you want to go through all three difficulties it definitely gets tough, but just Normal isn't bad at all.

[ssjlance]

Chrono Trigger. By far.

[greedostick]

Final Fantasy for nes. Unless you spend hours leveling and buying potions you're gonna lose.

[skaar]

How is Diablo II remotely difficult?

[roushimsx]

How is Diablo II remotely difficult?

No keyboard to use shortcuts, left mouse button sticks, someone taped over the optical sensor on the bottom of the mouse, people keep sending me AIM messages while I'm trying to play, and the dog won't quit barking.

[DefaultGen]

.....

[PresidentLeever]

No keyboard to use shortcuts, left mouse button sticks, someone taped over the optical sensor on the bottom of the mouse, people keep sending me AIM messages while I'm trying to play, and the dog won't quit barking.

Add to that you're having a friend over who insists on helping you with potion usage to make it less boring to watch you play, but every time things start to heat up he gets so nervous that he forgets all about the potions and just screams "Oh shit we're gonna die! Oh shiit!!" over and over..

That was how I got through Diablo 1 actually.. Took me two weeks or so!

Anyway I don't think there are that many RPGs where you can't just grind to reduce the challenge if needed. I can only think of Baldur's Gate 1-2 at the moment.

[Raedon]

I say....

1. Wizardry (NES)
2. Ultima Exodus (NES)
3. Monster Hunter Freedom (PSP)
4. Diablo II (PC)
5. Etrian Odyssey (DS)

EO isn't really hard it's just a grind though some of the puzzles did have me throwing up my hands to the point where I hit gamefaq.

I didn't find Diablo II very difficult but I can't comment sense I'm in the game's credits (http://www.mobygames.com/developer/sheet/view/developerId,21825/).

[roushimsx]

Anyway I don't think there are that many RPGs where you can't just grind to reduce the challenge if needed. I can only think of Baldur's Gate 1-2 at the moment.

It's all about installing the Throne of Bhaal expansion and busting that level cap for BG2. Hit all of those sidequests in Chapters 2 and 3. Still, it's pretty possible to completely fuck yourself over for the actual ToB quest if your party isn't varied enough.

Or maybe my swashbuckler sucks. I knew I should have gone Monk like everyone else!

[EX-Soldier]

Add to that you're having a friend over who insists on helping you with potion usage to make it less boring to watch you play, but every time things start to heat up he gets so nervous that he forgets all about the potions and just screams "Oh shit we're gonna die! Oh shiit!!" over and over...

lmaooo ahh that made my day

[Amnion-Chorion]

Chrono Trigger. By far.

Seriously? I never found Chrono to be all that tough, other than some of the optional bosses. It was actually one of the few RPG's I was able to complete as a kid, now that I think about it.

Anyway, I'm going to throw in another vote for the US version of 7th Saga, since it's so absurdly difficult that even with grinding, nearly every encounter can lead to an untimely death.

[Hokkus]

EO isn't really hard it's just a grind though some of the puzzles did have me throwing up my hands to the point where I hit gamefaq.

I beat Etrian Odyssey easily without grinding. I think EO II is much harder.

[Volcanon]

Chrono Trigger is EASY. The only hard part is if you go fight Lavos before the end of the game, which if it's on your first run-through usually means that you are committing suicide.


What about Dragon Warrior 2? Without a FAQ the puzzles are fairly hard, the game is a grindfest, there are long long dungeons, and even if your characters max levels the end of the game is still fairly challenging (end-game enemies spam instant-death spells and one monster, Gold Batboom, casts a spell which gives guarunteed instant death to your entire party (ultimate cheap)). At least you don't get game over if you die.

[Jorpho]

But yea. Fuck Wizardry IV. Have fun reading the wikipedia article.

Seriously, did anyone actually finish this game back in the day? It makes The Tower of Druaga (http://www.ntsc-uk.com/feature.php?featuretype=edi&fea=Druaga) sound like a kid's game.

[James8BitStar]

I've read of a few people who supposedly beat it. Never done it myself though.

[Wraith Storm]

Chrono Trigger. By far.

Sqare has always put insanely difficult optional bosses in thier games (Ruby Weapon, Ozma) but as far as the core games go... they really are pretty easy.

Square's RPGs have become the equivalent of "Radio Friendly". They appeal to the general masses and are scared that if their too hard, gamers will turn away and sales will plummet. So they give us games that have amazing production values, but take very little dedication to beat.

When I beat Final Fantasy 6, 7, 8, 9, and 10 I felt okay. I was like "Well that was cool. I finally beat it." and then put it on the self and never touched most of them again.

When I beat Phantasy Star IV it was a Revelation. I was stuck at the end for like a week or two and could NOT beat Dark Force. When I finally managed, I was jumping up and down and and screaming, "HOLY SH!T I finally beat Dark Force!!! I can't believe it!!! There is now way I just did that!"

PS IV certainly did not have the production values of FF6 or Chrono Trigger, but it was a huge challenge and when I beat it I really felt I accomplished something.

[Cryomancer]

No Megami Tensei in this thread? It's great getting an instant game over if your main character dies, even while the rest of your party is in perfect condition. Oh and he's open to instant death spells.

[Zebbe]

SaGa Frontier II here. The gameplay system was very complicated for me, with very few chances to grind. And that last tactical battle against the fake Gustave took forever for me to beat. Thanks to the internet, I managed to beat the game, with at least most of the hard work done by myself, including that tactical battle.

[Trebuken]

Playing Sacred all the way through Nobium...patience makes it hard...

[Volcanon]

Sqare has always put insanely difficult optional bosses in thier games (Ruby Weapon, Ozma) but as far as the core games go... they really are pretty easy.

Square's RPGs have become the equivalent of "Radio Friendly". They appeal to the general masses and are scared that if their too hard, gamers will turn away and sales will plummet. So they give us games that have amazing production values, but take very little dedication to beat.

When I beat Final Fantasy 6, 7, 8, 9, and 10 I felt okay. I was like "Well that was cool. I finally beat it." and then put it on the self and never touched most of them again.

When I beat Phantasy Star IV it was a Revelation. I was stuck at the end for like a week or two and could NOT beat Dark Force. When I finally managed, I was jumping up and down and and screaming, "HOLY SH!T I finally beat Dark Force!!! I can't believe it!!! There is now way I just did that!"

PS IV certainly did not have the production values of FF6 or Chrono Trigger, but it was a huge challenge and when I beat it I really felt I accomplished something.

Hear hear.

PS IV actually had quite a high production value (it's like the most beautiful genesis game out there, and defaintely the best RPG).

Even greater accomplishment? Beating PS II. Even with the playstation 2 remake that game is a demon.

[kainemaxwell]

7th Saga and Dragon Warrior 2 and 3.

[j_factor]

Phantasy Star II's difficulty is misunderstood. The game came with a detailed hint book. You're supposed to play it with the book. It says on the cover, "Your adventure would be very difficult without this guide." So, naturally, Phantasy Star II is very difficult without the guide.

[Wraith Storm]

Hear hear.

PS IV actually had quite a high production value (it's like the most beautiful genesis game out there, and defaintely the best RPG).

Yeah, your absolutely right. Phantasy Star IV really did have great production values and looked great (Especially with all the anime slides). It was such a stylish and effective way to tell a story.

I wasn't trying to knock on PS IV. I was just saying that by “comparison” PS IV doesn't have the big budget look of Chrono Trigger and doesn't throw around all the special effects and eye candy that FF6 did.

[Volcanon]

Ha, I'd say PS4 had nearly, if not equal special effects and graphics, especially the monster graphics, which were all animated (FF6 wasn't) and all large (most FF6 monsters were fairly small, chrono trigger too). The only minus really was that the explosions sounded like bad flatulence, but that was the fault of the genesis's sound chip more than anything.

Edit: not to mention that it came out four months before FF6 and more than a year before Chrono Trigger (in Japan, at least).