JRPG's in the current generation - What happened?

[G-Boobie]

Here's a disconcerting fact: the only Square Enix developed game released on the now three-year-old current generation of systems is Last Remnant, which is both secretly a SaGa game and an abomination unto the Lord.

Final Fantasy XIII, whenever the Hell it gets released, will likely be the next Square developed title released for this generation of consoles. Last Remnant released last month: they went two full years without releasing a game for current systems at all.

Odd, isn't it, that SE can't seem to get it together for anything but the DS and PSP these days unless it's a remake or re-release. The Tri-Ace games for 360 are acceptable, if a little obtuse and generic, as was Blue Dragon. Lost Odyssey was probably the best of the lot even if I personally couldn't get into it.

Other than that, there's Eternal Sonata and Tales of Vesperia. That's it.

... So, my question is this: is the traditional console JRPG genre dying, or more likely, going back to being a hardcore niche genre such as fighting games or visual novels? The last genuinely great example of the genre I've played is Persona 4(which I admit was recent, but released after a long drought). The one before that was Persona 3, a year and a half ago. Looking at release lists for the upcoming months reveals that there is nothing at all on the horizon.

The PSP and DS are great and everything, but sitting on the couch with the girlfriend and rocking some turn based action HD style is what I'm after. And it would appear that I'm out of luck in that department.

[Xander]

Give it time. Go play some PS2 JRPGs mainwhile, they are legions.

[swlovinist]

I think that there are alot of factors on why there are less games

1. Games made for next gen systems are expensive and require more of a "hit" to recoup their investment. Niche titles and Turn based RPGS are not the mainstream still(I agree with you though the good ones rock). This means less companies doing them due to the price tag. While many companies could afford doing a PS2 RPG, the price tag for a next gen title is got to be pretty expensive.

2. As Consoles age, we will probably see more RPGs, they usually show up more when the console is aged and is a year or two from twighlight.

3. This poor economy means game companies are doing worse, and making fewer games(and more sure bestsellers). Release date for the upcoming year are kind of mixed, I expect a year of sure hits but one that we will definately see a more shallow inventory of games on shelves due to tightening credit.

I think that we are lucky the 360 is getting a nice little flow of JRPGs at all. For all the rants I have about the system(my buddy just got a RROD on his third console), I think the consoles library is getting a nice little stream of JRPGs, something that was an eyesore with the first one. I want to believe that the future will look pretty bright for these type of games on the 360, as the system going into last couple of years of viable retail space before its replacement is announced. I wouldnt expect a ton, but the system will get them this year.



As for you rocking out with your girlfriend with some turn based action...I was wondering what plannet or dimension that is LOL. I cannot complain, my wife will play mario kart and wii sports with me :)

[Iron Draggon]

I suspect it's because to do a Square/Enix quality RPG in HD requires far more than it does to do one using lesser graphics technology... the requirements of the previous generations of hardware have already been perfected, so it's easy to whip out a stunning game for those consoles, but to blow you away in HD will take far more effort, and thus it will take far more time... be patient

the previous poster is prolly right too... most RPG's don't appear on consoles until very late in their lifespans, near the end of their demise... then there's a massive flood of them... I suspect this is because they finally see the light of day after spending years in development, getting to know the new hardware

[SegaAges]

Wow, you seriously read my mind.

I was going into the modern gaming forum to ask what a good one in, but you created a thread already. I will ask in here since it is totally on topic.

I want to get a jrpg for 360. You mentioned 2. Are those the only good ones. I want to play a game that takes forever (RPG), but at the same time has an awesome story line (JRPG).

I pound through games way to quick, and want a nice long game with a great story line to put me in my place when I try to beat it fast.

[Icarus Moonsight]

Atlus has been kicking SquareEnix's ass lately. I think the only SE releases I've bought the last few years were Dragon Quest Swords and two ports for the DS, Front Mission and Chrono Trigger. I have gone Atlus crazy since playing the Etrian Odyssey games, but First Departure for the PSP has been flirting with me lately in the game aisles. She's such a tart. LOL

Although, I'm not crazy for JRPG's. Or RPG's in general. Something is definately up.

[heybtbm]

Here's a disconcerting fact: the only Square Enix developed game released on the now three-year-old current generation of systems is Last Remnant, which is both secretly a SaGa game and an abomination unto the Lord.

There's also Infinite Undiscovery. A minor oversight, but it was a Square-Enix release.

Don't forget that there are two FFXIII titles coming (actually, three if you count the 360 version) White Knight Chronicles and Star Ocean 4.

As for the JRPG drought...I think it's pretty simple. Games cost more and take longer to develop this generation. Also, the Japanese aren't exactly flocking to the PS3 and 360. Look at the PS3/360 RPG titles for Nippon Ichi and Atlus. As of my count there's just one so far (Disgaea 3). When the JRPG boom finally hits, it'll be on the Wii in 2009.

[swlovinist]

Atlus has been kicking SquareEnix's ass lately. I think the only SE releases I've bought the last few years were Dragon Quest Swords and two ports for the DS, Front Mission and Chrono Trigger. I have gone Atlus crazy since playing the Etrian Odyssey games, but First Departure for the PSP has been flirting with me lately in the game aisles. She's such a tart. LOL

Although, I'm not crazy for JRPG's. Or RPG's in general. Something is definately up.

It does appear that Atlus has stepped up to the plate, while Square/Enix continue to shovel out the same. I like final Fantasy and all, but does that mean we need two dozen side story/prequel/remakes?

I for one am not holding my breath, but it really does not matter to me. In my opinion, I have more than enough PS2 RPGs, my small 360 Rpg lineup, along with my Fire Emblems from Nintendo to keep me busy for years.

[TurboGenesis]

There's also Infinite Undiscovery. A minor oversight, but it was a Square-Enix release.

Don't forget that there are two FFXIII titles coming (actually, three if you count the 360 version) White Knight Chronicles and Star Ocean 4.

As for the JRPG drought...I think it's pretty simple. Games cost more and take longer to develop this generation. Also, the Japanese aren't exactly flocking to the PS3 and 360. Look at the PS3/360 RPG titles for Nippon Ichi and Atlus. As of my count there's just one so far (Disgaea 3). When the JRPG boom finally hits, it'll be on the Wii in 2009.

Infinite Undiscovery is actually a Tri-Ace game (published by Enix-Square) as well as the upcoming Star Ocean IV.



But really, what RPG franchises does Square-Enix really have? Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest… Which have new titles on the horizon (FFXIII and DQX). Is Square considering doing another Mana game? How about another Vagrant Story game?
:confused:

[Daria]

I've been very pleased with the RPG offerings this generation. The 360 already has more RPGs available than the Xbox did, and a fair few Japanese developed ones at that. I've never been a Square fan so I'm not missing their releases. I thought Lost Odyssey was excellent, and enjoyed playing Eternal Sonata despite it's major flaws. I have Tales of Vesperia and Infinite Undiscovery on my backlog. And am thinking of trying out Spectral Souls 3 on the cheap.

Meanwhile the DS is satisfying my crave for more traditional oldschool gaming with the likes of Etrian Odyssey and Dragon Quest. And given that the PS2 is continuing to push out RPGs at a decent pace, I'm overwhelmed with games to play.

I don't see the genre going anywhere any time soon. As has already been said, I think developers are slowing down due to the high costs of producing a next-gen mammoth and for Square in particular that may be a good thing. In their hey-day I think popularity went to their heads and they started churning out some less than stellar games because RPG fans would buy up anything Square. Now hopefully their forced to take their time and concentrate on the story and characters as much as the visuals and battle system.

[Daria]

Dragon Quest…

Dragon Quest is usually contracted out to other developers. Level-5 and ArtePiazza respectively. Just saying since you made the distinction between Tri-ace and Square.

[Daltone]

... So, my question is this: is the traditional console JRPG genre dying, or more likely, going back to being a hardcore niche genre such as fighting games or visual novels? The last genuinely great example of the genre I've played is Persona 4(which I admit was recent, but released after a long drought). The one before that was Persona 3, a year and a half ago. Looking at release lists for the upcoming months reveals that there is nothing at all on the horizon.


From a personal perspective all I can say is... good! In terms of the RPG biscuit barrel I've come to see JRPGs as the stale custard creams that you find in the bottom of the tin when you clean it out. When all you were eating was digestives they seemed glorious and exquisite. Then you discovered jammie dodgers and shunned the custard creams to the depths of the container. When you try one now it's soft and uninspiring and hasn't aged well at all. You occasionally get a still fresh custard cream, but ultimately, you probably wouldn't go out and buy another packet.

Basically, I'm all in favour of RPGs like Baluder's Gate, KOTOR, Vampire: Bloodlines, The Witcher where you have to actually do some role playing instead of simply level grinding.

Rant ends.

[smork]

I think all the JRPGs went to the DS. It's damn near impossible to overstate the ubiquitousness of the DS in Japan.

Japanese people play far more handheld games these days than console games. People I know all own either a DS or a PSP (most likely the DS), with the occasional Wii thrown in there.

[Tempest]

Last Remnant, which is both secretly a SaGa game and an abomination unto the Lord.
Is it really that bad? I was thinking about picking it up, but I still need to get through Lost Odyssey and Infinite Undiscovery first. Maybe I'll wait until it goes to the bargin bin...

Tempest

[Icarus Moonsight]

It does appear that Atlus has stepped up to the plate, while Square/Enix continue to shovel out the same.

I'm so glad Atlus USA took a chance with SMT: Nocturne. 5 other games followed it, most recently Persona 4 with a US version of Imagine just around the corner. 6 new games in a series in 4-5 years?... SE can't even touch that anymore.

[eugenek]

Does anyone else think it's crazy that if you want traditional JRPGS nowadays, you should buy the XBOX, of all systems? Who would have thunk it?

[Tempest]

Does anyone else think it's crazy that if you want traditional JRPGS nowadays, you should buy the XBOX, of all systems? Who would have thunk it?
No kidding. I originally got a PS3 over the 360 just so I could play JRPGs, obviously I chose incorrectly. Now that I have all three systems it really doesn't matter I suppose... :)

Tempest

[skaar]

Go play Fallout 3. I heart it so.

I've also enjoyed Namco's offerings these days - I liked Eternal Sonata enough to play it through (so pretty :) and I love Chopin) and have been sitting on Tales of Vesperia.

[neist]

Is it really that bad? I was thinking about picking it up, but I still need to get through Lost Odyssey and Infinite Undiscovery first. Maybe I'll wait until it goes to the bargin bin...

Tempest

A friend of mine has to review the game and he tells me horror stories about back to back boss battles that can take up to 1-2 hours each.

Thats pretty horrible to me. Plus theres all the technical problems that people are reporting, though I haven't played the game to report on those.


Infinite Undiscovery is actually a Tri-Ace game (published by Enix-Square) as well as the upcoming Star Ocean IV.

But really, what RPG franchises does Square-Enix really have? Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest… Which have new titles on the horizon (FFXIII and DQX). Is Square considering doing another Mana game? How about another Vagrant Story game?
:confused:

I doubt they are doing much else. Koichi Ishii, the man who spearheaded the Mana series, left to form his own company. Akitoshi Kawazu is fairly deep into the Crystal Chronicles series, so that means no more SaGa, not that they would, as it wasn't exactly well recieved in its last incarnations. Front Mission could be possible, but Toshiro Tsuchida is busy doing work on Final Fantasy XIII.

Of course, they could all be working on their MMO code-named 'Rapture'. Who knows.

[Icarus Moonsight]

No kidding. I originally got a PS3 over the 360 just so I could play JRPGs, obviously I chose incorrectly. Now that I have all three systems it really doesn't matter I suppose... :)

Tempest

I still think the Wii will eventually rule the JRPG field down the road. DQX, Tales... the transition has already begun, in my eyes. PS3 did seem like a lock for JRPGs... Then again, many people bought a N64 in anticipation of Final Fantasy 7 so there you have it.

[G-Boobie]

As for you rocking out with your girlfriend with some turn based action...I was wondering what plannet or dimension that is LOL. I cannot complain, my wife will play mario kart and wii sports with me :)

She's very understanding of my 'game habit'. :)




I want to get a jrpg for 360. You mentioned 2. Are those the only good ones. I want to play a game that takes forever (RPG), but at the same time has an awesome story line (JRPG).

I pound through games way to quick, and want a nice long game with a great story line to put me in my place when I try to beat it fast.

I thought Vesperia was 'meh;, but I'm the only one I know who didn't really care for Lost Odyssey. I'd give that one a shot, with Vesperia as your backup, since it's story sucked hard hard hard.


There's also Infinite Undiscovery. A minor oversight, but it was a Square-Enix release.

Don't forget that there are two FFXIII titles coming (actually, three if you count the 360 version) White Knight Chronicles and Star Ocean 4.

As for the JRPG drought...I think it's pretty simple. Games cost more and take longer to develop this generation.

True.

Infinite Undiscovery is actually a Tri-Ace game (published by Enix-Square) as well as the upcoming Star Ocean IV.


Also true.


Is it really that bad? I was thinking about picking it up, but I still need to get through Lost Odyssey and Infinite Undiscovery first. Maybe I'll wait until it goes to the bargin bin...

Tempest

It is an embarrassment. We can probably thank FF XIII and Kawazu for that.


Go play Fallout 3. I heart it so.


Played it, loved it, but it's not really JRPG like.


I still think the Wii will eventually rule the JRPG field down the road. DQX, Tales... the transition has already begun, in my eyes. PS3 did seem like a lock for JRPGs... Then again, many people bought a N64 in anticipation of Final Fantasy 7 so there you have it.

You and Heybtbm are probably right about the Wii thing, Master Moonsight.

[dairugger]

i dont know about anyone else but im not looking forward to the next final fantasy. emo type characters with way too many zippers/belts just doesnt do it for me.. i wish theyd go back to actual midevil dungeons & dragons type characters (ff4/5) even something along 6 would rock..

I'd love to see the long fabeled Lunar 3 in the style of eternal sonata graphics, battles could be different tho.. or a super high def hand drawn artwork style, but old school.

im currently playing through phantasy star 4, its my first time even though i got the game back in 98 with the guide,and the game is awesome! i played phantasy star online back on the dreamcast and its nothing like this, i also hated the fact that there were no story to be found in pso. sega should make part 5!

[Sudo]

Wow, you seriously read my mind.

I was going into the modern gaming forum to ask what a good one in, but you created a thread already. I will ask in here since it is totally on topic.

I want to get a jrpg for 360. You mentioned 2. Are those the only good ones. I want to play a game that takes forever (RPG), but at the same time has an awesome story line (JRPG).

I pound through games way to quick, and want a nice long game with a great story line to put me in my place when I try to beat it fast.

Lost Odyssey is the best RPG this console gen IMO, and it's my second favorite game period on the current consoles behind MGS 4. Infinite Undiscovery, Tales of Vesperia, Eternal Sonata and Blue Dragon are all good as well, with IU being the best of the bunch after LO. I have The Last Remnant as well, but have yet to play it since I've been trying to get through the rest of my backlog first.


i dont know about anyone else but im not looking forward to the next final fantasy. emo type characters with way too many zippers/belts just doesnt do it for me.. i wish theyd go back to actual midevil dungeons & dragons type characters (ff4/5) even something along 6 would rock..

Neither Final Fantasy XIII or Versus XIII feature emo characters with many belts and zippers. Look at some of the trailers and screeenshots and you'll see this.

[Tempest]

Emo characters in the next FF? How about the last 3 or 4? It's almost a staple of the series at this point.

Tempest

[SegaAges]

G-Boobie, you mentioned the story line was meh.

I want to find a game that has an awesome story line tied in with the rpg.

Without spoiling it, how is the Lost Odessey storyline?

Same with blue dragon and those others. There are about 5 or 6 good ones mentioned, which one has the best story line or at least an awesome one?

This is one of the times where I am seriously going to buy the game after work instead of saying I am thinking about it (I asked for MegaMan games for X-mas, which means no buying mm games until afterwards).

[unwinddesign]

@SegaAges: I found the storyline to be decent, but not great. The ending annoyed me, and the main bad guy is really, really queer. I liked about half of the characters, and the other half of them were questionable. I'd say the storyline relies a bit too much on cliches, but there is some original stuff there, like the whole immortal theme. That livens it up a bit and makes it worth playing.

The best part of the story are the "Thousand Years of Dreams Segments" -- little short stories filling you in on Kaim's (main character) thousand year past. They are written exceptionally well, and are diverse and wholly original. There's about 30 of them, and they take about 10 - 15 minutes each to read (they're all text -- sounds like a minus, but the presentation is top notch). Easily worth playing the game for.

If you've played Final Fantasy, expect Lost Odyssey to be extremely derivative of the series. Not necessarily a bad thing, just know what you're getting in to. I put 65 hours into it and enjoyed it. For $40 or less, it's worth the cash for a RPG fan.

[SegaAges]

This game sounds cool and all, but of the jrpg's, what is the game that has the best story along with the awesome gameplay?

it definetelty looks like there are some questions about the LO story, and not good ones.

I will consider this one, but is there one with a better story that i should look into as well?

[Sudo]

This game sounds cool and all, but of the jrpg's, what is the game that has the best story along with the awesome gameplay?

it definetelty looks like there are some questions about the LO story, and not good ones.

I will consider this one, but is there one with a better story that i should look into as well?

LO definitely has the best story out of the 360's RPG library.

[Tempest]

I don't know, I thought Tales of Vesperia had a nice story. Well maybe not a great story, but the voice acting was top notch anyway. I like humor in my RPGs.

What about Enchanted Arms? I think it counts as a JRPG (tactical, but RPG nonetheless). It gets a bad rap for some reason, but I thought it was pretty good.

Tempest

[G-Boobie]

G-Boobie, you mentioned the story line was meh.

Without spoiling it, how is the Lost Odessey storyline?

Same with blue dragon and those others. There are about 5 or 6 good ones mentioned, which one has the best story line or at least an awesome one?


Lost Odyssey was Final Fantasy IV with an immortal main character and a worse save point spread. However, If you can get past the obvious parallels to FF IV, it's not a bad story at all. As Unwinddesign already said, there are excellent short stories that you read to sort out some of Kaim's(NOT Kain! NOT Kain!! Seriously!!! And Ced isn't Cid, even if he has an airship!! While we're at it, please disregard the pair of magical twins who are NOT Palim and Porum in any way! Please continue!) past. It's a great mechanic, and one I hope someone shamelessly rips off for future games.

Blue Dragon I have no opinion about. Everyone I know was disappointed with it, so I didn't touch it. Also, Akira Toriyama can stop recycling Dragonball character designs anytime he wants to.

I played the demo for Vesperia, but it didn't really grab me. The characters seemed to be the same stale rehashed stereotypes you find in every JRPG.

Ah, something becomes clear to me: part of the problem I have with most 'next gen' JRPG's has to do with how goddamn tired the story tropes and character archetypes are. Everyone has a plucky young hero, a magical princess or priestess who falls for the hero, a stern but kind mentor character, an evil, misunderstood villain who may or may not be leading an evil empire... That isn't to say that the JRPG genre is alone in that particular sin, but it's more and more apparent with everyone released.

I really enjoy the SMT games precisely because they avoid most of those cliches, or if they embrace one or two, they give them a depth that most others don't. It's also why I enjoyed XII so much: it had a pretty adult story(compared to, say, any of the Tales games).

Anyway, end of digression. SegaAges, if you need a next gen JRPG, I'd go with Lost Odyssey.

[BHvrd]

I'm really stoked for White Knight Chronicles, looks bad ass, but yeah there has been a lack as far as next gen AAA Rpg goes.

Look into White Knight Chronicles ASAP.

[jdc]

I too bought the PS3 at launch with the expectation of having at least SOME selection in rpgs on it by now. (where the hell IS the next instalment of Legend Of Dragoon...huh, Sony? lol) They all seem to be popping up on the PSP and DS. Maybe we'll see some in 2009.

[eugenek]

I'm really stoked for White Knight Chronicles, looks bad ass, but yeah there has been a lack as far as next gen AAA Rpg goes.

Look into White Knight Chronicles ASAP.

I was super-excited for White Knight Chronicles, but Famitsu gave it a 29/40. This is the same Famitsu that gave Last Remnant, of all games, a 38/40, so it's gotta be pretty damn bad. I'm still looking forward to it, but much more cautiously.

[G-Boobie]

I was super-excited for White Knight Chronicles, but Famitsu gave it a 29/40. This is the same Famitsu that gave Last Remnant, of all games, a 38/40, so it's gotta be pretty damn bad. I'm still looking forward to it, but much more cautiously.

Famitsu is infamous for granting good scores to, hey guess what, advertisers, friends, and business partners. You want to know why Last Remnant got the score it did? Nepotistic industry fellatio. 'Journalistic integrity' means different things in different countries, I guess. If Akira Toriyama or Nomura had been involved, that fucker would have gotten a perfect score.

Level Five probably just opted out of the two page spread advertising option and were punished accordingly.

[Daria]

Yeah everyone always quote Famitsu as scripture, but their scores generally seem way off to me. Level-5 has yet to put out a bad game so my hopes are held high for White Knight.

[eugenek]

Famitsu is infamous for granting good scores to, hey guess what, advertisers, friends, and business partners. You want to know why Last Remnant got the score it did? Nepotistic industry fellatio. 'Journalistic integrity' means different things in different countries, I guess. If Akira Toriyama or Nomura had been involved, that fucker would have gotten a perfect score.

Level Five probably just opted out of the two page spread advertising option and were punished accordingly.

I'm not arguing that the cultural norms are different over there and that reviews have to be filtered in that light. But a 29? This isn't some indie developer, it's Level 5, and Famitsu gave their last big RPG (DQVIII) a sparkling 39.

Besides, for as many times as they get something spectacularly wrong, they do reward good games. They gave Elder Scrolls IV a 38 and I doubt that they are "friends" or "business partners" with Bethesda Softworks. Call of Duty 4 and Halo 3 got great ratings too.

I mean, whatever. I hope White Knight is good. But I can't say I'm encouraged right now.

[Daria]

I'm not arguing that the cultural norms are different over there and that reviews have to be filtered in that light. But a 29? This isn't some indie developer, it's Level 5, and Famitsu gave their last big RPG (DQVIII) a sparkling 39.

You don't think it's odd that also happens to be another Square-Enix title? It's still a great game, but it's also got a lot of advertising behind it.

[eugenek]

You don't think it's odd that also happens to be another Square-Enix title? It's still a great game, but it's also got a lot of advertising behind it.

Well you have a point. Perhaps it wouldn't surprise me if they're...slightly gracious towards Square titles. Especially in light of Last Remnant. Or maybe they just enjoy patently unfun games...

But honestly, I just can't see them punishing a game that's otherwise good by giving it low scores. There's good reason to doubt high Famitsu scores, but are they ever wrong about the low ones? That's a real question, I actually don't know. Personally, I have agreed with their lower rated games, but of course I haven't played them all.

[Sudo]

Famitsu is one of the least credible sources when it comes to game reviews.

[nectarsis]

IMHO jrpgs are going for more flash, and style over substance (can be said about most genres these days). The older jrpgs didn't have Shakesperean plots all the time, but they were damn fun. No learning obtuse battle systems that actually can detract from the game as a whole.

[G-Boobie]

IMHO jrpgs are going for more flash, and style over substance (can be said about most genres these days). The older jrpgs didn't have Shakesperean plots all the time, but they were damn fun. No learning obtuse battle systems that actually can detract from the game as a whole.

I dunno, man, to me JRPG's are all about mastering a system; especially games like SMT and Grandia. That's all a JRPG is, in the end: a neat system to figure out and exploit.

Yeah, there's story and the world the game is set in, but they all tend to blend together after awhile.

[Icarus Moonsight]

Marvel Comics presents: What If? Emo kids had super powers!?

Androgynous, spiky haired, angst filled, dark and brooding anti-heroes out to save the world and bitch and whine about random stuff along the way, for the eleven-billionth time. Both saving and whining. LOL

This is why I can sit at home and play Etrian for hours on end and the next day pass by The World Ends With You in the aisles, uniterested... They gummed it up IMO. Made shit either too stupid (silly is good, stupid? not so much) or too complex (or both! yikes) for the eventual payoff. I say, if that's how it's gonna be, more Wizardry-clones and Rougelikes for me please. If it's really about game system abuse and maximizing benefits while keeping penalties to a minumum those types of games will do just fine. But, may I ask, make me earn it? I've had my fun with Vanish/X-Zone, Knights of the Round/Mime and the like... I want a mountain to climb and explore. Not an elevator ride to the top with a chatty operator that has a cat-girl fetish.

[chicnstu]

Blue Dragon I have no opinion about. Everyone I know was disappointed with it, so I didn't touch it.

I loved Blue Dragon but didn't enjoy Lost Odyssey very much. Here is my opinion (if anyone cares):

Lost Odyssey:

Bad:

I got tired of the Ring system (I never got tired of the Judgment Ring in Shadow Hearts: FtNW), the overall "twitchyness" of the game (Unreal Engine seems like a pile of crap to me, every game I've played that uses it has that "twitchyness" problem), the sometimes almost 1 minute load times for one battle, and the inconsistency of the scenes.

Good:

Story - My favorite story in any game, I thought that scene with the kids and their mom was very well done, very emotional. Some of the scenes are awesome with their animations and lip-syncing being human made, but with most of the scenes the development team just made the characters loop an animation and the lip-syncing wasn't even worked on. I wish all of the scenes had been made well before being shipped.

Characters - I thought Jansen was hilarious, he was the funniest character I've ever seen, I even thought he was funnier than most movie or TV characters, but GameInformer talked like they despised him.

Blue Dragon:

Bad:

Story - A very generic story. That's the only thing I didn't like, but it's not like I hated it, it was just "there". Hearing Shu say "I....won't....give...up" so many times was annoying. It sounded like the developer's felt like he needed his on phrase like Naruto's "Believe it".

Good:

Gameplay - The battles in the game were so much fun for me. In the overall game there was so much to do, so many numbers to manage (an RPG fan knows that's a good thing), it was so much fun switching the Shadow's classes to give them the abilities you wanted them to have. There was also more variety to the environments (there was even a cute little Christmas mask-party town, my favorite place in the game).

Way less technical problems than Lost Odyssey, everything felt so much smoother in Blue Dragon.

I loved the character/enemy designs, the overall game felt like a great combination of Dragon Quest and Final Fantasy.


JRPG's in the current generation - What happened?

I've always blamed it on the 360 for two reasons:

1. It's a system made in the United States, and it doesn't sell well in Japan (Japanese RPGs come from....Japan, and have almost always been on Japanese systems)

2. It came out a whole year before Wii and PS3. So most of the companies continued putting their RPGs on PS2 or made them for DS. So because they did that, it makes sense that it would take a while for more Japanese RPGs to start being made, which probably means most will move to Wii, especially since Dragon Quest X is coming to the system.

[kupomogli]

Not just Famitsu, but I honestly don't know any legitimate news sources that don't get paid off some way or another for good reviews.

I think after the Gamespot fiasco everyone knows that review scores are usually payoffs. It's pretty stupid though if you ask me. Because of all this, everyone gets all these specific scores yet none of these games deserve the scores in comparison to other titles that actually do.

Let's not forget about most review places going by the 10 point score rating which ultimately fails as 99% of all games are atleast a 6/10. So there aren't any games that actually suck? They're all average? That's a load of BS. So you can't really give an honest opinion of a review as you don't know whether 7/10 for review A is full of shit or the 7/10 for review B is correct and it may actually be a playable game.

[Aussie2B]

You can't apply the law of averages to games, or really anything that's being critiqued on its merits. Under a perfectly balanced scale, there should be just as many games deserving a 5 or lower as games that deserve a 6 or higher, but it would be a pretty sad state of affairs if there was just as many poor games out there as good games. It's only logical to assume that results would be skewed toward the positive end because games largely sell based on their quality and most game developers want to create a quality product, so there is both a financial and personal need to not release a sub-par game.

So really, it's inappropriate to use the word "average" to describe the quality of a game because there is no true average. What people really mean is "mediocre".

[BHvrd]

I was super-excited for White Knight Chronicles, but Famitsu gave it a 29/40.

Well crud.

I wonder if the online portion is salvageable.

[G-Boobie]

Well crud.

I wonder if the online portion is salvageable.

Never trust Famitsu when a Square Enix game is involved. As has been stated earlier in the thread, they gave Last Remnant a 39, and that game was crap. Speaking broadly and reductively(as is my normal method), Famitsu sucks. Actually, damn near every professional reviewer sucks. I tend to trust DP posters and friends as far as reviews go...

[Melf]

Well crud.

I wonder if the online portion is salvageable.

It's been said that the online portion is actually the bad part, and that single-player is where it's at, and that came straight from Famitsu itself (http://kotaku.com/5113983/shocker-famitsu-does-not-love-white-knight-chronicles). Take that as you will.

I'm really enjoying Infinite Undiscovery, and I liked Enchanted Arms a lot. I've got Lost Odyssey on tap, and White Knight Chronicles is on its way. Plus, there are all the great DS releases, DQ 9 & 10 coming... who said it was a bad time for JPRGs?

[chicnstu]

Let's not forget about most review places going by the 10 point score rating which ultimately fails as 99% of all games are at least a 6/10. So there aren't any games that actually suck? They're all average? That's a load of BS.

It makes sense to me for most games to average 6/10 (average). That's the way most things in life are...average. It's rare to find something above average, and it's rare to find something below average.

Also, it takes a lot of money to make most games and it takes a while to make a complete game. So if a company is going to spend a large amount of money and time, most will try to make their game at least a little fun. I also believe that most people that work for the company care if their game is fun, they want to make the next big hit (most with the intention to make more money).