best Amiga setup/version

[Soviet Conscript]

whats everyones opinion on the best Amiga computer in overall terms? i've only had experence with the 500A but latey i've been thinking of a better setup. i know the 1200 seems to have some compatability issues. i also know that there were some versions only released in europe and also alot of EU only games. so whats the best setup for overall compatability, expandability and performance?

[Joe West]

if my memory serves me rite, Amiga 2000 is the best

[tom]

or a 1200 with HDD and extra RAM, second FDD also, Philips 8833 or Commodore equivalent (only ever had very little compatability problems, unlike the 500+)

[robotriot]

Well, if you're going for playing games from HD via WHDLoad, a 1200 w/ accelerator card (030 at least) and a couple of MB of extra RAM is probably the best solution. No need to juggle all those disks anymore.

Otherwise I'd stay with the A500, since most of the games were made for it.

[icbrkr]

Agreed with the above, an A1200 with an '030 and some extra RAM will play anything you want via WHDLOAD.

If the A600's FastRAM expansion comes out soon for as cheap as it's planned (20 GBP, 8MB), that might be my setup of choice if it works well ;)

[zektor]

Well, I have never had anything but an A500 (with 1MB expansion) so I obviously prefer this classic as it is where all of my Amiga memories are. I have played thousands of games and demos with this setup, so I have no issue with it. Good to get an extra floppy drive and not have to swap disks so much tho....on games that support it that is.

[Ze_ro]

It depends on what you want to do I suppose. For the sake of this thread, I'm assuming we just want to play games.

If you want to actually collect disks, then go for a regular Amiga 500 (not a 500+) with at least 1MB of RAM. This is probably the cheapest of the Amiga systems, and the most compatible, though lacks AGA compatibility. It's also super easy to use, as you just stick the disk in and turn the computer on. Might as well be a console. The Amiga 500 came with 512k of RAM by default, though RAM expansion is cheap, and relatively easy to install (though you may have to replace the Agnus chip with a more recent version).

If you prefer to play stuff from hard drive, then your best bet is an Amiga 1200. Stick a 4GB hard drive in there, get at least some sort of accelerator card (even a cheap '030 with 8MB RAM is good enough), and install WHDLoad. This takes a lot more know-how to put together, as you'll actually need to know how to use Workbench and some basic AmigaDOS... but once you have it all together, it's pretty slick, and you'll never need to bother with disks. You can also use this setup to do some real computer work with the Amiga too, if you feel so inclined. WHDLoad handles pretty much all the compatibility issues too.

If you can get your hands on one, the 3000 and 4000 are nice machines... but they're much harder to find, expensive to expand, and they take up a lot more room. I've never owned a 600, but as far as I can tell, it's basically little more than a 500 with a hard drive, PCMCIA slot, and no numeric keypad.

Personally, I use an Amiga 3000 for most of my Amigaing, though I recently got an SX32 Pro for my CD32, which now easily outperforms the 3000.

--Zero

[icbrkr]

The 600 is the same thing as a 500 with up to 2MB chip and WB 2.1. The plus is that you can grab Amigakit's EasyADF kit and move files over via compact flash card and make real disks out of them. You can do that too with the A1200, but if playing off of disks, the A1200 is semi-incompatible with Amiga 500/1000/2000 games.

[zektor]

I spoke earlier of my Amiga 500, but I no longer have it. Years have passed and it was traded away back in the early/mid 90's....probably for a 486 or something. I missed it so much and have been trying for the past few months to get a good deal on another.

Seems the Amiga (and most other vintage computers) are having some sort of modern day resurgence. It was not easy for me to score an A500 for a decent price until today actually. Found one with a 1MB expansion, A520 video adapter, Amiga 3 1/2 external, mouse, some disks (including workbench luckily), and about a dozen original game disks....for $41.

This thread reminded me of how much I enjoy the games, and how much the A500 really means to me.

Not to get TOO off topic, but I reiterate, the A500 is just fine for playing most games. I have owned Amiga Forever for some time now, and it does include Amiga Explorer....which from my understanding will allow me to transfer ADF files back to the Amiga on disks providing I have a null modem serial cable (on the way) and some DD disks of course. If all works the way I am hoping it will, it'll be freakin' great.

I would recommend a visit to the Amiga Forever site and to check out their software:

http://www.amigaforever.com/

[Emuaust]

I have been using Winaue for the past month and its excellent, you can get anything amiga running on it.

[Blanka789]

I use a CDTV, but that's basically just an A500 in a different case from what I understand. I always thought that the 4000T was supposed to be the ultimate amiga...

[Ze_ro]

Well, sure, if you can get a 4000T, then by all means go for it! The problem is that it's very rare and expensive. It's also a giant beast, so good luck shipping it around. It has some great features, but if all you want to do is play Amiga games, it's overkill. The Amiga 1200 will play all the same games, and is much smaller and easier to find at the same time.

--Zero

[icbrkr]

Well, sure, if you can get a 4000T, then by all means go for it! The problem is that it's very rare and expensive. It's also a giant beast, so good luck shipping it around. It has some great features, but if all you want to do is play Amiga games, it's overkill. The Amiga 1200 will play all the same games, and is much smaller and easier to find at the same time.

--Zero

Hey, Zero is giving me a reason to brag.

My 4000T is equipped with:

68060/50Mhz
144MB of FAST Ram, 2MB Chip
20GB of HD space (only because I'm too lazy to upgrade it)
Cybervision64 video (VGA compatible)
Xsurf Ethernet card
External scandoubler
Lyra keyboard adapter (for using standard keyboards)
PS/2-USB adapter for standard mice
Workbench 3.9 and wayyy too much goodness onboard.

Is it overkill for playing games? Oh yeah.

It also looks a lot like this (an old pic)

http://www.particles.org/newsite/computers/amiga4000/2625.jpg

[zektor]

Very nice 4000T. The 68060/50Mhz tells me that this was probably the Escom release of the computer. Wish I had one of these :)

[Ze_ro]

Alright, well if we're going to be posting pictures, then here's my Amiga 3000. It's hooked up to a nice VGA monitor alongside my old DOS machine (Ha, ice and I both have 1571's hooked up in our pictures!). VGA support being one of the best features of the Amiga 3000. You can also see my SCSI CD changer, an external floppy, and a CD32 controller tucked away. What you can't see is the 8MB RAM expansion, IDE controller with drive (in addition to the 3000's built-in SCSI controller), and X-Surf ethernet card. Unfortunately, while most 3000's ran at 25MHz, mine is one of the earlier ones that is only clocked at 16MHz.

I do want to get an accelerator for it, but processor cards for the 3000 are a huge pain in the ass. I've already done the INT2 modification, but depending on the processor card, I might have to replace the DMAC and Ramsey chips (and getting the newer versions won't be cheap). The case design also doesn't provide much in the way of air circulation, not to mention the usual power issues, since Commodore tended to use the bare minimum in power supplies. If I could get an '040 running, I'd be very happy.

http://24.79.9.107/a3000.jpg

--Zero

[icbrkr]

Heh. The 1571 is hooked up to the C-One ;) I have it in a different case now, that picture was taken a few years ago.

The 4000T is an Amiga Technologies one, the 060 is a Cyberstorm MK2 add-on card that I paid my right nut for.

More pics!

http://www.particles.org/blog/600.jpg

This is my Amiga 600 - PAL model hooked up through a scandoubler, with all of 2MB on board (soon to be 8MB fast), 4GB HD and a compact flash adapter for moving files easily over. Also, there's a nullmodem cable hooked into the back so I can IRC through a shell on my OS X box.

http://www.particles.org/blog/cdtv.jpg

This is my pretty standard CDTV, no expansions, no nothing. I need to spray paint the drive black to match, and get a real mouse for it. The gamepad mice are just awful.

[Blanka789]

Heh. The 1571 is hooked up to the C-One ;) I have it in a different case now, that picture was taken a few years ago.

The 4000T is an Amiga Technologies one, the 060 is a Cyberstorm MK2 add-on card that I paid my right nut for.

More pics!

http://www.particles.org/blog/600.jpg

This is my Amiga 600 - PAL model hooked up through a scandoubler, with all of 2MB on board (soon to be 8MB fast), 4GB HD and a compact flash adapter for moving files easily over. Also, there's a nullmodem cable hooked into the back so I can IRC through a shell on my OS X box.

http://www.particles.org/blog/cdtv.jpg

This is my pretty standard CDTV, no expansions, no nothing. I need to spray paint the drive black to match, and get a real mouse for it. The gamepad mice are just awful.


I'm so jealous of that black CDTV keyboard!!!! Wish i had one...and yes, the mice are difficult to find, but I keep looking!

[tom]

Hey I like pictures.
Rare(ish) Amiga 500+ on 8833-II, and a CD 32 on my old Sanyo monitor:
http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c173/thomasholzer/commodoregaming.jpg

[theMot]

If the A600's FastRAM expansion comes out soon for as cheap as it's planned (20 GBP, 8MB), that might be my setup of choice if it works well ;)

Where can i get my hands on that?

Nice set up btw. :)

[icbrkr]

Where can i get my hands on that?

Nice set up btw. :)

Thanks!

Check out here: http://eab.abime.net/showthread.php?t=42262

It's been produced in Russia, but they were having a hard time sending out of country for some reason....

There's a group buy for a new run.

[icbrkr]

Hey I like pictures.
Rare(ish) Amiga 500+ on 8833-II, and a CD 32 on my old Sanyo monitor:
http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c173/thomasholzer/commodoregaming.jpg

Very cool! The 500+ wasn't released here so I've never seen one in person.

[98PaceCar]

Some cool setups here. I still need to figure out a way to escape with Ice's 4000T the next time I'm over there!! ;)

I don't have much in the way of rare Amiga gear, but I do have this:

http://i669.photobucket.com/albums/vv51/98pacecar/IMG_2345.jpg

It's a CD32 rebranded and used in Italian arcade machines. All but 1 of the games are porn based, but they are surprisingly fun!

[theMot]

I would say that's pretty rare.

Screen shots? :D

[Ze_ro]

I need to spray paint the drive black to match, and get a real mouse for it.
You should get the black floppy drive that was actually released for the CDTV. It would look a whole lot classier than that clunky 1010. I've been wanting to get one for use with my CD32, but they're relatively expensive.


I'm so jealous of that black CDTV keyboard!!!! Wish i had one...and yes, the mice are difficult to find, but I keep looking!
I have one that's been modified to work with my CD32. I wanted something that would match the case (though it still doesn't, since the CD32 isn't really black, but at least it's not beige), and I didn't want to resort to PC keyboards, because somehow that seems sacrilegious or something.

Anyways, on the subject of rare Amiga stuff, here's a picture of my PAL CD32 outfitted with an SX32 Pro. This bad boy has:
68030 processor @ 50 MHz
68882 FPU @ 50 MHz
32MB RAM (it can handle 64MB, but I doubt I'll bother going that high)
540MB hard drive
Battery backed clock
All the standard Amiga ports, including a VGA port (not scandoubled)
Unfortunately, I still don't have a permanent home set up for this. I need to put together a new power supply, since the standard CD32 brick just doesn't put out enough power to keep this machine stable.

http://24.79.9.107/sx32-1.jpg

And here's the main show. Unfortunately, it doesn't slide nicely into the bay since the PCB is too big, so you HAVE to actually open the case to install this thing. It just barely fits. You see that black cable just visible in the bottom left of the image? That goes to a smaller board that has the reset button, headphone jack, etc... I had to reroute that cable in a strange manner because it kept pressing against the heatsink.

http://24.79.9.107/sx32-2.jpg

--Zero

[OldSchoolGamer]

You should get the black floppy drive that was actually released for the CDTV. It would look a whole lot classier than that clunky 1010. I've been wanting to get one for use with my CD32, but they're relatively expensive.

--Zero

I considered that myself, seemed obvious for the CD32 but I remmeber tracking down some pictures and from what I remember the CDTV floppy interface is different from a standard Amiga one....... I guess that is not the case considering the pictures above but I swear when I looked at a picuture of the back of the CDTV the floppy drive connection was different.......

[icbrkr]

The floppy drive port is identical though there was a drive I couldn't get to work properly on it. Zero nailed the reason why I might spraypaint the 1011 - cost! It's cheaper to get some Fusion plastic paint than attempting to get the CDTV drive.

[Blanka789]

The floppy drive port is identical though there was a drive I couldn't get to work properly on it. Zero nailed the reason why I might spraypaint the 1011 - cost! It's cheaper to get some Fusion plastic paint than attempting to get the CDTV drive.

Just keep checking ebay, I got one a few weeks ago for about $40 with shipping, seemed reasonable to me.

[icbrkr]

$40 is a bit much for what it is... a disk drive that's black ;). Plus, why spend $40 when you can spend $1K on this?

http://picasaweb.google.com/HAWKEYEFILMWORKS/AmigaCollectionOver10000Items#

For the record, it's 5 Amiga 2000s (1 is a 2500), 5 A500s, 2 1200s, 1 1000, flicker fixers, bridgeboards, SCSI adapters, accelerators in the 1200s and a bunch on the side, monitors, kickstart switchers, chromakeys, Zorro expansions for the 500 and the 1000, a you just name it. Also not shown are about 3000 disks/games and CDs and a lot of manuals and mags.

I'll be picking it up next weekend...

[theMot]

Your obviously not married i take it lol :D

[98PaceCar]

Nah, he just has a really cool wife!

[zektor]

And my wife thinks I'm bad because I have four Commodore 64's and one Amiga! :)

Also, do you plan on keeping everything or parting with some of it? I would love to own a 1200HD :)

[Blanka789]

Simply amazing...hoping you resell some!

[icbrkr]

Nah, he just has a really cool wife!

I'll pass that along to Ginger ;).

I do plan on reselling some of it obviously - I don't have a need for so much stuff but it will probably take quite a bit to figure out what is all there. One of the 1200s is spoken for, the other one will replace my older one that I currently use. I'll also have to piece together all the other systems and to test everything out which will take quite awhile. I'll keep you posted!

[Blanka789]

If you find any CDTV stuff or maybe a 4000T I'll take it off your hands, free of charge!

Ah...I wish LOL

[leicamaster]

I love my setup its an amiga 1200 with an 4 gb HD and 2megs of ram its a beauty

[Coleman]

OK so after reading through this thread a couple of times i have decided that it is time - I would like to begin collecting amiga... someone pls help a noob get started?

[icbrkr]

OK so after reading through this thread a couple of times i have decided that it is time - I would like to begin collecting amiga... someone pls help a noob get started?

That's a pretty large question. Here's a start...

(taken from http://particles.org/forum/viewtopic.php?p=18#18 )

If you're looking into getting an Amiga to play games, you need to ask yourself some questions:

1) Do I want to play older bought games (1985-1991 era)? If so, get an Amiga 500 for cheap. The Kickstart 1.2 or 1.3 that comes with it should be plenty to use most games. Make sure that it has 1MB of ChipRAM for maximum compatiblity.

2) Do I want to play older games that I got from the Internet? In this case, you'll need to get yourself an Amiga that has a hard drive (to make life easier), minium 1MB of RAM (2MB preferred), Kickstart 2.04 or higher, PC2AM (available from aminet.net for free), and a parallel Laplink cable that's available from Office Depot or anywhere else. Using this program and the cable, you can copy the ADF files to the Amiga, and using ADF2BLITZ make real disks from them. I did this for awhile. Here, you can use any Amiga, but if it's just strictly for older games, an Amiga 500 or 2000 will work fine. You can also use a nullmodem and Amiga Explorer which is part of Amiga Forever.

3) I want to play everything that the Amiga has to offer, 1985 through present. Get an Amiga 1200 or 4000 but ensure that it has an 030 or better processor, 4MB minimum RAM, and a hard drive. The Amiga 1200 and 4000 have different graphics modes than the older 500/2000/3000 series, and a lot of games use this. The downfall is that a lot of older games are incompatible with the 1200/4000 series "out of the box". However, a program is out that allows you to install "disk only" games to the hard drive called WHDLOAD (whdload.de) and makes these games compatible. The bad thing is much of it requires an 020 processor better, and 4MB of RAM to be fully usable. Finding an Amiga 1200 shouldn't be hard with these specifications. The nice thing with the 1200 is that you can get an older PCMCIA Ethernet card for it so you don't need the above cable, and you can put it on your network and download files straight from the internet using FTP or through a browser.

[Coleman]

3) I want to play everything that the Amiga has to offer, 1985 through present. Get an Amiga 1200 or 4000 but ensure that it has an 030 or better processor, 4MB minimum RAM, and a hard drive. The Amiga 1200 and 4000 have different graphics modes than the older 500/2000/3000 series, and a lot of games use this. The downfall is that a lot of older games are incompatible with the 1200/4000 series "out of the box". However, a program is out that allows you to install "disk only" games to the hard drive called WHDLOAD (whdload.de) and makes these games compatible. The bad thing is much of it requires an 020 processor better, and 4MB of RAM to be fully usable. Finding an Amiga 1200 shouldn't be hard with these specifications. The nice thing with the 1200 is that you can get an older PCMCIA Ethernet card for it so you don't need the above cable, and you can put it on your network and download files straight from the internet using FTP or through a browser.

Ok i definitly fall into this catagory... What is the difference between the 1200 vs. the 4000?
Is there a better option available? I am the type of person that won't mind spending a little extra cash so i don't have to buy something again later down the road if i don't have to...

I am a games collector but a player at heart. I will definitly want to hunt down the original games for ownership value but i want to have fun too so downloading some stuff sounds like the best way to get started.

A lot of the stuff that you are talking about here i don't understand at all (more of a console gamer) it sounds like i can somehow hook up my amiga to a wireless home network and go from there to grab games off the web - down load them and make flopy's I can play? If thats the case what will i need to do this and what will it cost me. Are there required / prefered accessories that i need to know about?

BTW thanks for the link!

[robotriot]

I don't think you really need an A4000 for games at all, the 1200 will do, you can always upgrade it with a 060 accelerator. It'll still be cheaper than the 4000.

I'm not sure if there's a wireless card available for the Amiga, usually you will either get a PCMCIA ethernet card or one of the PCI expansion boards, that gives you PCI ports where you can use standard 100MBit PC-ethernet cards. Cheaper solutions would be using a serial null modem cable to copy files between PC and Amiga, or a CD-ROM drive on the Amiga side, and you just burn the downloaded games on the PC. You can write ADF format files back to floppy disk on Amiga, or, if you've got a 1200/4000 with an accelerator card, the more convenient solution would be downloading pre-installed WHDLoad games and using the program WHDLoad to play the games from hard disk. This has the advantages of way shorter loading times and better compatibility, since the hd-games are patched (running older games on an A1200 can be really difficult otherwise).

So what you need is:
Amiga 1200 w/ hard disk
Accelerator card, at least with a 68030 CPU and 8MB RAM. Best solution: 68060 CPU and 64MB or more.
PCMCIA ethernet card (only a couple of cards work on the Amiga) or PCI expansion board w/ 100Mbit PCI ethernet card
OR: Null modem cable (a lot cheaper, but also very slow)
OR: CD-ROM drive and an IDE-adaptor for ATAPI-drives; I don't know about SCSI CD-ROMs

[Coleman]

So what you need is:
Amiga 1200 w/ hard disk
Accelerator card, at least with a 68030 CPU and 8MB RAM. Best solution: 68060 CPU and 64MB or more.
PCMCIA ethernet card (only a couple of cards work on the Amiga) or PCI expansion board w/ 100Mbit PCI ethernet card
OR: Null modem cable (a lot cheaper, but also very slow)
OR: CD-ROM drive and an IDE-adaptor for ATAPI-drives; I don't know about SCSI CD-ROMs


First off what is the difference between a 1200 vs. a 4000?
What is the purpose of the accelerator card?
What will i pay for a 68060 CPU / 64MB Ram
What is the ideal amount of ram?
What is the best Ethernet card option and Why?
Do i want a CD-Rom drive and an ethernet card? Why / Whynot?
What does all of this cost?

What about monitors, keyboards controllers etc...?
Thanks for the Reply!

[icbrkr]

First off what is the difference between a 1200 vs. a 4000?
What is the purpose of the accelerator card?
What will i pay for a 68060 CPU / 64MB Ram
What is the ideal amount of ram?
What is the best Ethernet card option and Why?
Do i want a CD-Rom drive and an ethernet card? Why / Whynot?
What does all of this cost?

What about monitors, keyboards controllers etc...?
Thanks for the Reply!


Seriously, you're going to have to do some research for prices. As it works for all older equipment, YMMV and it can get costly.

A 1200 is an all in one unit, the 4000 is a big box unit. You can find more info by perusing amiga.org - check out 'images' for pics. Wikipedia is good for more technical info.

An ideal amount of RAM is dependant on what you want to do, just like every other computer in the world. For games, 4-8MB should be fine if you're running WHDLOAD. If you're running original floppies, the built in 2MB of a 1200 is fine.

If you're playing games, you won't need an ethernet card. You can transfer files by CF (compact flash) card, null modem, or laplink cable. If you're using original disks, you may never have a reason to transfer files.

If you're using original disks, you will never need a CDROM drive as very few games shipped on CD, and those that did usually required a beefed-up system.

You will pay your right nut for an 060 card. It's unneeded for games unless you want Doom type clones. A maxed-out 1200 system could easily put you into the $1K range.

Monitors run from $50 for a 1080/1084 on up. You can use a TV on a 1200 but it won't look as sharp. Some modes will work on a VGA monitor but 99.9% of games will not. You will need a scandoubler (about $175) to use a VGA monitor for all modes.

The big thing is the comment that "you're a console gamer". A lot of 'extra' things to do require quite a bit of knowledge of older computers and command line/text editing. If you're up to it, great, but if it's more of a 'put the floppy in the drive and go' you might be disappointed.

[zektor]

Well, to keep this inside of the Amiga thread:

Does anybody know a good source for DS/DD disks? I am really looking for a good deal OUTSIDE of ebay on bulk disks. I finally got my serial cable and have Amiga Explorer running with the A500, and this is the perfect setup for me :) Now I just need a slew of disks to get some more ADF's I would like to play over. I only had a few, and the Budbrains megademos already consumed them (I love demos!). Any advice is greatly appreciated!

[Soviet Conscript]

3) I want to play everything that the Amiga has to offer, 1985 through present. Get an Amiga 1200 or 4000 but ensure that it has an 030 or better processor, 4MB minimum RAM, and a hard drive. The Amiga 1200 and 4000 have different graphics modes than the older 500/2000/3000 series, and a lot of games use this. The downfall is that a lot of older games are incompatible with the 1200/4000 series "out of the box". However, a program is out that allows you to install "disk only" games to the hard drive called WHDLOAD (whdload.de) and makes these games compatible. The bad thing is much of it requires an 020 processor better, and 4MB of RAM to be fully usable. Finding an Amiga 1200 shouldn't be hard with these specifications. The nice thing with the 1200 is that you can get an older PCMCIA Ethernet card for it so you don't need the above cable, and you can put it on your network and download files straight from the internet using FTP or through a browser.

just figured out where my tax refund money is headed

[icbrkr]

Ebay is your best bet. Meritline used to be my source but they quit carrying them.

Check this...

http://cgi.ebay.com/50-3-5-Double-Sided-Double-Density-disks_W0QQitemZ130282554051QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_D efaultDomain_0?hash=item130282554051&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1205|66%3A2|65%3A12|39%3A1|240%3A13 18|301%3A1|293%3A1|294%3A50

It's going to be much cheaper than off-ebay for that quantity.

[Coleman]

OK let me try this again...

I think what i want is a system that i can upgrade over time to have the best of the best... eventualy (I'm sure this is like most people...) I want to run shapeshifter for non amiga type stuff but i also want full compatability with all of the older apps as well... I think that i need an A1200 for this?
I like accessories - CD-Roms - extra drives etc. this is all cool useful stuff IMO...
I also want a monitor that is going to take full advantage of all of the pretty pixels an amiga can push!
Keyboard/mouse/controllers etc.
Anyone want to sell me a starter kit?

[Ze_ro]

First off what is the difference between a 1200 vs. a 4000?
The 4000 has more expansion options... it's in a real computer case (that is, a desktop or a tower, rather than an all-on-one keyboard like the 1200), and has Zorro III slots for various expansion cards.

Keep in mind that you can get basically all the advantages of the 4000 with the 1200 as well, though you usually have to go about it a bit differently (ie, the 4000 has RAM slots on the motherboard, while with the 1200, they'll be on the accelerator card). The 4000 really isn't worth the cost I'd say.

The only thing I can think of that you wouldn't be able to do on the 1200 is use an Amiga graphics card, as only the 3000 and 4000 (and maybe 2000?) had the appropriate slot for them. These cards are very expensive though, and of relatively little use in my opinion.


What is the purpose of the accelerator card?
Makes the computer faster, and they pretty much all have RAM slots, which is important. The 1200 only has 2MB of RAM built-in, which is not a lot. If all you want to do is play games, the 68020 in the 1200 is good enough for 99% of the commercial game releases out there, but the RAM is a real bottleneck when you try to do WHDLoad stuff.


What will i pay for a 68060 CPU / 64MB Ram
Probably around $400-$500. If you really want the most powerful system, there are PowerPC accelerator cards out there as well. They'll be even more expensive though.

Also, if you intend to go with something that powerful in an Amiga 1200, you will likely have to gut the computer and put it into a tower case, as there just won't be enough room inside the standard case for the heat sink and fan.

I honestly think that an '060 or a PPC is overkill. It makes things faster, but there's almost nothing that really needs such speed on the Amiga. A 68040 would be nice, but an '030 is easily sufficient and FAR cheaper and easier to find.


What is the ideal amount of ram?
I honestly doubt you'll need more than about 8MB. RAM is cheap though, and everything on the Amiga uses standard RAM that will be easy to find (as long as it's not a GVP card... that company sometimes used their own proprietary RAM), so you might as well go 32 or 64MB.


What is the best Ethernet card option and Why?
On the 600 and 1200, your best bet is to use a PCMCIA ethernet adaptor. Don't just buy a random one though, as not all of them will work. It's also worth pointing out that some 1200 accelerator cards interfere with the operation of the PCMCIA port.

On the 2000, 3000, and 4000, your best bet is a X-Surf (http://www.jschoenfeld.com/products/xsurf_e.htm). It's basically an ISA ethernet card glued to an adaptor so it plugs into a Zorro slot.

I'm not familiar with any workable options for the 500. I think Commodore released an ethernet card for it, but keep in mind that most network cards for the Amiga use BNC or AUI jacks and don't have regular RJ-45.


Do i want a CD-Rom drive and an ethernet card? Why / Whynot?
A CD-ROM drive is very nice for transferring files over, so is ethernet. Trying to surf the net from an Amiga isn't a very rewarding experience, as the software feels fairly dated, getting it all set up is a pain (all the software is shareware, even the IP stack), and stuff like Flash and Java will really tax an older system.

An Amiga can read 720k PC floppies... but this is not a fun way to get stuff onto the Amiga, which is where CD or ethernet is very helpful. There are other ways of course (Compact Flash via the 1200's PCMCIA port, null modem cable, etc).

There are quite a few SCSI cards out there for the Amiga, and a lot of accelerator cards had built-in SCSI controllers, so if you're going to get a CD-ROM drive for an Amiga, chances are you'll be looking for an external SCSI drive. These are actually relatively cheap on eBay (stick with the older ones). With a 4000, you should be able to get an IDE drive working through the built-in IDE controller... this is also possible with a 1200, though much more difficult due to the case design.


What does all of this cost?
For what you're thinking of? More than a modern PC. Frankly, you could easily spend half the money to build a regular PC that booted straight into an Amiga emulator, and it would even be faster. Amiga hardware gets exponentially more expensive as you get more powerful stuff.

I wouldn't recommend diving right in. Spend a few weeks fiddling around with WinUAE, get a feel for Workbench and the kind of software you'd want to run, and by the end of that, you'll probably have a good idea of what you want out of a real Amiga system.

If you just get a stock Amiga 1200 and an '030 accelerator and some RAM, it shouldn't be too hard to keep things under $200 though.


What about monitors, keyboards controllers etc...?
Well, the 3000 has a standard VGA port, so pretty much any monitor is good there... but for all other Amiga's (even the 4000), you'll want a Commodore 1084S or similar RGB monitor. If you look around, you can get a scan doubler/flicker fixer, which will let you use a regular VGA monitor (the 3000 already has this hardware built-in), but these devices are pretty expensive and in high demand. Getting a 1084S is probably cheaper and more realistic.

As for keyboards, most will have it built-in, or you'll get one with the system. Amiga keyboards are not compatible with regular PC keyboards, so if you want to use a PC keyboard, you'll need an adaptor (like Lyra).

As for joysticks, you're in luck. Regular Atari style joysticks will work fine, and most games only use one button anyways. Genesis controllers work too. If you're feeling saucy, I'd say get a CD32 controller. Some Amiga games have specific support for them.

As for mice, you'll have to get a real Amiga mouse. PC mice aren't compatible. You can modify an Atari ST mouse to make it work, but they're hard enough to find too. Chances are, you'll get a mouse with the computer though, as they all came with one.


I want to run shapeshifter for non amiga type stuff
I don't think ShapeShifter is really a viable option these days. You're better off finding an actual Mac (easier than finding an Amiga), or running Basilisk II on a PC.

--Zero

[Ze_ro]

I honestly doubt you'll need more than about 8MB. RAM is cheap though, and everything on the Amiga uses standard RAM that will be easy to find (as long as it's not a GVP card... that company sometimes used their own proprietary RAM), so you might as well go 32 or 64MB.
I guess I should have mentioned: The Amiga can use extra memory as a RAM disk... basically, you can copy files straight into RAM and use it as an extremely fast disk drive. The more RAM you have, the more it can use, so I guess there IS some argument in favour of more RAM.... though I still doubt you'll ever need more than 8MB.

--Zero

[robotriot]

My argument pro 060 and 64MB RAM is that if you *really* want to do everything you can with an (68k) Amiga, you will also want to watch all the awesome demos for it. That's where the 060 CPU and extra RAM come in handy ...

[icbrkr]

Multitasking flies under an 060 (it's not shabby at all under an 030 though). It's great if you have a Picasso II or Cybergraphx card or something as well but really, it's definitely not a 'newbie' piece of hardware.

Where can I grab 060 demos? That might be interesting.

[robotriot]

Where can I grab 060 demos? That might be interesting.

Check out pouet.net, most newer demos are for 060: http://pouet.net/prodlist.php?platform[]=Amiga%20AGA&order=release

Specific recommendations are groups like TBL or Ephidrena. Check out http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-wtMEBPWeMo for example (it's a bit slower on a real 060 though ;)

[Coleman]

Thankyou very much this has been VERY helpful!

In general i am not a fan of emulation because it takes away from the "console feel" not sure if this will efect

[Soviet Conscript]

Thankyou very much this has been VERY helpful!

In general i am not a fan of emulation because it takes away from the "console feel" not sure if this will efect

i totally agree with you. yhea maybe its a little dumb to spend alot of $ on an amiga setup when you can just emulate it on a pc but that can be said for any system (well, alot of them).

i acually like the boxyness of the 4000 over the compact nature of the 1200.

[icbrkr]

Check out pouet.net, most newer demos are for 060: http://pouet.net/prodlist.php?platform[]=Amiga%20AGA&order=release

Specific recommendations are groups like TBL or Ephidrena. Check out http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-wtMEBPWeMo for example (it's a bit slower on a real 060 though ;)

Gracias senior. I have a feeling I'm going to be downloading some files this Sunday!

[icbrkr]

i acually like the boxyness of the 4000 over the compact nature of the 1200.

The expansion possibilities of the 4000 are better than the 1200, but cost wise, you can probably build a 1200 in a tower cheaper. The only problem is the 1200 will be more of less a big 'kludge' of hardware being kept together with duct-tape ;)

I like the boxiness too... the 4000T is coveted, but man, it takes up wayyyy too much room for a big mass of empty space inside of it.

[Coleman]

Can anyone give me a list of what they think are the best games released on this system? Especialy exclusive titles!

[98PaceCar]

Can anyone give me a list of what they think are the best games released on this system? Especialy exclusive titles!

http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&rlz=1T4GZHZ_enUS225US226&q=good+amiga+games

http://www.digitpress.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1170&highlight=amiga

[zektor]

Can anyone give me a list of what they think are the best games released on this system? Especialy exclusive titles!


Yep, check those links above. I always loved Shadow Of The Beast, Agony, Defender Of the Crown, Arkanoid (1 and Doh), King Of Chicago....the list goes on and on.

To get back to your original questions regarding an Amiga setup to start, I still recommend a 500 (with memory expansion of course) for a starter setup. I have been without an Amiga since 1992, and upon my recent re-entry this is what I have and spend thus far:

Amiga 500 w/1MB expansion, extra floppy drive, mouse, leather cover, 520 adapter (do you can hook it to a TV), all manuals and original Workbench/extras disks - $41 (plus $25 shipping)

Belkin null modem serial cable (to transfer ADF games from the PC to the Amiga 500 and copy to a real disk) - $20

1084S monitor (I didn't NEED this as I do have the 520 video adapter, but I wanted the nice monitor I used to own) - $110

150 DS/DD floppy disks new - Well, I needed these :) - about $90

Amiga Forever/Amiga Explorer - This was either $30 or $40...I purchased it a while back. Well worth the purchase.


With Amiga explorer, you simply drag and drop ADF disk images from the PC to your actual Amiga floppy drives which are seen through the null cable in Windows. From there, the Amiga just writes a disk. It is not lightening fast....a few minutes at least to make a disk. But, it works flawlessly. I made a few dozen games and demos just today. I just think it is awesome to actually be able to re-create actual disks again. I felt like I was 16 years old again, writing game names on floppy labels :)

This just gives you an idea of the cost of a basic setup. If you minus out the monitor it is not all that bad. Even monitor included, it is pretty darn good considering all youw ould be able to do with it. Just be careful purchasing an Amiga (or any computer for that matter) on ebay. I got very lucky and received a perfect package in which everything is physically and functionally working like new. You can also try the various Amiga forums on the net...which tend to be much better people to deal with :)

[icbrkr]

You got a steal on that 500 if it's in good shape. Normal going price is a bit around $50-70 depending on condition (though I know right now I've seen some going for very cheap), and an external drive sits around $20ish. Of course, you made up for it with $110 on the monitor instead of the normal $40-50 ;) But still, glad you're having fun again!

Now if you excuse me, I got a large stack of Amigas to go through...

[zektor]

You got a steal on that 500 if it's in good shape. Normal going price is a bit around $50-70 depending on condition (though I know right now I've seen some going for very cheap), and an external drive sits around $20ish. Of course, you made up for it with $110 on the monitor instead of the normal $40-50 ;) But still, glad you're having fun again!

Now if you excuse me, I got a large stack of Amigas to go through...

Ohh, you got that set :) Congratulations man, I can only wish to have that massive of a commodore Amiga collection one day. Yeah, the monitor was actually $75, but the freakin' shipping on this cost the rest...coming from California to NJ :) At least it is completely mint and brand new looking.

The Amiga 500 was very dirty initially (well, dust accumulation), but after a solid cleaning I was surprised to find that it was in absolute mint condition. No yellowing or any type or scratches or marks anywhere. The system has the A501 in the trap door, and amazingly enough the battery still retains the current time and date! Anyway, it is the Amiga that I had back in the day (the only Amiga I have ever owned actually) and that makes it even more special to me to have basically my exact old setup once again.

On a somewhat off-topic note, maybe you know:

I can't get my old time favorite "R-Type" to work correctly. It loads to title screen, press the fire bitton, and then black screen with no disk activity. I have tried multiple adf versions, and also tried removing the external floppy drive (since some games didn;t work right with it plugged in from what I remember) but nada. Got R-Type II going, but it just ain't the same :)

[icbrkr]

I completely understand. I've spent some time trying to get my A600 setup that I used to have back in the early 90s. I finally got an NTSC model a few weeks ago, so I'm pretty much complete with that project. I got my new case for it from the UK that I need to put it in at some point.

You might want to remove that battery before it gets 'fuzzy' ;). It'll still hold some current for awhile, but when they leak, they eat through the board it's mounted on. That's of course, bad.

What version of Kickstart are you using? Is the 501 being mapped as Chip or FastRAM? You might want to look into Degrader or something similar from Aminet so you can turn off your FastRAM or drop that system down to 512K Chip only. That might be why the game is bailing.

I did get the stack though some of the systems and accelerators don't work :(. But, 4 500s do work, 1 is salvagable, 1 needs some help. 1 2000 works fine, 2 have issues that I haven't identified yet. The 1000 works fine, and both 1200s seem to be doing okay.

[zektor]

What version of Kickstart are you using? Is the 501 being mapped as Chip or FastRAM? You might want to look into Degrader or something similar from Aminet so you can turn off your FastRAM or drop that system down to 512K Chip only. That might be why the game is bailing.


Good call. It is just the basic kickstart v1.3. Can't fastram be turned off in Workbench? I can't remember. I haven't used the Amiga for well over ten years, so I am just barely remembering everything. Luckily the AExplorer setup went without a hitch, and I was able to transfer over a newer version of workbench along with the disks and demos that I remember (Budbrains Megademos and many other greats!) and all has worked out well thus far. I am working off a TOSEC set I downloaded a long time ago, and just going through the various versions (cracked, alternates) is a little bit of as task. I've been transferring cracked games as a rule of thumb, as I have a feeling that the versions without the cracked flag are just uncracked transferred disks which will show their copy protection somewhere along the gaming line :) Still, I have to wonder WHY TOSEC would allow virus infected images, as some of them have the virus flag (Byte Bandit...etc)...

EDIT:

I did some searching and took your advice on the battery. After a bitch of a time getting the shielding off the A501 (needless to say, the shielding is destroyed) I got to the board to see the battery showing slight signs of leakage (white powder substance on one side, very slight and did not seem to touch the board...YET), so I popped the sucker off and cleaned the area with isopropyl 91%. I popped just the card itself now into the Amiga and all seems to work fine, except of course Workbench reporting no battery backed up clock found. A toss up between having the computer not show me time/date and permanently damaging the expanded memory board is no choice at all. I hope the board being connected without that shielding is ok, but I have seen other third party expansion modules that are shield free....so I guess it is ok.

And pic attached of my baby (before the monitor arrived) :)

[robotriot]

I removed the shielding from my Amigas as well, since I constantly had to fix something. Doesn't affect the operation though.

I think I went through three RAM boards due to battery leakage. The last one I had now didn't have an on-board battery, so that was finally settled. However, the A500 died completly a while later, so I've got a handy door stop now.

[icbrkr]

Good call. It is just the basic kickstart v1.3. Can't fastram be turned off in Workbench?

It can, but that would be for Workbench-aware programs which 99% of all games aren't. Degrader, or something similar, will set the flags and reboot your machine (allowing you to reboot to the game). Worth a shot anyway. You can test the theory by removing your A501 and booting the game to see if it works.


Still, I have to wonder WHY TOSEC would allow virus infected images, as some of them have the virus flag (Byte Bandit...etc)...

Flag <> Virus ;) Back in the day, many, many pirated games showed up as a 'virus' to virus checkers which nicely offered to 'fix' the bootblock for you. Since most games use their own written DOS format (NDOS), fixing it effectively destroys the game. Not saying none of them are infected .... just keep your 'write protect' tabs on.




I did some searching and took your advice on the battery. After a bitch of a time getting the shielding off the A501 (needless to say, the shielding is destroyed) I got to the board to see the battery showing slight signs of leakage (white powder substance on one side, very slight and did not seem to touch the board...YET), so I popped the sucker off and cleaned the area with isopropyl 91%. I popped just the card itself now into the Amiga and all seems to work fine, except of course Workbench reporting no battery backed up clock found. A toss up between having the computer not show me time/date and permanently damaging the expanded memory board is no choice at all. I hope the board being connected without that shielding is ok, but I have seen other third party expansion modules that are shield free....so I guess it is ok.


There's battery hacks out there so you can replace it with a standard lithium. You more or less need a battery holder, a diode and some wires. Check aminet. I've got to do the same thing - most all the machines I picked up have fuzzy batteries.



And pic attached of my baby (before the monitor arrived) :)
[/quote]

Sweet!

[zektor]

Thanks for the Degrader tip, although it did not work. The program is good however, and works as expected. I even tried removing the expansion memory and booting. Same deal. Goes to title screen (Press button to start) and after pressing the fire button on the joystick I get the black screen and that is it. Very odd. This occurs with every known dump of the game (I tried them all!) Maybe it is an incompatibility with this revision of A500? I have not looked at the board, but it must be among one of the first releases (Red power light, green drive light). I am just baffled. I played this before on my old A500 back in the day dozens of times. Oh well...

[icbrkr]

Bummer... are you using Kickstart 1.3? The only other thing I can think of is your disk drive - maybe just a tad misaligned? I'm reaching here. I'll have to try making a disk and trying it on my 600 or 1000.

[zektor]

Bummer... are you using Kickstart 1.3? The only other thing I can think of is your disk drive - maybe just a tad misaligned? I'm reaching here. I'll have to try making a disk and trying it on my 600 or 1000.

I received a beautiful 2nd Amiga 500 today that actually has kickstart 1.2 rom. I figured I'd give R-Type a go once more and created the disk. Still, same exact issue. Gets to title screen and when you hit the button on the joystick to start, blank screen and nothing else. So, now having tested it on two separate Amiga 500 units with two different kick roms (1.3 and 1.2) and still having the issue, I must conclude that the available images online are just not correct for an actual Amiga 500. I know they work in WinUAE, but not here. I wish I knew someone with an actual retail disk to try. Maybe I need to hunt one down and give it a shot. Did you ever get to testing it on your Amigas?

[icbrkr]

Just did...

http://www.particles.org/blog/rtype.jpg

That's Rtype on an Amiga 600 w/2MB CHIP, kicked down to KS 1.3. I used one of the images I found in the TOSEC (I had a choice of 8 or so)... it was the one with the longest filename ;)

[Soviet Conscript]

Just got my new Amiga 1200T setup so i figured i would ressurect this thread

(possible candidate for a move to the classic computer gameing sub forum?)

http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/7051/a1200.jpg

OS 3.9
4 GB HD
wifi
Apollo 1240 accelerator 68040 cpu at 32Mhz
32mb of RAM

the tower is probibly the biggest tower i have ever seen, 5 large bays, thing almost reaches my waist.

[Sonicwolf]

That tower is massive. Dwarfs the largest tower computer I have ever seen...

[kedawa]

That is HUGE! Put some legs on the side and it could be its own computer desk.

[AB Positive]

Wow... that's almost stupidly tall.

I'm a fan of the 'wedge' form factors myself, but a 1200T is pretty badass. Plus wifi? Hell, can't go wrong. Who needs spyware when you have AmigaOS? :D

[pato]

Wow! Some really nice Amiga setups. I still have all of my Amiga stuff. Although it is all put away due to lack of space. This thread brings back good old memories. I used to have an Amiga 2000 with a 386 board inside. My friends used to freak out when they came into my room and would see two monitors sitting side by side. (One Amiga monitor and one VGA). It's funny, back then, having the two side by side you could really see how far ahead of its time the Commodore Amiga was in relation to the older PC's. It wasn't until I got a 486 50 mhz pentium (Doom!) in 94 that things changed. Still, for a computer that was made in 85, it certainly stood the test of time.

I also still have my original 500, 500 plus and I even bought the Amiga CD32 when it first came out. All machines are Pal (except the original 500), so I need to have them all hooked up these massive transformers (220 to 110. I used to live in Europe) which is really annoying. Also, man do they ever heat up! I sometimes use emulators to play the old Amiga classics, but it just isn't the same now is it :)

The Commodore Amiga is still my all time favourite computer. I still remember when I had just bought a NES (Don't get me wrong, I love my NES too) and my friend invited me over to see this amazing new computer he got. What could he have that is so impressive. I mean, I have a NES. Then my friend busts out, Pang (Buster Bros in the U.S), Gemini Wing and Robocop. I was huge into Arcades then and to see those games running at home (I thought they looked Arcade Perfect lol) I was sold and knew I needed to have an Amiga. Those were the days...