What are the rarest officially licensed NES games other than Stadium Events?

[VG_Maniac]

Besides Stadium Events, what are the rarest officially licensed NES games? (Which of course, does not included unlicensed games like Bubble Bath Babes and Hot Slots).

[Cobra Commander]

The Flinstones Surprise at Dinosaur Peak is pretty damn rare I hear.

[icarwngs55]

Rescue Rangers 2
Bubble Bobble, Part 2
Flintstones: Surprise at Dinosaur Peak

[Sudo]

Rescue Rangers 2
Bubble Bobble, Part 2
Flintstones: Surprise at Dinosaur Peak

Is Rescue Rangers 2 really that rare? I knew it was uncommon, but I didn't think it was one of the rarest games on the system.

[ButtonMasher123]

Is Rescue Rangers 2 really that rare? I knew it was uncommon, but I didn't think it was one of the rarest games on the system.

Its rarity is due to its high demand much like a lot of the quality late era NES releases.

[icarwngs55]

Is Rescue Rangers 2 really that rare? I knew it was uncommon, but I didn't think it was one of the rarest games on the system.

It was a very late release. There are very few officially licensed NES games that are ubber rare like Stadium Events or Flintstones. So in the case of Rescue Rangers 2, yes it is rare and actually a good game.

Mike

[vintagegamecrazy]

Power Blade 2 is also quite rare, probably moreso than RR2 so keep that in mind too.

[tubeway]

The rarity guide on the digital press site is pretty useful for stuff like this. Just search for all of the nes games that were released in the USA, then sort by their rarity. You can tell which ones are licensed or unlicensed by checking their pages.

Question answered. Mods, please lock this thread.

Just kidding.

[DigitalSpace]

Rescue Rangers 2 is only an R5 (http://www.digitpress.com/DP/cmf/game.cmf?gameid=6095) in the DP guide. However, the only copy I've ever seen in the wild was the one I scored for $5 in 2007.

[icarwngs55]

Rescue Rangers 2 is only an R5 (http://www.digitpress.com/DP/cmf/game.cmf?gameid=6095) in the DP guide. However, the only copy I've ever seen in the wild was the one I scored for $5 in 2007.

Yea I have been collecting for years and years; seen thousands of NES games at all different venues; and only saw Rescue Rangers 2 once...and that is the copy I own!

And as far as it just being a "high demand cart" that isn't so rare, but just jacked up in price because it is in demand?? I don't believe that for a second. Sure you can probably see it on Ebay a fair but, but not in any great quantity.

Mike

[carlcarlson]

Yeah I've had over 1000 NES games go through my hands and have never come across RR2. It's not super hard to find online, but look for it in the wild and you'll realize that it really is a rarity.

Little Samson and Snow Bros are also quite hard to find (and both are excellent).

[aingevt]

I've been to plenty of places that sell NES games over the past 10+ years. I've only seen RR2 once. I was walking into a Gamestop in 03 when someone else was walking out. The guy had just traded in a few NES and SNES games. Among them was a sealed RR2. The wonderful Gamestop employee had just taken the plastic off to verify the games contents. I quickly went to the counter before he could do any more harm and asked how much. After assuring him that I didn't want him to throw away the box and inserts I walked away with a brand new copy of RR2 for about $5.

I was in such a hurry to get it I didn't think about what else the guy had turned in that I might have saved too, oh well.

[StakeRaiser]

Jimmy Connors Tennis is really rare, but no one other than super crazy collectors want it because well.....................its Jimmy Connors Tennis

Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade (ubisoft version) is also pretty rare, but most people don't realize there are two versions, Taito also made one that is a totally different game

[Mason P.]

Panic Resturaunt
Snow Brothers
Little Samson
Flintstones 2
Bubble Bobble 2
Ccntra Force
Hatris
Fire N' Ice
Snow Bros.

[BeaglePuss]

How did no one mention Bonk yet???

Other harder to find titles:
Panic Resturaunt
Snow Brothers
Little Samson
Flintstones 2
Bubble Bobble 2
Cowboy Kid
Jimmy Connor's Tennis
Godzilla 2
Power Blade 2
Nobunaga's Ambition 2

All of these games are harder to find than RR2 (and some by a long shot). Keep in mind that all these titles can be a pain to find loose, but there are FAR harder titles to find CIB (Sqoon, DK Jr. Math, Chubby Cherub, Color a Dinosaur, Kid Klown, ect.)

*Edit: I nearly forgot Pro Sport Hockey! Another game that is light years harder to find than RR2.

[The 1 2 P]

TMNT: Tournament Fighter was a super late release. I've also never seen Bases Loaded 4 in the wild. And I've only seen Contra Force once but you can easily score that on ebay.

[Famidrive-16]

I think Wacky Races and Duck Tales 2 are also both pretty difficult to find now. Not the rarest ever but not easy grabs.

[Push Upstairs]

I loved "Wacky Races". It was an easy game, but it was fun.

Sadly, it has shot up in price.

[boatofcar]

I've had tons of games go through my hands, including Flintstones 2. I've still never seen a Rescue Rangers 2.

[icarwngs55]

I think Joe (Mr. Digital Press himself) should chime in on this Rescue Rangers Conundrum. I mean not only is he a huge collector AND owns a video game store AND has thousands of games go through his hands BUT he also wrote the rarity guide.

So I ask you Joe...What do you think about Rescue Rangers 2?

Mike

[Oobgarm]

Thoughts on Motor City Patrol?

I have seen 3-4 total, only one in the wild.

Same for Color a Dinosaur.

[ryborg]

Same for Color a Dinosaur.

I have NEVER seen a CaD cart in the wild. Oddly enough, I have seen (and bought, obviously) the manual twice, once in a pawn shop and once at a thrift store.

[VG_Maniac]

What game is harder to find...Ducktales 2, or Rescue Rangers 2? They both seem to fetch about the same price on Ebay ($30 - $50 for a loose cart). I have only ran into Ducktales 2 once, and that was at a garage sale (where I bought it along with some other games they were selling in a lot).

[old_skoolin_jim]

I saw CaD in the wild once, at the newly-opened Gardner, MA Wal-Mart in late '94. Why didn't I buy it? A) I was 10 years old and didn't have $25, and 2) "THEY HAD FINAL FANTASY FOR $10—OMG!"

[Nesmaster]

RC Pro AM II is one you don't see very often too, but I'm sure it shows up more than the other titles already mentioned.

How about games on the other side of the pond, you can't forget those! Rodland, Mr. Gimmick and to a lesser extent Hammerin Harry. All licensed and all damn fine games. Unfortunately the only one of those I own is HH.

The ones I've personally never seen locally are Little Samson, Rescue Rangers 2, Power Blade 2, Contra Force. The rest I could've picked up locally. Some not for the best prices, but the opportunity was there. Those 4 I listed I HAD to buy online though.

Besides Stadium Events, I personally believe it's a toss-up between Flintstones 2 and Little Samson. You can get Bubble Bobble 2 almost any day of the week on eBay. What's funny is the huge monetary gap between #1 and #2, strictly speaking NTSC.

[icarwngs55]

Rescue Rangers 2 I feel is much harder to find than Duck Tales 2; only basing that on the fact I have seen probably 10-15 Duck Tales 2 and 0 Rescue Rangers 2.

Mike

[norkusa]

Been collecting NES for 13 years and about 50 carts shy of a US collection. Besides Stadium Events, Tournament Fighters is one of the few carts I've never seen before (found the manual though). Same goes for Contra Force but I ended up trading for a copy.

I've seen at least 3 or 4 copies of Rescue Rangers 2 but this was back in the Funcoland days when they had mountains of NES carts stocked. Bonk was a lot more common back then too.

A few more licensed games I've still never seen in the wild:

Wayne's World
Race America
Jimmy Connor's Tennis
Gemfire
Bignose Freaks Out
The Untouchables

[VG_Maniac]

Well, I get most of my NES games by buying large game lots on Ebay...and I've gotten two copies of Rescue Rangers 2 this way (one I kept, and one I re-sold). I have never once gotten a copy of Ducktales 2 in any of the lots I buy though...the only copy of that game I've ever seen in my life is the one I got at that garage sale 12 years ago.

Another game that seems pretty rare is Panic Restaurant...and I was lucky enough to get a copy of it with the booklet (I'm going to take a wild guess that the booklet is more rare than the actual game).

[RASK1904]

9)Stadium Events

8)Flintstones 2

7)Bandit Kings of Ancient China
7)Bonk's Adventure
7)Cowboy Kid
7)Gun+Nac
7)Little Samson
7)Miracle Piano
7)Panic Resturant
7)Power Blade 2
7)TMNT Tournament Fighters
7)Wayne's World

That's them. The rarest of the licensed games. Anything else is lower. 6's are considered uncommon. So thats it. Those are the rare games. All stollen from NA.

[Bloodreign]

Good thing I scored a loose Cowboy Kid for $4.99 a week or two ago seeing that it's a bit on the rarer side. This is the only copy I've ever seen and didn't even think to check the rarity guide like I normally do after purchases.

[Jehusephat]

I had no idea Rescue Rangers 2 was worth anything. I found a copy a long time ago and bought it because I liked the first game, but never for a minute thought it was actually rare. I hate to think of how many other rare/valuable games I've passed up in favor of more common ones.

[MarioMania]

I have both

Bonk's Adventure
TMNT Tournament Fighters

Got TMNT Tournament Fighters at Gamecrazy for $5

[Landon]

Ebay is pretty much the ultimate arbiter of rarity.
While regional interest can dictate how often any given cart is found 'in the wild', we can safely assume that at any given time, the number of carts listed on ebay will be reflective of it's overall scarcity.

Obviously, demand plays a huge role for how many of any given carts are on the market at any given time (the more popular, rare carts will sell faster while some of the less popular carts will sit for sale longer in ebay stores, thus creating the illusion of being more 'common') but an ebay active and completed listings search will usually tell the overall tale.

I've always felt that Dusty Diamond's All Star Softball was consistently underrated for rarity.

[portnoyd]

Ebay is pretty much the ultimate arbiter of rarity.
While regional interest can dictate how often any given cart is found 'in the wild', we can safely assume that at any given time, the number of carts listed on ebay will be reflective of it's overall scarcity.

That's not true. Games like Bubble Bobble 2 and Flintstones 2 are easy marks for reselling and easy cash money when you need money so that influences the amount of times you will see those games versus cheaper, nearly equally as rare games like Race America, Pro Sport Hockey, etc. Not to mention the amount of overpriced BIN auctions obscure using eBay as a rarity tool, as those games are always up and never leave active auctions because they never sell.

As with anything, you have to consider multiple sources to determine rarity since production runs are a trade secret and would be the definitive piece of information for rarity. Rarity values on DP were determined using world of mouth, eBay, relative release dates, rental only status, licensed versus unlicensed and other factors. I agree with the DP listings, primarily because I had a hand in them. :P

I order them as below. The difference between god and top tier is gigantic while the difference between 1st, 2nd and 3rd are not.

God tier: Stadium Events
Top tier: Flintstones 2, Bubble Bobble 2, Little Samson, etc
Second tier: Bomberman 2, Color A Dinosaur, Bonk's Adventure, etc
Third tier: Race America, Swamp Thing, Wayne's World, Conan, Wacky Races, etc

That being said, remember that the NintendoAge rarities are on a NES only scale, while the DP rarities are on an all system scale so take that into account.

[RASK1904]

Most the games evryone is saying "I think %$#& is realy rare too" are 6's. Very uncommon. So yes they are very hard to find in the wild. And just like any rarety scale there are more uncommon games than rare ones. It's easy to memorise the rare ones. Theres like 10. But when you get to uncommon theres like 100. So there are definitly some you will have never seen. So they seem rare to who ever has never seen them. Just kinda how rarety is suposed to work.

I have found 3 R7's in the wild and a lot of 6's. I've found 3 R.C. pro-AM 2's. I found Dusty Diamonds. No DT2 or RR2 though. I did miss out on a Snow Bros. once. ARGGGGGGG!!!! And I still remember that shit.

[phreakindee]

I bought a copy of Duck Tales 2 in the wild not long ago for 50 cents... never thought it was extremely rare or anything, just uncommon.

[calgon]

I've seen both RR2 and Ducktales 2 a handful of times in the wild dating back to 2003 or so, but have never seen cowboy kid, color a dinosaur, etc.

[Landon]

That's not true. Games like Bubble Bobble 2 and Flintstones 2 are easy marks for reselling and easy cash money when you need money so that influences the amount of times you will see those games versus cheaper, nearly equally as rare games like Race America, Pro Sport Hockey, etc. Not to mention the amount of overpriced BIN auctions obscure using eBay as a rarity tool, as those games are always up and never leave active auctions because they never sell.

As with anything, you have to consider multiple sources to determine rarity since production runs are a trade secret and would be the definitive piece of information for rarity. Rarity values on DP were determined using world of mouth, eBay, relative release dates, rental only status, licensed versus unlicensed and other factors. I agree with the DP listings, primarily because I had a hand in them. :P


It (the efficacy of ebay as an arbiter of rarity) is indeed pretty solid.
We agree that unrealistically priced BIN auctions can skew total availability figures, but even if you disregard the price outliers, ebay pretty much dictates 'what's out there' at any given point in time. We can argue theoretical behavioral economics all day (people selling because they're strapped for cash, people selling rare carts in bulk lots because they have no idea what they're worth, people selling rare carts to help fund the formation of a Guyanese cult...) but those things are anomaly based, entirely unquantifiable and for every theoretical yin, there is a theoretical yang. It's counter-productive to get caught in the theory-blender.

Ebay is middle-earth for all things collectible. While there may be the occasional 'reason' why it isn't nuts-and-bolts accurate, it is a completely standardized, public interface to buy and sell whatever is out there. As such, it generally reflects "whatever is out there". It killed the artificial sports card market, comic book market, collectible glasswares markets (which themselves were predicated on a fictitious notions of both "rarity" and demand) in spite of the plaintive pleas and theory-driven arguments from the various hobby-boosters for everyone to rely on more 'theoretical' pricing and rarity precepts that usually resolved back to an somewhat arbitrary price-guide of some kind... The retrogame community shouldn't fall into the same, unrealistic trap.

Further, I think a lot of rarity guides have had an undue influence on value that bears no relationship to actual rarity. In short, based on what I've seen, there is an enormous perception component to 'game rarity' (which in turn influences price) and some of it appears to be inaccurate. Much of this perception is driven by outdated and inefficient data.

Video Game Price Charts is an epic tool and if they were to collect data over a large sample size, I'd bet a substantial sum of money it would demonstrate precisely what I'm saying.

[pseudonym]

It (the efficacy of ebay as an arbiter of rarity) is indeed true.
We agree that overpriced BIN auctions skew total figures, but even if you disregard the price outliers, ebay pretty much dictates 'what's out there' at any given point in time. We can argue theoretical behavioral economics all day (people selling because they're strapped for cash, people selling rare carts in bulk lots because they have no idea what they're worth, people selling rare carts to help fund the formation of a Guyanese cult...) but those things are anomaly based, entirely unquantifiable and for every theoretical yin, there is a theoretical yang. It's counter-productive to get caught in the theory-blender.

Ebay is middle-earth for all things collectible. While there may be the occasional 'reason' why it isn't nuts-and-bolts accurate, it is a completely standardized, public interface to buy and sell whatever is out there. As such, it generally reflects "whatever is out there". It killed the artificial sports card market (which itself was predicated on a fictitious notion of "rarity) in spite of the plaintive pleas and theory-driven arguments from the various hobby-boosters for everyone to rely on more 'theoretical' pricing and rarity precepts... The retrogame community shouldn't fall into the same, unrealistic trap.

Further, I think a lot of rarity guides have had an undue influence on value that bears no relationship to actual rarity. In short, based on what I've seen, there is an enormous perception component to 'game rarity' (which in turn influences price) and some of it appears to be inaccurate. Much of this perception is driven by outdated and inefficient data.

Video Game Price Charts is an epic, epic tool and if they were to collect data over a large sample size, I'd bet a substantial sum of money it would demonstrate precisely what I'm saying.

Ebay might not be the best tool for some of the rarest items, they are often sold or traded in private deals on various websites.

Rarity and prices are based on supply and demand; if there's a low quantity of a particular title and high demand, that will increase the price, if there's a low quantity but low demand, the price will stay relatively low. Since no company has ever released the sales figures for their games, we can only make educated guesses about how "rare" they are based on experience and what portnoyd said.

Prices are wildly different across some of the rarer NES games. Some games like Flintstones 2, Bubble Bobble 2, Little Samson are steady $100+ sellers; others are in the $50-70+ range; still others are in the $30-50 range. A few like Color A Dinosaur, Miracle Piano are rare but you'd be lucky to get $10-15 each for them. A lot of these games are roughly equal in rarity.

I'm not familiar with Video Game Price Charts but it looks interesting. Anyway, it's too early in the morning to be arguing the semantics of rarity.

EDIT: For clarity and spelling mistakes. :embarrassed:

[GOLDEN KEYS]

i was looking for RR2 for months on ebay but finally gave up after failing to find one under $60. a couple months ago i'm browsing nes games at a local used game store and i see a copy hanging on the wall for $15. i bought it but thought it was a little strange because this place over charges for anything they possibly can and puts their "rare" games in a locked glass case. this case typically includes $25 copies of mega man 2, $15 copies of metroid, etc.

their average price for an nes title that isn't in the case is $4-$8... which means they realized RR2 was at least somewhat rare because that's probably the highest priced game i'd ever seen that wasn't locked up.

[vandy160890]

Snow Brothers
Flintstones 2
Ccntra Force
Fire N' Ice
These NES are really fantastic.

[vivaeljason]

I always thought Snow Bros. was one of the hardest NES games to find, but apparently it's only a 6.

And what's funny is that I had a few of the games listed at R6 in the DP guide as a kid in my Nintendo collection, only to sell them to Toys R Us for like a buck each as part of a deal with my parents to get an N64.

If only I knew now the value of Snow Bros., Wacky Races, Bubble Bobble II (which I basically stole from Blockbuster and forgot to return), and Fire n Ice.

[sniperCCJVQ]

http://www.nintendoage.com/index.cfm?FuseAction=Search.Results&pid=1&class_id=1%2C6&region_id=19&sort=Rarity_ID&order=desc

Seems pretty much to what i saw from the last 2-3 years

I was able to scored a Panic Restaurant in the wild for 2$, lucky me !

[portnoyd]

It (the efficacy of ebay as an arbiter of rarity) is indeed pretty solid.
We agree that unrealistically priced BIN auctions can skew total availability figures, but even if you disregard the price outliers, ebay pretty much dictates 'what's out there' at any given point in time. We can argue theoretical behavioral economics all day (people selling because they're strapped for cash, people selling rare carts in bulk lots because they have no idea what they're worth, people selling rare carts to help fund the formation of a Guyanese cult...) but those things are anomaly based, entirely unquantifiable and for every theoretical yin, there is a theoretical yang. It's counter-productive to get caught in the theory-blender.

So what you're saying is 'throw out everything else' because eBay is the gold standard and any variables that could affect eBay should be thrown out as well. Right. Solid argument, cheech. No matter how smart you try to sound is not going to make all the other factors you have to consider go away.


It killed the artificial sports card market, comic book market, collectible glasswares markets (which themselves were predicated on a fictitious notions of both "rarity" and demand) in spite of the plaintive pleas and theory-driven arguments from the various hobby-boosters for everyone to rely on more 'theoretical' pricing and rarity precepts that usually resolved back to an somewhat arbitrary price-guide of some kind... The retrogame community shouldn't fall into the same, unrealistic trap.

Too late.


Further, I think a lot of rarity guides have had an undue influence on value that bears no relationship to actual rarity. In short, based on what I've seen, there is an enormous perception component to 'game rarity' (which in turn influences price) and some of it appears to be inaccurate. Much of this perception is driven by outdated and inefficient data.

No, a lot of people can't tell the difference between rarity and value. Not the guides; the people who read them can't get it through their heads.

[ssjlance]

I was lucky enough to find Panic Restaurant at a flea market when I was younger. Never really knew it was rare until I googled it on impulse, as it was a bizarre game. Lucky me.

I missed out on Bubble Bobble 2, though. Local game store had it for $15, but I didn't really collect back then and it was that or Ninja Gaiden II. In hindsight, gah.

My brother swears that the same store also had Stadium Events at one point, but I think he's getting it mixed up with the more common version.

[Landon]

So what you're saying is 'throw out everything else' because eBay is the gold standard and any variables that could affect eBay should be thrown out as well. Right. Solid argument, cheech. No matter how smart you try to sound is not going to make all the other factors you have to consider go away.

No, that's not what I'm saying.
What I'm saying is that isolated anecdotes are stupid predicates for any position; said being almost the entire predicate for your position that the ability of ebay to arbitrate rarity (ie- the number of any given cart for sale at any given time) is skewed by one prospective variable (ie- people being more apt to sell rarer, more expensive carts because they "need money"). Variables are important, but it's important that we comprehend when they (variables) are anecdotal or integral.

Thanks for the compliment, though. If you think I was "trying to sound smart", I guess I must be doing something right.


Too late.

So I guess we agree on this.


No, a lot of people can't tell the difference between rarity and value. Not the guides; the people who read them can't get it through their heads.

We agree on the sentiment, but I do believe there's a causal relationship between price guides, rarity "rankings" and ultimate sale prices. The legitimacy of said "rankings" is often times in question.

[pseudonym]

He was using some mighty big words there, huh? \\^_^/

[mobiusclimber]

One thing that has NO basis for judging rarity is your subjective experience, tho, as some people on here have been suggesting (tho mildly). Just because you've never come across a certain title doesn't make it rare, no matter how many games you've come across. Going by that, I'd say Snow Bros is rarer than a Final Fantasy prototype, because I've seen that proto for sale locally whereas I've never seen Snow Bros locally. See? Just doesn't really work that way.

[Landon]

One thing that has NO basis for judging rarity is your subjective experience, tho, as some people on here have been suggesting (tho mildly). Just because you've never come across a certain title doesn't make it rare, no matter how many games you've come across. Going by that, I'd say Snow Bros is rarer than a Final Fantasy prototype, because I've seen that proto for sale locally whereas I've never seen Snow Bros locally. See? Just doesn't really work that way.

Absolutely correct. It's another example of how anecdote creeps into and contaminates analysis. It's understandable; the human animal is programmed to learn from experience, thus we value and understand things we've 'seen' , but it's important to distinguish between an isolated anecdote and an actual trend.

[pseudonym]

Absolutely correct. It's another example of how anecdote creeps into and contaminates analysis. It's understandable; the human animal is programmed to learn from experience, thus we value and understand things we've 'seen' , but it's important to distinguish between an isolated anecdote and an actual trend.

Your ideas fascinate me and I would like to suscribe to your newsletter, please. Pretty please.

So, how do you determine or "analyze" how rare a title is, then? Go on Ebay and keep track of every copy of a particular game that appears for auction?

mobiusclimber: Not exacty right IMO. Most people, even new collectors would assume that prototypes are naturally rarer than production carts; I'm not sure anyone would say that Snow Bros is rarer than any prototype just because they found a prototype and haven't found a Snow Bros cart yet.

[Landon]

Your ideas fascinate me and I would like to suscribe to your newsletter, please. Pretty please.

So, how do you determine or "analyze" how rare a title is, then? Go on Ebay and keep track of every copy of a particular game that appears for auction?

Snarky, idiotic, outdated internet'ism aside, some people are awfully good at writing programs... or contracting others to write programs for them to collect and sort data. I actually gave you a link to a simplified, free, publicly available example of just that.


mobiusclimber: Not exacty right IMO. Most people, even new collectors would assume that prototypes are naturally rarer than production carts; I'm not sure anyone would say that Snow Bros is rarer than any prototype just because they found a prototype and haven't found a Snow Bros cart yet.

He cited that as an illustrative example. Don't be obnoxiously hyper-literal.

[pseudonym]

Snarky, idiotic, outdated internet'ism aside, some people are awfully good at writing programs... or contracting others to write programs for them to collect and sort data. I actually gave you a link to a simplified, free, publicly available example of just that.



He cited that as an illustrative example. Don't be obnoxiously hyper-literal.

So what you're saying is that using a bot/spider to troll through Ebay would offer more conclusive evidence of rarity than collectors discussing it as a group? I don't think it would be better either way, even if you remove the human element from collecting data for rarity. Most rarity guides use examples from Ebay among other things as part of assigning rarity anyway.

I understand what mobius was saying, I don't think it was a good example. Almost no one would make that mistake in real life. It's good to discuss things like this with other collectors and not to arbitrarily assign rarity based on your sole experience.

[darkslime]

I actually own one of those rarities--Bonk's Adventure. It was $15 and came with about 30 other decent games. I wish someone would buy it from me on Amazon though because I'm broke.

[GOLDEN KEYS]

I actually own one of those rarities--Bonk's Adventure. It was $15 and came with about 30 other decent games. I wish someone would buy it from me on Amazon though because I'm broke.

look at this guy trying to get $200 for a cart only "bonk's adventure". it always confuses me why people do this when there are 4 or 5 other BIN running at less than half that.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Bonks-Adventure-Nintendo-NES-CLASSIC-VERY-RARE-GAME_W0QQitemZ200355727330QQcmdZViewItemQQptZVideo _Games_Games?hash=item2ea621c7e2

[GOLDEN KEYS]

here's one for $250...

http://cgi.ebay.com/Bonks-Adventure-Nintendo-NES-CLASSIC-VERY-FUN-HTF_W0QQitemZ200359404858QQcmdZViewItemQQptZVideo_ Games_Games?hash=item2ea659e53a

and here is one for $65...

http://cgi.ebay.com/Bonks-Adventure-Nintendo-NES-RARE_W0QQitemZ360220174500QQcmdZViewItemQQptZVideo _Games_Games?hash=item53decba8a4

[Daria]

look at this guy trying to get $200 for a cart only "bonk's adventure". it always confuses me why people do this when there are 4 or 5 other BIN running at less than half that.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Bonks-Adventure-Nintendo-NES-CLASSIC-VERY-RARE-GAME_W0QQitemZ200355727330QQcmdZViewItemQQptZVideo _Games_Games?hash=item2ea621c7e2

I find it amusing that for $200 they don't even bother to take a picture of the cart.

[Baloo]

I find it amusing that for $200 they don't even bother to take a picture of the cart.

I find it amusing that all three of those listings all only have stock photos.

[RASK1904]

Thats right time for an old fashion douche off!

Arguing over rarity wont help you find any of them.

Today I did find Die Hard, Pro Sports Hockey, Danny Sullivan's Indy Heat, Touchdown Fever, Metal Mech, Rollerball, Athena, WURM and a Gyromite w/ addapter. Add that up and thats R34!!!

[mobiusclimber]

I would hope that everyone on here understood that I used an extreme example simply to illustrate the point I was making, and that the people who pretended that I was being literal about it were in fact speaking facetiously. I hope so anyway.

To be perfectly honest, I can't give a lot of examples from my own life since I only started collecting in earnest a few years ago and haven't really come across too many rare carts (I think rarest has been DW4 and Princess Tomato).

[pseudonym]

I would hope that everyone on here understood that I used an extreme example simply to illustrate the point I was making, and that the people who pretended that I was being literal about it were in fact speaking facetiously. I hope so anyway.

To be perfectly honest, I can't give a lot of examples from my own life since I only started collecting in earnest a few years ago and haven't really come across too many rare carts (I think rarest has been DW4 and Princess Tomato).

http://i277.photobucket.com/albums/kk78/killerpup/rooney.png

Don't pretend you're not talking about me. And I haven't even begun my rant about NES collectors these days....

[mobiusclimber]

All you kids with your Nir-Van-A and High Fruck-tuss Corn Syrup and your vandalism! Have you ever done this before?! What language are you comfortable speaking?!

[Gameguy]

The best way to check rarity is to track how many people actually own the games at the same time. If there was a feature on this forum where every user could list the games that they currently own, that would be a better way to find out what games are rarer than others. I don't see this working though, who would really bother to list all their games and keep it updated regularly?

Checking ebay isn't that reliable, I remember watching auctions for Action 52 several years ago, for some reason loose carts were selling for over $100 each back then. There were always at least 7 different copies up at any time. A couple years later I didn't see any copies listed for months as the prices went down. How can you really track rarity based on auctions? If a game sucks and is valuable you'll see more people selling copies of it compared to another game that's less hard to find but way more fun.

Another point is where people are looking, are most people counting game stores as the wild or are they just checking thrifts, garage sales, and flea markets? If a game is valuable and people know about it, they might be more likely to sell their copies to game stores than selling it dirt cheap through other means. People might consider some games to be rarer than they actually are because they aren't looking in the right spot, if you can't find it cheap but a local store has 10 copies at any time priced at $80(which sell regularly) then it's not rare, it's just in demand.

I actually came across around 5 copies of Action 52 in the wild(they weren't all cheap but I still saw them for sale locally), yet there are plenty of R4s that I still haven't come across once.

[mobiusclimber]

The game stores around here all seem to really suck. The one I go to regularly (to laugh at the outrageous prices, mostly) never has anything really rare. I think the rarest game I've seen was the japanese version of Magical Chase (actually, I don't know if that's super rare or just htf and expensive). They'll have Contra Force but want $60+ for cart only. Pink Godzilla...erm, Gorilla... is the same way. I almost never see rare carts at any of the stores and the rarest stuff I DO come across has been on Craigslist.

[Pezcore343]

I think what's more important to rarity than how many are in existence is how many people are selling, aka out in the wild. If there are 100 copies of a game for example, all on ebay or in stores or with people looking to sell them, id say its less rare than something with 500 copies all in the hands of collectors who aren't looking to get rid of them anytime soon. Obviously with small numbers like these they're both rare, just making a point.

[Gameguy]

The game stores around here all seem to really suck. The one I go to regularly (to laugh at the outrageous prices, mostly) never has anything really rare. I think the rarest game I've seen was the japanese version of Magical Chase (actually, I don't know if that's super rare or just htf and expensive). They'll have Contra Force but want $60+ for cart only. Pink Godzilla...erm, Gorilla... is the same way. I almost never see rare carts at any of the stores and the rarest stuff I DO come across has been on Craigslist.
I agree with that, I've seen way more actual rare stuff on craigslist than in a game store. Someone even had a Japanese white developer's Game Gear complete in case. Even an actual game store was advertising regularly on craigslist and had a loose copy of Magical Chase. I asked what they wanted for it but I wasn't told an answer so I didn't bother to travel a few hours to get to the store. I asked what they wanted for it and was told "we want all old games for all systems". I couldn't get a straight answer from that guy and I asked a few times for the price. There were several other R7s and R8s listed by various people over the years on craigslist or kijiji. It really depends on the area though.

There was a store near me that had a couple R8s and other rare games, but finally closed as the prices were way too high. Loose NES games starting at $10, good ones starting at $20, etc. I didn't buy much there but there was rare stuff you could look at.


I think what's more important to rarity than how many are in existence is how many people are selling, aka out in the wild. If there are 100 copies of a game for example, all on ebay or in stores or with people looking to sell them, id say its less rare than something with 500 copies all in the hands of collectors who aren't looking to get rid of them anytime soon. Obviously with small numbers like these they're both rare, just making a point.
You're confusing rarity with overall value/demand. Something can be rare(not many in existence) and worthless, just as something can be common as dirt(many in existence) but valuable. Some games can be hard to find but they're still not rare, they're just in demand which is why they're not for sale so often. If you're talking about the value of a game instead of actual rarity, then yes, it's more important for how many games are available for sale rather than how many are in existence. If a game is in demand, the harder it is to find a copy for sale, the higher the value of it.

[mobiusclimber]

He's not talking about value or demand. Value is basically the monetary cost of an item. Demand is how many people want said item. What he's talking about IS rarity, but it's rarity based on a different scale than how many are in existence. I think tho that a lot of rarity guides DO take into account how many are available as well as how many were produced.

Think about it like this: Say a game manufacturer decides to junk all their unsold games. They may have produced thousands, but only sold a hundred. If they completely destroyed the rest of the amount that they produced, then that would make that game or games very rare.

[Gameguy]

Rarity is how many are currently in existance, not how many were originally produced. I know of Tetris for the Mega Drive, the game was already produced but was ordered destroyed before they were distributed(only some were saved).

The thing is nobody can be sure of how many copies of a game are actually out there, so most guides are really just estimates based on peoples experiences from different regions all put together. It's accurate enough to serve it's purpose, but it's not always accurate in all areas. Even with Gun-Nac, it's listed here at R5 but it was posted earlier in this thread that it's an R7 on NintendoAge.

I consider there to be a difference between how rare a game is, and how rare a game is to find for sale. How rare is a copy of Punch-out? vs. How rare is it to find a copy of Punch-Out at a thrift store? I don't come across the game too often in the wild but I don't consider it rare, it's just more in demand with a slightly higher value. I don't even see copies at game stores too often, I see the common games that nobody wants but hardly ever Punch-out.

[Landon]

So what you're saying is that using a bot/spider to troll through Ebay would offer more conclusive evidence of rarity than collectors discussing it as a group? I don't think it would be better either way, even if you remove the human element from collecting data for rarity.

Uh, yeah. Ebay is 100,000X better than "collectors discussing it as a group", simply because ebay reflects actual data and isn't liable to opinion, prejudice or exaggeration.

Given sample size across time, what's listed on ebay will generally correspond to what's "out there" and from the frequency of listings occurring, one can roughly gauge rarity in a totally quantifiable way.

Simple data scrapers with automated logic processes can resolve all this quite neatly. The only regret I have is that I didn't start it sooner so my sample size was larger, but so far, most 'rarity levels' corresponds with established anecdote, save for a few examples that cannot be explained away by anomaly or otherwise isolated reasons. It appears that some games are far more common than some think, while others are much scarcer than they're 'rated'. I couldn't care less about anecdotes from "in the wild"; anyone who cannot instantly and instinctively comprehend why ebay is immeasurably better for judging this stuff than a mosaic of peoples "personal experience" flat out sucks at logic.

The only real exception to this is what someone said earlier- mega-rare, holy grail type carts (NWC, for example) that might only transact once in a blue moon and often times, in private sales. Freak rarities aside, the rarity of almost everything else can be judged in this fashion.

[pseudonym]

Uh, yeah. Ebay is 100,000X better than "collectors discussing it as a group", simply because ebay reflects actual data and isn't liable to opinion, prejudice or exaggeration.

Given sample size across time, what's listed on ebay will generally correspond to what's "out there" and from the frequency of listings occurring, one can roughly gauge rarity in a totally quantifiable way.

Simple data scrapers with automated logic processes can resolve all this quite neatly. The only regret I have is that I didn't start it sooner so my sample size was larger, but so far, most 'rarity levels' corresponds with established anecdote, save for a few examples that cannot be explained away by anomaly or otherwise isolated reasons. It appears that some games are far more common than some think, while others are much scarcer than they're 'rated'. I couldn't care less about anecdotes from "in the wild"; anyone who cannot instantly and instinctively comprehend why ebay is immeasurably better for judging this stuff than a mosaic of peoples "personal experience" flat out sucks at logic.

The only real exception to this is what someone said earlier- mega-rare, holy grail type carts (NWC, for example) that might only transact once in a blue moon and often times, in private sales. Freak rarities aside, the rarity of almost everything else can be judged in this fashion.

Well, I'm glad that you posted again- despite my being a dick earlier I am genuinely interesting in your point of view even if I disagree with it.

What are these "anomalies" that you're talking about? If it's games that seem more common than it suggests in some rarity guide, it's been known to happen and often gets corrected in time. Despite how rare some game might appear to be, some games are simply more popular than others. Like Bubble Bobble 2 which is based on a popular series of games; some rarities like Color A Dino are shit and the only reason people seek them out is because they still need them; others are fairly innocuous like Fire 'N Ice, Swamp Thing, Race America, Pro Sport Hockey, Little Samson, etc and might not be picked up in favor of another more well known title.

These games just don't magically appear on Ebay, people have to buy them in the wild and if they choose to, sell them on Ebay or some other market for collectors.

About those mega-rare games: it's not just NWC carts, rarities like Stadium Events, Myriad/Caltron 6-1, the Panesian games... and lesser rares like Bonk, Flintstones 2, Little Samson etc, are sold in private deals. Data is bound to be skewered when for every one of these that end up on Ebay, there's another one that's being sold privately between two collectors. Just an example. And there are people that keep track of how many times a certain games comes up for auction as well as taking note of private sales, something you "conveniently" didn't bother to note when it was brought up.

We can discuss this all day long until we're blue in the face, I think the only true way we're going to find out how rare something is if the companies decide to release production runs / sales figures of these games, which is probably impossible. Not that I don't applaud what you're doing, if you're the person behind Video Game Price Charts, I don't think they way that rarities is decided now is going to change in the near future.

[Landon]

Well, I'm glad that you posted again- despite my being a dick earlier I am genuinely interesting in your point of view even if I disagree with it.

What are these "anomalies" that you're talking about? If it's games that seem more common than it suggests in some rarity guide, it's been known to happen and often gets corrected in time. Despite how rare some game might appear to be, some games are simply more popular than others. Like Bubble Bobble 2 which is based on a popular series of games; some rarities like Color A Dino are shit and the only reason people seek them out is because they still need them; others are fairly innocuous like Fire 'N Ice, Swamp Thing, Race America, Pro Sport Hockey, Little Samson, etc and might not be picked up in favor of another more well known title.

These games just don't magically appear on Ebay, people have to buy them in the wild and if they choose to, sell them on Ebay or some other market for collectors.

I think you're struggling with comprehending what I'm saying. Let me see if I can't simplify it for you.

Ebay will, at any given point in time, generally reflect the rarity of any given cartridge. While it isn't perfectly efficient (at any point in time), if the data is recorded and analyzed over a large sample size, the number of games listed over sample will generally correspond (@ ratio) with the number of games that exist in the first place, thus a meaningful "rarity" figure can be determined.

So, while (X) Color A Dinosaurs might be listed for sale on January 11th, 2010, and (Y) on January 19th, 2010, those examples are fragmentary and don't tell us much. However, when you add up enough fragments to create a meaningful sample size, rarer cartridges will exhibit a lower "rarity ratio" than more common carts. Relative scarcity can be gauged by the ratio between cartridges.

It isn't even that difficult to understand.


About those mega-rare games: it's not just NWC carts, rarities like Stadium Events, Myriad/Caltron 6-1, the Panesian games... and lesser rares like Bonk, Flintstones 2, Little Samson etc, are sold in private deals. Data is bound to be skewered when for every one of these that end up on Ebay, there's another one that's being sold privately between two collectors. Just an example. And there are people that keep track of how many times a certain games comes up for auction as well as taking note of private sales, something you "conveniently" didn't bother to note when it was brought up.

Private sales of all but the rarest of the rarest of the rare cartridges (Like NWC) are anecdotal, untraceable and statistically insignificant.. Feeble minds overemphasize anecdote. Don't fall into that trap.

As far as pricing goes, private sales are also liable to inefficient market factors (in that everything is derived from the opinions of two people, rather than arbitrated by the open market). In this regard, ebay is almost perfectly efficient whereas private sales are simply a reflection of a totally insignificant sample that only tells us what two people were thinking on any given day. Again, for the rarest of the rare examples, private sales are important as they're often the only data we have to go by, but for carts that can be found ten times over on the open market @ any given point in time, private sales are meaningless for purposes of analysis. Really, I'd suggest you research the precepts behind scientific polling and the margin of error, then get back to this discussion once you've boned up on the facts. A lot of what you're arguing "against" isn't even a relative matter of opinion. It's fact whether you like it or not.


Not that I don't applaud what you're doing, if you're the person behind Video Game Price Charts, I don't think they way that rarities is decided now is going to change in the near future.

I'm not the person behind Video Game Price Charts, but their system appears to be pretty decent (a bit different from my own) and it's awfully gracious of them to make it public. I wouldn't.

As far as how rarity levels are "decided", right now, it's pretty stupid and largely arbitrary, based on the opinions of a few people who are qualified only by an $8 domain name and having started a website that 'took'...

When a more efficient method for determining rarity is put forth, you can bet that collectors will quickly jettison the "opinion based" theories of old and adopt the more solid methodology... kinda like how all those 'collector price guides' of the 1990's almost immediately lost relevance in the face of a central market (ebay), so will arbitrary "rarity figures" once someone invests the time to do it scientifically rather than anecdotally. Ebay is the juggernaut of all this, as it creates a standardized, central market dynamic. Anyone selling for less than ebay will create an arbitrage opportunity for the buyer, anyone selling for more than ebay will have a hard time selling. Behold the power of a central market. From the central market we can gauge mean availability and from mean availability, we can determine price in relation to demand.

What amazes me is that considering how intelligent gamers are compared to the population at large, it's a bit surprising to see stone-age, voo-doo methodology still in use (and accepted!) to determine something so relevant to their spectrum of interest. It's like going into Silicon Valley and watching a bunch of programmers communicating with each other using smoke signals.

[Pezcore343]

Wow Landon, even though I HALF agree with you, you're being the biggest douche ever. Seriously, get off your damn pedestal and stfu.

[MarioMania]

What's the real value of Bonk's Adventure (cart only)on the NES??

I see the GB version on ebay for like or around $10..why is the NES version so in demand

[portnoyd]

Although I haven't seen the last page of comments develop, it's pretty clear that Landon thinks he's smarter than everyone else and can't be proven wrong. He'll take any hint he can to construe that you're agreeing with him. I think the case here is he's just trying to be right to satisfy an ego which demands he portray himself as the intelligent victor in the argument above the moronic losers. He's one of those people. His latest response to pseudonym reeks of 'How dumb are you that you don't get this', in the same way an adult tries to show linear algebra to a 4 year old.

EDIT: A little research into our subject shows that he was into real estate and now "web development", also known as "internet entrepreneur", also known as "unemployed". He's just using math analogies just to seem smarter than everyone else because he apparently can't stuff enough big words into his posts.

More research! This guy had this same argument with DP himself AND *me*. Behold:

http://www.digitpress.com/forum/showthread.php?t=55889

It would have been nice if he's wasn't such a dick this time as opposed to last time. You can almost see his tone go from opinionated but friendly and light, to forceful and condescending. What happened over those 5 years? Divorce? His career flopping out?

And regarding Jimmy Connors, you forget that DP rarity is over all systems. To call the game as on par with Crazy Climber on the 2600, a game that barely made it into stores, is lunacy. On a NES scale, a 7 is called for but not a shat higher. Of course, NintendoAge doesn't even agree with me and they call it a 6. Oopsie. But of course they don't just poll eBay so they're dead wrong, right?

So basically: extremely arrogant or monstrous troll - you decide, DPmerica. Either way, I hope he goes the fuck away. He probably will, rationalizing it as "I'm the smart one here and everyone else is not" and then go to NintendoAge or RFGeneration, where he'll get the same response and rationalize it the same way. Here's a hint: If everyone in the room won't stand anywhere near you, maybe it's you and not them.

Bonk's price has jumped significantly in the past 5 years. It's a solid HTF title but only the Bonk name and illusion of rarity has made it a cash money title. Loose cart will end up costing you anywhere from $50-$75.

[Pezcore343]

This may be a stupid question but what is HTF?

[portnoyd]

Hard to find.