how many chances would you give your 360?

[digitalpress]

Thought I'd pop in here just to add some facts to what appears to be a very subjective account of things in general.

1. RyanMurf does repairs at my store, but not of the 360 RROD/E74 variety. After trying every documented method he gave up.

2. About five months ago I was approached by a local businessman who owns a repair shop, claiming he could fix ANY 360. I wasn't entirely clear WHAT he was doing specifically at the time but after he performed a few successful fixes I signed him on. It has hardly been perfect - I'd estimate that 1 out of 4 or 5 "fixed" machines come right back in a few days. Our warranty on the fix is 60 days and from what I've seen they either work fine after the first week or they die right almost immediately.

3. My customers have been satisfied with the process. The longest wait is 2 weeks and if the fix doesn't take we offer to do it again (which I've since learned is an entirely different process) or they can get their money back.

4. If Ryan seems a little rambunctious just try to remember what you were like when you were 18. I'd rather he left it to me to represent my business and its services but I give him credit for even caring and moreso for his talents.

Please remember that whether you are "representing" Digital Press or bashing it that it is my livelihood you are discussing. I ask all of you as members of this community to please consider the consequences of your words in a public forum on my business' website.

[Daria]

Let's take a look at : http://www.digitpress.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1214774&postcount=9
Two years later, how'd that plan work out for you?

God, let's hope no one ever dredges up any of the dumbass things you said when you were 16.

:roll:

[Rob2600]

While Microsoft may be offering up the greatest extended warranty and repair service in the history of the electronics business, it doesn't change the fact that the technical failings of the 360 have not gone away regardless of any revisions that they've made. ... At this point it's not even an industry "joke" anymore, it's a melancholy expectation of nearly every 360 owner that their system will die in some fashion before it's expected lifespan.

Well put, Frankie. That's the point I've been trying to get across for the last year or two, which most people on here seem to ignore.

Yes, Microsoft is repairing 360s for free, for three years. Awesome. But what about when the three years are over and your 360 breaks? (I don't mean you specifically, Frankie.) Will you go through the hassle of selling your game collection? Or will you spend yet another several hundred dollars on a new 360, which will break after another few years? How much money will you pour into this defective product? How many times will you repeat this idiotic cycle?

And what about twenty years from now, when every new 360 console has been bought, played, and quite possibly broken. What will everyone do with their 360 game collection then? 30 million people will have shelves full of Xbox 360 games, but possibly no functioning consoles left to play them on.

So in the short term, Microsoft's warranty is great, but in the long term, all of your 360 games could be useless.


It's the Coleco Adam all over again, except in this case, a large, experienced company like Microsoft should've known better.

[Leo_A]

Considering I still have a fully functioning Coleco ADAM computer here, I'm little worried I'll have trouble finding working 360 consoles decades from now.

Buying and enjoying games on a console I enjoy isn't idiotic. The only thing approaching that that I saw was your post that put down everyone that has bought and enjoyed the console. Why you somehow think that 30 million 360 owners don't have a clue and that you somehow know better what they should do with their cash and entertainment time is beyond me.

Its a very easy equation for why we're 360 owners. We enjoy the console, the games, the services like XBL and XBLA, etc. We believe that the fun outweighs the hassles. I'm shocked you needed that spelled out for you and that it wasn't obvious, unless you just think 30 million 360 owners are fools and you're the only one with a clue? lol

And I doubt anyone is worried about your doomsday scenario of millions of consoles ceasing to be functional. There won't ever be any issues finding functioning 360's since only a extremely small percentage of people will be using them after the console generation ends. That's why its not difficult to buy operable Intellivisions despite the sucky controllers that have just become worse due to age and the overheating issues that plague many consoles. Yet I can spend all day at places like AtariAge's marketplace forum buying fully operable Intellivisions.

And I suspect (And hope) the console will be extensively hacked in the future after its discontinued commercially, erasing any DRM concerns with DLC, and hopefully a community will spring up offering repairs, spare parts, etc., much like what Best Electronics has done with 5200 controller parts.

[Rob2600]

Buying and enjoying games on a console I enjoy isn't idiotic. The only thing approaching that that I saw was your post that put down everyone that has bought and enjoyed the console. The only idiot is someone that thinks 30 million 360 owners don't have a clue and that he somehow knows better what they should do with your cash and entertainment time.

I didn't call anyone idiotic or put anyone down, I called the cycle idiotic. Don't be so eager to be offended.

[Leo_A]

In my defense, I toned that down through editing before you posted. I didn't mean to be so harsh.

And by calling the cycle idiotic of seeking repairs for a console, what does that say about the console owners that are instigating it? Sure sounded like you were calling people that willingly buy and enjoy the 360, despite the issues, as idiots to me.

[Frankie_Says_Relax]

Well put. That's the point I've been trying to get across for the last year or two, which most people on here seem to ignore.

Yes, Microsoft is repairing 360s for free, for three years. Awesome. But what about when the three years are over and your 360 breaks? Will you go through the hassle of selling your game collection? Or will you spend yet another several hundred dollars on a new 360, which will break after another few years? How much money will you pour into this defective product? How many times will you repeat this idiotic cycle?

And what about twenty years from now, when every new 360 console has been bought, played, and quite possibly broken. What will everyone do with their 360 game collection then? 30 million people will have shelves full of Xbox 360 games, but possibly no functioning consoles left to play them on.

So in the short term, Microsoft's warranty is great, but in the long term, all of your 360 games could be useless.


It's the Coleco Adam all over again, except in this case, a large, experienced company like Microsoft should've known better.


While I see your point ... I think you need to take into consideration that between negative press on the subject, and the speed and saturation by which such negative press can "spread" in this information era ... that there aren't as many clueless 360 owners today as there were 2 or 3 years ago. Sure, it's not absolute zero ... but the fact that MOST people could probably identify the term "RROD" (it could probably be a $1,000 question on Who Wants to be a Millionaire) means something.

I think that most people going in to a 360 purchase at this point in time either know what they're getting into or, if they don't - they will quickly get schooled through first hand experience (as even the newest 360s are prone to types of failure) as to what the "vicious cycle" is in being a 360 owner.

The short short is that if somebody, and I think that the demographic most vulnerable in this scenario is a first time console buyer, wants to get a new console and they do even the SMALLEST amount of research on the platform - any prospective 360 owner will find gigabytes of information on the web detailing the frustrations of the RROD and the typical experiences of Microsoft customer service (both good and bad).

It's like smoking. There's more than enough info out there detailing how bad it is for your health, but some people just like doing it.

Most of us really LIKE playing with our 360's. And with all the info out there we all know that they're NOT solid state hardware and likely won't last their expected lifespan ... but that doesn't stop us from enjoying those moments when they work.

In my history of six 360's I've only had to re-invest financially one time ... so it's not cutting into my pocket-book that much presently and my current unit is off-the-shelf new so I've got about 2 years left on a warranty ... but when that time is up ... if it does break down, as much as I love the thing I very well may take a break on XBOX hardware until the next console generation of the XBOX line. Who knows.

I don't think people who keep buying new 360's are "stupid" per se ... I think they're just more emotionally "invested" in the console than others who may be willing to look to alternatives in the current gen.

[Leo_A]

Unless you actively participate at videogame forums or read media associated with videogaming like IGN or print sources, I could see not knowing about this unless you stumbled upon something at Yahoo News or something similar about it on a slow news day.

None of my friends that play games actively participate in such things as videogame forums or read the many media sources that cover our hobby. I doubt any of them are aware of the RROD issue, despite gaming since they were young.

[Rob2600]

Frankie, good points. By the way, when I wrote "you" in my post, I wasn't referring specifically to you. It was just a generic "you." I just wanted to clarify. :)

And again, just to clarify, I didn't call anyone stupid. I guess "vicious cycle" is a less triggering phrase than "idiotic cycle." Either way, Microsoft has gotten millions of people stuck in a cycle of supporting a defective product. Good luck finding a fully functioning 360 ten years from now.

Like you wrote, enjoy the 360 while it lasts, but as you already know, don't expect it to last nearly as long as most other consoles.

[Frankie_Says_Relax]

Frankie, good points. By the way, when I wrote "you" in my post, I wasn't referring specifically to you. It was just a generic "you." I just wanted to clarify. :)

And again, just to clarify, I didn't call anyone stupid. I guess "vicious cycle" is a less triggering phrase than "idiotic cycle." Either way, Microsoft has gotten millions of people stuck in a cycle of supporting a defective product. Good luck finding a fully functioning 360 ten years from now.

Like you wrote, enjoy the 360 while it lasts, but as you already know, don't expect it to last nearly as long as most other consoles.

LOL, I'm sorry man, I didn't mean to imply that you called anybody stupid, I was just making that observation in my response completely independent of anything that you had said!

See how awesome totally civil debates/discussions can be?!?

THIS is what I love about this place and what I totally missed during my time off.


Unless you actively participate at videogame forums or read media associated with videogaming like IGN or print sources, I could see not knowing about this unless you stumbled upon something at Yahoo News or something similar about it on a slow news day.

None of my friends that play games actively participate in such things as videogame forums or read the many media sources that cover our hobby. I doubt any of them are aware of the RROD issue, despite gaming since they were young.

You might be right, but I'd like to believe that the bad press on this one has made more headlines than any other game console in history ... so even if only a small percent of the general non-hardcore-gaming public knows about the failings of the 360 that's a significant number in the big picture.

[Rob2600]

LOL, I'm sorry man, I didn't mean to imply that you called anybody stupid, I was just making that observation in my response completely independent of anything that you had said!

See how awesome totally civil debates/discussions can be?!?

THIS is what I love about this place and what I totally missed during my time off.

Sorry, Leo_Ames got me all paranoid now. :)

Welcome back! We missed you!

[Frankie_Says_Relax]

Sorry, Leo_Ames got me all paranoid now. :)

Welcome back! We missed you!

Thanks man, that means a lot.

Glad we had NAVA during the down-time.

[garagesaleking!!]

this thread is out of control, i have had my 360 e74 on me once about a year ago, i still believe the 360 is much better than the wii and ps3 for my needs, if my 360 broke again i would send it in again for repair, i would not be happy, but id do it and move on. As long as microsoft pays for it, ill be happy. I can just not game or play pc games till its fixed.

[Leo_A]

Sorry, Leo_Ames got me all paranoid now. :)

Welcome back! We missed you!

Sorry I got you all paranoid somehow, I was honestly just puzzled why it appeared you didn't understand why people were putting up with the technical issues of the 360, or that you thought (The way I intepreted your message) that 360 owners were just idiotic and didn't know better than to keep supporting a defective brand of gaming console.

Anyways, I apologize for coming up with a rude response, your welcome to your opinions either way, disagreeing with someone is never an excuse to be rude in return.

[Greg2600]

I think Microsoft will have to continue extending the warranties, because there doesn't seem to be a new console on the way for them, or Nintendo or Sony either. They're looking to move into motion capture like the Wii. So here again I just don't understand why Microsoft hasn't wised up and redesigned the system so that the RROD doesn't happen. I haven't followed it lately, is the main culprit still the graphics processor heatsink?

[kupomogli]

After what Rob2600 said.

We'll be going to museums, come across one with a 360. The panel/tablet will end up reading "The last 360 known to still work."

I wonder if since 360 discs will be useless in the late future, then will they fill up landfills like E.T. is rumored to have? Either that or will Microsoft actually create a system that doesn't break down and is compatible?

[Rickstilwell1]

I know how many chances Vegeta would give his Xbox 360:

It's Over 9000!!!!!!!

But myself, ah I haven't gone out and replaced my Pioneer Laseractive and it only died once. I still have it though for display and maybe some electronics person could take it apart and put a good custom power supply in it that doesn't fry so easily. It died while I was playing a Genesis game!!!! I don't even have any LD games.

This makes me think that I wouldn't be spending the money to buy a new 360 until it is old and cheap either. I hardly ever use my 360 Elite so I don't think mine will die until way after the warranty is up. By then, average Joe's will know how to crack it open and refurbish it like people do with NES systems today.

Oh and I just remembered: another system that seemed to die easily was the Atari Jaguar CD. I'm very lucky as my 3rd one actually worked. AVGN only bought two and they didn't work. I guess 3rd time's the charm with Jag CDs.

Then there's dead sound capacitors and screens on Game Gear, dead sound capacitors on TurboDuos (luckily I'm not there yet). DREs on any front loading CD-based system if too much dust gets in there and you don't come across a high quality CD lens cleaner disc.

[j_factor]

Then there's dead sound capacitors and screens on Game Gear

I think that might be the #1 reason only a small handful of Game Gear games are worth anything.

[Solertia]

How many chances? Well, as long as I keep getting a free one back from Microsoft, it can RROD all it wants.

[T3chnologyGuy]

Im on my second one and if it breaks im getting a new one just because i have to many games to just through it away.

[Icarus Moonsight]

The early adopters were blindsided... but, those who took the plunge after, I have to wonder about them. Best I can figure is the problems were such a scale that they were certain it would be corrected. For once, it's a benefit to me being a broke-ass bastard. LOL

[IronBuddha]

My experience with friends I know have been the complete opposite. 4 People I know that own PS3's have had problems with their system. I know quite a few more people that own 360's and never had any problems with them. I'm the last one out of all of us to buy a 360, I bought a 360 because of the experiences with people I know. I've had my 360 for a year now, no problems yet and my friends still have no issues.

[The 1 2 P]

As long as they have the best games this generation(and they do imo) then I will keep supporting them. Theres just too much fun to be had on the 360. My Wii gets very little play and a PS3 won't be a system I own until it drops in price and gets more than 3 exclusive games I want to play.

[Chemdawg]

as long as they keep replacing it for free. i got a 360 when they firsted came out, and about after a month or so it was dead, i sent it in got a new one for free and didnt take more than a week and i've never had a problem with it since.

[PapaStu]

The early adopters were blindsided... but, those who took the plunge after, I have to wonder about them. Best I can figure is the problems were such a scale that they were certain it would be corrected. For once, it's a benefit to me being a broke-ass bastard. LOL

Yes they were blindsided, and thats part of the reason MS started to repay those who had to pay for initail service done on their broken 360's.

I got mine a year after launch and there were enough problems to know that I needed to get a warranty. Best 50 bucks i've ever spent on a warranty. No stupidity on my part, no i'm sure this will be corrected by the time I got my system. I just acted accordingly. Since then i've used it twice, gotten two 'new' systems and am covered through this xmas. Worst thing thats happend to me? Some gouged discs, that I fixed and being without a videogame system for about 3 weeks one time, one week the second time and I got 2 free months of XBL for my 'lost' time as well. Hardly a huge deal. It's not like I don't have other systems that I can play, or even do the better thing like going outside to play and enjoying time with friends and family.

Remember, most of us spend too much time online to not know about the problems (or to see the early fervor over them) to be totally caught with our pants down. However now its really well known, and there are measures in place that handle a good percentage of the problems the systems get.