Driving games, argh

[Nebagram]

This originally started out as a review of Fuel (bottom line: half-finished, great concept but flawed execution, 5/10) but has instead turned into a rant on my absolute least favourite videogame trope of them all.

Why oh god why does the player's car always have to start at the back of the grid? Have developers never heard of qualifying sessions? Hell even a random draw would be acceptable. I'm not really keen on hearing any responses along the lines of 'it's more of a challenge to fight your way through' because defending a lead against a good AI driver should be equally challenging, if not more so, than ploughing through 15 sunday drivers.

Irritating, irritating, irritating. :(

[Poofta!]

i agree with you. whats even more frustrating how FORZA ranks it by car type (the worse rating your car has, the further back you start).

this has all bothered me since the ps1 days of GT1 & R4. after giving it a lot of thought i think its basically because it is extremely hard to code a good racing AI and make it challanging yet fair. the experienced human player is almost always better than the AI itself, so the AI often "cheats" and this may explain it getting the upper hand in start position. Racing is a sport[?] that is won or lost mainly by human error or "skill" (characterized by fear, or knowledge of the vehicle/road etc) these things would be difficult to simulate in an AI without making it seem either too easy or impossibly hard.

either way i agree its pretty annoying. but racing games are still one of my favorite genres. definitely top 3.

[G-Boobie]

Burnout Paradise.

Best racing game devised by man.

[coreys429]

Ultimate Driving Game to annoy anyone....Desert Bus and that was just a mini game for an unreleased Sega CD game.

[otaku]

I love forza and I love racing games and though it sucks to start at back (once you start winning you usually start further up) if your good enough you usually don't have to sweat it to much :P

[ProgrammingAce]

There's an inherent issue with designing AI for racing games. If the AI is skilled enough to match the player turn for turn, then the AI will be far too difficult. If you program the AI to make minor mistakes throughout the race, then the AI will be half a lap back by the time the race is finished.

The only real answer is to base the AI's skill as a probability depending on it's distance from the player. Starting the player in the back of the pack ensures that the AI has a chance to interact with the player and that the game isn't a complete walk in the park.

Generally, racing games aren't all that challenging, at least not compared to other genres. Making a "challenging" AI usually makes the game too difficult for the average player.

[otaku]

AND THAT IS why online play is a must for racing games!

[kupomogli]

Test Drive Unlimited.

Best racing game devised by man.

Fixed. :)

[cityside75]

Test Drive Unlimited.

Fixed. :)

Really? I've seen this game cheap a few times, but I wasn't sure it was any good.

[kupomogli]

It's worth it. Easily the best driver ever created. It's an open world simcade type game that takes place on one of the islands of Hawaii. The 360 version is the best version with the ability to create your own races and play those races or open rooms with other races online, but it also includes Motorcycles. The PS2 and PSP version only have where you can race to a single checkpoint. None of the games have offline multiplayer unfortunately and the PS2/PSP online sucks for the game, but thankfully the game has a huge amount of one player content that makes it far more worth it even if you were to play one player on the 360 and never were to go online.

I also think the PSP version is by far the best portable racing game, however one problem with the PSP version is that sometimes(very very rarely,) the area won't load quick enough when you drive through and then you'll basically run right into the invisible wall that's created. You'd really only notice it because, while it might happen offline, it mainly happens online and that's still where it's very very rare.

[The 1 2 P]

Speed Racer for the Snes is definitely one of the worst racing games ever. Are you a bad enough dude to endure endless amounts of pain trying to complete it?

As for good racing games, nothing will ever surpass the brilliance that is Burnout 3. Awesome single player mode, awesome online multiplayer modes and an excellent example of how to make a game fun, regardless of genre. Burnout Revenge and Paradise are both fun too but they can't touch Burnout 3. Nothing can imo.

[cityside75]

It's worth it. Easily the best driver ever created. It's an open world simcade type game that takes place on one of the islands of Hawaii. The 360 version is the best version with the ability to create your own races and play those races or open rooms with other races online, but it also includes Motorcycles. The PS2 and PSP version only have where you can race to a single checkpoint. None of the games have offline multiplayer unfortunately and the PS2/PSP online sucks for the game, but thankfully the game has a huge amount of one player content that makes it far more worth it even if you were to play one player on the 360 and never were to go online.

I also think the PSP version is by far the best portable racing game, however one problem with the PSP version is that sometimes(very very rarely,) the area won't load quick enough when you drive through and then you'll basically run right into the invisible wall that's created. You'd really only notice it because, while it might happen offline, it mainly happens online and that's still where it's very very rare.

I wanted to follow up on this, since I picked up TD Unlimited for the PC recently for $1 on a Half Price books clearance. I dragged out my dusty Thrustmaster Nascar Pro Force Feedback wheel and after tinkering with some settings and turning off all driver assists I have to say that TDU truly is one of the best driving games I've ever played!

One criteria that I've measured driving games by through the years is how realistically the cars handle when you're NOT pushing them to the limit. By this measure, very few driving games have ever felt entirely realistic to me, since everything from shifting gears to steering feels very unrealistic at "normal" speeds in most driving games. This is where TDU is different. I put my wife and my father at the wheel of TDU and after just a few minutes they were both cruising around Oahu very comfortably and not slamming into buildings or skidding off the side of the road like they typically do in racing games.

Aside from the driving dynamic, the force feedback is the most realistic I've felt, mimicking dips and juts in the road and giving you that squirrely feeling when you are really flying. I also love the setting and the scale of the game. A 30 mile drive into the mountains really will feel like a journey with tons of scenery variety and road types.

I'm glad I remembered this thread and picked up the game. Does anyone have the 360 FF wheel and this game? Is it a similar experience?

[robotriot]

I have a wheel for the 360 and TDU. Unfortunately, the D-Pad is broken on the wheel, which means you can't access the map in TDU, making it unplayable. Still, already playing with a regular controller is an awesome experience. Highly recommended!

[kupomogli]

Glad you like TDU. Game is amazing and gives you by far the most value for your money for any racing game I've ever played.

I recently played the GT5 time trial demo and in my opinion even though it's realistic, the realism is just too far out there. If you hit the grass, the amount of speed you'll max out at is 9mph. That's quite a bit unrealistic. Also from a complete stop, having your tires turned while pressing on the gas you spin out uncontrollably. Now I've never drove any actual fastest sports cars, but from what I have driven I feel that the "realism" in GT is a bit ridiculous.

When it comes to the most realistic driving game. I actually feel that Grand Theft Auto 4 feels to have the most realistic driving mechanics. TDU does have some driving mechanics that play off as it being slightly simcade, but for the most part TDU is near realistic. TDU is the better driving game because when it comes to driving it has more to offer. GTA4 offers much more than driving though.

If TDU2 ever gets released that's going to be a first day purchase for me. I'm not one who purchases accessories to get a realistic experience, but I probably will once that game comes out. Good thing that the PS3 uses USB, meaning I can purchase a USB wheel and if I ever decide to use it on computer games then I'll be set.

[The 1 2 P]

This is yet another reminder that Burnout 3(the best arcadey racing game ever) will cease to exist on April 14th. Well, the online play will cease to exist:(