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Family Computer
11-04-2009, 07:55 PM
I am interested in getting more knowledge about retro computers. I was hoping we could get some model recommendations for each type of computer, and I can update this first post with all the findings.

Maybe something like: Minimum Recommended, Overall Recommendation, and Rare/Overkill Recommendation

Anyway I will list some platforms and add the information in here...



Amiga

Apple II

Atari 8-BIT

Atari ST

Commodore 64

FM Towns

Macintosh Classic

MSX

PC8801

X68000

AB Positive
11-04-2009, 08:36 PM
Amiga:

Ideally you want an a1200 with a decent hard drive and some FastRAM which allows you to use the wonders of "WHDLoad" - a way to play disk images right off the hard drive. No swapping 13 disks for Scumm games!

Barring that, if one is like me and can only find an a500, 2MB FastRAM, 1MB chip and an external hard drive should do most of the heavy lifting. If you can find an accelerator too you're golden.



Atari 8-bit

This one kind of comes down to preference. However you get there though you want a SIO port and at least 64K of ram.

The sleek and slim 600XL can be modded up to 64K with three solder wires and a couple 4464 ram chips - easily found for around $2-3 bucks a chip.

800XL is a wider model compared to the 600XL, has a few extra ports and 64K standard. This model is considered to have the best keyboard compared to the XE series. Very easy to mod up to 1MB RAM, RGB video, etc...

65XE - a 64K machine in a smaller form factor, and looks much like an Atari ST. Pretty easy to mod but might want to consider replacing the keyboard.

130XE - 128K in the XE series and can be modded to the moon. Still - might want to replace that keyboard...


I personally like an 600 or 800 XL series, but you definitely want a SIO2PC solution so you can use software to load disk images right to the computer. Very cool.

Soviet Conscript
11-04-2009, 10:54 PM
Amiga - like AB said your best bet is probibly the 1200 solely because with WHDload you can pretty much play any Amiga game includeing the AGA stuff it also has a pcmcia slot for wireless internet.

you will get by just fine though with a A500 and 1meg ram. most games were made for this setup

C64 - well, there basicly all the same. there were only a few games that were made for the C128 and nothing that was stellar.

i prefer the C64c, its the c64 i grew up with. most people dislike its look since it lost that iconic breadbox form factor. i beleive they are identical though as far as specs and compatibility

Apple II - my vote goes to the Apple IIgs. vitually 100% compatible with all the older apple II software and it plays its own apple IIgs games. very solid and easy to upgrade computer.

macintosh - mac SE/30 it has a b/w monitor but very fast and expandible

kedawa
11-04-2009, 11:38 PM
I'm not sure, but I think the C64c may be slightly inferior to the C64 because it uses a cheaper version of the audio chip, or it isn't socketed, or something like that. It uses different versions of the SID, VIC, and I/O chips, at any rate.

Arkhan
11-05-2009, 12:13 AM
Amiga: An A4000 fully tricked out since it will do anything you want ever. If you are poor (*cough* smart *cough*), an A1200 properly equipped with harddisk, OS3.9, and ram expansion is equally capable. WHDLoad = <3 from there on out. The A4000 suurreeeee is sexy though.

Apple II: The IIGS, like Soviet said. There is no need for anything else!

Atari 8-BIT: 800XL is pretty much the good one IMHO. Its sturdy, has a nice feel, and is expandable.

Atari ST: ew! :-D

Commodore 64: A C128 w/ two 1571 drives will give you full range over everything Commodore related. This includes the extra RAM to have SID music in the Ultima games. Plus, the design of it is better than the breadbin, and the 1571s look and work better than a 1541.

FM Towns: Isn't there just the one model?

Macintosh Classic: Frig. I can't even remember. How classic do you mean by classic? The all in one clunkerboxes?

MSX: If you can't find an Panasonic MSX Turbo R FS-A1GT cheap, you want either a Philips NMS8250 (European) or a Sony HB-F1XD/XDJ/XDJ II/XV (Japanese)/Sanyo Wavy PHC70FD. These will play the widest range of games. The Euro models require an MSX-MUSIC or MSX-AUDIO cartridge to have FM sound.

PC8801: Get a PC9800 instead! :onfire:

X68000: The X68030 model. Its got the fastest CPU and RAM, and looks cool as hell.


I'm not sure, but I think the C64c may be slightly inferior to the C64 because it uses a cheaper version of the audio chip, or it isn't socketed, or something like that. It uses different versions of the SID, VIC, and I/O chips, at any rate.

It has an 8580 SID instead of a 6581 SID, which has some changes (fixes) that make digitized sfx from the 6581 era sound quiet.

Its actually better than the regular breadbin in general though.

Jorpho
11-05-2009, 09:39 AM
Didn't the IIGS have a non-standard serial port? Rather challenging to get anything done with an Apple II without a serial port, no?

j_factor
11-05-2009, 12:41 PM
For the Atari ST, there's really no reason to bother with the later (and mostly less common / more expensive) models. Very few games actually utilized the better hardware, and they tend to have issues running some older games. A 1040ST is all you need.

For Amiga, the 4000T is the "ultimate" model and a source of pride to anyone who owns one, but really, you don't need it. An A1200 will do almost anything you need. Even the CPU upgrades aren't exactly necessary. Another option that's great in theory is a CD32 console with appropriate additions. Be ready to spend a lot of money.

For Macintosh Classic, I hope you're not referring to the models that were actually named "Macintosh Classic". They sucked. IMO the original monochrome Macs are simply not worth it. The Macintosh II line was better, although it doesn't have a lot of noteworthy games. The LC line is similar, but has Apple II compatibility, which may interest you (although I'd just as soon get a IIgs). The best of the 68x era is the IIfx. Don't bother with the Quadras, they had issues. The Power Macs had a backwards-compatibility mode to run the 68k-based software, so you may not want to bother at all. The early Power Macs were great for the time, but I don't know that there's any reason to get one over a later Power Mac. I know that the final Power Macs in 2006 with OSX still had Classic to run older applications, but I'm not sure how high compatibility is, and that's not really a classic computer anymore.

Jorpho
11-05-2009, 12:48 PM
Don't bother with the Quadras, they had issues.This is the first I've heard of such things.

The early Power Macs were great for the time, but I don't know that there's any reason to get one over a later Power Mac.You could do all kinds of things with the PCI Power Macs that you couldn't do with the early ones.

This is a useful guide to undesirable Macintosh models:
http://lowendmac.com/roadapples/index.shtml

j_factor
11-05-2009, 01:55 PM
This is the first I've heard of such things.

Not so much the fault of the Quadra itself, but the 68040 processors they used. I recall that they had some sort of issue with memory, and Apple's fix for it slowed them down.

JustRob
11-05-2009, 03:08 PM
For the Macintosh info, spend all the time you can link clicking at Low End Mac. I lived on that site for so long I became one of its writers.

Soviet Conscript
11-07-2009, 12:31 AM
Didn't the IIGS have a non-standard serial port? Rather challenging to get anything done with an Apple II without a serial port, no?

why?.

Jorpho
11-07-2009, 11:34 AM
Without a serial port, you are pretty much limited to whatever disks you can find "in the wild". A serial port can be used to transfer data from a PC.

Volcanon
11-07-2009, 11:48 AM
For macs -

OS6 - Mac IIfx
OS7 - Early powermacs or a quadra
OS9 - The G3 iMacs are really good machines and dirt cheap. Otherwise the G3 towers.

Volcanon
11-07-2009, 11:50 AM
The iMacs have also got USB, so you can use modern printers and memory sticks.

Getting data on-off a mac without a cdrom is a turbo pain in the butt. Do you really want to mess with floppies? Those buggers failed constantly.

Soviet Conscript
11-07-2009, 12:19 PM
Without a serial port, you are pretty much limited to whatever disks you can find "in the wild". A serial port can be used to transfer data from a PC.

ah, yes, good point

but can't you just write the games to floppies on a pc and transfer that way?

maybe i'm just used to the hard way. i never got my serial cable transfer methed working on my amiga so when i have to do things between the 2 i have to burn everything to a CD and transfer that way.

Ze_ro
11-07-2009, 01:45 PM
For Amiga, the 4000T is the "ultimate" model and a source of pride to anyone who owns one, but really, you don't need it. An A1200 will do almost anything you need. Even the CPU upgrades aren't exactly necessary. Another option that's great in theory is a CD32 console with appropriate additions. Be ready to spend a lot of money.
The interesting thing I find about the various Amiga models is that almost all of them are useful in their own way. The 500/600 is a good entry level system for people who just want to buy disk games and play them... the 2000/3000 are interesting for their expansion options, and work nicely with WHDLoad... the 1200 is probably the best choice, mostly due to it's price, availability of expansions, and AGA chipset... and the 4000 combines all the best features of the 1200 (except the price part!) with the expansion capabilities of the 2000/3000 line. Even the CDTV and CD32 are interesting and useful in their own ways.

For someone just starting out though, I always recommend the 1200. The only major downside I find with the 1200 is lack of RAM. The built-in RAM isn't enough to run WHDLoad well (some games work, but many need more RAM, and having even more would allow you to pre-load stuff), and you can't expand the RAM without some sort of expansion card.


The Power Macs had a backwards-compatibility mode to run the 68k-based software, so you may not want to bother at all.
How reliable is this? I currently have a Mac Centris 610 that I've upgraded quite a bit (Full 68040, ethernet card, CD-ROM, video ram, etc)... I had always planned to "round out" my old Mac setup with a PowerPC machine (probably an iMac). But is there even any point in this, or would it just be easier all around to get an iMac and dump my Centris?


Without a serial port, you are pretty much limited to whatever disks you can find "in the wild". A serial port can be used to transfer data from a PC.
Well, there are always other ways. Personally, I use my above-mentioned Mac to write Apple II disks.

As for the original topic... I highly recommend the C-128 over any other model of C-64. They're a good bit harder to find, but they have a huge amount of built in features that can't really be done so well on the C-64 (at least, not without tons of add-ons)... CP/M mode, 80 column mode, built-in machine language monitor, improved drive access when combined with a 1571. The only downside I've ever really heard against the 128 is that people claim the SID chip in it is inferior to the regular 64... but honestly, I can't tell the difference, and unless you're a serious audiophile, I don't think you will either.

As for the Atari 8-bit line, I've always been partial to the XEGS myself. It's basically a 65XE in a different case, but it makes all the difference as far as I'm concerned. I've always liked the styling of the case, and the detachable keyboard means that you can essentially use the machine as a console if you prefer (I always present this option to console people who otherwise ignore the A8's as "computers"). As far as I know, the XEGS still has all the expansion ports you'd expect from an A8 computer. Ultimately, the 130XE is probably the better machine, but I think you'd be hard pressed to actually put it's advantages to good use.

--Zero

JustRob
11-07-2009, 02:16 PM
How reliable is this? I currently have a Mac Centris 610 that I've upgraded quite a bit (Full 68040, ethernet card, CD-ROM, video ram, etc)... I had always planned to "round out" my old Mac setup with a PowerPC machine (probably an iMac). But is there even any point in this, or would it just be easier all around to get an iMac and dump my Centris?


Well, there are always other ways. Personally, I use my above-mentioned Mac to write Apple II disks.

--Zero

ANY Power PC running ANY version of the classic Mac OS can run ANY program designed for ANY classic mac. How's *that* for backwards compatability? The only trick is being able to get the software onto the mac. I have an inherited tangerine iMac I use for running older mac stuff. I can transfer to it via CD/DVD or USB stick, or direct from the network/internet via ethernet or Airport wireless. For floppies...well, unless I find a USB floppy drive, I'm stuck finding disk images.

For both OS 7ish era useage and Apple II backwards compatibility, any of the 24-bit "dirty" LC series (including Performas, Quadras and regular old LCs) can use the Apple II card that was designed just for these machines. It's basically an Apple IIe on a card. Just make sure you find the Y-cable for disk/joystick usage, otherwise you won't be able to connect a Disk II drive to it.

AB Positive
11-07-2009, 02:47 PM
For both OS 7ish era useage and Apple II backwards compatibility, any of the 24-bit "dirty" LC series (including Performas, Quadras and regular old LCs) can use the Apple II card that was designed just for these machines. It's basically an Apple IIe on a card. Just make sure you find the Y-cable for disk/joystick usage, otherwise you won't be able to connect a Disk II drive to it.

O rly?

How pricey is it to accomplish this as I have an LC 520 :)

Soviet Conscript
11-07-2009, 07:44 PM
The interesting thing I find about the various Amiga models is that almost all of them are useful in their own way. The 500/600 is a good entry level system for people who just want to buy disk games and play them... the 2000/3000 are interesting for their expansion options, and work nicely with WHDLoad... the 1200 is probably the best choice, mostly due to it's price, availability of expansions, and AGA chipset... and the 4000 combines all the best features of the 1200 (except the price part!) with the expansion capabilities of the 2000/3000 line. Even the CDTV and CD32 are interesting and useful in their own ways.

For someone just starting out though, I always recommend the 1200. The only major downside I find with the 1200 is lack of RAM. The built-in RAM isn't enough to run WHDLoad well (some games work, but many need more RAM, and having even more would allow you to pre-load stuff), and you can't expand the RAM without some sort of expansion card.


you do like me and buy or make a towerized A1200. you can probibly put one together for cheaper then buying a stock 4000T and more powerful in some respects

JustRob
11-07-2009, 09:15 PM
O rly?

How pricey is it to accomplish this as I have an LC 520 :)

Not too bad price-wise, it's more of a waiting game really.

There are always a couple of the cards on ebay at any given moment, though they rarely have the cable. Then you just have to get yourself a Disk ][ drive, some floppies, and off you go!

Or, you could just do what the rest of us do and disk image it, though getting the images to the machine to actually play is harder with the II card vs a real Apple II.

Jorpho
11-07-2009, 09:43 PM
Well, there are always other ways. Personally, I use my above-mentioned Mac to write Apple II disks.Well, in that case you'd also need either a 5.25" drive for the Mac or a 3.5" drive for the Apple II - neither of which seem particularly common.

It occurs to me that a Mockingboard (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mockingboard) would be nice to have for hardcore Apple II users, but actually I don't know how much software really used it.

InsaneDavid
11-07-2009, 09:54 PM
Without a serial port, you are pretty much limited to whatever disks you can find "in the wild". A serial port can be used to transfer data from a PC.

Correct, but you can buy a cable that works for the IIgs and the IIc at RetroFloppy or make one yourself. Much easier to do with a IIe and a Super Serial Card however. ADTPro info for it here (http://adtpro.sourceforge.net/connectionsserial.html#MiniDIN8).

As for the Mockingboard, one was inside my Enhanced IIe and it's fun to screw around with. In the big box of diskettes that came with the computer were a couple things written for it, pretty cool simulated voice sounds.

JustRob
11-08-2009, 08:39 PM
Correct, but you can buy a cable that works for the IIgs and the IIc at RetroFloppy or make one yourself. Much easier to do with a IIe and a Super Serial Card however. ADTPro info for it here (http://adtpro.sourceforge.net/connectionsserial.html#MiniDIN8).


I second ADTPro. There are multiple vectors for transferring app/game data to a real Apple II with this app, it's cross-platform, and it can even bare metal boot it for you if you don't yet have a Dos 3.3 or ProDOS diskette.

Ed Oscuro
11-08-2009, 10:33 PM
X68000

X68000: The X68030 model. Its got the fastest CPU and RAM, and looks cool as hell.
I'm not aware of any gaming software that makes use of it. The XVI with regular 5.25" floppies is all most people will need: 2MB RAM at the least, 10 / 16 MHz switch for faster software. There are some games that would definitely have benefited from the higher specs of the 68030 and more RAM, like Gunship I believe, or Geograph Seal, or whatever other games were out there. The choppy nature of these games seems inherent, and you shouldn't be able to boost the resolution.

Myself...hmm, I have a Pro (desktop format, expandable), disassembled X68000 Ace HD (black) with busted monitor, and an XVI.

As Blue Lander also said recently, a lot of the X68000 software consists of arcade ports. Not a lot of original software, though it has the legendary Akumajo Dracula from '93 and Nemesis '90 Kai. It may be best just to go for arcade PCBs if one is looking for specific games that got arcade releases, depending on the price of the PCB. You'd probably save some money, on the whole, going with X68000 given how ubiquitous and cheap some ports of specialized arcade games are, i.e. Space Harrier or Thunder Blade; of course controllers are usable across many different games, games like Pac-Land have their own dedicated controller but you shouldn't have to use them and it's still a money and especially savings over arcade setups. Konami games tend to be more expensive, but so are the PCBs.

Funny story: After paying out the nose for the XVI, my source then comes up with an X68030 in like condition. Of course he probably had no idea it was coming, so...

FM Towns:
There's a whole ton of configurations to choose from here.

FM Towns Marty 1 & 2: I'm told the difference is just cosmetic. Used as a home console. Might not be compatible with all software; reportedly you may need a floppy drive for some games.

FM Towns Car Marty: Used for a GPS system, but can be pressed into service as a close analogue to a Marty. Can be used on a regular television with a special cable. Has ports on the back for floppy and keyboard (mouse as well I think). Seems overhyped due to its supposed rarity without promising new features. I like the form factor though (integrated carrying handle!).

FM Towns II - seems more like a complete hardware rev, i.e. more powerful processor and so on. Mine seems to be a small '95-era Macintosh-form slim "monitor pedal" desktop, and a monitor to match that. Others include a "classic Mac" all-in-one form factor machine with integrated monitor. Should be compatible with everything of note. I haven't started testing / playing my software on that system though.

Note: I have seen TV tuners for both X68000 and FM Towns. They may have some use for playing on a television.

Keep in mind that the FM Towns series is also home to a lot of arcade ports, so if that is your focus Blue Lander's notes about the uselessness of such a system applies again with MAME and superguns around. After the enthusiasm wears off, what do you have that you can't get elsewhere? The system shines with RPGs and adventure games though - not the H-game material the system is infamous for, but ports of famous games from Lucasarts, Origin Systems, and some others. It's got the best version of Loom, some Ultima games with CD voice acting (!) and other fun stuff. Ultima Underworld (I think both of them) adds a FPS element. Not too shabby, but it seems only sellers who don't know what they have will let these titles go cheaply.

Many of the arcade ports run better on original hardware. Hishou Zame (Flying Shark or Sky Shark) has amazingly bad video modes on a TV. Raiden (as Raiden Densetsu) is squeezed into a smaller space than normal. You've got craptastic CD music in most games that's either arcade plus echo, or "enhanced:" hardly beyond the quality of an X68000 with Roland synthesizer plugged in, and usually far worse than arcade original (although I think that Blandia fares pretty well on FM Towns). On the other hand, awesome music remixes seem to be the only saving grace for Galaxy Force II. Still, the music was worth the entry fee IMO.

I still love the FM Towns games in general - nicest game artwork available outside of game flyers and the original game cabinets, for instance. It has a fairly beefy CPU as well; Ving, CRI, and whoever was putting out Taito ports seemed to put a good amount of resources into programming for this system, and they also should've had a little extra over the 68000 to play with.

Mac Classic
So many models to choose from - find games first, then think about a model. If it's a non-Apple II-line game, you should be able to make do with the '95-era Macintosh Performas or similar running System 7.6.1, which is about the time they switched to the PPC. I have about three or four Macs from that era. For Macintosh IIc (maybe up to IIe?) there is also the system-on-a-chip that plugs into the Processor Direct Slot on some systems. I don't have one of those, unfortunately.

Arkhan
11-09-2009, 02:24 AM
If youre going to get a 68000 you might as well get the beefed up one incase you decide to do something besides play games on it. They all cost out the ass anyways half the time. lol

plus 680xx assembly is awesometime

Jorpho
11-09-2009, 08:17 AM
incase you decide to do something besides play games on it.Like what, exactly? Use some obscure Japanese application program? Browse the Internet with some poorly-supported outdated web browser?

AB Positive
11-09-2009, 09:01 AM
Hey, if you can go on IRC on an A8, why not put a X68000 online? :D

ubikuberalles
11-09-2009, 10:35 AM
I'll just touch on a few:

Atari 8-bit: Can't go wrong with the 800XL.
Atari ST - I prefer the 1040 STE although I'm not familiar with all the ST models.
Apple II - I like the Apple IIgs the best.

Ze_ro
11-09-2009, 01:04 PM
you do like me and buy or make a towerized A1200. you can probibly put one together for cheaper then buying a stock 4000T and more powerful in some respects
Probably cheaper than a 4000... but certainly not cheap in a general sense! For anyone other than a power user, I'd say you're perfectly well off with just a regular '030 accelerator, which should fit just fine in the trapdoor slot without having to gut the entire computer.

I know there are much faster accelerators available, but anything that you can't do with an '030 is probably best done on your regular computer anyways.

--Zero

Arkhan
11-09-2009, 03:18 PM
Like what, exactly? Use some obscure Japanese application program? Browse the Internet with some poorly-supported outdated web browser?

I was thinking more like programming, mods, experimenting....those obscure Japanese programs aren't really as much of a problem if you can read them though....

plus when you're talking old-computer you're automatically talking obscure and or poorly supported software with no actual use in 2009 most of the time.

most people arent buying these things to replace their WinXP desktops.

Jorpho
11-09-2009, 03:27 PM
most people arent buying these things to replace their WinXP desktops.Indeed, they're probably using them to play games. :hmm:

Ed Oscuro
11-09-2009, 06:40 PM
Is there anything stopping one from getting a Pro and swapping out the CPU?

Well, maybe that's a question I'll be better prepared to answer if / when I remember to get enough money to ship together and can still convince NeoGeoMan that it's mine...and the stars align, and so on. I think that it may not be surface mount, but maybe that's just a dream.

The BIGGEST problem with the X68000 series and expandability, I would guess, is hard drive support. I'm not aware of anything like a SASI -> SCSI adapter that works on the X68000 (that would make things much simpler); whenever "FM Towns / X68000 compatible" drives (of unknown reliability) show up on eBay they go for as much as an XVI Compact.

Arkhan
11-09-2009, 06:56 PM
Indeed, they're probably using them to play games. :hmm:

thaaaat was why i said



If youre going to get a 68000 you might as well get the beefed up one incase you decide to do something besides play games on it. They all cost out the ass anyways half the time. lol

lol

Ed Oscuro
11-09-2009, 07:04 PM
I am interested in getting more knowledge about retro computers. I was hoping we could get some model recommendations for each type of computer, and I can update this first post with all the findings.

Maybe something like: Minimum Recommended, Overall Recommendation, and Rare/Overkill Recommendation
So have we all been missing the point? ;)

I find it hard to believe the OP was looking for a software development, I think "rare" was more like "this is not going to be useful for many game titles." Easy enough to say what one means in a post though.

I doubt that an XVI is more expensive than a X68030, so there may be a savings there which will let somebody buy a game or peripheral they otherwise would have had to put off. That is important when games are the focus.

Arkhan
11-09-2009, 07:23 PM
im pretty sure the original point was to get input on various models for old computers for a hobbyist in terms of what they can do with said machine.

That usually implies that the person intends to do more than just fire up some games. Just because it doesn't replace a modern computer doesn't mean there are non-game aspects to the computers worth exploring.

:roll:

Family Computer
11-10-2009, 12:29 AM
Thanks to everyone who has given their input so far.

I have been lurking this thread everyday, and its exactly the type of info/discussion I wanted to get going.

I plan to update the first post as stated, but I just wanted to give the discussions a little bit more time to develop. I am a newbie for all these computers, so I don't personally have much to add.

As far as the original point? I really meant recommendations for overall use of the computer. Even though games are obviously a big part of it, I think that part of the appeal of these retro computers is seeing how technology has changed (and hasn't changed). So I would definitely be digging into whatever the computer has to offer, even if its not necessarily practical for everyday use.

Ed Oscuro
11-10-2009, 01:04 AM
Then my suggestion is to try emulation before you do something like me and get a bunch of stuff and not use it...these machines get rarer by the year and upkeep can be a pain in the butt (X68000 especially, what with the exploding power supply). It's not that I don't think anybody would be careful, but more the point that there is a lot of trouble getting some of these systems set up properly and to go through the expense of buying a machine and then not really using it...well. Amiga, not so big a deal. MSX2, again not so big a deal. FM Towns and X68000, bigger deal! Bigger sticker shock! Harder to find drives, and so on.

Jorpho
11-10-2009, 09:37 AM
By the way, would there be much point to getting an MSX Turbo R at this point? Does it break any compatibility?

blue lander
11-10-2009, 09:56 AM
Here's my recommendations for getting a PC-8801: First, you need to decide if you want a model that can play old PC-8001 games. Most of these games were on cassette, and many of the newer PC-8801's don't have a Cassette tape interface. If you don't care about that, go ahead with one of the newer, nicer looking models.

Secondly, you need to decide if you want a PC-88 you can upgrade. Some of the smaller newer units don't have expansion ports, so you can't add additional cards for hard disk controllers and whatnot. You can save a lot of money on shipping if you get a small light unit, but you probably won't be able to upgrade it later.

Lastly, I recommend buying a COMPLETE unit, meaning with a keyboard included. Different models of the PC-88 take different kinds of keyboards, and they all have incompatible connectors. Finding the right keyboard can be difficult and expensive, so better to just buy one with the unit.

This is the first PC-8801 I bought, the FE: http://www.old-computers.com/MUSEUM/computer.asp?st=1&c=400
It's small, light, and you can hook it up to a TV. However, it doesn't support a cassette deck, it doesn't have BASIC built in, and there aren't any expansion ports. I then bought a PC-8801 MKIIsr which is a fullly featured unit that works with just about anything. However,you have to hook it up to an RGB monitor.



X68000

I'm not aware of any gaming software that makes use of it. The XVI with regular 5.25" floppies is all most people will need: 2MB RAM at the least, 10 / 16 MHz switch for faster software. There are some games that would definitely have benefited from the higher specs of the 68030 and more RAM, like Gunship I believe, or Geograph Seal, or whatever other games were out there. The choppy nature of these games seems inherent, and you shouldn't be able to boost the resolution.

Is Geograph Seal better on a 68030? I've only played it on a 68000 based X68000, and it's not too bad considering the hardware it's running on...

I can't recommend a specific model of the X68000 to buy, but I can tell you NOT to buy the original one, because that's what I bought. It's cheaper than the others, but it's very difficult to upgrade the RAM in it. It's only got a megabyte built in, which is good enough for most games, but many require 2 megs. Each model X68k requires a different model memory upgrade module, so you can't put a megabyte of RAM designed for a newer X68k into an older one or vice versa. it took me three years of scouring YAJ to find the extra RAM for my X68k, and I bought two incorrect modules before I bought the right one.

Also, the original X68k only supports SASI hard drives, it won't work with SCSI.



FM Towns Marty 1 & 2: I'm told the difference is just cosmetic. Used as a home console. Might not be compatible with all software; reportedly you may need a floppy drive for some games.

My FM Towns Marty (I think it's a 2) has a built in floppy drive. Some games use it for saving data (like Zak McKraken). You can also hook up a keyboard and mouse to the Marty. I think the only things you can't do with the Marty is upgrade the RAM and add a hard drive. I have maybe 10 or 15 FM Towns games and they all run on the Marty without any problems, but I guess there may be games out there that require extra memory.


If youre going to get a 68000 you might as well get the beefed up one incase you decide to do something besides play games on it. They all cost out the ass anyways half the time. lol

plus 680xx assembly is awesometime

I'd recommend an old *NIX workstation like a NeXT Cube, Sun 3, SGI Iris or even an HP 9000/300 series computer if you want to do meaningful work other than gaming or if you want to play with 68k assembly and don't want to cross compile it on a more modern platform for whatever reason. I also found the Atari ST to be a really easy computer to learn 68k assembly on. It's not a very powerful platform, but the architecture is very simple and easy to learn.

Flack
11-10-2009, 12:48 PM
Here's my own two cents on a Commodore 64/128 setup. I'm not the authority on the matter, this is just my opinion.

Need: Computer, Monitor, Floppy Disk Drive, Joystick.
Highly Recommended: Fast Load Cartridge, second disk drive.
Unnecessary: Cassette Drive (Datasette), Modem, Printer.

Computer: I'll narrow it down to 4 machines: C64 (the original bread box), C64c (the white version), C128, and the portable (luggable) SX-64. The C64 bread box and the C64c are essentially the same machine. All peripherals are interchangable. There are slight internal differences in sound chips and trust me, I have a hard time hearing them. Unless you have both machines side by side you probably wouldn't know and it's even less likely that you'll care. The C128 is 100% backwards compatible, plus it can run 128 software. I believe there are around two dozen C128-specific games, and since there are something like 20,000 C64 games, it's really not a big deal for me. Some people like the shape of the 128 more but I've yet to find a used one with all of its keys (not sure why that was such a problem). Then there's the SX-64 which is good if space is a concern, although you'll be doing everything on a 7" screen.

Disk Drive: There were a lot of 3rd party disk drives released for the Commodore and I don't think any of them are 100% compatible. You really want a 1541 or a 1571. 1571s are built slightly different and, as a result, don't have the alignment problems the 1541s did. If you plan on copying many disks you'll want two drives, and to hook up two 1571s you flip a dip switch and to hook up two 1541s you have to disassemble the drive and cut solder traces.

Joystick: Any Atari 2600 compatible stick will work, including a Sega Genesis pad.

Monitor: Any Composite monitor will work. Commodore monitors have fantastic pictures, but you can run it into your flat screen TV, too.

Fast Load Cartridge: (Short Version) Commodore drives are slow. Fast Load cartridges make them go about 7x faster. My favorite is Epyx's FastLoad, but there are dozens to choose from. Some of the other models add other features like freezing games, editing memory, etc. All of them add shortened disk commands; for example, instead of having to type LOAD "PAC-MAN" ,8,1, with fastLoad you can just type %P*. Instead of having to type LOAD "$" ,8 and then LIST to get a disk's directory, you can simply type $. Much easier for new people to learn and it'll save you a lot of typing.

As for the unnecessary stuff, the Commodore Cassette drive is even slower than the floppy drive. Some games came with turbo loaders that sped things along but I don't think any of them were as fast as a simple disk drive with a FastLoad cart. The C64/128 has a cartridge port so between that and a disk drive, a Datasette is pointless. Unless you're really hardcore you won't need a modem or a printer, either.

Ideal Setup:

Computer: C64/C64c/C128/SX64
Drive: 1571, then 1541
Monitor: Any
Accessories: Joystick, FastLoad Cart

---

Two additional suggestions for "power users".

The first is JiffyDOS. JiffyDOS is a DOS replacement for the Commodore that involves burning eproms and soldering and installing chips and all kinds of fun. It's better and faster and probably not worth the money or effort for someone just getting into the Commodore. I know several people here have it installed. I don't and I get by just fine. If you get a Commodore setup and in five years find its OS limiting, you might look into JiffyDOS.

The other is a 1541 Ultimate, which I do own. It's a "disk drive" that uses SD cards for storage and reads/writes D64 images (the format used by most Commodore emulators). It has definitely replaced the x1541 family of cables as the quickest and easiest way to convert real disks to virtual disk images (and back). It's also awesome for downloading D64 disk images and playing them on a real 64. They're expensive ($200? More?), but I don't know anyone who bought one who regrets it. Again, if you're just getting into the 64 it's overkill, but I can hardly see owning a 64 setup these days without one, especially if you are converting disks back and forth.

Jorpho
11-10-2009, 01:20 PM
What about a modded C64 DTV?

Arkhan
11-10-2009, 02:19 PM
By the way, would there be much point to getting an MSX Turbo R at this point? Does it break any compatibility?

hell no there is no point unless you have a raging boner for the voice overs in Fray that you get in the Turbo R version, and want to play a few other good Turbo R exclusive games.

They are expensive. VERY expensive. 500$ expensive for a loose one and sometimes 1000+$ if its boxed, plus shipping, and usually have broken FDDs like everything else old and MSX. If you find it stateside, good luck. the seller will probably want 1000$ for a loose one.

They are fully compatible with everything MSX, and should only be bought if you really have a fist full of spare money. You get the R800 processor and 512k RAM which is really only important to you if you're doing dev-stuff. It does nothing for you gamewise.

and, as for next cubes, Nooooo. Noone should buy a nextcube. they are junk. B&W screen? bleh.

the cheaper alternative to a 1541U is buying the 12$ X transfer cable and writing .d64s direct to 5.25".

plus then you can hook your disk drives up to your PC and use them in winVICE, which is great. I used to take a 1541 around with me and play games on my laptop, lol.

Arasoi
11-10-2009, 04:12 PM
Does anyone own any of the the MSX/Laserdisc combo systems? The game lineup on them seems fairly decent, if you're a fan of the genre.

Info:

http://www.mccw.hetlab.tk/93/msxlaserdisc/en.html

I've been contemplating acquiring the LD player/MSX necessary for it, as Badlands and a few other ones are on it I'd like to play on the real hardware.

Arkhan
11-10-2009, 04:36 PM
theyre kind of a neat novelty, but a money pit... :-/

if you dont already have a way to play laserdiscs it might be cool, otherwise just get an MSX system by itself!

Ed Oscuro
11-10-2009, 04:46 PM
Is Geograph Seal better on a 68030? I've only played it on a 68000 based X68000, and it's not too bad considering the hardware it's running on...
Whoops, I wasn't being clear there. What I mean is that theoretically they could have - obviously a hard thing to expect on a system with fixed specifications throughout most of its lifetime - Metal Sight is another possibility. I'd actually not expect any of them to make use of the better hardware, including Gunship which came out relatively early in the system's life; the back-of-box quotes are all English and range from 1986 to 1988 at the newest; this game is copyrighted 1990. A bluish quick user card mentions "X68000 series," by 1990 this would maybe have included the Ace HD or something. No faster CPU by that time that I know of.

Out of the blue - looking at my copy of Gunship, the user disk (third party brand) which I assume was used to save game data has another sticker on the top with a rather round anime girl, looks familiar; there's the word "POPCOM" on the side. This should mean something to me, I think.

Incidentally, the warranty card on mine has the serial number 600090X; perhaps this game didn't get a very high print run. Box is a little worn, but I hadn't carefully inspected the contents which are in very nice condition.


if you dont already have a way to play laserdiscs it might be cool, otherwise just get an MSX system by itself!
Arasoi is serious about this, I assure you :)

I've read that the MSX LDs have mono sound only; one track is data (only a little bit, but enough to be a problem), so playing it on a regular LD probably won't work well. It wouldn't be very satisfying anyway. There also needs to be a data interface between the player and the MSX; you can't use just any player off the shelf.

Myself, the only LD game I would really like to own is Rocket Coaster, but eh there's other racing games out there :)

Flack
11-11-2009, 09:00 AM
What about a modded C64 DTV?

I would put it far down my list of "model recommendations". From what I understand approximately 25% of games don't work, plus there's a lot of work involved in making the system. I'd consider it a novelty more than a serious system, and certainly wouldn't use one as my primary system. That being said I wouldn't mind having one someday just to play with the new 256 color mode.

Flack
11-11-2009, 09:05 AM
the cheaper alternative to a 1541U is buying the 12$ X transfer cable and writing .d64s direct to 5.25".

plus then you can hook your disk drives up to your PC and use them in winVICE, which is great. I used to take a 1541 around with me and play games on my laptop, lol.

If I had a nickel for every hour I spent fiddling with x1541 cables, it would have been cheaper for me to just buy the $200+ 1541 Ultimate in the first place (if only it had existed back then!). I've never got the x1541 to work with any of the parallel ports on my laptops. I ended up keeping an old 486 dx4/100 around for years just for doing disk transfers. The 1541 Ultimate does it quicker and moving SD cards back and forth is much more convenient than having an old machine set up in the corner that I use a few times a year.

As for using 1541 drives on a PC laptop for emulation, I don't see the purpose at all. If you're already emulating the game, lugging around a big drive and sticking disks in it doesn't add anything to the experience for me. If I want portable, I'll tote a SX64 around I guess.

If we're making a list of "model recommendations", using a PC Laptop with a physical 1541 connected via an x1541 cable would be so far down my list that it might actually receive a negative rating.

Soviet Conscript
11-11-2009, 08:06 PM
alot of people seem to prefer the atari 800XL over the 130XE even though the XE seems more powerful out of the box

is this based solely on the better keyboard on the 800? are there any games or applications that take advantage of the 130?

Ze_ro
11-12-2009, 03:22 PM
I believe there are around two dozen C128-specific games, and since there are something like 20,000 C64 games, it's really not a big deal for me.
Indeed... despite previously recommending a C128, it has almost no advantage if all you're doing is playing games... It's extra features are very useful for programmers, and in case you want to screw around with CP/M (which you won't find many games for).


Monitor: Any Composite monitor will work. Commodore monitors have fantastic pictures, but you can run it into your flat screen TV, too.
If you want to use the C128 in 80 column mode, then you need something with a digital RGB port... this means either a 1902 (the monitor that Commodore designed for the 128) or a 1084S. Not much uses 80 column mode, but it's far nicer for productivity apps like word processors and terminal emulators (I used this a lot back then, but I doubt many of you will ever bother with it). Also, even with digital RGB, you still need a composite or separated hookup for 40 column mode, so you have a weird situation where you have two video cables hooked up to the same monitor. It's really weird.


Fast Load Cartridge: My favorite is Epyx's FastLoad, but there are dozens to choose from. Some of the other models add other features like freezing games, editing memory, etc.
The Epyx Fastload is relatively slow compared to other devices... but considering it's only about $5, and most of the faster options are around 10x that price, I'd certainly say it's a good investment!


a Datasette is pointless.
In Europe, it might be useful. In North America, almost no software for the C64 came out on tape.


the cheaper alternative to a 1541U is buying the 12$ X transfer cable and writing .d64s direct to 5.25".
Oh man, that doesn't even come close to replacing the 1541U... The 1541U has so many features it's crazy. It has literally replaced all my disk drives and mountains of disks. I have an SD card with around 20,000 .d64 files on it, they all load super fast without any disk swapping. I have all the benefits of whatever freezer cartridge I want it to emulate (including fastload), an REU if I need one, tape drive emulation (this may seem pointless, but .t64 files can be surprisingly convenient in some situations!), and so on.

Sure, you can use the 1541U to write disks easily... but the whole point of owning one is that you no longer need disks at all! It may be expensive, but if you add up the price of all the hardware it can replace, it's not so bad at all.


What about a modded C64 DTV?
Seems like a lot more work than it's worth to me. Speaking of which, there's also the C-One (http://www.c64upgra.de/c-one/). I've always wanted one, but things are progressing very slowly with it, and in the end I still wouldn't have a machine that I could feel confident enough with to dump my C128.

I'm surprised no one has asked about it yet... but what are minimum/recommended/excessive setups for a ZX Spectrum? I've always wanted to set one up, but importing everything from Europe isn't an attractive option (then again, no worse than dealing with Japan I suppose, and I see plenty of X68k and MSX talk)

--Zero

danielscheil
11-12-2009, 04:08 PM
X68000;

Like said before, every model with 2mb ram is enough for gaming. Look for a refurbished unit with new power source and sram, also both disc drive should work !

FM Towns;

In my opinion, the marty system is a pain in the ass if you compare it with a FM Towns PC;

- Unit has only Composite + S Video Output
- Some games do not work on it
- Some games have loading times from hell
- Some games need HD install to be really playable

If you buy a PC, get one with more then 16Mhz or else Mahou and a few other games will run to slow;
http://www.youtube.com/user/danielscheil#p/u/7/QvVVy4jn2mc (The game in this video is not installed on HD / if it is installed, it runs much faster!)
You should also look for a system with more than 2mb ram

MSX;

A MSX 2+ should be fine to play almost every game, if you need to play Turbo Games, get a Turbo R

Sorry for my englisch !

blue lander
11-12-2009, 04:55 PM
Is there any list of games that won't run on the Marty? Or a specific example even? I haven't plugged my FM Towns PC in since I bought the Marty, I find it much more convenient to hook it up to my TV and use it as a game console.

danielscheil
11-13-2009, 04:15 AM
Games i have testet;

Ultima Underworld 1+2 (loading times from hell)

Mahou Daikasen (needs more Ram)

Wing Commander (game runs too slow, loading times from hell)

Queen of Duellists (game runs too slow, loading times from hell)

Sim City 2000 (Not sure that it starts on a Marty but when it does, loading times from hell, game runs too slow)

+ a few porn games i testet do not start on a marty.

blue lander
11-13-2009, 08:32 AM
Hmm, that's good to know. I'll have to plug my FM Towns back in and compare load times between the two. Also, now that I think about it, New Zealand Story doesn't work right on my Marty either. The game runs fine, but the music is all randomized. I'll try that on my Towns PC too.

I'm suprised Mahou Daisakusen needs more RAM, the X68000 version runs fine on 2 megs.

danielscheil
11-13-2009, 09:17 AM
I'm suprised Mahou Daisakusen needs more RAM, the X68000 version runs fine on 2 megs.

Yep, it needs 3 MB, i have made a packshot;
http://img513.imageshack.us/img513/4175/bild0265.jpg

The X68k Version runs much slower like the FM Towns Version (on the right hardware)

I have buyed this beast today;

http://img221.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/users/4/4/6/7/michael_torojirou-img600x450-1254184376i54ieh30208.jpg

FM-TOWNS HG20
i80386DX(20MHz)
10 MB Ram
MO Drive
Multisync LCD

^_^

Ze_ro
11-17-2009, 02:04 AM
I'm surprised no one has asked about it yet... but what are minimum/recommended/excessive setups for a ZX Spectrum?
So... no one here rocks the Spectrum then? :(

--Zero

blue lander
11-17-2009, 08:41 AM
I've got a Spectrum, but only one model so I can't really compare and contrast the different versions. But from my limited knowledge I'd recommend getting an Amstrad built model with 128k RAM and an internal tape deck. The Amstrad versions are cheaper and more reliable (or so I'm told) than the original Sinclair versions, and they definitely have a better keyboard. They can be run of +5 volts DC so there's no need to import the power supply if you're in the US, you can just build one from Radio Shack. You can easily connect any old 15khz RGB monitor to it, so you don't need to worry about finding a PAL television. I do believe some really old 48k games aren't compatible with the +2, but I don't know if any of them are significant.

The +3 has a built in 3 inch floppy drive so some might prefer that model, but I don't think there are too many games in that format. I like having the internal tape deck so I don't have to worry about connecting an external one and tweaking the tone and volume

Nature Boy
11-24-2009, 08:49 AM
For the 8-bit family, I'd definitely recommend the 800 XL or the 130 XE.

The keyboard on the XL is nicer, but unless you're using the machine for writing essays or something I wouldn't pass up an XE because of the keyboard.

(I actually wrote my essays in high school on a 400 with that flat keyboard - where there's a will, there's a way).

The older models are cool (especially the 800 with it's second cartridge slot), but game compatibility is poor. At least with an XL you can run a translation program to get 99% of the OS-B games to work on an XL/XE.

danielscheil
01-05-2010, 06:36 PM
what is a good nec pc 98 setup for gaming?
i want a system that plays every game...

Arkhan
01-05-2010, 07:07 PM
what is a good nec pc 98 setup for gaming?
i want a system that plays every game...

A good setup is to just use Nekoproject or some other emulator. that way it WILL play every game. Good luck finding and setting a real one up that has 5.25", 3.5", and CD-ROM drives...!

plus, "real hardware" in this instance is a bit superficial since the only truly specialized hardware in them is the FM soundcards. PC-98s were just the run of the mill PC at the time. Direct competition with the IBM crap.

What you can run into with PC-98 is that if you get a newer model (pentium) to play some of the more recent games, the old games don't exactly work right.

also PC-9801 != PC98. PC98 (the newest, end of the era machines) games (newer stuff like Pretty Samy) wont run on a PC-98. It's kinda like trying to run Myst on a 286. PC98s came at the end of the PC-9800 era and are infact IBM compatible.

PC-98 games use the PC-98s non-IBM (cbus, video, sound) hardware, so you can see the problem here!

and then comes twiddling with settings on the computer. If you aren't able to read Japanese, this will be your downfall!

if you absolutely HAVE to ship one of them clunkers overseas to yourself, your best bet is to locate one with a CD-ROM drive, and 3.5" and kiss the 5.25" games goodbye

you almost need TWO PC-98s to really get everything. One of the early dual 5.25" models, and then a newer 3.5"/CD-ROM one.

...pricey (shipping! ahh!), and tricky to locate.

I speak from experience :) Only buy the real thing if you have random expendable cash.

an_turtar
01-06-2010, 12:18 AM
MSX: I have an MSX-2, two 2+ machines and a Turbo-R. The Turbo-R does not have a cassette port, so obviously you can't load games directly from cassette. Also, many MSX1 games won't work at all even from disk, so I bought Nyyrikki's MSX1 emulator for the Turbo-R, and it works great (search for it on MSX.org). I am looking to sell my machines though, they take up too much room. Anyway, you should be looking for at least an MSX-2, the 2+ is obviously slightly more enhanced.

X68000: The X68030 is not fully compatible with older games, some of them won't run and you need patches for them. However, the X68030 does have a better power supply than the older machines. My XVI has an 030 power supply and it's never been a problem. As was mentioned before, you'll need at least 2MB, and for Super Street Fighter 2, 4MB. Some games run better at higher speeds. The XVI is capable of 16MHz, the 030 of 25MHz. I tested all of my games and these were the results.

These games ran better at 16MHz:
F-15 Strike Eagle II
Hishouzame (slightly better scrolling)
Jack Nicklaus Championship Golf
Mahou Daisakusen
Populous
Populous 2
Populous The Promised Lands
Powermonger
Salamander (a lot better, almost no slowdown)
Sim City
Sim Earth
Star Wars Attack on the Death Star
Super Street Fighter II
Viewpoint

These games ran TOO fast:
Arkanoid Revenge of DOH
D-Return
Full Throttle
Granada


These games exhibited problems:
Dragon Spirit (music messed up)
Fantasy Zone (music messed up)
Gradius (music messed up)
Naious (music messed up)
Nekketsu Koukou Dodgeball Bu (corrupt graphics)
Twinbee (corrupt graphics)


So, a very nice X68000 setup would feature:
2MB RAM, preferably more
Hard Disk drive. Later models used SCSI, so get a later model.
MIDI card. Capcom and Konami games especially have great MIDI music.
Keyboard and Mouse. A lot of people don't have these.


Sinclair Spectrum: I have the 48K, 128K, 128K+2 (built-in cassette player), and 128K+3 (built-in disk drive) models. I've had the 48K model for as long as I can remember, just this year I modded it to give composite video output, and it works perfectly here in Japan. The power supply required for each model is:
48: 9V 1.4A
128: 9V 1.85A
+2: 9V 2.1A
+3: 5V @ 2A, +12V @ 700mA, -12V @ 50mA (special PSU, not like the others). This is the same power supply as used on the +2A/B which were basically +3's with a cassette player. They're black, the original +2 is grey.

So you can run the first three models listed with any 9V PSU (centre negative). I sometimes run my 48K model off my MIDI synth power supply. The full 1.4A is not needed if you don't have any peripherals, my aforementioned synth PSU only supplies 1A, and the machine is fine. Usually though, I run all three models off my +2 power supply. I also have a DivIDE (http://baze.au.com/divide/) and all of my games are on that, so I can load them instantly. For those that don't work from the DivIDE, I still have all my cassettes, but to save them, I load from an iPod. The volume isn't loud enough so I connect the iPod to speakers, and then the speakers to the Spectrum, the speakers' amplification is enough for the games to load.

There are not too many disk games, for a newcomer the +2 might be the best bet, BUT it doesn't have an external casssette port, so no loading from iPod. This IS possible on a +3. For the hardcore collector, an original 48K model is a must, the 128K models are hard to get, and quite expensive. I value mine highly as it's the last real Sinclair machine, before Amstrad.

Arkhan
01-06-2010, 03:01 AM
PM sent!

danielscheil
01-06-2010, 04:25 AM
Thank you very much Arkhan !
But where can i play more games ? on the old or on the new version ?
Does the old one boot from floppy or do i have to install the 5 1/4" games ?

^_^

Arkhan
01-06-2010, 12:31 PM
Thank you very much Arkhan !
But where can i play more games ? on the old or on the new version ?
Does the old one boot from floppy or do i have to install the 5 1/4" games ?

^_^

the 5.25" games boot from floppy.

You'll find that the majority of games are 5.25" and 3.5" usually since PC-9801s are so old...

Rising Stuff has a 5.25" unit. no 3.5" drives though. Its an ollllld model

danielscheil
01-07-2010, 10:08 AM
ok, thx again i have buyed this one now
http://img277.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/users/9/3/8/4/ayumixpop-img600x485-1258513032ubwbbt39985.jpg
http://img277.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/users/9/3/8/4/ayumixpop-img600x414-1258513032k1wwlz39985.jpg
http://img277.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/users/9/3/8/4/ayumixpop-img600x426-1258513032k0dmwj39985.jpg
do i need a special keyboard & mouse or can i use my fm towns or x68k accessoires ?
And do i need a special monitor or can i use the x68k or fm towns monitor?

Arkhan
01-07-2010, 10:39 AM
damn thats a nice find. Whered you nab that at, and how much!?



Not sure on the keyboard. I use the one that came with mine. I'm not sure how specialized it really is. You might be able to use any old keyboard to be honest


i use an old monitor with RGB for it, so depending what monitor you're using with the FM TOwns or x68k, you could be set already

danielscheil
01-07-2010, 12:16 PM
thanks, it was not that high; 12.000yen + around 100$ shipping to germany (yahoo.jp)
i would love to connect this beast to my lcd tv but i have not much hope about it.

Arkhan
01-07-2010, 08:58 PM
thanks, it was not that high; 12.000yen + around 100$ shipping to germany (yahoo.jp)
i would love to connect this beast to my lcd tv but i have not much hope about it.

120$, not too bad! Yahoo.jp has alot of nice stuff

good luck hooking it up to an LCD monitor, lol. That will end in frustration.

danielscheil
01-08-2010, 12:46 AM
If it does not work on the tv ( i dont think it will because of the 24khz) i use my multisync lcd screen.

Arkhan
01-08-2010, 05:25 AM
If it does not work on the tv ( i dont think it will because of the 24khz) i use my multisync lcd screen.

hope you have the proper connections for this!

how long til it arrives

danielscheil
01-08-2010, 10:43 AM
1-3 months ^_^

Arkhan
01-08-2010, 07:29 PM
ah, you picked surface boat mail? :)

Im too impatient for that , i always pay for the like 3 day airmail

danielscheil
01-09-2010, 05:12 AM
I can wait (it is not easy but it works) and i save a lot of money with surface.
I have ordered 3 or 4 heavy systems with monitors over surface (X68k, FMT, 2x FMT UX) and i never had any problems. Shipping is from 1-3 months. It is every time a surprise with sea ^_^

Arkhan
01-09-2010, 06:00 AM
I can wait (it is not easy but it works) and i save a lot of money with surface.
I have ordered 3 or 4 heavy systems with monitors over surface (X68k, FMT, 2x FMT UX) and i never had any problems. Shipping is from 1-3 months. It is every time a surprise with sea ^_^

yeah. last time I tried surface the place forgot to mail it so i ended up waiting 4 months, going HEY WHERES MY STUFF, and then it was airmailed to me. lol

blue lander
01-11-2010, 10:07 AM
+3: 5V @ 2A, +12V @ 700mA, -12V @ 50mA (special PSU, not like the others). This is the same power supply as used on the +2A/B which were basically +3's with a cassette player. They're black, the original +2 is grey.


I run my +2A off of just the 5V @ 2A (with an old PC AT power supply), and as far as I can tell everything works fine. I don't know what the -12V is for, but it doesn't seem to be necessary.

A question to you PC-9801 people: What do you see in this computer? I'm asking as somebody who can't speak Japanese, and there doesn't seem to be too much you can play if you don't understand the language. Most of the library seems to be RPGs and dating sims. Are there any good action style games for it? I've imported the PC-8801, PC-6001, and several other 8 bit Japanese computers, but I feel no need to get a PC-98. Am I missing out on anything?

danielscheil
01-11-2010, 03:32 PM
It has a few action titles and shoot em ups
http://www.pc98.org/main.html
(and a few more...)

i also love old, vintage porn games porn games and thats the perfect system ^_^