Anyone considering a switch to PC gaming?

[Jorpho]

On the subject of PhysX... Can anyone with an nVidia card say how much of a difference you've noticed with it? I've actually never tried it with hardware acceleration, is it noticeable?I never even knew I had PhysX until I tried to install Trine.

[NayusDante]

arrow keys are for newbs, you will get rocked in every multiplayer match you play because you are missing instant access to key in game commands such as jump, crouch, quick weapon switch, sprint etc. using WASD will get you used to it pretty quickly, you will never look at them. however using WASD is the only way you can use those other commands without ever lifting some fingers off your movement keys, enabling you to still move and not die.

i used arrow keys only, at one point... before mouse look became a staple of pc FPSs (i believe duke nukem 3d was the first fps w/ a viable mouse look, so people began to switch their configs to use WASD).

Are we going to have to settle these silly arguments with some UT?

[PC-ENGINE HELL]

Yea, that's why I posted those score pics of prior matches I was on. I was like, wtf he talking about, I do great online or off. But then again I could see someone hating arrow keys just as much as I hate using wads, so oh well. To each their own. Some people are just hard core on the wads scheme.

[j_factor]

What do most left-handed FPS gamers do? If you rest your right hand's fingers on WASD, you can't comfortably reach many other buttons.

[Berserker]

What do most left-handed FPS gamers do? If you rest your right hand's fingers on WASD, you can't comfortably reach many other buttons.

PL:" would seem like a reasonable substitute, assuming that your mouse is on the left-hand side of the keyboard. What I mean by that is P = Forward, : = Backward, L = Strafe left, " = Strafe right.

It's not quite as natural as it is for a righty to rest their hand on WASD, but at least that way you've still got your pinky resting on a shift key and your thumb resting on the space key, with the various other surrounding keys available for whatever additional functionality a game offers (only reversed).

You might also consider using the numpad, as that would probably be more comfortable as it's at the end of the keyboard like WASD is for righties, though you'd want to remap some keys. So I would use 5 for moving backwards instead of 2, so that your middle finger doesn't have to travel as far. Maybe remap the Right or Down Arrow key to jump since that's what your thumb comes to rest on. Enter for Run/Walk toggle, and so on.

Really what the keys are themselves isn't that important (WASD vs PL:" vs 8456) - basically you just want a relatively comfortable enough setup with plenty of extra surrounding keys within easy reach that you can map to additional functions.

[Lothars]

I will never switch fully to PC gaming but I love playing PC games anyway and finally got a new top of the line computer, so I am playing everything i haven't played in a long time.

If anyone has Steam and wants to play something my name is Lothars on it.

[j_factor]

PL:" would seem like a reasonable substitute, assuming that your mouse is on the left-hand side of the keyboard. What I mean by that is P = Forward, : = Backward, L = Strafe left, " = Strafe right.

It's not quite as natural as it is for a righty to rest their hand on WASD, but at least that way you've still got your pinky resting on a shift key and your thumb resting on the space key, with the various other surrounding keys available for whatever additional functionality a game offers (only reversed).

You might also consider using the numpad, as that would probably be more comfortable as it's at the end of the keyboard like WASD is for righties, though you'd want to remap some keys. So I would use 5 for moving backwards instead of 2, so that your middle finger doesn't have to travel as far. Maybe remap the Right or Down Arrow key to jump since that's what your thumb comes to rest on. Enter for Run/Walk toggle, and so on.

Really what the keys are themselves isn't that important (WASD vs PL:" vs 8456) - basically you just want a relatively comfortable enough setup with plenty of extra surrounding keys within easy reach that you can map to additional functions.

I don't know why I never thought of the numpad. That sounds perfect. It also fixes the other thing I never liked about WASD, which is "down" and "up" not being lined up correctly. I hate that.

[Berserker]

I don't know why I never thought of the numpad. That sounds perfect. It also fixes the other thing I never liked about WASD, which is "down" and "up" not being lined up correctly. I hate that.

One thing I forgot to mention that you should be careful about when using that setup is to make sure that numlock is on - this is because you want the game to see the numpad keys and the arrow keys as two separate things so that they can be mapped to separate functions. The same also applies for the PgUp/PgDn keys, which are a bit more of a stretch, but still well within reach.

PgUp, PgDn, Up/Down/Right arrow, 7, 9, 1, 2, 3, 0, ., Enter, /, *, -, and +. These are the extra keys you'll have to work with, and they should be enough for most games.

[The 1 2 P]

During the last gen(PS2/Xbox/GC) I got much more interested in pc gaming because of all the fps(one of my favorite genres) games they were getting(HL2, Doom 3, Farcry, Painkiller, Fear, etc). But then the Xbox(and later the 360) started to get the majority of all those games as well. Plus, I don't think I'm ready for the whole mouse and keyboard setup yet.

Today pc gaming offers very little that I can't get on a console. It may offer prettier graphics but Star Wars: The Old Republic is the only upcoming game it has that interest me and thats not nearly enough to make the switch. Console gaming keeps me very satisfied.

[WCP]

When I think about using WASD, it's just very hard for my head to grasp the concept of it. How do you move diagonally? W = go forward, and A = go left and D = go right. S = go backwards?

Is that how it works? I haven't tried it in years and just don't remember it. My question is, what if you're trying to movie in a diagonal direction? Instead of going North, you want to go Northwest, or Northeast. Do you hit both keys simultaneously? Seems like the left thumbstick on a 360 or PS3 controller makes much more sense than WASD, in terms of diagonal movement.

I should probably just download a demo of some game and give it a try using WASD, see if I can even wrap my head around it. To me, it would seem that a nunchuk type single thumbstick thing, paired with a mouse for camera/aiming, would be the most ideal setup.

[BHvrd]

When I think about using WASD, it's just very hard for my head to grasp the concept of it. How do you move diagonally? W = go forward, and A = go left and D = go right. S = go backwards?

Is that how it works? I haven't tried it in years and just don't remember it. My question is, what if you're trying to movie in a diagonal direction? Instead of going North, you want to go Northwest, or Northeast. Do you hit both keys simultaneously? Seems like the left thumbstick on a 360 or PS3 controller makes much more sense than WASD, in terms of diagonal movement.

I should probably just download a demo of some game and give it a try using WASD, see if I can even wrap my head around it. To me, it would seem that a nunchuk type single thumbstick thing, paired with a mouse for camera/aiming, would be the most ideal setup.

Xpadder is your friend! MMMkay?

http://www.xpadder.com/

[graciano1337]

Today pc gaming offers very little that I can't get on a console. It may offer prettier graphics but Star Wars: The Old Republic is the only upcoming game it has that interest me and thats not nearly enough to make the switch. Console gaming keeps me very satisfied.

I will definitely be putting together a good PC for The Old Republic. I can't wait...

[Berserker]

When I think about using WASD, it's just very hard for my head to grasp the concept of it. How do you move diagonally? W = go forward, and A = go left and D = go right. S = go backwards?

Is that how it works? I haven't tried it in years and just don't remember it. My question is, what if you're trying to movie in a diagonal direction? Instead of going North, you want to go Northwest, or Northeast. Do you hit both keys simultaneously? Seems like the left thumbstick on a 360 or PS3 controller makes much more sense than WASD, in terms of diagonal movement.

I should probably just download a demo of some game and give it a try using WASD, see if I can even wrap my head around it. To me, it would seem that a nunchuk type single thumbstick thing, paired with a mouse for camera/aiming, would be the most ideal setup.

Yes - Forward/backward movement + right/left movement = diagonal movement.

It's really not that complicated. Basically you just rest your middle finger on the W key, and then let your other fingers rest naturally on the other keys (except for S).

So: pointer finger rests on D, ring finger rests on A, alternate between W and S keys with the middle finger, pinky finger rests on Shift (typically this is your run/walk key), and your thumb rests on Space (jump). And yes, you should probably get a demo to get a feel for it. Since I'm guessing you haven't built your computer yet, you might want to look for a demo of an older game, like Quake 3: Arena or something.

[WCP]

Xpadder is your friend! MMMkay?

http://www.xpadder.com/

The vast majority of modern PC games support controllers (except for Bioshock 2 wtf? ), so it's not really a big deal. I would likely get the wireless dongle thing, so I could just use a Xbox 360 controller with it. I'm just trying to wrap my head around the whole preference for WASD and Mouse, when it should be Nunchuk and Mouse.

[NayusDante]

The vast majority of modern PC games support controllers (except for Bioshock 2 wtf? ), so it's not really a big deal. I would likely get the wireless dongle thing, so I could just use a Xbox 360 controller with it. I'm just trying to wrap my head around the whole preference for WASD and Mouse, when it should be Nunchuk and Mouse.

Bioshock 2's gamepad support is indeed an oddity, because the GFW brand requirements include Xbox 360 controller compatibility, as of the last time I checked.


I can understand the nunchuk for movement, but you only get one finger for movement that way (thumb). It's nice to have the analog movement, but you don't have the same reaction speed available that a keyboard gives. Most PC games aren't coded for analog movement, but I wouldn't mind it.


Has anyone considered different input devices for console FPS? Personally, I'd like to see the right analog replaced with a trackball, which provides absolute movement. An analog stick registers input depending on how far you move it and how long you hold it there, but a trackball registers how much it has been rotated. Console RTS would finally make sense.

[zyo]

I could get more of that "next-level" feeling

You STILL don't have a Sega CD?

[WCP]

You STILL don't have a Sega CD?

Heh heh...


I got a Sega CD. I've always been a hardcore early adopter. I had the Sega CD preordered and paid in full before it was even released. The funny thing is, I remember being really excited about Joe Montana CD Football. When I went into Software ETC, before the Sega CD was released to look at the display box, on the back it had a picture of a few of the upcoming Sega CD games, and Joe Montana CD Football was one of them. I thought it looked pretty cool at the time. I was thinking that maybe just somehow it would end up blowing Madden out the water. I had to wait awhile for that game to come out, and then was totally disappointed when it did.

When I did go home with my brand new Sega CD, I was totally amazed by the experiences at first. I actually liked the Sherlock Holmes game and Sol-Feace. I remember getting Night Trap and Sewer Shark as soon as they were available, and I actually liked those as well. I know FMV games are considered the devil, but I actually enjoyed them. They were corny as can be, and very silly, but I had alot of fun with them.

[Poofta!]

i always forget just how console-centric this forum is. it is truly my fault for bringing half of this stuff up. its like trying to preach carburetors on an import car forum (or vice versa, really).

its the arcade stick for street fighter argument.

the vast majority of pc gamers do wasd, console gamers it seems are uncomfortable w/ it. probably the same way i feel (retarded) when i pick up a controller for for halo.

[NayusDante]

its the arcade stick for street fighter argument.

Quoted for truth. I'm going to remember that one...

[izarate]

arrow keys are for newbs

I've always used the arrow keys ever since Wolfestein. Never had a problem.

[LucidDefender]

That Radeon is nothing more than a glorified HD-Video card, meant for doing things like Blu-Ray playback. The refresh rate and frame rates recorded from it when I was testing them didn't touch the 8800GT I was benchmarking against, let alone the 9800GT.


Why... why would you be measuring the "refresh rate"? That makes no sense.

The Radeon 4850 is indeed faster than the 8800GThttp://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=3341&p=15 Also, if you're such an expert, how could you not know that the 9800GT is just a rebadged 8800GT? Interesting that your "tests" showed the 9800GT to be noticeably faster...



22" is pretty nice. i was mostly pointing out the guy w/ a limp video card. im just saying it makes no sense to try to game on a pc if youre games will look worse than the consoles...

Amusing that we have PC elitists here that haven't a clue what they're speaking about. The 4850 is a limp card? The 8800GT is a better card? Hmm.



dear god stop posting



Why? Everything he's been saying is sound, and factual.

[Icarus Moonsight]

I still have a Riva TNT and a deuce around here somewhere... Last time I was heavy into it, those were top end hardware. If there was something compelling and worth it, I'd be up in there. Tinkering and tweaking rigs again. I just don't see a reason to be a main PC gamer. The only plus side I can see now, is the plethora of case mod kit available... I'd make my machine look like a euro-trash disco and airbrush Gloria Gaynor Inside on the side panel. I wouldn't really play anything on it. I'd just turn it on to give people seizures. LOL

[PC-ENGINE HELL]

I just now went back and read this due to LucidDefenders post.

This is coming from someone who has been, up until this year, heavily involved in computers, from programming and networking to building $5000+ custom gaming pc's...

Are you sure? It doesn't sound like it, honestly. Everything you said here Im about to address would be shot down on any computer gaming forum.



That Radeon is nothing more than a glorified HD-Video card, meant for doing things like Blu-Ray playback. The refresh rate and frame rates recorded from it when I was testing them didn't touch the 8800GT I was benchmarking against, let alone the 9800GT. Lets not talk about the new GTX series, such as the 280. You aren't even in the same LEAGUE.

The 4850 and 4870 were both solid performers that had no problem trampling 8800GT/9800GT in most games. Both the 4850 and 4870 are still widely used today and still hold up well. Even better if placed in Crossfire solutions. I hardly ever see anyone complain about these cards on forums like Guru3d. Why? Because they perform so well.



Do you want to know WHY I moved to consoles, and do almost no PC gaming anymore? I got tired of fighting with the systems, changing hardware and screwing with drivers all the time, to get performance levels I could get on a CONSOLE for nearly 1/4 of the cost. Yes, there are some genres I do believe still work better on PC. RTS is a very PC-centric gaming experience.

Both the Xbox360 and PS3 take a visual and frame rate hit on the same title when compared to the Pc counterpart. This is widely know, and not something that can be simply wrote off or ignored. Changing out hardware every 3 years is not a big deal. If you felt you had to more then that, I don't know what to tell you. Just because a new line of cards came out doesn't automatically make yours garbage. Build a good solid system right from the start and it will last awhile.

Go build a cheap system using Pc-Chips boards and lower end Nvidia cards, then well that's your problem. Drivers and game patches are just a way of life. I don't usually update drivers unless I need to, or every 3 months, which ever comes first. Sticking to a 3 month cycle mainly has continued to serve me well.


Once the PS3 and 360 were released, the advantages to PC were gone. The consoles have so much power, and in order to match that performance in the PC realm, you have to spend some dough.

Yea, they have so much power, yet they are having to continue to make visual compromises to keep the games from chugging along below 30fps. If that's considered a advantage, I think I'll pass.



I mean, seriously, all I have to do to play a PS3 or 360 game on my 62" screen is put the disc in and turn on the system. I STILL can't find drivers that will allow me to plug the 260GT in to that thing, even via HDMI, and come out on a good res. IT keeps wanting to go 1440x900, which looks HORRIBLE.
I don't know what to tell you there, maybe you should swap cards, or ask around. Given what you said above, it sounds more like you consider everything that deals with a gaming computer a totally unpleasant hassle. Your more the type who wants the quickest solution, even if its not the best one, hence why your settling with the performance the 360 and PS3 are giving you, which isn't horrible, but def not up to a good gaming computers standards. Due to that Id question just how much time you actually invest in solving your hardware or software related problems.

For the heck of it, I'll list my main gaming comps specs:
Sony Trinitron Multiscan 520GS
Aerocool T3 case
Phenom X3 8400 with TLB fix disabled
Asus M2A-MVP Crossfire board
Two HD3850 256 meg cards running in Crossfire mode
SoundBlaster Audigy
Ageia Physx PCI
Corsair DDR2 2 gigs
Seagate 40 gig Sata for Operating system, Seagate 80 gig Ultra ATA 133 for games and files.
Pioneer DVD burner
BFG 650 watt psu
Thermaltake 250 watt VGA psu
Windows 7 Ultimate 32-bit

Zero complaints on games performances. The latest game I beat on this comp was Battlefield Bad Company 2.

[WCP]

PC-ENGINE HELL : Hey, you seem pretty knowledgeable about PC gaming.... What is your take on PC versus Xbox 360 and PS3, if I'm using a 720p projector? My primary gaming screen is my 122" 16:9 screen, and my Optoma HD7100 projector. The projector is a native 1280 x 720 projector. If I was buying a brand new projector right now I'd definitely be getting a 1080p projector, but I don't have a spare 2 grand sitting around to upgrade the projector right now.

I'm going to stick with this puppy until the whole 3D Stereoscopic thing shakes itself out, and I figure out where things are headed in the projector world. (3D Blu Ray players are coming soon, and ESPN is going to have a special 3D channel on Direct TV) Meanwhile, I'm stuck at 720p. If I build a modern gaming PC, with say a Radeon 5770 as my primary GPU, would I really see that much of an improvement over a PS3 or 360 if I'm only running it at 1280 x 720? I'm guessing that I would be able to have all other settings 100 percent maxed out, so some of the visual effects should be pretty cool, and a bit beyond what the 360 and PS3 are capable of right now, but I'm just wondering if not being able to go to 1920 x 1080 is going to really rain on my parade?

I could skip building a PC this year, and just save my pennies towards a 1080p projector and get that first, and then revisit the whole PC thing a year or 18 months from now. I'm still enjoying playing PS3 and 360 games, but I must admit I'm kinda jonesing for some next, next, next generation action... if you know what I mean...

[NayusDante]

You could run Crysis perfectly fine at 720p with that card, as long as your CPU and RAM are good. In direct comparison, you'll probably get better performance from a decent PC than a console at that resolution in cross-platform games. But like I mentioned before, there really isn't very much out there to rival the games on consoles.

The difference between 720p and 1080p is probably less important if you're using a projector, but 122" is pretty big, so it's hard to say. On a PC, you can get a nice picture at that resolution if you enable anti-aliasing, which is how I played Oblivion. Back then, I had a Radeon X1800 GTO, and the framerate sucked at 1920x1080, but 1280x720 was perfectly fine maxed with some AA.

My best advice is to look at games before you look at buying hardware. Don't bother if there's nothing in particular that interests you. Also look at input devices, and make sure you have room for a mouse and keyboard if you want to play any FPS.

[Jorpho]

but I must admit I'm kinda jonesing for some next, next, next generation action... if you know what I mean...I sure don't. In the end, PC games are going to play pretty much the same as the console games, so you might as well not bother.

[WCP]

I sure don't. In the end, PC games are going to play pretty much the same as the console games, so you might as well not bother.


Well, the main thing I'm talking about is running a game at 1920 x 1080, compared to running the same game at 600p. Alot of console games don't even run at a true 720p resolution. (Halo 3, Modern Warfare, a few others....) Also, with console games, you have to deal with some screen tearing, or framerate issues. If you have a PC that can run Bad Company 2 at 1080p with everything maxed out, it's going to almost seem like it's running on a PS4 or Xbox 720 compared to the PS3 or Xbox 360 versions of the games. I mean, obviously, I'm exaggerating a little bit, but you get the idea. I understand the whole, "Why be such a graphics whore, it's all about the gameplay" argument, but at the same time.... it looks so PURDY!!!!! :)

[SegaAges]

There are definate ups and downs to going PC.

I have always been a half and half sort of guy. I like PC gaming because a buttload of games that are also released on consoles go to PC and for much cheaper.

I personally don't use steam or gog.com or anything because I love my physical copies.

From what I have seen, there is nothing that is going push the envelope of graphics anytime soon with games, so you should be good dropping money on something that is cnot completely cutting edge.

It all just depends on how much you want to commit yourself to being a pc gamer. This means money. Getting the rig setup will cost you a good chunk of coin, but after that, you will not have to upgrade it for a very long time.

My rig a expensive, but not super bad:
motherboard: 150
cpu: 200
ram: 50
video card: 250
monitor: 250
psu: 100

There are some very good pc only titles as well. Dawn of War 2 is super, super fun. Well, I am a DoW1 junkie, so saying 2 is good is a little biased, but it is a really good and fun game.

Also, most of the really big console titles that are not exclusive to 360 or ps3 are also out on pc for like 10 cheaper.

If you want to make the jump, start small. Get a new video card. After that, then go for bigger components like a cpu and motherboard.

[LucidDefender]

PC-ENGINE HELL : Hey, you seem pretty knowledgeable about PC gaming.... What is your take on PC versus Xbox 360 and PS3, if I'm using a 720p projector? My primary gaming screen is my 122" 16:9 screen, and my Optoma HD7100 projector. The projector is a native 1280 x 720 projector. If I was buying a brand new projector right now I'd definitely be getting a 1080p projector, but I don't have a spare 2 grand sitting around to upgrade the projector right now.


I'm not PC-ENGINE HELL, but I'll offer my opinions. If you know the maximum resolution you'll be using is 1280x720, a Radeon 5770 will be more than sufficient; at that resolution, you'll typically be more cpu-bound than gpu bound these days. It could do 1920x1080 fairly well for most titles, but you may have to lower graphical quality on certain titles.

I recently upgraded from a 8800GT to a Radeon 4890. I considered the 5770, but a used 4890 can be had for less money, and is faster. The only downsides are the power consumption of the 4890, and fan noise.

[WCP]

There are definate ups and downs to going PC.

I have always been a half and half sort of guy. I like PC gaming because a buttload of games that are also released on consoles go to PC and for much cheaper.

I personally don't use steam or gog.com or anything because I love my physical copies.

From what I have seen, there is nothing that is going push the envelope of graphics anytime soon with games, so you should be good dropping money on something that is cnot completely cutting edge.

It all just depends on how much you want to commit yourself to being a pc gamer. This means money. Getting the rig setup will cost you a good chunk of coin, but after that, you will not have to upgrade it for a very long time.

My rig a expensive, but not super bad:
motherboard: 150
cpu: 200
ram: 50
video card: 250
monitor: 250
psu: 100

.

One thing I've always wondered about, is that when I'm looking at a thread talking about new PC builds, they always seem to leave out the cost of the OS. Windows 7 OEM version for system builders isn't cheap.... is it? Or are most people just pirating it or something, so they don't consider the cost of it, cause they're just pirating it?

Looking at your numbers, the ram seems pretty inexpensive. I think the price of ram has jumped up quite a bit recently. Here is my plan, if I were to build a gaming PC (still not sure if I want to go that route at this time):

motherboard: $120
cpu: $180 (i5 750 Quad Core)
ram: $110 (4 gig DDR3)
video card: $150 Radeon HD 5770 (best bang for the buck)
monitor: I'll be using my projector mostly...
psu: $90

other expenses:

Tower: $70
Fans: $20
DVD: already have a nice Pioneer that I would move to the new rig
HDD: Not sure what I would do here. Was considering maybe using a small SSD for the boot drive with Windows 7, and then having a second larger hard drive for pure storage. Unfortunately, if I went this route, it would get very costly. I could just get a decent 1.5 terabyte normal HDD for around $100
Operating Sytem: $95 (Windows 7 OEM for system builders)


I'm not sure if I'm forgetting anything else...

[NayusDante]

Back last year, we had the beta and release candidate for Windows 7, so everyone used that. Maximum PC ran a few articles on PC builds that year that just said "get Win7 RC1 for free" instead of listing OS price. Of course, now the RC shuts down every two hours.

And it doesn't shut down cleanly... it BSODs.

[WCP]

I recently upgraded from a 8800GT to a Radeon 4890. I considered the 5770, but a used 4890 can be had for less money, and is faster. The only downsides are the power consumption of the 4890, and fan noise.

Also, the fact that the 5770 is DX11 compatible. My idea with going with a 5770, is that I should be able to find one around $150 or maybe even slightly less when the Fermi cards come out. By saving some coin on the GPU, I can slide more towards the CPU. I just think that if you're building a new PC, upgrading the video card is going to be a given. You're going to have to upgrade the video card every 8 to 14 months. If you put more $$$ towards the CPU, then you might be able to ride that CPU for a couple of years or more, depending on the games you're going to be playing and the settings.

[SegaAges]

Nah, I caught my ram on a deal. I made all of these upgrades around September or October last year.

As for my OS, my company gave me a msdn subscription, which means I paid nothing for the OS.

[PC-ENGINE HELL]

I doubt most gamers are pirating it. A lot of people are still using XP or XP 64-bit though too. There was a nice chunk of people,myself included, that avoided Vista like the plague after giving it a initial try. You can get Windows 7 Home Premium OEM at Newegg for around 107 or so I think. Prob cheaper elsewhere even. Not much is going to keep people who have paid for a OS from using it on multiple system builds they do for that matter. Even Win 7 has fixes out now to defeat WGA.

[WCP]

Even Win 7 has fixes out now to defeat WGA.

Pardon my ignorance, but what is WGA?

[PC-ENGINE HELL]

Windows Genuine Advantage
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_Genuine_Advantage

[swlovinist]

I have to admit that I use my computer for games that were not ported to other systems, or just niche stuff. There are a ton of classics that are on computer only, so I have a small collection of computer games and an older computer around just for that. With consoles costing what they do, I think that an average computer could get someone by that wanted to play some of the mainstream games that didn't require a high end setup. Not to mention there is a ton of FREE games available for the system online.

[Poofta!]

for the record i never said my video card, or pc for that matter, was better than his. i think theyre both pretty archaic.


most people dont consider OS price cause frankly, they pirate. its too easy to do, and too expensive otherwise (i lucked out w/ 2 cheap win7 copies)

[WCP]

most people dont consider OS price cause frankly, they pirate. its too easy to do, and too expensive otherwise

You know... that's what I figured. Back in the day, I had a copied version of Windows 98. The thing is, I've had a legit version of Windows XP, came installed on my Compaq PC that I got, and whenever I've had to do various Microsoft related updates, it would run that program where it would try to determine if you had a legitimate version of Windows, and I always felt at ease when it would do that, cause I didn't pirate that version, and didn't have to worry about it. I would think that if I pirated Win 7, I would always be kinda leery of doing various Microsoft updates, because of that. That's why I just figured that I might as well have legit OS nowadays. It does kinda suck that I'm going to have to sink around $95 for the OEM version for system builders, but I guess thems the breaks.....

[Hari Seldon]

You know... that's what I figured. Back in the day, I had a copied version of Windows 98. The thing is, I've had a legit version of Windows XP, came installed on my Compaq PC that I got, and whenever I've had to do various Microsoft related updates, it would run that program where it would try to determine if you had a legitimate version of Windows, and I always felt at ease when it would do that, cause I didn't pirate that version, and didn't have to worry about it. I would think that if I pirated Win 7, I would always be kinda leery of doing various Microsoft updates, because of that. That's why I just figured that I might as well have legit OS nowadays. It does kinda suck that I'm going to have to sink around $95 for the OEM version for system builders, but I guess thems the breaks.....

Same here, I have not one but two copies of Windows 7. OSes last from 3 to 6 years, even more if you are not willing to upgrade.

[Jorpho]

whenever I've had to do various Microsoft related updates, it would run that program where it would try to determine if you had a legitimate version of WindowsYes, that wold be the aforementioned, easily-cracked WGA.