Can you play Roms on the actual system?

[Anthony1]

Ok, this might be a super stuoid question, but here goes anyways...


Wouldn't it be great if you could play all those Super Nintendo or Sega Genesis Roms on an actual SNES or Genesis? I would think that there would be a device, that would plug into the cartridge slot of the Genesis or the Super Nintendo, that would also have a usb connector to hook up to your PC, where you could load Roms on it, and then you could play those actual Roms on the Real console.

So you could use the actual controller, and the real system, in your living room or wherever, and you could play tons and tons of different games for the SNES or Genesis.

Does something like this exist?

If not, why not?


I just think that this would be perfect for the gamer that just isn't happy playing the Roms on a computer screen and wants to play Roms in their living room, kicking back on the sofa.

[YoshiM]

I haven't heard of one, but I'm sure it probably could be done. The question is WOULD anyone. From the NES upwards the companies would build in security chips so only approved carts would work. Couple that with specialized chips to perform certain duties. It's one thing for software ROMs to work on an emulator, I'm sure it's entirely another to run the ROMs on the original hardware. To build a device that would properly communicates with a Genesis or SNES would be time consuming and probably expensive. Then there's the whole legal thing as Nintendo and Sega are both rereleasing their classic titles (slowly but surely). To have a device that both circumvents the security of the system (which is illegal) and to play ROMs that are most likely title the person doesn't have (also can be seen as illegal) to sell this device could be financial suicide.

Bottom line: you probably won't see one. But would it be cool? Yes.

[digitalpress]

Actually I know that you can do this with the N64 "Dr. Z64 Backup" or one of a handful of other similar products, and I'm pretty sure Genesis and Super NES had these "backup units" as well.

Consider also the Cuttle Cart or Intellicart, which play ROMs for Atari 2600 and Intellivision on their consoles, respectively.

[jonjandran]

There have been a lot of devices that did this.
For the nes and snes there were floppy disc drives that hooked up to them and allowed you to copy your games in rom form and then play them off of the floppies. And the N64 had cd drives and zip disc drives that did this , etc.......

[digitalpress]

Here is some info on the SNES and Genesis versions:

http://home.inreach.com/xmikex/console/help.html

[YoshiM]

Ah, I stand corrected. There may not be exact devices you were looking for, but there are alternatives. My bad. :embarrassed:

[NE146]

One of the easier/cheaper ways people use to play roms on an original system is just use a flashcart. As far as I can tell, probably the most popular ones right now are the GBA Flashcarts (Like XGFlash) which of course allow you to play GBA roms on a GBA or GBA player. Also, here's a Genesis flashcart for example: http://www.tototek.com. Don't know if there's one for the snes though.. Although I do know some people use a piece of hardware to backup/play roms on their snes (as mentioned above)

And yep. I use the Cuttle Cart to play 2600 roms on the 2600. :D

[Anthony1]

There have been a lot of devices that did this.
For the nes and snes there were floppy disc drives that hooked up to them and allowed you to copy your games in rom form and then play them off of the floppies. And the N64 had cd drives and zip disc drives that did this , etc.......


Yeah, I know about these devices, but the problem with these is that they require that you have the original cart, and then they copy the original cart. I'm talking about a device that would bypass that altogether. Basically it would have a usb connector, and you would connect it to your PC and you would transfer roms that you have downloaded from the net, into this device. Then you can take this device and plug it into the cartridge slot of a SNES or Genesis, and when you turn the system on, you would get a screen that would show the Roms that are on that device and then you would scroll up or down and highlight the particular rom and the push the button and then you would be playing that game on the actual system without ever needing to come in contact with the original cartridge.

I can't imagine that a device like this would be so hard to make. I'm sure that in Hong Kong they have devices like this.

[Anthony1]

One of the easier/cheaper ways people use to play roms on an original system is just use a flashcart. As far as I can tell, probably the most popular ones right now are the GBA Flashcarts (Like XGFlash) which of course allow you to play GBA roms on a GBA or GBA player. Also, here's a Genesis flashcart for example: http://www.tototek.com. Don't know if there's one for the snes though.. Although I do know some people use a piece of hardware to backup/play roms on their snes (as mentioned above)

And yep. I use the Cuttle Cart to play 2600 roms on the 2600. :D


Ah, yes, now this looks like what I'm talking about! So if I had a MD-PRO 64M Flash Card Kit for Genesis/MegaDrive, then I could transfer roms that I have downloaded off the internet with a usb cable to this device, and then play them on my actual Genesis?

How many games would the 64M version hold?

[hydr0x]

There have been a lot of devices that did this.
For the nes and snes there were floppy disc drives that hooked up to them and allowed you to copy your games in rom form and then play them off of the floppies. And the N64 had cd drives and zip disc drives that did this , etc.......


Yeah, I know about these devices, but the problem with these is that they require that you have the original cart, and then they copy the original cart. I'm talking about a device that would bypass that altogether. Basically it would have a usb connector, and you would connect it to your PC and you would transfer roms that you have downloaded from the net, into this device. Then you can take this device and plug it into the cartridge slot of a SNES or Genesis, and when you turn the system on, you would get a screen that would show the Roms that are on that device and then you would scroll up or down and highlight the particular rom and the push the button and then you would be playing that game on the actual system without ever needing to come in contact with the original cartridge.

I can't imagine that a device like this would be so hard to make. I'm sure that in Hong Kong they have devices like this.

ehm are we really on a collectors board here? i thought it is common knowledge that backup-units exist and how they work

example: Super Wild Cards for SNES, they have disc and/or zip slots so u can play every rom u downloaded, no problem at all, copy it to the disc (or connect per cable) and play your favourite rom on your snes

[YoshiM]

ehm are we really on a collectors board here? i thought it is common knowledge that backup-units exist and how they work

example: Super Wild Cards for SNES, they have disc and/or zip slots so u can play every rom u downloaded, no problem at all, copy it to the disc (or connect per cable) and play your favourite rom on your snes

Anthony1 seems pretty new at this, so cut 'im some slack. I usually don't think about backup units, but I admit a while after I posted my first message the little light bulb came on followed by whapping my forehead with my palm with the words "duh" escaping my lips. So I put my foot in my mouth and I'm a big boy so I admit I was wrong.

::inserts foot into mouth::

Thrrr, ith tha' bdrwrrrr?

[petewhitley]

I've got a Super Pro Fighter (disk-based copy unit) for the SNES and couldn't be happier with it. There are plenty of SNES games I want to play on the big screen w/ the original SNES controller but have no interest in actually purchasing/collecting. It's as easy as sin to use the thing too. I highly recommend them.

[Anthony1]

Sorry, I'm new to all this stuff.


Yes this is a collectors board, but it is also a Video Game Forum for Retrogamers. I'm a RetroGamer, but I don't really care about collecting. I'm really just into playing the old games.

I brought up this question, because I was thinking why should I go out and pay 10 bucks a pop or more for all these SNES games when I can just download the ROM for free and play it on my PC. But then I realized that I really don't like playing these games on the PC, I like holding the REAL controller in my hand and playing the real system. But I don't really care if what is in the cartridge slot is the actual real game, or some type of backup device.

So that is why I brought up this question.

I'm not really familar with the backup devices. I had heard of them in the past, but I had always thought that people would rent a game, then back it up, and then they would basically have it for free. I didn't know that there were backup devices that would actually let you play ROMS that you've downloaded off the internet onto the actual real console. I thought you had to have the physical cartridge first, and then copy it.

[Anthony1]

By the way, while we are on this subject, is there a device like the Super Pro Fighter or Super Wild Cards that works with the TG-16?

[NE146]

You know one option you can do which a LOT of people are doing now is getting an xbox and modding it to play console emulators (http://forums.xbox-scene.com/index.php?s=45919da30c390cff5d10662a8aada0ff&act=SF&f=17).

It may not be the original system, but I will say it's just about as good and comparable an experience sitting on your comfy couch with the big-screen tv with the xbox and it's s-pad in hand as it is with an snes/snes pad in hand. (quite honestly, aside from the pad, I can't tell the difference). ;)

Works great for a lot of systems too.. with Sega CD, 32X, 2600, Colecovision, Genesis emulation being particularly notable

Or you can do a TV-out from your pc. But then portability to different tv's and getting a real good pad become an issue. But you do what you gotta do ;)

[hydr0x]

Sorry, I'm new to all this stuff.


Yes this is a collectors board, but it is also a Video Game Forum for Retrogamers. I'm a RetroGamer, but I don't really care about collecting. I'm really just into playing the old games.



i know that you didn't know about the backup-units, otherwise you wouldn't have asked. Of course you can't know everything if ur new to these things (i also don't know a shit about a lot of systems). I only wanted to express how surprised i was to see that people like Joe don't really know about backup-units as they are quite common and known, it wasn't meant negative, i was only surprised by this.




I brought up this question, because I was thinking why should I go out and pay 10 bucks a pop or more for all these SNES games when I can just download the ROM for free and play it on my PC. But then I realized that I really don't like playing these games on the PC, I like holding the REAL controller in my hand and playing the real system. But I don't really care if what is in the cartridge slot is the actual real game, or some type of backup device.

So that is why I brought up this question.



one simple answer why you shouldn't do it: IT'S ILLEGAL!!!

no really, it's against the whole collecting fun, of course i also play a rom on my backup-unit once in a while, but i mostly use it to check if my snes games have already been dumped or to play translations of japanese games (i mostly own).



I'm not really familar with the backup devices. I had heard of them in the past, but I had always thought that people would rent a game, then back it up, and then they would basically have it for free. I didn't know that there were backup devices that would actually let you play ROMS that you've downloaded off the internet onto the actual real console. I thought you had to have the physical cartridge first, and then copy it.

mh funny thought, then were would the backup-units store the games? on a 4GB hd (in 1992? :o) it would be impossible, you have to have a slot for some kind of storage unit. And one other thing, where do u think do all the roms on the net come from if u couldn't copy them onto disk from the copier? ;)

[Anthony1]

[/quote]

one simple answer why you shouldn't do it: IT'S ILLEGAL!!!



Well, yes technically, it is illegal, but who would I really be hurting by playing illegal versions of SNES and Genesis games? Nintendo? Sega? Third Parties? No.

The only people I would be hurting are people that sell their old games on Ebay and at Flea Markets and Garage Sales. And FuncoLand and GameStop.

These games are so old, the only ones in existence are used ones that have already been sold to a end user. So it's not like I'm hurting Toy's R Us or Target or Wal-Mart buy playing Roms.

I do not, and would not copy or burn games from current systems. Like the XBOX, GameCube or PS2. Or even Dreamcast for that matter. But as far as the really old systems go, I play their Roms on the computer, what really would be the difference if instead of playing them on the PC, I played them on a back up cart on the actual system?

Actually this whole discussion is really a moot point anyway, because either these backup devices are impossible to get ahold of, or they are too ridiculously expensive to even consider.

[petewhitley]

one simple answer why you shouldn't do it: IT'S ILLEGAL!!!


Remember years ago when Nintendo made a strong push arguing that video-game rentals were illegal? :roll: Legality is the last reason I'd do or not do just about anything...

[digitalpress]

Well, yes technically, it is illegal, but who would I really be hurting by playing illegal versions of SNES and Genesis games? Nintendo? Sega? Third Parties? No.

How about "YES".

You're hurting Sega, who might very well have lost a sale to you when they release their next Smash Pack collection for Game Cube, GBA, or PC.

You're hurting Nintendo, who might very well have more cool retro plans in the works like the e-Reader, which plays old games on new systems.

I'm not saying that what you're planning to do is right or wrong, do what you want to do - you know the rules. But don't try to justify it like this. If you call Nintendo or Sega, do you really think they'll say "it's OK"?

[buttasuperb]

Well, yes technically, it is illegal, but who would I really be hurting by playing illegal versions of SNES and Genesis games? Nintendo? Sega? Third Parties? No.

How about "YES".

You're hurting Sega, who might very well have lost a sale to you when they release their next Smash Pack collection for Game Cube, GBA, or PC.

You're hurting Nintendo, who might very well have more cool retro plans in the works like the e-Reader, which plays old games on new systems.

Similar to what I was tryin to get at with that selling Roms argument last week. Yet, for some reason you seemed to be against me on that one.

[digitalpress]

Butta, if you'd just READ something for a change instead of arguing for the sake of it, things may seem a bit clearer.

It's not an issue of whether playing ROMS is right or wrong. I clearly stated that I wasn't arguing that. It's an issue of justifying whether or not it hurts a company that I was debating.

[jonjandran]

one simple answer why you shouldn't do it: IT'S ILLEGAL!!!


Remember years ago when Nintendo made a strong push arguing that video-game rentals were illegal? :roll: Legality is the last reason I'd do or not do just about anything...

Didn't the Rental Companies (Blockbuster , etc ) have to settle out of court in order to rent games and movies? Don't they pay more for their tapes and games to make up for this ?

[buttasuperb]

:hmm:

Yea I READ posts before I reply.

Part of my argument was that selling the MAME discs hurts Playmore since it has Metal Slug 3 and KoF2001 roms on it, and both are available new for Neo Geo and are slated for PS2 releases. Thus, they are still poised to make money from the games, and selling the roms hurts the company. Yet no one gave a shit about that. When you can get those 2 roms amongst many others for 25 bucks, why will people buy the PS2 releases?

In fact, those 2 roms being on the discs that were being sold, were the biggest reason I was pissed off.

[jonjandran]

AH Nevermind ,, everyone just do what they want..... Sorry.

[digitalpress]

In fact, those 2 roms being on the discs that were being sold, were the biggest reason I was pissed off.

I've said it before and I'll say it again. If you don't OWN the game, you're not entitled to the ROM. So regarding your point above, I'm in total agreement if the buyer didn't have them already.

Now to get back onto THIS topic.

Just because the ROM is OLD doesn't make it "legal to own". It doesn't matter if it's Gyruss, or StarFox, or Metal Slug 3. The companies that own the rights to those games may very well have future plans for them, as I've mentioned above.

On the other hand, I think emulation is a GODSEND. I like the fact that if I need a quick fix for something like... a Sega Master System game, I don't have to dig for the game under that precariously perched, teetering stack of games. I can play it on my PC with a HotRod joystick. Is it the same? Not really. Does it satisfy me anyway? Usually, yes.

[buttasuperb]

I've said it before and I'll say it again. If you don't OWN the game, you're not entitled to the ROM. So regarding your point above, I'm in total agreement if the buyer didn't have them already.

I agree completely, that's why I make a big stink over the issue. Especially the selling of roms. Oh, and I really doubt the buyers of those discs have all the CPS2, Neo Geo and other arcade games that are on MAME.


On the other hand, I think emulation is a GODSEND

And I agree again, but on the basis that we don't know when these carts will die, emulation is guaranteed to keep the games alive. Then again, I don't have nearly as many games as you, so I can find any game in my collection rather easily.

[Kid Ice]

:hmm:

Part of my argument was that selling the MAME discs hurts Playmore since it has Metal Slug 3 and KoF2001 roms on it, and both are available new for Neo Geo and are slated for PS2 releases. Thus, they are still poised to make money from the games, and selling the roms hurts the company. Yet no one gave a shit about that. When you can get those 2 roms amongst many others for 25 bucks, why will people buy the PS2 releases?

.

In the case of Metal Slug 3, I'll probably purchase the game because of
playing the rom.

ICE

[buttasuperb]

In the case of Metal Slug 3, I'll probably purchase the game because of
playing the rom.

ICE

Well, that certainly is kick ass to hear. :rocker:

You bring up a good point. I'm not opposed to testing out roms to see if you like a game or not, then buying the game if you like it.

[hydr0x]

Actually this whole discussion is really a moot point anyway, because either these backup devices are impossible to get ahold of, or they are too ridiculously expensive to even consider.

mh not really you can still get them brandnew at some online stores/importers e.g. the SWC DX2 64Mbit for SNES for 250-350 bucksm it plays all roms there are, has a zip drive and is the best backup-unit available for snes

you can get the older versions 24/32Mbit for about 60-80 bucks

[Anthony1]

Well, yes technically, it is illegal, but who would I really be hurting by playing illegal versions of SNES and Genesis games? Nintendo? Sega? Third Parties? No.

How about "YES".

You're hurting Sega, who might very well have lost a sale to you when they release their next Smash Pack collection for Game Cube, GBA, or PC.

You're hurting Nintendo, who might very well have more cool retro plans in the works like the e-Reader, which plays old games on new systems.

I'm not saying that what you're planning to do is right or wrong, do what you want to do - you know the rules. But don't try to justify it like this. If you call Nintendo or Sega, do you really think they'll say "it's OK"?



Actually, I would not be the type of person to buy any Smash Pack collection or e-Reader or anything like that. I have never gotten those Namco Musuem games or anything like that. I don't buy any of the Game Boy Advance remakes either. So they wouldn't have gotten any extra sales from me. Now, of course, that is only me personally, and there could be lots of other people out there that would buy those games but instead just play the Roms on their computer.

I truly think that the only people that would be hurt by MY decision, (not anybody elses decision) would be Ebay and all the Delivery Companies. USPS, UPS, Federal Express, etc, etc. Maybe Goodwill and some Flea Market guys would also be hurt. I can't really say that GameStop or GameCrazy or FuncoLand would be hurt, because I don't buy their retro games anymore anyways, cause they charge too much.

[Achika]

Actually, I would not be the type of person to buy any Smash Pack collection or e-Reader or anything like that. I have never gotten those Namco Musuem games or anything like that. I don't buy any of the Game Boy Advance remakes either. So they wouldn't have gotten any extra sales from me. Now, of course, that is only me personally, and there could be lots of other people out there that would buy those games but instead just play the Roms on their computer.

I truly think that the only people that would be hurt by MY decision, (not anybody elses decision) would be Ebay and all the Delivery Companies. USPS, UPS, Federal Express, etc, etc. Maybe Goodwill and some Flea Market guys would also be hurt. I can't really say that GameStop or GameCrazy or FuncoLand would be hurt, because I don't buy their retro games anymore anyways, cause they charge too much.

You know, this sounds like you don't want to spend any money on this "hobby". You want everything for free, $10 is too much for a cart..you'll just download it and play it. Then you want something to plug that ROM into the system, do you think giving money to a third party to help play those illegal ROMs is any better? No, apparently that's too much also. Well, I hope you're happy, it's people like you that make it harder and harder to work at Gamestop, Funco, etc. You have no idea how many jerks come in and say "Oh, why buy the cow when you can get the milk for free? Go download this ROMzzzz" And as far as flea market dealers, eBay, etc....Just take a look at certain games on there, that go for about 5-20$ MORE than what Gamestop charges, you can't find them at your stores? Oh, well that doesn't speak for the entire country.

You won't buy the Namco's, Smash Packs, E-Reader cards? Why? Because they are already on your computer or because you don't have the "proper" controller? >:(

Just because you view Gamestop, EB, Funco's prices as "high" doesn't make your playing of ROMs to games you don't own "right" I've tried to keep quiet on this topic, but your logic is severly flawed

[Anthony1]

You know, this sounds like you don't want to spend any money on this "hobby". You want everything for free, $10 is too much for a cart..you'll just download it and play it. Then you want something to plug that ROM into the system, do you think giving money to a third party to help play those illegal ROMs is any better? No, apparently that's too much also. Well, I hope you're happy, it's people like you that make it harder and harder to work at Gamestop, Funco, etc. You have no idea how many jerks come in and say "Oh, why buy the cow when you can get the milk for free? Go download this ROMzzzz" And as far as flea market dealers, eBay, etc....Just take a look at certain games on there, that go for about 5-20$ MORE than what Gamestop charges, you can't find them at your stores? Oh, well that doesn't speak for the entire country.

You won't buy the Namco's, Smash Packs, E-Reader cards? Why? Because they are already on your computer or because you don't have the "proper" controller? >:(

Just because you view Gamestop, EB, Funco's prices as "high" doesn't make your playing of ROMs to games you don't own "right" I've tried to keep quiet on this topic, but your logic is severly flawed[/quote]



Whoa, whoa, settle down good buddy. I don't want to spend ANY money on this "hobby". Please. I've spent over 300 bucks on retro gaming in the last 30 days alone! I've bought my original TurboGrafx, Sega Genesis, Super Nintendo, Sega CD, Atari Jaguar, 3DO, Sega Saturn, Sony Playstation, Nintendo 64, Sega Dreamcast, Playstation 2, XBOX and GameCube on the day those systems were released! I have not copied one single game on a CDR for any system that uses CD's. I don't have copied PS2 games, or XBOX games or Dreamcast games, or PS1 games or anything like that.

The Roms that I'm talking about are TurboGrafx, Genesis and Super Nintendo Roms. These are systems that were released in 1989 and 1991. The current year is 2003. These games aren't sold at Toys R US, Target, Wal-Mart, Best Buy, Circuit City, or any place like that. Sure GameStop has a handfull of Genesis carts and like 50 Super Nintendo carts, but that is about it. They buy these games for 50 cents, if even that, and then put a $7.99 or $9.99 or $14.99 sticker on them and sell them with no instruction booklet, box or anything. I've been to every Funcoland, GameCrazy and GameStop within a 20 mile radius of my home, and the vast majority of the games that I have seen for those systems are way, way overpriced in comparison to Ebay. The games that weren't overpriced are no longer there, cause I already BOUGHT THEM! None of these places sell Turbo Grafx games, and alot of these stories have extremely limited selections of Genesis games, with most only having old Sports games that nobody cares about.


Now the jerks that you talk about that come in the store and say why would I want to pay any money for this when I can get the cow for free, probably have a huge collection at home of burned CDR's with XBOX games and PS2 games and PS1 games and Dreamcast games on them. They probably have all those systems modded with special chips in them to play illegal games. They probably download current PC games of IRC and don't pay a penny for those.

Well, I don't have any of that crap. I have never modded any of my systems, and I have never burned any games. I have never downloaded any PC games off the internet for free, either.

Excuse the heck out of me for thinking that it wasn't a capital crime for me to play 12 year old games that are no longer being sold at any retail outlets on my PC! By the way, I don't even play these ROMs! I might play them for 5 minutes to see if I should try to get the actual real game off of Ebay. When I posed the original question about whether or not you could play these downloaded ROMs on the actual system, it was more of a curiousity than anything.

So please don't prejudge somebody that you know nothing about. Leave your impressions in your own brain, next time.

Thank you very much.