Classic Gaming Vs Emulation

[Emuaust]

Sorry if this thread has been done before and if so please lock/merge.

In my Gameroom with all my consoles I also have a PC connected with Sega Saturn style gamepads that is used only as an emulation box. If anyone has seen my room they would know Im far more keen on collecting actual hardware and games then emulation, but its nice to have it there to try stuff out.

After spending some time with it on the weekend, probably the first time in 12 months really, I got wondering and thought Id ask the question, Do you fins any consoles that are greatly improved in your eyes through emulation.

I say yes and it may have something to do with being a PAL gamer but to me I prefer NES emulation over the real thing, all of the games I have that I play via emulation look far more impressive and run faster/smoother. Having native RGB scart for a lot of consoles gives the optimal picture quality for most of my consoles and having an emulator spit a nes image out at 480p is a vast improvement over my av connected Toaster.

Another issue I suppose is relevant to me as a PAL gamer is the fact that some PAL nes titles are horribly slowed down, like Mega Man 2 and playing via a good nes emu fixes this issue.

Another console I have to add is the N64 and once again for pal issues but also I find the console blurry as hell to the point I get headaches from playing it, via emulation with a nice sharpening up, its much more fun, playing games that make you feel ill isnt my idea of a good time.

Id be interested to hear others opinions, as a collector I much prefer using actual hardware and games, there is just a "feel" to it that I love, but there are consoles like the 2600 and the Nes I get more enjoyment out of emulating, is this the case for others?

[Dangerboy]

Sort of depends on the situation, though my reply isn't true emulation to a degree.

I like playing the Wii DLC NES games because they look sharper. I also love playing PSX on the PS3, because Lego issues here and there aside, a lot PSone games look amazing in HDMI.

[Ze_ro]

Having native RGB scart for a lot of consoles gives the optimal picture quality for most of my consoles and having an emulator spit a nes image out at 480p is a vast improvement over my av connected Toaster.
Honestly, I kind of feel the opposite. RF connections and such aside, a lot of games were programmed with the limitations of the system in mind, including the video quality. The blurring effect rounds out the pixels, in a way that sometimes looks better... and some higher end games take advantage of dithering effects to do cheap transparency which ends up looking terrible through an emulator.

Of course, a smart-ass would point out filters like Scale2x (http://scale2x.sourceforge.net), and whatever you want to call this (http://advancemame.sourceforge.net/rgb.html)... but it seems kind of silly to be doing this after the fact.

Ultimately, I like the "authenticity" of sticking actual plastic cartridges into a machine, and holding the proper controller... even if that means I occasionally have to blow the dust out of a cartridge, or solder a broken wire in my controller.

--Zero

[Emuaust]

Ze_ro, I couldnt agree more, as I state, there is just something that I cant put into words that makes playing the real thing fun and having 4000ish games shows I have a passion for this very thing, but to me emulation does improve the Nes experience and as I state, this might be due to playing PAL consoles.

Maybe its time for me to go NTSC Nes.

[Matt-El]

I kinda used to have a thing about playing specifically on the console and using the specific games with it, but now i don't care really.

But the biggest disadvantage to emulation is not everything works exactly how you want it. That's emulation in a nutshell. Works as best as the programmer of the emulator wants it to work or is able to make it work. Like you can't play Starfox 2 on any old emulator, only one specific version. And one emulator displays graphics not quite the same as another. or there's a version problem with different variations of roms in mame, or whatever. Lots of stuff gets in the way of enjoying things fully, but it all depends on your perspective.

Convenience? Nostalgia? Collector craze? Anything can make a person go one way or another. I lean toward convenience nowadays.

[Rickstilwell1]

I usually enjoy emulation on the PC more for the handheld systems. Not having such blurry screens, harder to see screens or battery life sucking makes the games a bit more enjoyable. The one that I really care about is Sega Game Gear as it had a huge library of fun games and there was no device to play it on the TV in full color with sound coming out the TV speakers. I'd say Game Boy / Color / Advance is more enjoyable on a Super Nintendo or GameCube with an adapter but Game Gear has nothing to bridge the cartridges except software emulation. Some emulators like Dega even have the abilty to make the sound better instead of pure 8-bit. Sometimes it's fun to hear the original sound, but the upgraded sound is a bit more pleasing to the ears.

[ReTrO-pLaYeR]

Emulation (on computers) is never a good thing, and doesn't represent how it really feels when experienced on a television set and game controller. And, there's also a few issues on certain computers concerning the speed and such other factors- meaning it might not run at the frame rate you'd normally see. I'm just a purist, but I do on occasion emulate games if I just want to see what they're like.

[kupomogli]

I emulate all my older systems on the PSP. I just don't have the room to have multiple systems hooked up and don't like unhooking and rehooking up, there's the portable factor I like, and some systems, such as the Sega CD, I have games, but no console.

[Berserker]

Emulation (on computers) is never a good thing, and doesn't represent how it really feels when experienced on a television set and game controller.

While I somewhat agree with the second part, I couldn't disagree more with the first.

Emulation has enriched classic gaming almost beyond measure. It allows us to play gems that we either probably or positively wouldn't have the chance to experience otherwise, and it ensures that you, my young classic gaming enthusiast, will never have to go without that which you love for the rest of your life.

I mean, I usually prefer playing on a physical console too, but I also think the people who've worked tirelessly on developing emulation for the last decade or so to the point that it's at now deserve at least a little respect for busting their asses to preserve our passion.

[JSoup]

I used to have a thing about emulation (mostly after I started using it). It bothered me that I was playing a game without physically having it, made me wonder if playing the game 'counted', if you understand my meaning. Then I decided that it didn't matter, as I was mainly emulating games that are damn near impossible to get, so I owning the ROM was just about as good as I was going to get.

These days, I emulate anything pre-PS1.

[goldenegg]

I'm a huge retro gaming fanatic and also a huge fan of the current state of PC/MAC based emulators. I've always liked emulation, but many emulators were laking in many regards, especially those not designed to be cycle-accurate. Timing of the game in many cases could be off ever so slightly, but the overall impact (i.e. feel) of the game was noticeable.

Today, there are extremely solid, cycle accurate emulators for all major consoles pre-PSX. These emulators can go as far as perfectly emulating the flicker and slowdown experienced when playing a game on the original hardware. Playing games on them using a good game pad (I prefer the Saturn type USB pads) can provide an experience that is extremely close to playing on the original console.

Unfortunately, you don't find these emulators ported to other systems such as the PSP or Wii. This is usually due to the large amount of x86 assembly used and/or much higher system requirements over less accurate emulators.

Looking at my own collection of consoles and vintage computers, I find myself using emulation more than going to the original hardware. Why? Convenience. It's simply not possible for me to have everything set up all the time. Doing something like playing a little Bruce Lee on the C64, then Conan on the Apple II and then Ninja Gaiden II on the NES would never happen for me without emulation.

I realize this is a topic that splits the community. The one thing that bothers me are the people who hate emulation, simply because they feel it somehow minimizes their collections. My message to those people? Get over it. I won't argue that there's something 'special' about holding an actual cart in your hands, plugging it in to a system and playing on original hardware. Fact is, that's simply not what everyone wants. In a lot of cases, people just want to play the games. For that, emulation provides a level of accessibility that's makes these games available to a wider audience.

[BetaWolf47]

The pro-hardware arguments here have already summed up my opinion pretty well. For me, it really depends on my mood.

Like Ze_ro said, most older games/systems were made with the limitations in mind. Compare a sharp, pixellated, unfiltered screenshot from an emulator to a smooth, soft picture on the real console and you'll see the difference easily.

Filters like hq2x and Super Eagle don't help much either, in my honest opinion. In most cases, the game is better off looking pixellated. This is because instead of smoothing out pixels, it just makes them round, giving the game an unnatural visual feel. If you're going to use filters, see if your emulator features an NTSC filter or interpolation.

As for sound, I'm very, very nitpicky. Very few emulators have near-perfect sound. It's usually only the top 2 or 3 emulators for each system that compare to the real deal here.

I could go on, but it already feels like we're beating a dead horse here.

[PresidentLeever]

I can sort of understand the smoothening/blurring argument, but since I have a modern TV and good cables, the games end up looking very pixelated anyway. It's especially noticeable in later, western Genesis games. There are good emulator filters for those games though, not smoothening but blurring ones.

I'm definitely in the pro-emu camp, I've found some of my now favourite games that way and it made me get into shooters, a genre I previously disliked.

[BetaWolf47]

You just reminded me of a funny argument someone posted towards me on another forum. When someone said, "Classic games look like crap on HDTVs!" I said that most people still have old SDTVs around. I'm dead serious on this, the person called me selfish for thinking that people should keep SDTVs around, and adhere to "MY" requirements. He was serious about it too.

[skaar]

The controller is the most important thing for me - I can play NES half the devices in my home, but can only use the controller in a limited few of them.

Emulation's biggest curse is the what I call MP3 syndrome - so many games, so little effort, and no desire to stick to one title. "Aw dammit died again." = Savestate, toggle game, come back to it later (maybe)

I just can't stick with games that way. Which is why I hit next on my ipod way too much.

[Robocop2]

They both have their places really. There is no emotional substitue for playing a game on the original hardware at least to me. It definitely is the more authentic way to experince a given game and arguably better under most circumstances. That having been said; the option of emulation does open up alot of opportunity for people to experience games that they would not otherwise have intrest in trying or capability to purchase. Air Raid; as subpar as the game may be; is a good example of a game few would otherwise have the opportunity to experience without emulation.

There is less emotional involvement with having just a ROM image as a file on your computer vs. tracking down the cart/disc and adding it to your collection. One can build quite a substantial collection of images with minimal effort. I was able to collect the entire 2600 library in a matter of minutes and save them to a folder on my computer for example. The collector in me prefers owning hardware and software; The gamer in me is okay with having roms and emulators for the occasional play session as a supplement to my collecting efforts.

From a preservation perspective emulation is the future as eventually physical media will degrade and be lost. Maybe not for some time but eventually. Without some way to preserve the games they will be lost so it does serve that purpose I suppose though there are always the flash carts but that wouldn't address the loss of hardware.

[PresidentLeever]

You just reminded me of a funny argument someone posted towards me on another forum. When someone said, "Classic games look like crap on HDTVs!" I said that most people still have old SDTVs around. I'm dead serious on this, the person called me selfish for thinking that people should keep SDTVs around, and adhere to "MY" requirements. He was serious about it too.

Well, hopefully that was just a dumb kid talking but I do see this kind of attitude around gamers my age as well (24). In this particular case it's hard to blame people though, what with the absolute massive hype around HD. In my country there was even a public announcement from the government (through their TV stations) to make people go out and buy HD TVs for when they went digital.

[JSoup]

The controller is the most important thing for me - I can play NES half the devices in my home, but can only use the controller in a limited few of them.

I forgot about this. I have the same problem. I used to run emulators from my PC, but it's a pain to play an SNES game with a keyboard and it's a hassle trying to find a controller compatible with my rig.

Which is why I now run all my emulators on the Wii, through Homebrew Channel. The Wiimote and Virtual Console controllers are good for just about all your retro needs.

[BetaWolf47]

I'm confused at that. Windows-wise, I've never had a problem finding an emulator that supports run-of-the-mill USB controllers. Compatibility was never an issue really. The hard part is finding decent USB gamepads.

[JSoup]

I'm confused at that. Windows-wise, I've never had a problem finding an emulator that supports run-of-the-mill USB controllers. Compatibility was never an issue really. The hard part is finding decent USB gamepads.

It's mostly because my PC was old as hell when I started learning about emulation. It made finding compatible parts difficult.

[Baloo]

The controller is the most important thing for me - I can play NES half the devices in my home, but can only use the controller in a limited few of them.

Emulation's biggest curse is the what I call MP3 syndrome - so many games, so little effort, and no desire to stick to one title. "Aw dammit died again." = Savestate, toggle game, come back to it later (maybe)

I just can't stick with games that way. Which is why I hit next on my ipod way too much.

That's a very interesting analogy, and it actually fits really well. When you buy a CD or a game, you play it, read the manual, many times over to get a true feel for the game. And sometimes even if you don't like the game or song at first, you might end up liking it later. For emulators, you merely grab one single rom (or in music, some mp3) and play it once or so, either liking it or not liking it, but you miss out on everything included with that song or game if you had bought it new. It's just not the same.

I'm pro-hardware all the way.

[JSoup]

That's a very interesting analogy, and it actually fits really well. When you buy a CD or a game, you play it, read the manual, many times over to get a true feel for the game. And sometimes even if you don't like the game or song at first, you might end up liking it later. For emulators, you merely grab one single rom (or in music, some mp3) and play it once or so, either liking it or not liking it, but you miss out on everything included with that song or game if you had bought it new. It's just not the same.

It's not just that, it's that the game mean theoretically less to you as a ROM than as it would as a physical copy. Mostly because you spent money on the physical copy, so you'd best try to like it. Whereas ROMs are free, if you don't like a single aspect of a game, who cares? Toss it and get a new one.

[Berserker]

I'm confused at that. Windows-wise, I've never had a problem finding an emulator that supports run-of-the-mill USB controllers. Compatibility was never an issue really. The hard part is finding decent USB gamepads.

I feel the same way, which is why I ended up getting a Smartjoy Playstation-to-USB adapter back when Liksang.com was still around. Best $10 I ever spent. I know some folks aren't too fond of the dpad on it, but I've found that the Dual-Shock 2 has just the right combination of controls to where it's extremely adaptable to every emulator I've ever thrown at it.

[BetaWolf47]

Emulation wise, I prefer to use gamepads with a floating dpad. The Logitech controllers turned me off at first since they looked like clones of PS2 controllers. However, the button response and dpad design is perfect. Plus it's very durable too. It's strange, because even ripoffs of that specific gamepad aren't as good as it. I got one by SteelSeries that looks exactly like it, but it's not nearly as good.

Thrustmaster used to have pretty good gamepads too. Not sure which of their pads are still any good.

[JSoup]

I think I need to look into getting a USB controller. For the most part, my emulation is done through the Wii these days, but PS1 modding is rather challenging and requires a bunch of shit. Whereas PS1 emulation, such as it is, is easiest on the PC.

Wanna get my Dragon Quest 7 on. :guitar:

[Arkhan]

to hell with emulators. Use em to test out potential buys, but jesus, they are always crap. All of those 2xSaiUberEagler9er filters make the game look like someone in photoshop had a stroke.


I much rather prefer playing them on a nice CRT TV, with the sound routed out to an amp/speakers, with real controllers in hand.

doing it on PC, with a USB controller, etc, always leaves something to be desired.

and im not about to buy expensive adapters to plug an NES controller into a PC, when I can just use the thing on a real NES, and get the real deal.

[kupomogli]

Whereas PS1 emulation, such as it is, is easiest on the PC.

PSX emulation is easiest done on PSP I think. Instead of having to download the emulator, bios, etc. All you have to do is rip each game and turn it into an eboot file. Then the PSP is pretty much a PSX controller without R2 and L2. Very few games use all the buttons so those few games just edit the controller to what would work best.

[Arkhan]

PS1 emulation is easiest on a PS3 w/ backwards compatibility.

deeeuuhhhhh

[Rickstilwell1]

PS1 emulation is easiest on a PS3 w/ backwards compatibility.

deeeuuhhhhh

uhh all PS3s even the new ones have PS One backwards compatibility. PS2 is the only one they removed later on. It's not really the same kind of emulation much though as you still need the real games for that and can't used a burned copy.

[JSoup]

Super nitpicking, but PSX =/= PS1.

Regardless, PSP modding is way hard. At least, I found it to be way hard (granted, the last time I actually had a PSP was four some odd years ago).

[bartre]

PSP modding isn't that hard.
took me maybe 45 minutes to mod mine.

as far as ps1 emulation, even then it tends to be a pain, mostly for the fact that you've got to figure out which version of the loader to use.
I still haven't gotten a FF8 to work from beginning to end with one plugin.

[Berserker]

as far as ps1 emulation, even then it tends to be a pain, mostly for the fact that you've got to figure out which version of the loader to use.
I still haven't gotten a FF8 to work from beginning to end with one plugin.

Yeah, I'm not too fond of the whole plugin approach that seems to be prevalent in PS1 and N64 emulation. I'd rather have 1 option that does work over 10 options that might work.

[skaar]

For anyone who wants to go that route, dealextreme.com still sells a bunch of PS1/PS2 to USB (or PS3) converters for cheap. I picked up a bunch and do most of my on-the-go emulation with an original PS1 pad (no analog)

Works great.

Also, PS1 and PS2 emulation on my PS3 are by no means perfect - DDR and Space Channel 5 have horrible lag I wasn't able to overcome.

[BetaWolf47]

Why do people insist on buying USB adapters for PS1 controllers for emulation? Really, they don't beat Logitech and some Thrustmaster controllers, perhaps Saitek too.

[Baloo]

It's not just that, it's that the game mean theoretically less to you as a ROM than as it would as a physical copy. Mostly because you spent money on the physical copy, so you'd best try to like it. Whereas ROMs are free, if you don't like a single aspect of a game, who cares? Toss it and get a new one.

Exactly. And you don't really give the game the chance that it deserves.

[Enigmus]

To me, it all depends on the system. I set a copy of Project 64 up with no filtering and a widescreen aspect, and holy shit, Super Mario 64 looks like Van Gogh in 1080i!

So, if you need to give a system a chance, emulation is your pal. If you prefer holding a pad, just eBay yourself a system. It's your choice. I'm just the middle ground guy here.

[Eyedunno]

Why do people insist on buying USB adapters for PS1 controllers for emulation? Really, they don't beat Logitech and some Thrustmaster controllers, perhaps Saitek too.
I've had some really bad experiences with both Thrustmaster and Saitek. Logitech is probably better, but at the time I bought my PS2 controller and adapter, I was through with chancing it; I already knew from experience that PlayStation pads were good and reliable, and besides, I wanted to emulate some FFVII. :P Though presently, I prefer either a USB Saturn pad or an SNES pad through my Super Smart Joy.

[pato]

As many have mentioned, I too prefer playing games on the original console. However, I do have an original xbox modded with a 500gig hd. Got all my xbox games installed along with emulators of consoles I own. Since it is not convienient for me to have all my systems hooked up, I often play games on my xbox on an actual tv with either my xbox controller or my ps2 controller with an adapter. Not to mention I can use my Xbox and PS2 arcade sticks as well. I prefer my emulation this way over playing games on my pc.

[Zing]

Emulation's biggest curse is the what I call MP3 syndrome - so many games, so little effort, and no desire to stick to one title. "Aw dammit died again." = Savestate, toggle game, come back to it later (maybe)

I always referred to this as the "MAME syndrome". Having a complete MAME rom set. Playing an old favorite for about five minutes before moving on to the next.

[BetaWolf47]

I'm starting to have trouble on Master System emulators. I tried both Fusion and Regen, but both had a good bit of lag between the time I pressed a button and when something happened onscreen.

[josekortez]

I recently got my hands on a GP2X, and it is my first attempt at emulation. Before now, I have been very keen on owning physical copies of everything I want. Money and time wasn't a factor until recently. I know it's not the newest version of the GP hardware, but it is pretty great to be able to place the Genesis games I love without having to pull my system out of its crate and then file through a cardboard box full of games to find the cartridge I want to play. When I get an SD card reader and another SD card, I plan to try some homebrew GP2X games because I like the device so much.

[NE146]

I gotta say I emulate anywhere I can... on the PSP, the PC, the Wii, and the Xbox (probably the best (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OWkBOy_fZwc)) and really have no problems with it.

However I think I'm pretty aware of the differences since I used to think it was a lot of fun to set up a real 2600, 5200, NES, Colecovision, Turbografx and others, as well as their emulated versions via an Xbox on an SDTV, and instantly (by switching channels or video inputs) do an A/B comparison and see how close I could get it to look. I'd do this with different emulators for the same console, and if they get updated I'd check it again. Good times.

The truth is I could never EXACTLY match the output of the real thing on a regular SDTV although I've gotten pretty close. There is definitely a difference though, as far as dimensions and aspect ratio. You can resize and tweak to your hearts content but it's very hard to truly match. Also it differs in little details you wouldn't think about until you see it up close and personal like the glowing "spokes" in your ship in 5200 Space Dungeon. also the overall "look" and color is always different.. probably scanlines or something. Also as said above sound is another major factor with some emulators falling just short enough of the actual sound to make a difference. To me this is more annoying. Does it matter in the end though as far as playing games? I guess not really to me for the most part. But if you're a purist it might. I also have to admit I probably wouldn't be so dismissive of it if I also didn't have the real thing available as my comfort blanket if I ever really wanted it. :p

Also there ARE consoles that I can't really stand playing emu'd versions of.. and the Atari VCS is one. Playing it on a D-Pad just feels all wrong and I can't do well in some of the faster games with it. Those games simply need that 2600 Joystick to me, and that buzzing display on a regular SDTV. :D If I'm playing a game to just check it out, emu'd with savestates is fine.

Last thing I'd like to say is my prefered method is obviously the console emulation on the xbox/wii because while PC emulation is definitely superior all around, even with a pad I just have a really hard time sitting on a desk playing something like Simon's Quest on a computer monitor. Also, playing puzzle games like Adventures of Lolo / Eggerland on a PSP while sitting on the crapper = 100% WIN.

[Ed Oscuro]

Why do people insist on buying USB adapters for PS1 controllers for emulation? Really, they don't beat Logitech and some Thrustmaster controllers, perhaps Saitek too.
For USB PSX-compatible stuff, a Xbox 360 pad is pretty good.

For digital eight-way games, the Saturn USB2 pad is good.

Yeah, I don't get USB adapters either, they just add lag - maybe not much though.

I'm starting to have trouble on Master System emulators. I tried both Fusion and Regen, but both had a good bit of lag between the time I pressed a button and when something happened onscreen.
Probably some (another?) issue with your PC's configuration.

[Rickstilwell1]

I'd also like to add that emulation expands my gaming habits. Since emulation and real games play so much differently, it gives me a reason to play through every game I actually like twice - once on hardware and once on emulator with savestates and fast forwarding when I want to speed parts of the game up.

It's like I'm trying to build up a collection of complete save battery files acquired through my own work as well as save states for game endings of games that don't save. I know those cartridge batteries are going to die on me someday so emulation removes the frustration of that fact in long RPGs. I actually tend to beat pre-Playstation RPGs on emulators first because of that fact. I spent a long long time getting through the NES Final Fantasy trilogy and when I was done I was pleased so I bought repros of the two unreleased in USA games so I could enjoy them on hardware in what I would call "hard mode." Now I'm trying to beat the Dragon Warrior series and it is taking forever. I'm stuck at the end of Dragon Warrior 2 where you have to spend days leveling up to fight the end boss. (Thank you fast-forward option, it still takes days using this method....)

[Ed Oscuro]

Since emulation and real games play so much differently, it gives me a reason to play through every game I actually like twice - once on hardware and once on emulator with savestates and fast forwarding when I want to speed parts of the game up.
Heh, it's true. Even when the emulation is accurate, it's a different way to play. A bit like playing some early Toaplan "mash the button" arcade shooter with autofire circuits and without.

That said, I only tend to play any given game one way or the other. I did just recently get a real copy of Sweet Home, though, so I'll try to play that one in the original language sometime (played through the translated ROM some years back).

[tomaitheous]

Why do people insist on buying USB adapters for PS1 controllers for emulation? Really, they don't beat Logitech and some Thrustmaster controllers, perhaps Saitek too.

I've had one since they first started coming out... (probably going on 8-9 years I think). I like the PS1 dual shock d-pad (using the "PS-one" version of the controller. White matches my PC case), better than the PC game pads out there. And I'm used to this shape, too. I've used a 360 controller before as well, but the d-pad is poor. Which is too bad since the I love the everything else about that controller.

To the original poster, yeah - I can see those points. But I personally like the look of the original NES NTSC output. And emulation gives me this:
http://alexandria66.2mhost.com/~pcengine/nes_emu_snots/blastermaster1.PNG
http://alexandria66.2mhost.com/~pcengine/nes_emu_snots/crystalis1.PNG
Nestopia does an awesome job at this, as well as letting you control all those emulated artifact, blurring, tint, saturation, fringing, screen curvature, etc. It's perfect.

So I'm happy playing NES emulation on my PC, with my 19" PC display. My real NES system sits on the shelf along with the large stack of games for it. Every once in a while, I'll fire it up. Then I quickly remember why I use emulation over the damn finicky cart connector (and having to sit somewhere else to play the games, and not in my comfy computer chair).

Edit: fixed links

[Eyedunno]

It's like I'm trying to build up a collection of complete save battery files acquired through my own work as well as save states for game endings of games that don't save. I know those cartridge batteries are going to die on me someday so emulation removes the frustration of that fact in long RPGs.
Indeed. This is the #1 reason I got an SNES PowerPak (the other reason was for the potential for homebrew, which hasn't been realized yet, but maybe someday...), though it also turns out to be really nice to have almost my entire collection on one cart. I also have a Mash-Mods programmer that I used to back up my saves that weren't already lost, like my near-perfect FFV save.

Edit:

I've used a 360 controller before as well, but the d-pad is poor. Which is too bad since the I love the everything else about that controller.
Yeah. The 360 controller might well by my favorite controller ever if not for that horrible, horrible d-pad, which is probably in the top three worst I've ever used.

As for emulation, yeah, I agree with others that the best application of emulation is in the portable arena. It's so awesome to be able to bring a whole bunch of classics on the go, even if they don't play 100% perfectly.

[tentencanidae]

I think after years of just assuming that the real games are better than emulation, simply becasue they're real... I've changed my mind.

I haven't changed my answer though. I still think the real games are better. But think about it with an iPod perspective.

If you, like me, were a child growing up during retro gaming years.. Then when you play your old games, it goes far deeper. It brings back memories of my old childhood friends, going with mom or grandma to buy the games at Toys"R"Us or Bradlees (Back when you took a card from a plastic pocket to the register for the real game). Even places like Consumers or Alexanders (If you're from Northern NJ).

I feel like people from my generation (Circa 1980) have a special bond with the products of our childhood. The 80's we're the years of excess. There were the largest marketing campaigns of all-time. Parents generally had more money, regardless of social class, to buy kids games and toys.

Nothing beats grabbing a Coca-Cola at a Pizzaria, and remembering pumping quarters into Ms. Pac-Man and Arkanoid... Nothing beats catching a glimpse or hearing mention of classic Transformers or He-Man... and certainly, there's nothing like playing Super Mario.

As for everyone else, emulation seems like the better way to go in every aspect. These games were never dear childhood items to them. They can fit every NES game ever made on a thumbdrive, with an emulator that runs off of it. It's nostalgic to THEM, as a part of realizing the history of gaming. It's roots.

I on the other hand, have much stronger bonds with these games.

Would the game be just as good if I had a modded USB NES Gamepad? Probably.
Would the gameplay or storyline be different? Probably not.
Would it still just not be the same? Absolutely.

I buy NES games because it keeps me young at heart. My body gets older (29), and my life moves on... but I still have a sacred place I can disappear to for a few hours, and be a little kid all over again. It's cheesy... but true.

On the other hand... I wasn't involved with Amiga, Commodore 64, or Amstrad.. So emulator's on my hacked XBOX are perfect for me. I can still try an old classic out when I'd like, but I have no lifelong bond with those games.

[Emuaust]

This sums up perfectly my opinions on emulation, Its a great way to play games and if you dont have that nostalgic attatchment to the system then its the way to go.

[arcadecup]

I dislike emulation it never feels right playing the game without its soul (original hardware). I only use it for reference nothing else.

[BetaWolf47]

I've had one since they first started coming out... (probably going on 8-9 years I think). I like the PS1 dual shock d-pad (using the "PS-one" version of the controller. White matches my PC case), better than the PC game pads out there. And I'm used to this shape, too. I've used a 360 controller before as well, but the d-pad is poor. Which is too bad since the I love the everything else about that controller.

Well, that's the thing. At least 90% of all PC controllers nowadays are modeled after the Dual Shock. It's not like you need to get used to a new shape or design. Logitech Dual Action, for example, is almost an exact clone of the Dual Shock 2, but uses a different finish, different button design, a different dpad, and a slightly different shape. These differences are, in my and others' opinions, improvements. The buttons give a more pleasant feel upon pressing them, the analog sticks are pinpoint accurate, the finish prevents your hands from slipping, the dpad is among the most accurate ever, and the different design conforms to your hand. This is just one controller as an example, though.

Even playing an NES game on PC using a PC controller feels more natural to me :P

[Sabz5150]

Classic gaming on the original console because Coke from a glass bottle just tastes better.

Its the real thing or nothing.

[tomaitheous]

Well, that's the thing. At least 90% of all PC controllers nowadays are modeled after the Dual Shock. It's not like you need to get used to a new shape or design. Logitech Dual Action, for example, is almost an exact clone of the Dual Shock 2, but uses a different finish, different button design, a different dpad, and a slightly different shape. These differences are, in my and others' opinions, improvements. The buttons give a more pleasant feel upon pressing them, the analog sticks are pinpoint accurate, the finish prevents your hands from slipping, the dpad is among the most accurate ever, and the different design conforms to your hand. This is just one controller as an example, though.

Even playing an NES game on PC using a PC controller feels more natural to me :P

I've tried many a PC gamepad over the years. I only have one PSX to USB adapter, so I've had to buy additional PC gamepads for two player games and such. I have been through quite a bit of controllers (including logictech). They feel cheap. They definite don't last long. There decent, but nothing I've experienced with better than the PSX dual shock controller, for retro gaming. I rarely use the analog control stick of the dual shock because I hate the delay you get (for digital dpad games, it never translates correctly because of the "threshold" point). Nothing can replace a dpad for games made with for a dpad (except maybe a digital stick, but even then...). If I had to rate my favorite PC gamepad, it would have to be the MS sidewinder gamepad (usb version). The Dpad was nice and the button layout was nice for arcade emulation (SF2 style). The controller itself was comfortable and didn't feel cheap.

Also, to the guy that was nit picking: PSX=PS1. Get over it, already ;)

[kedawa]

Years of emulating have made me completely intolerant of the flickering mess that most NES games turn into on real hardware, but other than that I do prefer playing the real thing.

[BetaWolf47]

I've tried many a PC gamepad over the years. I only have one PSX to USB adapter, so I've had to buy additional PC gamepads for two player games and such. I have been through quite a bit of controllers (including logictech). They feel cheap. They definite don't last long. There decent, but nothing I've experienced with better than the PSX dual shock controller, for retro gaming. I rarely use the analog control stick of the dual shock because I hate the delay you get (for digital dpad games, it never translates correctly because of the "threshold" point). Nothing can replace a dpad for games made with for a dpad (except maybe a digital stick, but even then...). If I had to rate my favorite PC gamepad, it would have to be the MS sidewinder gamepad (usb version). The Dpad was nice and the button layout was nice for arcade emulation (SF2 style). The controller itself was comfortable and didn't feel cheap.

I guess I'm just lucky. I had a supposedly cheap Thrustmaster controller that has lasted me nearly a decade.
http://ii.alatest.com/product/90x90/b/b/Thrustmaster-Firestorm-Digital-2-0.jpg
That baby has 12 buttons and a quite responsive dpad. It's odd, because the Firestorm line is supposed to be really cheap and brittle. That thing is godly for any system that doesn't use a joystick or analog stick. This gets my vote, unless we're discussing N64 emulation.

I'm surprised at the Logitech one breaking on you. Maybe it was the first model Dual Action?
http://www.logitech.com/assets/450/450.jpg
Either way, I've had the 2nd model dual action and a G5 gaming mouse, and they have both held up well despite me not taking good care of either.

Well, if you've never had a good PC controller, I'd say you're just unlucky. I've had bad ones myself, but between the 3 big companies (Logitech, Thrustmaster, and Saitek), there are some great controllers out there.

[poloplayr]

The controller is the most important thing for me - I can play NES half the devices in my home, but can only use the controller in a limited few of them.

Emulation's biggest curse is the what I call MP3 syndrome - so many games, so little effort, and no desire to stick to one title. "Aw dammit died again." = Savestate, toggle game, come back to it later (maybe)

I just can't stick with games that way. Which is why I hit next on my ipod way too much.

Amen.

[GuyinGA]

I don't have a problem with emulation (most of the games I've played/beaten are emulated), but I am aware that my computer will not capture all the nuances of the actual NES or SNES or Genesis system. Even then, it's nice to play games that cost a small fortune to acquire in actual cart form (i.e. Stadium Events, Sanro Carnival '92 Recca, etc.)

And I use Logitech Dual Action to somewhat make it similar to a real system....although PS1 games are a lot better with it IMO.

Plus, it's nice to use more than the maximum allowed Game Genie/Action Replay/Gameshark codes if you do that sort of thing.