Bioware Writer: JRPGs are not RPGs

[Famidrive-16]

Back to shitty character designs; I refused to play Resident Evil 4 for almost two years based solely on the stupid emo haircut that Leon Kennedy has.

uh, wow

[shopkins]

No one needs more than one belt. If you have one belt to hold your pants up, you're good. Okay, I guess gunslingers are an exception, but there's no way that huge honking Gunblade is going to fit in those belts around Squall's hips so he can't use that as an excuse.

[Richter Belmount]

While I'm not into the FF series, I really don't think that the character designs are that terrible. What I do find intolerable is the human beings that feel that dressing like their favorite FF characters will make them "cool". If I see one more emo flamer with his hair styled like Cloud I will spray him in the face with Windex.

Back to shitty character designs; I refused to play Resident Evil 4 for almost two years based solely on the stupid emo haircut that Leon Kennedy has.

The post that has made the most sense so far

[Poofta!]

Oh yeah. He said that shit. What do you think about it?

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http://www.strategyinformer.com/news...13-isnt-an-rpg

Talking with Strategy Informer about the upcoming release of Star Wars: The Old Republic, Daniel Erickson, Writing Director for Bioware said that Final Fantasy XIII isn't an RPG. This was in reply to a question about the main staple of The Old Republic being its story, and how the game might be affected without good game play to support it, much like Final Fantasy XIII was.

"Well, before I address the main point I just want to take a slightly more controversial route: You can put a 'J' in front of it, but it's not an RPG. You don't make any choices, you don't create a character, you don't live your character... I don't know what those are - adventure games maybe? But they're not RPG's." said Erickson.

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As someone who has been playing JRPGs since Dragon Warrior, has completed dozens of them, has enjoyed them immensely, who has more than a hundred easily in his collection but still drools at the pics of more accomplished collections posted here, and who still regularly buys new ones...

I agree. They can be great games and a lot of fun but they're for the most part misnamed. JRPGs combine stats, visual novel storytelling and adventure elements in a wonderful stew, but somebody decades ago looked at them and saw superficial resemblances to Dungeons and Dragons and now we're stuck with the inaccurate name.

i agree with you as well, shopkins. and i am someone who has literally hundreds of JRPGs and just about every major PC RPG. =]

[Ed Oscuro]

The phrase "role playing" doesn't necessarily imply a lack of constrictions, to me.
That might be because it means that you are, in fact, playing with constrictions, by a set of rules: in a role.

I agree with Shopkins agreeing with me (thanks!), these are Adventurish games. TACTICOOL too (but not tactful :( )



The entire battle engine of Mass Effect, Bioshock and Fallout 3 is an FPS with stat building thrown in.
There's a screamer. Did you not read what Mister Sothy wrote?

The entire battle engine of JAPANESE ADVENTURE GAME X is a Sim City with stat building thrown in.


The post that has made the most sense so far
Especially the part Famidrive-16 quoted.

[Richter Belmount]

Fami 16 who? I see an astrocade

[Ed Oscuro]

Fami 16 who? I see an astrocade
Because you cited an astrocade post as the one that "made the most sense," remember? It's all on this page. (I am hating DP's forum system dropping nested quotes, you lose the context too often.)

Here is the full texts:

astrocade: I didn't play Resident Evil 4 because of bad hairs!
Famidrive-16: wow
Richter Belmount: APPROVED!11

[Richter Belmount]

Because you cited an astrocade post as the one that "made the most sense," remember? It's all on this page. (I am hating DP's forum system dropping nested quotes, you lose the context too often.)

Here is the full texts:

astrocade: I didn't play Resident Evil 4 because of bad hairs!
Famidrive-16: wow
Richter Belmount: APPROVED!11

Approved!

[mobiusclimber]

There's a screamer. Did you not read what Mister Sothy wrote?

The entire battle engine of JAPANESE ADVENTURE GAME X is a Sim City with stat building thrown in.

So far no one has stated WHY these games should be considered RPGs. I think it's a valid question. Seems like the internetz has decided that the Zelda series isn't an RPG (to the point of people being flamed for saying it is) AND YET games that play even less like an RPG and have even less to do w/ an RPG are being called RPG. I'd like to know why. I've played them and I really don't see the connection. And so far neither you nor "Mister Sothy" has stated why. Instead of slagging off someone's opinion, you might want to state one of your own.

[Astrocade]

Approved!

I approve your approval! :D

[j_factor]

So far no one has stated WHY these games should be considered RPGs. I think it's a valid question. Seems like the internetz has decided that the Zelda series isn't an RPG (to the point of people being flamed for saying it is) AND YET games that play even less like an RPG and have even less to do w/ an RPG are being called RPG. I'd like to know why. I've played them and I really don't see the connection. And so far neither you nor "Mister Sothy" has stated why. Instead of slagging off someone's opinion, you might want to state one of your own.

http://www.digitpress.com/forum/showthread.php?t=113452 :)

[Ed Oscuro]

So far no one has stated WHY these games should be considered RPGs.
That's not what my point was. Let's talk about one thing or something else, only one at a time, please.

The point was that it's simply insane to say that, as Mister (don't you forget it) Sothy said, a viewpoint dictates the game type. If this isn't what you intended, that's great, but it's what I saw written.

You can role play and you can shoot at the same time. (Disagree? Vampire the Masquerade: Bloodlines should be in your playlist.) You can role play a race car driver, you can do whatever. All this crap is stuck in peoples' minds because of D&D, as has been mentioned before, but having fancy shiny sticks does not role playing make, nor does 2D. I would agree that "role playing" is a term that could mean almost anything; after all, when you grab the joystick, you are "playing" a role, no matter what game, even if it's a really strange and not at all likely version of the role (the "play" part covers that unlikeliness or unrealism).

But by the reasoning you gave earlier, I guess we should all be adhering to the One True Religion, and saying that any game which doesn't have flanking, or AOEs, or twenty sided die cannot be an RPG. I mean look at these sad television games, they don't even have a third dimension for chrissakes! Not enough bags of holding either.

Instead of slagging off someone's opinion, you might want to state one of your own.
We're stuck in doldrums of lol here; I already wrote a lot back on post #28 (http://digitpress.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1720973&postcount=28).

So instead of writing insane stuff and taking me to task for not having addressed something else (which wasn't the point of my post), please spend a minute to read what I wrote before. It may not be life-changing but at least you can see that I attempted to break out of the mold here before it lapsed back into "LOL I DIDNT PLAYED RE5 BAD ARCHER WOMAN!1 DONT LIKE THEMS" and "fps cannot be it have rts in it"

[Poofta!]

this thread is hilarious. for the record i am totally gonna take Mr Oscuro's side here. and we dont even get along most of the time. I'd like to think i know a thing or two about RPGs; and he hit the nail on the head there.

[Ed Oscuro]

this thread is hilarious. for the record i am totally gonna take Mr Oscuro's side here. and we dont even get along most of the time. I'd like to think i know a thing or two about RPGs; and he hit the nail on the head there.
Anybody who gets along with that many girls is...I don't know where I was going with that, but thanks.

[mobiusclimber]

The point was that it's simply insane to say that, as Mister (don't you forget it) Sothy said, a viewpoint dictates the game type. If this isn't what you intended, that's great, but it's what I saw written.

You can role play and you can shoot at the same time. (Disagree? Vampire the Masquerade: Bloodlines should be in your playlist.) You can role play a race car driver, you can do whatever. All this crap is stuck in peoples' minds because of D&D, as has been mentioned before, but having fancy shiny sticks does not role playing make, nor does 2D. I would agree that "role playing" is a term that could mean almost anything; after all, when you grab the joystick, you are "playing" a role, no matter what game, even if it's a really strange and not at all likely version of the role (the "play" part covers that unlikeliness or unrealism).

But by the reasoning you gave earlier, I guess we should all be adhering to the One True Religion, and saying that any game which doesn't have flanking, or AOEs, or twenty sided die cannot be an RPG. I mean look at these sad television games, they don't even have a third dimension for chrissakes! Not enough bags of holding either.

We're stuck in doldrums of lol here; I already wrote a lot back on post #28 (http://digitpress.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1720973&postcount=28).

So instead of writing insane stuff and taking me to task for not having addressed something else (which wasn't the point of my post), please spend a minute to read what I wrote before. It may not be life-changing but at least you can see that I attempted to break out of the mold here before it lapsed back into "LOL I DIDNT PLAYED RE5 BAD ARCHER WOMAN!1 DONT LIKE THEMS" and "fps cannot be it have rts in it"

My point before had nothing to do w/ first-person as opposed to third-person. It had to do with a game that is 90% one genre throwing in 10% of another and calling it that second genre. Don't hide a chocolate chip inside a jar of peanut butter and then have the nerve to call it a Reese's. Games like Mass Effect are basically the new Castlevania IIs. Yeah, you talk to people, and yeah you can "upgrade" your character, but it's more about having the right items and quick reflexes than it is about having the right level or stats. Or maybe I really am just far off base. I've tried to play Mass Effect and Fallout 3 and the like, and got bored and frustrated. Maybe they become more of an RPG after 20 hours or something. I dunno.

[Poofta!]

My point before had nothing to do w/ first-person as opposed to third-person. It had to do with a game that is 90% one genre throwing in 10% of another and calling it that second genre. Don't hide a chocolate chip inside a jar of peanut butter and then have the nerve to call it a Reese's. Games like Mass Effect are basically the new Castlevania IIs. Yeah, you talk to people, and yeah you can "upgrade" your character, but it's more about having the right items and quick reflexes than it is about having the right level or stats. Or maybe I really am just far off base. I've tried to play Mass Effect and Fallout 3 and the like, and got bored and frustrated. Maybe they become more of an RPG after 20 hours or something. I dunno.

yeah youre far off base. and honestly probably very bad at both games.

you know you can play those games by pausing the action and assigning firing commands, right? and you dont even need to be gunning in mass effect! in fact, reflexes wont help you too much cause damage and accuracy and defense and resistance to fire is still calculated behind the scenes with stats (not your trigger finger and WASD keys)

you should read daria's post, the one that you were linked to earlier on this page. exploration, barter system, freedom to shape your adventure etc etc all RPG elements. ME and Fallout have much more in common w/ RPGs than FPSs. i wonder how much your mind would change if their perspective was bird's eye? since the only thing even remotely linking them them the Halos and Lost Planets out there, is perspective.

[Sothy]

I would like to point out mobiusclimber... for hating fallout 3 and "not having played the old ones" it's weird you use that avatar yeah?


That would be like me posting how shitty and stupid DOOM is...

[Icarus Moonsight]

But Doom would have been completely stupid... If it weren't for all that damn pesky 'fun' getting in the way... And those blasted van-hippy kids and their Great Dane.

[Astrocade]

you know you can play those games by pausing the action and assigning firing commands, right? and you dont even need to be gunning in mass effect!

So you're saying that they're really just shitty First Person Shooters?

[kupomogli]

I've never played Mass Effect so I can't really say anything about that one, but I'm with Mobius Climber when it comes to Fallout 3. Fallout 3 is more like a first person shooter than an RPG.

Sure you take quests, set your specific stats, gain levels to get different perks on how your character plays, etc. VATS is an auto targeting system that has a much higher hit percent and hit percent is based on if you have the one VATS perk as well as your distance from an enemy, stuff in the way, etc.

If you were to try and shoot someone in the head and missed by a half inch, there wouldn't be a roll to see if the bullet somehow curves into their head making you hit. The same thing if you hit someone in the head or the arm, etc. It's not going to just miss. Though there are critical hits.

So yeah. The main gameplay mechanic of Fallout 3 is an FPS. It's an FPS you can more thoroughly customize your character though it more resembles an RPG than most games the RPG tag is thrown on. Zelda, Alundra, Castlevania, etc.

I was reading VGChartz the other day and the term RPG is being used so loosely that Red Dead Redemption was called an RPG in a few of their stories. About the only thing RDR has in common with an RPG are the missions that can be taken, purchasing items, and an inventory. So is GTA an RPG.

[Icarus Moonsight]

Life is an RPG. It's a secret to everybody.

[Gameguy]

It's funny how people are mentioning DOOM.

DOOM RPG
http://www.doomrpg.com/n.x/Doom%20RPG/Home