powerbase converter vs. sega master system - which is better?

[c0ldb33r]

I never owned a SMS when I was a kid, we (and everyone else I knew) were NES owners.

I've got a SMS (model 1) system and a bunch of games now which I quite like, but because I never owned the system as a kid, I've got no nostalgic love for it. I was thinking of selling the SMS system and getting a powerbase converter instead. This will give me more space and one less system to hook up.

Is there any benefit to having an actual SMS over a powerbase coverter?

[BetaWolf47]

Power Base Converter is not 100% compatible.

[sixwayshot]

Power Base Converter is not 100% compatible.

There's, like, 1 game that can't be used with it. Others may need a SMS controller to work, but they work just fine.

And that one game that won't work is F-16 Fighting Falcon, which isn't good. At all.

Or am I wrong? Is there more to the compatibility?

[diskoboy]

F-16 Fighting Faclon is the only game not compatible with the converter.

But all other games (card or cartridge) and perepherials work fine, including the Segascope 3-D glasses. And IIRC, the converter won't fit on model 2 Genny's. There is a version that fit's on model 2 consoles, but it was only released in Europe.

They're both equal, IMO. But most people prefer the converter, because it's basically like having two systems in one. I have a Genny and a SMS.

The only problem I know of with the converters is the capacitors in them had a tendency to dry up quick. And since the converter was basically a pass-through device with no chips of it's own, gameplay would become glitchy - like an NES with a bad 72-pin connector. But it's an easy fix if you're handy with a soldering iron.

[Greg2600]

PBC is more compatible than the SMS Model 2!

[Baloo]

Go with the PBC, it doesn't take up nearly as much space, and has all the functionality of a full Master System, minus all of ONE game.

It also looks nicer.

[j_factor]

The Power Base Converter lacks Snail Maze. :p

[Blitzwing256]

snail maze does exist on cart though (brazilian)

[c0ldb33r]

My main genesis unit is a CDX - I know the PBC doesn't work with a model 2 or 3 genesis, but I'm pretty certain it works with a CDX (it just looks funny), correct?

[j_factor]

My main genesis unit is a CDX - I know the PBC doesn't work with a model 2 or 3 genesis, but I'm pretty certain it works with a CDX (it just looks funny), correct?

It works, but the power plug is a tight fit. It actually also works fine with a model 2 if you saw off the back part that hangs down.

[diskoboy]

It does not work with the Model 3/Majesco Genesis.

[todesengel]

As everyone else has already said just go with the PBC and sell off your SMS. Keep at least one SMS controller around for those games that won't work with a Genesis controller though.

[InsaneDavid]

It actually also works fine with a model 2 if you saw off the back part that hangs down.

Same with the JVC X'Eye, once you cut the back off the PBC.

[MarioMania]

..or get a Honey Bee Adapter for the PBC for the Genny 2

[ccovell]

For US systems at least, the Genesis' video output with the PBC is slightly superior to the SMS'. Plus Gen pads are 10x better than SMS pads. I can't think of any (realistic, non-snail maze) upside to using a US SMS system.

[Oldskool]

If your Genesis 1 is S-Video modded, I would think you can benefit from the mod on a PBC as well. One of these days I'll get into SMS, there is just so much SG/MD to deal with first.

[j_factor]

..or get a Honey Bee Adapter for the PBC for the Genny 2

That's a good idea, never thought of that.

[InsaneDavid]

Plus Gen pads are 10x better than SMS pads.

Moot point since you can use a Genesis controller with the SMS. Also, as has been said, you need to keep an SMS pad around either way for the few games that won't work with a Genesis controller - Wonder Boy in Monster Land comes to mind.

[Nintega Grafx-16]

I personally had a bad experience with the PBC. Games used to freeze up and reset automatically on my old one. As for the Master System I got later on, I had never had any technical issues with it.

[Orion Pimpdaddy]

There's a little bit of good and bad regarding the Power Base Converter. If you mod a Genesis to s-video, your Power Base Converter will get the s-video as well, according to what someone else told me. However, Wikipedia talks about a problem with the Power Base Converter:

"When a Master System game is inserted, the system puts the Z80 in control, leaving the Mega Drive's main 68000 processor idle. The power base converter had inferior capacitors however, meaning that after a few years use, the system may suffer from glitchy play, to rectify this the user must remove the capacitors from the board or replace them."

[Nintega Grafx-16]

There's a little bit of good and bad regarding the Power Base Converter. If you mod a Genesis to s-video, your Power Base Converter will get the s-video as well, according to what someone else told me. However, Wikipedia talks about a problem with the Power Base Converter:

"When a Master System game is inserted, the system puts the Z80 in control, leaving the Mega Drive's main 68000 processor idle. The power base converter had inferior capacitors however, meaning that after a few years use, the system may suffer from glitchy play, to rectify this the user must remove the capacitors from the board or replace them."

Hm. No wonder mine was glitching up. Thanks for the info.

[Emperor Megas]

The Power Base Converters saves space and is easier to hook up if you're not going to have another system permanently set up, however you can't play one game (F-16 Fighting Falcon) that you probably wouldn't have wanted to anyway, and sometimes the PBC can be moody and carts have to be reinserted a few times to connect with the pins on the board properly.

The SEGA Master System has Snail Maze, and Safari Hunt and Hang-On built into most systems, so that's three free games right off the bat, albeit bottom tier ones. The pause button on the Master System is also lot easier to reach than the one on the PBC, and you probably won't have as many issues with games not loading because of a loose contact either.

If price and appearance are a factor, I'm pretty sure that the PBC costs a little less, on average, and you can usually get one in better cosmetic condition than the Master System, which is prone to scratching.

It's also worth noting that the Master System has access panel underneath for an unused expansion port which is a great place to hide a few joints from your wife or girlfriend, if you're into that sort of thing. You'll have to cut out the little plastic guard to access it though. The Genesis has a similar port, but it's utilized by the SEGA CD add-on, so...

[Baloo]

The SEGA Master System has Snail Maze, and Safari Hunt and Hang-On built into most systems, so that's three free games right off the bat, albeit bottom tier ones. The pause button on the Master System is also lot easier to reach than the one on the PBC, and you probably won't have as many issues with games not loading because of a loose contact either.

Master systems came with either Snail Maze or Safari Hunt/Hang-On, not both. How is it easier to reach on the Master System compared to the PBC? In all honesty, they're both on the console.


It's also worth noting that the Master System has access panel underneath for an unused expansion port which is a great place to hide a few joints from your wife or girlfriend, if you're into that sort of thing. You'll have to cut out the little plastic guard to access it though. The Genesis has a similar port, but it's utilized by the SEGA CD add-on, so...

I Lol'd.

[nebrazca78]

...sometimes the PBC can be moody and carts have to be reinserted a few times to connect with the pins on the board properly.

This is the main reason not to like the PBC. If your Genesis cart slot is well used the PBC can be a pain. There is an extra connection being made that has the opportunity to make poor contact. Under this circumstance even if you get the game to start it may decide to stop working at any time. This is also a common problem with the 32X. But if your Genesis slot is nice and tight you won't have much of a problem unless the caps are bad. I know people that love F-22 but I agree with almost everyone else that it isn't a must play so the loss of this one game shouldn't hurt.



The SEGA Master System has Snail Maze, and Safari Hunt and Hang-On built into most systems, so that's three free games right off the bat, albeit bottom tier ones.

IMO Hang On & Safari Hunt are great games.



If price and appearance are a factor, I'm pretty sure that the PBC costs a little less, on average, and you can usually get one in better cosmetic condition than the Master System, which is prone to scratching.

I've seen a ton of crapped out PBCs that looked like people had been playing hockey with them. They all still worked though. I think generally speaking the PBC is more reliable than the SMS Model 1 console. Less stuff to go wrong.

Not having to screw with swapping cords all the time is worth switch in itself. Plus if you have a Sega CD Model 1 the whole setup looks killer and you get three systems in the space of one.

Or if you have a CDX and have the PBC version 2 that's even better. But the PBC II has no card slot and goes for $100 to $200 from what I've seen so there are drawbacks.



It's also worth noting that the Master System has access panel underneath for an unused expansion port which is a great place to hide a few joints from your wife or girlfriend, if you're into that sort of thing. You'll have to cut out the little plastic guard to access it though. The Genesis has a similar port, but it's utilized by the SEGA CD add-on, so...

The Saturn also has a nice easy access back door for hiding illegal drugs.

[Nintega Grafx-16]

I think generally speaking the PBC is more reliable than the SMS Model 1 console. Less stuff to go wrong.

I have never seen a faulty SMS 1 in my lifetime. Sega built those like tanks unlike those used PBCs which chances are, like Orion mention earlier, have fried caps that causes it to makes it freeze and reset repeatedly. (happended to me)

[nebrazca78]

I have never seen a faulty SMS 1 in my lifetime. Sega built those like tanks unlike those used PBCs which chances are, like Orion mention earlier, have fried caps that causes it to makes it freeze and reset repeatedly. (happended to me)

I sold a lot of four or five non-functional SMS Model 1 systems on eBay a few months ago. They get loose power jacks, stop turning on at all, have software errors and I also had one where it worked but the video was all messed up the top and bottom halves of the screen were not aligned correctly. But then again I probably have 10X more SMS systems pass through my hands than the average person.

[Emperor Megas]

Master systems came with either Snail Maze or Safari Hunt/Hang-On, not both.I didn't realize (or recall) that.


How is it easier to reach on the Master System compared to the PBC? In all honesty, they're both on the console.The one on the PBC is inset. The one on the Master System isn't.



I have never seen a faulty SMS 1 in my lifetime. Sega built those like tanks unlike those used PBCs which chances are, like Orion mention earlier, have fried caps that causes it to makes it freeze and reset repeatedly. (happended to me)I've gone through at least 3 Master Systems. They stopped powering on, and one would only play for so long, and then it would freeze. And this was back when they were relatively new.

[Emuaust]

Baloo is incorrect there is a version of the sms 1 hardware that I have right here in front of me that has both safari hunt/Hang-On and the snail maze game. I assumed that pretty much that the Master System Plus bundle had this feature in it, didnt it?

Also whoever said the genesis has better video out then the sms, may I ask how you are connecting your console to you display?. The Megadrive/Genesis is well know for its shitty composite video out and the sms 1 has a much clearer output of color on composite and then there is RGB where there is very little difference.

If space is an issue for you then go the genesis and a pcb, if not then go a sms 1 for its super cool looks!

[todesengel]

Master systems came with either Snail Maze or Safari Hunt/Hang-On, not both.My model 1 SMS has both Hang-On/Safari Hunt and the Snail Maze game.

Edit - Just noticed that Emuaust already mentioned that there's a version with both.

[MASTERWEEDO]

The Power Base Converters saves space and is easier to hook up if you're not going to have another system permanently set up, however you can't play one game (F-16 Fighting Falcon) that you probably wouldn't have wanted to anyway, and sometimes the PBC can be moody and carts have to be reinserted a few times to connect with the pins on the board properly.

The SEGA Master System has Snail Maze, and Safari Hunt and Hang-On built into most systems, so that's three free games right off the bat, albeit bottom tier ones. The pause button on the Master System is also lot easier to reach than the one on the PBC, and you probably won't have as many issues with games not loading because of a loose contact either.

If price and appearance are a factor, I'm pretty sure that the PBC costs a little less, on average, and you can usually get one in better cosmetic condition than the Master System, which is prone to scratching.

It's also worth noting that the Master System has access panel underneath for an unused expansion port which is a great place to hide a few joints from your wife or girlfriend, if you're into that sort of thing. You'll have to cut out the little plastic guard to access it though. The Genesis has a similar port, but it's utilized by the SEGA CD add-on, so...

I have my SMS hooked up right above my Genesis, and I never knew it had games on the console. i think the Power base Converter is one of the only Genesis addons I havent owned, hell i never even seen one in the wild.

Most systems have a lil expansion port for hiding things, but using a gamebit and putting it nes games it damn near undetectable, for larger packages, just use empty cases, you know which one on the shelf is empty, noone else even has any idea. that is, if you do that sort of thing.

also, if you are hiding a few joints from your gf/spouse, I'd say there are some issues in the relationship that need worked out. especially if she's smoking it all when you arent home.

[BetaWolf47]

There's a little bit of good and bad regarding the Power Base Converter. If you mod a Genesis to s-video, your Power Base Converter will get the s-video as well, according to what someone else told me. However, Wikipedia talks about a problem with the Power Base Converter:

"When a Master System game is inserted, the system puts the Z80 in control, leaving the Mega Drive's main 68000 processor idle. The power base converter had inferior capacitors however, meaning that after a few years use, the system may suffer from glitchy play, to rectify this the user must remove the capacitors from the board or replace them."

This is also the case with Genesis model 1 units. Combine the bad capacitors in model 1 with the bad capacitors in the PBC, and you'll most likely have glitches all over. The price of new capacitors probably negates any price difference between a real SMS and PBC. Model 1 Genesis circuit boards are capped to hell.


Also whoever said the genesis has better video out then the sms, may I ask how you are connecting your console to you display?. The Megadrive/Genesis is well know for its shitty composite video out and the sms 1 has a much clearer output of color on composite and then there is RGB where there is very little difference.

Bleh, look at Ace's guide about Genesis revisions on Sega-16. Not all Genesis systems are built equally, that's for sure.

[chrisbid]

youd also be missing out on the badass sms boot screen

[buzz_n64]

I was wondering what the best way is to play Japanese SMS games or Mark III games. I see an adapter online for the genesis, but would it be better to get the Japanese SMS system instead? I heard the Japanese system has more features, and the adapter wouldn't play all games.

[fahlim003]

I was wondering what the best way is to play Japanese SMS games or Mark III games. I see an adapter online for the genesis, but would it be better to get the Japanese SMS system instead? I heard the Japanese system has more features, and the adapter wouldn't play all games.

The Japanese SMS is pretty good as it has FM synthesis meaning potentially better, fuller music. The adapter to allow US/EU games to be played on the Japan SMS is here: http://www.smspower.org/Shop/GenderAdapter with more info here: http://www.smspower.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=8714

Plus the Japan SMS can play Mark 3 games in addition to Japan SMS games, someone correct me if I am wrong.

As for the topic, if I saw a PBC in the wild I'd grab it without any hesistation. The PBC2 looks great and I can see the benefits it would have over the original but the price sure is high. Personally I'd like to simply get another SMS, and import one no less, but that's a few years away I think.

[Ze_ro]

Alright, so the Japanese Mark III has a Yamaha YM2413 that provides FM sound capabilities. This chip wasn't included in the North American Master System, but supposedly there are a number of games that have support for it anyways... and here's a homebrew expansion (http://users.tpg.com.au/vile88/smsfm/smsfm.html) that adds this hardware via the expansion port. My understanding is that the Genesis doesn't have this chip, and therefor you will never get SMS FM sound using a PBC. However, the Genesis does have the more advanced YM2612... any chance it's capable of filling in for the YM2413, or are they entirely different?

With the talk about SMS compatibility... how about a Game Gear with a Master Gear converter? My understanding is that there are a few text-heavy SMS games that are near unreadable on the smaller screen, and obviously you have no card port... but are there any other issues?

--Zero

[nebrazca78]

Alright, so the Japanese Mark III has a Yamaha YM2413 that provides FM sound capabilities. This chip wasn't included in the North American Master System, but supposedly there are a number of games that have support for it anyways... and here's a homebrew expansion (http://users.tpg.com.au/vile88/smsfm/smsfm.html) that adds this hardware via the expansion port. My understanding is that the Genesis doesn't have this chip, and therefor you will never get SMS FM sound using a PBC. However, the Genesis does have the more advanced YM2612... any chance it's capable of filling in for the YM2413, or are they entirely different?

With the talk about SMS compatibility... how about a Game Gear with a Master Gear converter? My understanding is that there are a few text-heavy SMS games that are near unreadable on the smaller screen, and obviously you have no card port... but are there any other issues?

--Zero

I don't know anything about using the Genesis FM chip but I can tell you reading SMS text on the Game Gear screen is a bitch. And there are situations where the text is entirely illegible.

[ccovell]

Alright, so the Japanese Mark III has a Yamaha YM2413 that provides FM sound capabilities....However, the Genesis does have the more advanced YM2612... any chance it's capable of filling in for the YM2413, or are they entirely different?

The two systems' FM chips are incompatible.

For playing US/EU games on a Japanese Mark III or SMS, this adaptor is also good: http://www.tototek.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1_28_29&products_id=73

[Greg2600]

As I mentioned, the NEO Myth MD Flash cart (http://www.ic2005.com/shop/product.php?productid=33) has the SMS FM chip installed. Since most people, like me, are never going to build our own chip/board and solder to a SMS. The problem with the Neo Myth stuff is the insane prices. $140 for the cart, and probably another $70 for the SD card adapter, because you're fitting very few Genesis games on a 256 Megabit card (32 megabytes). Then again, good luck finding a Japanese Sega Master System, they are expensive, and usually in Japan.

As for SMS games that use FM sound, Here's an incomplete list from someone on Sega-16's forum.....

Games with FM music, never released in Japan
Altered Beast
California Games
Casino Games
Cloud Master
Galaxy Force
Golfamania
Out Run 3-D
Poseidon Wars 3-D
Rampage
Rastan
Rescue Mission
Scramble Spirits
Shanghai
Tennis Ace
Time Soldiers
Ultima IV
VigilanteGames with FM support, released worldwide
Aleste
After Burner
Alex Kidd: The Lost Stars
Alien Syndrome
Aztec Adventure
Blade Eagle 3-D
Bomber Raid
Captain Silver
Cyborg Hunter
Double Dragon
Fantasy Zone II
Fantasy Zone: The Maze
Global Defense
Golvellius - Valley of Doom
Great Golf
Kenseiden
Lord of The Sword
Maze Hunter 3-D
Miracle Warriors - Seal of The Dark Lord
Out Run
Parlour Games
Penguin Land
Power Strike
R-Type
Shinobi
Space Harrier 3-D
SpellCaster
Thunder Blade
Wonder Boy in Monster Land
Zaxxon 3-D
Zillion II - The Tri FormationGames with FM music, via hacks (which is why you'd want a flash cart)
Ys
Wonder Boy III: The Dragon's Trap
Phantasy StarComparison regular (PSG) sound and FM Phantasy Star (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a8ZkCadTqZM)

If you want to hear the difference, download an FM-designed ROM and play it on the Fusion emulator, and one that isn't on Fusion.

[MarioMania]

Have anyone made a Sonic FM version for the SMS??

[Greg2600]

I would be surprised if they did. Replacing the music on an entire game like that is quite extensive. Plus you'd need the source code. Just play the Genesis versions!

BTW, a great SMS website is SMS Power (http://www.smspower.org/).

[Cloud121]

Is my PowerBase Converter getting worn down? For some reason, my copies of Miracle Warriors and Shinobi will not work on my Power Base Converter, yet they work fine on my SMS. All my other SMS games work fine on my PBC. I'm thinking of just buying another copy of Shinobi as it's cheap as dirt.

I've also played these same games on my PBC before, so I know they should be working.

[Ed Oscuro]

Plus the Japan SMS can play Mark 3 games in addition to Japan SMS games, someone correct me if I am wrong.
I'm about 20 days late but a couple points:

First, many games - not just JPN ones - can play the FM music, so if you want to go that way, the JPN SMS with a converter for SMS carts is the way to go. Enjoy the FM music! (Hopefully)

Secondly, what's a "Japan SMS" game? In Japan, Mark III = what we call our SMS. It's called the Mark III because it's a revision of a line, that's pin-compatible, back to about 1983 with the SG-1000 line (I believe the Mark II was more or less just an aesthetic refresh of the SG-1000). You can play SG-1000 and SG-1000 Mark II cards (Hero, ZOOM 909, Wonderboy, Girl's Garden, Ninja Princess to name a few I think are all available as cards) and cartridges (N-Sub, Borderline, as well as newer stuff) on the Mark III or Japanese SMS.

To clarify: In Japan, the games all come in "Silver Cartridge" or "Gold Cartridge" marked boxes (I don't know what the difference is, whether it be a signifier of whether they work on the SG-1000, or something else like ROM size, though any SMS game I can think of with a JPN region equivalent i.e. Shinobi, Aleste, The Ninja, etc. came as a gold box, I think Solomon's Key maybe as well) about the size of a standard (-ish) Famicom box, with print that likes to wear off. These will play in Mark III systems (which require an add-on module for FM Sound) or the Japanese Sega Master System, whose box borrows the Tonka-era Western black and white patterned look, which is actually not too unattractive.

[j_factor]

Secondly, what's a "Japan SMS" game?

A Mark III game that uses FM synth?

[Gameguy]

There are some rumours that Phantasy Star can't save properly when using a Power Base Converter, can anyone confirm or disprove this?

[WizDawg]

OK I know the PBC does not work on a Genesis 3, just get a black screen. But I want to know why. Does anybody know the answer? From what I read it works on a model 2. Missing hardware? A different voltage somewhere? Different pinout?