Screw You, Sega Saturn.

[bartre]

kidding.
seriously though, there are a few things about this system that i hate.

first and foremost, and i'm sure it's been said before, the game cases.
every region has their own style, from the jewel case in Japan, to the longbox case in the US.
the US cases seem to get all kinds of crap, but i recently discovered the flaming rectangular turd that is the PAL case.
I mean, wow, this is crap, it's two pieces of plastic bound with a strip of thin cardboard, no extra support on the spine.
second, the manual has nothing to hold it in place, aside from the small indent on the cover side.

second, there's the original controller.
i've since replaced all of mine with the second controller, so this isn't as big of a deal as it once was, but the triggers on those things are awful.
plus there's the shape of it, it's like playing with the bill of a baseball cap.

then there's the internal memory.
not much to say here, there's just not enough of it

I do love the Saturn though.
in the short time i've had mine (< 1 year) i've bought more games for it than i have games for any other system, and i've enjoyed it tons, esp Guardian Heroes, the Shining Games, Nights, and Keio 2

[sixwayshot]

If memory's an issue, just grab one of the Action Replay carts. They've got a ton of memory in 'em. Only downside is that you can only transfer files to and from the device, you can't save directly to the device in-game.

[bartre]

yeah, i've got one, it's in there right now, i'm just saying, sometimes there's not enough space to even save two games, granted they're big ones, but yeah, that's bad...

[buzz_n64]

The mid 90s loved long boxes 3do,cd-i,sat, early ps, and even cds, Saturn didn't last long enough over here to convert like the playstation did.

I use the 3d pad to play most games.

Memory card is a must.

Fantastic games, always loved the system more than the playstation.

[Rickstilwell1]

Ah yes, the payoff for annoyances in any system will always be the fun of the games. Even games you can get on Playstation are often cheaper on the Saturn due to less demand in the system. X-Men: Children of the Atom was like $13 for a loose copy, when the only PS1 game I could find was like $40 disc only. I went ahead and bought both because I had a lot of income back then but it showed me Saturn had its benefits.

[BetaWolf47]

The mid 90s loved long boxes 3do,cd-i,sat, early ps, and even cds, Saturn didn't last long enough over here to convert like the playstation did.
A few special games had jewel cases though, like Virtua Fighter Remix and the controller pack-in version of NiGHTs into Dreams. They fit on your shelf so much better than the huge game cases! Just 10 of the large cases takes up more room than about 25 SNES carts!

[Nintega Grafx-16]

You forgot to mention that the REALLY GOOD games are really expensive. That is one thing I loathe about the Saturn.

[sixwayshot]

Pretty much every game worth getting for the Saturn will cost a bit of cash. I've got a bunch of Saturn games, but they're all stuff like Myst or Mortal Kombat II, which, admittedly, are good games. They're just not the best the console has. I'd kill to get a copy of Marvel Super Heroes, or Saturn Bomberman, but they're expensive, or at least out of my price range...

[bartre]

yeah, before i had my saturn, i had never paid more than $50 for a game, and that was JUST if it was brand new, and a rare occurrence too.
since then, i've bought Guardian Heroes for $70, Keio Flying Squadron 2 PAL for $60, Shining Force III for $75, Magic Knight Rayearth for $55, plus there's a handful of really good games that run about $30
the good news is that locally, i picked up a copy of Nights CIB for $3.

[joshnickerson]

I played a friend's Saturn and I absolutely loved the Virtua Cop games. He kept bugging me, telling me I should pick up a Saturn myself. Finally, one night a couple years ago I said if I ever found one for twenty bucks, with a copy of Virtua Cop, I'd buy it instantly.

The very next day, at the dirt mall, I came upon a Sega Saturn in an old cardboard box, with a few complete games, including Virtua Cop 2. Asking price? Twenty dollars.

So yeah, now I have a Sega Saturn :D

[dreamcaster]

first and foremost, and i'm sure it's been said before, the game cases.
every region has their own style, from the jewel case in Japan, to the longbox case in the US.
the US cases seem to get all kinds of crap, but i recently discovered the flaming rectangular turd that is the PAL case.
I mean, wow, this is crap, it's two pieces of plastic bound with a strip of thin cardboard, no extra support on the spine.
second, the manual has nothing to hold it in place, aside from the small indent on the cover side.
All the more reason to exclusively get Japanese Saturn games?


second, there's the original controller.
i've since replaced all of mine with the second controller, so this isn't as big of a deal as it once was, but the triggers on those things are awful.
plus there's the shape of it, it's like playing with the bill of a baseball cap.
The smaller controller is generally more plentiful and certainly isn't expensive to buy so I don't get the issue here.


then there's the internal memory.
not much to say here, there's just not enough of it
Yeah, screw Sega for including something that most consoles don't generally have anyway.

[UnpluggedClone]

the graphics suck hard that's for sure unless it's 2d...

[dreamcaster]

No more or less than early gen PlayStation games.

[Bugbear]

"I played a friend's Saturn and I absolutely loved the Virtua Cop games. He kept bugging me, telling me I should pick up a Saturn myself. Finally, one night a couple years ago I said if I ever found one for twenty bucks, with a copy of Virtua Cop, I'd buy it instantly.

The very next day, at the dirt mall, I came upon a Sega Saturn in an old cardboard box, with a few complete games, including Virtua Cop 2. Asking price? Twenty dollars."

Awesome story! Getting a Saturn will have to wait, but you guys make them sound like the best thing on earth. I've always kind of wanted a Sega CD, too.

[ApolloBoy]

All the more reason to exclusively get Japanese Saturn games?
I certainly think so. I hate the huge jewel cases that the US games came in with a flaming passion, so I only plan on buying CIB Japanese games for my Saturn.

[bartre]

i dunno, i love the look of the big cases, but they're just so damned fragile.
but i guess i'll deal, after all, it just makes the valuable games more valuable

also, on the subject of graphics, they're pretty good considering the time frame for the console.
in fact, with all the games i've played on mine, the only one that's ever bothered me was Duke Nukem 3D, felt like you were perpetually walking into a tunnel.

[Logicdustbin]

to be fair, a lot of first gen controllers suck, and got replaced (think of the 'duke' for the xbox)

[Nebagram]

the US cases seem to get all kinds of crap, but i recently discovered the flaming rectangular turd that is the PAL case.
I mean, wow, this is crap, it's two pieces of plastic bound with a strip of thin cardboard, no extra support on the spine.
second, the manual has nothing to hold it in place, aside from the small indent on the cover side.

Early ones yes, they are flimsy as hell, but later games (about 1997 onwards iirc) came in proper full plastic sturdy cases.

[gameofyou]

the graphics suck hard that's for sure unless it's 2d...

Try Panzer Dragoon Zwei, Sega Rally, VF2, or VC2. To me they hold up quite well.

[PC-ENGINE HELL]

My favorite stuff on Saturn tended to be the arcade ports more then the original titles. I did like stuff like Shin Shinobi Den, Panzer Dragoon 1-2, Magic Knight, and Shining Force 3, but the vast majority I played was def the arcade related titles. The Saturn was a excellent format for that kinda work. Also, Fire Pro Wrestling 6 Man Scramble was just a hell of a lot of fun. Probably the single most original title for the system that got the most play time from me.

[Kitsune Sniper]

Oh yeah. I love my Saturn. I picked up a bunch of cheap games a few months ago and they're all awesome.

[BetaWolf47]

I like my Saturn as well. I also don't mind the first controller too much either. The reason the first one gets so much flak, perhaps, is because the second one is amazing.

But why rag on it so badly right after its 15th anniversary, bartre?

[Kitsune Sniper]

I like my Saturn as well. I also don't mind the first controller too much either. The reason the first one gets so much flak, perhaps, is because the second one is amazing.

But why rag on it so badly right after its 15th anniversary, bartre?

The triggers really suck on the first version of the pad... Die Hard Trilogy has a quick-turn option in Die Hard With A Vengeance which uses the triggers, and I could -never- get it to work with the old pad. It was easier with the second model pad.

I didn't mind the DPad that much, but those damn triggers!

[j_factor]

There are actually three different kinds of European cases. The one that's like a tall Genesis case is just weird.


Ah yes, the payoff for annoyances in any system will always be the fun of the games. Even games you can get on Playstation are often cheaper on the Saturn due to less demand in the system. X-Men: Children of the Atom was like $13 for a loose copy, when the only PS1 game I could find was like $40 disc only. I went ahead and bought both because I had a lot of income back then but it showed me Saturn had its benefits.

The PSX version of that game is an abortion. It was actually canceled due to being a bad port, and then two years later they changed their minds and released it anyway. I'm sure the PSX version is just uncommon because it sold terribly, whereas the Saturn version was semi-popular at the time due to being more timely (and a good port).

[Baloo]

Sega Saturn is my favorite system of all time. I'm surprised you don't like the controller, unless your using that shitty US one that came with the first run of Saturns, that one is horrible.

There's something about the Saturn I like, it's so well-rounded for a system. There's literally great games in every category. Sports, RPGs, beat-em-ups, platformers, racing, 2D fighters, 3D fighters, shmups, rail shooters, there's something on it for everyone.

And yet it's so neglected...

[bartre]

why rag on it so badly right after its 15th anniversary, bartre?

i hate the rose colored glasses i guess.

yeah, when i was complaining about the controller, i was talking about the first one, not the second, japanese style one, that's pretty sweet.

don't take this to mean that i hate mine, i'm just acknowledging the problems with the system.

gotta say though, Shinobi Legions gets more than a little ridiculous after about level 4.

[Swamperon]

Saturn PAL cases come in two varieties, the kind you described and then others are the more standard, durable dvd-like cases with spine supported. I think they switched at some point during the Saturn's life over here?

But those flimsy kinds are annoying! It pains me whenever I open up my copy of Saturn Bomberman and I can see how easily it could break.

[gameofyou]

gotta say though, Shinobi Legions gets more than a little ridiculous after about level 4.

Yeah, the mine cart level is crazy. My biggest frustration with the game is that it seemed entirely random whether it would perform the double jump or not.

I sat down and seriously played this game a couple weeks ago. I actually made it to the final level, for the first time since owning the game. I then summarily got my butt kicked by these huge missle-type things. What the hell is up with that final level ???

[bartre]

Yeah, the mine cart level is crazy. My biggest frustration with the game is that it seemed entirely random whether it would perform the double jump or not.

I sat down and seriously played this game a couple weeks ago. I actually made it to the final level, for the first time since owning the game. I then summarily got my butt kicked by these huge missle-type things. What the hell is up with that final level ???

yeah, the double jump is lame, you've got to have pinpoint timing, plus you have to hit up + jump to do it, WHY?

anyway, yeah, the final level is dumb, you spend most of it hiding from missiles.
it's like playing ninja frogger, which is a lot less awesome than it sounds for those of you who haven't played it.

[wingzrow]

I own exactly ONE game for the sega saturn. Saturn bomberman. If I ever find another game like panzer dragoon, or guardian heroes ile add that to my collection, but as it stands, saturn games just aren't easy to find.

[dreamcaster]

i hate the rose colored glasses i guess.

You sure picked the wrong forum to post in. :P

[zektor]

There aren't enough words I can use to express how much I love the Saturn. It is one of the most underrated systems ever created. Once you explore the WHOLE library (Eur/Japan) you will be absolutely amazed. The system also has the best video output I have seen from that era. I recently found that out when testing one with an S-Video cable on a new LCD TV. I am floored. Looks better than I ever remember it!

I would definitely recommend a mod chip tho. There are quite a few games that I have never been able to track down, and the mod chip was the only way I could have ever played all of the games that I have.

[zektor]

I own exactly ONE game for the sega saturn. Saturn bomberman. If I ever find another game like panzer dragoon, or guardian heroes ile add that to my collection, but as it stands, saturn games just aren't easy to find.

That is one good game to own tho! I have never been able to find a complete copy personally.

[BetaWolf47]

I own exactly ONE game for the sega saturn. Saturn bomberman. If I ever find another game like panzer dragoon, or guardian heroes ile add that to my collection, but as it stands, saturn games just aren't easy to find.

Panzer Dragoon is one of the most common non-sports game for the system though! Expect to see Panzer Dragoon and Panzer Dragoon Zwei a lot before you see anything like Guardian Heroes.

[dreamcaster]

There aren't enough words I can use to express how much I love the Saturn. It is one of the most underrated systems ever created. Once you explore the WHOLE library (Eur/Japan) you will be absolutely amazed. The system also has the best video output I have seen from that era. I recently found that out when testing one with an S-Video cable on a new LCD TV. I am floored. Looks better than I ever remember it!

I would definitely recommend a mod chip tho. There are quite a few games that I have never been able to track down, and the mod chip was the only way I could have ever played all of the games that I have.

Agreed! The Saturn already looked surprisingly decent via composite on my LCD (better than my PSX or N64), but connecting s-video is just so beautifully crisp.

[bartre]

yeah, the PD games are all really awesome, cheap, and easy to find.
now, if you're talking about Panzer Dragoon Saga, that's another story...

[starsoldier1]

Me and my friend did a review on the Sega Saturn and we had some problems with it too.
http://blip.tv/file/3614214

[gameofyou]

I put some collections of Saturn game footage on YouTube, which (in my opinion) are the best games I've played on the system, since buying it in 1995.
http://www.youtube.com/user/gameofyou1

[zektor]

Me and my friend did a review on the Sega Saturn and we had some problems with it too.
http://blip.tv/file/3614214


You have some problems, but it has nothing to do with the Sega Saturn. I watched about 45 seconds. Come on man.

[bartre]

You have some problems, but it has nothing to do with the Sega Saturn. I watched about 45 seconds. Come on man.

i made it a point to watch the whole thing.
but damn, that was annoying as hell.
not even actually funny or anything, just dumb.

[starsoldier1]

i made it a point to watch the whole thing.
but damn, that was annoying as hell.
not even actually funny or anything, just dumb.

Yeah, pretty much but that's why it's on blip instead of Youtube. I knew I would get a lot of heat for this so called 'review'.

[starsoldier1]

You have some problems, but it has nothing to do with the Sega Saturn. I watched about 45 seconds. Come on man.
No, me and my friend have some problems but we blame it on the boos. We hold a controller sometimes... so it has a little to do with the Saturn... kinda.

[Sonicwolf]

unless your using that shitty US one that came with the first run of Saturns, that one is horrible.

It took me five years to find the Japanese styled controller. Damn the North American Saturn launch pad sucked harsh.

Where I live, Sega Saturn stuff is scarce and sold at lame premium prices. I really would love to get into the Saturn, but, as I said, its hard when local flea markets ask 20-40 bucks for Daytona USA. My Saturn collection is pitiful. I have had the console in my collection since 2004 and I only have 12 games - - Mostly sports ones too.

[fahlim003]

It took me five years to find the Japanese styled controller. Damn the North American Saturn launch pad sucked harsh.

Where I live, Sega Saturn stuff is scarce and sold at lame premium prices. I really would love to get into the Saturn, but, as I said, its hard when local flea markets ask 20-40 bucks for Daytona USA. My Saturn collection is pitiful. I have had the console in my collection since 2004 and I only have 12 games - - Mostly sports ones too.

There's always ebay dude. I live the despite being in a different part of Canada, Saturn prices and scarcity are the same, very lame. I got my first Saturn off ebay, which was strange as it was cheap and from Ontario. Pretty much everything else in my 50+ software collection came from abroad, many of which courtesy ebay.

[dreamcaster]

I have about 30 Saturn games and the most I have ever paid is about $40AUD. And I live in the biggest dead-end in the western world for games collecting.

eBay is your Saturn friend, however, I have found some pretty obscure stuff in the wild for a couple dollars over the years. e.g. white 3D controller, white wireless IR controller set, PAL Guardian Heroes.

[Baloo]

I've managed to get some decent Saturn games, but even though I've had it for a year, I've only been able to get about 17 titles, all of which are good though. It seems the best Saturn stuff is hard to find, even the more common titles like Sonic 3D Blast, Panzer Dragoon, NiGHTS, even Virtua Fighter 2 just don't pop up in the wild that often. Where I work we have few Saturn games, and all the best ones don't last on the shelf very long at all, even the common titles like Daytona, VF2, Sega Rally tend to go quickly.

[wingzrow]

Honestly, I consider myself lucky if i see some sports games for the system. They're THAT hard for me to find in the chicagoland area. Maybe I'm looking in the wrong places but I haven't seen any.

[theclaw]

More than anything, I detest the elitist segment of its fanbase. Furthermore... Not only do I have massive hands (wrist to middle finger over 7 inches), and can't stand round d-pads in general, but I'd first used its original US controller. So I ended up very much against the (IMHO godawful) Japanese design when I'd gotten to try it years later.

Yet even despite all that, it's an otherwise solid system I just avoid openly associating myself with for those reasons. My biggest regret is not investing in a RAM cart. Should I get back into Saturn, that'll be among the top proirities. I don't want to again lose save data from those batteries.

[bartre]

Honestly, I consider myself lucky if i see some sports games for the system. They're THAT hard for me to find in the chicagoland area. Maybe I'm looking in the wrong places but I haven't seen any.

wow, that's pretty bad.
in general, my local shops lack anything worth mentioning, a few dozen copies of street fighter the movie, VF2, daytona usa, and a few others, but generally any game that's any good that everyone doesn't already have is gone pretty quick.
but then again, they're usually painfully underpriced unless it's one of the really rare games, ex: rampage for $5, Scud for $3, Bug for $2, all complete.

[M15fit]

The saturn is an excellent machine and looks great through S-video on an LCD. I also have a scart to component converter but can't tell the difference from that and S-video. I am in Australia and also hate the stupid cases, I just back them up instead and use a cd book. I also prefer the original Controller instead of the small version, I find it more comfortable for fighting games. The Saturn has some true gems, the catch being the majority are Japanese only, Therefore i've built quite a large Library of Japanese titles, I can read Kanji for the most part which also helps. Imho, the 2d fighters are generally as close to arcade as you're going to get for the era, SF3 Alpha is amazing as is the other capcom fighters, I have all of the SNK fighters with cartridges and can say they are excellent ports. I have finished all of the Atlus RPG's and sega RPG's. I think english ports may have been a big risk but would have probably saved the system in Europe, Aus and the U.S. I think everyone should try Exhumed/Powerslave, and even the commons like quake and Duke Nukem.

[wingzrow]

through S-video on an LCD

You mean on a CRT, right? I'm just going to assume you meant an old tv and not an hd one.

[M15fit]

You mean on a CRT, right? I'm just going to assume you meant an old tv and not an hd one.

No, I meant an LCD TV, Looks great on s-video. I realize this may sound surprising, but i speak the truth

[BetaWolf47]

I'm lucky when it comes to Saturn. I see commons at my two main Play N Trade stores all the time, and have been fortunate enough to run into a handful of really great games on one occasion. I still won't forget the time I got Albert Odyssey, Saturn Bomberman, and Dragon Force, among other games, for $4 apiece, all in the same store.

[Kyle15]

I've had to get all my Saturn stuff from out of town too. Stuff like this doesn't usually appear that easily, and like others have mentioned before me, go for premium prices. Its mostly due to the "OMG OLD GAME EQUALS GOLD" and "BIG CASES EQUALS CASH" deal. Given that, I'm fine with what I have so far. All I do is continue to search and hit better places when I go out of town.


I'm lucky when it comes to Saturn. I see commons at my two main Play N Trade stores all the time, and have been fortunate enough to run into a handful of really great games on one occasion. I still won't forget the time I got Albert Odyssey, Saturn Bomberman, and Dragon Force, among other games, for $4 apiece, all in the same store.

Nice! Finds like that don't come around often, but prove quite rewarding when the time comes.

[Tron 2.0]

pc-engine>sega saturn

At least that's what the consoles gives me the feeling of.Both suported poorly in the u.s while they had a good run in japan.I still have a saturn and i was early adopter of the console,while i use to be bitter towards soa for how they handle it.At least there were plenty of imports to chose from.

Hmm last i check i had a 100+ games for it,but in recent years i've slimed down on it.

Once in a while i get it out for a play through.The sega saturn did 2d so well...then again that's what the console was design for.

[wingzrow]

No, I meant an LCD TV, Looks great on s-video. I realize this may sound surprising, but i speak the truth

Blasphemy! You can't play anything pre PS2 on an hdtv! You miss the scanlines, which blend the picture a certain way. Trust me, find an old tv on the curb with an S-video jack and try running your old games on that. You'll be surprised how much better they look. I would never play Mega Man 8 or panzer dragoon saga on an HDTV, it just doesn't look right.

[M15fit]

Blasphemy! You can't play anything pre PS2 on an hdtv! You miss the scanlines, which blend the picture a certain way. Trust me, find an old tv on the curb with an S-video jack and try running your old games on that. You'll be surprised how much better they look. I would never play Mega Man 8 or panzer dragoon saga on an HDTV, it just doesn't look right.

hehe, I know you're right. But I'm sticking with s-video on a 24 inch screen, I no longer have a CRT tv. I'm currently playing Wachenroder and it looks great, And thanks for the memories, Mega man 8 is getting a run through when i get home. Pure classic

[j_factor]

Blasphemy! You can't play anything pre PS2 on an hdtv! You miss the scanlines, which blend the picture a certain way. Trust me, find an old tv on the curb with an S-video jack and try running your old games on that. You'll be surprised how much better they look. I would never play Mega Man 8 or panzer dragoon saga on an HDTV, it just doesn't look right.

Hey now, Dreamcast is great on an HDTV -- better than PS2, since it has a much higher rate of progressive scan support.

I've actually found that older systems look pretty damn good on my plasma. About even with my CRT, I dare say. Unfortunately Mega Man 8 and Panzer Dragoon Saga remain on my "to get" list, but I can go play Mega Man X4 and Panzer Dragoon Zwei as substitutes.

[zektor]

Blasphemy! You can't play anything pre PS2 on an hdtv! You miss the scanlines, which blend the picture a certain way. Trust me, find an old tv on the curb with an S-video jack and try running your old games on that. You'll be surprised how much better they look. I would never play Mega Man 8 or panzer dragoon saga on an HDTV, it just doesn't look right.

Bullshit. It depends on the LCD HDTV in question. I am using a 40" Samsung 1080P HDTV I purchased about a year ago. It has one s-vid port on the left side of the TV. I previously had the Saturn hooked up to an older CRT TV, and I can tell you that it looks WORLDS better on the HDTV through s-vid.

I do agree that LCD HDTV's normally SUCK for pre-ps2 machines, but the Saturn is definitely an exception (fortunately). I also have the Dreamcast hooked up to s-vid on the same TV. The DC looks good, but nowhere near how perfect the Saturn looks on it.

[GarrettCRW]

I've actually found that older systems look pretty damn good on my plasma. About even with my CRT, I dare say.

Other than some translucent effects, I've found this to be true with my LCD set. However, the Sega systems do tend to weather the upgrade better than most everything else.

[dreamcaster]

Yeah, I've noticed Nintendo seems to go out of their way to make the video output on their consoles suck. That said, SNES via S-Video looks pretty decent.

The PSX has pretty decent video output too, though still not up to par with the Saturn.