Who really holds down the reset when they turn the power off?

[Oldskool]

Who does this? Games like Zelda state to hold the RESET button while turning the POWER off so that you don't kill your save games. I used to do this ALL the time as a child in fear of nuking my game. But as I've gotten older and not really cared anymore, I just turn it off. And my Zelda save file is STILL there to this day.

What's the story behind this? Does it just keep the power from spiking the battery or something?

[mobiusclimber]

What's the story behind this? Does it just keep the power from spiking the battery or something?

Yes. And I've had game saves get erased from not doing that. DW1 not Zelda, tho.

[Double Ugly]

Interesting. I don't recall ever noticing this. Is this for the NES?

[CDiablo]

Did this religously, and saves still got erased.

[Ro-J]

I lost my Final Fantasy game save from not holding down the reset, at least that's what I am choosing to believe what erased it. My fiance at the time hated RPG's and said they were a waste of time, she was more of a Bubble Bobble player and would complain we should play something together. But regardless, one night I was playing FF and fumbled on the power button (light flickered a few times) and the next day my game was gone. If I held down the reset button this wouldn't have happened.

[Voliko]

I make sure to do it every time. I don't want to be taking any risks that can be easily avoided.

[Arkhan]

I loaned Wizardry 1 to a friend.

a few hours later "WHats it mean if the party roster is FIGHTER1 FIGHTER2 etc"

I hung up the phone, lol.

My 68 Ninja was goneeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee.

I about punched his face in!

I always hold reset in. It's a frigging rule.

[Zing]

I think it's not so much that the reset button itself does something more "gently", but that it prevents an accidental quick on/off, which is what seems to wipe saves.

[Kitsune Sniper]

Of course I do, that innkeeper chick in Final Fantasy yelled at me all the time so I would do it!

[jdheins]

Holding the reset button actually screwed up my Tecmo Super Bowl season, or so I think anyway, now I never do it!

[csgx1]

I never do it.....maybe I'm lucky but no lost saves yet either.

[MASTERWEEDO]

Never did it.

[buzz_n64]

I never hold the reset button, but I have lost game saves once or twice on Zelda. Not sure if it's because of this or not, maybe.

[FoxNtd]

I've been aware of this from the writing on the back of the carts since as long as I can remember, and have always used the reset+power shut down procedure. My first Famicom game that has a battery back-up for save files also seems to describe the very same procedure on it.

From the hardware point of view, I can't explain how this influences what happens when the game is powered off and/or why the save is preserved (or at risk) depending how you power down. Hmm..

[Rickstilwell1]

I never used to and I never had my games erased except on rare occasions. I had a gold cartridge copy of Zelda 1 and I thought its battery had died like my copy of DKC3 on SNES. It turned out that when I played it again and held the reset button when powering off, it actually kept the new save and held it there ever since I started doing this.

I think it's really hit or miss, but taking extra precautions never hurt much. I've had far more problems with SNES saves but that's because my first SNES was filthy inside and all my original copies of the games got dirty from it. I since re-bought all the games I had at the time as I sold them in a lot.

[Zing]

I have always done this procedure and never, ever, lost a game save.

I see several people post here who have lost saves and claim they did not do the procedure.

Use this information wisely.

[Zing]

From the hardware point of view, I can't explain how this influences what happens when the game is powered off and/or why the save is preserved (or at risk) depending how you power down. Hmm..

Here is my hypothesis:

When you just hit the power button, the power to the cart and the system is terminated at the same time. This could cause power surges or voltage spikes which interfere with the battery's voltage or the SRAM memory chips.

When you hold the reset button, just the power to the cartridge is disabled. Then, when you press the power button, no voltage is being supplied to the cart, so it is safe.

[Arkhan]

sounds good to me.

I usually hold reset while powering on too, incase a flickerfuckfest happens.

[FoxNtd]

Here is my hypothesis:

When you just hit the power button, the power to the cart and the system is terminated at the same time. This could cause power surges or voltage spikes which interfere with the battery's voltage or the SRAM memory chips.

When you hold the reset button, just the power to the cartridge is disabled. Then, when you press the power button, no voltage is being supplied to the cart, so it is safe.

If that's true, then the RAM still has power and the CPU is still running. Any instructions in the pipeline should still be ongoing in execution and will probably work uninterrupted since RAM is still live too. I suppose a crash/freeze would occur if there is a page fault... If this is still true for consoles then why is it that hitting reset seems to immediately halt execution? (I have to go and test this, but from what I remember, as soon as you hold reset, but don't let go, it's like you pause the CPU.)

Resetting ought to be going back to the known starting state, just like where the machine finds itself when first powered on. I wonder what the reset button is really doing when it's held down before being released. The answer to this ought to tie into the save file preservation. Damn, we need a computer engineer who specializes in consoles to address this.

See, when I first thought about what the state of the machine is during the time reset is held, initially I wanted to say that the halting of execution would ensure there wasn't any I/O ops being done to wherever the save data is stored. But, if you were right in the middle of I/O and held reset right there, you'd prevent the CPU from completing the task. So... it doesn't make sense. I really wanna figure out just what the hell happens in the machine that is supposed to make it "safe" for your save data, argh, what a puzzle..

One other thing. I also consider that any data in the segment that stores save data that does not resemble a save file is ignored and reported to the gamer as an empty slot. This is because there is no particular reason to arbitrarily assign any values to that segment if there is nothing of interest to store there, and hence since the value there is unknown, you will have a random set of data (i.e. garbage.) My point of this is that it is important that the data that ends up being in your save file still resembles a save file, and if it can't be identified by the game it will assume it's garbage and report an empty slot. So no save or somehow-corrupted save is the same as, well, nothing.

EDIT: If I have made an error, please correct me.

In reference to the quote above, in any case, if nothing special is going on, at the least perhaps the disabling of the flow of voltage to the cart slot is an added preventative measure. Reset held or not, cutting the power (or halting execution) during saving is probably going to screw you no matter what. But, if the cart is off first to prevent flukes, it might simply just boost your chances of not getting screwed. Would be funny if this is actually the answer.

[Zama]

*Raises hand* I always hold the Reset button before turning off a saved NES game. :wink 2:

[Enigmus]

I always hold it down when powering off.

Nothing can make me angrier at my NES than forgetting to hold it and seeing that my save for either Zelda or Maniac Mansion is gone from a voltage spike.

[YoshiM]

I'm reading a few people losing stuff in Final Fantasy when not doing reset. Sounds like what happened to me: I stood up to press the reset button and the stand the system was on shifted and my finger slipped, pressing the power button. Turned it back on and my work was all gone....

The one time I didn't hold that stupid button.

[jb143]

Zing's hypothesis is basically what I was going to suggest, only it wouldn't have any effect on the battery, just the memory. I've been holding off saying anything because I'd really like to look at the schematics first to make sure I'm right and I'm currently in a limbo of being too busy/lazy at the moment. Anyways, turning something off causes all sorts of voltages to be places they aren't exactly planned for normal operation. Memory chips have read/write pins and if there hapens to be the wrong voltage on them it can cause the memory to be corrupted. Not too likely but it could happen. Holding the reset button would cause a "soft reset". They actually have chips that do just this used with microcontrollers and I'm wondering if the NES incorporates something similar into it's design.

But like I said, without digging into the schematics and researching it further, this is just my educated guess.

[rpepper9]

Not to jack a thread, but what is with all the avatars that say "you gonna get raped"?

I think I have seen Mel Gibson, the King, Pee Wee Herman and Danny Glover?

[Enigmus]

Not to jack a thread, but what is with all the avatars that say "you gonna get raped"?

I think I have seen Mel Gibson, the King, Pee Wee Herman and Danny Glover?

Because they all remember to hold the reset button down when powering off their Nintendo Entertainment Systems. :rolleyes:

[j_factor]

So how come this seems to only apply to NES? I don't recall ever seeing a Master System, Genesis, or SNES game tell me to use the reset button. Sometimes you don't even have a reset button, the Nomad for example.

[BetaWolf47]

So how come this seems to only apply to NES? I don't recall ever seeing a Master System, Genesis, or SNES game tell me to use the reset button. Sometimes you don't even have a reset button, the Nomad for example.

I think it's got something to do with the resetting lockout mechanism NES uses. I remember holding the reset button not being necessary on the toploader.

[Arkhan]

I think it's got something to do with the resetting lockout mechanism NES uses. I remember holding the reset button not being necessary on the toploader.


That is correct.

On a whim, I tested that theory and put my DW2 save up for sacrifice

Flicked that fucker on and off 20 times, still good to go.


I think the original NES just had some doofy hardware design oversight. Maybe the thing wasn't originally designed with battery backed saving in mind? The original wave of games didn't have saves. Just passwords, or nothing at all, so they didn't plan for it?

Resetting might clear out any stray nonsense going on that could potentially get sent to the land of your save games, and kill it.

[Haoie]

Later versions of both PS1 and PS2 ditched the reset button completely.

Yippie!

[shopkins]

I got sick of the king in Dragon Warrior always bossing me around and making me do it as a kid, so I decided to defy him. I even jammed the power button a couple of times for good measure. Sure enough, it deleted my saves. Don't screw with the king.

I lost Dragon Warrior 2 saves, too, even though I was holding the reset button. That was a rental cartridge, though.

[Einzelherz]

I actually never read the save menu on Zelda when I got it back in 88. I ended up playing the first dungeon a few hundred times before I realized that you had to hold reset to get the save to take.

[GarrettCRW]

It's practically required with Tecmo Super Bowl. The backup memory on that game is extremely volatile once you get near the end of a season.

[Arkhan]

It's practically required with Tecmo Super Bowl. The backup memory on that game is extremely volatile once you get near the end of a season.

Thats cause nothing can contain fuckin bo jackson.

[Fatalstar64]

I never do and the saves are about 18 years old and counting.

[bohproper]

its funny you should say that because i have a super mario world that ERASES every game save if i hold down the reset button for too long..

So how come this seems to only apply to NES? I don't recall ever seeing a Master System, Genesis, or SNES game tell me to use the reset button. Sometimes you don't even have a reset button, the Nomad for example.

[burn_654]

I actually have decided not to do this on my Sharp NES TV...the reset button is different. As opposed to being able to hold it in (and have the screen stay blank like a toaster) it's a click-ey button and acted like it was resetting multiple times. It completely wiped my Zelda cartridge. That said I hold the reset button on my toaster.

I'm really not sure if one method or the other is better. I kind of have to hope for the best with the NES tv.

[JSoup]

I never held the reset button either. Never had a problem with saves.

[kedawa]

Is this really necessary if you power off from a power bar instead of the console?

[Arkhan]

Is this really necessary if you power off from a power bar instead of the console?

good question. Go try it!

(seriously)

It might be a loophole.

or it'll still destroy a save and make you angry at the world!

[Zing]

Is this really necessary if you power off from a power bar instead of the console?

Wow. Do people really power off their electronics by cutting the power instead of pushing the power switch?

[JSoup]

Wow. Do people really power off their electronics by cutting the power instead of pushing the power switch?

My friend was shocked to find out that I turn the power switch off on the back of the PS2 when I'm done with it instead of just putting it into sleep mode. I replied that I didn't even know the PS2 HAD a sleep mode.

[j_factor]

My friend was shocked to find out that I turn the power switch off on the back of the PS2 when I'm done with it instead of just putting it into sleep mode. I replied that I didn't even know the PS2 HAD a sleep mode.

I always assumed you were supposed to put it in sleep mode and then switch it off at the back.

[Zing]

There is no reason for the standby mode unless you use it as a DVD player with the remote.

[Arkhan]

Wow. Do people really power off their electronics by cutting the power instead of pushing the power switch?

Dude, haven't you been reading the other thread? lol

flicking off the mains captures .0000001% of the energy and saves it!

Over time you might make a difference that way! :D