Is this what online gaming is all about?

[crazyjackcsa]

I finally got my Wii online with a LAN adapter and have been playing online the last few days, mainly Mario Kart and Goldeneye 007.

I've found it to be fun, but frustrating. The Mario Kart experience is much like what people complain about in the off line game. There isn't the AI problems of course, but staying in first is frustrating, in most races I could get to first place, but staying there is impossible.

In Goldeneye it seems to be far too random, in a ten minute game, I managed to kill roughly 20 people, but died like 20 times. So that's a kill every 30 seconds, and a death every 30 seconds, You never know where a shot is coming from until it's too late. Death comes from all over the place, there doesn't seem to be any strategy, no way to stay alive. It's like a bunch of two year olds yelling "POW POW!" at each other.

I know what most people will think, the Wii isn't the online console, but is it the same all over?

[theclaw]

Meh. Online gaming has few gems. There's not enough in-game incentive to keep playing.

Partly due to what I deem the "arena and forget" design model. Too many online games make players enter a closed battlefield, where events inside hold little long term significance. Either in narrative, unlockable content, or player character abilities.

XBL style achievement points are something of a placebo in this regard. They do little if anything gameplay wise. A better idea would be to build on RPG mechanics. Which are a conceptually more modern approach than what I mentioned above. Since it'll mean there is plot development and your character will grow. MMOs may have their own issues, but it's a start in the right path.

[Robocop2]

But don't you think that the whole leveling system alot of FPS' seem to incorporate nowadays address that somewhat? Sure none of it carries over into the single player aspect but its still there as a progression system for your character

[theclaw]

Sure from what I've seen. I haven't played many of those games to say much.

[PapaStu]

For FPS games, balance of maps and weapons is important. Also knowing the maps and where people will camp and where the action zones are (where most of the fighting takes place) is your key to survival. A 1 to 1 K/D isn't bad at all. It also means that you're most likely running into those areas, getting a frag or two and getting wasted. However, i'd not want to claim one 10 minute game as how you're going to perform all the time.

I think in CoD:MW MP, where i've got probably 30 or so hours of play, i've got a .8 K/D ratio. I tend to run into areas a bit more than I should, but I can easily go on 25-6 runs for a game or even better. I care more about my accuracy and stat'ing out my guns than I do w/ straight kills or my ratio.

The whole point is that the online is semi 'random' in the first place. You don't know how people are going to play, being serious... or not. Also, its about pushing skill. You may be on one game, the worst the next. You're acting like w/ every MP game of Mario Kart, you're going to end up first?

[emceelokey]

The Wii isn't exactly the best example of online gaming. Considering that most people that play games online and most games that are heavily anchored in online game play are based in other consoles, the games and the audience for online gaming on the Wii is going to be limited and might be populated with more of a casual gamer than on the other two systems.

Play a game like Battlefield or the COD series online and you'll notice the difference of an experienced player and team players pretty easily. I've never played a game online on the Wii so I'm not sure how it works but I believe they have their friend code system where you have to get a code for each game and the whole infastructure of online gaming on the Wii is a bit broken and outdated even before it came out.

BAttlefield BAd Company 2 is a great example of online FPS game. You're not just mindlessly roaming around looking for people to shoot. If you want, you can play a whol match just healing and reviving people or driving vehicle and you can play your part in the team and the better your team works as a team, the better you guys will be.

I'm pretty sure it's better on the PS3 and 360 compared to the Wii in all aspects and it's not even worth judging online gaming based off of the Wii.

[crazyjackcsa]

No, I don't expect to end of first or win every round, It's the randomness that gets me. If you're reading the other Mario Kart thread, it seems all the issues people bring up in it are amped up to 11. I don't mind coming in first, fifth or last as long as that's where my skill level puts me. But too often it seems to go, blue shell, blue shell, red shell, POW and suddenly, I'm in 10th place.

In FPS,I play a little more methodically I suppose. I;m not upset with the kill ratio, It just bugs me that it happens so quickly. I'd much prefer half as many deaths if each one had some build up. A little game of cat and mouse or running around trying to find where that sniper is hiding, or a drawn out back and forth battle, things like that. It's more like: Spawn, kill a guy, guy kills you, spawn, kill a guy guy kills you.

I'm newish to the online world, my last online console being the Dreamcast, but even games like Quake Arena or Alien Front Online seemed to have less randomness to it, maybe because it was fewer players?

And yes I understand that the Wii isn't the "ultimate" online gaming system. But it's the one I own.

[Icarus Moonsight]

I got my kicks done and out of the way on online gaming on the PC platform in the late-90s up to the release of the Dreamcast. Online play in console gaming has become a the] focus, which I do not agree with. Taking a console game online can be fun, but it's more of a nice little extra than what my intentions are mainly with consoles. I haven't seen anything that fundamentally makes me think of console gaming any differently than I did ~20 years ago. I guess you could say I'm not very impressed with what's out there so far. I do recognize a potential for that change though.

[Frankie_Says_Relax]

Hackers and stream-of-consciousness talkers are the two things that bug me about online gaming.

I LOVED Mario Kart Wii online until people started hacking Wii consoles/games and using exploits.

I got sick of losing online rank points to people who used all sorts of ridiculous exploits like infinite blue shells and star power, so I quit playing Mario Kart Wii that when that was all the rage.

I spend most of my online gaming time on PS3 these days.

Mod Nation Racers mostly filled the hole that Mario Kart Wii left (my OTTO vote for best racer AND most under-appreciated game of 2010) and there are fewer mic-enabled jibber-jabberers.

Cheaters and hackers you'll have to deal with just about everywhere at SOME point. They're just part of the landscape of online gaming.

But generally speaking, where online gaming vs. offline gaming is concerned I get a hell of a lot more personal enjoyment and satisfaction in playing against human opponents or with human team-mates than against any computer AI.

Resident Evil 5 is a prime example, that game is pretty brilliant IMO if you have a regular online co-op teammate to play through the entire adventure with ... but if you're stuck dealing with a computer controlled partner the game is more of a chore.

And as far as losing a lot is concerned, some games require a LOT of practice and observation to watch what the successful users are doing to be successful (in some cases you'll find that it's hacking/exploiting), and some games have an online leveling up system (Modern Warfare, Bioshock 2, Uncharted 2, etc.) the more you play online and better you do you unlock better abilities or points that you can apply to better abilities. That seems to be the way that most online multiplayer games are trending.

Though, if your concern is primarily with Goldeneye Wii and Mario Kart Wii, I know for a fact that Mario Kart was full of hackers, and I've read here and elsewhere that Goldeneye has a lot too.

[PapaStu]

No, I don't expect to end of first or win every round, It's the randomness that gets me. If you're reading the other Mario Kart thread, it seems all the issues people bring up in it are amped up to 11. I don't mind coming in first, fifth or last as long as that's where my skill level puts me. But too often it seems to go, blue shell, blue shell, red shell, POW and suddenly, I'm in 10th place.

In FPS,I play a little more methodically I suppose. I;m not upset with the kill ratio, It just bugs me that it happens so quickly. I'd much prefer half as many deaths if each one had some build up. A little game of cat and mouse or running around trying to find where that sniper is hiding, or a drawn out back and forth battle, things like that. It's more like: Spawn, kill a guy, guy kills you, spawn, kill a guy guy kills you.

I'm newish to the online world, my last online console being the Dreamcast, but even games like Quake Arena or Alien Front Online seemed to have less randomness to it, maybe because it was fewer players?

And yes I understand that the Wii isn't the "ultimate" online gaming system. But it's the one I own.


Forget 'ultimate'. That changes with each AAA release, day of the week and 50 other variables.

So for Mario Kart, you're reading that the AI is lame w/ item drops, due to balancing things between all, regardless of skill. Thats a problem. It's leveling the field for you, instead of relying on your skillz. Add in glitchers galore and the Mario Kart Wii experience is nuked.

GoldenEye is a FPS that prides itself on the hectic. Most of those maps are not designed for lone snipers hidin in the bushes, forcing you to hide the kids, hide the wives. Those are maps that have close respawns, to keep you in the action. In general FPS games arn't meant to be that slow of a draw. Game types maybe, but not the whole experience. People playing online FPS's mostly get the 'satisfaction' by getting kills... lots of kills.

I'll go back to CoD MW/MW2. There are the 'frantic' modes of Team DM, or DM. Then there are strategy types like bomb games, or CTF/KotH matches. Those dont reward for rushing. THOSE are slower paced. You want a good middle between the types? Play Hardcore. That'll teach you REAL fast.

The Wii has some great stuff, but in many regards their online aspects are lacking, due to the hoops required to even get to play people online. Their online has been designed around playing w/ friends, not with the random nublets who'll give you the challenge that most other online experiences will give you.

[exit]

Never played online with the Wii, but I've had a generally positive experience playing online with my PS3. You're always going to have those little annoyances, but whenever people start yelling in my ear, I just throw my headset off and continue playing without any disturbances. I've had loads of fun playing Warhawk, Burnout Paradise, Uncharted 2 online and played a 3 hour marathon of X-Men last night.

It can also depend on what game you're playing, I've gotten nothing but headaches playing COD: Modern Warfare online, to the point where literally every match had people arguing the entire time and ended up completely turning me off from playing. So it can sometimes come down to what audience the game you're playing attracts.

[Damaramu]

BAttlefield BAd Company 2 is a great example of online FPS game. You're not just mindlessly roaming around looking for people to shoot. If you want, you can play a whol match just healing and reviving people or driving vehicle and you can play your part in the team and the better your team works as a team, the better you guys will be.

Yeeeesss. A buddy of mine and I play BC2 quite a bit, always as a squad. Squad based play is the way to go. We usually go Assault & Medic to constantly feed ammo and revive one another.

Lone wolves are usually bush wookies (ie Recon aka sniper). I LOVE hunting those fuckers down. They almost never see that knife coming. :wink 2:

[hbkprm]

lost planet (1 & 2) and virtua fighter 5 are idea online games. all are underrated and greatly ignored.

[eskobar]

I got a great time with Diablo II and that experience was not machted until i started to play current generation online games ... Uncharted 2 still has many cheap kills but once you get the hang of it, it is a DELIGHTFUL online game.

Is is a bit more frustrating to play Modern Warfare 2 or Bad Company 2 whit soo many campers hidden .... but you can get some friends online and try to compete :D

[The 1 2 P]

Online gaming can be really fun but also frustrating. Just like most games, you need to practice as much as possible to get good at coming in the top three in racing games or even for fps games. As others have already mentioned, not every mode in an fps is strictly focused on killing. There are many objective based alternatives. If you play a team based game(rather slayer or objection) with a group of people who actually communicate(with headsets) and work together you will probably have a really good time. But if you get team mates who want to be lone wolves and keep running out to get killed then that will soil the experience.

When I started playing COD:MW2 online my KTD was horrible but thats because you can't just run out in that game like you can in something like Halo because you die alot faster. Every game has their specific balances that you need to keep in mind.

And then there are of course modders/hackers/stand-byers/etc to deal with. On that note, it's a wonder I ever enjoyed playing Halo 2 online. It must have had the worst all-around cheating of any fps game in existence. At times it seemed like every other game you played against a variety of cheaters. But it was "the" console online multiplayer game to play until Gears of War came out. I'm not sure how much modding/cheating goes on during Wii online multiplayer sessions but I doubt it's as bad as the 360.

Finally, although both racing and fps games are fun in their own right, theres nothing like playing against real people. Anyone can kill an AI controlled avatar but human controlled opponents are just as random in their attack style as you are and thats what makes it so great.

[Compute]

Although I have not played MP games on Wii, I can tell you than I get extremely frustrated playing MP on PS3. I'm not very good at COD, but my K-D rates are absolutely terrible. What it comes down to is the fact that I do not have time to devote to "practicing" all day long so I can play as good as some of these people who have been with the franchise for 5 years. Frustrating enough for me to set the game down for a few days.

What could they do to change it? Put in systems to make it more challenging for seasoned players? People would just delete and re-make their profiles every 2 days so they could keep the 7-rounds-per-minute homing rocket launcher so they could have a good K-D ratio. Or they would stop playing that game and move onto something where kills beget the ability to make more kills.

[heybtbm]

The Wii isn't exactly the best example of online gaming.

Understatement of the Year.


BAttlefield BAd Company 2 is a great example of online FPS game.

I love this guy!

[heybtbm]

What could they do to change it? Put in systems to make it more challenging for seasoned players? People would just delete and re-make their profiles every 2 days so they could keep the 7-rounds-per-minute homing rocket launcher so they could have a good K-D ratio. Or they would stop playing that game and move onto something where kills beget the ability to make more kills.

It's called Battlefield. It's a Thinking-Man's COD. Imagine an online FPS that's more than DIE repawn DIE respawn DIE.

Tactics, strategy, vehicles, huge maps...or you can just go around and kill people. Your choice.

[LaughingMAN.S9]

if you routinely become frustrated playing cod and you're not in a clan, do yourself a favor and avoid team deathmatch, instead just play mercenary or free for all,


what ever string of bad luck you might find yourself having in a game is magnified a thousand times when you're playing against an entire squad that coordinates all of their movements and actually play like a team, nothing is more frustrating than turning a corner and killing some guy only to be gunned down by 5 different ppl all shooting in concert from different directions

[Neil Koch]

I like the online part of Goldeneye, but it certainly has its problems.

A big one is that it doesn't keep people who are similar levels together. I'm level 10, and I'm regularly playing against people who are in 30's and 40's. Because of the leveling system, they have much better guns and equipment, and combined with the better knowledge of the levels and spawn camping, it leads to a lot of quick deaths like the OP mentioned.

Also, some of the maps are too small for 8 people. And frankly, some of them just flat out suck. And the rage quits (resulting in whole games, and the XP you earned, being scrapped) are very annoying. Most of the issues could be addressed with being able to make custom matches, something that has been in online FPS games since the days of Quake.

[kupomogli]

I got a great time with Diablo II and that experience was not machted until i started to play current generation online games ... Uncharted 2 still has many cheap kills but once you get the hang of it, it is a DELIGHTFUL online game.

Is is a bit more frustrating to play Modern Warfare 2 or Bad Company 2 whit soo many campers hidden .... but you can get some friends online and try to compete :D

Uncharted 2 online is very fun. Whether it's any of the deathmatch or capture modes they have, or the co-op modes. It does suck when you're not playing with people who are decent against a group of people who play as a team, but fun regardless. Camping is there, but not annoying like in games susch as the Call of Duty games where if you were to camp you'd probably see one guy running along every 15 minutes. It really makes me wonder why these people are playing video games if they're doing nothing but camping. I get bored as hell camping. These people should play Metal Gear Solid or join the military if they like staying in the exact same spot for long periods of time.

While Call of Duty Modern Warfare is somewhat enjoyable to play, I got tired of it quickly. I'd rather play Unreal Tournament 3 or Halo.

[retroman]

Dude..Goldeneye is the shit...you just need to get to a high level and unlock the guns and armor and other props you get...then you will kick ass and win out a shit load of games...just watch for the cheaters who have hacked the game..and there are quite a few..just dont go that rout..will ruin it for you and everyone else...they are all a bunch of bitches in my opinion. send me a message with your friend code if u ever want to play

[The 1 2 P]

I get bored as hell camping. These people should play Metal Gear Solid or join the military if they like staying in the exact same spot for long periods of time.

LOL. Thats why I don't play Metal Gear games, their pace is way too slow for me. The only legit reason to camp is if you have either a powerful short range weapon(like a shotgun) or a powerful long range weapon(like a sniper). It is frustrating as hell playing against those people but why would you try to charge someone across a battlefield with a shotgun? On the other hand, there are some people who camp regardless of what weapon they have, even a rocket launcher. But unfortunately camping is just something you have to get use to in online gaming just like modders and rage quitters.

[Neil Koch]

Dude..Goldeneye is the shit...you just need to get to a high level and unlock the guns and armor and other props you get...then you will kick ass and win out a shit load of games...just watch for the cheaters who have hacked the game..and there are quite a few..just dont go that rout..will ruin it for you and everyone else...they are all a bunch of bitches in my opinion. send me a message with your friend code if u ever want to play

Yeah the cheaters are a bag of suck. I'm wondering why EA doesn't ban these people? If you look at the leader boards, most of the top entries are obviously from cheaters (obviously inflated stats) - it's not that hard to keep an eye on something like that and just boot those people.

Also the rage quits are incredibly annoying. There should really be some sort of XP penalty if you intentionally quit a game. I've been mostly playing Heroes mode, and I've lost so much XP because people will quit out of the game in the last couple of minutes when they're losing.