item damaged during shipping - seller responsible?

[norkusa]

Have a problem with a sale I made on ebay recently and I'm confused on how I should handle this since it has never happened before to me before. Hoping someone that has been through a similar situation can give me some advice.

I sold a new & sealed PS2 game on Ebay. Received payment and shipped it out. Then a few days later, the buyer contacts me and asks if I sent him the same game pictured in my listing (I did) because it was severely crushed and mangled when he got it. The strange thing is that the said the packaging looked fine and did not appear to be tampered with (I used a bubble mailer and wrapped the game up with a layer of bubble wrap). Now he obviously wants to return it for a refund.

Who is at fault here and should I be refunding this? My return policy says "New items must be received in new/unused condition in order for a refund". The buyer is legit...he posts here and I think I may have even sold him stuff in the past too. That's why I'm confused on what to do. He's a fellow collector and I can totally sympathize but at the same time, how much can I responsible for a package after it leaves my hands?


tl;dr - item damaged during shipping, do I give a refund?

[Cornelius]

Well, the official eBay/Paypal stance is that you are responsible for getting the item into the buyer's hands in the described condition. This is regardless of the shipping method the buyer chose and/or insurance or anything else. So, the buyer can file a Paypal claim and will win.

As to how it should work... I dunno. It would be nice to say that the buyer should pay for insurance if they are worried about transit damage, but it is the sender that has to file any insurance claims, so that doesn't really work so well.

[ianoid]

Even if he doesn't win the paypal filing, he'll neg you. so you have to ask yourself, is the price worth a neg? For me, almost never.

[ryborg]

Well, the official eBay/Paypal stance is that you are responsible for getting the item into the buyer's hands in the described condition. This is regardless of the shipping method the buyer chose and/or insurance or anything else. So, the buyer can file a Paypal claim and will win.

Exactly this.

With that in mind, I recommend offering a partial refund and that he keeps the game. I know he said he'd like to return it for a refund, but what good does a mangled game get you? If it was packaged properly, maybe the buyer is understanding that these things occasionally happen when you have items shipped to you.

I'd also ask for a photo of the supposed damage. Sometimes buyers exaggerate or just want a cheap excuse to get their money back. I recently sold a McFarlane figure on ebay and the buyer said it was absolutely trashed in the mail. I found that extremely suspect since I ship those extremely secure. I asked for a photo and got a worthless, grainy photo that looked like it was taken on a digital camera from 1996.

He insisted on returning the figure, and it ended up being fine when I received it a few days later. Annoying, but whatever. You can't always avoid the flakes. I'm not saying the buyer is one of these idiots, but it's always a possibility.

[megasdkirby]

I agree with ryborg: ask for a picture.

This is why I avoid bubble mailers. Even when packed nicely, the post office can really abuse the hell out of it. At least in a sturdy small box, it's protected somewhat. Yes, the same thing can happen in a box, but in a bubble mailer, protection is much lesser and it's prone to being at the mercy of the Post Office.

There is also no guarantee that by refunding the buyer that he/she won't neg you. The buyer may do it anyway. But since the buyer is a DP member, I feel he/she is very understanding and won't neg you.

Although something I found odd: why would the buyer ask you if it's the same item when he/she knew it was damaged during shipping (can be obviously seen on the package itself). If I get a package that has been abused to hell and destroyed, I won't ask the seller if it's the same item, since it was obvious that it was abused/destroyed during shipping.

Hope for the best, though. :)

[bangtango]

It'd help to know.....

-How much the game sold for. If it was under $15-20, I'd probably just eat the refund but then again I don't make my living as a reseller for a primary source of income.

-Whether or not the disc is still in good condition and playable (anyone can replace a PS2 case easily enough)

[tpugmire]

That's why I ship FedEx. If something happens, I just file a claim. It also helps that I work there. I rarely use the post office, too many bad experiences.

[MarioMania]

It's the Post Office Fault here, not your's...

The guy shoud realize when a package get out of your hands and in the Post Office hand ..it's there problem

If they lose it, it's on them

[megasdkirby]

That's why I ship FedEx. If something happens, I just file a claim. It also helps that I work there. I rarely use the post office, too many bad experiences.

You can also put USPS Insurance on it.

I do that at times, depending on the item. I've noticed that in many instances, using insurance scares the crap out of the postal employees and they treat the package better and/or it arrives faster. This is at least in my experiences.

If by any chance the cover was broken and nothing else (the disc and manual and artwork are in very good condition), you could offer a replacement case. Whenever I get a game in which the case itself was damaged but everything else is intact/perfect condition, I just simply replace the case with a new one.


It's the Post Office Fault here, not your's...

The guy shoud realize when a package get out of your hands and in the Post Office hand ..it's there problem

If they lose it, it's on them

Tell that to Ebay. They will easily side with the buyer stating that the seller should have used a better method to ship the items.

Unfortunately, I would have to agree with Ebay on that one. I purchased gameboy/coleco/intellivision...any game that has a cardboard box and the sellers ship it via a regular BUBBLE MAILER. Really? A bubble mailer? What where they thinking? Bubble mailers might be great for certain items, but whenever an item that is somewhat flimsy or fragile is shipped, it's NOT a correct choice. Like they say over here in PR:

"Lo barato sale caro"

[bangtango]

Unfortunately, I would have to agree with Ebay on that one. I purchased gameboy/coleco/intellivision...any game that has a cardboard box and the sellers ship it via a regular BUBBLE MAILER. Really? A bubble mailer? What where they thinking? Bubble mailers might be great for certain items, but whenever an item that is somewhat flimsy or fragile is shipped, it's NOT a correct choice. Like they say over here in PR:

"Lo barato sale caro"

Agree. Only two negatives/neutrals I ever had selling on forums or Ebay was related to two different products each mailed in a bubble mailer that both arrived damaged. After the second time, I stopped using bubble mailers for my sales completely. I'll only use them if mailing a cd-r or dvd'r to a friend.

Otherwise I'll just use them for mailing a $2 manual, something that won't cost me an arm and a leg to reimburse if a USPS machine tears it in half.

[MarioMania]

Tell that to Ebay. They will easily side with the buyer stating that the seller should have used a better method to ship the items.

So if it's the Post Pffice Fault, It's on the seller..regardless, that's a stupid rule ebay has

[Oobgarm]

Last time something arrived damaged to a customer that didn't take insurance, I refused a return or refund.

Got a neg from it, and moved on.

That might paint me as a dick, but everything was fine and packed well when it left my hands. I'm not paying for the post office's mistake.

[MarioMania]

Last time something arrived damaged to a customer that didn't take insurance, I refused a return or refund.

Got a neg from it, and moved on.

That might paint me as a dick, but everything was fine and packed well when it left my hands. I'm not paying for the post office's mistake.

one time I bought some VCS Manuals on AA..Came Wet and Damage..I didn't complane ..I knew it was the Post Office Fault, I told the guy what happened ..I said if I wanted a refund..I said Nah it's only $3

[megasdkirby]

So if it's the Post Pffice Fault, It's on the seller..regardless, that's a stupid rule ebay has

Agree and disagree.

Agreed if the item was packaged nicely and protecting the item in question. In other words, there is no reason for the item to become damaged during shipping.

Disagree if the item was sent in a lousy way. A bubble mailer for a boxed game. A system tossed in a box with no protection whatsoever. A fragile ceramic figurine in a regular manila envelope.

If I shipped a game in a box and it was sturdy enough to protect it from most damage, then it's not my fault if the Post Office abuses of it. However, if I ship the item half ass and it breaks during shipping, it IS my fault because I failed to protect the item adequately.

I've been through sending an item and it breaking during shipping, all because I decided to skimp on shipping materials for protection. Fortunately, I had a few spares so I simply sent a replacement and all was well. Also helps that it was for a friend in Florida, and he was/is very understanding.

But after that experience, I use common sense when shipping items. And even then, I mostly ship using a small box, like Cornelius stated in another topic (since I have quite a few in storage).

So a seller really isn't free from any liability. It all depends on the situation.

[eskobar]

It was an expensive game ? ... or why do you have to overthink what to do ?.

I always try to put myself on the other side and think about what would be the best treatment that i can get ... and that is my answer.

Usually eBay is great to make money but once in a while something goes wrong and i think that most of the time is pretty easy to solve this things.

As a Mexican seller it happened to me that one box arrived extremely damaged but the item was in perfect condition and the buyer sent me the picture just to be grateful for the great packing.

Cheers !

[megasdkirby]

one time I bought some VCS Manuals on AA..Came Wet and Damage..I didn't complane ..I knew it was the Post Office Fault, I told the guy what happened ..I said if I wanted a refund..I said Nah it's only $3

Would you feel the same if the manual was for a rare game, like for Air World, Stadium Events, and what not?

I don't think so...you would be very livid. And although you know it was not the sellers fault, you would still try to put part of the blame on the seller for not sending in a slightly better manner to protect it during shipping.

When it's cheap, no prob. When it's expensive, everything changes.

[MarioMania]

It was just common VSC Games like Asteriods

[bangtango]

Saying the seller shouldn't have to pay for USPS's mistakes may seem logical for items that arrive damaged. But that same logic doesn't necessarily fly when the buyer never receives the item at all. Don't those more often than not turn out to be a refund to the buyer? Yet those are also USPS "mistakes."

[98PaceCar]

So if it's the Post Pffice Fault, It's on the seller..regardless, that's a stupid rule ebay has

If you buy something from Wal Mart and take it home to find out it's broken, who's responsible for that? You're going to blame Wal Mart and take it back to them. They are going to smile (or at least look at you blankly) and take it back, as they should.

The seller being responsible for ultimate delivery is a part of doing business and if an item arrives broken (or not at all), the cost involved falls to the seller as another part of doing business.

[bangtango]

If you buy something from Wal Mart and take it home to find out it's broken, who's responsible for that? You're going to blame Wal Mart and take it back to them. They are going to smile (or at least look at you blankly) and take it back, as they should.

The seller being responsible for ultimate delivery is a part of doing business and if an item arrives broken (or not at all), the cost involved falls to the seller as another part of doing business.


Good point. People bid on auctions based on a written description (or a stock description) in an auction listing.

Nobody in their right mind would bid what they feel a sealed game is worth to them for a game that is in poor condition from damage.

[Parodius Duh!]

sending stuff in bubble mailers is usually a bad idea. They can get stomped on, twisted up, and the outcome is itll look fine on the outside, not so much on the inside. I got 2 famicom games from a seller and the bubble mailer looked fine, they were wrapped up tight with bubble wrap inside, but once they were unraveled they practically fell apart in my hand, they were legitimately shattered into a billion pieces. Also, from experince working in the post office, your stuff IS NOT handled nicely, it gets tossed, flung, accidentaly stepped on, etc.

[Marriott_Guy]

Many good points, but in the end it is the Seller's responsibility to ensure that the item sold is delivered in the same condition as it was advertised.

I have had quite a few transactions through eBay (and DP/RFG/Assem/etc.) and in 95% of the cases I have always included insurance to safe guard both myself, but more importantly my customer. I endured too many of the crappy packaging during my collecting days and did not want to subject any person I sold to the same - I want them to feel reassured in their purchase. Insurance provides this, regardless if I ship through UPS, USPS or Fedex. I include this (insurance cost) right up front when quoting shipping charges.

I have only had to claim one item (Panasonic Q) for insurance (via USPS). I take pictures of everything I ship out prior to mailing, and requested pictures from the Buyer who responded promptly. That is the key (before \ after pictures) in filing a successful claim. I kept the Buyer abreast during the entire time and copied them on the actual forms I filled out. He received his refund and left me a positive (non DP member - it was on eBay).

Insure Items - Package for the Apocalypse (no bubble mailers) - Keep Buyer Informed if any Claim = Positive Feedback (hopefully :) )

Hope your situation turns out well.

[norkusa]

The game was Disgaea (sealed, non-GH version) and I got $40 for it. The buyer sent me several pics today:

http://home.comcast.net/%7Enorkusa/disgaea_damaged.jpg

He sent some pics of the packaging too. There was a big tear across the front from where he opened it up but before that, the only visible damage was a small tear/hole in the back-middle of the mailer. Keep in mind that the game was wrapped up in an extra layer of bubble wrap too.

Doesn't really look like I have a chance of winning this in a Paypal dispute (does Paypal *ever* side with sellers??), so I'm just going to tell him to return it for a refund. Don't know what I'm supposed to do with this game now though.

Funny thing is that I just posted in a thread last week about using bubble mailers to ship SMS/Genesis games. Never had a problem using them in 10+ years of selling and now look what happens. Go figure.

[megasdkirby]

Sorry to see what happened, nork. :(

Is there any possibility that the box and artwork can be found online, through a company like bregames?

Seriously try to opt and put the games inside sturdy boxes or at least place pieces of thick cardboard on the sides. That should offer alot more protection that just using a bubble mailer.

[eskobar]

The game was Disgaea (sealed, non-GH version) and I got $40 for it. The buyer sent me several pics today:

http://home.comcast.net/%7Enorkusa/disgaea_damaged.jpg

He sent some pics of the packaging too. There was a big tear across the front from where he opened it up but before that, the only visible damage was a small tear/hole in the back-middle of the mailer. Keep in mind that the game was wrapped up in an extra layer of bubble wrap too.

Doesn't really look like I have a chance of winning this in a Paypal dispute (does Paypal *ever* side with sellers??), so I'm just going to tell him to return it for a refund. Don't know what I'm supposed to do with this game now though.

Funny thing is that I just posted in a thread last week about using bubble mailers to ship SMS/Genesis games. Never had a problem using them in 10+ years of selling and now look what happens. Go figure.

pfffffffffffffffffff, good game *_*


I think that you can still try to sell it here or eBay to recover something .... ^^;

[norkusa]

Yeah. I guess I'll just open it, tape it up, put it inside a new case, and try to re-sell it. Just glad this didn't happen before the re-print though when used copies were selling for $100+ :-/

I bought a bunch of 11 x 14 in bubble mailers today. Now when I ship single games out, I'm going to put them bubble wrapped inside of a small flat rate priority box before it goes inside the mailer. Something still tells me that it wouldn't have saved this one though.

[megasdkirby]

For the time being, just place the games between two pieces of cardboard, thick cardboard.

Yes, the bubble mailer will have a really tight fit, but otherwise it will be protected alot more, which is always a plus.

I've purchased Wii and Xbox games like this...it's tough to take out, but it really protects the item during shipping. And it's good enough to smack someone with. :)

[Marriott_Guy]

Sorry to see what happened, nork. :(
Seriously try to opt and put the games inside sturdy boxes or at least place pieces of thick cardboard on the sides. That should offer alot more protection that just using a bubble mailer.

+1

If you can't/opt not to use a box, then definitely use some sturdy cardboard to protect the item. This will obviously not work as well as the box, but will give it some protection from what was pictured by your buyer (seal torn).

It could have been worse... Have you offered him a discount to just keep it? For $40, assuming you pay the return shipping fees, it is definitely worth exploring.

[theclaw]

Doesn't really look like I have a chance of winning this in a Paypal dispute (does Paypal *ever* side with sellers??), so I'm just going to tell him to return it for a refund. Don't know what I'm supposed to do with this game now though.

I lost an item not described case against a seller of Russian MW2 keys, and lost. Even though the seller broke ebay rules by asking for positive feedback before they'd send the item. I guess my fault for not asking the key's origin before purchase. Nowhere did the ad specify its language...

[ryborg]

(does Paypal *ever* side with sellers??)

For "not as described" disputes, no. A buyer could buy a red shirt and complain that it wasn't blue to Paypal and he would win the dispute. I know there are reports of Paypal occasionally siding with the seller, but it's very very very rare.

[Cornelius]

Okay nork, you've said it yourself that you've been doing this for 10+ years with no problems using bubble mailers. Let's say in an alternate reality you'd been using boxes or PITA reinforced bubble mailer packaging during that time. It would have taken until now for an inter-dimensional being to notice any difference in your outcomes, except that the you would have spent less time packaging and had better/higher priced sales versus the not-you you. So, you have to decide which 'you' came out better off. Did this one incident offset those 10+ years of just sliding the game in a mailer and sending it off?

I'm not trying to be critical of the packaging zealots (I'm lookin' at you kirby! :hail: :love:), but using a box every time does come at a price.

Your $40 item is right on the edge for me between box or bubble mailer. I mean, I'm not crazy! I wouldn't send a Bubble Bath Babes in a bubble mailer (even if it would be appropriate name-wise). Heck, I wouldn't send a Bubble Bobble 2 in a bubble mailer. But for me in the 3 or 4 years I've been selling on eBay there is no way I'd switch to boxes or cutting out custom pieces of cardboard for every game. It just doesn't pay off and I'm not even a bigtime seller having only ~700 feedback (100%+ thankyouverymuch) over these past few years.

[mobiusclimber]

Use better/sturdier packaging materials? How about putting insurance on there instead? That way:

a) The post office will be less inclined to treat it like it's a football.
b) If it DOES get damaged, the post office pays for it.
c) If it gets lost, the post office pays for it.
d) If it gets stolen off someone's porch (or the buyer just CLAIMS it was), the post office pays for.
e) The buyer is less likely to lie and say it was damaged/stolen/etc knowing there will be a federal (haha) investigation into it.

The downside is the cost. I only ever use insurance on items that are worth $40 or more since it costs over a dollar to insure stuff. I've also not had to file any claims (which I hear the PO will fight you on like crazy), but I think the big reason I haven't is b/c I insure stuff. I could be wrong, it could not have anything to do with my rock (sorry, Simpsons reference), but I do an awful lot of selling and considering all the problems I had BEFORE I started using insurance, I'm just going to say it's working and continue on.

[ryborg]

Use better/sturdier packaging materials? How about putting insurance on there instead?

I'm not sure having insurance would have helped here. Like you mentioned, the PO makes you prove the item was damaged during shipping, not because of poor packaging, which is a tough sell and involves a lot of time and paperwork.

It's a freak thing. Screw the haters, I think the PO does a great job overall. I've shipped 10,000+ items domestically and I can count on one hand the amount that were actually damaged during shipping.

[Snesguy666]

what about buyers damaging the item and claiming a fake refund or
maybe just calming a fake refund such as :game dose not work" and buyers just belive them without any proof? and buyer tells them to keep it and the buyer gets a refund and the working game/item?

((this has never happned to me)) and i always try to provide proof unless me camera is broken.

[theclaw]

Heck. I once had a buyer either an idiot or lying who claimed an item didn't work. Yet they actually returned it for refund and paid full return shipping (over $20) themselves, as my ads specify to do. Despite it turned out to be working when I received it back! I immediately relisted that one.

My opinion leans toward the latter. They're one of those people who appears to not leave feedback. Ever. Zero left for any buyer or seller.

[megasdkirby]

But for me in the 3 or 4 years I've been selling on eBay there is no way I'd switch to boxes or cutting out custom pieces of cardboard for every game. It just doesn't pay off and I'm not even a bigtime seller having only ~700 feedback (100%+ thankyouverymuch) over these past few years.

Oh, I would not either. For super cheap games, I would think bubble mailers would be best. No use using a box for a $5 game...unless you already had one available. The most I would do if I wanted was put the pieces of cardboard if they were available.

For $20 games, I would use the pieces of cardboard.

For $40+ games, I would use boxes.

Those are for reinforced games. Those that are fragile (like GB games, Intelli games, Coleco games), bubble mailers are not practical, IMO. Unless the box is flatten during shipping and placed between pieces of card, I would not use bubble mailers. But for DVD type games, I would understand.


Use better/sturdier packaging materials? How about putting insurance on there instead?

Thing is, that just would not work for every scenario. If you would to use a bubble mailer for a cardboard boxed game, and file an insurance claim, the possibility is high that the post office will say "You should have used better packaging" and deny your claim. Or if you tossed an NES system inside an empty box three times as big with no protection (so it moves inside the box), the post office will also deny your claim...heck, at times even refuse to put insurance to begin with.


Screw the haters, I think the PO does a great job overall. I've shipped 10,000+ items domestically and I can count on one hand the amount that were actually damaged during shipping.


Agreed. I've had more issues with UPS and Fedex than with USPS. I actually prefer them.

[mobiusclimber]

The PO sells padded envelopes and encourages their use, so I don't see how they can then claim that it's insufficient packaging. We're not talking about shipping fine china here.

[bangtango]

It's a freak thing. Screw the haters, I think the PO does a great job overall. I've shipped 10,000+ items domestically and I can count on one hand the amount that were actually damaged during shipping.

Truth is, all the major carriers do a good job "in general." At least USPS, UPS, Fedex and DHL. If they didn't, they wouldn't be in business.

Most people who have regular problems with one or more carriers don't do a good job of studying fees or regulations for that carrier.

I know plenty of people who complain about USPS yet they haven't the slightest idea what a delivery confirmation slip is, how you insure a package and what it means or why their mail gets lost & delayed if they are too thickheaded to enter their CORRECT zip code or apartment number when ordering stuff, etc.

Just discussing UPS/Fedex, the only real delivery problems they have are tied into weather delays (an uncontrollable matter), the occasional incompetent driver (which can happen to anybody) or screwed up rural, apartment, condo, business or university addresses. That doesn't even include imbeciles who order shit without bothering to check the shipping address for accuracy before submitting it online. Not the carrier's fault.

That's as stupid as not figuring out what somebody's return policy is before making a purchase and then bitching about not liking the company/seller's policy after attempting to make the return and having it fail because of something that could have been worked around by studying the damn return policy.

[Rickstilwell1]

Yeah. I guess I'll just open it, tape it up, put it inside a new case, and try to re-sell it. Just glad this didn't happen before the re-print though when used copies were selling for $100+ :-/

I bought a bunch of 11 x 14 in bubble mailers today. Now when I ship single games out, I'm going to put them bubble wrapped inside of a small flat rate priority box before it goes inside the mailer. Something still tells me that it wouldn't have saved this one though.

But never do this with a cardboard boxed game. Why? Mail delivery persons are used to squeezing bubble mailers tightly inside your mailbox instead of putting them below where packages go. My CIB copy of Donkey Kong for Game Boy got squashed a little so I ask for a $5 refund and got it, telling the seller to never ship it like that again. If you're going to use a priority mail box, leave it that way, don't put an envelope around it.

If you're sending a game with a hard case like a PS2 or PS1 game, then your method should be fine. But never a soft box.

[megasdkirby]

The PO sells padded envelopes and encourages their use, so I don't see how they can then claim that it's insufficient packaging. We're not talking about shipping fine china here.

They will encourage it's use because they are selling them to make a profit. Same with those new fancy boxes they sell. Whatever makes them money, they will "encourage".

Also, it all depends on the item. Try placing a small porcelain figurine in a bubble mailer. USPS might tell you that it's ok, but common sense tells you "that's stupid!". Yet unfortunately many sellers have done this... O_O


If you're sending a game with a hard case like a PS2 or PS1 game, then your method should be fine. But never a soft box.

EXACTLY. Some sellers are naive in which they think that something really fragile will arrive nicely in a method that is not meant to be shipped in. Basically, if sending something like a CIB NES game (with cardboard box), use a box to ship! Never risk and be optimistic that a simple bubble mailer will protect the game from harm. Better be safe than sorry.

[norkusa]

But never do this with a cardboard boxed game. Why? Mail delivery persons are used to squeezing bubble mailers tightly inside your mailbox instead of putting them below where packages go. My CIB copy of Donkey Kong for Game Boy got squashed a little so I ask for a $5 refund and got it, telling the seller to never ship it like that again. If you're going to use a priority mail box, leave it that way, don't put an envelope around it.

If you're sending a game with a hard case like a PS2 or PS1 game, then your method should be fine. But never a soft box.

Well the reason I do this is because $5-$6 Priority shipping on a small/light item turns off a lot of potential buyers, no matter what its value is. It's much easier to sell things when shipping is $2.99 for first class so that's what I usually go with. I always list Priority as an alternative option but nobody ever uses it.

I used to tell the post office clerks to stamp the package with a couple "Fragile" stamps but I'm convinced they treat those packages worse, so I don't even bother with the stamping anymore.

[megasdkirby]

Well the reason I do this is because $5-$6 Priority shipping on a small/light item turns off a lot of potential buyers, no matter what its value is. It's much easier to sell things when shipping is $2.99 for first class so that's what I usually go with. I always list Priority as an alternative option but nobody ever uses it.

I used to tell the post office clerks to stamp the package with a couple "Fragile" stamps but I'm convinced they treat those packages worse, so I don't even bother with the stamping anymore.

Priority Mail =/= Box only
First Class Mail =/= Bubble Mailers only

You can easily send something in a box via First Class Mail as long as the total weight does not surpass 13 ounces. I've done this several times, and those who have purchased from me know this as well. That the Post Office says that boxes are only for Priority and better services (which some have, even the one near home) is full of bullshit.

Also, you can send items via Priority Mail in a bubble mailer, usually because the item is over 13 ounces, forcing Priority Mail as the default option.

Yes, if the boxes you have are only that of Priority Mail, then I understand why you can't ship items in a small box. I would recommend, however, to save small boxes in case that you may need to ship something in the future via First Class Mail. You don't need to purchase them, just save those you come across.

[Griking]

Doesn't really look like I have a chance of winning this in a Paypal dispute (does Paypal *ever* side with sellers??) Typically not. All policies are pretty much designed to the buyer's advantage. That being said, looking at the picture you posted it's looks like the game was crushed. Unfortunately those are the chances you take when you ship in a bubble mailer.

[Zing]

It is my personal experience that Paypal will side with you and not force a refund. I have been on the other end as the buyer receiving cosmetically damaged goods. My claim was refused.

[norkusa]

It is my personal experience that Paypal will side with you and not force a refund. I have been on the other end as the buyer receiving cosmetically damaged goods. My claim was refused.

Really!?!? Well the the buyer already sent the game back and I gave him his refund. Definitely going to fight it next time though.

[megasdkirby]

Really!?!? Well the the buyer already sent the game back and I gave him his refund. Definitely going to fight it next time though.

It depends on how solid the case is. From all the cases I've seen, it's the other way around: the buyer usually wins the case. Now, if when the claim was filed, the "explanation" is poor or not convincing...and not as "Not as Described", then the seller will win.