Why do game systems have region locks?

[stalepie]

Is there any obvious answer? Is it to make it easier to market a title in certain areas, such as Japan first? Nintendo seemed to have started it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Regional_lockout#First_things_first:_Why.3F

The article itself doesn't address the question of why. I think it's really dumb. I'm supposed to buy some laserfix from Austria on eBay (an unlisted auction?) and then pay 50 dollars for some other guy on Digitpress to install the chip, just so my PS2 Slim can play a couple of old PS1 imports. Lame!

Or I can buy a Japanese PS1, except when I tried searching for information about the correct voltages (power supplies) to use I found that GOOGLE WAS TOTALLY USELESS. Hate Google. Absolutely worthless search engine. Don't see how anybody gets anything useful out of it.

Isn't there any better search engine than Google? Something that pulls up relevant information when I search for "ps1 voltage" or "playstation 1 voltage." I know, it's giving me PS3 information and PS2, because it's more popular and seems related, but it's obvious by "ps1" that I don't mean ps3, so it should know better. I mean, why not throw in Wikipedia's entries for giraffes and mongooses and Diane Sawyer? That's just as related to what I want. Assholes. I hate google.

hate the internet. Everything is totally hard to do. It's much easier to go talking to someone face to face at a store

except you can't DO THIS because it's ILLEGAL even though it's perfectly legal to fucking buy the PS1 imports from eBay. what am I supposed to do with them then? Just let them sit around on the shelf?

Why the fuck do they have region locks, and should this thread be locked too? Fucking region locks.

And they could just put up all those titles on the PSN store too lickety split. Probably would take them about an hour of uploading if they don't already have them up and prepared just unavailable to buy and search for.

Thank G-d for Snesorama and Emuparadise. I actually get to PLAY some of these games. Fuck you kevin butler. Assohle.

Jesus, I mean why does it matter if Night Striker or Sexy Parodius is translated? Just put it up on the store. Oh but we get Shienryu, everybody's least favorite import shooter. Not Harmful Park. Not something actually good.

[stalepie]

And yeah yea hI know I can just copy the data off the CDs to my hard drive and play them with an emulator -- which i've done before -- but I don't WANT to use an emulator!!!!! damn it!!!

:)

[stalepie]

It's like imagine if you buy a box of chocolates from Switzerland, you're a tourist there and you buy some chocolates, and you take it home with you on the plane and then you take it out of your suitcase or travel bag or whatever when you get home and you find you can't open the package!!! or when you taste it it tastes much bitter than you thought chocolate ever possibly could, more bitter than it did in Switzerland even though it's Real chocolate or whatever.


or a book. You buy a book overseas and you take it home with you and then the words are all blurry when you open it at home.

[stalepie]

"I don't think this is exactly the reason. Handheld consoles use their own proprietary video display system, however video game consoles that use TVs are faced with the issue that some countries use 50Hz video systems (most PAL formats, and SECAM) and others use 60Hz systems (NTSC), so games have to be re-designed/re-programmed to be sold in certain countries. --Zilog Jones 23:11, 12 Jun 2005 (UTC)"

Couldn't the game just be programmed to have both versions on one disc? They make both versions anyway. It might even save them money not having to design and print separate copies for different cuntries.

[stalepie]

It seems like the only useful information you ever find with a search engine is on forums (sort of), but then it's just scrawled in some half-assed all-lowercase I-didn't-seem-to-pass-5th-grade kind of way by some anonymous stranger who wouldn't dare give out his real name. It's never a good website without ads that has documented information that's easy to browse and seems intent on permanently staying.

like this:
http://psx-scene.com/forums/f20/japanese-ps2-america-power-supply-29153/

Just a bunch of fucking ads. Then you scroll around trying to read the annoying text of the actual discussion and trying to decide whether these anonymous strangers know anything about ps voltages OR ANYTHING, anything of importance.

Not just trivial matters like this, but historical information (discussions about history), technical information of all kinds, etc. The internet is totally ugly. There seems to be so little attempt at quality control or all the good sites are shoved aside for the bad.

Or maybe people just don't use search engines anymore. I don't know.

[Frankie_Says_Relax]

Easy with the stream-of-consciousness posting there, you know you can edit your existing posts, right?

Region locks have in part a lot to do with keeping profits properly regionally distributed.

If people who own a game system in country X can buy the software at a bargain rate from country Y which has a severely depressed economy/currency value that tends to screw with the projected/intended/actual profits that the manufacturer of said game system wants for country X.

There are other reasons for region lock-outs, but that's one for sure.

[stalepie]

I guess you're supposed to trust comments in forums based on how good their avatar is.

Have a clever avatar of a cat shaking its head rapidly? Maybe that person knows what he's talking about then!

[stalepie]

Frankie doesn't have a good avatar, so I don't think I agree with him. For instance, how does he explain the regionless DS?

I bet the game companies themselves don't know why they have region locks.

[Swamperon]

Because video game companies are evil.

At least that's what I tell myself. ;)

[stalepie]

If you put Howard Stringer in a corner and asked him about it he'd be like "The PS3 had what?"

[stalepie]

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/84/Sir_Howard_Stringer_Shankbone_Metropolitan_Opera_2 009.jpg/220px-Sir_Howard_Stringer_Shankbone_Metropolitan_Opera_2 009.jpg

[Frankie_Says_Relax]

Frankie doesn't have a good avatar, so I don't think I agree with him. For instance, how does he explain the regionless DS?

I bet the game companies themselves don't know why they have region locks.

There are a few region-locked DSi titles, but the 3DS is the first region-locked Nintendo portable system.

I can't speak for Nintendo regarding WHY they've never been concerned with region-locking other than it has never been a part of their portable system legacy.

I suppose the logic is that portable systems are portable and will frequently travel to other regions.

[mattimeo310]

Is this some kind of elaborate scheme to increase post count?

[PapaStu]

Simple answer? Licensing = monies.

Games are licensed for use on systems. Publishers in the distribution of games, don't necessarily have the legal right to release games in other portions of the world. A publishing company may not want to go throught the costs of porting a title (not only for language, but for tv's as well) due to needing to make new agreements with the developers of the game for what could be a very small upswing in sales in another region before even factoring in the costs of licensing it in another region. Some games also have music in them that is licensed for use only if the game is released in one region. Unless new agreements can be forged, or music replaced that can also stop the publishing of a game.

Portables early on didn't have the simple 'lockout' of a power plug difference or a tv signal difference. Making them region locked when it was designed as a portable system a bit silly. Now that they are accessing regional online networks where once again, publishers are paying for games to be released, the units are beginning to get locked down.

[Lady Jaye]

What both Stu and Frankie said.

Region lock = protectionism and distribution agreements. Same reason as to why DVDs and Blu-rays are region locked.

[stalepie]

Simple answer? Licensing = monies.

Games are licensed for use on systems. Publishers in the distribution of games, don't necessarily have the legal right to release games in other portions of the world. A publishing company may not want to go throught the costs of porting a title (not only for language, but for tv's as well) due to needing to make new agreements with the developers of the game for what could be a very small upswing in sales in another region before even factoring in the costs of licensing it in another region. Some games also have music in them that is licensed for use only if the game is released in one region. Unless new agreements can be forged, or music replaced that can also stop the publishing of a game.

Portables early on didn't have the simple 'lockout' of a power plug difference or a tv signal difference. Making them region locked when it was designed as a portable system a bit silly. Now that they are accessing regional online networks where once again, publishers are paying for games to be released, the units are beginning to get locked down.

When you say, "some games have music in them which is licensed for only one region," why not make music CDs also region-locked? Or mp3s? Is that already done and I just haven't noticed?

I know VEVO on YouTube (which I like) blocks music from playing in certain countries, but it's my understanding that the data is being streamed from outside of the country. It's not the same as if you buy a music CD in another country, put it in your purse and then take it home to your home country. Your country may have laws about what you can possess (such as drugs), but you can still play the CD in your CD player at home.

Putting a region lock on the DVD or game doesn't have an affect on whether the game maker is going to have it ported to other regions, as far as I can tell. Some games stay in Japan and never get translated or ported and some games don't. A lot are released overseas, of course, therefore making it semi-absurd that there's region locks when no changes regarding the rights to this-or-that data (music, for instance), is made. I'm sure you'll think of some instances, but plenty of it is unlicensed (or inhouse composed) music that has no legal trouble going overseas. (It used to always be that way really).

There just isn't region locks for other goods besides these few types of items. That's why it is strange. Maybe I'm mistaken and there's actually region-locks on Kindle books you buy or something.

The difference between VEVO blocking music to a country and Kindle blocking something to a user based on their region is that you haven't already paid for it before you see that you are blocked. Of course, I know damn well that if I buy an import PS1 game from eBay that I need a modded PS1/2/3 or emulation or Japanese system to play it on, and it usually says that in the auction, but I'm just saying from a rights perspective you still have already purchased the product. It's a little alien way of thinking to say you can purchase something but not be able to use it unless you move to the region that it's meant to be used in. I just don't really get it.

It would make more sense if you simply couldn't purchase the foreign item in the first place.

--
Also what you said about the DS seems to contradict -- the same should apply to either system. It seems like you're saying the real reason regionlocks were started weren't due to monies and licensing but practical issues like PAL/NTSC.

Also publishers were always "paying for the games to be released." They had to manufacture and distribute them...

[stalepie]

I guess it's just price discrimination like you say, like this says:

There are many purposes that region coding can achieve, but the primary one is price discrimination, i.e., allowing the manufacturer to demand a higher price depending on what the market will allow. There is great disparity among the regions of the world in how much a person is willing to pay for a DVD. Price discrimination is especially applicable to DVDs, as the marginal cost of selling one DVD is relatively small, allowing the seller a great deal of flexibility in pricing.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DVD_region_code#Purpose

I still find it strange that it's broken down into such broad regions, though. Seems like it should be by country.

Maybe it is. If you look at this map it shows a country in South America that is colored orange.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:DVD-Regions_with_key-2.svg

Then there's some little country out in the South Pacific that's colored orange. So it's not really regions.

China and America/Canada are the most separate from the rest. (And are on opposite poles of the diagram 1-6).

[Enigmus]

See the button labeled "Edit"? Click on it.

Posting bloat solved.

[stalepie]

(shrug) I've always NOT used the edit button on purpose, despite getting modded in the past at other places, because I'd otherwise have to add some dashes (---- / ====) or something between sections or a lot of spacing anyway (the red line that Digitpress has been posts makes that look nicer). Since I don't have an avatar or a signature it doesn't really create extra space or "bloat", or extra time spent scrolling up and down.

Plus you can see that I did use the edit button in some of the posts above as well as elsewhere.

Another cool feature of not editing posts is you get timestamps between posts - sometimes a post is added a day later or sometimes it's 3 minutes later.


oh cool there's some deer outside right now. Gotta look. 2 deer. great. love it. living in georgia is wonderful :)
gonna go check them out instead of posting obnoxiously over and over again in this thread -

[Bojay1997]

When you say, "some games have music in them which is licensed for only one region," why not make music CDs also region-locked? Or mp3s? Is that already done and I just haven't noticed?

I know VEVO on YouTube (which I like) blocks music from playing in certain countries, but it's my understanding that the data is being streamed from outside of the country. It's not the same as if you buy a music CD in another country, put it in your purse and then take it home to your home country. Your country may have laws about what you can possess (such as drugs), but you can still play the CD in your CD player at home.

Putting a region lock on the DVD or game doesn't have an affect on whether the game maker is going to have it ported to other regions, as far as I can tell. Some games stay in Japan and never get translated or ported and some games don't. A lot are released overseas, of course, therefore making it semi-absurd that there's region locks when no changes regarding the rights to this-or-that data (music, for instance), is made. I'm sure you'll think of some instances, but plenty of it is unlicensed (or inhouse composed) music that has no legal trouble going overseas. (It used to always be that way really).

There just isn't region locks for other goods besides these few types of items. That's why it is strange. Maybe I'm mistaken and there's actually region-locks on Kindle books you buy or something.

The difference between VEVO blocking music to a country and Kindle blocking something to a user based on their region is that you haven't already paid for it before you see that you are blocked. Of course, I know damn well that if I buy an import PS1 game from eBay that I need a modded PS1/2/3 or emulation or Japanese system to play it on, and it usually says that in the auction, but I'm just saying from a rights perspective you still have already purchased the product. It's a little alien way of thinking to say you can purchase something but not be able to use it unless you move to the region that it's meant to be used in. I just don't really get it.

It would make more sense if you simply couldn't purchase the foreign item in the first place.

--
Also what you said about the DS seems to contradict -- the same should apply to either system. It seems like you're saying the real reason regionlocks were started weren't due to monies and licensing but practical issues like PAL/NTSC.

Also publishers were always "paying for the games to be released." They had to manufacture and distribute them...

You're confusing a product which may contains various licensed elements with a product that can in and of itself be licensed. When a composer or band or label licenses their music for a game, a film, a television show etc..they often impose significant territorial restrictions. They do this for a variety of reasons, not the least of which is they don't want to harm sales of their albums, concerts, etc...in those territories or damage their reputation as somehow being a sell-out. Similarly, game manufacturers want to be able to maintain the highest price possible for the longest period of time on their products and one way to do that is to prevent people from importing the identical product for less whether that's because games in the other region are simply cheaper or because the game was released months or years earlier in that region and has now fallen in price.

In this high speed internet age unfortunately, it is becoming harder and harder to limit territories. In fact, television and movie studios are closely monitoring websites to make sure their products don't end up on-line worldwide prior to being released in particular territories. You might think it's not a big deal, but by some estimates, as much as 2/10 of a rating point can be lost if something premieres in English in Europe and people are able to watch or download it prior to an initial US airing. In dollar terms, that can be hundreds of thousands of dollars in lost ad revenue per episode or millions over a season of episodes.

I'm not sure why you're so argumentative about this whole issue. Obviously, some manufacturers care less about regional locks than others. Some clearly believe it impacts their profits and others may not. In any event, there are good arguments for and against regional coding.

[Lady Jaye]

Stalepie: are you arguing for the sake of arguing or of trolling?

Case in point re. games with regional licenced music: Daigasso Band Bros on the DS, which was finally (after all these years) released in Europe but not here. Was it due to lack of market interest? Probably not, more in terms of music licencing costs.

[Frankie_Says_Relax]

(shrug) I've always NOT used the edit button on purpose, despite getting modded in the past at other places, because I'd otherwise have to add some dashes (---- / ====) or something between sections or a lot of spacing anyway (the red line that Digitpress has been posts makes that look nicer). Since I don't have an avatar or a signature it doesn't really create extra space or "bloat", or extra time spent scrolling up and down.

Plus you can see that I did use the edit button in some of the posts above as well as elsewhere.

Another cool feature of not editing posts is you get timestamps between posts - sometimes a post is added a day later or sometimes it's 3 minutes later.


oh cool there's some deer outside right now. Gotta look. 2 deer. great. love it. living in georgia is wonderful :)
gonna go check them out instead of posting obnoxiously over and over again in this thread -

Just like it is on most civilized/well-maintained message boards, multi-posting in the same thread is frowned upon here. Please refrain from doing so.

Thanks.

[stalepie]

dang it, now my schnauzer has gone after them. There was 4 of them, a whole family. Wish schnauzers came with region locks.

[Lady Jaye]

Ok, that's enough. Stalepie, consider yourself warned. Trolling will not be tolerated.

BTW, it is bad form to flame moderators in a message board, especially if you intend to last more than a few days before being banned.

After the region lock, here comes the *THREAD LOCK*.

[Bojay1997]

dang it, now my schnauzer has gone after them. There was 4 of them, a whole family. Wish schnauzers came with region locks.

I think we need a mod to go ahead and lock this thread and ban this guy. He is clearly trolling.