I Hate Water Levels!

[Nz17]

Ever since I can remember I have hated water levels. The first ones I can recall are the water stages in Super Mario Bros. for the NES. At the time I had never played a water level so I started this game with no biases, but over time I grew to think "Ugh!" to myself whenever I encountered one in any game.

Things were simple enough in the beginning. Oh sure, Mario's ones slowed you down and you had to move in a different way from normal stages, but if you rapidly pressed the 'A' button you could get through those stages faster. And let's not forget the Mega Man ones, where the physics for jumping are completely changed... and when you held down the 'jump' button for too long, the deaths by spikes were numerous. Then there were the Sonic The Hedgehog water acts. There was no way you could move faster through those other than to avoid the water at every chance or to try to "run" underwater to gain momentum.

I guess my problem is I like movement in games to be fast. That's why I can recognize the quality of slow paced games even if I don't enjoy their plodding pace. But with water stages, the speed is almost always slowed down from the regular stages, and in the ones concerned with your mammalian status (Echo the Dolphin, Sonic, etc.), you are in constant danger of drowning unless you are always seeking out air. These stages have enough obstacles and dangers abounding throughout without the need for this omnipresent worry!

So which water stages do you dislike, and what's so bad about them? Do you wish games would skip them altogether? Or perhaps you like water levels and you'd like to defend some good examples. Let us know!

[jperryss]

I hate water levels in:
SMB (pretty much all of them)
The Labyrinth Zones in the first Sonic game. God I hated them.

I think the ones in the Mega Man series are fun.

[Rickstilwell1]

I like water levels in the Sonic games for Genesis, but really dislike the Game Gear and Master System water levels. There is just way too much slowdown compared to their Genesis counterparts. The difference in physics is already hard enough to get used to after playing the Genesis ones first without the water to make it any worse. I think it would have been better if they had skipped water levels completely on the 8-bit versions.

[heybtbm]

Jolly Roger Bay (http://youtu.be/WqT_hbowjQ0) and Dire Dire Docks (http://youtu.be/wqF6CCAiEtE) are maddening for me to this day. Great music, terrible controls.

[Drixxel]

The water levels, or segments of levels, in the Sonic games have always annoyed me more than any other game. Clunky control, the overarching pressure of drowning, weird platforming.. good lord, what a killjoy. Storm's stages in Spider-Man/X-Men: Arcade's Revenge are my least favourite in that game, but those levels are just weirdly designed in relation to the rest.

Conversely, I enjoy the added challenge of a water stage like, say, Maridia in Super Metroid. There's the added danger of your sluggishness placing you in harm's way, but there's not the same lethal tension of air supply. Getting up to the Wrecked Ship through Maridia sans gravity suit gives you quite a sense of (pointless) accomplishment. The Seabed of St. Elles is a really cool stage in Soul Blazer, it defies the typical "water level" conventions and more just offers a cool new environment to wander around in with fancy undersea enemies to slash the crap out of.

[frogofdeath]

Jolly Roger Bay (http://youtu.be/WqT_hbowjQ0) and Dire Dire Docks (http://youtu.be/wqF6CCAiEtE) are maddening for me to this day. Great music, terrible controls.
Before reading your post, I was going to say those are some of my favorite water levels, especially Dire Dire Docks. I may also be in the minority, but I enjoyed the Water Temple in Ocarina of Time.

[Rickstilwell1]

Before reading your post, I was going to say those are some of my favorite water levels, especially Dire Dire Docks. I may also be in the minority, but I enjoyed the Water Temple in Ocarina of Time.

Yeah I think the Shadow Temple is more annoying than the Water Temple

[Leo_A]

Jolly Roger Bay (http://youtu.be/WqT_hbowjQ0) and Dire Dire Docks (http://youtu.be/wqF6CCAiEtE) are maddening for me to this day. Great music, terrible controls.

I enjoyed the water levels in Super Mario 64.

[Aussie2B]

I find that I'm generally okay with water levels in 2D games, but I often dislike them in 3D games. Like how I dig the water levels in the Donkey Kong Country games, but in Banjo-Kazooie and Donkey Kong 64? Ugh. Part of it is because rudimentary 3D graphics portraying deep sea environments freak me the hell out, but they're just plain frustrating with irritating controls and bad camera angles a lot of the time too.

I dislike some 2D water stages too, though. You can count me as another person that hated the Labyrinth zone in the first Sonic. That's where the speed difference really is bothersome. In a game that uses its speed as a selling point, you don't slow it down THAT much (granted, that game had many parts that slowed the action down, so it didn't live up to its claim that well anyway).

[Lanzo]

Yeah, I hate any water level were u are under pressure of drowning. In Sonic it was a pain when the timer came on with the unforgettable tune and then your hearts just starts pounding.....lol. And Banjo Kazooie with the shark in treasure trove cove. Donkey Kong country had relaxing water levels for the most part. And I know it's not a classic game or really even a level, but in Ninja Gaiden 2 that one dinosaur boss thing that you had to fight while sprinting on top the water the whole time, was a nightmare.

[The 1 2 P]

If you hate water levels then theres no way you could possible like the dam level in TMNT for the Nes. I actually love that game and have beat it a couple times but racing against the clock underwater against a bunch of timed bombs was more than maddening for a preteen child back then.

[Gameguy]

I didn't like those levels in Donkey Kong Land for Gameboy because there's spots where you're chased by giant squids. I once got past those levels but my saves got deleted for some reason, I got up to the water levels again and gave up because I didn't want to play through them again.

[Baloo]

I don't care for the water levels in the Sonic series, but the worst definitely has to be Banjo-Kazooie. Sluggish controls AND bad camera angles make those parts of the game a real chore.

[XYXZYZ]

I usually don't like water levels either. But I love the one in Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (NES) where you have to defuse the bombs. The water levels in the Megaman games are good too, you walk a little slower but jump really high.

[Boltorano]

I'm the same way, except for conveyor belt puzzles.

That said, I absolutely loathe the Water Temple too.

[kupomogli]

To me, it really depends on the game. Though I agree, most water stages are the least enjoyable. There really isn't any Mario games that I've disliked water levels, although on Mario and Mario 3 they're my least favorite stages in comparison to the others.

Same with Super Metroid which someone else mentioned, as well as Metroid Fusion. The water stages aren't bad at all and add different environments that are nice to play through.

Mobile Suit Gundam Federation vs Zeon or Gundam vs Gundam. In Belfast Base and the Atlantic Ocean while the gameplay is the same, it's just you move slightly slower under water(unless using Zeon mobile suits such as Z'Gok, Acguy, etc.) Same with the Gundam Battle games. Not as enjoyable as fighting on land unless you're in a suit that's good under water.

However, the water stages on Mobile Suit Gundam Senki 0081 are what pushed me to sell the game. It was never a great game to begin with, and then when you go through the water stages, your characters move about 50 times slower and using thrusters under water depletes it twice as fast.

There are a lot of games that you have to move from one place to another underwater that aren't stage based. Soul Reaver, Defiance, etc. The under water portions wouldn't be so bad if you could actually see something, but you can hardly see where you're going and you lose direction so easily.

Devil May Cry and 2 both have some underwater stages. Ummm. Yeah.

[Haoie]

I'm playing Spyro right now, and it has some functional water levels.

And no air meter, thank god!

[Emperor Megas]

I usually love water stages. I love practically anything to do with water in video games though. I'm one of maybe 3 people who really liked the Labyrinth Zone, and really loved the water stages in Donkey Kong Country. I especially like water stages in shooters. Games like Gaiares, Dragon Spirit, Thunderforce III, Super R-Type, etc..

[Steve W]

Some I like, some I don't. For example, Sonic's stages were annoying, being in the water in Pitfall II slows the game down, not to mention avoiding the eels. Jungle Hunt's water stage is my least favorite part of the game.

I always loved water levels in Battlemorph on the Jaguar. The pace of the game slowed down, but you ended up getting attacked more by subs and things so you didn't notice that much. It was sort of soothing to me, especially the music change when you'd dive.

[Rickstilwell1]

Oh I just remembered another annoying one. In the Nintendo 64 version of 007: The World Is Not Enough the last level is underwater in a submarine and you can drown or the place will blow up if you don't move quickly enough. Underwater FPS is a disaster.

[Cass]

Yeah I think the Shadow Temple is more annoying than the Water Temple

Have to disagree. The Shadow Temple is confusing and ridiculously linear, but it's more challenging, while the Water Temple is just ... well, it's the Water Temple. Even more ridiculously linear, to the point where it's just annoying.

I've noticed this myself, btw, and I've always always despised water levels. Whether it be Mario, Sonic, Zelda, Kirby, whatever! Heck, even newer modern games with water levels (like the newer Zelda games) make me sigh in agitation at the sight of submergence. I think it's just that hardly any game has ever really gotten underwater controls right. Never impossible, just always annoying. Usually you have to do take current into account, etc... but they always just seem harder.

Oh yeah... forgot Starfox 64. I avoid Aquas at all costs.

[tom]

The Jungle Hunt water level is great, so is the H.E.R.O., ok in H.E.R.O. you fly over it, but it's still great.

How about water games like Seaquest, excellent choice of game....

[Swamperon]

I hated Labyrinth zone in Sonic when I was little. Still do. Oddly I quite enjoy the water level in Sonic CD.

I also usually hate them in 3D platformers, Banjo Kazooie and SM64 especially. BK had Rusty Bucket Bay which was a POISONOUS water level. It drained your air/health even whilst you were on the surface. Naturally it has what is considered the hardest jiggy in the game to obtain within its watery depths, which additionally involves precision swimming and racing against the clock. Ugh.

And the infamous Water Temple in OoT. Eventually I managed to memorize it so it wasn't too much of a bother but now I've likely forgotten that.

[frogofdeath]

This thread has helped me remember all these "great" water levels from the N64 games. I love Aquas in Star Fox 64 and really wish they had incorporated at least one more water level into that game (and maybe one or two more tank levels...). BK's Rusty Bucket Bay is another classic that I had forgotten, even with the fact that it killed you just being in the majority of the level. Now I may need to go back and replay both of these games.

[k8track]

being in the water in Pitfall II slows the game down, not to mention avoiding the eels.
Actually, avoiding the eels is extremely easy. Just float on the surface above them and you'll never hit them; they don't really go up and down. Now, avoiding the piranhas in the second quest (Atari 5200/8-bit only), that's difficult. All the other creatures have a pattern (even the crazy bats, which you should jump over), but those piranhas are unpredictable, and you can get hit no matter how skilled you are, the one random thing you can't predict or control (your slow speed in the water really hampers things with those guys).

[Cass]

I also usually hate them in 3D platformers, Banjo Kazooie and SM64 especially. BK had Rusty Bucket Bay which was a POISONOUS water level. It drained your air/health even whilst you were on the surface. Naturally it has what is considered the hardest jiggy in the game to obtain within its watery depths, which additionally involves precision swimming and racing against the clock. Ugh.

Oh god, I forgot about this sodder. Ironically, this isn't my least favorite stage in BK, but it ranks. I guess I could just never get used to the swimming mechanics of nearly any platformer, and worse yet, having to do it against the clock, which happens in nearly ever 3-D platformer with a water level I can think of.

[Zing]

I dig the water levels in the Donkey Kong Country games

Everyone prefers the water levels in DKC. They actually had some gameplay other than "run as fast as you can to the end", and the music within was the best of the game.

When I was young, I loved the water levels of SMB. Now, when I play through them, I find them boring. You can just swim along the top the entire way safely. I usually try to get all of the coins just for the challenge.

The water levels in SMB3 are great fun if you have the frog suit.

Super Mario 64 water levels were great. I had no problem with the camera angles or controls.

Water in Ape Escape is a nightmare, whether under the water or on a raft on top of the water.

[tom]

Uh how could I forget Pitfall 2.

[Aussie2B]

I think turning the key to free Clanker in Clanker's Cavern in Banjo-Kazooie is worse than anything in Rusty Bucket Bay (although I probably dislike like the stage as a whole more than Clanker's Cavern, especially with Rusty Bucket Bay's music, which makes me want to take an ice pick to my ears). Other than the one submerged jiggy, you can avoid spending that much time in Rusty Bucket Bay's water, but Clanker's Cavern... ugh. You're stuck in the water most of the time, and messing with that key without drowning... ridiculous. You have to exercise such precision with those crappy swimming controls to catch the bubbles of air from the fish. I just beat this game for the first time very recently, so it's fresh in my mind.

Really, most of the stages in Banjo-Kazooie either had water as a major element (Treasure Cove Trove, Clanker's Cavern, Rusty Bucket Bay) or as a minor element but very dangerous when you had to deal with it (Bubble Gloop Swamp, Freezeezy's Peak, Mad Monster Mansion, Click Clock Wood, Gobi's Valley). Pretty annoying. Only the very first stage of the game was free of it (well, it does have a little bit of water, but it's not a concern).

[Cozumel]

When I was a child, water level in first Sonic game for Master System get me sick.

[buzz_n64]

Any level that has an oxygen level bar is dreadful.Without it, it's tolerable in some games, Crash, SMB3, SMW... As mentioned before, Donkey Kong Country seems to be the only game where it is enjoyable.

[Cozumel]

Any level that has an oxygen level bar is dreadful.Without it, it's tolerable in some games, Crash, SMB3, SMW... As mentioned before, Donkey Kong Country seems to be the only game where it is enjoyable.

Alex Kidd in Miracle World is another game with funny water levels, specially with the octopus cheat.

[Tron 2.0]

Hmm this thread shows up about the worst water levels,in video games and sa has a top ten on it coincidence i think not ;)
http://www.gametrailers.com/video/top-10-screwattack/717175

[Swamperon]

I think turning the key to free Clanker in Clanker's Cavern in Banjo-Kazooie is worse than anything in Rusty Bucket Bay

Argh I hate turning that key! I usually do three quick(ish) dives to turn it instead of trying to catch the air bubbles. At least the jiggy in RBB can be skipped but raising Clanker is needed for most of that level's jiggies. :(

There's also the jiggy at the end of a very long deadend pipe. I find getting back in time near impossible (Banjo is a pain to turn around in small places) so I just save & quit once I get it. A bit cheaty but much less of a pain.

I loved how in SMG you can grab hold of a shell and use it to propel you through the water. Made the water levels almost fun!

EDIT: In fact I think the only level in BK that doesn't have any form of water shennanigans is Mad Monster Mansion? (Though you do climb down a toilet)

[Balloon Fight]

I've always hated and complained about water levels. Each water level makes the game less fun imo.

[Aussie2B]

EDIT: In fact I think the only level in BK that doesn't have any form of water shennanigans is Mad Monster Mansion? (Though you do climb down a toilet)

There's the well in Mad Monster Mansion. I believe you can get everything in there as a pumpkin, in which case you don't have to worry about air, but if you don't notice the hole at first like me and try to get the jigsaw piece and notes with normal Banjo, it's pretty terrible.

[Nz17]

Hmm this thread shows up about the worst water levels,in video games and sa has a top ten on it coincidence i think not ;)
http://www.gametrailers.com/video/top-10-screwattack/717175

Laugh @Tron 2.0: You have a good point - the same exact topic on the same exact day? What a "coincidence." LOL

[j_factor]

I find that I dislike "Mario-style" water levels, mainly Mario and DKC. I've always found it difficult to maneuver those levels. I also don't care for the water level in Battletoads, which is a pain in the ass. But otherwise, I usually like water levels. I like the water levels in the Sonic games, except Labyrinth Zone which I'm so-so on. I like the water levels in the Kirby series, Turrican, World of Illusion, and so on.

That video sucks, by the way. Ecco is a great game, Hydrocity is a great level (much more fast-paced than Labyrinth Zone anyway), Mt. Kazai is not that bad, and as much as I don't like Wind Waker, sailing is not in the same category at all.