Opinions on Sports Games [Archive] - Retrogaming Roundtable

Glitch695

07-30-2011, 11:54 AM

I'll tell you what always gets me to feel bad for someone. Whenever I go to a rummage sale, and see someone selling a bunch of PS2 or whatever games and it's like 5 straight years of Madden, NCAA, and Baseball games. And they might have the odd crappy licensed title in there too. The one I was at yesterday had a total of 30 Xbox and PS2 sports games and Kung Fu Panda. Wow.
I'm not saying everyone should grow up playing RPGs on the SNES (although they actually should), I played NBA Jam like a fiend growing up. But do you really have no other interest than Roster Update 20xx every year? Or is it their parents forcing them on them?
Does anyone else see this as being rather empty or am I just a rotten elitist?

Mr Mort

07-30-2011, 01:12 PM

I don't think you're a rotten elitist, you just have good taste, like me ;)

I couldn't agree with you more, I can't stand sports games, unless they're the extreme variety, like the Midway sports games, the SSX games, the old Tony Hawk games, etc.
I find it insane that people buy what's essentially the same game year after year for nothing more than minor gameplay improvements and roster updates.

Besides, I don't like the sim-like aspect of most sports games, I find it to be very boring.

Sirjess

07-30-2011, 01:36 PM

I dont collect any sports games, even my large NES collection is mostly sports free.

Boltorano

07-30-2011, 02:04 PM

For completeness sake I've considered raiding the entire display case full of $0.99 SNES sports games at the local game store and just getting one of each, but other than that I have no interest.

BetaWolf47

07-30-2011, 02:25 PM

I hate generic sports games and like wacky sports games. Arcady games with overexaggerated violence and force, as well as colorful graphics and "special moves", are fun. Take Mario Tennis, Base Wars, NBA Jam, or NFL Blitz for example. Those are great sports games, since it's not just realistic boringness.

Madden NFL 93 and Sega Sports Hockey on the other hand...

Ro-J

07-30-2011, 02:27 PM

I bought NHL '9X every year back when they were new on the Genesis and had a blast with them. Team and player updates to reflect the latest season made the games more compelling to play, plus they were awesome party games -- 4-player NHL '94 was my second favorite party game back then (next to SNES Bomberman).

I no longer buy the same sports game year after year, but I imagine those that do do so because they are a lot of fun.

skaar

07-30-2011, 02:46 PM

There's a reason used book stores seldom take in Harlequin Romances.

The 1 2 P

07-30-2011, 03:07 PM

I haven't regularly played sports games since the Nes days and during the Genesis days NBA Jam was pretty much the only sports title I played. After that I moved on to more important games, ones where you get to line up head shots and teabag fallen bodies.

portnoyd

07-30-2011, 03:42 PM

There's a reason used book stores seldom take in Harlequin Romances.

They smell like tuna?

Rickstilwell1

07-30-2011, 04:03 PM

My opinion is that sports games can be good, but the good ones are few and far between. The ones I would think usually like to buy the updated games year after year are the big sports fans. People who generally watch sports on TV all the time. My uncle likes sports games, but when the new version comes out he always sells the old version rather than keeping them all.

bigred5687

07-30-2011, 05:41 PM

when the new version comes out he always sells the old version rather than keeping them all.

This is what I do. I love sports, and I love video games. I might be one of the few on this site that gets madden every year. To each there own.

Icarus Moonsight

07-30-2011, 08:10 PM

There's a reason used book stores seldom take in Harlequin Romances.

They smell like tuna?

I heard EA asked Fabio to be the cover model for Madden for life. He balked because of the career curse.

kainemaxwell

07-30-2011, 08:36 PM

Only football game I still play is tecmo super bowl for the nes. never played the snes edition.

Steven

07-30-2011, 09:02 PM

I generally like 16-bit sport titles. From the wacky (Looney Tunes B-Ball) to the serious (NBA Live '96). Then again I'm also a fan of sports in general in real life.

In fact, my favorite game ever is probably the original Ken Griffey Jr. on SNES. Awesome game.

Atarileaf

07-31-2011, 11:11 AM

I find it insane that people buy what's essentially the same game year after year for nothing more than minor gameplay improvements

You could also be describing just about any FPS out there too.

Lanzo

07-31-2011, 11:28 AM

In fact, my favorite game ever is probably the original Ken Griffey Jr. on SNES. Awesome game.

Right here. Buying the sports games every year is a waste. But Ken Griffey Jr. and Extra Innings IMO our the best and only baseball games you will ever need for SNES. I will admit though I am buying my first Madden ever this year simply because I'm a Cleveland fan and Peyton Hillis is on the cover.

Steven

07-31-2011, 05:38 PM

Right here. Buying the sports games every year is a waste. But Ken Griffey Jr. and Extra Innings IMO our the best and only baseball games you will ever need for SNES.

What did you think of Griffey Winning Run? I was never able to get into it myself, but still trying to keep an open mind about it. Also I have to remind myself not to compare it TOO MUCH to the original, because they are two entirely different games.

Apparently, there are many GWR fans, and even some who like it more the original. One day I hope to "get" GWR like the fans do. Until then, the original is king in my book.

ugly_monster

07-31-2011, 08:59 PM

I don't mind sports games. Kinda like first person shooters on the newer systems. They make those for people who don't play much and don't need to accomplish anything when they DO play.

BetaWolf47

07-31-2011, 11:01 PM

What was that SNES baseball game that showed the players getting pissed when they struck out? I remember the batters breaking bats in half and yelling at the umpire. Priceless in 16-bit :D

Steven

08-01-2011, 12:46 AM

What was that SNES baseball game that showed the players getting pissed when they struck out? I remember the batters breaking bats in half and yelling at the umpire. Priceless in 16-bit :D

ironically, the game discussed earlier in this very topic, heh. KEN GRIFFEY JR PRESENTS MAJOR LEAGUE BASEBALL.

http://www.rvgfanatic.com/media/DIR_1117515/KGJ-SOA.JPG http://www.rvgfanatic.com/media/DIR_1117515/KGJ-SOA2.JPG http://www.rvgfanatic.com/media/DIR_1117515/KGJ-SOA3.JPG http://www.rvgfanatic.com/media/DIR_1117515/KGJ-SOA4.JPG

genesisguy

08-01-2011, 11:02 AM

I had a Genesis in the 16-bit days so there was no way of escaping the sports games and all those EA NHL games played so much better on the Genesis. If you grew up with a SNES I can see why you wouldn't like a chunk of the popular EA games of the 16-bit era.

It comes down to individual tastes. I have no interest in playing RPGs. I never liked them as a kid and now as a retro gamer I read about them all the time online and everytime I start to think I should get into them I look at one on youtube and the slow moving game play and constant scrolling text is like pulling teeth. On the other hand I still play NHL '94, Bill Walsh College Football, Ice Hockey, and Tecmo Bowl to this day.

I'm lost at modern sports games. I tried a few on PS2 and mastering the controls and plays are so intense you might as well just go out and play the real sport.

Casati

08-01-2011, 04:02 PM

A few of my favorite vintage sports games are Tecmo Super Bowl, Madden '96, NHL '94, RBI baseball 1/2/3/4/'93/'94, Sports Talk Baseball, Dusty Diamond's All-Star, Baseball Simulator 1.000, and most Jaleco sports titles. I don't buy for updated rosters although I'll buy a copy for the year that my favorite team peaked.

I like RPGs, and strategy, but play only one RPG until finished, then start another, but most of my gaming time is spent on arcade, puzzle, shooters, racing and sports.

I don't like vintage basketball video games because it's too easy to steal and difficult to block shots or dribble to the basket without being called for an offensive foul. I don't like Konami Track & Field/II because I'm very bad at it so my athlete usually gets disqualified or places last.

I typically play versus the computer and am annoyed with unrealistic stats such as excessive shots on goal or excessive shooting percentage, so my preference is simulation rather than arcade play.

TonyTheTiger

08-01-2011, 04:05 PM

But do you really have no other interest than Roster Update 20xx every year?

This is the problem right here. This blatant begging the question is so prevalent that it's just outright taken at face value when it's blatantly not true.

Mr.Platypus

08-01-2011, 05:09 PM

This has been puzzling me too. Why do sports games depreciate so badly? The stock response seems to be that they keep getting replaced by a newer version with only slight differences. But I think this is an inadequate response. I think Atarileaf brought up a good point: Aren't all FPS games just as similar to each other? Or consider the Megaman series. What is the difference between Megaman 1 and Megaman 2 besides some different characters? I have to admit that there are different environments, but something remains completely the same between them. I feel like the difference between Megaman 1 and Megaman 2 is LESS than the difference between Double Dribble and Arch Rivals. Yet no one would think Megaman 2, or 3 or any of those are less valuable because they are so similar.

I use Megaman because it had so many sequels. But you see I could have picked on Gradius/Lifeforce/Gunnac/Zanac/Xevious... you get the point. Are horizontal or vertical shooters really all that different from each other?

Another problem with the "redundant versions" response: It's not the case that someone that owns a newer version of Madden isn't interested in an older version. It seems to me the problem is much worse. Even people that do not own any version of madden don't want Madden 99' or whatever. So the problem seems to be with the sports Genera itself. It can't be that there's no interest in the sports genera, EA is making a ton of money off them. It's just that there's no interest in old sports games.

I have my own theory, but it's offensive and I think I would like to hear if anyone else is thinking what I'm thinking.

Glitch695

08-01-2011, 05:13 PM

This is the problem right here. This blatant begging the question is so prevalent that it's just outright taken at face value when it's blatantly not true.

Then what exactly is the point of buying that same game every year? The argument will of course be made by some for most RPGs having similar derivative stories or platformers being interchangeable, which on the platformers I can agree on a lot of them.
But I see it as a problem that when the new game comes out, it renders the old one useless. Why play Madden 2009 when 2011 has better graphics, more up to date teams, possibly more complex yet in depth control, etc? The only thing I can think of is price - a new game is $60 while that old one is $2. But hey, if I just wait a year I can get the currently $60 game for that $2 price tag, but by then, of course, a new game is out already that has better aspects anyways. It is blatantly true that hundreds of old sports games clutter game stores/ thrift shops/ etc and practically can't be given away at .99 cent prices.
People go back and play the 16 bit stuff to this day, I said I do too: NBA Jam, Mutant League Football, etc. And even with the 16 bit comparisons, most people still do not plunk in Madden 94- they play Tecmo Super Bowl or MLF, or NBA Jam. But most people just don't play NCAA 2002 because once the new sheen is off of it, it's a relic with little replayability.
Furthermore, I think the people on this board who do buy those games every year obviously have interest in other games as well, and appreciate the classic gaming and collecting aspect of the hobby. My lack of understanding is with those who buy just sports games every year, and that's it.

Atarileaf

08-01-2011, 05:21 PM

Being a retro gamer, graphics aren't that important to me if the game is fun but part of it might be that sports fans want up to date rosters. Sure if I could easily replace the rosters in NHL 95 with 2011 real life rosters I'd love to do that but you really can't. It would be fun playing an old Genesis game and seeing 2011 players on it BUT I still love playing with Dougie Gilmour and Dave Andreychuk though :D

tom

08-01-2011, 05:26 PM

I like some sports games
Tennis on VCS is great,
so is Enduro.
are racing games sports games? Is F1 a sports game and Gran Turismo is not? Who knows....

of course, the Epyx game series were always great too

skaar

08-01-2011, 05:32 PM

People either play the game to play the sport for the fun of the sport or play it to play their team that they follow IRL.

That sentence didn't make much sense. Oh well, continuing on:

If they're following a team and roster, then they don't want to be reminded of older players that have been traded away/retired/got arrested for beating up hookers. They want to follow their current team through the current year. That and the "improvements" game makers supposedly offer.

Myself, I stopped playing NHL games around 2004, because the controls just got silly. Now if I want to play a hockey game, I fire up an older title. Assuming EA hasn't broken it by now by downing their servers.

courtesi1

08-01-2011, 05:58 PM

There are only 2 sports games that I can tolerate:

1. Color Baseball on the TRS80 CoCo.
2. ISS 98 on the N64

Atarileaf

08-01-2011, 09:48 PM

1. Color Baseball on the TRS80 CoCo.

Yes, I'm a HUGE Coco nerd and I love this game. The hand written "Home Run" is a thing of beauty. Its easy against the computer but great fun with a second human player.

Haoie

08-02-2011, 02:31 AM

Never ever had a sports game in my collections, not about to start.

Rickstilwell1

08-02-2011, 06:37 AM

Never ever had a sports game in my collections, not about to start.

Not even one of the Mario ones to try and get a Mario fullset?

calthaer

08-02-2011, 10:25 AM

What was that SNES baseball game that showed the players getting pissed when they struck out? I remember the batters breaking bats in half and yelling at the umpire. Priceless in 16-bit :D

This is pretty much how I feel about sports games. I don't care about or watch sports in real life, and have no interest in memorizing the stats, relative skill, or value of hundreds or thousands of players in order to gain the enjoyment a lot of people seem to get out of the game. The last time I played a sports game with some friends - and it's been a good five-plus years - it was a hockey game, and we had some big bobbleheads feature turned on, and I made it my goal to check as many people as possible during the match. That was kind of fun.

Something like NES Ice Hockey, where the depicted size of the player gives a visual indicator of how fast or strong the player is, is way more my speed. Otherwise, I feel like I'm just look at a big "chess" board and see a bunch of pawns, and wonder why in the world people are content to differentiate them only with numbers, and not even numbers that are in sequential order based on how good the player is. It makes no sense to me.

jonebone

08-02-2011, 11:34 AM

I'm the guy who buys Madden every year at release, sometimes at midnight. Sucks paying $60 for a game that you know is going to fall to $1, but the enjoyment I get out of playing it right at the beginning of the season is priceless. Just something about it that puts me back in full swing football mode.

skaar

08-02-2011, 01:28 PM

I still play the hell out of Ice Hockey for NES every few months.

The last baseball game I gave a lot of attention to was the one that came out with the Sega Saturn... I'd have to look up the name. But at the time, it was perfect.

Before that World Series Baseball (the talking one) for the Genesis and before that Hardball! for the Genesis.

Now it's all showboating and player animations and too many buttons - you stop playing the game and focus on all the fluff. I don't want to manage my team and injuries and rosters and other bullshit - I want to play through a season and have fun.

Griking

08-02-2011, 04:09 PM

I have similar thoughts when I go to a goodwill. Many times I see stuff there and it blows me away that there's a person out these that bought some of that stuff new.

98redM6

08-02-2011, 04:54 PM

I don't see the problem with buying sports games of the same franchise every year. If you follow sports, then you want the latest roster updates and of course you want to be able to play it with the latest features. My brothers play Madden and NBA Live almost all year long, so they get their money's worth. That being said, my only gripe is that these games are $60. They should be more in the range of $40 tops. With competition between Amazon, Wal-Mart, New Egg, Buy.com, and other online retailers, these games can be had for about $40 after some included credit and bonuses (i.e. Madden '12 on Amazon for $60 with $20 credit). The key is also to trade these games in at the right time.

Sports games have a lot of replay value, if you play online and if you have friends that are willing to play. I'd also rather play a quick game of Madden than play an RPG and get so immersed in it that I spend days upon days playing. I guess I'm somewhat biased since I hate games like Final Fantasy and WoW.

substantial_snake

08-02-2011, 05:58 PM

I view yearly updates to sports games largely the same way I view the constant updates to Street Fighter..Alpha 2 Turbo Super Max Ultra Denki 2028 Edition(s). I'm not a fan of the games themselves and they largely see the same to me every year. That doesn't mean that their aren't significant changes/updates for the fans of the series, just that it doesn't appeal to my personal gaming tastes. There is no real reason to look down on someone's gaming preference just because they don't align with your own and that does make you rather elitist.

Ze_ro

08-02-2011, 06:44 PM

Atarileaf

08-02-2011, 06:56 PM

Meh. Sports games are just another part of the scene, like first person shooters or role playing games. I can't really see much difference between Modern Warfare and MW2... or between Romance of the Three Kingdoms 1 and 2.

Maybe that Madden fan feels that you were silly for buying Fallout 3 when Fallout New Vegas was around the corner?

--Zero

Love the avatar by the way. Glad to have the Jets back. :)

I stopped playing sports games after the ps1 and n64 era. They were getting overly complicated for me back then. I still see a lot of replay value in the older sports titles and some of the Genesis NHL games are still my favorite video games of all times. In fact I originally bought my Genesis just to play sports games.

Crap like Sonic and Mario never appealed to me. Still don't.

OldSkoolBrian

08-03-2011, 01:02 PM

What sucks is when you fo to a Yard Sale and someone wants 5-6.00 for these games. I don't even buy sports games anymore.. It's worst then buy a car.. As soon as you pull out of Gamestop the value just dropped 80%

bangtango

08-03-2011, 03:08 PM

As preposterous as it might sound to FPS or RPG fans, people actually buy the new sports games each year when they come out.

2K and EA aren't releasing "NBA 2K12" and "Madden 12" for the PS2 later this year for the fun of it. They've determined they are going to cost xxxx much to make and will ultimately sell xxxx copies and turn a tidy profit.

The real question is why is it ok for Nintendo to sell the same Mario or Zelda games to the consumer 7-8 times over for a price equivalent to what EA sells a "roster update" for? Why is it ok for Sega to do the same thing with the Sonic games? Nobody calls those consumers stupid or shortsighted for buying the same thing over and over again. That's the nonsense that gets said about the guy who buys a lot of EA Sports games, though.

Heaven forbid someone works for a living and spends $60 of their hard-earned money to be able to use their team's new free agents or draft picks without having to spend hours on internet forums getting instructions on how to successfully "create" the newest rookies or spin off 10-15 tedious trades with half the NFL to get your favorite team's 2011's free agent pick-ups on your roster in an older game.

That someone isn't me, though, since I generally wait until the inevitable price drop to $1-2 :roll:

Gameguy

08-03-2011, 03:34 PM

In fact I originally bought my Genesis just to play sports games.
It was actually a big selling point for the Genesis, it had lots of sports games and they played faster on the Genesis compared to the SNES because of the faster processor. The Genesis was marketed using sports games so it wasn't just a coincidence, Sega knew people were into those games.

I get that there's a lot of people who are into sports games, I just never saw the appeal to buy the latest update every year as I'm not into sports that much.

BenG76

08-03-2011, 04:04 PM

I only play the older sports games such as Ice Hockey or Basball Stars on the NES. The newer sports games are too complicated for me.

MarioMania

08-03-2011, 04:15 PM

The only football game I play is Tecmo Super Bowl

Why don't EA just release Madden one time..and put the update though DLC for like $10

calthaer

08-03-2011, 04:51 PM

Why don't EA just release Madden one time..and put the update though DLC for like $10

This is totally a rhetorical question...EA is probably phrasing it like this:

"Why would we release the game updates via DLC for $20 when there are loads of people willing to pay $50-60 for it? We'd have to sell 5-6 times as many to make up for the lost revenue."

BetaWolf47

08-03-2011, 05:29 PM

The real question is why is it ok for Nintendo to sell the same Mario or Zelda games to the consumer 7-8 times over for a price equivalent to what EA sells a "roster update" for? Why is it ok for Sega to do the same thing with the Sonic games?
This is a mute point. That's because Nintendo has never charged $50 or $60 for a rerelease. Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time was given away for free on Gamecube. Twice. Many NES games were included as unlockables with Animal Crossing. Then they were released digitally on Wii for $5-10. Then it was released on 3DS remade for half of what it originally cost.
Same with Sega. The Sonic games got released in compilations and digitally for a fraction of what they cost originally.

Nobody calls those consumers stupid or shortsighted for buying the same thing over and over again. That's the nonsense that gets said about the guy who buys a lot of EA Sports games, though.
Because it's not the same thing. Buying a $60 game, and possibly paying for DLC, year after year, is not the same thing as buying a remake for $30 or an emulation for $10.

If EA were releasing compilations of classic sports games with modified rosters, it'd be a different story. But it's not. It's them releasing another roster update with some fine-tuning to the core of the game and a few extra features for $60 a year.

GameNinja

08-03-2011, 06:23 PM

Eh, they can be a bit fun but they can also be a bit too complicated to learn for somebody who isn't into the game's sport.

If people want to spend their money on it year after year that is fine by me!

Are they seriously releasing Madden for Ps2 this year?!?!

garagesaleking!!

08-03-2011, 07:05 PM

I cant resist buying madden every year. It just gets me excited about football and lets me live as my fantasy players. Its the whole experience.

Ze_ro

08-03-2011, 07:53 PM

"Why would we release the game updates via DLC for $20 when there are loads of people willing to pay $50-60 for it? We'd have to sell 5-6 times as many to make up for the lost revenue."
The other side of that argument is that production costs for DLC are significantly lower. No need for boxes and discs. You never have to ask yourself how many copies to make, or any of the crap that comes with the retail business. Depending on the pricing, a DLC scheme could be a lot more profitable in the long run.

Of course, dealing with rule changes and physics tweaking and graphic upgrades and stuff doesn't quite work the same way as roster updates.

That's because Nintendo has never charged $50 or $60 for a rerelease of Legend of Zelda
No, but how different are the Legend of Zelda games these days? Of course, we all know there's a different story, and new items, and new dungeons and whatnot... but how much do you want to bet that Skyward Sword is going to have bombs, boomerangs and a hookshot among weapons? And friendly Gorons and Zoras and a horse named Epona that you can ride? And Stalfos and Skulltulas? And Fire, Ice, Water and Air/Wind themed dungeons? And some part where you have to shoot an eye with your bow and arrow to activate something? And cracks in the walls to show you where you have to lay a bomb to open a secret passage? And enemies that will steal or burn your shield? And chances are good there are going to be two different "worlds" that you can travel between which will affect one another.

The Zelda games may all look different to us, but to Madden fans, they might as well just be a yearly update too.

--Zero