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stonic
08-17-2011, 05:52 PM
From CNN:
http://www.cnn.com/2011/TECH/gaming.gadgets/08/17/finishing.videogames.snow/index.html

By Blake Snow, Special to CNN
August 17, 2011 8:00 a.m. EDT | Filed under: Gaming & Gadgets


Editor's note: Blake Snow is a freelance journalist who has written about technology for Salon, Wired and many other news sites. He lives alongside the Wasatch Mountains in Utah with his family. His full bio and contact information is at blakesnow.com.
(CNN) -- Once considered a cult pastime, video games have grown immensely in the last 30 years to become a mainstream fixture alongside movies and music.
But you wouldn't know it by how often players finish their games.
In fact, the attrition (or bounce rate) of video games is pretty pathetic. "What I've been told as a blanket expectation is that 90% of players who start your game will never see the end of it unless they watch a clip on YouTube," says Keith Fuller, a longtime production contractor for Activision.
That's a lot of unfinished games.
And it doesn't get much better when isolated to just avid gamers.
"Just 10 years ago, I recall some standard that only 20% of gamers ever finish a game," says John Lee, VP of marketing at Raptr and former executive at Capcom, THQ and Sega.
And it's not just dull games that go unfinished. Critically acclaimed ones do, too. Take last year's "Red Dead Redemption." You might think Rockstar's gritty Western would be played more than others, given the praise it enjoyed, but you'd be wrong.
Only 10% of avid gamers completed the final mission, according to Raptr, which tracks more than 23 million gaming sessions.
Let that sink in for a minute: Of every 10 people who started playing the consensus "Game of the Year," only one of them finished it.
How is that? Shouldn't such a high-rated game keep people engaged? Or have player attention spans reached a breaking point?
Who's to blame: The developer or the player? Or maybe it's our culture?
The correct answer is, in fact, all of the above.
The aging gamer
At the beginning of the 21st century, the average gamer was pushing 30 -- mid-to-late 20s, to be exact. They weren't playing as often as they did in their adolescence, but in between entry-level jobs, earnest slacking and higher education, there was still ample time to game.
Fast forward to today, and the average gamer is 37, according to the Entertainment Software Association. The average age of the most frequent game buyer is 41 -- nearing Just for Men-type levels. They're raising kids. In the middle of a career. Worried about retirement.
Not only that, but time is precious for gamers of all ages.
"People have short attention spans and limited time now," says Jeremy Airey, head of U.S. production at Konami.
"The amount of digital distractions now is far greater than it's ever been before," he says. "People need time to check their Facebook, send a Twitter (tweet), be witty on their blog, play with their phone -- oh, and that game you made. If they feel as though the end is far away, they'll simply say, 'I don't have time for that' and stop playing."
In other words, the longer the game, the higher probability a player will abandon it. "Red Dead Redemption" takes upward of 30 hours to complete, according to howlongtobeat.com, and few players are willing to commit that much time.
A glut of games
Not only that, but the accelerating rate at which new games are released cannibalizes existing games and further distracts the already inundated player.
"In the last two decades the growth of video games has produced a huge influx of games," Fuller says. "There are more players today, but there are also more games per player. Since you can't spend as much time on each game, you're less likely to finish the one in front of you."
Not only did gamers have more time in the eight- and 16-bit days, but they had fewer games to complete.
Of course, engagement levels vary by genre and difficulty. "As expected, 'Red Dead Redemption' is the lowest completed high-profile game because it's so big," Lee says.
The gaming platform has an impact on completion rates as well. Low-caloric and hyper-short web games are finished 85% of the time, according to Backloggery.com, a website that helps players finish the games they already own before buying new ones. Conversely, meatier games on PS3 are finished less often, according to Backloggery.
Either way, this shifting demand is more than enough to sway developers in a different direction. For starters, they are creating less epic games, at least in terms of duration.
"Long gone are the days of starting a game on a high-level concept," says Konami's Airey. The reason: "It's costly," he says.
Fuller says the devil is in the details.
"I worked on a project that took 50 people and 18 months to produce 20 minutes of game play," he says. "With the expectations so high for visual and audio fidelity, lifelike animations, enemy behavior and movie-quality cinemas, it can take two years for a team of 100 people to create six hours of playable story. At an average burn rate of $10,000 per man month, that's $24 million just in developer cost. You're not likely to find a publisher that will foot the bill for extending that campaign to 20 hours."
Of course, why make a 20-plus hour game when most players aren't completing them, as is the case with "Red Dead Redemption"? The answer is, most publishers don't.
Growth of online multiplayer
Which brings us to perhaps the biggest contributing factor in the decrease of lengthy campaign modes. It is this: Gamers may say they like playing epic single-player games. But when push comes to shove, what they really want is online multiplayer.
"The trend of low completion rates is equally driven by the growing importance of multiplayer," says Scott Steinberg, head of video game consulting firm TechSavvy. "Companies are more aware than ever of where and how games are being consumed, and what features players look for. As a result, they're de-emphasizing single-player, which seem to demand lower levels of player time, energy and investment."
Case in point: "Call of Duty: Black Ops." At an average of 67 hours played, it's the most-played recent game by far, according to Raptr, followed by "Halo: Reach" at 43 hours, and "Bad Company 2" at 18. (Perhaps today's gamer would finish a lot more games if he weren't so busy with multiplayer.)
But that's not entirely true. What's really happened is that with their change in lifestyle, gamer tastes have evolved. Instead of "Zelda"-like games that take longer to start and resume, they're more inclined to play stop-and-go titles in bite-size games.
Need more convincing? "These days, I know many people who buy the latest single-player/multiplayer shooter (game) and never even bother to load the single-player," Fuller says.
The future? Shorter games
So it's come to this: People have less time to play games than they did before. They have more options than ever. And they're more inclined to play quick-hit multiplayer modes, even at the expense of 100-hour epics.
Is that a problem?
Not at all, Fuller says. "They're lucky to find the time to beat a 10-hour game once or twice a month," he says of the average-age gamer. "They don't feel cheated about shorter games and will just play a longer game for as many hours as their schedule allows before moving on to another title.
Steinberg agrees: "Just because you don't slay the final boss or rescue the princess doesn't mean you can't see most of, if not all, of what a game has to offer in the hours leading up to it."
Not only that, but gamers are already warming to the idea of shorter games.
"Completion rates are actually on the rise," Lee says. "Many games now have a 40% to 50% completion rate, thanks to 10-hour campaigns instead of the 20-30 hour ones of yesteryear. Of course, that's good or bad depending on how you look at it. It's better than before. But it still means that more than half of all game content never gets appreciated."
To counter that, Airey says extended play content will increasingly come from expansion packs, a sort of best-of-both-worlds approach.
"We're at a stage now that we're trying to find ways to keep mind share (consumer awareness about a product)," he says. "When the consumer is not playing our game, their friends aren't either. So games will trend toward being shorter and then support the need for 'more' via downloadable content."
No matter, says Casey Willis, an avid gamer from Atlanta. "Make a game worth my time and money, and I'll be happy. After all, 10 hours of awesome is better than 20 hours of boring."

kupomogli
08-17-2011, 05:55 PM
Anyone who reads that want to post the short version?

TonyTheTiger
08-17-2011, 06:14 PM
"Too many games and they're all too damn long."

XYXZYZ
08-17-2011, 06:22 PM
I finished The Goonies II for my Nintendo Entertainment System earlier today.

substantial_snake
08-17-2011, 06:23 PM
Anyone who reads that want to post the short version?

The article breaks down that low completion rates for games (10-20%) are caused by changing market demographics. "Core" Gamers (young adult to adult males) are getting older therefore are less interested in playing long epic games (Red Dead Redemption cited) to completion. This coupled with a much higher completion rate of shorter games and the rise of competitive multiplayer means that long single player experiences are falling towards the wayside do to the changing market.

Shorter Shorter Version: Average Gamers are losing their attention spans for longer games, therefore longer games are not made as often.

There is truth to this article. I gave a hardcore PC gaming buddy of mine tons of shit when he revealed to me that he has never finished Half Life 1 due to the length of the campaign. He at the tail end of college and says he really just doesn't have the time to stay interested in anything he can't finish in a night, which equates to the standard 6 hour COD campaign.

Personally I somehow retained the knowledge that save functions exist for a reason and have an attention span longer then 5 minutes, and if a game is good I'll definitively want to play it through to completion. If a game is bad or I just don't like it I wont bother, but a good game drives me to see the rest of the story or have a good time with the experiences presented. [/elitestgamerasshole]

Eternal Champion
08-21-2011, 03:44 PM
There is truth to this article. I gave a hardcore PC gaming buddy of mine tons of shit when he revealed to me that he has never finished Half Life 1 due to the length of the campaign

I haven't finished Half-Life 1 or 2, either, but have played them several times, just for the experience. Half-Life 1 gets too cheap-ass platform jumping and the experience that the game offered until that point stopped, so I stop there.

Geez, if the average age of core gamers is my age, 36 or so, I am not at all surprised. Responsibilities of life and all that.

duffmanth
08-21-2011, 05:46 PM
The only time I don't finish a game is if I get to a part that I can't get past and get pissed off enough I just give up.

Lady Jaye
08-21-2011, 07:28 PM
Time is indeed a factor for many of us. Consider all the DPers who have a career and maybe kids, and you just lowered the amount of free time that the average DP member has for games.

I know that I have a lot less free time than I had 10 or 15 years ago, and I also have other interests aside from gaming that take up a lot of time. Ass to this all the games I have now, and indeed, I don't tend to complete my games in general, although I've been trying to do so. My bigger issue is that sometimes I let too much time lapse before trying to resume a game and I end up being somewhat lost. For instance, it's been a while since I've played Dragon Quest VI, DQIX, and Final Fantasy: Crystal Chronicles: Ring of Fates. I'll have to check out what to do next because it's been too long since I last played and it's keeping me from trying to finish those games.

misfits859
08-21-2011, 07:39 PM
Yep, my 10 month old has really screwed up my game playing time. I've only recently began playing again and I'm still only finding time to play a couple of hours per week. Sure as hell is gonna make finishing my Fallout 3 campaign tuff...

:help:

Rickstilwell1
08-21-2011, 09:19 PM
I'm more into long games like RPGs, but the truth is I'm still playing the old ones because those were really long. There's so many old ones I don't know if I'll ever run out of my favorite kinds of games to play. Even if they don't make as many anymore.

I even find myself replaying the ones I thought were the best.

Eternal Champion
08-21-2011, 10:26 PM
Yep, my 10 month old has really screwed up my game playing time. I've only recently began playing again and I'm still only finding time to play a couple of hours per week. Sure as hell is gonna make finishing my Fallout 3 campaign tuff...

:help:I had way more game time when my daughter was under a year than when she got to be a toddler, and especially now, in Kindergarten.
After she was born I sold Zelda II, Zelda III SNES, Phantasy Star II, Chrono Trigger, FFIII. I still regret selling Zelda II, but there is no way in hell I'll ever in my life until retirement be able to commit to games like that. I spent so many hours playing Zelda II back in 1989 it's just inconceivable.

Graham Mitchell
08-22-2011, 10:18 AM
I had way more game time when my daughter was under a year than when she got to be a toddler, and especially now, in Kindergarten.
After she was born I sold Zelda II, Zelda III SNES, Phantasy Star II, Chrono Trigger, FFIII. I still regret selling Zelda II, but there is no way in hell I'll ever in my life until retirement be able to commit to games like that. I spent so many hours playing Zelda II back in 1989 it's just inconceivable.

You guys are scaring me. I just got married...you know what's next!

That said, I'm pretty busy even without kids. 10 hours with a reason to replay would be optimal. The portal 2 single player campaign was perfect for me.

spoonman
08-22-2011, 02:36 PM
Game endings are WAY overrated anyway. Bioshock I'm looking at you!

When you game on every platform it's hard to play everything to the end, but I still try.
I just know to stay away from 80+ hour RPGS though.

calthaer
08-22-2011, 04:13 PM
I'm personally a big fan of making a game last 5 or 6 hours - ten tops - and then adding in re-play value for people who really love the game. Re-play, IMO, would be things like:

-Additional characters who might change up the story slightly upon a second play-through
-Collectible items
-Beating a bunch of hard scenarios to get 100%
-100% map exploration

or something like that. The newer Castlevania games for DS are, according to this set of criteria, pretty good. You can finish it in about 10 hours, maybe 15, but then there are all sorts of souls / cards / items / enemies to collect, or other characters to play through the game as, or that arena area in the castle where you have to beat 30 rooms and get to the end, if you're really feeling like you want more.

A lot of (J)RPGs have all sorts of meaningless, trivial, vapid, time-filler side-quests that are merely so much trite bloviation foisted upon a gaming populace. I liked FF7, for instance, but man, there were all sorts of pointless little meandering trips they made you do (that were supposedly these grand, "heart-felt", "oh my gosh" types of things), like Cloud being in that wheelchair and all that junk. Ooooh, he's exploring his inner self! Look at how profound it is!

Dumb. I don't have the patience for that nonsense any more.

spoonman
08-22-2011, 05:14 PM
I'm personally a big fan of making a game last 5 or 6 hours - ten tops - and then adding in re-play value for people who really love the game. Re-play, IMO, would be things like:

-Additional characters who might change up the story slightly upon a second play-through
-Collectible items
-Beating a bunch of hard scenarios to get 100%
-100% map exploration

or something like that. The newer Castlevania games for DS are, according to this set of criteria, pretty good. You can finish it in about 10 hours, maybe 15, but then there are all sorts of souls / cards / items / enemies to collect, or other characters to play through the game as, or that arena area in the castle where you have to beat 30 rooms and get to the end, if you're really feeling like you want more.

A lot of (J)RPGs have all sorts of meaningless, trivial, vapid, time-filler side-quests that are merely so much trite bloviation foisted upon a gaming populace. I liked FF7, for instance, but man, there were all sorts of pointless little meandering trips they made you do (that were supposedly these grand, "heart-felt", "oh my gosh" types of things), like Cloud being in that wheelchair and all that junk. Ooooh, he's exploring his inner self! Look at how profound it is!

Dumb. I don't have the patience for that nonsense any more.

I agree. I am a fan of this as well.
Another game that is fast to beat, but a blast to play over and over again is Castle Crashers. I love the Tekken style addition of unlocking a new character each time you beat it with another. I think I've beaten that game more than any other game I've ever played!

Sunnyvale
08-22-2011, 05:27 PM
Personally, as one who is not remotely satisfied with his collection, I have little time for long games. I'd rather go find a Sega CD or something than beat any of the modern super-games. The fact that those in my age group (36) are the core group of gamers is a little bit of an eye-opener. Changes the way I view the secondary market, for sure. For example: those 'worthless' sports games they crank out nowadays might end up being pretty rare in ten years, eh?

Sothy
08-22-2011, 05:35 PM
those 'worthless' sports games they crank out nowadays might end up being pretty rare in ten years, eh?

Magic 8 ball says no

spoonman
08-22-2011, 10:07 PM
I find time for all games, new and old. :)

I play everything from Atari 2600 games to Uncharted 2 and Red Dead Redemption.

You have to use your game time wisely. I recommend playing a portable game while your console games are updating.

SpaceHarrier
08-22-2011, 11:42 PM
I don't have an excuse. I'm just lazy. I've beaten about 30% of the games in my collection. There is no rhyme or reason, however if a game is mega-hard, that is definitely a factor. I play a game as long as it's compelling or fun. When I get bored I stop.

Icarus Moonsight
08-23-2011, 01:13 AM
That article does a lot of 'it's this or that' along with some questionable assumptions. Corporate game production is bloated, before the economy went bust they had "sky is the limit" gleam in their eyes and were allocated too many resources. This is the restructuring resulting from the unsustainable and unnatural warping of their structure of production. Of course the longest R&D and projects have to go first, they're higher order goods and furthest from the consumer... *sigh*

Higher concepts have to be sacked huh? Tell it to Notch, I'll wait.

Maybe I should start writing.

j_factor
08-23-2011, 01:49 AM
Games suck. That's why.

Icarus Moonsight
08-23-2011, 04:40 AM
To be fair, what percentage of those who played Donkey Kong achieved a kill screen?

Edmond Dantes
08-23-2011, 05:16 AM
There was a discussion about this article at another forum I visit.

As I said there, "the reason I don't finish a lot of games is because a lot of games are shit."

Aussie2B
08-23-2011, 05:27 AM
I don't buy for a second that games are getting shorter now. I'm frequently searching out games that won't be a big commitment, and I almost always find myself turning to games 16-bit and earlier to fill that need. As much as I love the era, games started to get bloated with the N64 and PlayStation. Platformers had you collecting a bajillion and half doodads that stretched the game out to 20-40 hours, and a large number of RPGs were hitting 40-80 hours. It only got worse with the PS2 and company. Then the 40-hour RPGs were "short". Same situation now. Honestly, it's the fault of the gamers. If you talk to teenage gamers, the majority will tell you that longer is always better. With the big blockbusters, they may be 10 hours because the developers know that the game is flashy enough that the teens won't care, but when you look at the average game that has to fight for sales, the developers will do whatever they can to pump up the gameplay hours. When a 16-year-old kid is looking at "generic 40-hour Japanese RPG" versus "generic 80-hour Japanese RPG", he's going to pick the latter.

Sunnyvale
08-23-2011, 06:37 AM
Magic 8 ball says no

Shake it again, and remind it of the 32X.

dynastygal
08-23-2011, 11:15 AM
I don't finish games either because a new one comes out and I get distracted, or I get stuck. Since I'm skint now and can't afford new games I'm working my way through my collection - completing games then will sell some.

Swamperon
08-24-2011, 07:09 AM
I finish most of my games but what I usually find is that I'll play a game for days/weeks, get to a part where I get stuck or die and then not touch it for months. Later I'll pick it up and complete it.

There's no reason for this, and the parts where I stop playing aren't actually that difficult. Maybe it's wanting to make the game seem to last longer than it really will.

As for game length, generally I don't care as long it feels well paced and I've got my moneys worth. But that is all down to personal taste.

dynastygal
08-24-2011, 12:48 PM
Some of the parts where I get stuck or die I've left for years and as with age comes experience so I can complete them due to more experience in game playing.

Smashed Brother
08-24-2011, 10:24 PM
Back in the day, I would've just laughed at this article as I poured another cup of 80 hour rpg into my mug. But now that I'm in my 30's, with 90% of my game collection sold off to different parts of the world, I completely understand and agree with the article.

If I do game, I can pretty much only play arcade games and Dreamcast shooters. I simply don't have the attention span nor the time to follow
'Character X through Gameworld Y'. On top of that, other hobbies and life are constantly distracting me. I have no kids, and I'm not married (just have a gf), but I believe that after many years of gaming and nerding out over new releases, I broke though some sort of wall. Now I just look back and find myself amazed at how much time I spent chasing games.

SpaceHarrier
08-25-2011, 12:45 AM
Back in the day, I would've just laughed at this article as I poured another cup of 80 hour rpg into my mug. But now that I'm in my 30's, with 90% of my game collection sold off to different parts of the world, I completely understand and agree with the article.

If I do game, I can pretty much only play arcade games and Dreamcast shooters. I simply don't have the attention span nor the time to follow
'Character X through Gameworld Y'. On top of that, other hobbies and life are constantly distracting me. I have no kids, and I'm not married (just have a gf), but I believe that after many years of gaming and nerding out over new releases, I broke though some sort of wall. Now I just look back and find myself amazed at how much time I spent chasing games.

Amen, brother..

Hey, that actually works! LOL


It would have been nice if older me could have coached younger me, "Hey, might not wanna stock up on so many RPGs.."

Baloo
08-25-2011, 09:42 AM
I don't buy for a second that games are getting shorter now. I'm frequently searching out games that won't be a big commitment, and I almost always find myself turning to games 16-bit and earlier to fill that need. As much as I love the era, games started to get bloated with the N64 and PlayStation. Platformers had you collecting a bajillion and half doodads that stretched the game out to 20-40 hours, and a large number of RPGs were hitting 40-80 hours. It only got worse with the PS2 and company. Then the 40-hour RPGs were "short". Same situation now. Honestly, it's the fault of the gamers. If you talk to teenage gamers, the majority will tell you that longer is always better. With the big blockbusters, they may be 10 hours because the developers know that the game is flashy enough that the teens won't care, but when you look at the average game that has to fight for sales, the developers will do whatever they can to pump up the gameplay hours. When a 16-year-old kid is looking at "generic 40-hour Japanese RPG" versus "generic 80-hour Japanese RPG", he's going to pick the latter.

This. Games are just becoming too long, quests to "100% complete" them have become the norm, and they end up stretching for so long toget the special ending after the regular ending that it's just not worth it. I'd rather play a game where I can just play it once through and beat it, especially where RPGs are concerned. I just played through Panzer Dragoon Saga and that game was almost perfect for that. A 12 hour game over 4 discs took me a week to beat, and wasn't too time-extensive, a couple of hours a day was good enough to beat it. These 20 and 40 hour grindfests are just ridiculous.

When the game starts becoming too long, that's when I say that's enough and lose interest in the game. I've got plenty of games, and would actually like to beat some of the other ones I have as well, don't want to waste all of my free time on one game :|

djshok
08-25-2011, 12:49 PM
I can't say I agree with this. I generally find most new games to be too short and I typically finish all my games and wish there was more. The only new game I never finished was AVP on PS3 not so much because it's too long but because it's just too repetitive. They don't really vary the missions up very well. But that's only new game I have that I didn't complete (out of 30 or so PS3 titles). Maybe I'm an anomaly though.

j_factor
08-25-2011, 12:57 PM
I can't say I agree with this. I generally find most new games to be too short and I typically finish all my games and wish there was more.

Whatever occupation you have, I want it. I would kill for that much free time.

Flack
08-25-2011, 01:42 PM
I just have to say this, and I know nobody else will give a shit.

What the article implies is that only 1 out of 10 gamers finishes their games.

If you read between the lines though, they are only talking about Red Dead Redemption, and they got those numbers from Raptr. I looked up Raptr and it works with PC games and Xbox Live and that's it.

So really what the article should push is that only 1 out of 10 people who bought Red Dead Redemption AND played it on a PC or have Xbox Live AND subscribe to Raptr.

I realize that this is a technicality that most of you couldn't care less about, but from someone with a background in journalism, this irked me.

Lady Jaye
08-25-2011, 02:02 PM
You raise an excellent point, Rob.

Icarus Moonsight
08-25-2011, 05:35 PM
The threadbare assumption is the sample rate necessarily transfers +/- to the entire group... Using a specific case to back up a statement that general is very iffy.

They are also conflating higher concept with linear cinematic style, which I think is as low level as interactive media gets. Not low in terms of quality, low in that it's the base. Some 2600 games had higher concepts than many of the stuff that gets rolled out today. Why so many Zombies? It's a Freudian slip of a confession.

skaar
08-25-2011, 05:43 PM
Anyone who reads that want to post the short version?

Too many gamers who don't bother reading more than a paragraph at a time are too lazy to finish video games.


Whatever occupation you have, I want it. I would kill for that much free time.

Also this.

SpaceHarrier
08-26-2011, 02:23 AM
"Long gone are the days of starting a game on a high-level concept," says Konami's Airey. The reason: "It's costly," he says.
Fuller says the devil is in the details.
"I worked on a project that took 50 people and 18 months to produce 20 minutes of game play," he says. "With the expectations so high for visual and audio fidelity, lifelike animations, enemy behavior and movie-quality cinemas, it can take two years for a team of 100 people to create six hours of playable story. At an average burn rate of $10,000 per man month, that's $24 million just in developer cost. You're not likely to find a publisher that will foot the bill for extending that campaign to 20 hours."
Of course, why make a 20-plus hour game when most players aren't completing them, as is the case with "Red Dead Redemption"? The answer is, most publishers don't.

Lazy, cheap bastards.

Between the worldwide sales of the 360 and PS3 versions of Red Dead Redemption, they sold 8 million copies. Pretty good numbers there. Do developers really care if people complete their game, or are they trying to justify making crappy iphone apps?

The question is: would you pay $59.99 at retail for Angry Birds? Also, would you have bought Red Dead Redemption if it were 2 hours long?