Report: 3DS hardware revision due in 2012

[RCM]

My first thought when I heard they were dropping the price was "they're clearing stock." It'll be interesting if this proves true... and confusing to mainstream consumers.

"Nintendo is to radically revise the design of the 3DS, according to reports, with a new unit due in 2012 sporting a second analogue stick, reduced emphasis on 3D and perhaps even a new name.

The claims come from sources close to French site 01.net, and while they appear outlandish it should be noted that the site has, so far this year, published information on Wii U and Vita that was later proven largely correct.

The first claim is that Nintendo executives believe they made a mistake in not adding a second analogue stick to the original 3DS design. Nintendo R&D is now apparently at work on a peripheral, to be sold separately for around $10, that will add the functionality of a second stick. As such Nintendo has tasked "a select group of developers" with development of games specifically designed for dual analogue sticks.

The report goes on to claim that Nintendo is admitting defeat in its attempt to convince the market that 3DS's glasses-free effect is harmless, and is struggling to market the device's USP through traditional media channels. As such it is to release a new version of the system next year, with a new dual-analogue design, reduced emphasis on 3D and potentially a different name.

The report speculates that, far from being designed to increase the installed base, the recent global price cut was intended to clear stock of the old design ahead of the revision's release next year. It also claims that developers are becoming increasingly frustrated with Nintendo's submission and approval process, as well as the price and scarcity of dev kits - apparently only 300 are being manufactured per month.

All of which sounds fanciful at best but, as mentioned above, it is worth pointing out 01.net's past. In January, it reported on the technical specifications of Sony's PlayStation Vita, which at the time was still codenamed Next Generation Portable. Its report proved largely consistent with the Vita's final specs which Sony revealed last week.

Then, in April, it lifted the lid on Wii U, revealing for the first time the system's development codename of Project Café. Its claims of a six-inch, single-touch screen on the controller, backwards compatibility with Wii games and IBM PowerPC processor proved correct.

Should the 3DS claims be proven correct it would represent a remarkable admission of failure on Nintendo's part. Few would contest, given Nintendo's past, that a hardware revision would transpire at some point, but surely none would predict that it would act so quickly and so drastically. But Nintendo has already shown its willingness to act at speed by cutting the global price of 3DS by up to 40 per cent within six months of launch.

Nintendo responded with a curt: "We don't comment on rumour or speculation.""

Source: http://www.next-gen.biz/news/report-3ds-hardware-revision-due-2012

[Oobgarm]

3DS will be known as Virtual Boy 2.0

I look at a "revision" as a new machine for them. This was a failed experiment. Gunpei Yokoi's laughing in his grave.

[portnoyd]

So instead of just 3DS Lite-ing us, they're going to take it up a notch. Oh Nintendo, you're so derp.

[dynastygal]

In other words, more silly little upgrades that the fanboys will lap up and go out and buy a whole new handheld for. I still have my original Nintendo DS...none of this lite, 3D nonsense.

[Frankie_Says_Relax]

If this is true, it will be Nintendo's fastest hardware revision at retail, beating the GameBoy Advance SP and the DS Lite, both of which had more than a year on their predecessors.

The "clearing stock" theory seems very reasonable.

While I'm personally satisfied with the 1st generation hardware (I rarely play it for periods long enough to drain the battery fully) if they make a model with a longer battery life and fix minor QA issues like screen scratches, D-Pad paint ripple, and analog nub failure I don't think that is ultimately a bad thing.

I'd love to see a 2nd analog nub, but after multiple iterations of the PSP with no 2nd nub appearing I've trained myself not to be hopeful of such things.

[Icarus Moonsight]

Recently in gaming, waiting pays off huge. If they dub it the Gameboi I'll shit bricks.

[NE146]

There goes my money again. :p

[Robocop2]

I'll enjoy my 3DS for now and worry about this later.

[sidnotcrazy]

You know, I don't believe the analog stick addition, but some of this seems plasable. I would love a larger screen though.

The 3ds would have sold more units if it was region free, and had a better line up of games at launch, at least IMO

[YoshiM]

The 3ds would have sold more units if it was region free...

Besides you and perhaps a couple scoops of gamers, a system being region free isn't that big a deal to most people. It might have sold five extra units if it was. Though I will admit that this is from a more American point of view-I have no idea what Europeans go through with their gaming and how popular importing is there.

[Rob2600]

If this is true, it will be Nintendo's fastest hardware revision at retail, beating the GameBoy Advance SP and the DS Lite, both of which had more than a year on their predecessors.

Yeah, and I thought the year or two between the Game Boy Pocket and Game Boy Color was quick!

[Patney]

There's a bunch of games that comes out in America but never sees a release here in Europe, so I was very disappointed with the region lock. I also save 50% of my money importing games...

[Frankie_Says_Relax]

I also save 50% of my money importing games...

That's a primary reason that region locking exists.

[Patney]

Yeah, I know, but I just had to mention it. Only about 10% of my games are imported anyway, and that's mostly games that are exclusive to North America OR was released in NA long before Europe (I hate that shit). I even bought both EU and NA versions of Demon's Souls because I couldn't wait to play it plus I wanted to support localization of such titles.

[spoonman]

In other words, more silly little upgrades that the fanboys will lap up and go out and buy a whole new handheld for. I still have my original Nintendo DS...none of this lite, 3D nonsense.

Going from the original DS to the Lite wasn't exactly a silly little upgrade in my opinion. I recently used a friend's original DS after using my DS Lite and DSi for several years and I could barely see the screen. Putting them side by side showed how extreme the upgrade on the LCD really was.

That being said, I still hate the D-pad on the Lite. I love the silly little upgrades on the 3DS also. :P

[Patney]

I agree, DSlite was a needed upgrade. The screens of the original DS are terrible, it's like those first color screen cell phones. Extremely weak light and a bluish tint all over. I also felt like the lite was way more portable and sleek.

[j_factor]

I don't believe it. How exactly could they "de-emphasize" 3D? You can already turn the 3D off. Maybe marketing will talk about it less, but that has nothing to do with a hardware revision. I can't fathom how an analog nub peripheral would work either -- where exactly will it attach? I haven't really heard a bunch of complaints about the 3DS's lack of a second analog nub anyway; the 3DS has its problems, but one analog nub isn't really high on the list.

I also don't see how $170 is a "clearing stock" type of price. That's still higher than the DS launch price. The price drop put the system at what it should've been in the first place.

I can believe that a hardware revision is coming, and even that it's coming fast. But the particulars of this article don't add up IMO.

[Icarus Moonsight]

Re-branding. Taking this as a lead and on it's face, it won't be called 3DS anymore. Best to do it soon, as to sweep this all under the rug. The second analog is for those that are aware of 3DS (or already own one) to differentiate. It's brilliant really. Perhaps unprecedented?

One of the many things hurting the platform is their failure to fully get out from the DS's shadow. Laziest, most predictable and least exciting overall system design by them since the Gameboy Color, I'd say.

[retroguy]

Hmmm....If I want the original design, I guess I'd better get it soon because we all know that as soon as they're gone from store shelves Ebay will be flooded with $300 3DSes listing it as an "ultra rare" system and the price will just go up from there. *sigh*

[spoonman]

As far as the DS Lite goes...
I thought they dropped the price to $99. I haven't seen a single store selling it for less than $124.99.

I also don't trust buying it from any of the merchants on Amazon since many of of them sell bootleg Chinese games, and now fake DS Lites too.

I'd like to get another to have since I do like the option of playing GBA games on it.

[heybtbm]

Hmmm....If I want the original design, I guess I'd better get it soon because we all know that as soon as they're gone from store shelves Ebay will be flooded with $300 3DSes listing it as an "ultra rare" system

...and even then no one will want them.

Looks like waiting paid off. There's going to be a lot of great games coming out in the next 6-12 months. I can't wait to see how this develops. One thing is for sure..."3D" will not be in the name.

[LaughingMAN.S9]

oops wrong thread

[Leo_A]

Looks like waiting paid off. There's going to be a lot of great games coming out in the next 6-12 months. I can't wait to see how this develops. One thing is for sure..."3D" will not be in the name.

You do realize that this is a rumor from a single website, don't you?

[heybtbm]

You do realize that this is a rumor from a single website, don't you?

Hence the...


I can't wait to see how this develops.

[Leo_A]

And then you say that one thing is for sure, 3D won't be part of its name.

Seemed worthwhile pointing it out to you that this is all rumor, and not even a very strong one at that, at this point. There's nothing sure about anything, let alone completely changing the name of the platform.

[spoonman]

...and even then no one will want them.

Looks like waiting paid off. There's going to be a lot of great games coming out in the next 6-12 months. I can't wait to see how this develops. One thing is for sure..."3D" will not be in the name.

Well from what I have read, sales are up since the price drop (which we all knew would happen), and with their biggest IP's ahead of them I think they will do just fine.

I personally know a few people who are waiting for the big three to come out before buying one. Those being; Mario Kart, Super Mario, and Kid Icarus.

I bought one at launch and aside from a few quips; battery life, placement of stylus, crap web browser, I am happy I bought it when I had.

[heybtbm]

And then you say that one thing is for sure, 3D won't be part of its name.


Fine. I will formally amend my statement to this...

If this ends up happening, one thing is for sure..."3D" will not be in the name.

[Lanzo]

The way I thought of this was that they were going to make a new system that costs less to make since from what I have heard they are taking a loss on every system since the price cut (true?). So maybe some of the changes will reduce cost. Another rumor is that the new system would tone down the 3D effect. Also, I don't mean to sound ignorant but what makes the 3DS so expensive compared to DSi? (Seriously) is it the actual 3D? I don't own a dsi but is there a big difference graphically?. My brother has one and they seem very similar to me.

[goatdan]

I look at a "revision" as a new machine for them. This was a failed experiment. Gunpei Yokoi's laughing in his grave.

*IF* this is true, I agree with you completely. But, also if this is true, Nintendo is being about as completely stupid as can be. The heads at Nintendo noted that by doing such a large price drop so shortly after introducing the system, they ran the risk of alienating their biggest fans who may choose to wait when the Wii U comes out. I think that is a VERY valid worry, and that is a big reason that Nintendo decided to give everyone the "ambassador" games -- I would imagine that Sega wouldn't have taken such a big hit on the 32X if they said, "Hey, but if you bought one, we'll give you one of every game we made for free!", so at least Nintendo is trying to appease those people.

But, if this is true, and in 6 months or so a revision comes out that makes the current model obsolete, then not just is Nintendo telling those ambassadors that, "Hey, don't buy our hardware right away because we might change it drastically really quickly," they are also telling everyone who buys a 3DS at the lower price that it was a dumb idea.

*IF* Nintendo does this, unless they offer to upgrade every single 3DS out there for free, they might as well shoot themselves in the foot for the Wii U.

[Nature Boy]

You do realize that this is a rumor from a single website, don't you?

I was thinking the same thing. I'll believe it when I see it quoted by more sources.

I just can't seem them rebranding so soon. Nor trying to make it more Vita like by including a second analog stick. Without further corroboration, it just feels like a Sony fanboy trying to needle Nintendo fanboys or something.

[Robocop2]

Where is all of this "Nintendo looses money on each 3DS sold" talk coming from? Last I heard they cost them ~100 bucks per unit to produce. Last time I checked 170.00 would equate to approximately 70.00 profit granted split between all parties but still its not like the system its self is a black hole for Nintendo.

Also; I find the rumor of a replacement system this soon to be kind of hard to swallow. I don't really think they would be releasing that red 3DS if they're trying to clear stock to make way for a new revised 3DS.

[PapaStu]

Nintendo isn't going to dump the 3DS. There is no way that they've created a legitimate 'alternative' in such a short period of time. Especially something thats going to have the backing of the publishers. Besides, what other system has had such a stellar launch year that didn't make us think that shit had hit the fan and they were done? Their chips are in the pot, they will work it like a horse and things will turn around.


PS2? It was a VERY dry first year, GTA III, MGS2 and GT 3 saved its bacon. Look at it now.

GBA got off to a slow start. 'Too soon they screamed!'. Moar better games on GBC they said. Look at it now.

DS got off to a rocky start. 'Too soon they screamed!'. Moar better games on GBA they said. Look at it now.

Hell, even look at the PS3, releasing for it's $599 US DOLLARS! has come back and taken on a life of it's own. Yes it took a few years, but it took the original XBox a few years too.

There have been VERY few failures in our 'modern' era.
Specific hardware issues like RRoD, YLoD and even where systems are stumbling (PSP in America for example) they are still being supported by other regions that have propped it up. We haven't had a single major console failure since the NGPC in 2000 and that died because the company died, not because of a pulling of console support.

As i've said in other threads about this, the price point hurt alot of early adoptors AND the $10 increase on game costs didn't help things along either. We're 5 months in and we've got 36 games. Almost all have launched at $39 and some were glorified tech demos. That hurts. However, games have started to sneak down to 29 and September (if releases hold steady) looks to have the most releases in a month since the launch of the system with 11 titles.

You guys are all thinking just like movie companies. It doesn't hit 50 zillion bucks week one, it's a failure of epic proportions. Forgetting that the best stuff has staying power and rakes in steadily week after week. Give something that will be the standard for the next 6-10 years a little fucking time.

Now my google-fu is weak (so finding number of titles released for the year isn't happening), but I know that only 11 titles were in the US launch for the DS and there were 16 3DS launch titles. In 5 months since release, they've doubled the number of titles.

PS. Nintendo is dropping new color schemes for this 'on the way out' system... http://www.amazon.com/Nintendo-3DS-Flame-Red/dp/B0050SVMYA/ref=amb_link_357174962_2?pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=hero-quick-promo&pf_rd_r=0PKJ8TN4STTXQSXZKM29&pf_rd_t=201&pf_rd_p=1314332762&pf_rd_i=B002I096AA

[Icarus Moonsight]

Concurrent development and multiple explored paths are extremely common.

I don't think even a comparison to Virtual Boy is warrented at this point. 3DS is more drama and at least 20% more interesting.

[spoonman]

But, if this is true, and in 6 months or so a revision comes out that makes the current model obsolete, then not just is Nintendo telling those ambassadors that, "Hey, don't buy our hardware right away because we might change it drastically really quickly," they are also telling everyone who buys a 3DS at the lower price that it was a dumb idea.

*IF* Nintendo does this, unless they offer to upgrade every single 3DS out there for free, they might as well shoot themselves in the foot for the Wii U.

How would current models become obsolete?
Even the old phat DS plays even the newest DS titles that haven't even been released yet. It's not like they are going to change the size of the card slot so all new 3DS games will no longer fit into the original 3DS.

I really don't understand why people have such a problem with new revisions. Every company does this. It's just how technology evolves.

[nickerous]

At this point, I don't care about any 2nd analog nub. Show me a game that benefits from it that I want to play and I'll think about it.

The price drop so soon after launch doomed the Wii U for me. I'll not buy it until it has 10 games I want. Maybe I'll ask for it as a gift, but absolutely not buying it next year....maybe not in 2013...

[kedawa]

If you're anything like me, you could be waiting for a long time.
I'm having trouble coming up with ten Wii games that I want, even though it's been out for five years.

[Rickstilwell1]

One thing I don't like about the 3DS is the screen - you can't play it at all in the sun. you have to be indoors without light coming in through the window, or outside after the sun is going down.

The graphics are great though. Much better looking than regular DS games can do.

[dairugger]

One thing I don't like about the 3DS is the screen - you can't play it at all in the sun. you have to be indoors without light coming in through the window, or outside after the sun is going down.

The graphics are great though. Much better looking than regular DS games can do.

what handheld can you play in the sun?

[PapaStu]

what handheld can you play in the sun?

The ones w/o a backlight. GBA, GBC, GB, NGPC all work fine in the sun.

[Kyle15]

what handheld can you play in the sun?

The big question is, what game can you play in the sun? That would be Boktai.

[retroguy]

Let's be honest here: As soon as the Playstation 1 came out (and possibly before that), "hardcore" gamers decided that Nintendo was stupid and they've been repeating that endlessly ever since. All this talk about the 3DS failing, Nintendo losing customers, etc. is nothing more than "harcore" gamers rooting for Nintendo to fail because they're still mad that the "hardcore" systems got curbstomped by a "lame kiddie system". Well guess what folks, Nintendo isn't going anywhere. Their stuff has always been popular and has always sold well. The problem (which is with us not them) is that the standard for success has changed. The NES sold 30-40 million systems and was considered a gigantic success, but that's apparently not good enough anymore in a world where the PS2 sold 100 million systems. My question is, why not? It's true that Nintendo is the only one of the big three to make money on their hardware and not have to rely on software sales to balance things out. If Nintendo is making lots of money in profits (and they are), wouldn't that be a better measure of success than the number of systems they've sold? If Sony is losing lots of money (and they are), wouldn't that be a better measure of failure? I think so.

[PapaStu]

The big question is, what game can you play in the sun? That would be Boktai.

The sun is in your hands!

[spoonman]

Let's be honest here: As soon as the Playstation 1 came out (and possibly before that), "hardcore" gamers decided that Nintendo was stupid and they've been repeating that endlessly ever since. All this talk about the 3DS failing, Nintendo losing customers, etc. is nothing more than "harcore" gamers rooting for Nintendo to fail because they're still mad that the "hardcore" systems got curbstomped by a "lame kiddie system". Well guess what folks, Nintendo isn't going anywhere. Their stuff has always been popular and has always sold well. The problem (which is with us not them) is that the standard for success has changed. The NES sold 30-40 million systems and was considered a gigantic success, but that's apparently not good enough anymore in a world where the PS2 sold 100 million systems. My question is, why not? It's true that Nintendo is the only one of the big three to make money on their hardware and not have to rely on software sales to balance things out. If Nintendo is making lots of money in profits (and they are), wouldn't that be a better measure of success than the number of systems they've sold? If Sony is losing lots of money (and they are), wouldn't that be a better measure of failure? I think so.

Sony is losing lots of money?
Where did you see that? Last I heard they were doing very well and I'm seeing headlines like this "PS3 sales up 13% in April despite PlayStation Network troubles"

With system exclusives like Uncharted 3, God of War: Origins Collection, Resistance 3, Ico/Shadow of the Colossus Collection, Ratchet & Clank: All 4 One, Journey, Last Guardian, Twisted Metal 3, Sly Cooper: Thieves in Time, Starhawk, & more all due out shortly I don't think Sony will have anything to worry about!

Uncharted 3 alone will make them a ton of cash.

Also I think "hardcore gamers" support multiple consoles. I for one buy and play just about every console that hits the market. I think non-hardcore gamers are the ones that will pick a company or console and avoid others. Or maybe those are Fanboys.. Who knows...

[DragonMaster Sam]

Well, I was planning on picking up a 3DS soon, but after reading that article, I'm not sure if I should wait or not.

[Robocop2]

Also I think "hardcore gamers" support multiple consoles. I for one buy and play just about every console that hits the market. I think non-hardcore gamers are the ones that will pick a company or console and avoid others. Or maybe those are Fanboys.. Who knows...

Or they're hypnotized....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eX4MdXF3OWI&feature=related

[Patney]

As a "hardcore gamer", I own every console because I hate missing out on great games. But I wish there was a single platform for all games...

[smoreyjinza]

Although this rumor can't be disapproved until the system's entire life is played out, I'm not sure it would happen so soon. Nintendo did mess up without the inclusion of a second analogue stick.
__________________
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[goatdan]

How would current models become obsolete?
Even the old phat DS plays even the newest DS titles that haven't even been released yet. It's not like they are going to change the size of the card slot so all new 3DS games will no longer fit into the original 3DS.

Adding a second analog stick that there will be no easy way to just "bolt on" to your 3DS is a LOT more dramatic than releasing a new hardware revision that does the same stuff.

Controllers may get revisions, but it's rare that those revisions are really majorly supported. I can't think of a portable that had two versions that came out that changed the fundamental control schemes they presented the user with -- The GBA to GBASP didn't add two buttons or anything like that.

*That's* the issue that I have with it -- how could Nintendo create a "bolt on" second analog stick that doesn't make the original system feel like complete crap in your hands? Or, is Nintendo just going to tell all the early 3DS adopters, "Yeah, we came up with better hardware, but you can still play it the old way! You just won't be able to use those features in our games that use them!"

And if they do that, why would anyone buy a Wii U until they are certain that it contains the features that are needed to actually play games that come out for it one year later?


I really don't understand why people have such a problem with new revisions. Every company does this. It's just how technology evolves.

Revising the PS2, Xbox 360 or PS3 are totally fine by me. Heck, so was the NES, SNES and Genesis revisions. Handheld-wise, I had no problems with the GBA, DS, Game Boy or even the Lynx. A new way to play that early adopters won't get -- that's just stupid.

[PapaStu]

Revising the PS2, Xbox 360 or PS3 are totally fine by me. Heck, so was the NES, SNES and Genesis revisions. Handheld-wise, I had no problems with the GBA, DS, Game Boy or even the Lynx. A new way to play that early adopters won't get -- that's just stupid.

Revising the PS3 and giving it new controllers w/ rumble? Early adoptor wanting rumble, but stuck with those 'paltry' SixAxis controllers? That'll be +49 buck plzkthnx.

Revising the PS3 and removing the PS2BC to a lower compatability % before removing it completely with the first two revisions? While 4 years in most of the units are beginning to fail due to weak thermal paste? That'll be +249 for a new system plzkthnx!

Were you mad when Nintendo created Motion Plus? Sold it as a dongle, before putting it in the controllers? That 'hurt' early adoptors by not letting them experience those games.

Stop assuming that they're going to add additional functionality to the system via the addition of another stick and screw over the 'early' adoptors. They've never done that with a handheld before, I doubt they'd do something like that now.

[The 1 2 P]

I'm not sure why this would surprise anybody, unless it's because of it happening a mere year later. But rather it happens in 2012 or 2013 it will eventually happen. There was an artical where one of the Nintendo reps said there wouldn't be any revisions for the 3DS(for atleast a long time) because they were throwing in all the tech it would ever need from the start. I need to go find that so I can link it.

[kedawa]

That sounds like something that a PR person would say, not someone that actually knows what's up with hardware.
Hardware revisions don't have to add features, and in fact they often remove some.
Technology improves, design flaws are discovered, ways to reduce cost are found, and hardware revisions start to make a lot of sense.
The changes may end up being internal and invisible to the end user, of course, but they will happen.

[heybtbm]

Let's be honest here: As soon as the Playstation 1 came out (and possibly before that), "hardcore" gamers decided that Nintendo was stupid and they've been repeating that endlessly ever since. All this talk about the 3DS failing, Nintendo losing customers, etc. is nothing more than "harcore" gamers rooting for Nintendo to fail because they're still mad that the "hardcore" systems got curbstomped by a "lame kiddie system". Well guess what folks, Nintendo isn't going anywhere. Their stuff has always been popular and has always sold well. The problem (which is with us not them) is that the standard for success has changed. The NES sold 30-40 million systems and was considered a gigantic success, but that's apparently not good enough anymore in a world where the PS2 sold 100 million systems. My question is, why not? It's true that Nintendo is the only one of the big three to make money on their hardware and not have to rely on software sales to balance things out. If Nintendo is making lots of money in profits (and they are), wouldn't that be a better measure of success than the number of systems they've sold? If Sony is losing lots of money (and they are), wouldn't that be a better measure of failure? I think so.

U mad?

This is some of the worst analysis I've read on any subject in some time. Just plain embarrassing.

"Hardcore" gamers enjoy all systems. Not sure which definition you're using.

[Malon_Forever]

I just want the new Paper Mario....

[The 1 2 P]

That sounds like something that a PR person would say, not someone that actually knows what's up with hardware.
Hardware revisions don't have to add features, and in fact they often remove some.
Technology improves, design flaws are discovered, ways to reduce cost are found, and hardware revisions start to make a lot of sense.
The changes may end up being internal and invisible to the end user, of course, but they will happen.

I found it. Iwata made the comment as a direct response from one of the 3DS engineers. I agree with you about finding ways to cut cost but I still think the article is even more amusing now, all things considered:

Nintendo Has No Plans For A 3DS Lite (http://www.industrygamers.com/news/nintendo-has-no-plans-for-a-3ds-lite/).

[Icarus Moonsight]

It's seeming more and more to me that 3DS is mostly a DS redesign, to be honest.

[spoonman]

We will no doubt see improvements made to the 3DS weather or not Nintendo introduces a new SKU. There are changes done to consoles and portables every few months and most are internal. I think there was something like 13 revisions to the original PSX motherboard.

I believe B/C was removed from the PS3 for a few reasons.

It saved Sony time and money from continuously trying to improve compatibility, especially on the 2nd revision with the emulated Emotion Engine.
This is time and money that should be spent on PS3 games.

Besides, Sony doesn't see a penny of profit for people playing old software on their new PS3. They will no doubt offer PS2 games as DLC Classics and they would most likely sell more if people don't have the option of playing their old discs.

The same should be said about the upcoming Wii U not being compatible with Game Cube discs. I see A Game Cube Virtual Console section coming...

[goatdan]

Revising the PS3 and giving it new controllers w/ rumble? Early adoptor wanting rumble, but stuck with those 'paltry' SixAxis controllers? That'll be +49 buck plzkthnx.

Yes, but a handheld contains the controller more or less as part of the package.


Revising the PS3 and removing the PS2BC to a lower compatability % before removing it completely with the first two revisions? While 4 years in most of the units are beginning to fail due to weak thermal paste? That'll be +249 for a new system plzkthnx!

Okay -- so you're talking about removing something from a system that early adapters got as a bonus. Yeah, the console failure thing sucks, but ever since the original Playstation, the first revision of most console hardware has been not nearly as solid as the later revisions.


Were you mad when Nintendo created Motion Plus? Sold it as a dongle, before putting it in the controllers? That 'hurt' early adoptors by not letting them experience those games.

Again, doing something in a controller is different than replacing the entire system. And let's be honest -- that dongle isn't required by the majority of Wii games anyway. Besides all that, I think it's a heck of a lot easier to upgrade the system after it has been out for what -- two or three years -- with something like that?


Stop assuming that they're going to add additional functionality to the system via the addition of another stick and screw over the 'early' adoptors. They've never done that with a handheld before, I doubt they'd do something like that now.

I'm not sure if you didn't read my earlier post in this, but my entire contention with the news report was that this goes against what Nintendo has promised. Reread my first post. When they announced the 3DS price drop, Nintendo pointed out with this price drop that it means that it is going to make it tougher for them to sell the Wii U. If Nintendo's real reason for the 3DS price drop was to clear stock so they can introduce a significantly upgraded version of the console that shortly thereafter, it makes everyone who buys a console right now feel duped by them, and everyone who is an ambassador will feel doubly duped -- again, the reason the games were announced for those early adapters was to give them some sort of bonus to make them feel less disappointed at having such a HUGE price drop so quickly.

My point, perhaps not expressed clearly enough, was that if Nintendo is pointing out the fact that the price drop is a hurdle toward the introduction of the Wii U, that it would be both *extremely* boneheaded and totally against what they had said. For that reason, I *greatly* doubt that the reports are true. A 3DS Lite may be in the works. A 3DS Lite that has a bunch of new features would really, really surprise me if it was in the works.

[Leo_A]

I believe B/C was removed from the PS3 for a few reasons.

It saved Sony time and money from continuously trying to improve compatibility, especially on the 2nd revision with the emulated Emotion Engine.
This is time and money that should be spent on PS3 games.

Besides, Sony doesn't see a penny of profit for people playing old software on their new PS3. They will no doubt offer PS2 games as DLC Classics and they would most likely sell more if people don't have the option of playing their old discs.

The generally accepted reason is Sony did this to drive down production cost. Trimming things like the PS2's GPU (Only the Emotion Engine, the PS2's CPU, was emulated), SACD support, USB ports, and so on from the system was an all out attempt to drive the console's price down quickly after they realized the error of their ways with a far too high MSRP early on.

I believe the hybrid emulation/hardware BC systems have more than passable PS2 backwards compatibility, so I really doubt they did this to save development money on furthering it. I'm pretty sure it was as simple as they wanted to save the cost of including the PS2's GPU in every system they sold.


When they announced the 3DS price drop, Nintendo pointed out with this price drop that it means that it is going to make it tougher for them to sell the Wii U.

That doesn't sound right at all. While they perhaps feel that way internally, I can't imagine Nintendo actually coming out and expressing anything but optimism with their price drop. I can't visualize them stating that publically, or even see a possible need why they'd want to state that.

I only saw them spin their early price drop in a positive way.

[kedawa]

Trimming things like the PS2's GPU (Only the Emotion Engine, the PS2's CPU, was emulated), SACD support, USB ports, and so on from the system was an all out attempt to drive the console's price down quickly after they realized the error of their ways with a far too high MSRP early on.
The Emotion Engine is the PS2 CPU, and the 60GB launch PS3 contained both the Emotion Engine and the Graphics Synthesizer(GPU).
It's the later BC models that only have partial PS2 hardware.

[Leo_A]

The Emotion Engine is the PS2 CPU, and the 60GB launch PS3 contained both the Emotion Engine and the Graphics Synthesizer(GPU).
It's the later BC models that only have partial PS2 hardware.

I know, reread my post. ;)

I was explaining to him that they removed backwards compatibility to save the cost of including the PS2's GPU in every system they sold.

[Patney]

Technically PS3 should be capable of emulating the PS2... I heard that there were some tests with a few PS2 games and they ran fine except for a few hitches. Also considering computers weaker than the PS3 can emulate PS2 decently, an emulator coded by Sony themselves should be far from impossible. I guess they are too busy making money off HD-makes.

[goatdan]

That doesn't sound right at all. While they perhaps feel that way internally, I can't imagine Nintendo actually coming out and expressing anything but optimism with their price drop. I can't visualize them stating that publically, or even see a possible need why they'd want to state that.

I only saw them spin their early price drop in a positive way.

Okay:


The Nintendo president also admitted concern that the 3DS price drop might affect Wii U early adoption: "With regard to the influence on the Wii U, what we have to take most seriously is that the price markdown could damage the trust of the consumers who bought the Nintendo 3DS just after the launch. I feel greatly accountable for it. Our decision of the price markdown this time has a side effect that, at the launch of the Wii U, people may feel that the price might drop in the near future if they wait. What we will be able to do to recover the consumers' trust before the launch of the Wii U is very important to us."

Source: http://www.destructoid.com/wii-u-not-getting-price-or-launch-date-until-2012-207834.phtml

Bold by me -- that is *exactly* why I think that Nintendo will not greatly redesign the 3DS right now, and if they they they are absolutely stupid.

[Icarus Moonsight]

They won't greatly change it, even if they do some alterations.

[Leo_A]

I didn't mean to doubt you, Goatdan, I mostly just didn't understand why they'd of actually admitted to it.

Usually when something drastic is taken like this 3DS price drop, corporations do their best to spin it as positively as possible despite it being obvious to outsiders that it was an emergency measure that they took with possible negative ramifications. Seemed somewhat unusual to be honest about that.

[goatdan]

I didn't mean to doubt you, Goatdan, I mostly just didn't understand why they'd of actually admitted to it.

Usually when something drastic is taken like this 3DS price drop, corporations do their best to spin it as positively as possible despite it being obvious to outsiders that it was an emergency measure that they took. Seemed somewhat unusual.

Oh, I wasn't saying that you did doubt me, I just found the quote so I thought I'd share.

This post actually stuck out at me because it was so uniquely honest. I was actually surprised that it took me some time to find it, because I thought I had seen it a few places when it came out. Regardless, that quote is the exact reason that I think any major 3DS redesign would be even more backward than Nintendo usually has been lately. It would clearly show that Reggie has absolutely no control, and I guarantee it would make everyone who has purchased a 3DS to date feel screwed -- just like all those people that Sega convinced to buy a 32X.

The 3DS Ambassador program is Nintendo's attempt at appeasing it's hardcore fan base to hopefully convince them that buying a Wii U on day 1 isn't a risk too.

[calthaer]

It's seeming more and more to me that 3DS is mostly a DS redesign, to be honest.

That would be fine by me. One of the big reason I liked the DS was because it was the only modern system for which intriguing 2D games were coming out. I thought the touch-screen really did add a refreshing, unique spin on the pixelverse, and I liked it.

But this 3D nonsense...putting some sort of advanced 3D graphics on a tiny screen just seems like a waste of time. If I want 3D, I want it on the big screen - not this tiny little window. It's kind of a shame that the PC is now the 2D platform of choice, and the former 2D king is starting to pine badly for the 3D crown of the PC - when the crown is just way too big for its tiny little head.

[Icarus Moonsight]

Before I actually used one, I was intrigued by the 3D aspect. I can't say that fascination lasted after first contact. It's neat, but it is a full tilt gimmick. Until someone utilizes the 3D toward a gameplay use, it's [3D] not going to be anything else other than a blurry 3D camera and kinda 3D media player.

[spoonman]

Technically PS3 should be capable of emulating the PS2... I heard that there were some tests with a few PS2 games and they ran fine except for a few hitches. Also considering computers weaker than the PS3 can emulate PS2 decently, an emulator coded by Sony themselves should be far from impossible. I guess they are too busy making money off HD-makes.

Well can you blame them though?
What reason would they have to spend any amount of time tweaking their emulation for old PS2 discs to work on the PS3 when
A. They can use that time designing PS3 software and
B. They make $0.00 off of PS2 games in people's collections or used game bins.

Also the price of the PS3's hardware didn't seem high to me, but then again I bought the Neo-Geo AES ($750) & Philips CD-i ($799) in 1990, and the 3DO in '93 ($550) so the PS3 in 2006 for $499 was something of a bargain.

It's all in comparison I suppose and I sure I only spent $399 on my 360, but I had to buy 3 of them to keep keep on playing my 360 games :oops: (please no console wars. It's the truth and besides, I love all my consoles. :)

[substantial_snake]

Although I HIGHLY doubt this the only way I could see Nintendo make a 3DS with less emphasis on 3D is to produce a model that uses a conventional LCD instead of the parallax 3D screen. It could solve much of the battery life issue and lower the costs a bit again I highly doubt that this is the case but just a random idea.

I personally don't care if another major hardware revision of the 3DS is incoming. I still feel that 160 is too much to ask for this system and would be upset if I had even paid that, not even mentioning the ridiculous 250 dollar initial price tag. If they can drop costs and still be successful with a new version then I say go for it.


Technically PS3 should be capable of emulating the PS2... I heard that there were some tests with a few PS2 games and they ran fine except for a few hitches. Also considering computers weaker than the PS3 can emulate PS2 decently, an emulator coded by Sony themselves should be far from impossible. I guess they are too busy making money off HD-makes.

Well the 80 gig fat PS3's did software emulate the PS2 with a very high level of compatibility though not as high as the hardware emulation 60 gigs. It was the model after they had removed the Emotion Engine chip for cost but still retained PS2 backwards comparability, it all worked through software so the console really had no problems doing it. Then they shortly removed it in the next versions of the fat and slim for no real reason, however considering how the HD remake concept has taken off it may have been an intentional business decisions more then anything else.

[spoonman]

Although I HIGHLY doubt this the only way I could see Nintendo make a 3DS with less emphasis on 3D is to produce a model that uses a conventional LCD instead of the parallax 3D screen. It could solve much of the battery life issue and lower the costs a bit again I highly doubt that this is the case but just a random idea.

I think the whole battery life problem with the 3DS is blown out of proportion. 3 hours is more than enough portable gaming time for me and I always charge my systems when not using them. The included cradle makes it that much easier to remember to charge it.

You can turn off 3D, lower the brightness, turn off Wi-Fi, turn on the power saving function if you want to extend your time. There is no reason to eliminate 3D to save power when you can simply switch it off.

Also, I'm sure we will continue to see better 3rd party battery replacements as well.



I personally don't care if another major hardware revision of the 3DS is incoming. I still feel that 160 is too much to ask for this system and would be upset if I had even paid that, not even mentioning the ridiculous 250 dollar initial price tag. If they can drop costs and still be successful with a new version then I say go for it.


I paid $250 for my 3DS and I'm completely satisfied with my purchase.

I guess it all depends on what you are looking for though. If you don't care about playing games in 3D with improved graphics it's obviously not worth it.

I like the improved screen, the 3DS Store, Virtual Console, and Netflix. So I am getting my money's worth out of it. The 20 free games is a nice bonus too.

I will admit the launch was extremely weak, but if you sorted through the crap you would have found a couple games (namely Ridge Racer 3D, Pilot Wings, SSFIV 3D) to hold you over until the big ones (Super Mario 3D Land, Kid Icarus, Paper Mario, Mario Kart 3D) hit.

[j_factor]

Well the 80 gig fat PS3's did software emulate the PS2 with a very high level of compatibility though not as high as the hardware emulation 60 gigs. It was the model after they had removed the Emotion Engine chip for cost but still retained PS2 backwards comparability, it all worked through software so the console really had no problems doing it.

It didn't all work through software. They removed the Emotion Engine, but retained the PS2 GPU. It was only half software emulation. The same backwards compatibility that launch PS3's had in Europe.

[substantial_snake]

I think the whole battery life problem with the 3DS is blown out of proportion. 3 hours is more than enough portable gaming time for me and I always charge my systems when not using them. The included cradle makes it that much easier to remember to charge it.

You can turn off 3D, lower the brightness, turn off Wi-Fi, turn on the power saving function if you want to extend your time. There is no reason to eliminate 3D to save power when you can simply switch it off.

Also, I'm sure we will continue to see better 3rd party battery replacements as well.

I don't think it is because its so very uncharacteristic of a Nintendo portable. I have owned a Gameboy, GBC, GBA, GBA-SP, and DS Lite all great portable system and all devices that I could play for a hour or two then throw into a backpack or my car knowing that I didn't have to put it on a charger. Nintendo has always emphasized portability with its handheld products which is part of its overall appeal and the 3DS simply doesn't deliver on this.

On a similar note I really don't know how widespread of a problem this is but my cosmo black would have serious scratches in the top screen by now if I hadn't both gotten it a screen protector and stuck on oversized rubber feet to the top screen. It not only looks bad but I fear that keeping the hinges in a slightly engaged state is going to wear them out faster then they normally would. This being a major design failure on Nintendo's fault and again being very uncharacteristic of them in my experience of their usually well designed portable products.

[On a side note I picked up the Niko battery and cradle for my 3DS and am very happy with it so far. Although I haven't done a ton of testing it does come close to about doubling the battery life of the system with everything on max in my experience. It also adds a little weight and "girth" to the system that I and my big hands really appreciate. I recommend this to whoever else has battery issues with the 3DS...but again I shouldn't of had to buy a 30 dollar battery to make the system acceptable..]


I paid $250 for my 3DS and I'm completely satisfied with my purchase.

I guess it all depends on what you are looking for though. If you don't care about playing games in 3D with improved graphics it's obviously not worth it.

I like the improved screen, the 3DS Store, Virtual Console, and Netflix. So I am getting my money's worth out of it. The 20 free games is a nice bonus too.

I will admit the launch was extremely weak, but if you sorted through the crap you would have found a couple games (namely Ridge Racer 3D, Pilot Wings, SSFIV 3D) to hold you over until the big ones (Super Mario 3D Land, Kid Icarus, Paper Mario, Mario Kart 3D) hit.

I am interested in both better graphics to see what Nintendo comes up with using the 3D in its first party outings. The only games I own at the moment are Ghost Recon Shadow War and LoZ:OoT and LoZ really impressed me with full 3D because it really felt like looking into a window rather then looking at a screen. The only thing that interests me online shop wise is the 3D classics line in that there is a lot of potential to make old experiences new a fresh again.

I don't hate the 3DS by any means because its a neat system and I don't regret paying a hundred bucks for one. I just feel like it was just mistep after mistep because Nintendo decided to go back on some of their well know standards while charging far too high a price for their console. The market and Nintendo seem to have agreed with the very sluggish sales and the dramatic price drop of the console. I do agree that once the holidays hit it will probably be worth the asking price because the games will justify picking one up but before then I still think its too much.


It didn't all work through software. They removed the Emotion Engine, but retained the PS2 GPU. It was only half software emulation. The same backwards compatibility that launch PS3's had in Europe.

I was unaware of this but its interesting. I supose further board revisions eliminated the GUP as well making emulation just not worth the effort on Sonys part. Learn something new every day I suppose.

[The 1 2 P]

Edit: I see that a thread was already started about it.

[shertz]

Im waiting for a 3DS XL system much like the DSi XL. Thats when I'll get a 3DS.