Sonic 1 vs. Mario World

[Kevincal]

Which is technically better, which do you like better?

2 of the greatest games of all time for sure. Personally I go with Sonic 1 because in 1991 it was new, fresh, fast, and just damn cool. Super Mario World felt a little too similar to Super Mario Bros. 3 in 1991. Which of course is not a bad thing at all. It's just, it might as well have been called Super Mario Bros. 4, which it was in Japan

Kind of like how Sonic & Knuckles is basically Sonic the Hedgehog 4, still a great game, but the series getting a little long in the tooth. In 1991 that is how I felt about Mario World, I had already played Mario 1-3 and wanted something new, enter Sonic.

I think both games deserve a perfect score though.

I think Mario World is the more difficult game. Longer and more difficult than Sonic 1. Graphically I have to give the nod to Sonic. Gameplay, Sonic, and even music, Sonic. I just overall like Sonic 1 slightly more than SMW.

Of course I guess we are all partial to which game we chose to buy / play in 1991. Anyone lucky enough to have both a Genesis and SNES in 1991 and play both of these games at the same time? I was only 10 in 1991 so could only afford 1 system.

btw, 1991 was 20 years ago already. Damn.

Just checked Wikipedia and Sonic 1 came out exactly 2 months before Mario World in the US. Imagine if Nintendo had released the SNES and Mario World in the US before Sonic, Sonic may have never caught on and became popular.

[buzz_n64]

Which is technically better, which do you like better?

2 of the greatest games of all time for sure. Personally I go with Sonic 1 because in 1991 it was new, fresh, fast, and just damn cool. Super Mario World felt a little too similar to Super Mario Bros. 3 in 1991. Which of course is not a bad thing at all. It's just, it might as well have been called Super Mario Bros. 4

Kind of like how Sonic & Knuckles is basically Sonic the Hedgehog 4, still a great game, but the series getting a little long in the tooth. In 1991 that is how I felt about Mario World, I had already played Mario 1-3 and wanted something new, enter Sonic.

I think both games deserve a perfect score though.

I think Mario World is the more difficult game. Longer and more difficult than Sonic 1. Graphically I have to give the nod to Sonic. Gameplay, Sonic, and even music, Sonic. I just overall like Sonic 1 slightly more than SMW.

Of course I guess we are all partial to which game we chose to buy / play in 1991. Anyone lucky enough to have both a Genesis and SNES in 1991 and play both of these games at the same time? I was only 10 in 1991 so could only afford 1 system.

btw, 1991 was 20 years ago already. Damn.

Super Mario World is called Super Mario Bros. 4 in Japan.

Sonic & Knuckles was so similar to Sonic 3, that they decided to make the cart as an add-on for Sonic 3.

Sonic 1 looks better and plays faster, but Mario World is more of an adventure and expansive. I really love the world map, and being able to replay levels.

[Aussie2B]

It's just, it might as well have been called Super Mario Bros. 4

It was. It's on the Japanese packaging.

I'd pick World, but, honestly, I think both get a little more credit than they deserve. Maybe if I had played them when they were new, I'd feel different, but since I played both roughly within the past decade, I don't have that nostalgia that everyone else does. I enjoyed both, but Super Mario World is too easy and has some awkward elements (not that crazy about the cape, Yoshi, the football player enemies, etc.), while Sonic isn't remotely as fast as his reputation makes him out to be (outside of a few stages, many force you to a crawl). I also hate the Labyrinth Zone in Sonic, and it sucks that the game has no passwords or saving.

[crazyjackcsa]

Super Mario World is called Super Mario Bros. 4 in Japan.

Sonic & Knuckles was so similar to Sonic 3, that they decided to make the cart as an add-on for Sonic 3.

Sonic 1 looks better and plays faster, but Mario World is more of an adventure and expansive. I really love the world map, and being able to replay levels.

Not entirely true. Sonic 3 and Sonic and Knuckles were originally intended to be one game, but was split into two to get Sonic 3 out in time for the Christmas rush.

[kedawa]

Super Mario World kept me entertained for a lot longer than Sonic the Hedgehog, since the overworld made it less linear and the save sytem allowed more flexibility in how and when I played it.
Being able to play with another person also helped enormously.

[Blanka789]

I love both, but I'd give the nod to Super Mario World. To me, the first Sonic game was great, but not quite on the level with the best of everyone's favorite plumber. Sonic 2 is really where the series established itself as a true competitor to Mario.

[Berserker]

Super Mario World for me. I liked the non-linearity, the replayability, which all the secrets added to as well. I liked the graphics/world itself more.

That said, I did have both consoles during this time, and while it seemed like they were constantly coming out with new Sonic games, by the time SMW finally got a sequel, I was already moved on to PC gaming pretty heavily. So through that period I'm sure I played much more Sonic, even though I preferred SMW to any individual Sonic game.

[Robocop2]

While I love Sonic 1; I'd say the edge goes to SMW simply because of the sheer size of the game. Hidden paths and worlds whereas Sonic follows a totally linear path excepting the different paths you can take through the levels. Both good games for sure but I do think that SMW has Sonic beat.

[Kevincal]

For me, I was a hardcore Mario Bros. 3 fan when the time came to choose between buying a SNES and Genesis. I ended up buying the cheaper Genesis w/ Sonic 1, I will never forget when I got home and played Sonic 1 for the first time, I was so blown away by the graphics. The speed and color was just unreal. My friends and I were just smiling ear to ear amazed at how awesome this game was. Let's not forget the music, incredibly awesome music. The control and play mechanics was perfect as well. As was the story.

I actually prefer a shorter and easier game such as sonic over a longer and more difficult game like Mario World. For instance, I hated so much the forest area of Mario World, for a long time I could not figure out how to progress. This is the same reason I am not a huge Zelda fan, those games are huge, large and very challenging to complete. I guess I have a short attention span, but I really do prefer easier games with flash over huge games with lots of substance. :)

Resident Evil 1 is another example, I bought that game around its release in 1996 and it was fun, until it became too challenging and I would just always end up getting lost, not knowing what to do, frustrated. I tried to revisit this game recently and the same thing, the game became too difficult for me. I get frustrated easily when games become very difficult and confusing. That is what I love about Sonic, it is just pure straightforward gaming.

I have to say also that I prefer Mario Bros. 3 over Mario World. I guess it's mostly for nostalgia.

There are only a handful of games that truly amazed me awith their awesomeness at the time of their release. Mario Bros. 1, Mario Bros. 3, Sonic 1, Mario 64 & Gran Turismo 3.

Honorable mention to Ridge Racer on the PlayStation & Diddy Kong Racing on the N64. Among a lot of others. :P

[drmay]

Sonic

[8-bitNesMan]

Mario World runs rings (heh heh, get it?) around Sonic the Hedgehog. I was lucky enough to have a Super NES sitting under the tree Christmas morning 1991 and I don't think I've ever been impacted before or since quite like I was on that glorious day. It may be slower than Sonic but the worlds and colors are so beautiful and the music was magical to me also. I remember playing each save file to 96 worlds and taking my SNES on family vacation and rocking out on some Mario World in the hotel rooms that we stayed in. Even years later I played it with my best friend just to see if we could get all 96 worlds in one sitting. We did it in a few hours and still had a ball doing it. I never played Sonic to completion, even when I had the time and attention span to do so. And @ Aussie2B: Call me crazy, but I loved the cape, Yoshi, and the football player Koopas ;)

[j_factor]

Both are great games with pretty significant flaws.

Super Mario World is thought of as a much larger/longer game, but I think that's true to a lesser extent when you really look at it. Mario moves kinda slow, making the same stretch "seem" longer. When I play Super Mario World, I find myself continuously holding down the run button, which to me indicates that they did something wrong. Each area would contain rather similar levels grouped together, and further repetition with the ghost houses and castles. Some of the levels were basically straight lines, and some were extremely short. I didn't mind Yoshi, but I don't feel he really added much to the game either, and the cape feels like a lamer version of the raccoon. I didn't like the "!" blocks/rooms, which felt pointless. The "secrets" where you take a key to a keyhole sound better on paper than they actually are. In practice, when I play the game, I skip most of the secrets and the Star Road. Most of the bosses are pretty lame, too, and the game overall is on the easy side.

Sonic's levels are much more detailed, vibrant, and interesting. But there's still some repetitiveness in having three acts to each zone. I like the special stage aspect of the game, but the special stages themselves are just okay. Arguably the game is a little too short and basic. But I find myself coming back to it to try to beat my times, an element of replayability that SMW doesn't have. I also think Sonic has much better music.

Pretty much a tie, in my eyes. As an aside, I think it's interesting that Super Mario World has a somewhat better critical reputation, but Sonic was much more influential. With games like Jazz Jackrabbit, Socket, Zool, Kid Chaos, Awesome Possum, etc. it seemed like everyone was ripping him off. You can see a lasting influence in games like Crash Bandicoot (and even the commercials for Crash Bandicoot).

[8-bitNesMan]

...and the cape feels like a lamer version of the raccoon.

I always thought that the cape was a wonderful expansion of the raccoon suit. You could stay in the air a lot longer with the cape, from one end of a level to another if your flying skills were good :D

[BlastProcessing402]

Despite my username, I've never been a huge fan of the hedgehog. SMW over Sonic 1 and it's not even close. I think SMW is my favorite platformer of all the times.

[Aussie2B]

Pretty much a tie, in my eyes. As an aside, I think it's interesting that Super Mario World has a somewhat better critical reputation, but Sonic was much more influential. With games like Jazz Jackrabbit, Socket, Zool, Kid Chaos, Awesome Possum, etc. it seemed like everyone was ripping him off. You can see a lasting influence in games like Crash Bandicoot (and even the commercials for Crash Bandicoot).

That has me curious, though, when exactly did the rip-offs start springing up? How many came before Sonic 2? While the first Sonic was successful and well-liked, most Sonic fans seem to think that the series really took off with 2. Perhaps it was Sonic 2 that really cemented the idea in the industry that Sonic's style was the future, making everybody want a piece of that pie.

In terms of influence, it's not really a fair comparison, though. Super Mario World had no chance of having the same kind of impact since it was the 4th in the series and just building off of past ideas. Sonic was brand new and fresh. The real Mario influence stems from the first Super Mario Bros., and perhaps 3 as well. Sonic itself wouldn't exist without the first Mario. Basically all platformers owe a little to Mario considering the genre was mostly nonexistent before that, so its influence stretches farther than Sonic's, just it's not coming from World.

[Emuaust]

J_factor brings up a great point regarding Mario games and the run Button, I also find myself holding that down the whole time I am playing. I wonder what it would of been like with a walk button instead.

[Gameguy]

I've got to go with Sonic 1 since I've played it more than Super Mario World. I just like it better.

[j_factor]

That has me curious, though, when exactly did the rip-offs start springing up? How many came before Sonic 2? While the first Sonic was successful and well-liked, most Sonic fans seem to think that the series really took off with 2. Perhaps it was Sonic 2 that really cemented the idea in the industry that Sonic's style was the future, making everybody want a piece of that pie.

Perhaps. It's a little complicated by the fact that Sonic 2 came only a year after the first (ok, maybe more like 16 months), and in terms of stylistic elements isn't very distinct from it. Also consider that there were two Sonic 1's, with the 8-bit version very popular in Europe. You could argue that all of these games were influenced by Sonic generally, rather than specifically Sonic the Hedgehog for Genesis.

But still, when I look at 2d platformers in general from ~1992 on, I see a lot more direct influence from Sonic than from Super Mario World, or Mario generally.


In terms of influence, it's not really a fair comparison, though. Super Mario World had no chance of having the same kind of impact since it was the 4th in the series and just building off of past ideas. Sonic was brand new and fresh. The real Mario influence stems from the first Super Mario Bros., and perhaps 3 as well. Sonic itself wouldn't exist without the first Mario. Basically all platformers owe a little to Mario considering the genre was mostly nonexistent before that, so its influence stretches farther than Sonic's, just it's not coming from World.

It's absolutely a fair comparison in my view. Some of the most influential games of all time are sequels. Super Mario 64 and Street Fighter II, for starters. Super Mario World has plenty of elements that could have been copied. They just weren't, at least not widely. The Donkey Kong Country series was definitely influenced by it. Not much else was.

Sonic wouldn't exist without Mario, but it was developed as a response to Mario, not as a game that was influenced by it. Super Mario Bros. itself was preceded by Pac-Land, Pitfall!, Jungle King, etc. and Legend of Kage came out around the same time. That's not to say that Super Mario Bros. wasn't highly influential, just not quite in the way that you're suggesting, IMO.

[Aussie2B]

If World had been vastly different from its predecessors like Street Fighter II and Super Mario 64 were, it could've perhaps been influential, but I just don't think it has enough original ideas to make any waves. In my eyes, it's basically a not-as-good version of Super Mario Bros. 3, with fancier graphics and a more pandering difficulty level. Yoshi is probably the most notable addition, yet even that isn't a far cry from, say, the dinosaurs in the Adventure Island series.

As for platformer influence, I'd say it's cumulative. All platformers that aimed to rip-off Sonic were still taking after Mario in a way as well. In some it was really obvious, like how Croc stole both Mario's ?-boxes AND Sonic's ring concept (except with gems).

[Ackman]

I didn't like SMW, it's just not nearly as good as SMB3, not even close. Sonic 1 was pretty good for the time but Sonic 2 blew it out of the water and everything else imho.

I thought that Sonic 3 kinda sucked but S&K more than made up for that.

[j_factor]

It doesn't matter if it had original ideas or not. Not all of the elements that made Sonic distinct and the source of much copying were original to it. Sonic borrowed from Castle of Illusion and Sega's own Psycho Fox. Yet, any elements of Psycho Fox that went on to be used in other games did so via Sonic, and we don't generally call anything a rip-off of Psycho Fox. Likewise, if a game plays and looks like Super Mario World, I'm going to say it was influenced by that, regardless of where those elements originally appeared.

More games from 1992 on used more thematic and sylistic and gameplay elements that appeared in Sonic the Hedgehog than in Super Mario World.

[substantial_snake]

Emotionally Sonic 1 hands down. It was one of my favorite games back when it was still new and it retains that spot today. I love the music, colorful design, and precise timing and reflexes needed to really nail a speed run in this game.

Objectively SMB World hands down. Its overall a longer and more challenging game that you can really sink your teeth into over time. There are tons of things to discover and explore where as in Sonic its mostly a linear affair you can complete in under an hour. I'm sure had I owned a SNES versus a Genesis back in the day their would be no contest in between these two games.

I honestly don't feel like its a fair comparison however based on comparing a polished title in a mature franchise versus a upcoming first title in a franchise. SMB World is IMO one of the best platformers ever and the best overall Mario game I've played and comparing the two just seems...weighted. A comparison between SMB World and Sonic 2 or Sonic 3 & Knuckles (yes its one damn game) would be much harder for me at least.

[Drixxel]

More games from 1992 on used more thematic and sylistic and gameplay elements that appeared in Sonic the Hedgehog than in Super Mario World.
There was certainly a dearth of mascot-focused platformers that followed in Sonic's wake and, yeah, it was as much their marketing that bears a resemblance to Sonic as their overall design. Attempts at a franchise-building hero had obviously been tried before but Sonic and his "attitude" ushered in a particular kind of '90s fad. While there's the occasional game like Kid Chameleon which straddles the line between Sonic's "cool" and Mario's "sprawl", the majority of attempts that come to mind include the likes of Aero the Acro-bat, Bubsy, and Zero the Kamikaze Squirrel which are more about aping Sonic's attitude than anything.

Sonic was certainly influential but it's hard to say if that influence is warmly regarded when you consider the mascot detritus that it spawned.

[NerdXCrewWill]

Was I the only one who found that Super Mario World was a much faster game overall? Sure, Sonic runs really fast . . . for like one level. As someone else mentioned, Sonic slows to a complete crawl in many levels of the original five games. The Sonic Advance series, on the other hand, keeps up the pace much better.

Sonic 1 doesn't really have anything nearly as interesting as Super Mario World, in terms of level design. I will admit though, that Sonic does seem to have a lot less linear levels because they involve more layers of platforms vertically than the majority of SMW's levels. I think the level design suffers from slowdown. Sonic's movement is based around momentum, but most of the time you don't have much space to run before you encounter something that stops you. Much of the gameplay is stop and go.

I think Sonic CD stands up to Super Mario World's level design much better. It's still not as good, though.

[crazyjackcsa]

Was I the only one who found that Super Mario World was a much faster game overall? Sure, Sonic runs really fast . . . for like one level. As someone else mentioned, Sonic slows to a complete crawl in many levels of the original five games. The Sonic Advance series, on the other hand, keeps up the pace much better.

Sonic 1 doesn't really have anything nearly as interesting as Super Mario World, in terms of level design. I will admit though, that Sonic does seem to have a lot less linear levels because they involve more layers of platforms vertically than the majority of SMW's levels. I think the level design suffers from slowdown. Sonic's movement is based around momentum, but most of the time you don't have much space to run before you encounter something that stops you. Much of the gameplay is stop and go.

I think Sonic CD stands up to Super Mario World's level design much better. It's still not as good, though.

Yes, yes you were. As was pointed out, some people use Mario's run as the default speed ( I am one of them) I will grant you that Super Mario World offers more unique stages, but from a level to level basis, there is far more going on in Sonic's world. Multiple paths for each level, multiple switch point in each level to (to travel from various paths, )

More frequent boss fights, the search for rings to access special stages, a sweet reward for completing the special stages (In Sonic 2 and beyond).

Sonic and Mario is a battle for the ages, that's for sure.

[treismac]

I never fell for Sonic the way I did for Super Mario World. While I enjoy Sonic, I absolutely love Super Mario World. The addition of the cape and Yoshi filled the Mario universe with awe once again, and the ability to save made exploration of the game a savory mission as you unlock the game's many secrets. I think my love of the past Marios greatly impacted my affection for the fourth (at least in America, right?) in the series. I had history with Mario. Sonic? There was no nostalgia there nor highly anticipated return of an old friend. In fact, the whole "cool" angle Sega tried to market Sonic with as their new edgy mascot struck me as lame. A fun game? Yes. But no Mario. Sonic is, however, a very visually attractive flagship that, unfortunately, lead Sega to where it is today.

[The 1 2 P]

I'd have to say Sonic, mainly because I've hardly played Super Mario World and the parts I did play didn't give me the impression it was a better game than Sonic. One day I'll have to play thru the entire game.

[Leo_A]

I've always felt like Super Mario World was the much better game of the two. I've replayed that countless times over the years to 100% completion, but have only bothered playing through Sonic a few times over the years (And just once with all the emeralds).

[exit]

I was never a big fan of Sonic, I enjoyed playing the games, but it didn't always "do it" for me. I guess because the games sometimes felt cheap to me and had a hard time playing them at a younger age as a result. I was always a bigger Mario fan anyway and enjoyed just about every Mario game that's been released, so naturally I'll have to go with SMW.

[kedawa]

I think Sonic just felt more like an arcade game.

[Rob2600]

I received an SNES for Christmas in 1991 and loved Super Mario World. I was a huge fan of the NES trilogy and had high expectations. Super Mario World lived up to all of them.

A year later, I finally played Sonic the Hedgehog on my friend's Genesis. After all the huge hype, I was disappointed. I kept asking him, "How do I go really fast like in the commercial??" I guess Sega's commercials were misleading. :(

Looking back, I'd say Super Mario World is a well thought-out, finely-crafted classic, whereas Sonic the Hedgehog is a standard platformer that happened to be backed by Sega's marketing.

[Baloo]

Sonic 1 for me. While I've played through both games to completion, Super Mario World never really tickled my fancy. The game is a bit TOO long for a Mario game, and the levels are just kind of...boring. I prefer Super Mario Bros. 3 in that aspect. That's not to say it's a bad game, just not my favorite entry in the Mario series.

Sonic 1 on the other hand is one of my favorite games in the Sonic series. The levels are a good balance of speed and puzzle/platforming elements, and it brings something a bit fresher to the table in comparison to most of the platformers of it's time, like Kid Chameleon, and M.C. Kids, and the Mario series, etc. etc. There's just something about Sonic 1 that's very fun, vibrant, and cool.

[Rob2600]

Super Mario World never really tickled my fancy. The game is a bit TOO long for a Mario game, and the levels are just kind of...boring. I prefer Super Mario Bros. 3 in that aspect.

Too long? One reason I like Super Mario World more than SMB3 is its save feature. That makes a huge difference. Even as a child, I rarely had the time (or patience) to make it all the way through SMB3 in one sitting.

And I'd say without warping, SMB3 probably takes as long to beat.

[crazyjackcsa]

Hard to believe that 20 years later, we're still fighting about this. Good to see everybody sticking hard to their favorite without conceding that both are great games that offer a unique experience.

[tom]

SMW was easy, Sonic 1 was not, weird me, but I like easy games.

[jwmollman]

I grew up with Super Mario World, so I'll have to vote for that one. I like the idea of replaying levels, the massive world, the different "areas" of levels down the pipes, etc.

I always knew Sonic existed, but we never had a Genesis when I was a kid, so I never had the chance to really see what the game was like. I really only had the chance to play at dentist's offices or something. I only started getting into Sonic (still not as much as Super Mario World) until a few years ago when I began collecting. But still, my vote goes to Super Mario World.

[NayusDante]

I really only had the chance to play at dentist's offices or something.

What is it with dentists and the Genesis? That was my exposure to Sonic as well...

Sonic definitely has more precise timing, and for me that's actually a minus. I much prefer the freedom of motion you have in SMW. You can be good at SMW and not just be hitting the right buttons on a schedule, it's more reactive.

[RPG_Fanatic]

If you asked me in 1991 I would have said Sonic but now playing both I would have to say Mario is a shit load better.

[retroman]

Wow..a hard choice...I love both games, but i will give it to Sonic because it took Sega and the Genesis to a new level which it really was kicking Nintendo's butt. The graphics were the best for the Genny at that time, the gameplay was easy for anyone to pickup, but hard to put down..

[Nz17]

Sonic The Hedgehog was technically better. I also liked it better back then. But Mario World has much higher replayability, level count, and has held up better with time.

I've played Sonic 1 a ton, and deservedly so. But after all these years of playing it, if given a choice I'd play Mario World just because it has more levels, you can easily replay any level you want, and I've played it for a total of less hours than Sonic 1.

[starchildskiss78]

This question is as easy to answer for me now as it was in late 1991. I absolutely loved Mario and his adventures. I remember reading about the Super Nintendo and Super Mario World in Nintendo Power. I chose a Genesis over the Super Nintendo for reasons unknown (maybe it had not come out quite yet? I remember Sonic The Hedgehog recently came out and Altered Beast bundles were still available at Service Merchandise. I actually requested that bundle over the Sonic bundle.)

The Mario games always seemed like an subtle evolution over the previous games in the series. I finally beat Super Mario World 17 years after its release, but I had fun doing so. It has been 20 years since Sonic came out and I still can't beat the game. It isn't for lack of trying. The graphics are nice, the tunes are memorable, and the concept is not bad. I just don't have the patience to beat it. I think it has something to do with needing to get the emeralds to get a "good" ending. I detest any game that forces you to ultra-super-mega beat the game to beat it. I could have (and did the first time) beat Super Mario World with the shortest route possible without getting all the stars and I still won the game and got the ending I deserved.

I guess Mario's games are more rewarding...

[genesisguy]

Sonic 1. It made me want a Genesis for Christmas. I had an NES with Mario 1,2, and 3 already and what I had seen and played of SMW felt like a step in the wrong direction at that time and it still does today. Sonic 1 is still fun to play through to this day whereas if I want classic Mario I go for the NES and either SMB1, 2, or 3.

[Sneak613]

Too long? One reason I like Super Mario World more than SMB3 is its save feature. That makes a huge difference. Even as a child, I rarely had the time (or patience) to make it all the way through SMB3 in one sitting.

And I'd say without warping, SMB3 probably takes as long to beat.

I agree. The save feature was a huge thing for me too. I also agree totally with your opinion on getting through SMB3 without warping takes a long time.

As for my take on this debate, I'll take Super Mario World over Sonic any day.

I'll give Sega credit, and conceed that Sonic was great for them, and gave them a character to market and create games, but nothing will convince me that it was better than SMW.

As I mentioned, loved the save feature, the way you could finish levels in different ways to open different 'paths' on the overhead map. So many hours of enjoyment with that game. :) I still play it today on occasion.

...In fact, recently I finaly 'ponied up' some money, and ordered a reproduction cart (hack of SMW) "Super Mario World: Return to Dinosaur Land"... I'm hoping I have as much fun with it as I did the original.

[PresidentLeever]

It has been 20 years since Sonic came out and I still can't beat the game. It isn't for lack of trying. The graphics are nice, the tunes are memorable, and the concept is not bad. I just don't have the patience to beat it. I think it has something to do with needing to get the emeralds to get a "good" ending. I detest any game that forces you to ultra-super-mega beat the game to beat it. I could have (and did the first time) beat Super Mario World with the shortest route possible without getting all the stars and I still won the game and got the ending I deserved.

I guess Mario's games are more rewarding...

Not as much as I detest a gamer judging a game that he hasn't beat :P And how did you know about the different endings?
Seriously, the ending you get without collecting everything is fine, it's not that hard to get the emeralds once you know the levels and the reward is minor. It's very much an optional thing for some added replay value. Furthermore it shouldn't take more than an hour of your time to get through it without them.

It seems to me like you just skipped through SMW anyway, so what was so rewarding? Finding secret levels is a big part of the challenge in that game, and anyone can beat it.

[ReaXan]

Sonic 1 was good, but not great. A game like Rocket Knight Adventures would have held up better against Mario as a pak in title.

[NeoZeedeater]

As an aside, I think it's interesting that Super Mario World has a somewhat better critical reputation
It only has a better critical reputation in recent years. In 1991, Sonic got more positive attention from the press. I think nowadays respect for the 16-bit Sonics has decreased because people are unfairly letting the last decade of shitty Sonic games affect their judgement, not to mention the current media's bias for Nintendo when talking of the past.

I love Sonic 1 and SMW. They're both among my favourite platformers but Sonic wins this round. The wiki entry on platform games sums up nicely why it impressed me more.


1990 marked the release of the Super NES, along with the much awaited Super Mario World. In order to fend off the new competition, Sega released Sonic the Hedgehog.[46][47] Whereas Nintendo's offering featured a conservative design, true to the Mario tradition, Sonic showcased a new style of design made possible by a new generation of hardware. Sonic featured large fields that scrolled effortlessly in all directions, as well as all manner of uneven terrain, curved hills, and a complex physics system that allowed players to rush through its levels with well-placed jumps and rolls.
Combine that innovation with it also being a more artistically striking game. I love SMW's exploration elements but the level design is pretty inconsistent. There are a lot of filler parts. Aside from Labyrinth Zone's annoying water, Sonic 1's level design is top notch.

[ReaXan]

Combine that innovation with it also being a more artistically striking game. I love SMW's exploration elements but the level design is pretty inconsistent. There are a lot of filler parts. Aside from Labyrinth Zone's annoying water, Sonic 1's level design is top notch.

Sonic 1's level design is good but you couldn't do the best Sonic move(down spin) until part 2. That downspin is what made Sonic to me.

[123►Genei-Jin]

Sonic for me.
I had an SNES back then and loved SMW, but Sonic's level design felt more compelling to me.
I can't say anything bad about SMW really, I just think level design gets too simplistic over time.
I simply have more fun playing Sonic than SMW.

[VG_Maniac]

I consider Super Mario World to be the better game. While Sonic 1 was a more revolutionary game at the time and felt more "fresh", Super Mario World just gave you a lot more bang for your buck. It was much longer and has much better replay value. Plus, I've always preferred the gameplay of the Mario series over Sonic (although I still love the classic Sonic series).

[crazyjackcsa]

Interesting that everybody picks up on the fact that Mario was a more refined game, and it was. But If you look at how far Sonic came in just a few short years, Sonic 3 and Knuckles more than compares to Mario. It has the length, mutiple characters, 3 different styles of play, different routes to take, multiple special and bonus stages, 14 chaos emeralds, it really is incredible.

[starchildskiss78]

Not as much as I detest a gamer judging a game that he hasn't beat :P And how did you know about the different endings?
Seriously, the ending you get without collecting everything is fine, it's not that hard to get the emeralds once you know the levels and the reward is minor. It's very much an optional thing for some added replay value. Furthermore it shouldn't take more than an hour of your time to get through it without them.

It seems to me like you just skipped through SMW anyway, so what was so rewarding? Finding secret levels is a big part of the challenge in that game, and anyone can beat it.

I know about the different endings from vgmuseum. I think getting the emeralds may be easy for some but I still concede that the ending is not as rewarding to the player if you don't get all the emeralds. Watching Eggman/Robotnik juggle the emeralds at the end is a kick in the pants.

Oh, and you're entitled to your opinion about someone who hasn't finished the game, but I played far enough to know I am not a fan.

As for Super Mario World, I played every stage and looked for every secret exit to completely beat the game. The autumn theme you get after beating the game is nifty.

[aryoshi]

Think I'm going to go with Super Mario World. I love Sonic The Hedgehog, it was and still is amazing, but comparing the two, I think SMW definitely dominates it. It was much lengthier, there's tons of levels and multiple exits for several, tons of great characters, and best of all? Yoshi!

[treismac]

Looking back, I'd say Super Mario World is a well thought-out, finely-crafted classic, whereas Sonic the Hedgehog is a standard platformer that happened to be backed by Sega's marketing.

Well said, sir.

[PresidentLeever]

I know about the different endings from vgmuseum. I think getting the emeralds may be easy for some but I still concede that the ending is not as rewarding to the player if you don't get all the emeralds. Watching Eggman/Robotnik juggle the emeralds at the end is a kick in the pants.


OK well, what I'd like to know is a gameplay-related reason not to like Sonic 1, I don't see how a three frame animation after the credits could swing someones overall opinion either way. The reward in both these games lies mainly in the enjoyment of beating the levels and collecting stuff, not so much the story/cutscenes.

I was replying to your argument about SMW being easier to beat and still get a good ending (didn't know there were different ones), which I don't see how it makes the game more rewarding when there's less effort involved.

[goatdan]

I always thought that the cape was a wonderful expansion of the raccoon suit. You could stay in the air a lot longer with the cape, from one end of a level to another if your flying skills were good :D

To me, the cape highlights everything that was wrong with SMW compared to SMB3. The thing that I love about SMB1 and SMB3 is that the controls are extremely simple -- you almost never have an issue with a learning curve, no matter what is going on. And, as the levels get more difficult, you can rely on how they always act. It makes experimenting with what is really a limited set of tools to find the secrets that much more rewarding.

With SMW, between the cape and Yoshi just for instance, you have SO much needless complexity. You're right -- if you're good at the cape you can practically fly from one end of the level to the other. But that is what bugged me and still bugs me about the game -- you had to overcome a serious learning curve for the special things to be able to use them to the full ability. Instead of walking up and knowing exactly what that particular item does, you have to remember what color Yoshi does what and so on.

From the first moment I played SMW, it bothered me that they took the series in that direction. I still find it a decent game, although no where near as good as SMB1 or SMB3.

Back in the day, I also thought that Sonic had a ton of flaws. It was fun to watch, but felt like total luck when playing it. I never liked that the speed impacted your ability to react to things, and it became all about memorization.

It wasn't until Donkey Kong Country that I really felt like this was addressed well by a platformer on either console. So, to me -- the answer for this question is neither.

[Leo_A]

With how optional flying and using the special capabilities of the Yoshi's were, I really don't see how either is much of a problem. You could play through this game nearly from end to end with ease and just utilize the standard capabilities you've had since the first Super Mario Brothers. I can't think of any areas that required you to fly and only one area in the Special World where I believe you all but need the blue Yoshi's flying capabilities to reach the goal.

And it's not like you'd ever be specifically be seeking out a yellow Yoshi (Creates a small earthquake after eating any colored Koopa shell)) or red Yoshi (Shoots fireballs after eating any colored Koopa shell).

[Emperor Megas]

I was a huge fan of the NES trilogy and had high expectations. Super Mario World lived up to all of them...

...Looking back, I'd say Super Mario World is a well thought-out, finely-crafted classic, whereas Sonic the Hedgehog is a standard platformer that happened to be backed by Sega's marketing.These are my feelings as well, and pretty much a case closer.

[goatdan]

With how optional flying and using the special capabilities of the Yoshi's were, I really don't see how either is much of a problem. You could play through this game nearly from end to end with ease and just utilize the standard capabilities you've had since the first Super Mario Brothers.

No, but that's my point -- the special abilities are not as easy to use as the original capabilities from the earlier games. You didn't need to find the white mushroom houses in SMB3 either, but to me -- unlike in SMW -- when you have that challenge the controls are SO easy to master that it needs simply skill and reflex to react to the levels to win, while SMW needs a lot more mastering of the controls to do the special things.

To me -- and again, I *totally* get why some people like that -- this destroyed the charm of the SMB games being extremely simple, but requiring you to be very creative to find all of the cool little nooks and crannies where the secrets were. Endless 1Ups at the Goomba pipes on Level 1-2 on SMB3 is a perfect example -- I can pull off that trick easily just by playing around with the controls, whereas I don't think I could do something similar with SMW and the cape because it is so much more precise about how many different things the cape can do.

I don't know if that makes any sense, but again -- in reply to the OP - Donkey Kong Country!

[Leo_A]

The cape really isn't that complicated. Hold Y to run and press B to take off. No need to keep pressing a button to fly upwards like in SMB3.

From there, your only options are to either keep pressing left or right in a rhythm (Whichever is the opposite direction you're moving) if you want to fly horizontally, up on the d-pad if you want to dive, down if you want to soar upwards, or keep B pressed in if you want to glide back down (Far simpler than constantly hitting a button to wag your tail to glide down like in SMB3).

It's no more complicated than SMB3. In fact, other than the extremely easy to learn technique for horizontal flight (Which is 100% optional in this game), the cape controls are easier and more sensible than SMB3's raccoon tail is to use, if you ask me.

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree.

[SpaceHarrier]

Super Mario World. Even though I love Sonic, the game that made me need a Sega Genesis, there is just so much to do in SMW.

I'd take Sonic 2 over SMW, though.

[Zebbe]

Sonic 1. Much better graphics and music, and I prefer the faster gameplay as well. It's not a standard platformer, they were much slower and less animated up to that point. Sonic's design has hills, loops and multiple paths, which are all worthy of mention as well. I'd take SMB3 over SMW any day as well, the worlds were so much more imaginary there.

[NerdXCrewWill]

When I was 5 years old, I could fly easily with Mario's cape and his tail. I never thought it was complex at all. Everyone I've ever put in front of Super Mario World has picked it up easily, including other 5 year olds (at least well enough to get through the level, although maybe not well enough to fly past everything). Super Mario World is hardly complex. There are more secrets that require some extra skill, but that was hardly mandatory.

Since I'm talking about my experiences as a kid, I figure I'll add something about Sonic 1. Sonic's momentum based running was really tough for me. I had to back up to get running starts to get through loops. I really disliked that aspect as a kid, as well as the slow as molasses walking throughout much of the game. Luckily Sonic 2 and Sonic CD fixed that. I think those two games are both much better than Sonic 1.

Also, I still stand by my belief that Super Mario World allows you to move through the levels faster than Sonic 1. The running just isn't as fast as Sonic's when you're moving full speed.

[PresidentLeever]

^Agreed on your last paragraph, SMW is the overall faster/better flowing game. Besides the lack of spindash in Sonic 1, the controls when turning are less responsive (fixed in later games), there are several parts where you're just waiting for objects to move (elevators in Spring Yard, floating blocks in Marble Zone etc.) and the game slows to a crawl during the underwater sections.

Nowadays if I want to play Sonic 1, I go for the romhack that lets me play as Tails as he can swim, spindash and even fly past some of the slower parts.

[starchildskiss78]

OK well, what I'd like to know is a gameplay-related reason not to like Sonic 1, I don't see how a three frame animation after the credits could swing someones overall opinion either way. The reward in both these games lies mainly in the enjoyment of beating the levels and collecting stuff, not so much the story/cutscenes.

I was replying to your argument about SMW being easier to beat and still get a good ending (didn't know there were different ones), which I don't see how it makes the game more rewarding when there's less effort involved.

I wasn't quite clear about the SMW bit. I didn't get to the end of the game taking the route where I skipped the special stages or alternate paths. I put the game down for a while (after getting to about World 5) and started from scratch. I may be being a stickler, but I do like to enjoy the ending of a game after putting forth so much effort to beat it.

My opinions between Sonic 1 and SMW are mostly just a matter of preference it seems. SMW was vibrant, colorful, and contained memorable enemies. Sonic 1 had beautiful stages and catchy music, but I felt like the speed and spinning was just a gimmick. Half the time I would be speeding along and get hit by an enemy! And I still stand by my stance that the story in Sonic 1 seems more contrived than SMW. Yes, Mario has saved Princess Peach's bacon two times before SMW but I guess I enjoy saving her.

Bottom line...it's a matter of preference. We don't have to share opinions on something. Sometimes our reasoning may not seem rational, but after 21 years since my exposure to Mario and the NES I still love Nintendo to the core.

Happy gaming my friend...play whatever causes you the most enjoyment! :)

[PresidentLeever]

Bottom line...it's a matter of preference. We don't have to share opinions on something. Sometimes our reasoning may not seem rational, but after 21 years since my exposure to Mario and the NES I still love Nintendo to the core.

Happy gaming my friend...play whatever causes you the most enjoyment! :)

Sure, and I don't mind that. I'm just here for the discussion and maybe finding a new angle on these games that have been talked about to death. I can definitely see where you're coming from regarding Sonic.

Same to you man :)

[goatdan]

The cape really isn't that complicated. Hold Y to run and press B to take off. No need to keep pressing a button to fly upwards like in SMB3.

From there, your only options are to either keep pressing left or right in a rhythm (Whichever is the opposite direction you're moving) if you want to fly horizontally, up on the d-pad if you want to dive, down if you want to soar upwards, or keep B pressed in if you want to glide back down (Far simpler than constantly hitting a button to wag your tail to glide down like in SMB3).

It's no more complicated than SMB3. In fact, other than the extremely easy to learn technique for horizontal flight (Which is 100% optional in this game), the cape controls are easier and more sensible than SMB3's raccoon tail is to use, if you ask me.

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree.

Deal on the agreeing to disagree. For my part, the hitting the button on SMB3 allows you to make very precise drops in altitude which I felt like was impossible with SMW's cape. I played with it a lot -- I've beaten SMW multiple times -- but I've never felt like I could do everything with the cape that I could with the Raccoon Tail.

Man, all this talk makes me want to play SMB3 again :)

[chrisbid]

sonic the hedgehog had more to do with the success of the genesis than smw did with the success of the snes. in 1991 mario was stale, and nintendo was tired of him. in fact, it took nearly another 20 years before nintendo would release another console 2d mario game. the staleness of smw is one of the reasons why the snes stumbled out of the gate after launch.

sonic the hedgehog was a breath of fresh air in 1991. it legitimized sega as a real player in the industry. marketing alone can never sell a game, it can only provide a spark. when a game goes into the sales stratosphere like sonic the hedgehog (pulling up with it the install base of the sega genesis), the quality of the game is the workhorse.

in 1991, sonic the hedgehog was the better game. it sold better than smw, and it pushed more consoles sales than smw. people bought sega genesis consoles to play sonic the hedgehog the same way people bought NESs to play super mario bros 5 years earlier. people didnt start buying SNESs in big numbers until Street Fighter II was released.

in 2011, sonic and sega are laughing stocks and it is easy to forget that they were ever on top of the world. add to that modern gaming sensibilities (games should be easy, games should save progress, ability to grind, etc), then smw is the better game. but an old schooler like myself still appreciates how fun sonic the hedgehog is... with my limited time to play games, going back and whipping through the original sonic and collecting all the emeralds is still quite the challenge.

super mario world feels like a chore, i love to play through the first world, but things start to get dull in world 2. and with the ability to save, and go back and grind for lives and what not, there is no sense of danger of me losing all of my lives.

[Kevincal]

That's well said, I kinda feel that way too. The other thing Nintendo messed up on in 1991 was trying to sell their system with SMW at a higher price than the Genesis with Sonic. That is why I chose a Genesis with Sonic over a SNES with SMW. I can't remember the exact about but it was something like $25-50 more for the SNES SMW bundle. If they had been the same price I would have gone with the SNES bundle. I even remember one of my parents asking me "you sure you dont want the new nintendo system?" Heh. One thing is for sure I like Mario Bros. 3 more than SMW.

When you think about it, SMW and Sonic & Knuckles have a lot of similarities, 4th game in the series and getting to the point that the series is becoming tired and worn out and too similar to the previous game in the series to really have a wow factor. Sonic definitely had that wow factor. So much so that Sonic alone took hardcore NES gamers and turned them into Sega Sonic lovers, like me. :) I went running back to Nintendo when the N64 came out though lol. I never gave the Saturn a chance. :P

[Rob2600]

in 1991 mario was stale, and nintendo was tired of him. in fact, it took nearly another 20 years before nintendo would release another console 2d mario game.

I'm not sure where you're getting your "facts" from, but Super Mario World 2: Yoshi's Island was released four years after SMW in North America, not 20.

And if Nintendo thought the Mario series was stale and tired, why did it pour so much effort into Super Mario 64? Your post makes no sense.

[Leo_A]

I'm not sure where you're getting your "facts" from, but Super Mario World 2: Yoshi's Island was released four years after SMW in North America, not 20.

I think despite the tag line at the end of the title, most people consider Yoshi's Island its own series rather than entries in the 2D Super Mario platforming lineup. I know that's how I feel and that's the impression I've gotten from forums like this over the years,

Anyways, it isn't correct even if you take that point of view. Super Mario Land 2 was very much a traditional Mario platformer and was released after Super Mario World was. In fact, it even took several elements from Super Mario World and it's quite clear that that they took a lot of inspiration from it (The world map, alternate exits, the Mario sprite, the feather is a bit like the cape was, the midpoint level markers, etc.).

But after that, I think most people agree that we didn't get another one until New Super Mario Brothers was released on the DS.

[chrisbid]

- i did use the word console in my description. as good as handheld titles can be, even AAA handheld titles are not given the resources of their console older cousins

- super mario world 2 is not a proper mario game despite the title

[chrisbid]

I'm not sure where you're getting your "facts" from, but Super Mario World 2: Yoshi's Island was released four years after SMW in North America, not 20.

And if Nintendo thought the Mario series was stale and tired, why did it pour so much effort into Super Mario 64? Your post makes no sense.

they put all of their effort into 3D mario, a completely different style of game from the first 4 super mario bros games. nintendo thought 2D mario bros games were stale. it showed in super mario world, and it furthered showed in the fact that they didnt make another one until the late 00's.

[Leo_A]

- i did use the word console in my description.

Sorry about that, I missed that the first time around.

[SonicBoom]

Look at my name and take a guess.

[ReaXan]

I think Sonic 2 was the real competitor to Super Mario World even though it was released a year after the SNES. Most people I knew didn't even start getting a SNES/Genesis until 92-93 and even up to 1995/1996 in some cases.


Sonic 3 is obviously the best Sonic in the series and Mario eventually dominates Sonic after the 16 bit era but Super Mario World didn't age well for me. Sonic 2 was a slightly better experience as a child compared to Super Mario World.

Also would have also been nice if Sega would have pushed the Sparkster/Rocket Knight Adventure character more, basically having it so there were more games with him and have commericals where he and Sonic team up and put Mario in a garbage can like that he is "old news" or something.Even make a crossover game with Sonic and Sparkster. Sega could have made a few harder hits on Nintendo looking back.

Basically there wasnt enough Mario content on the SNES while we got alot of mostly good Sonic content.. SMW2 came late in the SNES's life, which was around the time I started getting into the Playstation.