Mass effect 3 ending?

[c0ldb33r]

I've never played a mass effect game and never will, so I'm not concerned about spoilers.

What's the deal with the ME3 ending? I've read online that there's some real brouhaha about how crappy it is.

What's the deal with it?

[Spidey80]

Well,I guess the ending is so bad that someone is actually complaining to the Federal Trade Comission about it,believe it or not

[Gamereviewgod]

The short of it is that choice is taken away from the player. The decisions made at the end of the game don't matter because the ending is effectively the same no matter what choices were made. That betrays the whole idea of the series in the first place.

But complaining to the FTC? Yeah... no.

However, I'm glad to see people finally speaking up. That's what consumers should do. Kudos to all fighting back a bit -except the guy taking it to a government level.

[ubersaurus]

I really liked it. I consider it a thoughtful and appropriate ending to Shepard's adventures, in the vein of something from Arthur Clarke or Stanislaw Lem. It wasn't a happy ending and it wasn't one that explained every detail of what happens next; rather, all of the endings leave you thinking to yourself what's going to happen next.

I argue that everything you did in the game did matter, since the journey is just as important as the ending, and even if it doesn't show it, everyone you saved is still alive and kicking thanks to whatever your final decision is. I've seen some people complain about that last decision point because they didn't like any of those options, but honestly at that point your character is bleeding out and in no condition to argue for a fourth way. And there are changes based on your decisions and effectively how high your readiness numbers are - whether or not you fail, or Earth blows up, or you survive, etc. so I mean, it's not like your decisions are entirely bereft of changing it.

Much as I'd like to see Shepard retire someplace tropical with his buddies, that trilogy could not have ended that story any other way than it did and still tell an interesting tale. Enough video games have the hero overcome all odds and live to gloat about it. Too many people are up in arms because one game had effective enough writing to make them care about everything, and now their character (probably) does not survive to see it. As someone who enjoys a good tragedy, a thoughtful story, and the belief that games can tell one as powerful as any other medium, I don't see the problem.

[Dangerboy]

*** THERE ARE SPOILERS IN THIS POST. YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED. ***

I can help.

As one of the few who thought the ending(s) was fine, essentially the problem isn't that "all the endings were the same", but more that there wasn't exactly closure for any of the relationships you had built up. There is a pretty definite end to the galaxy's / earth's storyline, and truth be told, 2 / 3 times Shepard's storyline. The bigger problem comes in play when the video segments that are supposed to represent what happened in each part are a bit too vague for their own good. Secondly, the ending, in all three of its variants, are not the same.

a. All the decisions made up to Mass Effect 3, relationships aside, are handled and taken care of during the process of the game. Many of these end up being a War Asset (which you accumulate to essentially decide how your ending choice plays out). Even minor little, practically toss-away moments from the first 2 games and their DLC come into play (example: Liara's father is revealed thanks to a 4 second choice in Lair of the Shadow Broker's "After Game" area). Already on my 3rd play-through, the amount of what is truly represented and activated from the previous games is staggering.

b. The ending(s) should in no way have been a surprise to anyone - from the first time you speak with Sovereign in ME1, the fact that the in-game's "cycle of life" will continue no matter what happens, humans or not, reapers or not. Through-out the entire ME3 experience, death and the cycle ending is all you hear about. A Prothean VI, late, late into the game even shows the a 'cycle-pattern' that reflects the locations of all the Mass Relays. Having destroyed one relay in ME2's "The Arrival" to slow down the reaper invasion, it was never off the table that the other relays wouldn't be destroyed. It is also made abundantly clear that the cycle will be restarted by the time the game ends. It's simply never stated "how" the cycle will be restarted.

c. The endings are all different in what the repercussions of the action are - not the action itself.

Essentially, in all three endings, Shepard (your character) ignites a giant prothean design device that triggers an event, then in the process destroys all the mass relays, leaving everyone in the galaxy where they are, scattered across the stars.

Note that Earth surviving in any of this is based on the War Asset collection.

Choice 1 - You essentially obliterate yourself into the giant evil machines and take control of them. You end up sacrificing a teammate, save a race of sentient machines, and die.

Choice 2. You destroy the device, but in doing so destroy all synthetic life in the universe. You sacrifice a teammate, the sapient machines, the other race known as the Geth, and technically yourself, due to implants. If your War Assets are high enough, you get a small clip of Shepard's chest showing him / her breathing again.

Choice 3. You throw yourself into the Machine's Core, and combine with it. Due to your implants, you cause the machine to completely rewrite the DNA of life, so that synthetic and organic are now one cohesive being. According to the game, this is the final evolution of life. You sacrifice yourself, but save your teammate, save the sapient race, and the Geth race.

The other problem came in the presentation: You're essentially being presented the final choices by a VI of the device's 'owner'. The VI Looks like a child Shepard sees die in the beginning of the game, and constantly has nightmares over.

Like I said, I loved the ending (I choose, and always choose 3). The biggest problem is just the closure of relationships in the game. But seriously, who expects a happy ending when half the galaxy is burning?

[LaughingMAN.S9]

http://cdn.memegenerator.net/instances/400x/15992406.jpg

[Rev. Link]

I loved the way it ended (I chose to destroy the Reapers, coincidentally), though I would have liked a little more info on what happened to everyone after. I'm guessing there'll be some kind of DLC epilogue.

But I can't understand these people complaining about it. I mean sure, if you don't like the ending then I get why you'd be upset. Endings are hard things to write. Look at Lost. How many long running series, be they shows or movies or games or books, have polarizing endings? You can't please everyone. But this is the first time I've heard of people making petitions and whatnot demanding the ending be changed. If I was in charge of Bioware, I'd make some DLC, tell them it's their new ending, charge $10 for it. Then when they play it, it's just a shot of all the guys at Bioware giving the finger. I mean damn. "Retake Mass Effect"? It was never yours to begin with, you ungrateful turds! It's Bioware's story! They gave us something really special, allowing us to make some major choices about how we wanted the story to play out along the way, and when it's all over we repay them by demanding they change it. Sickening. The sense of entitlement these people have.

They remind me of all the folks who keep whining, "George Lucas raped my childhood!"

[heybtbm]

I thought the ending was great. The final decision you have to make is probably the most epic choice in the history of video games. 3 games/5 years lead up to that one point. THAT is the definition of epic IMO.

MINOR SPOILER

Besides, the criticism about the ending not offering enough "closure" is silly. The entire last act of the game is one big "goodbye" from Shepard. You literally hear "Goodbye/Goodluck" from just about every character over the 3 games in the last 1/2 hour of the game. What more do people want?

[Gamereviewgod]

I mean damn. "Retake Mass Effect"? It was never yours to begin with, you ungrateful turds! It's Bioware's story! They gave us something really special, allowing us to make some major choices about how we wanted the story to play out along the way, and when it's all over we repay them by demanding they change it. Sickening. The sense of entitlement these people have.

They remind me of all the folks who keep whining, "George Lucas raped my childhood!"

Damn those consumers who spent $180 on a trilogy and are unhappy with it. :roll:

No one has any allegiance to a developer. We don't "repay" them, they provide us with a product. It's not entitlement to express displeasure with it. In fact, it's what consumers are supposed to do. Bioware would be wise to acknowledge the complaints considering how many are (rightfully) speaking up. They're a business, and goodwill towards the fan base is valuable.

[LaughingMAN.S9]

i actually didnt hate the ending i was just more upset that they didnt really show what happens to the rest of your team members that survived, that was really all i would have asked for, like a 10 minute metal gear solid 4 ending lol


i gave them a couple of hundred hours of my life spread across 3 games, the least they could have done was give me 10 minutes back lol


*spoiler alert*

also there were kind of minor plot holes or just random stupid shit at the end which kind of made me say "wtf" at the end, case in point: how the fuck did the illusive man just magically appear out of nowhere already inside the reaper, also the whole reaper taking the form of the little kid she witnessed dying in the begining without any sort of explanation was just stupid,

[LaughingMAN.S9]

I loved the way it ended (I chose to destroy the Reapers, coincidentally), though I would have liked a little more info on what happened to everyone after. I'm guessing there'll be some kind of DLC epilogue.

But I can't understand these people complaining about it. I mean sure, if you don't like the ending then I get why you'd be upset. Endings are hard things to write. Look at Lost. How many long running series, be they shows or movies or games or books, have polarizing endings? You can't please everyone. But this is the first time I've heard of people making petitions and whatnot demanding the ending be changed. If I was in charge of Bioware, I'd make some DLC, tell them it's their new ending, charge $10 for it. Then when they play it, it's just a shot of all the guys at Bioware giving the finger. I mean damn. "Retake Mass Effect"? It was never yours to begin with, you ungrateful turds! It's Bioware's story! They gave us something really special, allowing us to make some major choices about how we wanted the story to play out along the way, and when it's all over we repay them by demanding they change it. Sickening. The sense of entitlement these people have.

They remind me of all the folks who keep whining, "George Lucas raped my childhood!"


people are entitled to what they paid for, if you paid money for something you were unhappy with, should you just grin and bare it and write the loss off or knowing the influence the consumer has now more than ever to effect change, excercise that power to get what you think is fair, whatever that may be

[ubersaurus]

i actually didnt hate the ending i was just more upset that they didnt really show what happens to the rest of your team members that survived, that was really all i would have asked for, like a 10 minute metal gear solid 4 ending lol


i gave them a couple of hundred hours of my life spread across 3 games, the least they could have done was give me 10 minutes back lol


*spoiler alert*

also there were kind of minor plot holes or just random stupid shit at the end which kind of made me say "wtf" at the end, case in point: how the fuck did the illusive man just magically appear out of nowhere already inside the reaper, also the whole reaper taking the form of the little kid she witnessed dying in the begining without any sort of explanation was just stupid,

That was the Citadel, not a reaper, and if it's going to appear as something to a character that has to make a tough choice, may as well be something that has very clearly been haunting them for months, something that signifies the people s/he couldn't save.

If someone is writing a story, and it has an ending that deliberately does not explain everything that happened in their story, their readers/players/viewers should not get any say in how THEY want it to go. That reeks of fanfiction, and I'd rather fanfiction stays out of legitimate storytelling. The people who wrote ME3, they are the ones who have the storytelling power.

Another example: If you're playing a D&D style role playing tabletop game, and the GM does something you don't like, you don't get to bitch and moan and force them to change their story. You accept it as the story that GM was telling, that you played an important character within. Maybe I didn't like in the Doctor Who game I'm in that a character was killed off seemingly without any meaning. But what's done is done, and you can gripe about it, but don't expect the person running the story to change their tune.

[Gamereviewgod]

If someone is writing a story, and it has an ending that deliberately does not explain everything that happened in their story, their readers/players/viewers should not get any say in how THEY want it to go. That reeks of fanfiction, and I'd rather fanfiction stays out of legitimate storytelling. The people who wrote ME3, they are the ones who have the storytelling power.

If a director/writer make a film and the studio screening it to a preview audience finds the majority didn't care for the ending, it's changed. Artistic intent be damned, they're a buisness and they want their customers satisfied. Happens all the time, hence why alternate endings exist or are even implemented into home video releases.

Video games are not ironclad.

[ubersaurus]

That's prerelease though. This is already out :P

[LaughingMAN.S9]

That was the Citadel, not a reaper, and if it's going to appear as something to a character that has to make a tough choice, may as well be something that has very clearly been haunting them for months, something that signifies the people s/he couldn't save.

If someone is writing a story, and it has an ending that deliberately does not explain everything that happened in their story, their readers/players/viewers should not get any say in how THEY want it to go. That reeks of fanfiction, and I'd rather fanfiction stays out of legitimate storytelling. The people who wrote ME3, they are the ones who have the storytelling power.

Another example: If you're playing a D&D style role playing tabletop game, and the GM does something you don't like, you don't get to bitch and moan and force them to change their story. You accept it as the story that GM was telling, that you played an important character within. Maybe I didn't like in the Doctor Who game I'm in that a character was killed off seemingly without any meaning. But what's done is done, and you can gripe about it, but don't expect the person running the story to change their tune.


yea i forgot it was the citadel, after i beat it, i pretty much just moved on lol, but anyway back to what i said earlier about the ending, again let me clarify. i had no real issue with the ending and i agree that if the writers felt that strongly about their work they should stick to their guns, but that doesnt change how stupid some of the things in the end were which could have easily been explained away with just 1 simple line of dialogue


for example, that little kid that was haunting shepards nightmares and later was the form chosen by the reaper, i dont even know where to begin, 1st why the fuck would the reaper choose that 1 image to present itself to shepard out of anyone it could have chosen which leads me into my 2nd question, HOW the fuck did the reaper even KNOW to choose that kid? he wasnt there, no explanation, sure you could probably try to infer that shepard was in the begining stages of being indoctrinated or whatever and part of the process is reading sheps thoughts bla bla bla, but if that was the case it wouldn't work within the framework they set up because not barely a moment earlier, the reaper was going on and on about how the illusive man could never take hold because he himself was indoctrinated from the begining


and now that leads me to yet another point of contention that most people have overlooked, if the illusive man was indoctrinated the whole time, then everything he did was part of their plan, so getting him to believe the right course of action is to control the reapers benefits the reapers HOW again??? if you bought the from ashes dlc then your prothean squad member mentions that every cycle theres always someone who preaches the same shit about controlling the reapers bla bla bla, yet the reaper kid makes no mention of this at all, they could have easily just said "we do this to create infighting or someshit to add to the chaos" but they dont, as far as they are concerned it never happened, and finally, if they always had the power to merge synthetic and organic life forms, why not just fucking do it from the begining and save everybody the fucking headache? oh nooo we're here because to save organics from synthetics by building synthetics that will kill organics, pffft lame



again i still enjoyed the ending overall, i could have lived with all of that if they just showed something of your crew in the end, like post war rebuilding, tali and legion playing in a pond or something, ashley putting flowers on your grave or showing she's pregnant, SOMETHING sonnnnnn lol


the end.

[Rev. Link]

Damn those consumers who spent $180 on a trilogy and are unhappy with it. :roll:

No one has any allegiance to a developer. We don't "repay" them, they provide us with a product. It's not entitlement to express displeasure with it. In fact, it's what consumers are supposed to do. Bioware would be wise to acknowledge the complaints considering how many are (rightfully) speaking up. They're a business, and goodwill towards the fan base is valuable.

No one forced all those people to spend money on those games. They saw something they were interested in playing and they decided to purchase it. If they didn't like it, that's fine, but they don't get any say in how it was made after the fact.

You don't walk out of a movie theater, decide you weren't happy with the movie you just saw, and decide to start an online petition trying to get the director to go back and reshoot a better ending. This is no different.

[Robocop2]

Having just finished it up I can honestly say I don't get what the fuss is about. I thought it tied things up nicely, the galaxy was saved no matter what from what I gather. I would have liked a bit shall we say, more ending no matter the choice. It did seem kind of short for what was a fairly epic story. Ans I kinda like that Shepard didn't pull the typical hero is back to 100% and ready to take on the next enigmatic threat that you see in a short clip approaching the galaxy for the sequel.
I just get pissed about the end message about playing more and buying dlc to further build that legend....

[Night Driver]

I thought the ending was unbelievably awful--a staggeringly ill-conceived conclusion to the series. Probably the worst ending to any work of fiction I've ever experienced, in any medium. No hyperbole. It's sad really, to witness such a memorable work of character-driven science fiction be driven straight off a cliff 10 feet from the finish line.

Anyway, I think this video does a good job of explaining what specifically is wrong with the ending.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7MlatxLP-xs

[Gamereviewgod]

No one forced all those people to spend money on those games. They saw something they were interested in playing and they decided to purchase it. If they didn't like it, that's fine, but they don't get any say in how it was made after the fact.

You don't walk out of a movie theater, decide you weren't happy with the movie you just saw, and decide to start an online petition trying to get the director to go back and reshoot a better ending. This is no different.

So, you want people to not spend money on the games because they might not like the ending that couldn't have known they didn't like unless they purchased it?

And people have done that with movies. They will continue to do so because they are consumers.

[Gamereviewgod]

That's prerelease though. This is already out :P

Doesn't change the fact that people have spent boatloads of money on it.

[ubersaurus]

Doesn't change the fact that people have spent boatloads of money on it.

Well, sure. But that can go for the ending of a story in plenty of mediums. Consider it like this, using your own movie example of changing an ending prerelease with what Lucas does with Star Wars, or what Spielberg did with his ET rerelease. Once a story is out, it's out. That's the tale you told. Changing it after the fact is doing a disservice to that work, and doing so because of pressure from people who may or may not know the first thing about effective storytelling is just terrible. To put it another way, the Star Wars prequel trilogy doesn't ruin the original three movies and all the enjoyment most people got out of them unless they let it.

I'm fine with post-game DLC, I don't think Awakening or Witch Hunt took away from the ending to Dragon Age Origins. At the same time, though, I like the notion that the galaxy, no matter which ending you select, is now in a position to develop their own technology and build their civilization up independent of the trappings the Reapers led them down. Legion said in ME2 the Geth believed every species should have the ability to forge their own path in the galaxy and shouldn't take the easy shortcuts. In all of the good endings of ME3, that's now exactly what everybody gets to face.

I think that makes for a more interesting ending than having Shepard and all his pals sipping margaritas in Rio, or one that spells out what your crew gets up to now.

[Gameguy]

Well, sure. But that can go for the ending of a story in plenty of mediums. Consider it like this, using your own movie example of changing an ending prerelease with what Lucas does with Star Wars, or what Spielberg did with his ET rerelease. Once a story is out, it's out. That's the tale you told. Changing it after the fact is doing a disservice to that work, and doing so because of pressure from people who may or may not know the first thing about effective storytelling is just terrible.
Several films were changed after they were first released without becoming worse. Blade Runner comes to mind, as does The Abyss. It really depends on why the changes were made. It's just with George Lucas he changed things for the wrong reasons and did it poorly so the films are worse off than how they started.



Also, new endings are being made for Mass Effect 3.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-17626125

[ubersaurus]

You misread. It's not a new ending being made. It's additional cinematics and epilogues being made for the existing endings to make it a bit clearer what's going on. Which honestly if I wanted shit spelled out for me I'd read a kid's book; I prefer being able to use my own imagination to think of what comes next for everyone.

As far as Blade Runner is concerned, wasn't it changed because Ridley Scott wanted it changed? It isn't like a bunch of people who liked his other work wrote a petition naming him the worst filmmaker in the world until he agreed to make changes to his work. That is bullying the storyteller, and I don't like it.

[Gameguy]

As far as Blade Runner is concerned, wasn't it changed because Ridley Scott wanted it changed?
You mean like how George Lucas wanted to change his own works after they were already released?


Consider it like this, using your own movie example of changing an ending prerelease with what Lucas does with Star Wars, or what Spielberg did with his ET rerelease. Once a story is out, it's out. That's the tale you told. Changing it after the fact is doing a disservice to that work.

That's the quote I was replying to, it's what you wrote.

[ubersaurus]

You mean like how George Lucas wanted to change his own works after they were already released?



That's the quote I was replying to, it's what you wrote.

I'll make it known that I've only watched the theatrical cut of Blade Runner; didn't care for it enough to ever check out the rerelease. And yeah, no one got a petition together demanding Lucas change his movie so Han shot second or to make the end of Jedi more fun and happy.

If the ME3 team came out and said, "we want to change the ending to make a couple things clearer and more in line with what we intended," then okay, sure. It may be shittier but it was their choice to do that without being pressured into it. The way this came about leaves a horrible taste in my mouth, especially since people are still griping because they don't want additional cinematics; they want new endings with at least one being "happy."