Best Star Fox game?

[BetaWolf47]

Which Star Fox game is the best? I'm wondering whether I should have included Star Fox Adventures in this poll, since it wasn't intended as a Star Fox game. And no, this does not include prototype games or unrelated Atari games.

[buzz_n64]

At the time, Star Fox was revolutionary, but it looks bad looking back at it now, plus the play controls were improved upon in later games. My vote goes to Star Fox 64 for sure.

[Superman]

I've always liked the original Star Fox on SNES. Maybe it's the geometric shapes or maybe it is the slowdowns while playing it or maybe some of both.

I've also only played Star Fox 64 (of the games listed) and it is pretty good, but Star Fox is still my favorite.

[sheath]

Without having played through the rest I am comfortable saying that the original Star Fox is the best game in the series. For one it has the best music, and Nintendo is silly for losing those tunes for whatever reason. For another Star Fox is the most like Galaxy Force II and Star Blade, which is a very very good thing. Rail shooters that made space seem all kinds of awesome are sorely lacking today. I miss CSK.

[Malon_Forever]

Star Fox 64 by the biggest margin in the history of this board.

[fahlim003]

Since Star Fox 2 isn't on the poll, maybe it's Star Fox 64. I quite enjoy Star Fox 1 although despite limited exposure to SF64, I'll have to give it the nod.

[j_factor]

I didn't really care for the non-Arwing stages of Star Fox 64.

[kupomogli]

Mobile Suit Gundam Encounters in Space

[kainemaxwell]

64, hands down. Took everything awesome about the first game and made it more awesome.

[Leo_A]

Except it destroyed all the audio that made the first game so special. The original has one of the best background musical scores in videogaming history. In its place is mediocre music in Star Fox 64 and some lousy dialogue voiced by equally lousy voice talent.

The original Star Fox is my favorite of the bunch and the only one I have any affection towards. Star Fox 64 might've been a well done game, but it was nothing but disappointing for this gamer.

[RCM]

Star Fox 64 by far. It's probably my favorite Nintendo game and is kind of like their Shinobi III in a sense that it's excellence is unmatched by the rest of the franchise. When I get my 3DSi XL the revamped version is a day 1 purchase for me.

[cityside75]

Except it destroyed all the audio that made the first game so special. The original has one of the best background musical scores in videogaming history. In its place is medicore music in Star Fox 64 and some lousy dialogue voiced by equally lousy voice talent.

The original Star Fox is my favorite of the bunch and the only one I have any affection towards. Star Fox 64 might've been a well done game, but it was nothing but disappointing for this gamer.

I couldn't possibly agree more.

[Ryudo]

I couldn't possibly agree more.

This man is 100% correct. SF64 has awesome music and the voices were better than the "dabba dabba"
I love both games but anyone who says bad about anything SF64 is wrong wrong wrong..wrong wrong wrong you're wrong you're wrong you're wroooooooooong!

[Leo_A]

Unless I missed something, he was in agreement with me that Star Fox 64's audio elements didn't come anywhere close to living up to those of the original.

And while the text dialogue and animal sounds of the original are nothing to sing praise over (Unlike the music in the game), they have one important element that puts them above Star Fox 64's counterparts. They're easy to ignore completely. Give me that anyday over being annoyed everytime a character opens their mouth in the sequel.

The epic atmosphere of the original is completely absent in the sequel. I suspect more than a few people that were playing the original Star Fox circa 1993-1995 thought similarly when the sequel rolled around. For a game that I was looking forward to so much (Along with F-Zero X), they're two of gaming's biggest disappointments for me.

I could tolerate many of the things that I found disappointing in Star Fox 64. But that awful dialogue and voicework was just too annoying to ignore. Makes me glad to this day that characters mostly don't speak in Zelda releases. At least Europe got a version without the voices that is more tolerable (Although the animal sounds are much more intrusive and approach being grating at times compared to the SuperNes original).

Should've kept Argonaut Games on the job and tasked Koji Kondo or whatever his name is to repeat his job as music composer on the sequel. Would've loved to have seen what the same team could've done on the hardware.

[Darth Binks]

Star Fox 64 for sure. It blew my mind the first time I played it. I wasn't able to put it down. When you add the fact that it came with a rumble pack, it wins without question. The rumble pack changed the game.

[jonebone]

Didn't realize that this would even be a poll. Starfox on SNES is completely unplayable if you played Starfox 64 first, as I did. The SNES version lasted about 2 minutes on me before I turned it off and shelved it for eternity.

SF64 is one of my favorite games indeed. Multiple paths through the galaxy and trying to get all of the medals can keep ever the best gamer busy for awhile.

[tom]

Star Fox on Apple ][ (EA)

[sloan]

I don't know what Starfox Adventures was trying to accomplish, but it is not a Starfox game IMO.

[Robocop2]

I vote Starfox 64. Partly because of the 3DS port. I really enjoy this one on the go. The only downfall is the stupid voice acting. I wish for the gibberish of the original and wish it was at least unlockable.

[Rob2600]

Star Fox 64 is one of the all-time best video games ever.


Except it destroyed all the audio that made the first game so special. The original has one of the best background musical scores in videogaming history. In its place is mediocre music in Star Fox 64 and some lousy dialogue voiced by equally lousy voice talent.

I've always found the music in Star Fox 64 to be excellent. It's catchy, well-written, and well-arranged. The exciting stages have exciting music, the depressing, pollution-infested stages have somber music, etc. The soundtrack is dramatic and fits the game perfectly.

The voice acting in SF64 is some the best I've ever heard in a video game. It makes the game so much more engaging and interactive. What about it do you find lousy?


the text dialogue and animal sounds of the original are nothing to sing praise over (Unlike the music in the game), they have one important element that puts them above Star Fox 64's counterparts. They're easy to ignore completely.

The whole point of Star Fox and Star Fox 64 is that you're *not* supposed to ignore the other characters. They're part of your team. Sometimes they need help, sometimes they help you, and sometimes they just comment on the situation in general. They add a ton of atmosphere to the game. And the enemies taunts shouldn't be ignored, either. The dialog is part of what makes the first two Star Fox games so special.

If you're ignoring your wingmen and what they have to say, you're missing a big point of the games. You're not flying solo. I'm guessing you hate the Star Wars: Rogue Squadron games, too?

[Aussie2B]

You can count me in the crowd that thinks the original is by far the winner in the audio department. The other soundtracks don't remotely compare.

[Rob2600]

Some people prefer rock or techno soundtracks and find orchestrated music boring. Oh well.

[Aussie2B]

I like orchestrated music, but I do find the music in Star Fox 64 boring.

[cityside75]

Unless I missed something, he was in agreement with me that Star Fox 64's audio elements didn't come anywhere close to living up to those of the original.

And while the text dialogue and animal sounds of the original are nothing to sing praise over (Unlike the music in the game), they have one important element that puts them above Star Fox 64's counterparts. They're easy to ignore completely. Give me that anyday over being annoyed everytime a character opens their mouth in the sequel.

The epic atmosphere of the original is completely absent in the sequel. I suspect more than a few people that were playing the original Star Fox circa 1993-1995 thought similarly when the sequel rolled around. For a game that I was looking forward to so much (Along with F-Zero X), they're two of gaming's biggest disappointments for me.

I could tolerate many of the things that I found disappointing in Star Fox 64. But that awful dialogue and voicework was just too annoying to ignore. Makes me glad to this day that characters mostly don't speak in Zelda releases. At least Europe got a version without the voices that is more tolerable (Although the animal sounds are much more intrusive and approach being grating at times compared to the SuperNes original).

Should've kept Argonaut Games on the job and tasked Koji Kondo or whatever his name is to repeat his job as music composer on the sequel. Would've loved to have seen what the same team could've done on the hardware.

Yes, I am in complete agreement with you. The cross-over from alien gibberish to actual dialogue was a huge mistake IMO. I remember at the time they really touted that voicework as a response to the whole cartridge vs cd debate that was raging. It was meant to prove that extensive dialogue could be included in a cartridge game (which few cartridges had ever featured). To me, it was way overdone to prove that point and Slippy...god did I hate Slippy's voice. I had shown the original Starfox to everyone when it came out as a demo of what video games of the time could do, but I hesitated to do the same with Starfox 64 because it sounded like a bad Saturday morning cartoon (and I was in my mid-20's by that point).

As has been said, I don't consider Starfox 64 to be a bad game by any means but it was a disappointment after the original rocked my world in every way (especially the AMAZING audio).

The magic of the original's audio wasn't just the music either. The game had some amazing ambient sounds that at the time made me recall the original Battlestar Galactica and of course Star Wars, but with a unique twist that was all Nintendo. I'm thinking specifically of your ship sounds which were multi-layered airy ambience that rose and fell with your speed in a way that I still find extremely pleasing and "authentic" if you will. When you take a destroying hit in the original and for a second the only sound you hear is the last gasps of your ship before it explodes...amazing.

Aside from the audio, the game had a cinematic grandeuer to it that was really taken down a notch with gimmicks like "All Range Mode" (to me another ham-fisted response to criticisms of the first game's extremely railed paths) and all of the silly dialogue (not just the voices themselves but the actual dialogue).

[tom]

Star Fox 64 here too, SNES Star Fox is so annoying, although I played it well over halfway through, those stupid animal squeeks made me throw the cart into the dustbin.

[SpaceHarrier]

SNES Star Fox here. As for the soundtrack, I love the original.

N64? I famously threw the cd soundtrack in the garbage, still sealed, after playing the game and hearing the music.

[BetaWolf47]

So confused by the dislike of Star Fox 64's soundtrack here. Would love to have that soundtrack CD you threw in the garbage. What is it about the soundtrack that people don't like? Star Wolf's Theme is one of my favorite tracks of all time!

I thought the game was a huge improvement to the original in every way, including music, graphics, plot, voice acting, control, and gameplay. I thought the voice acting was supposed to be considered really good for 1997. Heck, I still think the voice acting is pretty good, the only exception being Slippy's voice. It's one of my top 10 games of all time.

[Leo_A]

My main problems with the music is that it just sounds plain and uninspired. It isn't poorly done nor is it even annoying to listen to, but it just doesn't emit any of the atmosphere that the amazing soundtrack of the original did. When you go from a game that had one of the best soundtracks in gaming history and jump into a sequel, anything less than amazing is a let down and Star Fox 64 wasn't anywhere even close.

As for why I feel that way, that's about as easy to express in words as trying to explain why a certain color is your favorite. It's just different taste. Hard to quantify why. There's just nothing there that compares to the music of the original like this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wNHoxFzJ8-8


The whole point of Star Fox and Star Fox 64 is that you're *not* supposed to ignore the other characters.

You're talking to someone that has finished it before without a teammate left alive (Something I've never heard anyone else even mention over the years). In fact one of my biggest criticisms of the game is what you can't damage your teammates (Although they'll whine if you shoot them).

I don't think the dialogue does much for the game (Although I think it's serviceable for the most part with the occasional exception). And in Star Fox 64, it takes what is mostly a fine game (Although I'll go to my grave still considering it a disappointment compared to the original) and drags it down severely.

The sequel doesn't even handle the crash sequence nearly as well as the original did for just one minor example of how Star Fox excelled compared to its sequel (In fact I think it's one of videogaming's best death sequences).

To me, Star Fox 64 just felt like a videogame adaptation of a cartoon aimed at young kids. It's not even just the dialogue that does that, there are many elements there like Star Wolf that just reinforces that impression. I could see playing this at an early age and having a lot of nostalgia for it. But as someone that experienced the original Star Fox first and was well into my teens when the sequel hit, it was nothing but disappointing outside of its technical merits (I'm not so blind that I'm incapable of seeing that it has high production values).

Forgetting all the criticism I have for it (I've just skimmed the surface here, there's a lot outside of the audio elements that I find fault with), it's disappointing simply because it's devoid of all the magic the original had.

[SpaceHarrier]

So confused by the dislike of Star Fox 64's soundtrack here. Would love to have that soundtrack CD you threw in the garbage. What is it about the soundtrack that people don't like? Star Wolf's Theme is one of my favorite tracks of all time!



Well, music is totally subjective and all... but I just don't think the music fit the game. It sounds a little too Legend of Zeldaish. I wanted 'spacey' sounding music, with a shit-ton of reverb, electronic sounds, and thumping, exciting beats. You know, like SNES Corneria. Not purely orchestral military march stuff.

Second, I find the SNES' attempt at orchestral type music to be alot more pleasing than what the N64 put out. Blech.

By the way, I was 17 when I threw that out, and my mother fished it out of the trash, thinking I put it there by accident. She gave it to me 14 years later, and it's still in perfect condition. Looking back, yes it was a stupid thing to do, and the collector in me wants to kick younger me for ever doing that, but it was a gut reaction to how I felt about the music at the time.

[Rob2600]

Star Fox 64 just felt like a videogame adaptation of a cartoon aimed at young kids.

Just because a video game isn't dark, edgy, and "badass", that doesn't automatically mean it's "kiddy" or "weak". Not everything in life has to have cursing and a heavy metal or techno soundtrack to be considered "cool".

But unfortunately, there are many adults who feel this way. They must be very insecure with their own maturity and adulthood that they can't appreciate a good orchestrated soundtrack or look beyond animal characters to see the artistic merits below the surface. (I'm not necessarily saying you, I'm just saying there are a lot of teens and adults like that.)


it's disappointing simply because it's devoid of all the magic the original had.

I played Star Fox on the SNES when I was 15, and Star Fox 64 when I was 19. It was a day-one purchase for me. It's one of my all-time favorite video games.

What's interesting is I find Star Fox 64 to have *more* magic than the SNES original. I thought the first Star Fox was an impressive technical achievement, but it lacked a bit in personality. Star Fox 64 oozes charm, personality, and excitement. If the intro cinematic doesn't get you pumped up, with the military music and General Pepper's desperate plea for help, you simply aren't human ;) Seriously though, I can't see how anyone could consider the voice acting bad. To me, the voices were done very well, with lots of emotion. The performances aren't awkward and stilted like in Resident Evil.


And I forgot to mention, if you don't finish a level with all your teammates intact, you can't earn medals.

[RCM]

Just because a video game isn't dark, edgy, and "badass", that doesn't automatically mean it's "kiddy" or "weak". Not everything in life has to have cursing and a heavy metal or techno soundtrack to be considered "cool".

But unfortunately, there are many adults who feel this way. They must be very insecure with their own maturity and adulthood that they can't appreciate a good orchestrated soundtrack or look beyond animal characters to see the artistic merits below the surface. (I'm not necessarily saying you, I'm just saying there are a lot of teens and adults like that.)



I played Star Fox on the SNES when I was 15, and Star Fox 64 when I was 19. It was a day-one purchase for me. It's one of my all-time favorite video games.

What's interesting is I find Star Fox 64 to have *more* magic than the SNES original. I thought the first Star Fox was an impressive technical achievement, but it lacked a bit in personality. Star Fox 64 oozes charm, personality, and excitement. If the intro cinematic doesn't get you pumped up, with the military music and General Pepper's desperate plea for help, you simply aren't human ;) Seriously though, I can't see how anyone could consider the voice acting bad. To me, the voices were done very well, with lots of emotion. The performances aren't awkward and stilted like in Resident Evil.


And I forgot to mention, if you don't finish a level with all your teammates intact, you can't earn medals.

I agree with just about everything Mr. 2600 says above.

[NE146]

While I very much enjoy Starfox 64 (heck I re-bought it on the 3DS), I find I do have a preference overall for the SNES version. That is the one that has the magic for me oddly enough.. graphics notwithstanding. I just think it has the better soundtrack. Also the space battles "feel" epic to me.. going into the large ship corridors etc. It's just all cool feeling. Starfox 64 feels a bit more contrived, and the soundtrack in it just simply isn't as good.

But again I like both. Just saying if I had to choose between them.

[TonyTheTiger]

The Saturday morning ham and cheese is part of what I think makes the game so perfect. It's Disney's Robin Hood with space fights and laser beams. If it were anything but ham and cheese then it'd be doing something wrong.

[BetaWolf47]

I agree with Rob2600 on his sentiments on what makes a mature game and what doesn't. Too many people confuse "gritty and realistic" with "mature". It's just a different style. Star Fox 64 always seemed more mature to me than 90% of the games out there, despite being E-rated and starring anthropomorphic bounty hunters. Maybe I'm just an idiot, or the fact that I grew up with the game, but I never saw any of it as "ham and cheese" either.

As for the music, they may have gone a bit overboard with trying to make it sound orchestrated for an N64 game. They go for a more dramatic theme than Star Fox SNES, but that's all the more reason I love it.

This thread is kind of ironic. Despite Star Fox 64 getting more votes, the original Star Fox fans are far more vocal about their love for the original. Maybe I should play some original Star Fox tonight.

[Leo_A]

Just because a video game isn't dark, edgy, and "badass", that doesn't automatically mean it's "kiddy" or "weak". Not everything in life has to have cursing and a heavy metal or techno soundtrack to be considered "cool".

Did I ever say that a game had to have any of that? Heck, does the original Star Fox have anything of the sort? What makes you think I'm holding Star Fox 64 to some different standard here than the original? I don't think a game needs to be "dark, edgy, and badass". I think if you browse my posting history here a bit, you'll come to find that my taste largely doesn't even include any such games that you described and that those descriptions are turn-offs for me. The direction they took Star Fox 64 in simply wasn't what I wanted from a sequel. I wanted something much more akin to the original, just upgraded to take advantage of the enhanced technology of a new console. I didn't get that...

In fact some of the reasons I prefer the original Star Fox are polar opposites of the things you listed. For instance, I really liked the bright colors of the game's counterpart to Earth, the beautiful blue sky, and the beautiful background in that level (Another area that Star Fox excelled in compared to the sequel, every single background is a work of art in every world). You feel like you're flying through a manicured world populated by life that has just been invaded minutes prior to you scrambling into the air to lead a last ditch counterattack that is worth saving (Beyond perhaps all the windowless cities you fly through ;)). You feel like there's something there worth saving and protecting.

In Star Fox 64, you're left feeling after Corneria like there's little point to go any further. Dark colors, destruction, and so on are everywhere. It's as if Andross has already conquered and destroyed the place, leaving little to save and leaving you wondering why these 4 talking animals are bothering to go on any further when the war has already been lost anyways.


If the intro cinematic doesn't get you pumped up, with the military music and General Pepper's desperate plea for help, you simply aren't human ;) Seriously though, I can't see how anyone could consider the voice acting bad. To me, the voices were done very well, with lots of emotion. The performances aren't awkward and stilted like in Resident Evil.

Give me the opening cinematic of the original anyday where they're leaving the hanger and exiting the base. Impressive graphics, it's exciting, and it has great audio that gets you pumped up for the action that's about to start. Star Fox 64's counterpart just doesn't compare. It's just too far subdued and is needlessly stretched out and boring (Thing's like "Falco here" and the other teammates checking in was just pointless and hardly exciting for instance and that's largely all there is there). Hardly does anything to get you in the mood.

About the only good things I have to say about the opening is the game borrowed the "Good Luck" at the end of the mission briefings from the SuperNes game and I like the "Let's Rock and Roll" line at the end of the intro. Kind of reminds me of a more contemporary version of what British pilots would often say during the Battle of Britain when they'd spot German aircraft and were engaging the enemy, which was "Tally Ho!". So I liked that line.

Here are some select quotes from just Corneria of just how corny the dialogue is...

"I will not be defeated by this worm!"

"You annoying little flies!"

"My emperor... I've failed you!"

There are dozens of more such lines throughout the game (Particularly from the talking bosses... another complaint I have with the game).



As for the music, they may have gone a bit overboard with trying to make it sound orchestrated for an N64 game. They go for a more dramatic theme than Star Fox SNES, but that's all the more reason I love it.

We're polar opposites here. To me, Star Fox 64's soundtrack sounds far less orchestrated than what was accomplished on the SuperNes and far less dramatic.

[scaleworm]

This man is 100% correct. SF64 has awesome music and the voices were better than the "dabba dabba"
I love both games but anyone who says bad about anything SF64 is wrong wrong wrong..wrong wrong wrong you're wrong you're wrong you're wroooooooooong!

Too funny, and Too true. My vote's the original. SNES rules.

[Shulamana]

I have only played the original Star Fox, Star Fox 64, and about 5 minutes of Assault.

Star Fox 64 just feels so different from the game it is a remake of. It's definitely one of my favorite N64 titles, but I have to go with the original game just for the music and overall experience.

[wiggyx]

You're talking to someone that has finished it before without a teammate left alive (Something I've never heard anyone else even mention over the years). In fact one of my biggest criticisms of the game is what you can't damage your teammates (Although they'll whine if you shoot them).

I don't quite get your point. I've finished the game with no teammates remaining as well, and I'm sure plenty of folks have. It's not like they provide any sort of helpful service. Hell, the hardest part about beating it without teammates is being careful enough to NOT attack the bad guys that are gunning for 'em.


I have only played the original Star Fox, Star Fox 64, and about 5 minutes of Assault.

Star Fox 64 just feels so different from the game it is a remake of. It's definitely one of my favorite N64 titles, but I have to go with the original game just for the music and overall experience.

That's probably because it's not a "remake".

[TonyTheTiger]

It's hard to say whether it's a remake or not. The story and dialogue seems to imply that this is the first time the team has engaged Andross. Yet it's obvious the characters have a history with each other with the way the team is familiar with Star Wolf and other friends that show up. But it's not like all those relationships were established in the original.

[Leo_A]

I don't quite get your point.

Read my post again and read the quotation I included just prior to what you included. My response was a rebuttal to that.

My point was that I don't think the interaction with your teammates is nearly as important to the experience as Rob2600 thinks it is. Nothing more, nothing less.

In fact I think it's so unimportant to the experience that I'll routinely play it the opposite way that the designers intended and try to finish it without anyone left alive (Another annoyance with Star Fox 64; as I recall they're never really gone).

So I don't think the dialogue being less than exceptional in the original is very important. What's important is that it doesn't detract from the experience, unlike the case of Star Fox 64 for a significant minority of players judging by this thread.

[wiggyx]

It's hard to say whether it's a remake or not. The story and dialogue seems to imply that this is the first time the team has engaged Andross. Yet it's obvious the characters have a history with each other with the way the team is familiar with Star Wolf and other friends that show up. But it's not like all those relationships were established in the original.

While it doesn't really feel like a sequel, it also does not appear as a remake IMO. There are lots of new characters, enemies, levels, etc.

When I think remake, games like MGS/MGS:Twin Snakes and SMB/SMB:All Stars come too mind.

StarFox64 feels more like the 2nd Hulk movie; not a sequel and not just remake of the movie that came 2-3 years prior.


Read my post again and read the quotation I included just prior to what you included. My response was a rebuttal to that.

My point was that I don't think the interaction with your teammates is nearly as important to the experience as Rob2600 thinks it is. Nothing more, nothing less.

In fact I think it's so unimportant to the experience that I'll routinely play it the opposite way that the designers intended and try to finish it without anyone left alive (Another annoyance with Star Fox 64; as I recall they're never really gone).

So I don't think the dialogue being less than exceptional in the original is very important. What's important is that it doesn't detract from the experience, unlike the case of Star Fox 64 for a significant minority of players judging by this thread.

Gotcha. In that case, I'm 100% with you. As much as the N64 game is my fav, I'd actually prefer the jibberish that they speak in the original. It's definitely easier to ignore, that's for sure.

[Lerxstnj]

What was Star Fox Adventures intended to be, if not a Star Fox game?
It's the only one I've played, and it is friggin' great!

[Aussie2B]

Star Fox Adventures was originally Dinosaur Planet for the N64. Since it had so many similarities to Star Fox (what with the anthropomorphic characters and such), Nintendo suggested that Rare turn it into a Star Fox game.

[j_factor]

Star Fox Adventures is great, but it's not really a Star Fox game. Even in the final product, Star Fox as the main character feels very artificially imposed.