Does the Pc engine DUO output RGB?

[BricatSegaFan]

So my question is does the pc engine DUO output rgb over scart?

[ApolloBoy]

Not without modding, it only outputs composite video otherwise.

[bb_hood]

Does the Duo-R or any of the other japanese pc-engine console output RGB?
Is the mod on the turbo duo difficult or expensive to have done?

[theclaw]

No, duo has no expansion port. That's where the RGB output pins were on original pc engine & turbografx.

Presumably they considered either RGB as part of PC Engine CD, or an RGB version of what the US knows as Turbo Booster.

[BricatSegaFan]

No, duo has no expansion port. That's where the RGB output pins were on original pc engine & turbografx.

Presumably they considered either RGB as part of PC Engine CD, or an RGB version of what the US knows as Turbo Booster.

Oh ok so its not like a Sega genesis that can output rgb from its av pins via scart?

[theclaw]

Nope. pc engine duo has only a 5 pin av jack.

sega genesis used like 8 or 9.

[isufje]

Does the Duo-R or any of the other japanese pc-engine console output RGB?
Is the mod on the turbo duo difficult or expensive to have done?

it's difficult but also fun and inexpensive to DIY (Do It Yourself). I did a black US Duo long ago but it died. i eventually transfered over the parts (video amp and buffer) to a shinny Japanese Duo R. That Duo R lost it's shine, but the RGB picture still going strong ^_^

If you're interested in DIY, check out this thread -> http://nfggames.com/forum2/index.php?topic=2351

just scroll down to the post by vkp_ashley (that's me) The diagram and parts list is all there. 50 bucks in parts and you're done. digikey.com

coincidentally i always wanted to collect old turbografx(s) and mod them for RGB/YPbPr then sell them, but i'd never make a profit so i abandoned the idea :p

[Graham Mitchell]

If you're going to mod your Duo for RGB, replace all the caps while you're in there. Those things are notorious for leaky capacitors. The first thing to go is the audio. If you let it sit you'll have motherboard-level corrosion in no time. It happened to me and I was PISSED.

In fact, even if you're not going to mod it, you should probably have it recapped.

[bb_hood]

If you're going to mod your Duo for RGB, replace all the caps while you're in there. Those things are notorious for leaky capacitors. The first thing to go is the audio. If you let it sit you'll have motherboard-level corrosion in no time. It happened to me and I was PISSED.

In fact, even if you're not going to mod it, you should probably have it recapped.

The Turbo Duo I play with has already had the caps and laser replaced, so Im cautious about messing with it too much. I wouldnt want to screw anything up.
I also have a Duo-R that has been sitting in its box on the shelf for the last 6 years or so, should I be concerned about the caps leaking or are those generally not as bad as Turbo Duos?

[xelement5x]

The Turbo Duo I play with has already had the caps and laser replaced, so Im cautious about messing with it too much. I wouldnt want to screw anything up.
I also have a Duo-R that has been sitting in its box on the shelf for the last 6 years or so, should I be concerned about the caps leaking or are those generally not as bad as Turbo Duos?

Duo R and RX have better capacitors than the original Duo, however all things will fail in time. Many guys at PCEFX replace them with tantalum caps at this point since they're better than the original electrolytic kind.

[Graham Mitchell]

Yeah a modded duo r is the way to go. Mine works beautifully.

[Gameguy]

Duo R and RX have better capacitors than the original Duo, however all things will fail in time. Many guys at PCEFX replace them with tantalum caps at this point since they're better than the original electrolytic kind.
Using Tantalum caps might not be a great idea, sure they can last longer than regular caps but if they do fail they really fail badly. The boards weren't designed to use those types of capacitors, I doubt any of the safeguards would be in place.

I'll just post some quotes from Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tantalum_capacitor) as it's faster.


Tantalum capacitors have lower equivalent series resistance (ESR) than aluminum electrolytic capacitors of the same capacitance, which is a significant advantage in many designs. However, care must be taken when designing a circuit using tantalum capacitors, to limit charge and discharge currents (particularly those of a repetitive nature) to a level that does not overstress other circuit components.

Tantalum capacitors are extremely reliable. However, their failure mode tends to be a short-circuit, due to the extremely thin dielectric; designs using these capacitors need to take into account the consequences of this possible failure mode. There is also a possibility of catastrophic thermal runaway failure (see below).

Thermal runaway and self-destruction
Tantalum capacitors are, under some conditions, prone to self-destruction by thermal runaway. The tantalum oxide layer may have weak spots that undergo dielectric breakdown during a voltage spike. The tantalum anode then comes in direct contact with the manganese dioxide cathode, and the leakage current causes localized heating; a chemical reaction then produces manganese(III) oxide and regenerates (self-heals) the tantalum oxide layer.

However, if the energy dissipated at the failure point is high enough, a new self-sustaining exothermic reaction may initiate, similar to the thermite reaction, with tantalum as fuel and manganese dioxide as oxidizer. This can destroy the capacitor, and occasionally produces smoke and possibly flame. To prevent catastrophic thermal runaway failure, auxiliary protective devices (e.g. thermal fuses, circuit breakers, or current limiters) may be used to limit fault currents.

When applying tantalum capacitors, the possibility of thermal runaway (see above) or spontaneous short-circuiting must be considered. In many cases, a failed capacitor will only make the circuit stop functioning normally. However, if sufficient power is available, catastrophic thermal runaway may cause a fire or small explosion. A design can prevent this by using external current limiting (e.g. thermal fuse, circuit breaker).

Plus from other sources online, Tantalum capacitors aren't good for audio quality. Why would you want to use them for repairing the audio circuit? They cost more and sound worse, and really any regular aluminum capacitor will be better than the standard surface mount caps that came with the Duos. Those weren't made well which is why they're failing so badly, modern aluminum caps should last another 30 years before needing replacement.
http://www.bext.com/replace.htm

[BricatSegaFan]

On a side not regarding rgb via scart with any console. I heard that you can remove pin 19 on a scart cable and it reduces video noise, is this true?


Here's the snippet from Wikipedia


Using higher-quality cables such as those with ribbon cords that have properly shielded coax cables inside might help in reducing a 'ghosting' effect, but it does not always completely eliminate it due to various factors. A more permanent method is to remove pin 19 from the SCART plug that is put into the TV. Pin 19 is Video Out, and removing it prevents a signal from being broadcast by the TV into the cable in the first place, so it cannot cross-talk with the incoming signal.

[xelement5x]

Using Tantalum caps might not be a great idea, sure they can last longer than regular caps but if they do fail they really fail badly. The boards weren't designed to use those types of capacitors, I doubt any of the safeguards would be in place.

I'll just post some quotes from Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tantalum_capacitor) as it's faster.






Plus from other sources online, Tantalum capacitors aren't good for audio quality. Why would you want to use them for repairing the audio circuit? They cost more and sound worse, and really any regular aluminum capacitor will be better than the standard surface mount caps that came with the Duos. Those weren't made well which is why they're failing so badly, modern aluminum caps should last another 30 years before needing replacement.
http://www.bext.com/replace.htm


I personally haven't done a replacement like this so I can't attest to the quality, though from my understanding capacitors on the motherboard do control other parts besides simply the audio.

The best explanation I was given was:
there are 2 main types of tant caps.
the wet tant has leakage issues and a use life, where the solid tant is more suseptable to inrush/spikes.
when replacing aluminum caps with tant, try to uprate the cap voltage ratings, to avoid spike/inrush damage.
a properly selected tant cap should never fail, but defects do occur causing early failure.
ceramics are a better choice when available, as inrush and spikes rarely hurt them.

That said, in a regular scenario 'almost anything' would be better to have in a regular Duo than the original capacitors which may be leaking/failing at this point. But people can do whatever they want with their hardware, it is theirs after all.

[Zap!]

Apparently, it does RGB without modding now:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Scart-RGB-Cable-for-PC-Engine-TurboGrafx16-EXT-Connector-/171761504758?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item27fdc891f6

http://www.ebay.com/itm/TurboGrafx-16-RGB-SCART-out-Box-Turbo-Booster-Alternative-Grafx-THS7314-Cable-/251928133015?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3aa8163d97

[synbiosfan]

Apparently, it does RGB without modding now:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Scart-RGB-Cable-for-PC-Engine-TurboGrafx16-EXT-Connector-/171761504758?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item27fdc891f6

http://www.ebay.com/itm/TurboGrafx-16-RGB-SCART-out-Box-Turbo-Booster-Alternative-Grafx-THS7314-Cable-/251928133015?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3aa8163d97

A Duo doesn't have that connection.

[Zap!]

A Duo doesn't have that connection.
Misread the title, my bad.