Would you buy a rare game if you knew it would hurt the owner?

[recorderdude]

Okay, before I start this topic, I have to tell a story. It's a story about me, and the reason I am a collector today.

Long before my birth and still continuing today, my mother has dealt with serious mental issues. Growing up with the nausea and spinning attacks of meniere's disease and several other mental disorders a common household occurrence was not easy. I had to watch my mother go through recovering from open brain surgery at six years old. At the same time, I was becoming incredibly fascinated with video games. Mom had two copies of some super outdated gaming magazines from around the time Donkey Kong Country was new. I read those issues from cover-to-cover religiously, and they consumed practically all of my free time. Eventually, my parents got the hint, and, partially as a way to distract me from the brain surgery and partially due to my desire, Santa Claus brought me a super nintendo that year.

As a gamer, growing up. I had the best of both worlds, with a Super NES and all the best titles AND a GameCube with tons of quality retro collections and a few modern games, too.

I spent hours on the donkey kong countries, mario world, yoshi's island and all stars, star fox, link to the past, a ton of quality licensed games and my personal favorite on the system, kirby's dreamland 3, which was also one of the few games mom could actually play with me. I spent equal time on the 4-game zelda collection that came with my cube, various gamecube sonic games and collections (I stopped at heroes, and while I really wanted to play shadow the hedgehog at the time, maybe it was a good thing...), as well as smash brothers melee, spyro, both megaman collection titles. They are the games I remember most fondly, without a doubt. Friends came over every other day to play them with me.

Those were the happiest times of my life.

They had to come to an end.

Around when I turned ten years old, my mother was committed to a mental institution for a little over a year. My father, who despised gaming from day one and still does to this day, decided it was time for me to grow out of the "kiddy video games" and turned to ebay to make what he figured they were worth.

What followed was the biggest heartbreak of my entire life.

My super nintendo, with two controllers and an ASCII fighter stick SN, free from yellowing or smoke damage, bundled with countless classics and a game total nearing thirty, games that, even back then, were rare and sought after like dreamland 3, Yoshi's Island, and so many more...

Set at a "buy it now" of $30.

Snapped up within the hour of posting.

My nintendo gamecube, which, at the time, was still reasonably current, along with two controllers, a 512 memory card and some of the best games on the system...

Set at a "buy it now" of $20.

Snapped up within the hour of posting.

For years, the only video game I had was frogger for the gameboy, and I couldn't even play that with anyone.

I haven't truly played any of those games for YEARS, and only now have I finally begun to reclaim what I lost.

That's why I'm a collector. To reclaim the childhood I almost had.

Now, you may be thinking..."What the hell does this have to do with the topic title?"

Imagine, for a moment, that you're at a garage sale. You see the one thing you've been looking for to complete your collection your entire life. The seller is an unknowledgable looking man who wants $10 for it. All of a sudden, a child runs out of the house, begging his father not to sell it. He informs the child that it's something he has to do, perhaps a punishment for a tantrum or a push to mature.

Would you still be able to buy it?

This is a question I don't expect definite answers for. There is a great possibility that someone else would just come along and get it after you pass it up, or that the father would just turn to the internet or even a goodwill to get rid of the troublesome system. Perhaps you'd try to inform him of the item's value, but that would likely make him even more tempted to sell it.

Personally, I could never see myself doing this. I grew up knowing the pain of losing everything you enjoy and I would never do that to someone else if I could avoid it.

But then, who's to say that lot I bought on ebay for a steal didn't suffer the same fate? Or the massively underpriced wii I picked up two years ago with porn bookmarks and a confused looking thirteen-year-old stuck to the photo channel?

I think what I'm trying to get across is; do we, as collectors, take games away from those who would enjoy them even more than ourselves whether we know it or not?

[kupomogli]

Even if I didn't buy the game, someone else would. So I have no problem buying something that someone else wants to sell.

[bb_hood]

I think what I'm trying to get across is; do we, as collectors, take games away from those who would enjoy them even more than ourselves whether we know it or not?

You cant feel bad for wanting video games or wanting to buy them cheap. You cant feel bad about negotiating with people either. If someone is selling their children's beloved toys without the child knowing, thats pretty low. Thats on the parent, not on the buyer. The actions would be tantamount to stealing. You cant expect buyers to do background checks on every item they purchase. Ive found that most of the time that Ive bought older video game lots of CL that the sellers are about my age and they are selling their collection for whatever reason. Ive never really bought anything that I thought might have been stolen.

[Parodius Duh!]

If you feel that bad toss him an extra 10 bucks. You not buying it isnt going to stop the game from being sold. Or buy it for the asking price and hand it right back over to the kid who is distraught because of its sale.

[Gameguy]

I would still buy it, the parent(s) would still try to sell the games to someone else if you decide not to buy it. Even if you gave it back to the kid it would just be sold again to someone else. Maybe the parents are doing it to punish their kid for some reason, maybe they aren't doing their homework or going to bed on time. Who knows for sure why it's all being sold as each situation is different.

If the kids are really bothered by it I'm sure they'll still remember it when it's time for them to take care of their parents decades later.

[Rickstilwell1]

I would first buy the item and hand them the money and say thanks. But once the item was in my hand I would tell them while walking away "oh by the way you're an asshole, your kid deserves better than you". It would be pretty funny.

[FayeC86]

I'd buy it and never give it a second thought. While parents aren't perfect, and wont always act in the best interest of the child, I have to assume they know the situation better than I do. Maybe the Kid has it coming. My parents always knew threatening to take away something I liked was a surefire way to get me to behave.

[ProjectCamaro]

I would still buy it; we cannot base our judgment on a couple seconds of what we see. I mean honestly how many times do children cry and complain when their parents do something, are parents supposed to always give into their children's desires to the point of the children ruling the house? As an individual who knows absolutely nothing about the situation I think it's completely unfair and unreasonable to instantly take the side of the young child over an adult. For all I know the kid stole money from his parents to buy the games and now the parents are selling them to recoup their stolen money.

I'll never understand how someone without any knowledge of the situation feels they deserve the right to judge others based on a couple seconds. How many things have we all done and said that could have been taken out of context if the entire story was not known?


But once the item was in my hand I would tell them while walking away "oh by the way you're an asshole, your kid deserves better than you". It would be pretty funny

I don't agree with this at all, you're automatically assuming the child is completely in the right and the parents are wrong without knowing the totality of the circumstances. All you'd be doing is giving the child validation when he might be in the wrong.

[JSoup]

Generally speaking, if something is for sale and I find the price reasonable, I generally don't have an issue buying it. There have been a few times that the purchase was soured a bit by the seller basically being in a bad way, but I figure the best thing I can do for him/her is buy the thing, as they need the money more than my pity.

This is what happened when I got my PS3. I got it from a guy on Craigslist for $120 (when they were going in store for $400), came with one game and no controllers. Went to the guys apartment, had just missed him as he thought he had time to go shopping with his family. Told him it wasn't a problem and waited for him. He rolled up an hour later with his very pregnant wife and six kids, then loaded all their food into the small studio apartment they lived in. That was two or so years ago and the system still works fine, so the only reason I could see for him selling it so low was the lack of controller and the extreme need for funds.


That's why I'm a collector. To reclaim the childhood I almost had.

That...strikes me as a bad reason to become a collector. This has "future hoarder" written all over it.

[scaleworm]

First: I am SO truly sorry that this did happen to you.

I never had anything as a game bundle sale happen to me, but being raised by a very mentally unstable father did have favorite toys of mine crushed in front of me by him in his anger fits (self was usually involved in these as well in being slapped about, and always verbally abused).

I had as a kid, with my siblings, a little B&W TV and an Atari 2600, with a few games, most that I had purchased with money I saved by shoveling snow in Detroit, as well as cutting lawns.

He would constantly be taking away the system or TV if we were playing it "too much", a stupid in retrospect approach to a child's "childhood", and then eventually took it all away, TV system and all the games I had purchased.

I still (to this day) get a tinge of fear playing games for any extended time, in fact, as typing this, realize this may be why I do not play them for as long as I should, and this is the source of my gaming anxiety?

You are not alone. Mental illness, by either parent (both in my case), really can screw up a kid/to adult's life, and the associations we form via these illnesses being push down (forced) upon kids, really messes them up in the long haul.

In response to your question " Would you still be able to buy it?” I had to really think on this.

I did so as the result of (while not identical by any means) your biography shared with us here, and by age (I am an older gamer/collector). I have cash, I have time, so I could easily "swoop in" on the bundle for the kill, BUT, if a child was involved, and fear or horror and crying, I do not know what I would do, in defense of the kid (of course, always the kid, they are truly helpless after-all, and fully dependent on parents, or adults for leadership, support, help, and defense). Whew, tough one. I would not buy, or I would, and then give it TO the kid, and if the "parent" had an issue with that, I'd double my offer and INSIST that the kid get the game/system back. As to a conversation with the parent" well that is a whole other conversation piece that I'd rather not sully your post with...

I have purchased games from kids in garage sale mode, but always they were selling them willingly, never forced.


There is a large developer's house (developed once owned) in my neighborhood that had a garage sale last summer, and the parents' have kids, and they are being forced out of the house (Repo), as well as his elder mother that lives with them, due to the recession.
They have truly lost all possessions. His elder (proud) daughter was helping as well selling some of her personal items...

As an avid tool user, and seeing him having to sell his tools, forced to sell his tools, I conversed with him, and his wife, and afterward felt SO bad I fought back tears and had to hug them both. I could NOT buy any tools, but watched as the vultures hovered around me/them, and did so, and were more than happy to do so.

People come with (sadly at times) a LOT of baggage. How we approach that and console or not that baggage is what (to me) makes us different than all other known life forms on Earth.

Damn, what a way to start a long work day (Your post, my retort).
I am sorry (sincerely) that this happened to you.

Being a parent, a truly involved compassionate, but responsible parent is the toughest job on Earth.

I would never trade this gig I have as one, for anything ON Earth.

[Polygon]

Even if I didn't buy the game, someone else would. So I have no problem buying something that someone else wants to sell.

I have to agree. Regardless of whether I buy it or not, they're going to sell it. I can understand how you feel as I was in a similar situation growing up. However, if they're going to sell it one way or another I see no reason to not buy it. Beside, I'm sure you've unknowingly bought used items in the past that it caused someone a good deal of pain to let go.

[recorderdude]

This thread has produced a lot of interesting opinions thus far, and I can agree with a lot that has been said. For the most part, someone else *would* buy the game after passing it up, and you can never tell exactly what the kid did. It's a very hard decision to make when you really think about it. My personal experience could likely blind me from considering many of the superior options to simply walking away, but, to be honest, I've yet to come across a situation such as this myself; as you said, most are kids my age selling games or parents whose kids want newer games like the newest FPS and need dough to buy it.
As for my life itself, my situation today is a little better than it was back then. My mother is a little more mentally stable, though she has to take a weekend in a hospital perhaps once every 2 months or so. My relationship with my father is as mixed as it always was (and always seems to be for teenagers and parents) and while I can never forget the sale, I can forgive him for not knowing the real value at the time by now; holding grudges that long against someone who loves you is more than foolish. While I still love video gaming, I try to keep my purchases very financially sound; I limit my total spending on entertainment/gaming as a whole to $50 each month (if that), and never spend what I do not have. I am selling doubles and games I do not personally enjoy but know others will more. This fall, I'll be going to a trade school/college for electronics, and dad demands all the games out of the house by then (even though I've organized my collection to occupy one tiny sliver of the basement along with my treadmill), so I'll probably ship them to close friends for safekeeping or put them in public storage.

Back to the issue, though, while the reason I became a collector was to get back what was sold, I've found myself opening up to a lot of other great titles on various systems. It's still my biggest goal, but not the only one, and not so dominant in my life that it consumes all of my time.

I really do appreciate the time everyone has put into their responses (especially scaleworm, I feel ya on the time troubles, for a while dad was limiting my ENTIRE usage of the TV for a day to one half-hour) and I think, more than anything, this has been a good way for me to vent about an issue most people I still know IRL (all near or over 50) would just laugh off.

[Final Boss]

If the game was incredibly rare and old and I had hunted for it for years, I'd buy it in a heartbeat. If I wouldn't, someone else would. And that someone else might just sell the game for ten times the price. But I'd promise to buy the kid any new game he wants (within reasonable limits - I'm not gonna get some child I don't even know a limited edition Metal Gear or anything like that). The kid would be too young to value the game for the reasons I would. As far as I know, he'd be pining after it because it was a fun game for him, not a treasure of immense sentimental value. I'm pretty sure I could fix that with a game from the current generation.

Everyone would be happy.


I would first buy the item and hand them the money and say thanks. But once the item was in my hand I would tell them while walking away "oh by the way you're an asshole, your kid deserves better than you". It would be pretty funny.

If this place had a vote system, this post would get +1 from me.

[bb_hood]

This fall, I'll be going to a trade school/college for electronics, and dad demands all the games out of the house by then (even though I've organized my collection to occupy one tiny sliver of the basement along with my treadmill), so I'll probably ship them to close friends for safekeeping or put them in public storage.

Back to the issue, though, while the reason I became a collector was to get back what was sold, I've found myself opening up to a lot of other great titles on various systems. It's still my biggest goal, but not the only one, and not so dominant in my life that it consumes all of my time.

I really do appreciate the time everyone has put into their responses (especially scaleworm, I feel ya on the time troubles, for a while dad was limiting my ENTIRE usage of the TV for a day to one half-hour) and I think, more than anything, this has been a good way for me to vent about an issue most people I still know IRL (all near or over 50) would just laugh off.

Alot of people have Dads that are hard-asses. I can totally see why you would be angry or traumatized at someone selling your valued games. Sure its an asshole move on his part and he obviously had no right to sell them if the games belonged to you. You do have a right to be angry, but you have to remember one important thing: he just wants you to succeed. Alot of people view watching TV and playing games to be a waste of time, and from reading this it seems that your father probably feels this way. Im not saying this should excuse his actions, but just keep in mind that he probably got rid of your stuff because he thought it was a distraction or potential distraction. In short, he probably got rid of your stuff because he cares about you, and not because he felt like being an asshole.

[JSoup]

If this place had a vote system, this post would get +1 from me.

Could always rate the thread up, there is a selection for that on the thin bar above the first post.

[Final Boss]

Oh, I'm afraid I can't do that. I'm not a communist :pimp:

[ProjectCamaro]

I would like to add to recorderdude and scaleworm that I am truly sorry for the situation you both grew up in and can completely empathize with both of you.

I'm a police officer and see on a daily basis how mental illness, drugs, etc... affect children. Most of the children believe that it's normal behavior from adults as it is all they know. Everything I do in those situations is for the kids, they are my only concern since they are the innocent bystanders forced into a situation that they have no control of.

I hope you both have sought help if not now at some point in your life. Seeking assistance is not a sign of weakness but strength and self-awareness of the situation you had forced upon yourself. You need an outlet and a safe way to work through the problems your childhood has caused you. It’s ok not to be strong and “ok” all the time and opening up in private to someone who do not know on a personal basis can do wonders for you.

[Atarileaf]

Its sad what happened to the OP but the tragic story of the mother aside (which I do feel bad about) from a buyers perspective, when I walk up to a yardsale or buy something from an ebay seller/craigslist/kijiji - I really don't care nor do I want to know their personal backstory. Just if the item works and what it costs. If I can get a good deal, fantastic.

I've seen the ebay and kijiji ads that go on about some wife or parent selling their husbands or kids games as some kind of punishment for this or that blah blah blah. I don't care.

If its for sale and up for grabs at a bargain basement price I'll jump on it and let the moral police whine that its wrong while they secretly wish it was them who got the deal.

[scaleworm]

I would like to add to recorderdude and scaleworm that I am truly sorry for the situation you both grew up in and can completely empathize with both of you.

I'm a police officer and see on a daily basis how mental illness, drugs, etc... affect children. Most of the children believe that it's normal behavior from adults as it is all they know. Everything I do in those situations is for the kids, they are my only concern since they are the innocent bystanders forced into a situation that they have no control of.

I hope you both have sought help if not now at some point in your life. Seeking assistance is not a sign of weakness but strength and self-awareness of the situation you had forced upon yourself. You need an outlet and a safe way to work through the problems your childhood has caused you. It’s ok not to be strong and “ok” all the time and opening up in private to someone who do not know on a personal basis can do wonders for you.

Great response, Totally in agreement with you here ProjectCamaro.
Kids are the products of good or bad parenting and being an inner city kid and teacher, I know exactly what you mean.

Rarity I agree is one thing, and yes, i guess by default I am more socialist that not (Hell, we live in a society that DOES public funding support teachers, schools, police, firefighters, social, mental health and medical systems, food production, waste water treatment, freeways, roads, drinking water, electricity (in our state), parks, shoreline, etc... so technically if the public good pays for society to perpetuate for the good all of this, for ALL, then indeed this is a socialist nation we live in (is that bad?, to retain a society?...

but I digress...

Back to rarity: if in the scenario one sees a sale against the seller (kid in this instance) and the item was stupid rare, I would walk, or double the asking price and pay if I REALLY needed it, giving the cash to teh kid. (as long as the idiot parent was not SO stupid as to have it so stupid cheap... gosh this gets more and more subjectively difficult....

Humans are worth more than inanimate any day in my book, and kids above all rule my priority system.

[Edmond Dantes]

I'm gonna be honest, topic starter...

if my dad did something like that, I'd fucking shoot him. My memories, the things that make me want to keep on living, versus his fucked-up ideals on "maturity"? Yeah, obvious answer there.

And if that scenario played out (the kid crying and begging for the game not to be sold)... well, if it was a game I REALLY wanted, I'd buy it, but my heart would kill me if I didn't reassure the kid or say something to the dad about how fucking stupid he is. If it came to a fist fight, so fucking be it.

I hope to god you somehow managed to get your memories back without paying too much, once you got away from that cocksucker.

(Sorry for the language in this post, but it had to be done)

[xelement5x]

Its sad what happened to the OP but the tragic story of the mother aside (which I do feel bad about) from a buyers perspective, when I walk up to a yardsale or buy something from an ebay seller/craigslist/kijiji - I really don't care nor do I want to know their personal backstory. Just if the item works and what it costs. If I can get a good deal, fantastic.

I've seen the ebay and kijiji ads that go on about some wife or parent selling their husbands or kids games as some kind of punishment for this or that blah blah blah. I don't care.

If its for sale and up for grabs at a bargain basement price I'll jump on it and let the moral police whine that its wrong while they secretly wish it was them who got the deal.

That's interesting. While I don't want to hear a sob story, a lot of times when I'm buying stuff from people on CL I ask about where they got the item. It's always neat to hear a story, and helps fill the time while I'm testing or looking over stuff. Rarely are the people i buy from locally colletors, they're normally just people looking to make some extra cash on old "junk".

One that specifically sticks out in my mind is a guy I bought a ton of stuff from. It was all in his storage unit and he was just clearing it out, he told me about how his grandpa bought the Master System for him and they used to play it together when he'd visit. When I was going through it all when I got home last night I almost teared up when I went through the instruction manuals and saw high score tables filled out with "Nathan" and "Grandpa".

That's the kind of stuff I'll try to keep in my collection as long as I can because I almost feel like I have my own personal connection to it.

[Aussie2B]

Generally speaking, if something is for sale and I find the price reasonable, I generally don't have an issue buying it. There have been a few times that the purchase was soured a bit by the seller basically being in a bad way, but I figure the best thing I can do for him/her is buy the thing, as they need the money more than my pity.

This is what happened when I got my PS3. I got it from a guy on Craigslist for $120 (when they were going in store for $400), came with one game and no controllers. Went to the guys apartment, had just missed him as he thought he had time to go shopping with his family. Told him it wasn't a problem and waited for him. He rolled up an hour later with his very pregnant wife and six kids, then loaded all their food into the small studio apartment they lived in. That was two or so years ago and the system still works fine, so the only reason I could see for him selling it so low was the lack of controller and the extreme need for funds.

While I feel bad for the kids, both in a general sense and if the PS3 happened to be played by them, it's really hard for me to feel bad for the parents. To be in that kind of situation and bring seven kids into the world is pure irresponsibility. Having kids isn't a privilege; it's a huge responsibility, both financially and otherwise, which deserves the respect of considering if you have the means to do so or not before you take the plunge. If you accidentally get pregnant and have one or two kids when you're not quite financially ready, okay, that's fine, and I can understand. You can make do. But seven kids? That's a pattern repeating over and over again, and they should have the maturity and wisdom to recognize that and use some birth control or something before they're cramming nine people into a studio apartment and burdening all of their children with a childhood of constant financial struggle and stress. With each additional child born, they're effectively making the standard of living for the older children worse and worse.

[sloan]

On one side of the argument, I believe I would say 'no' to buying the games or system if I saw a kid crying or otherwise protesting the sale. I just could not sleep well at night after doing so.

On the other side of the argument, what if the a-hole parents were selling something uber-rare like NES World Championship, Genesis MUSHA, or Atari VCS Chase the Chuckwagon for something like $10? I just believe it is a situation that I couldn't really say until I was put in it. My guess is that I would buy the rare item but say 'no' to the rest.

Like a poster above, I would most likely tell the parents what jerks they were being though.

[Atarileaf]

That's interesting. While I don't want to hear a sob story, a lot of times when I'm buying stuff from people on CL I ask about where they got the item. It's always neat to hear a story, and helps fill the time while I'm testing or looking over stuff. Rarely are the people i buy from locally colletors, they're normally just people looking to make some extra cash on old "junk".

One that specifically sticks out in my mind is a guy I bought a ton of stuff from. It was all in his storage unit and he was just clearing it out, he told me about how his grandpa bought the Master System for him and they used to play it together when he'd visit. When I was going through it all when I got home last night I almost teared up when I went through the instruction manuals and saw high score tables filled out with "Nathan" and "Grandpa".

That's the kind of stuff I'll try to keep in my collection as long as I can because I almost feel like I have my own personal connection to it.

I don't mind hearing stories on the history of the items or how it came to be in their possession, if they're a collector etc.

Here's another thing to consider - what if someone gives you a FAKE sob story in the hopes that you feel bad and pony up more dough.

"Oh I hate selling these games but we really need the money. My son needs an operation and the utility company is going to shut off our power tomorrow"

I've had that happen at a yard sale (the utility thing, not the operation part). Seller was telling EVERYONE at the sale about her personal problems and some did offer a bit more money for things.

Was any of it true? I don't know. Maybe, maybe not but I paid the asking price on the PS1 games and not a penny more.

[wiggyx]

Sad thread makes me sad :(


I'm not exactly sure what I would do. The scenario that you set up is sort of dramatic and I can't imagine that happening all too often in real life. I think I would most likely make the purchase though. Life is what it is, and I'm sure we've all had our big disappointments. I'm not the angry/stressed/overwhelmed parent in that situation, and I wouldn't be doing anyone a favor by picking up that poor child's emotions.

With social media being so invasive today, I may find that same kid's sob story 5 years later on a forum or a blog or wherever. If I did, I might be compelled to return it to him/her if that's where their heart still was. I can't tell you how many SNES lots I've purchased on eBay over the years, and hearing your story seriously makes me want pack one up and sent it to you.

[recorderdude]

I don't know how I'd feel if someone on here was the person that actually bought my lots so many years ago. It'd be...surprising, at the least.

As far as fake stories go, I've found one way that sometimes helps determine if a story's legit.

At one point, I was buying a few PS1 things from a mother selling her son's games. She seemed extremely relieved that someone was "finally buying these so my son can finally afford a car" for her asking price of 50 cents each, which I figured I wouldn't get lower than. Her son was there too, escatic that they were being sold.

I wasn't aware of the values at the time, but one of them was a CiB Intelligent Qube.

Another was a CiB longbox Primal Rage.

Then, I noticed something else in the corner.
She also had 3 PS1 GunCons for $1 each. I asked her if she would take $2 if I bought all three of them and she immediately agreed. Someone willing to take slightly LESS if more is bought as a whole as a bundle deal...that's someone who is genuine in their desire to sell, whatever their cause is. Perhaps, THEN, you throw them a few extra bucks if you feel bad for them. I wasn't compelled to myself since they were literally some of the last dollars I had to spend that day (and the main reason I asked about the guncons in the first place), but looking back on it, I probably would have if I knew the values and realized what an insane deal it was.

(all the games and guncons I bought worked great, btw)

On the other hand, I'm certainly not foreign to attempted seller cons involving kids. When I picked up a dreamcast from a local farmer's market for $25 (which, I will say, the seller tested and demonstrated the working capability of the system, which still works to this day), his son was wandering around the store, complimenting all of the games, especially more expensive ones. When I was purchasing my DC, the seller asked me what games I had for it. I told him I had SA2 and the seller immediately suggested I purchase a copy of SA1 as well to go with it, and that he had plenty of them...as he showed an obviously burned disc in a case. When I refused, the kid went APESHIT saying I needed to buy one because they needed the money. His dad obviously had trained him to help push sympathetic fools into buying more, but the kid couldn't act at all - no dice with me. Honestly, I sorta had to pry him away as I left with my DC. His father looked pretty embarassed.

[sloan]

OP: Who set those BIN prices? You, or your dad?

What is your relationship like with your father currently?

Also, I stated earlier that if I saw a kid crying or protesting the sale, I would decline to buy. However, it should be pointed out that when a person buy's ebay auctions, it is impossible to know if some jerk parent is somehow punishing his/her kid.

On a similar note, I went to a retro game store a while back and looked at their VCS selection. The store clerk asked if I was interested in seeing some more rare VCS games. I said 'yes' and he brought a box from the back room. The games in that box obviously came from a collector. Homebrews like Dungeon, Pac Man Arcade, and Berzerk VE, along with rare stuff like Road Runner and Off the Wall CIB. I was saddened to know that a collector probably fell on hard times and had to sell his collection to this shop. Knowing the low-ball rates shops like that pay for people's stuff, it made me extra sad. I did buy a couple homebrew titles without any remorse though, since the collector had already sold the stuff to this shop.

[recorderdude]

Pops set the BiNs, my relationship with him now is much more positive, though it's incredibly bipolar; we're either having the time of our lives or at eachother's throats at any given time, though we do enjoy our time together more. I sincerely respect how hard it was to raise me while mom was in and out of mental wards (he divorced her years ago for financial reasons, but he still tries his hardest to help her and remains there for her no matter what); he tells me all the time he had to be tougher on me growing up since he had to play both mom and dad in my life, and he's got plenty to worry about besides that. Despite being a billingual science/math teacher and a professional artist he couldn't get a job for years. Thankfully, he's had a bit of luck with an art job recently and may FINALLY get his foot into the art world again. He's likely worried now that i'll take collecting so far that I'll end up buying myself into debt and foregoing all my intellectual pursuits, mainly because of one of our friends. This person is there for us when we really need him, but his hobbies absolutely dominate his life. He's almost 50 years old, buys a crapton of slabbed/graded comics and is stuck between deciding to keep them or sell them, putting him in a destructive limbo between collector and reseller. He's in debt all the time and getting in further every time he digs himself out. I can completely understand dad's fear due to the presence of that good friend in our lives.

As for reclaiming the games, I'm doing so in a very, VERY slow manner. I don't even know if I'll have half of them before I head off to college. As much as I'd love play them all again super soon, I know I've got to spend responsibly, and can't even push myself to spend more than $20 any time I go to a game store.

[Atarileaf]

I'm gonna be honest, topic starter...

if my dad did something like that, I'd fucking shoot him. My memories, the things that make me want to keep on living, versus his fucked-up ideals on "maturity"? Yeah, obvious answer there.

And if that scenario played out (the kid crying and begging for the game not to be sold)... well, if it was a game I REALLY wanted, I'd buy it, but my heart would kill me if I didn't reassure the kid or say something to the dad about how fucking stupid he is. If it came to a fist fight, so fucking be it.

I hope to god you somehow managed to get your memories back without paying too much, once you got away from that cocksucker.

(Sorry for the language in this post, but it had to be done)

Dude you have some serious issues if you put video games above a family member. Video games are "the things that make me want to keep on living"? @_@

Serious, serious issues. :help:

I lost both my parents to cancer at a young age and although my father and I didn't have the greatest relationship, if someone called him a cocksucker because he didn't want me to play video games, that person would be carrying their teeth home in a little baggie. :vamp:

[wiggyx]

Meh, depends on the family member. If they put you that low on the totem pole, then it only makes sense to return the favor.

[Atarileaf]

Meh, depends on the family member. If they put you that low on the totem pole, then it only makes sense to return the favor.

Read that guys post again and tell me that he's not seriously screwed up.

[wiggyx]

I think I understood it pretty well, and based on my own some of my personal family dynamic, I empathize.

[Edmond Dantes]

Dude you have some serious issues if you put video games above a family member. Video games are "the things that make me want to keep on living"? @_@

Serious, serious issues. :help:

EDIT - Less asshole-ish version.

I think some people could stand to re-evaluate their notions of "family" and what's healthy and normal.

When you think about it, what's so special about "family?" It's just random who you end up having as a mother, father or sibling. It's really as meaningless a connection as "we were in the same kindergarten class."

Besides, that dad who is getting onto you about your hobbies and interests (such as video games, in the OP's case)? Nine times out of ten, the father has some pet interest he's equally geeky about. Maybe he collects audiocasettes or something, or used cars. And as you get older, you start to realize how dumb your parents really are, that they're no different than most of the other human race. That being the case, why do they deserve any particular respect?

Please tell me its not "because they gave birth to you." You never asked them to, and most of the time the child was an unintended consequence, not the main intention.

[recorderdude]

While I can't agree with absolutely everything in that post, as I accept my father for who he is due to the fact that he still tried his hardest to raise me without any assistance, and, to be honest, a lot of extra baggage, I can safely say my father is obsessed with 1920s sheet music. Every time he goes to the reuzit shop he rummages through boxes of it to pick out tunes, there's certain songs he looks for...just like game collecting. I suggested printing it out, but he wants to collect the real deal. He plays it every night on our digital piano, too. He also watches a lot of 50s and 60s dramas on the THIS station all day, and pans me for loving animated media while despising it himself.

I'm a fan of a lot of gaming music, but he's sort of off-and-on with what he likes (he seemed to be okay with "katamari on the swing") and what he hates (any chip music ever).

Of course, as a kid, he grew up mainly in the 70s and hung with hippies. His parents hated the popular music at the time and were against him getting a guitar or doing anything other than continuing the family business of barbery. I'm sure at some point he decided he was going to ensure that his kid went to school and to college and did something they wanted to, and had goals to be a better father than his was. Looking upon my childhood, I hope that I am not necessarily "Better" than my father, but both more fortunate in the fate of my wife and more understanding that each generation is going to have something the previous one finds really stupid (and that there's a good chance my kids won't like old video games at all), but try to look into it better instead of writing it off like my dad did.

[Greg2600]

You have to break the chain of being a jerk, and sounds like you did. My grandfather had a violent temper and was not supportive of his kids that much, which my father always said he would refuse to behave like.

As for whether to buy someone else's collection? How would we know? I've found that most of the time when mom or dad try to sell their kids' stuff, it's in terrible condition and a waste of money. I've found that when someone sells their own games from childhood, they are in far better condition.

[Aussie2B]

EDIT - Less asshole-ish version.

I think some people could stand to re-evaluate their notions of "family" and what's healthy and normal.

When you think about it, what's so special about "family?" It's just random who you end up having as a mother, father or sibling. It's really as meaningless a connection as "we were in the same kindergarten class."

Besides, that dad who is getting onto you about your hobbies and interests (such as video games, in the OP's case)? Nine times out of ten, the father has some pet interest he's equally geeky about. Maybe he collects audiocasettes or something, or used cars. And as you get older, you start to realize how dumb your parents really are, that they're no different than most of the other human race. That being the case, why do they deserve any particular respect?

Please tell me its not "because they gave birth to you." You never asked them to, and most of the time the child was an unintended consequence, not the main intention.

Wow, that's gotta be one of the most cynical things I've read in a LONG time. I'm genuinely sorry that your family relationships must be so sour to the extent to give you such a view on family bonds.

As for why parents deserve respect, how about the fact that they raise you, make sacrifices for you, spend an inordinate amount of money on you, deal with every annoying, stupid, or distressing thing you've ever done, and in general put you ahead of them? Sure, there are some fucked up parents who don't do these things, but the vast majority do.

Nobody is perfect, not even parents. They're human like the rest of us, so some of the things they do are wrong. Sometimes they do things that are hurtful or hypocritical, sure, but if you save your love only for people who are absolutely perfect, you're going to be pretty damn lonely in life. That's why people talk about "unconditional love" when discussing family. They see your flaws but still love you in spite of them. I don't care how close two friends are, you can't trust a friend to always stay by your side like a loving family member. I've even had a friend who went on and on about how he saw me like family, only to cut me off the second I said something that pissed him off. Family isn't so fickle. You can only truly count on your family and spouse in life; nobody else will ever care about you in quite the same way. And I really pity anyone unfortunate enough to not have a good relationship with family, especially if you get bitter to the point of not even being willing to put in the effort to nurture good family relationships yourself (better to try and get rejected, since at least you have a chance, than to automatically write people off and have zero chance of things improving).

[Rickstilwell1]

I would still buy it; we cannot base our judgment on a couple seconds of what we see. I mean honestly how many times do children cry and complain when their parents do something, are parents supposed to always give into their children's desires to the point of the children ruling the house? As an individual who knows absolutely nothing about the situation I think it's completely unfair and unreasonable to instantly take the side of the young child over an adult. For all I know the kid stole money from his parents to buy the games and now the parents are selling them to recoup their stolen money.

I'll never understand how someone without any knowledge of the situation feels they deserve the right to judge others based on a couple seconds. How many things have we all done and said that could have been taken out of context if the entire story was not known?



I don't agree with this at all, you're automatically assuming the child is completely in the right and the parents are wrong without knowing the totality of the circumstances. All you'd be doing is giving the child validation when he might be in the wrong.

This was assuming I knew exactly what happened as recorderdude mentioned. If I didn't know for sure then I just wouldn't know anything messed up was going on.

[Ed Oscuro]

With a story like that, it must be hard to remember loyalty to one's family for a moment. Yet, painful though it may be, you should take this up with him, not with us. We can only be sightseers in this sad business.

I hope you manage to recover some of your peace.

As to the topic title, I'm just a custodian of things, yet I fear that everything we attempt to grasp onto will eventually slip away. If somebody who sold me something once asked for it back, I would probably sell it back to them, with only a few exceptions. But I think that giving back a game is not the same as giving a person peace.

[Gameguy]

Nobody is perfect, not even parents. They're human like the rest of us, so some of the things they do are wrong. Sometimes they do things that are hurtful or hypocritical, sure, but if you save your love only for people who are absolutely perfect, you're going to be pretty damn lonely in life. That's why people talk about "unconditional love" when discussing family. They see your flaws but still love you in spite of them. I don't care how close two friends are, you can't trust a friend to always stay by your side like a loving family member. I've even had a friend who went on and on about how he saw me like family, only to cut me off the second I said something that pissed him off. Family isn't so fickle. You can only truly count on your family and spouse in life; nobody else will ever care about you in quite the same way. And I really pity anyone unfortunate enough to not have a good relationship with family, especially if you get bitter to the point of not even being willing to put in the effort to nurture good family relationships yourself (better to try and get rejected, since at least you have a chance, than to automatically write people off and have zero chance of things improving).
I think I understand what you're getting at. Make sure to only choose an existing close family member to be your spouse as outsiders can't be trusted. I guess that might work for some people but it sounds a bit disgusting and creepy.

[wiggyx]

Wow, that's gotta be one of the most cynical things I've read in a LONG time. I'm genuinely sorry that your family relationships must be so sour to the extent to give you such a view on family bonds.

As for why parents deserve respect, how about the fact that they raise you, make sacrifices for you, spend an inordinate amount of money on you, deal with every annoying, stupid, or distressing thing you've ever done, and in general put you ahead of them? Sure, there are some fucked up parents who don't do these things, but the vast majority do.

Nobody is perfect, not even parents. They're human like the rest of us, so some of the things they do are wrong. Sometimes they do things that are hurtful or hypocritical, sure, but if you save your love only for people who are absolutely perfect, you're going to be pretty damn lonely in life. That's why people talk about "unconditional love" when discussing family. They see your flaws but still love you in spite of them. I don't care how close two friends are, you can't trust a friend to always stay by your side like a loving family member. I've even had a friend who went on and on about how he saw me like family, only to cut me off the second I said something that pissed him off. Family isn't so fickle. You can only truly count on your family and spouse in life; nobody else will ever care about you in quite the same way. And I really pity anyone unfortunate enough to not have a good relationship with family, especially if you get bitter to the point of not even being willing to put in the effort to nurture good family relationships yourself (better to try and get rejected, since at least you have a chance, than to automatically write people off and have zero chance of things improving).

You said it yourself, there are parents that DON'T do right. They deserve nothing in return from their children.

[InsaneDavid]

You said it yourself, there are parents that DON'T do right. They deserve nothing in return from their children.

I don't agree with that. No reason for anyone to reciprocate being an asshole. It's called taking the higher road, something I wish more people could do.

[JSoup]

I don't agree with that. No reason for anyone to reciprocate being an asshole. It's called taking the higher road, something I wish more people could do.

Despite my extreme cynicism and generally bleak outlook on humanity, I agree. My grandmother is one of the worst human beings I've ever met in my life, but I still spend half my time at her house making sure she doesn't kill herself in a kitchen accident or something. It's called doing the right thing.

[MachineGex]

As a dad, I am always trying to balance my son's gaming. Too much games and he simply has a difficult time listening after he plays too much.

Having a 9 year old son, I know for a fact if he plays too much(video games), his behavior starts to suffer. It simply isn't good for him to play games all the time. Before I had a kid, I heard parents say the same thing and thought they were full of shiat. But I know when he plays more than an hour a day, his behavior suffer greatly. It is almost like an addiction.

[wiggyx]

I don't agree with that. No reason for anyone to reciprocate being an asshole. It's called taking the higher road, something I wish more people could do.

I'm not saying one should reciprocate with asshole-like behavior, but rather that holding onto the notion that "blood is thicker than water" or "family will always be there" as so many have asserted isn't always a decision which will benefit one's mental health.

Essentially, if they can't be loving parents, then they shouldn't receive no love in return. That's no being an asshole, it's keeping yourself safe from the frustration and disappointment that will inevitably follow if you continue to try and earn their love/affection/attention/etc.

I'm just bothered by people insisting that their way is the only way. I.e. Statements like "family is all you can ever trust". That's an opinion based on personal experience, yet it's presented as empirical data. That's not something you can spread like margarine all over everyone's family dynamic. It's all too easy for a complete stranger, via the web no less, to criticize someone about their method for dealing with their problems. We are all unique. What works for one person will not always work for another. That's all I'm driving at.

[xelement5x]

I don't mind hearing stories on the history of the items or how it came to be in their possession, if they're a collector etc.

Here's another thing to consider - what if someone gives you a FAKE sob story in the hopes that you feel bad and pony up more dough.

"Oh I hate selling these games but we really need the money. My son needs an operation and the utility company is going to shut off our power tomorrow"

I've had that happen at a yard sale (the utility thing, not the operation part). Seller was telling EVERYONE at the sale about her personal problems and some did offer a bit more money for things.

Was any of it true? I don't know. Maybe, maybe not but I paid the asking price on the PS1 games and not a penny more.

Heh, good point.

Slightly off topic, but most sob stories in general just make me shut down and go into a whole other mode. When I was younger I worked retail and call centers and I've heard it all, at this point I can just feel when people are trying to get something out of you from the tone of their voice and mannerisms so all I just cut off all sympathy for them. I know I might sound like a dick here, but in general people who beg might get my sympathy or empathy; but not my respect.

[sloan]

Heh, good point.
I know I might sound like a dick here, but in general people who beg might get my sympathy or empathy; but not my respect.

One day, you could find yourself in similar straits. Are you telling me you will deserve no respect if you find yourself in need of someone else's sympathy or empathy? What comes around goes around.

[Edmond Dantes]

Wow, that's gotta be one of the most cynical things I've read in a LONG time. I'm genuinely sorry that your family relationships must be so sour to the extent to give you such a view on family bonds.

It's not cynicism. It's being realistic and thinking thoroughly about such views.

In particular, the idea that parents deserve any special treatment is an idea both wearying and warying. You said it yourself:


Nobody is perfect, not even parents. They're human like the rest of us, so some of the things they do are wrong. Sometimes they do things that are hurtful or hypocritical, sure, but if you save your love only for people who are absolutely perfect, you're going to be pretty damn lonely in life.

But think about that in reverse: do you then think I should unconditionally love every random joe I meet? Obviously if I followed such a rule, I would be opening myself to abuse. With parents its no different. Heck, there are many kids who were taken away from their biological parents and placed with a surrogate family, and were much better for it.

That two people had a wild night of passion and I was the result doesn't in any way entail that I owe them something. Or at least, it shouldn't. If I had asked for them and they had asked for me, then it would be different.


I don't agree with that. No reason for anyone to reciprocate being an asshole. It's called taking the higher road, something I wish more people could do.

If there's something I wish more people would do, it would be judging situations on a case-by-case basis.

Taking the high road, being honorable, being sagely, etc... Those are awesome maybe 10% of the time, but the other 90% you're basically handing aggressors free reign to walk all over you.

[InsaneDavid]

Taking the high road, being honorable, being sagely, etc... Those are awesome maybe 10% of the time, but the other 90% you're basically handing aggressors free reign to walk all over you.

Never once have I allowed anyone walk over me in my life. I learned from an early age to mind all the percentages, hedge all my bets, and to see things from every angle. Everything in life favors the bold and sometimes stepping back and playing things as they lie is the boldest move one can make.

[Edmond Dantes]

I agree with that.

I just don't agree with values that come down to "doing/feeling X is always right in every situation and anything else is wrong."

[Aussie2B]

I think my previous post was pretty clear in that I was presenting the general, most common scenario. If you guys want to complain about people making statements along the lines of "This applies to everyone", look to the post that I was replying to, that suggests that all children owe nothing to their parents and that family bonds are of no greater value than those with any other random person.


I think I understand what you're getting at. Make sure to only choose an existing close family member to be your spouse as outsiders can't be trusted. I guess that might work for some people but it sounds a bit disgusting and creepy.

Is this an attempt at a joke that fell completely flat on its face or what? :? Everybody knows that family doesn't have to be related by blood to count as "family". Adopted children are just as much family as biological children, and if you, say, get married and have kids, would you introduce them as "These kids are my family, and this is my wife" or would you just say "This is my family"? If someone takes your name, they're joining your family. Even if they don't, or even if you're not married, if you're committed on that kind of level, you're family. I consider my fiance and his family as much my family as my blood family. I've lived with them for over 10 years, and his family treats me no different from if I was an actual daughter/sister.

[Gameguy]

Is this an attempt at a joke that fell completely flat on its face or what? :?
For the most part. You went on to say that nobody in life would be as close as family, no matter how close you became with friends they would still be unreliable and untrustworthy. Then you said an exception as a person's spouse. What is a spouse then? It's clear you contradicted your own point about family right in the same paragraph, it's certainly possible to completely trust someone who isn't family. You made it sound that if people aren't related there's no way for that to happen.

[Edmond Dantes]

Wow, that's gotta be one of the most cynical things I've read in a LONG time. I'm genuinely sorry that your family relationships must be so sour to the extent to give you such a view on family bonds.

As for why parents deserve respect, how about the fact that they raise you, make sacrifices for you, spend an inordinate amount of money on you, deal with every annoying, stupid, or distressing thing you've ever done, and in general put you ahead of them? Sure, there are some fucked up parents who don't do these things, but the vast majority do.

Nobody is perfect, not even parents. They're human like the rest of us, so some of the things they do are wrong. Sometimes they do things that are hurtful or hypocritical, sure, but if you save your love only for people who are absolutely perfect, you're going to be pretty damn lonely in life. That's why people talk about "unconditional love" when discussing family. They see your flaws but still love you in spite of them. I don't care how close two friends are, you can't trust a friend to always stay by your side like a loving family member. I've even had a friend who went on and on about how he saw me like family, only to cut me off the second I said something that pissed him off. Family isn't so fickle. You can only truly count on your family and spouse in life; nobody else will ever care about you in quite the same way. And I really pity anyone unfortunate enough to not have a good relationship with family, especially if you get bitter to the point of not even being willing to put in the effort to nurture good family relationships yourself (better to try and get rejected, since at least you have a chance, than to automatically write people off and have zero chance of things improving).


I think my previous post was pretty clear in that I was presenting the general, most common scenario.

If that was meant to come off as "general" and "common sense" it failed. It was neither.

[Atarileaf]

if my dad did something like that, I'd fucking shoot him. My memories, the things that make me want to keep on living, versus his fucked-up ideals on "maturity"? Yeah, obvious answer there.

I don't care what kind of relationship someone has or doesn't have with his parents, this is a MASSIVELY screwed up individual to say something like this

(1) Shooting a father over selling video games
(2) Saying that video games are what makes you want to keep living

I'm sorry but there's some serious warning bells that should be going off with the people who ARE close to you if this is how you talk and act in real life. This is beyond cynical, this is deep, dark, disturbed "someone call a shrink before this guy kills someone" crap going on here.

[peeingas]

Whenever someone writes something like "I'm selling my kid's old games" it immediately makes me suspicious. Writing something like that is often a way of lulling a buyer into a false sense of superiority. A way of making the buyer think you know nothing about what you are selling, when in fact often you do.

[sloan]

I don't care what kind of relationship someone has or doesn't have with his parents, this is a MASSIVELY screwed up individual to say something like this

(1) Shooting a father over selling video games
(2) Saying that video games are what makes you want to keep living

I'm sorry but there's some serious warning bells that should be going off with the people who ARE close to you if this is how you talk and act in real life. This is beyond cynical, this is deep, dark, disturbed "someone call a shrink before this guy kills someone" crap going on here.

I tend to agree. Looks to me like someone who might go into an Aurora, Colorado movie theater with guns a blazing.

[Ed Oscuro]

Man this thread went off the tracks. Lay off the sanctimony people. Just because somebody hates their parents doesn't make them the target of hate and spree shooter comparisons...they need your love.

And I'm all ready for the luvin'.

[Tanooki]

I don't know I really don't. I mean the way I'd see it is not knowing anything more than a pissed looking parent and some crying kid about their stuff going on. You'd have to draw the conclusion likely they did something pretty horrible, and that regardless if they did or not (your problem, a hater on games parent) the seller is an asshole for selling their kids stuff instead of putting it up as a punishment. I'd probably buy it, but give the guy a blasting for being a horrible person after I had it in my hands as stealing your kids stuff and hawking it off for a few bucks to get even (which is what it is) is a bullshit and damaging thing to do as they won't forget it, ever. I'm not certain I'd take the stuff, but I'd probably realize as others did that the loser parent would just push it off to the next person anyway so if it's something one needed you might as well just take it as being all personally moral won't change the asshole is going to sell their kids stuff and will.

[Nature Boy]

It's just random who you end up having as a mother, father or sibling.

Don't forget to mention this in your letters to your World Vision sponsored child - it will make them feel better to know people in more affluent countries feel the same way they do!

Moving on...

It makes sense that if it was a more rare item that I'd be more inclined to buy it, as opposed to a common item, where I'd be more likely to walk away. It would have nothing to do with feeling guilt though - it would be about wanting to get out of an awkward situation as soon as I feel I am able to. With an item I perceived as rare, I'm pretty sure I'd be willing to stick it out until I got the item.

The relationship between the parent/child is none of my business. I think it's naive to presume I would know anything about what's going on having never met either person before in my life. Excepting violence that is - that makes it pretty obvious as to what's going on, and that would make it my business.

[Gameguy]

Don't forget to mention this in your letters to your World Vision sponsored child - it will make them feel better to know people in more affluent countries feel the same way they do!
A lot of sources discourage those sponsoring a specific child type programs, instead of helping an entire community become self sufficient by fixing the real problems it just creates short term benefits to one specific person. It's better to give to charities that focus on helping the entire community instead.

It doesn't really have anything to do with the topic in this thread, but it's one more legitimate reason to dislike the guilt trip style infomercials that are constantly aired on TV.

[Edmond Dantes]

Love all this "family values" stuff.

My dad once forced me to stop trying to talk a girl out of committing suicide. He claimed I was spending more time with her than with "the family" and that "the family" was more important, and that unless I was gonna marry her, her fate was unimportant.

But according to what I'm hearing here, he's right and I'm wrong, because Father Knows Best.