Worst PS1 RPGs

[Nz17]

What are the (in your opinion) worst original PlayStation role-playing games? Whether it is awful graphics, terrible voice acting, unlikable characters, repetitive music, grating sound effects, broken game-play, poor mechanics, or flawed design, which PSX RPG is king of crud? (Or at least a part of the royal court.)

Though I can't say that it is -THE- worst RPG on PlayStation 1, The Granstream Saga is mighty, mighty cruddy.

[FoxNtd]

I thought Azure Dreams was one of the most annoyingly poorly designed games I've ever seen not just on PS but in general for the RPG genre.

[kupomogli]

My opinion for worst PSX RPGs are Eternal Eyes, Monster Seed, and Hoshigami. Best are Brigandine, Brigandine Grand Edition, and Tactics Ogre. Coincidence both my favorites and least favorites are TRPGs.

Aside from maybe Shadow Madness which I own but haven't played, the worst of your standard PSX RPGs are still good games, atleast debatably. As difficult as it is, I actually like Beyond the Beyond. My least favorite is actually a highly praised RPG that everyone loves for some reason, and no it's not a highly praised actual good RPG(like how some people who hate on FF7.)

My least favorite out of those I've played though is Valkyrie Profile and since I know there are people who will go :O, but it's my opinion and I'll explain why. The entire game you're doing two things. You're watching story bits that only rarely interconnect on how characters have died and then get those characters to join your party and most of the storyline isn't good except the opening scene when you get your first two characters and a few hidden scenes. After getting allies on your party, you go back to the dungeons that give you the most experience and grind the characters levels by killing every enemy in the dungeon, leaving, then reentering, then make sure you send them to the other world before going to the next chapter. Once characters start starting with 999 points, you really have no need to grind since you can just use all those points and send the characters as they are.

The battle system system is just as repetitive as what you're doing the entire game. You will find one good tactic for each enemy type and you will constantly use and reuse that same tactic ever battle, or every turn in each battle. Each character can attack 1-3 times depending on their equipped weapon and each attack is different to where you might knock an enemy up, knock them back, etc. You'll need to use the attacks in a specific order to make sure each one hits them. Your goal is to find a group of attacks that will get you 100% so you can use your special attacks, although you'd probably be better off finding a two group team that can get 100% or three group team, so you could always use the third character for healing if needed and still take maximum damage. It's a great battle system at first but when you're doing the same thing from the first time you enter battle to the last round of the last boss fight, repetition sets in way way way before you get near the end of the game.

So hit select to find where you need to go in order to get the new character, go to the hardest very small dungeon and grind for exp doing the same set of combos each round, slightly new set with your new character, send the character to Odin, repeat.

I own but haven't played Valkyrie Profile 2, and while the battle system is the same repetitive battle system of the original, you actually have a progressive storyline and dungeons where getting further into the game you'll actually be required to go to new areas, new dungeons, and actually lead towards something rather than, hey, keep going to these same dungeons you've unlocked since chapter two or three to level people up and feel like you've gained literally no progress while doing the same thing endlessly.

[Aussie2B]

Valkyrie Profile doesn't require grinding or returning to the same dungeon more than once, not at the beginning of the game nor end. In fact, you could skip some dungeons completely if you wanted. And the battle system in VP2 is very different. It's like Star Ocean 3 + Valkyrie Profile + Star Ocean: Blue Sphere.

Anyway, I've focused on acquiring the "big-name" RPGs for the most part, so I've yet to try several of the budget RPGs from no-name developers/publishers. Monsterseed seems pretty lousy from what little I've played, though. Darkstone seems lame too. But for RPGs I've actually played to completion and can give a genuinely informed opinion on, I'd say Final Fantasy VII and Chrono Cross were the PlayStation RPGs I've least enjoyed so far. I kinda hate to name RPGs that are competently made at the very least in a "Worst RPGs" topic, and I know they're loved by many but I'm honestly not trying to be inflammatory. I've just yet to play through a truly awful RPG on PlayStation, and while I don't think those games are close to being terrible on the level of something like Bubsy 3D, I did indeed dislike them.

[tom]

Japanese RPGs

[FoxNtd]

Totally forgot about Valkyrie Profile. As soon as the game started I just really hated the way it was laid out. Hated it enough I just shut it off and got rid of the game. :-\

[JakeM]

I thought Azure Dreams was one of the most annoyingly poorly designed games I've ever seen not just on PS but in general for the RPG genre.

Its a Rouge-like though.

[Tron 2.0]

Beyond the Beyond nuff said :p

[BricatSegaFan]

I'm probably going to take a lot of flak but....Final Fantasy 7.

Everyone made a huge deal about this game, I finally played it by the time FFX was out. Boy was I let down. I couldn't get into the story and the characters were a bit forgettable to me. Every one talked it up as the best game ever to grace my unworthy face.

[JakeM]

I'm probably going to take a lot of flak but....Final Fantasy 7.

Everyone made a huge deal about this game, I finally played it by the time FFX was out. Boy was I let down. I couldn't get into the story and the characters were a bit forgettable to me. Every one talked it up as the best game ever to grace my unworthy face.

How far did you get in it? The story gets way better further on, and the things Cloud goes through are interesting. The ecological and spiritual themes are handled well, surprising the same company later made that horrible movie. The music is unforgettable.

[o.pwuaioc]

VII is not the worst, though perhaps VIII is. VII is just highly overrated. IX was mostly quality, though.

[Bloodreign]

Beyond the Beyond nuff said :p
There's nothing really wrong with that game, it gave me quite a challenge when it first came out. Sure it's not a beautiful game, nor does it really have to be. The enemy rate encounters are high, but I got through it all save for finding the games last stone tablet to get to the final boss, but find it I did eventually.

I for one like Beyond the Beyond, my first PS1 RPG I purchased, but not the first one I ever finished (Dragon Warrior 4 NES gets that honor).

[Tron 2.0]

There's nothing really wrong with that game, it gave me quite a challenge when it first came out. Sure it's not a beautiful game, nor does it really have to be. The enemy rate encounters are high, but I got through it all save for finding the games last stone tablet to get to the final boss, but find it I did eventually.

I for one like Beyond the Beyond, my first PS1 RPG I purchased, but not the first one I ever finished (Dragon Warrior 4 NES gets that honor).
You mention what you thought what was great about it,but i didn't i like it.If any thing i thought it broke the game and it's not one of camelot software finest 'if you ask me.I do remember after i completed the game i sold it not to long afterwards.

[Daltone]

I don't know if Shadow Madness is the worst, but it is certainly not good. It's just... boring to play, even for a (wannabe) JRPG. Kings Field (which I understand is actually Kings Field II) also falls in to the "so dull I want to claw my eyes out" category.

[LaughingMAN.S9]

There are a couple of rpgs that i own that i suspect are corny (rhapsody: a musical adventure and jade cocoon for example) but from the ones i've played definetly legend of dragoon and ogre battle


To be fair i didnt get to far in either and ogre battle looked like it have been pretty decent over time once i got past the graphics and gameplay but legend of dragoon just fucking bored me to tears, everything about it looked wack, graphics were horrible, dialog was horrible, battle system horrible, music horrible, basically everything about that game was screaming for me to gtfo of there and never return, which i have done.

[Rickstilwell1]

There's nothing really wrong with that game, it gave me quite a challenge when it first came out. Sure it's not a beautiful game, nor does it really have to be. The enemy rate encounters are high, but I got through it all save for finding the games last stone tablet to get to the final boss, but find it I did eventually.

I for one like Beyond the Beyond, my first PS1 RPG I purchased, but not the first one I ever finished (Dragon Warrior 4 NES gets that honor).

That was actually one of my favorite PS1 RPGs and I replayed it 10 times so far. Like most RPGs as a teen I used Gameshark the first time to skip the grinding and saved that challenge for later playthroughs. By then I knew where pretty much everything in the game was and was pretty sure I've encountered every monster in the game, including the rare Demon Bat which is formed by a group of bats in the last cave when enough team up (looks just like the monster called Burial)

I haven't actually hated any RPGs for Playstation yet but there are some that I feel are less organized when it comes to keeping track of in-game items. As choppy and ugly Darkstone looks it actually plays quite well. I really liked King's Field games but Shadow Tower seems a bit "off" to me.

[CastlevaniaDude]

Final Fantasy VII bored me to tears.

[Jorpho]

Though I can't say that it is -THE- worst RPG on PlayStation 1, The Granstream Saga is mighty, mighty cruddy.Really? Isn't that supposed to be the followup to SoulBlazer/Illusion of Gaia/Terranigma?
http://www.hardcoregaming101.net/quintet/quintet4.htm

[Rob2600]

Does Tail of the Sun count as an RPG? If it does, that's the worst.

[aguy]

While it got good reviews for the time, I thought Wild Arms was crap. The story is meh, the sfx during battle are horrible (literally sounds like you are beating a monkey), and the 3d rendered battle graphics are the worst.

[kupomogli]

While it got good reviews for the time, I thought Wild Arms was crap. The story is meh, the sfx during battle are horrible (literally sounds like you are beating a monkey), and the 3d rendered battle graphics are the worst.

It's your opinion, but I disagree with everything but the sound effects, and even if all the story wasn't very good, does gameplay not matter anymore? As for the 3D battle graphics being the worst, they look better than other 3D renders on the system. The one I'm using as a comparison is outside of combat, but still a 3D render. There really was no point to give the characters in Wild ARMs big heads, because unlike Brave Fencer Musashi who had a behemoth sized head bigger than his upper body, his head was big to add detail to his face.

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b334/kupomogli/waff7_zps75ac7d15.png

[Manhattan Sports Club]

I prefer SNES for RPGs as opposed to PS1 because the latter are bombast on cinematics, loadtimes, and ugly 3D rendering/textures that contaminates most early 3D games! That, and 2D ages better than 3D (and we know PS1 was actually a shitter when it came to competant 2D).

Grandia gets my vote. I own the Saturn version and bought the english PS1 version on PS1, and have been struggling to understand the comparison between this game and FF7. Now, for a while I was on the "hate FF7" bandwagon until I lightened up, finished the game, and enjoyed it without taking it too seriously. But how the hell Grandia even compares is beyond me. The game is painfully linear and the only real redeeming factor is the battle system. Everything looks like shit too, moreso in the PS1 version. I would rank that one more harshly not just because of its technical shortcomings in comparison to the Saturn version, but because there are way better RPGs that I like on PS1. For a Saturn RPG it could get away with that criticism, but it was mostly disappointing. Some who praised the game claimed the lighthearted nature as one of the appeals storywise (which I do understand). They also said they'd rather replay Grandia than FF7, I assume because of the novelty of it being underrated in the west. But for me it's the latter.

Eternal Eyes was novel to me when I first played it because I had little exposure to RPGs back in the late 90s/early 00s, and was just getting ahold of these games. Plus, it was cheap. But in retrospect it was really a lame game. I've never played some of the games mentioned by others here but looking at them on youtube in action is enough to repulse me.

On the other hand, I think Azure Dreams is probably much better on the Gameboy Color than PS1. And I have to defend Shadow Madness. The story/dialogue is actually the most redeeming part of that game. It was enough to get me into it, actually. Only weeaboos would criticize it for being a 'wannabe jrpg' as the aesthetic is really westernized, and not some 'wannime" crap that most weeaboos try to produce. That in itself was novel for a western game, to be in J-RPG format.

There's alot of pathetic RPGs I've played as imports that never made it over here and for good reason. Most of what we'd consider the AAA titles made it stateside so while I've found some obscure gems, the ammount of crap in the japanese PS1 library for JRPGs is alot bigger. There's some budget RPGs that would make any weeaboo weep regarding whether JRPGs can be superior to western ones, so shamefully tacky that it makes even some of the worst WRPGs look like The Last of Us in comparison.

[Alpha2099]

Vagrant Story was a huge disappointment for me. I abandoned it after a few hours of playing. The biggest problem I had with it was the combat system. The timed button presses weren't as well executed as, say, The Legend of Dragoon. Leveling up was a pain, and the first big boss I came to (which was some sort of dragon-like thing; definitely not the very first boss but one of the early ones) barely took any damage from me even with a chain of attacks. Also, most of the dungeon crawling devolves into "Block Puzzle: The Game". It seemed like a nice concept when I started playing, but I quickly got sick of it.

[T.A.P.]

I remember despising Azure Dreams, Brave Fencer Musashi and Chocobo's Dungeon 2.

[Edmond Dantes]

I don't know if Shadow Madness is the worst, but it is certainly not good. It's just... boring to play, even for a (wannabe) JRPG. Kings Field (which I understand is actually Kings Field II) also falls in to the "so dull I want to claw my eyes out" category.

... Yep, I knew it. Minute I saw the topic title I knew "Someone is gonna say King's Field, I just know it."

Poor game doesn't get the love it deserves....

[Lictalon]

I'd have to say Thousand Arms.

That was sad, since it was a game with good potential, namely:

1. Anime style and cutscenes
2. Built-in dating sim


Which was ruined by:

1. Repetitive battles
2. Completely unbalanced characters (new characters started at a low level and were hard to catch up)

[LaughingMAN.S9]

Why do people hate final fantasy 8?

I will never understand that, i can totally see some people not liking ff7 due to he enormous hype surrounding it and it not possibly living up to certain expectations but ff8? That game doesn't deserve a score any lower than an 8 out of 10


Only things wrong with it in my eyes was the entire Laguna subplot which i found utterly ridiculous and added very little and a few kind of unlikable party members (looking at you selphie)

Apart from that the game had a great story, arguably some of the best graphics and cgi cutscenes on the playstation, probably my favorite turn based combat in any rpg save persona due to it being more interactive and the best minigame in any final fantasy with triple triad


Honestly the only answer im willing to accept is that you just prefer steampunk midievil over sci fi futuristic settings


Someone help me out here

[Tupin]

Why do people hate final fantasy 8?

I will never understand that, i can totally see some people not liking ff7 due to he enormous hype surrounding it and it not possibly living up to certain expectations but ff8? That game doesn't deserve a score any lower than an 8 out of 10


Only things wrong with it in my eyes was the entire Laguna subplot which i found utterly ridiculous and added very little and a few kind of unlikable party members (looking at you selphie)

Apart from that the game had a great story, arguably some of the best graphics and cgi cutscenes on the playstation, probably my favorite turn based combat in any rpg save persona due to it being more interactive and the best minigame in any final fantasy with triple triad


Honestly the only answer im willing to accept is that you just prefer steampunk midievil over sci fi futuristic settings


Someone help me out here
I've always heard the three main problems of the game being these:

Drawing magic
Triple Triad
A "grrr so angsty" antagonist that hasn't aged well

That said, I liked FFVIII. Certainly more than VII or X/X-2...

[bigbacon]

I've always heard the three main problems of the game being these:

Drawing magic
Triple Triad
A "grrr so angsty" antagonist that hasn't aged well

That said, I liked FFVIII. Certainly more than VII or X/X-2...

i loved 8 and triple triad isn't even needed, yes drawing is annoying. I think the reason most hate it is there is A LOT of character development that past games didn't have. A lot of the game was spent growing your knowledge of the characters so that by the time the end rolled around, you sort of felt like you knew them personally.

Some other annoying points are probably the weapon upgrade system and the lack of weapon/armor stores. i think it is a highly underrated FF game and I actually like it more than 7 which is like blasphemy in the gaming world. FF7, although a good game, is totally overrate in my mind.

[Alpha2099]

If you wanna know why people don't like FF8, just watch Spoony's video series about it. His feelings encapsulate just about every gamer's criticisms all in one package.

[kupomogli]

Final Fantasy 8 had a lot of problems for people to see it as a bad game.

The junction system breaks the games difficulty regardless of level. As long as you know how to use the junction system well, it makes the game too easy.

Limit breaks are broken further decreasing the difficulty. Just keep your health in yellow and cancel your turn until your limit is available. As long as you take advantage of the junction system, you can go from close to the beginning all the way to the end of the game using limit breaks. If you stick with three characters the entire game, don't bother with Irvine as a character if you're going to do this.

Drawing magic, drawing summons.

There are almost no side quests. Aside from drawing from specific enemies to get summons or secret bosses that you can fight in an area you pass through. I think there are two areas in the game you don't ever have to go to.

Leveling up does nothing. Enemies level up with you, so there's no reason to grind EXP for those that like to do so. If you take advantage of the junction system and play Triple Triad to become extremely overpowered, then leveling up makes the game harder, since you can walk through the game like nothing if you abuse the junction system. If you play through the game and use the junctiton system normally though, enemies are pretty much balanced the entire way through.

All of that being said, it's a decent game. Not the best Final Fantasy but definitely not the worst.

[Manhattan Sports Club]

I remember despising Azure Dreams, Brave Fencer Musashi and Chocobo's Dungeon 2.

I consider myself a fan of the Chocobo's Dungeon series. It's probably among the best of the Fushigi na Dungeon anthologies besides Shiren. It's really misunderstood, but I think the first, which wasn't released in the US, was better in some ways.

I would also add Threads of Fate. That one was underwhelming.

[FrankSerpico]

I thought Squall's general angstyness was balanced out pretty well by Rinoa's badassness and Zell's wildcard antics. Rinoa>Aerith. And Tifa too for that matter

[Alpha2099]

Rinoa>Aerith. And Tifa too for that matter.
How many RPG characters out there can fire a dog out of their weapon? LOL

[kupomogli]

How many RPG characters out there can fire a dog out of their weapon? LOL

There's always the possibility of the dog being shot from her weapon. Where's that explosion come from though?

[Lictalon]

Why do people hate final fantasy 8?

Someone help me out here


What some others said:

1. Drawing magic
2. Emo protaganist
3. Triple Triad (especially how the rules keep changing)

I'd also add:

1. Compared with FF7 and FF9, it's relatively serious. Serious, adult plotline. Realistic art (for the PS1).
2. Plotline entirely focused on romance between Squall/Rinoa.
3. All the characters were human - no exotics.
4. Very few exotic NPCs for that matter (one Shumi village, a few pockets of Chocobos).
5. Completely modernistic setting; not magical/fantasy at all. It felt like a mix of Europe and Disneyworld.
6. History of the world only marginally touches the plotline (that is, it wasn't an epic storyline).
7. Not that much humor, save for making fun of the dry characters and some comedy relief (Selphie again)
8. No clearly defined villians (the sorceress turns good, etc.).
9. Academy-based story (which might appeal to a Japanese audience, but not a Western one).

I still liked the game; it just isn't as memorable as FF7, in gameplay, events, or characters.

[Alpha2099]

^^ I think Lictalon summed it up much better than I ever could. Nice description.

[Tupin]

Yeah, I don't think that the academy-based story was as big of a deterrent when the game was originally released in the US as it is now. I mean, there's so many Japanese games set in academies that end up being dating simulators or visual novels that many really don't appeal to Westerners, apart from the obvious niche groups.

I doubt that a Final Fantasy game like VIII would be made today, even Persona can only move so much and is heavily influenced by is setting.

In general, a lot of the problems people have with VIII isn't the game itself. It's more the culture that has created itself since the game came out, with the movement against "weeaboos" and all of that.

[Edmond Dantes]

Someone else already said this, but it bears repeating:

Watch Spoony's videos about FF8. He sums up quite nicely every little thing that's wrong with it, from how much the gameplay mechanics suck to how completely ass-tarded the storyline is.

[Press_Start]

What some others said:

1. Drawing magic
2. Emo protaganist
3. Triple Triad (especially how the rules keep changing)

I'd also add:

1. Compared with FF7 and FF9, it's relatively serious. Serious, adult plotline. Realistic art (for the PS1).
2. Plotline entirely focused on romance between Squall/Rinoa.
3. All the characters were human - no exotics.
4. Very few exotic NPCs for that matter (one Shumi village, a few pockets of Chocobos).
5. Completely modernistic setting; not magical/fantasy at all. It felt like a mix of Europe and Disneyworld.
6. History of the world only marginally touches the plotline (that is, it wasn't an epic storyline).
7. Not that much humor, save for making fun of the dry characters and some comedy relief (Selphie again)
8. No clearly defined villians (the sorceress turns good, etc.).
9. Academy-based story (which might appeal to a Japanese audience, but not a Western one).

I still liked the game; it just isn't as memorable as FF7, in gameplay, events, or characters.

You forgot to add:

A. Battles don't reward money- the game gives you a timely "allowance".
B. LV 99 easily achievable by Disc 2/3.
C. And the weapons...Especially the ultimate ones, they're a b!tch to get.

Get a magazine. (No, srsly you need a magazine.)
Take said magazine to a particular weapon shop. And not just ANY random shop cause....
Said shop has to "decipher" said magazine to make said weapon available then gives list of items necessary to make said weapon.
Mug random enemies for said items.
Go back to same said shop to build AND buy said weapon.
And said weapon only deals 300-400 points of damage in battle. What....a....rip.

[Little Miss Gloom]

Lunar 1 and Lunar 2.

...

What?

[Alpha2099]

Lunar 1 and Lunar 2.

...

What?
I was about to call blasphemy, until I remember that I only made it about halfway through Lunar 1. Not that I thought it was bad, but I lost interest.

[Haoie]

Nobody's mentioned Alundra II?

[bb_hood]

Personally I think both Lunar games are pretty horrible

[Jorpho]

Take said magazine to a particular weapon shop. And not just ANY random shop cause....
Said shop has to "decipher" said magazine to make said weapon available then gives list of items necessary to make said weapon.I don't remember that at all...

And said weapon only deals 300-400 points of damage in battle. What....a....rip.Don't you need them principally to get new limit breaks for Squall?

[BlastProcessing402]

FF8 was also the start of the whole "leather" thing in the series.

Anyway, I'll go with Shadow Madness, I can't believe I was looking forward to that POS.

[FrankSerpico]

Personally I think both Lunar games are pretty horrible
It's really just a generic JRPG, but considering the time they came out they compare pretty well with other JRPGs of the era. I always thought WD pulled off a helluva coup by convincing so many people to pay almost 90 bucks for the re-release, though. I was 15 or 16 at the time of the re-release, and the only person I knew who ended up getting it non-used was this awful basement dwelling weeabo whose parents bought him anything he asked for.

[Daria]

Anyway, I'll go with Shadow Madness, I can't believe I was looking forward to that POS.

The first two games I ever owned for the PSOne were Shadow Madness and Star Ocean 2. First time I tried SM I wrote it off as the ugliest POS I'd ever played. Later I gave it a second chance, and while it was still ugly and I realized a blatent Final Fantasy ripoff to boot I also came to appreciate the game's script. Now I consider it one of my favorite games for the system. If not technically good, it's at least funny and well written. More than can be said for a lot of the games of that era.

As far as the worst RPG is concerned, I really REALLY didn't like Legend of Legaia. But honestly the game's not so much bad as it's just terribly mediocre. I think that's the real problem with the PSOne's library- there are so many great RPGs available that the bland ones just don't compare.

[Aussie2B]

Personally I think both Lunar games are pretty horrible
It's really just a generic JRPG, but considering the time they came out they compare pretty well with other JRPGs of the era. I always thought WD pulled off a helluva coup by convincing so many people to pay almost 90 bucks for the re-release, though. I was 15 or 16 at the time of the re-release, and the only person I knew who ended up getting it non-used was this awful basement dwelling weeabo whose parents bought him anything he asked for.

90 bucks? o_O If any store was charging that, then they were majorly gouging. The MSRP was $60, which was still $20 more than the average PlayStation RPG back then, but for all the extra goodies (and the fact that I was spending that much on N64 games already, without any extras), it seemed fair enough to me.

Maybe you're thinking of the Arc the Lad Collection? I'm pretty sure that was more expensive yet, although still not close to $90.

[Press_Start]

It's really just a generic JRPG, but considering the time they came out they compare pretty well with other JRPGs of the era. I always thought WD pulled off a helluva coup by convincing so many people to pay almost 90 bucks for the re-release, though. I was 15 or 16 at the time of the re-release, and the only person I knew who ended up getting it non-used was this awful basement dwelling weeabo whose parents bought him anything he asked for.

Calling Lunar a generic JRPG is like calling Superman a guy in colorful tight or calling Walking Dead just a TV show about zombies or Helen's famous sausages are......well, sausages. It's shallow, thoughtless, short-sighted, flat and ignores all the best qualities of the game: innovative/original battle system, rich n' endearing characters in a gripping fantastic heroic story in a exotic land delivering the best animation for its time with a top-notch cast n' crew to match. Basically, it's the perfect standard what every generic JRPG should be striving for, not something to be lumped with them.

[Daria]

Calling Lunar a generic JRPG is... shallow, thoughtless, short-sighted, flat and ignores all the best qualities of the game: innovative/original battle system, rich n' endearing characters in a gripping fantastic heroic story in a exotic land delivering the best animation for its time with a top-notch cast n' crew to match. Basically, it's the perfect standard what every generic JRPG should be striving for, not something to be lumped with them.

This.

I also have to wonder, if Lunar's just another generic RPG to you what do you consider your classics to be?

[Terminusvitae]

I actually really enjoyed FF7 and just replayed it a few months ago. It's far from perfect, but what game isn't?

As for the topic's question, I'd have to second either <i>The Granstream Saga</i> or <i>Alundra 2</i>.

[FrankSerpico]

Don't get me wrong, I have Silver Star Story for my Sega CD and I played through it and really enjoyed it. I have yet to get ahold of Eternal Blue, but I know many consider it to be better than its predecessor. I just don't think Silver Star Story belongs in that elite category with games like FF6 or FF Tactics, and I can certainly see why someone who's first exposure to the game was the re-release wouldn't be all that impressed. I think a lot of the lore surrounding the game has to do with it coming out in an era where fans on this side of the pond were starved for JRPGs but idiotic publishers claimed we only wanted Madden and Mortal Kombat.

[kupomogli]

Maybe you're thinking of the Arc the Lad Collection? I'm pretty sure that was more expensive yet, although still not close to $90.

Arc the Lad Collection was $79.99 at launch, kind of close, but yeah, still not $90.


innovative/original battle system

Your characters move in battle!? INNOVATION!! Other than using Flee to back away from an enemy so you force them to move up to you, there's really no difference in the way this plays from a standard JRPG battle system. It's really not that innovative, but hey, who am I to say you can't further overrate the game for almost no reason at all.

Anyways. The Lunar games are far from the worst RPGs ever released as they're decent, but they're some of the more overrated RPGs in the genre. It's similar to Earthbound how it receives massive praise for being an extremely generic RPG and while the Lunar games are much better than Earthbound, they're not on the level the fanbase praises them.

From FrankSerpico's original Lunar post and then his most recent post, it doesn't sound like he's saying it's the worst game ever made. Sounds like he was replying to the earlier Lunar comments that it's a good series that's extremely overrated.

[Daria]

Your characters move in battle!? INNOVATION!! Other than using Flee to back away from an enemy so you force them to move up to you, there's really no difference in the way this plays from a standard JRPG battle system. It's really not that innovative, but hey, who am I to say you can't further overrate the game for almost no reason at all.

Actually the PSOne Lunars implement one of my favorite battle mechanics- the ability to see and circumnavigate the enemies in the dungeons. Granted I don't know who originated the concept, and you may not actually fight any less mobs than in a traditional random battle format, but you FEEL better about it. Nothing's more frustrating/nerve wracking than the suddeness of "step, step, FIGHT!" at least Lunar made you feel like you had some control over when and where each battle occurred.

[FrankSerpico]

I certainly wasn't trying to say that Lunar is anywhere near one of the worst RPGs ever made. In fact, I'd say most of the traditional nominees for worst PS1 rpg like Shadow Madness, Beyond the Beyond etc. are still leaps and bounds ahead of the worst examples of the genre on 16-bit systems. I will forever loathe Shining in the Darkness even though I'm a huge Sega fan and can appreciate some of its innovative qualities, and 7th Saga was one of the most hateable games I've ever tried to slog through.

[Aussie2B]

Hell must've frozen over because I have to agree with kupomogli in that Lunar's battle system isn't particularly innovative or original. Not that that's necessarily a bad thing. It's pretty much your classic turn-based Japanese RPG battle system.

I like Lunar all right. There are some things I don't care for about it and it didn't leave a huge impact on me, but it's still enjoyable enough overall.

[Edmond Dantes]

Eh, I'd prefer a traditional battle system over some of the more esoteric crap some of Square-Enix forces us to put up with.

I'll admit that if judged on how innovative it is yeah Lunar isn't that good (this is actually why I didn't like the Sega CD ones initially) but once you get past that, it's almost comparable to Chrono Trigger--nothing new, but everything done right.

[PizzaKat]

I loved Final Fantasy VIIIs card game (triple triad?) I actually started a new game to get all the rare cards. O f course I had to go to city to city and ask a specific dealer and answer specific questions I think. Didnt have much games back then. I loved the story and the fact there were just humans. The only annoying part was drawing spells from enemies and calling the special monsters (I forgot their names) went into that long production. Its cool but I just wanna get over with it.
I dont know if its my skill but I had to level up right away in Lunar as the enemies were extremely powerful.

[Press_Start]

Don't get me wrong, I have Silver Star Story for my Sega CD and I played through it and really enjoyed it. I have yet to get ahold of Eternal Blue, but I know many consider it to be better than its predecessor. I just don't think Silver Star Story belongs in that elite category with games like FF6 or FF Tactics, and I can certainly see why someone who's first exposure to the game was the re-release wouldn't be all that impressed. I think a lot of the lore surrounding the game has to do with it coming out in an era where fans on this side of the pond were starved for JRPGs but idiotic publishers claimed we only wanted Madden and Mortal Kombat.

Here's a list of PS1 RPGs I played before Lunar: Vandal Hearts, FF7, Wild Arms, FF Tactics, Suikoden, Breath of Fire 3, Tales of Destiny, Xenogears, Parasite Eve, Brave Fencer Musashi, and never once did Lunar perform any less than any RPG I played past, present, or future. It stands with the best of them while bringing something to table all without the help of being part of an "elite category", which sounds incredibly snobbish n' very insecure giving out a strange vibe like you guys only play games just to feel superior to others, then again those who live in ivory towers do see everyone as ants.




Your characters move in battle!? INNOVATION!! Other than using Flee to back away from an enemy so you force them to move up to you, there's really no difference in the way this plays from a standard JRPG battle system. It's really not that innovative, but hey, who am I to say you can't further overrate the game for almost no reason at all.

Sorry, Lunar does have an innovative/original battle system with a fresh and nuanced approach in reinventing the classics by removing all the traps and trites of the old system, retooling and simplifying what works well at the same time redefining the rules of engagement in ingenious and clever ways in and outside of battle be in an open field that felt like a chess board that will satisfy veteran and new players alike giving the them freedom to try strategies and possibilities rarely before seen in RPGs and holds enough familiarity that players won't get lost like say in FF8. It's everything new and old at the same time with a significant degree of success.



Anyways. The Lunar games are far from the worst RPGs ever released as they're decent, but they're some of the more overrated RPGs in the genre. It's similar to Earthbound how it receives massive praise for being an extremely generic RPG and while the Lunar games are much better than Earthbound, they're not on the level the fanbase praises them.

I hate to sound like a broken record but that was shallow, thoughtless, short-sighted, and flat....on top of that, I would like to add: narrow-minded, antagonizing, selfishly ignorant, downright hateful and void of any n' all matter of substance to back up whatsoever. It's somebody else's dam opinion in your regurgitated pseudo-intellectual venomous stew.

[Wraith Storm]

I always thought Guardian's Crusade was pretty bad.

I know some people seem to have really enjoyed the game but to me it seemed so simple... like a beginner RPG 101 for kids. There were so many good RPGs out at the time that after a few hours with Guardian's Crusade I gave it back to my friend and moved on to other RPGs that had much more to offer me.

It didn't do the game any favors that its art direction was fairly generic and while well composed, I didn't care much for the music either.

[Daria]

I know some people seem to have really enjoyed the game but to me it seemed so simple... like a beginner RPG 101 for kids. There were so many good RPGs out at the time that after a few hours with Guardian's Crusade I gave it back to my friend and moved on to other RPGs that had much more to offer me.

It didn't do the game any favors that its art direction was fairly generic and while well composed, I didn't care much for the music either.

It's funny, all the reasons you didn't like Guardians Crusade are the same reasons that I found it charming. :P

I liked the simplicity of it, like playing a 3D version of an NES RPG.

As for Lunar, I don't see the point of arguing opinions. Press Start and I think it's a classic, FrankSerpico and Kupo think it's overrated garbage. Personally I think FF6 and FFT aren't all that great either, an opinion which many RPG fans would find blasphemous. But what does it matter? Not as if the quality of a game diminishes just because one less person admires it, or that a game improves by having one more fanboy in its corner.

Personally I think Lunar's good enough to stand on its own, it doesn't need me or anyone else championing its virtues.

[FrankSerpico]

which sounds incredibly snobbish n' very insecure giving out a strange vibe like you guys only play games just to feel superior to others, then again those who live in ivory towers do see everyone as ants.

Wow. Do you always over-psychoanalyze when your clams are steamed over something this irrelevant?

[Daltone]

which sounds incredibly snobbish n' very insecure giving out a strange vibe like you guys only play games just to feel superior to others, then again those who live in ivory towers do see everyone as ants.

Wow. Do you always over-psychoanalyze when your clams are steamed over something this irrelevant?

Press_Start feels strongly about people having a negative opinion of Nintendo and certain JRPGs. Your opinion had better not differ or it'll be a tongue lashing for you laddo!

EDIT: He's probably just upset that Baldur's Gate 2, the greatest RPG ever, nay, the greatest game ever, didn't come to the Wii. I wouldn't worry too much...

[meggo]

Eternal Eyes is REALLY bad. Just god-awfully bland.

[LaughingMAN.S9]

Arc the Lad Collection was $79.99 at launch, kind of close, but yeah, still not $90.



Your characters move in battle!? INNOVATION!! Other than using Flee to back away from an enemy so you force them to move up to you, there's really no difference in the way this plays from a standard JRPG battle system. It's really not that innovative, but hey, who am I to say you can't further overrate the game for almost no reason at all.

Anyways. The Lunar games are far from the worst RPGs ever released as they're decent, but they're some of the more overrated RPGs in the genre. It's similar to Earthbound how it receives massive praise for being an extremely generic RPG and while the Lunar games are much better than Earthbound, they're not on the level the fanbase praises them.

From FrankSerpico's original Lunar post and then his most recent post, it doesn't sound like he's saying it's the worst game ever made. Sounds like he was replying to the earlier Lunar comments that it's a good series that's extremely overrated.


I remember when I first tried to suggest earthbound was overrated....barely left the forum with my life intact lol

[Wraith Storm]

It's funny, all the reasons you didn't like Guardians Crusade are the same reasons that I found it charming. :P

I liked the simplicity of it, like playing a 3D version of an NES RPG..

Heh. I can see that though. Like I said, I know its a game that some people look fondly upon, but it just didnt appeal to me.


Eternal Eyes is REALLY bad. Just god-awfully bland.

I really want to try Eternal Eyes. All I have ever heard were bad things about it, but its a Kenji Terada game. Surely there is something redeeming about it.

[kupomogli]

I really want to try Eternal Eyes. All I have ever heard were bad things about it, but its a Kenji Terada game. Surely there is something redeeming about it.

I don't know if there's anything redeeming about the game. I've never known anyone to have a good opinion about this game.

[kupomogli]

I hate to sound like a broken record but that was shallow, thoughtless, short-sighted, and flat....on top of that, I would like to add: narrow-minded, antagonizing, selfishly ignorant, downright hateful and void of any n' all matter of substance to back up whatsoever. It's somebody else's dam opinion in your regurgitated pseudo-intellectual venomous stew.

If people didn't have differing opinions there would be less to talk about. There would be far less responses if everyone agreed on everything, because there would be no counter arguments. This is just as much true for sports, tv shows, books, movies, food, etc, as it is for video games.

The difference between my post calling Lunar and Earthbound overrated compared to your earlier post and this one, is I wasn't throwing insults at someone based on their opinion.

[Daria]

I don't know if there's anything redeeming about the game. I've never known anyone to have a good opinion about this game.

The original MSRP of $10 was quite nice... and I kind of like the character art. But yeah... no Eternal Eyes is not a good game.

[kupomogli]

The original MSRP of $10 was quite nice... and I kind of like the character art. But yeah... no Eternal Eyes is not a good game.

Didn't know it was $10 MSRP. I got it and Rogue Trip for $5 each. Rogue Trip was amazing and I assumed they just sold poorly.

[Press_Start]

If people didn't have differing opinions there would be less to talk about. There would be far less responses if everyone agreed on everything, because there would be no counter arguments. This is just as much true for sports, tv shows, books, movies, food, etc, as it is for video games.

The difference between my post calling Lunar and Earthbound overrated compared to your earlier post and this one, is I wasn't throwing insults at someone based on their opinion.

The difference is my opinions are back with cogent statements and facts and you want everyone to take whatever you say without question as fact. Case in point, three counter posts given between Daria and me in support of Lunar and your argument for otherwise is......Earthbound is overrated?, which A) has nothing to do with Lunar and B) it's your own dam opinion.......again! Like defending "Tomatoes are Evil!" by claiming "Tomatoes are REALLY, REALLY, REALLY Evil with Zucchinis!" So, C) you got nothing and my arguments still stands. And that's what this whole debate boils down to: the people screaming "BUCK FUTTER!" and the people providing cogent arguments, well-thought opinions, nuanced ideas, hard evidence, and screaming "BUCK FUTTER!".

Oh before i forget, congrats on the baby Daria!

[Gamevet]

Beyond the Beyond nuff said :p

Yep!

The game pretty much slaps you in the face, with the best character being cursed; Everytime he swung his sword, he lost hit points. I completed the game and immediately traded it in.

[Tron 2.0]

Yep!

The game pretty much slaps you in the face, with the best character being cursed; Everytime he swung his sword, he lost hit points. I completed the game and immediately traded it in.
I did the same,when i had the game and solid it rather quickly.It's definitely "one of camelot software weakest rpgs" that they made.

[Rickstilwell1]

I did the same,when i had the game and solid it rather quickly.It's definitely "one of camelot software weakest rpgs" that they made.

I'm pretty much the opposite but then again the first time I played it I used Gameshark so I was able to learn all the dungeons and puzzles thoroughly before playing through it normally, making it very easy for me to play through it again and again. Beyond the Beyond is in my top 10 favorite games probably. It actually kind of disappoints me that few people like the game as much as I do because that means there's no fan spinoffs with those characters or anybody making custom characters for fighting games based on them.

Also Samson is definitely not the best character in the game. He would have been ok at first uncursed, but when Finn levels up he and even Percy begin to equal or surpass Samson's strength. Also unlike Samson they both can actually learn and use a lot of magic spells. Their speed is also faster at the same level. All three are good characters to have in the front row though so their already strong attacks do even more damage.

Making the most out of characters really depends on where you place them in the party formation and your fighting tactics.