XboxOne(NineEightFour)

[Scotterpop]

Xbox1984. That's what I'm calling Microsoft's new "console."

The idea of an always online Kinect sensor viewing, listening, and reporting this information back to several hundred thousand servers scares the shit out of me. Are you guys okay with this? Because I'm sure not. You're essentially inviting Big Brother into your house to monitor everything that goes on in your living room. Why aren't more people making a big deal out of this??? It would be one thing if this were an optional accessory like the current Kinect, but it's not. You can't operate the next Xbox without it. So you really have no choice. If you want to play the next generation of Xbox games, you have to sacrifice your privacy and anonymity to do it. Anyone else feeling a little Orwellian paranoia over this, or am I overreacting?

[JakeM]

Some group of hackers will be able to spy on people. Its gonna happen, just a matter of time. Hell, it could be a Microsoft employee who does it just because he can.

[WCP]

clever girl.... :)


I like the title of the thread

[Gameguy]

The idea of an always online Kinect sensor viewing, listening, and reporting this information back to several hundred thousand servers scares the shit out of me. Are you guys okay with this? Because I'm sure not. You're essentially inviting Big Brother into your house to monitor everything that goes on in your living room. Why aren't more people making a big deal out of this??? It would be one thing if this were an optional accessory like the current Kinect, but it's not. You can't operate the next Xbox without it. So you really have no choice. If you want to play the next generation of Xbox games, you have to sacrifice your privacy and anonymity to do it. Anyone else feeling a little Orwellian paranoia over this, or am I overreacting?
It would bother me, but I don't know about most people. People use Facebook sharing their real names and detailed personal information with strangers voluntarily, I'm not sure if people would have a problem sharing their information with a company.

When people are replying to some classifieds I have listed, their emails are now linked to their Facebook pages or Twitter. If you're a stranger to me why do I need to see a real picture of you or your family, what TV shows or movies you're watching, what your interests or hobbies are, what stores or restaurants you like, what athletes or sports teams you like, etc. To me that's too much to share with random people when you're using your real name.

[JakeM]

It would bother me, but I don't know about most people. People use Facebook sharing their real names and detailed personal information with strangers voluntarily, I'm not sure if people would have a problem sharing their information with a company.

When people are replying to some classifieds I have listed, their emails are now linked to their Facebook pages or Twitter. If you're a stranger to me why do I need to see a real picture of you or your family, what TV shows or movies you're watching, what your interests or hobbies are, what stores or restaurants you like, what athletes or sports teams you like, etc. To me that's too much to share with random people when you're using your real name.

Um, theres privacy settings on facebook people use so you dont know everything about them. Theres a big difference between simple information like what movies you like and who youre related to, and what youre saying in house and other things the Xbox will see and hear. Its really not that detailed, and it really depends on the person on facebook what they share. What stuff do you share on there? You can have your posts/status updates only available to your friends, like I do. The stuff in the second paragraph isnt that big of a deal, not liek youre reading their minds.

[Gameguy]

Um, theres privacy settings on facebook people use so you dont know everything about them. Theres a big difference between simple information like what movies you like and who youre related to, and what youre saying in house and other things the Xbox will see and hear. Its really not that detailed, and it really depends on the person on facebook what they share. What stuff do you share on there? You can have your posts/status updates only available to your friends, like I do. The stuff in the second paragraph isnt that big of a deal, not liek youre reading their minds.
I'm just saying my personal experience. Plenty of people reply to some of my ads, I can click on their Facebook links, I can read everything that's posted. Not everyone uses privacy settings, which is my point that a large number of people don't care about privacy and won't care about XBox listening to you. You don't think it's a big deal for someone to know your interests in detail and know people who are close to you? Learn about social engineering, it's easy to find out real personal information if you know some basics about someone and some of their contacts.

You think the new XBox can read minds? What are you worried about it overhearing? If you're that bothered, just unplug the thing when you're not using it. Simple enough. Just as easy as privacy settings.

[skaar]

http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m313/elisson1/ColanderBorg-Man2006.jpg

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_XoUuH7bbwJY/R2igl3oAn6I/AAAAAAAAAQ4/g9uVlNGYRfI/s400/JohnnyAppleseed2.jpg

http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m313/elisson1/Jewish%20Stuff/Elissonphone2012_0308_0004b.jpg

[BHvrd]

http://i.imgur.com/9i6LzvG.jpg

[RARusk]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aGwUNTGrnvE

[Gamereviewgod]

I'm writing on a laptop with a camera pointed right at my face. My cell phone has two cameras to where no matter how I place it, it can see me.

I fail to see how Kinect is any different or a more logical device to hack if people want to peer into my life.

[Rev. Link]

I'm also making this post on a laptop with a camera. The difference, though, is that if I put a piece of duct tape over the lens (which I do) the laptop doesn't stop functioning. Microsoft's insistence on the always-on Kinect being a part of the new Xbox is disgusting to me, and it's a big reason why I won't be buying one.

[badinsults]

You know, nobody is forcing you to buy one of these things.

[WCP]

I'm writing on a laptop with a camera pointed right at my face. My cell phone has two cameras to where no matter how I place it, it can see me.

I fail to see how Kinect is any different or a more logical device to hack if people want to peer into my life.


Well, in regards to the cellphone, normally the cellphone is laying on a table with the camera either aimed downwards at the table or up at the ceiling. Or, the camera of the cellphone is giving a great picture of the inside of a pants or jacket pocket. My laptop is older, and doesn't have a camera built into it, so I can't really comment on that.

Regardless, the Kinect is somewhat unique in that it's basically your TV staring back at you. It has a wide angle view, and it's basically staring back at your sofas and chairs and everybody sitting in them, or standing in front of them. It's taking a large view of your living room area and basically analyzing everything that goes on inside that space. It's constantly scanning every word that is said, looking for a voice command to activate it.

It's a little creepy if you really think about it.



You know, nobody is forcing you to buy one of these things.


True.. But if they show a next-gen Crackdown 3 that looks absolutely amazing at e3, it's the equivalent of them putting a gun to my head and forcing me to buy it.

Yeah, I know it's a bit sad that one game could cause me to need this thing, but I will say that the amount of money that I spend on gaming won't change. If I can't buy my games at a discount, or used, then I will simply purchase way fewer games than I normally I would. In a given year, I probably buy about 15 games, and with the Xbox One, they will be lucky if I buy about 4 or 5 games for the whole year. That's the downside to their draconian measures. There will be a segment of the population that adapts to this New World Order by just buying fewer games overall.

[JakeM]

You think the new XBox can read minds? What are you worried about it overhearing? If you're that bothered, just unplug the thing when you're not using it. Simple enough. Just as easy as privacy settings.

Im not going to buy it. Im just pointing out that this thing goes way beyond facebook or social media.

And this is something also as scary, if not scarier. Go 23 seconds into the video.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ueZuiBUF8RU

[Scotterpop]

http://i.imgur.com/9i6LzvG.jpg

My God, it's full of spies!

[Tanooki]

I read online you can effectively disable while keeping kinect on the thing by messing with the wires going to it. I imagine I could see privacy people doing that so it can get around being spied upon if that ends up working out.

Thanks for the topic name, caught it right away and it gave me a laugh.

The camera is a problem, but also the checking every 24hours to see if you're online is obtrusive too, it's a snitch box. You can't share or loan out stuff anymore unless you're fine giving people your login/pass and personal info (banking too?) tied to it which would effectively lock you out on your system at the same time if they're on. Of course you have the crippled used too that they're now trying to explain and not at the same time saying only registered stores who can tie to their network can sell used, and every game will send part of the profits straight to MS and more profits to the game developer too so they'll know what you have and don't have every day (tied to the activation) and with rates that'll really screw gamestop and the rest. You know, since games are so unique that used sales somehow have to be gimped considering they really don't do shit to any other form of media or cars. I doubt used music shops or carmax have to give back a cut to the RIAA, X artist or Ford/GM. Bleh.

[Panzerfuzion]

Gaming is transferring to a rental based setup. IMO It's because of piracy.

[JakeM]

This is hopefully true.

http://kotaku.com/xbox-ones-kinect-can-turn-off-microsoft-says-noting-510100564?utm_campaign=Socialflow_Kotaku_Facebook&utm_source=Kotaku_Facebook&utm_medium=Socialflow

[Gameguy]

Im not going to buy it. Im just pointing out that this thing goes way beyond facebook or social media.
I'm not going to be buying it either, I agree that I don't like the concept of it watching you or listening to what you're saying. I'm not sure if it would even send that information anywhere for any purpose but I'd rather do without it.

I just meant that most people probably wouldn't care either way about it, meaning the average consumers who would be buying these. Not the dedicated fans or those good with computers who read up about this thing online.

The main problem people seem to have about this is with Microsoft getting private information from you, not that they could be sharing that info with other companies. With Facebook privacy settings it keeps other people from seeing your info publicly, but the company would still have access to everything you provided to them that's on their servers. Privacy settings don't keep them from having access to your content so it's basically the same thing. Anything you post to Facebook belongs to Facebook and they can do whatever they want with it if they choose to. I'm not on Facebook or Twitter, no way would I bother with those.

It's from a few years back but does anyone remember this?
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13739_3-9854409-46.html


"Facebook may...provide developers access to...your name, your profile picture, your gender, your birthday, your hometown location...your current location...your political view, your activities, your interests...your relationship status, your dating interests, your relationship interests, your summer plans, your Facebook user network affiliations, your education history, your work history,...copies of photos in your Facebook Site photo albums...a list of user IDs mapped to your Facebook friends."

[JakeM]

You really need to be on Facebook to understand how it works. I mean, its stuff you tell a person on the first date.


your dating interests, your relationship interests, your summer plans, your Facebook user network affiliations, your education history, your work history,

You dont list your dating interests, unless they mean the gender seeking answer, which is a male/female/both/other thing.

summer plans, no....unless you write a status saying youre going to the cabin and lake for the week.

your education history is just there as a fill out of where you went to school, same with the job history.

your current location is just what city you live in, not actually where you are right now.

to do a facebook app you did agree for it to see who your friends were, which before facebook had a privacy setting for it, anyone could see. it was just there for ad placements.

The only way for facebook to be as scary as the xbox one or as youre comparing the two, would be for our private messages to become as public as our status updates, which again theres settings. Youre reading far to into people sharing basic watercooler talk subjects, on facebook, with actual private things.

[Gameguy]

So what exactly is wrong with the Xbox One then? If Facebook isn't a problem with your information then what is the Xbox doing?

[ProjectCamaro]

German Privacy Official: Xbox One is a "Twisted Nightmare"

http://www.ign.com/articles/2013/05/28/german-privacy-official-xbox-one-is-twisted-nightmare

[JakeM]

So what exactly is wrong with the Xbox One then? If Facebook isn't a problem with your information then what is the Xbox doing?

Wow, I cant believe Ive wasted my time on you. Youre on block for now on.

[Gameguy]

Wow, I cant believe Ive wasted my time on you. Youre on block for now on.
Fine by me. For anyone else, basically this user doesn't have a problem with Facebook knowing private details about users for marketing purposes but having Microsoft watch you sitting on your couch is somehow worse. Sure it's creepy, but plenty of people watch you or listen to your conversations whenever you're in public. Setting privacy settings doesn't keep Facebook from accessing your information, it just limits what other users can see.


your current location is just what city you live in, not actually where you are right now.
Just to clear things up, Facebook keeps track of the IP addresses you use when logging into your account. That's how it knows your current location, not just from whatever you put in your profile. This is something basic that most major sites keep track of, even this forum keeps track of IP addresses. If anyone gets banned but keeps registering new accounts, a persons' IP address can be blocked to keep them from accessing the site. Even google keeps track of your IP address and everything you search for. Your ISP keeps track of the sites you visit. Anything connected online can keep track of you, though while possible not everything chooses to do so.

Basically JakeM is an idiot. If you have a problem with privacy concerns it should be with everything, not just with a specific company. Otherwise it's like you're just anti-Microsoft.

[skaar]

Wow, I cant believe Ive wasted my time on you. Youre on block for now on.

And who are you?

[geneshifter]

Wow, I cant believe Ive wasted my time on you. Youre on block for now on.

You escalated that a little too fast there, little guy.

[Zthun]

I'm going to convince my fat ass 85 year old neighbor to buy one and wank off in front of it. Policy changes will surly go into effect after MS employees suddenly decide to burn their eyes out.

[Rev. Link]

For me, it's not just because it's Microsoft. Hell, I played my 360 more than anything else in gen 7. If Sony decides you have to have the Eye set up at all times with PS4 then I won't be getting that either. It's just a privacy issue. I deleted all personal information from my Facebook profile. I only kept the profile as a way to get in touch with relatives/friends as a last resort. I also stopped using Google for web searches. I now use Startpage, a search engine which gives you Google results without actually tracking your searches.

[Scotterpop]

The difference between Facebook and the new Kinect is that FB only has the information that you choose to give it. Whereas the Kinect gathers continuous information indiscriminately. That's a VERY important distinction. Having no control over the collection and distribution of my personal information is what I take issue with. Especially when it's being gathered from the "privacy" of my own home. So here's hoping that Microsoft isn't bullshitting us regarding the privacy settings on this device. Otherwise I'm going to feel like a Prisoner in my own house every time I turn on my Xbox...

Me: "What do you want?"
XBoxOne: "We want... information. IN-FOR-MATION!"
Me: "You won't get it!"
XBoxOne: "By hook or by crook... we will."

[JakeM]

Well, this is interesting perspective. Im getting one eventually.

6706

[CDiablo]

Good news is MS said you can turn off Kinect functionality. Bad news is we dont know how to turn off all the other secret cameras they have installed.

[Gameguy]

I now use Startpage, a search engine which gives you Google results without actually tracking your searches.
I wasn't aware of this before so thanks. :)

I do get that people can be using Facebook and other services similar to it because they either have to or the usefulness outweighs the negatives, just using the features as safely as possible for privacy concerns(which doesn't eliminate the risk entirely but limits it). That's fine. I just disagreed with earlier postings saying sites like Facebook are safer security wise with information than with this new Xbox One camera/microphone feature. What would Microsoft really be doing with this information and how would they sort through it? Are they really going to watch video from each console 24 hours a day for each customer? Would they really be monitoring people all the time? So far people are worried about possibilities and nothing has been confirmed yet.

Main reason why I brought up Facebook was that plenty of people don't care about their privacy and won't be bothered with the features this console has. Plenty of people post tons of information on Facebook, more than what's needed to use it, and don't limit their privacy settings. A camera always watching them won't bother them too much. Some people might even enjoy being watched.

[skaar]

DuckDuckGo is also a thing.

[Daltone]

Can you not just point the Kinect thing at a wall if you don't like it and don't want to use it?

[The 1 2 P]

Can you not just point the Kinect thing at a wall if you don't like it and don't want to use it?

That or put something over it. When I watch movies on my 360 sometimes my stretching will start the Kinect hand guide or bring up the Kinect browsing menu during the movie. So now I just put one of my controllers in front of it and it doesn't interupt my tv watching.

[Gameguy]

DuckDuckGo is also a thing.
Thanks, I've added that to my bookmarks too.


Can you not just point the Kinect thing at a wall if you don't like it and don't want to use it?
From what I've read if it can't detect you or your movement it will refuse to work, it's different from the 360 Kinect which you can just aim at a wall. I'm not sure if this has been confirmed or not, I just read it somewhere.

[ThatMan]

Basically JakeM is an idiot. If you have a problem with privacy concerns it should be with everything, not just with a specific company. Otherwise it's like you're just anti-Microsoft.

Calling complete strangers on the internet idiots-always mature and reasonable.

[Bojay1997]

Calling complete strangers on the internet idiots-always mature and reasonable.

Is that you, JakeM?