It's Official! Older Is Just Better.

[JakeM]

The Xbone and PS4 are having major defects within hours of their releases. This is probably due to the factory workers taking out their frustrations about their living conditions onto the consumers. Maybe its because the machines are just too far ahead of their times and they cant handle their power.

Either way it doesnt matter, way back when from the ps2 era to the atari and odyssey era, all you had to do was put the game cart or disk in and press the power switch. Flickering lights on the tv make your eyes go wide open and all of a sudden youre in another world, instantly trying to save a princess or saving your kingdom. No system updates, no patch dowloads, no DRM, no FTP extra charges, no EXCLUSIVE DLC CONTENT, all you had was that one game. You just bought that game and you played it.

Not to mention when you looked at a console you could tell which one it was by the game, the graphics and sounds were so distinct, there was a real reason to go with one over the other. When you saw Mario 64 you knew it was o nth N64, when you saw Metal Gear Solid you knew it was on the PS1, when you saw Virtua Fighter 2 you knew it was on the Saturn, I can go on and on. I miss that, but the developers want their games on both the 360/ps3/ps4/Xbone now. Those last two are scary similar, so theres no real identity to have as their own. This homogenization is wrong. Theres too much big money in the gaming industry at the top and this is the start of it falling down. People are gonna stick with their current systems for a long time now after this. Maybe theyll even look back at the older games and systems and realize that gaming is about the games, not debates on privacy and cameras watching you all the time, or streaming your games like a million other people at the same time.

What do you guys think?

[Bojay1997]

The Xbone and PS4 are having major defects within hours of their releases. This is probably due to the factory workers taking out their frustrations about their living conditions onto the consumers. Maybe its because the machines are just too far ahead of their times and they cant handle their power.

Either way it doesnt matter, way back when from the ps2 era to the atari and odyssey era, all you had to do was put the game cart or disk in and press the power switch. Flickering lights on the tv make your eyes go wide open and all of a sudden youre in another world, instantly trying to save a princess or saving your kingdom. No system updates, no patch dowloads, no DRM, no FTP extra charges, no EXCLUSIVE DLC CONTENT, all you had was that one game. You just bought that game and you played it.

Not to mention when you looked at a console you could tell which one it was by the game, the graphics and sounds were so distinct, there was a real reason to go with one over the other. When you saw Mario 64 you knew it was o nth N64, when you saw Metal Gear Solid you knew it was on the PS1, when you saw Virtua Fighter 2 you knew it was on the Saturn, I can go on and on. I miss that, but the developers want their games on both the 360/ps3/ps4/Xbone now. Those last two are scary similar, so theres no real identity to have as their own. This homogenization is wrong. Theres too much big money in the gaming industry at the top and this is the start of it falling down. People are gonna stick with their current systems for a long time now after this. Maybe theyll even look back at the older games and systems and realize that gaming is about the games, not debates on privacy and cameras watching you all the time, or streaming your games like a million other people at the same time.

What do you guys think?

Your entire argument is pure hyperbole with very little factual support. Yes, the PS4 and likely the Xbox One have some defective units at launch. That has always been the case. I personally had friends who got defective Wiis, Gamecubes, PS2s, PS3s, Xbox 360s and even a defective Atari 2600 at launch. New consoles are no different than any other consumer product. The typical lemon rate for electronics is anywhere between 1 and 3 percent, assuming there isn't something more serious like a widespread problem such as the RROD on the 360 or the defective early discs on the Dreamcast.

Sales for both the PS4 and Xbox One have been massive so far and they will continue to grow over time as more games are released. People have already started ditching their 360s and PS3s and frankly, given the upcoming release schedules, there is not much in the way of new games coming out for either of those last generation consoles (at least beyond next gen ports of stuff that should perform better on the new hardware). Your recollection of history is poor at best. The Saturn and PS1 shared plenty of multi platform games and ultimately, both were great consoles. It will be the same with PS4 and Xbox One.

[Dashopepper]

This is probably due to the factory workers taking out their frustrations about their living conditions onto the consumers. Maybe its because the machines are just too far ahead of their times and they cant handle their power...

Theres too much big money in the gaming industry at the top and this is the start of it falling down....

Hmmm.. Or it's possible its just a new system launch and there's a lot of technology and the're having some issues. I don't really like modern consoles either but your two paranoid posts on them makes me like "retro" a little bit less :(

[Neb6]

I really like this part:




No system updates, no patch dowloads, no DRM, no FTP extra charges, no EXCLUSIVE DLC CONTENT



Consoles should be SIMPLE.

And yeah, I do agree that each machine had a more of an 'identity' relative to its competitors. I find the use of very similar hardware in the two new systems to be somewhat disturbing.


As for bugs.... I guess it's bound to happen as the complexity goes up. Hopefully that'll be ironed out soon. AND hopefully we'll be able to see what the new machines are capable of. So far what I've seen looks like anything I've already seen on the 360 and PS3.

[Greg2600]

I never got a console at launch, ever. I always waited primarily for a larger number of games to roll out. Therefore I often missed the hardware failure issues.

[Bojay1997]

I really like this part:



Consoles should be SIMPLE.

And yeah, I do agree that each machine had a more of an 'identity' relative to its competitors. I find the use of very similar hardware in the two new systems to be somewhat disturbing.


As for bugs.... I guess it's bound to happen as the complexity goes up. Hopefully that'll be ironed out soon. AND hopefully we'll be able to see what the new machines are capable of. So far what I've seen looks like anything I've already seen on the 360 and PS3.

Unfortunately, today being simple also means being obsolete within just a few years. The ability of the PS3 and Xbox 360 to patch software and especially their own operating systems allowed them to have a successful 8+ years of life. I'm excited about the fact that the PS4 and Xbox One will have similar long lives thus protecting my early investment in the hardware.

[bb_hood]

The Xbone and PS4 are having major defects within hours of their releases. This is probably due to the factory workers taking out their frustrations about their living conditions onto the consumers. Maybe its because the machines are just too far ahead of their times and they cant handle their power.

Either way it doesnt matter, way back when from the ps2 era to the atari and odyssey era, all you had to do was put the game cart or disk in and press the power switch. Flickering lights on the tv make your eyes go wide open and all of a sudden youre in another world, instantly trying to save a princess or saving your kingdom. No system updates, no patch dowloads, no DRM, no FTP extra charges, no EXCLUSIVE DLC CONTENT, all you had was that one game. You just bought that game and you played it.

Not to mention when you looked at a console you could tell which one it was by the game, the graphics and sounds were so distinct, there was a real reason to go with one over the other. When you saw Mario 64 you knew it was o nth N64, when you saw Metal Gear Solid you knew it was on the PS1, when you saw Virtua Fighter 2 you knew it was on the Saturn, I can go on and on. I miss that, but the developers want their games on both the 360/ps3/ps4/Xbone now. Those last two are scary similar, so theres no real identity to have as their own. This homogenization is wrong. Theres too much big money in the gaming industry at the top and this is the start of it falling down. People are gonna stick with their current systems for a long time now after this. Maybe theyll even look back at the older games and systems and realize that gaming is about the games, not debates on privacy and cameras watching you all the time, or streaming your games like a million other people at the same time.

What do you guys think?

New console systems always have problems at launch. At this point in the game, no one should be surprised that these 2 new consoles have problems. I dont even know what kind of problems they have. Like seriously at launch the systems are gonna have the worst selection of games, the most problems, and they will cost the most. That being said, im sure a few years from now they will both be excellent platforms for entertainment in general.

If you are looking for simple games that work 100% of the time, load in 3 seconds, and are simplistic and short platformers then play old stuff. That stuff is a thing of the past so you just gotta deal with it.

[bigbacon]

new stuff is always going to have problems. Thing with new consoles vs old is look at how much more complex they are, how many moving parts they have, etc. cart based machines had no moving parts and they were are not that complex, don't generate tons of heat, nor were they used in the same way new ones are. You didn't have to update them either and they do SO much more than old stuff ever did.

the numbers of failures are stuff pretty small compared to the amount sold/made/being used.

[PreZZ]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=92KjJsntxGY

[ProjectCamaro]

I never got a console at launch, ever. I always waited primarily for a larger number of games to roll out. Therefore I often missed the hardware failure issues.

Same here, I wait until we get a "slim" model, a price drop, or both before I buy. That way there's a good amount of games out for much better prices, plus the console is then reliable and any issues would have already been resolved.

[Bojay1997]

Same here, I wait until we get a "slim" model, a price drop, or both before I buy. That way there's a good amount of games out for much better prices, plus the console is then reliable and any issues would have already been resolved.

While there's nothing wrong with that, if you wait too long and have any interest in things like multiplayer or collaborative gaming (things like Little Big Planet and the like), by the time you get around to actually buying the console and/or game, the community playing that particular game might be long dead. The Xbox slim didn't release until 5 years after launch and the PS3 slim came out three years after launch. I think at about year 3 is when most consoles seem to really hit their stride with innovative games if the last two generations are any indication. Of course, this time around it might be even longer for a redesign as Sony and Microsoft seem very concerned about using stock off the shelf components and I don't know how much size or cost reduction you are going to see in the next few years on those items, especially if the PS4 and Xbox One continue to sell well and don't exhibit major design defects.

[sloan]

The Xbone and PS4 are having major defects within hours of their releases. This is probably due to the factory workers taking out their frustrations about their living conditions onto the consumers.

If that's the case, then why aren't there more defective Nike shoes, slave labor clothing, et al. I get the argument, but have to believe that those foreign labor camps have some quality control in place to catch errors before they ship, mostly, anyway.


No system updates, no patch dowloads, no DRM, no FTP extra charges, no EXCLUSIVE DLC CONTENT, all you had was that one game. You just bought that game and you played it.

Today's consumers are more the ADHD crowd. They just can't handle a single game with no extras. Get bored in about a half hour of playing the new game without DLC. Much as you may hate to admit, things are not going back.


This homogenization is wrong. Theres too much big money in the gaming industry at the top and this is the start of it falling down.

Can't say I haven't wished for the same, but most likely isn't gonna happen anytime soon, unless you count Nintendo with WiiU. And even they may be saved by all their first party exclusives, eventually.


People are gonna stick with their current systems for a long time now after this.

This just sounds like talking to hear your own voice. On what do you base this claim?


What do you guys think?

I most likely will not get any of the new systems anytime soon and won't miss a beat. Already have so many systems and games that modern stuff means little to me. However, I also realize that this younger generation likes a lot of this eye candy, so will eat it up. Thankfully, there is room enough for both types in today's gaming world.

[goob47]

Look, I understand why some people are fighting this guy's opinions and kinda being jerks about it, but c'mon. You're right on a lot of points, JakeM. It's so strange that two machines with hardware so similar will form these massive fan bases based on what exactly? "We're better cause we're stronger." "We're better cause we have better graphics." All of these statements may very well be true, but it's ultimately up to the customer to decide what they want-- but then you realize that you don't have very much of a choice, do you. Think about the early handheld era: you had Neo Geo Pocket, Wonderswan (Japan only, I realize that), Game Boy, Sega Game Gear, Turbo Express, even the Sega Nomad! There were so many options out there, and there was a distinct difference between them! I predict that in the next 10 years, history will repeat itself just as it did during the first video game crash. First too much shovelware is injected into the market (crappy FPS games that are the same freaking thing every time), then the consumers finally realize that there isn't any point in buying more systems and games. You know why? Because they realize that the money that circulates through this industry is handed out to these FPS developers like they're fricking great or something. Think if each company was given the same amount of monetary funding; think of all of the things that small developers/game companies could do if given the resources? That's what this world needs:

Something different.

[Rickstilwell1]

Look, I understand why some people are fighting this guy's opinions and kinda being jerks about it, but c'mon. You're right on a lot of points, JakeM. It's so strange that two machines with hardware so similar will form these massive fan bases based on what exactly? "We're better cause we're stronger." "We're better cause we have better graphics." All of these statements may very well be true, but it's ultimately up to the customer to decide what they want-- but then you realize that you don't have very much of a choice, do you. Think about the early handheld era: you had Neo Geo Pocket, Wonderswan (Japan only, I realize that), Game Boy, Sega Game Gear, Turbo Express, even the Sega Nomad! There were so many options out there, and there was a distinct difference between them! I predict that in the next 10 years, history will repeat itself just as it did during the first video game crash. First too much shovelware is injected into the market (crappy FPS games that are the same freaking thing every time), then the consumers finally realize that there isn't any point in buying more systems and games. You know why? Because they realize that the money that circulates through this industry is handed out to these FPS developers like they're fricking great or something. Think if each company was given the same amount of monetary funding; think of all of the things that small developers/game companies could do if given the resources? That's what this world needs:

Something different.

That's where the Ouya comes in. Or those free to download PC games developed in Game Maker and RPG Maker and scattered across the internet.

[The Adventurer]

Old stuff was new once. [/philosophy]

[bb_hood]

Look, I understand why some people are fighting this guy's opinions and kinda being jerks about it, but c'mon. You're right on a lot of points, JakeM. It's so strange that two machines with hardware so similar will form these massive fan bases based on what exactly? "We're better cause we're stronger." "We're better cause we have better graphics." All of these statements may very well be true, but it's ultimately up to the customer to decide what they want-- but then you realize that you don't have very much of a choice, do you. Think about the early handheld era: you had Neo Geo Pocket, Wonderswan (Japan only, I realize that), Game Boy, Sega Game Gear, Turbo Express, even the Sega Nomad! There were so many options out there, and there was a distinct difference between them! I predict that in the next 10 years, history will repeat itself just as it did during the first video game crash. First too much shovelware is injected into the market (crappy FPS games that are the same freaking thing every time), then the consumers finally realize that there isn't any point in buying more systems and games. You know why? Because they realize that the money that circulates through this industry is handed out to these FPS developers like they're fricking great or something. Think if each company was given the same amount of monetary funding; think of all of the things that small developers/game companies could do if given the resources? That's what this world needs:

Something different.

Both may be similar machines that play similar software, but everyone has their own preference. You can say we dont have much choice, but what exactly do you expect? These 2 (xbone & ps4) systems are brand new, and there are still boatloads of quality game available for the ps3 and xbox360. All kinds, of course FPS are all over the place but there are many other types as well. FPS games are popular and they sell, so they release many of them and many sequels. When shit doesnt sell the companies eventually go out of business. 10 years from now im pretty sure people will still be buying video games. Video games are an entertainment niche that will be filled by some other company if sony, microsoft, nintendo, etc.. went out of business. There will always be demand for video games in a retail setting, no matter how popular vintage gaming gets.

[Tanooki]

Sure there will be demand, but in what form. If Sony and MS continually just copycat each other and have a select few similar titles (ms) or some better variety of select games (sony) yet almost all the library still is the same and offers the same people will tire, all but the hardcore and you know that isn't a living sustainable business model. If that shit keeps up you'll have stand out outlier systems, PCs, smart phones and tablets filling the gap when disgust at an ever more expensive penis measuring pissing contest rages on, and they'll run that way.

JakeM could have worded it better but he's not that far off the mark which goob kind of spelled out too.


Also keep this in mind: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2rIJmGj4g-s

[Bojay1997]

Sure there will be demand, but in what form. If Sony and MS continually just copycat each other and have a select few similar titles (ms) or some better variety of select games (sony) yet almost all the library still is the same and offers the same people will tire, all but the hardcore and you know that isn't a living sustainable business model. If that shit keeps up you'll have stand out outlier systems, PCs, smart phones and tablets filling the gap when disgust at an ever more expensive penis measuring pissing contest rages on, and they'll run that way.

JakeM could have worded it better but he's not that far off the mark which goob kind of spelled out too.


Also keep this in mind: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2rIJmGj4g-s

Meh. I think Nintendo is at far more risk for having its business model collapse than Sony or Microsoft. The PS3 and Xbox 360 both sold very well and software sales on the 360 ended up beating the software sales of the Wii despite the fact that the Wii outsold it by a pretty good margin. Nintendo is very dependent on a fairly small pool of IP, makes most of its money on handhelds and it is directly competing with other more casual platforms like smartphones and tablets. Sony and Microsoft both embraced niche and indie titles this past generation and Sony in particular seems eager to support indie developers this generation. There is a lot of compelling content on the PS3 and Xbox 360 and I am certain this will continue on the PS4 and Xbox One.

[Tanooki]

Maybe or not, too hard to say. Going by history of their non-leader status from N64 to present (Wii being the exception) they've never had a year where they've failed to make money so the model they've been using hasn't killed them so far. Wii U has had a bad start, but we'll just have to see how it goes long term, but even yet as it stands the 3DS is propping it up enough. You're right they're competing with smaller platforms like tablets, perhaps that's why they added one to the controller. There's no doubt that the other guys went after indie things and this generation at least Sony is embracing it well without changing terms (ms did) but Nintendo also has been getting into that pool of interests too if you check what the Wii U eShop has going for it.

[homerhomer]

Hmm


The new consoles are pretty much just PC computers. The new Xbox and PS4 are both x86 platforms with off the shelf parts. Plus all the latest consoles all dedicated Operating System. I feel that these consoles more PCs than anything.

With all the issues being publicized, I think it's part extended complexity of the latest offerings and availability of the Internet and social media.

Are they better? I'm guessing only time will tell.

[SuperEliteGamer]

Wtf is this?

[Atarileaf]

I never got a console at launch, ever. I always waited primarily for a larger number of games to roll out. Therefore I often missed the hardware failure issues.

So true, let the early adopters suffer through the growing pains of new consoles.

[Atarileaf]

Wtf is this?

It's time travel to your personal hell where morals rule with an iron fist.

[Atarileaf]

First too much shovelware is injected into the market (crappy FPS games that are the same freaking thing every time).

I watch Rich from ReviewtechUSA and whenever he does a discussion video with a FPS in the background, I usually can't tell one from the other. I have a hard time understanding why games like COD Ghosts are so popular. The same people decry the annual sports updates but will gleefully buy up the latest lame FPS update like there's some huge difference. Run around like an idiot shooting people as gorily as possible while other 10 years old f-bomb you through your headset. Yea, fun times. :roll:

[Bojay1997]

I watch Rich from ReviewtechUSA and whenever he does a discussion video with a FPS in the background, I usually can't tell one from the other. I have a hard time understanding why games like COD Ghosts are so popular. The same people decry the annual sports updates but will gleefully buy up the latest lame FPS update like there's some huge difference. Run around like an idiot shooting people as gorily as possible while other 10 years old f-bomb you through your headset. Yea, fun times. :roll:

It's the same reason people still play lazer tag or play paintball or shoot airsoft. It's a competitive multiplayer experience that lets players do things in a safe gaming environment that they would never do in the real world. While not every FPS is brilliant IMHO, there are some great ones and even some classic ones like the Bioshock series, Half Life, Golden Eye, etc...Just because you don't like FPS games and can't recognize the differences between them doesn't mean they are worthless or not fun.

[Orion Pimpdaddy]

The OP makes some good points, but I'm having a ton of fun playing the PS4 and WiiU. We should appreciate the kinds of games we get to play today. That being said, what gets on my nerves are the updates that you get prompted to run. I miss the days of turning on a system and being able to play within five seconds.

Some older consoles did have technical issues at launch. I remember having to return my Sega CD to the store because it "ate" my Alice in Chains CD.

[Atarileaf]

It's the same reason people still play lazer tag

People still play lazer tag? I thought that died out in the 90's

[Atarileaf]

I remember having to return my Sega CD to the store because it "ate" my Alice in Chains CD.

Gotta be the first time a sega cd has actually done something useful :D

[Bojay1997]

People still play lazer tag? I thought that died out in the 90's

Nope. Ultrazone and a few other chains are still around and while I haven't taken the kids in a year or so, the last time we went on a Saturday afternoon, it was packed.

[ReaXan]

I think everyone who got into collecting did it primarily for two reasons

a.They didn't get to play the games they wanted to play as kids because of financial reasons. They have the resources to make it happen now.

b.They are trying to relive a feeling that the particular game or system offered them at one point in their life.


I am guilty of both and in the end I realized after a certain point there is no going back. You can't have the same feeling someone had for say Earthbound unless you played it when it came out as a child and before being exposed to newer technology in gaming. Some games just hit a chord at the right time and can't again. Some will disagree with me on this yet alot of collectors buy into a nostalgia hype for certain games because of either positive experiences and intangibles that made the game personal to them because of a life event that was going on or a perfect storm of good vibes in their life when they played the game.

There are people with large collections that have backlogs of games they want to play but never even got around to it and eventually just sold them and embraced other things because they never got what they wanted out of gaming as adults. A FULL return to childhood or something along those lines. They tried to relive someone else's gaming life and that never seems to work out from my experience.

I guess as a guy that grew up on the NES and who is now 30 I have seen the evolution of gaming to what it was to what it is today and yet I think that we should let a new generation of gamers create their own identity and not try to force ours on them. They are playing games for the same reason we use to. To have fun and have good memories we can look back on it one day in appreciation for what we were blessed with at one time in our lives.

Finally, I think its time for alot of retro collectors to try to create new memories instead of trying to recreate what happened in your life 20 years ago. Find games that YOU can make personal for yourself as an adult even its some random PS2 game you never heard of. That said, don't try to play games because a kid lived and breathed a certain game when he/she was 12 years old and now tries to convince you that you will have the same experience he or she did. Its your experience that matters in the end. They got theirs so get yours.

This is my last post at DigitPress and I had fun the last 10 years sharing it with you guys while getting to read the comments from a large amount of high quality individuals. A new gaming chapter of my life now begins and I hope everyone gets the most enjoyment possible from this generation of gaming.

[Neb6]

I think everyone who got into collecting did it primarily for two reasons

a.They didn't get to play the games they wanted to play as kids because of financial reasons. They have the resources to make it happen now.

b.They are trying to relive a feeling that the particular game or system offered them at one point in their life.

I am guilty of both and in the end I realized after a certain point there is no going back. They tried to relive someone else's gaming life and that never seems to work out from my experience.

... I think that we should let a new generation of gamers create their own identity and not try to force ours on them.

That said, don't try to play games because a kid lived and breathed a certain game when he/she was 12 years old and now tries to convince you that you will have the same experience he or she did. Its your experience that matters in the end. They got theirs so get yours.



You make it sound like a bad thing. :)

Believe it or not, I actually can re-create the feeling I had when I played these games back in the day. So -- for me -- it works.

Having said that, I also play modern games. There's nothing wrong with experiencing both old and new games.

I agree that we should let the current generation enjoy their time gaming. I'm right there with them. I don't try to eclipse their gaming experiences; I simply introduce them to the old stuff. If they dig it, then great. If not, great too. There are only so many free hours in a week.

Finally, I have no problem playing games on the referral of someone else's fond memories of a game that I might have missed the first time around. I've discovered a lot of great titles that way.

Happy trails... wherever it is that your attention will be turned.

[Sothy]

Cougarlife.com

[MidnightRider]

I think that we should let a new generation of gamers create their own identity and not try to force ours on them. They are playing games for the same reason we use to. To have fun and have good memories we can look back on it one day in appreciation for what we were blessed with at one time in our lives.

That's always been my outlook too. We had our generation, let them have theirs. Are we going to force Voltron and He-Man on them, because we don't care for what cartoons are nowadays as well?



Finally, I think its time for alot of retro collectors to try to create new memories instead of trying to recreate what happened in your life 20 years ago. Find games that YOU can make personal for yourself as an adult even its some random PS2 game you never heard of.

In my case, I didn't quit post-4th gen because of nostalgia. I did so because I simply just don't care for what video games have transformed into(for example, if I never see another FMV for as long as I live, I'll be happy). Meanwhile, I can still find enjoyment out of 4th gen and prior. One can make plenty of new memories, because there are still a bunch of undiscovered titles, to the individual, in any remotely successful console's library.