PayPal Fraud - Best Way to Deal With It?

[Tritoch]

As I alluded to in another thread, I'm currently dealing with my first scammer on PayPal. This person received the item, then filed a "non-receipt" complaint simply because he knew he could and probably get away with it (no tracking was used since I gave him free BIN shipping).

I just received my second seller warning from PayPal, with one of three possible actions open to me:


As stated in the PayPal User Agreement, you are required to resolve any complaints within 7 days of the filing date (by Aug 17, 2003), using one of the following methods:

1. Provide a refund to the buyer for the full amount of the disputed transaction
2. Provide a tracking number that confirms proof of delivery to the buyer Confirmed Address
3. Provide proof of a previously issued refund to the buyer for the full amount of the disputed transaction.

If you do not attempt to resolve this complaint in the specified time period, we will process the buyer's refund, and your access to your PayPal account may be limited.

Obviously I can't do 2 or 3, so if I do anything it has to be #1 or nothing at all. I've emailed PayPal outlining the situation with enough proof (including the positive feedback the buyer left me before filing the complaint) that I think it stands a reasonable chance of being overturned, but I'm scared about what might happen to my PayPal account (which I do a lot of business through) if I don't refund this buyer's ill-gotten gains.

So, how should I proceed with this? If I don't refund the buyer the full amount ($15) by August 17th, what kind of punishment will PayPal enact on my account? Should I just go ahead and eat the $15, or hold out in the hopes that his complaint will be overturned before the deadline? If I do refund him the $15, is there a chance I could get it back later?

I hate liars. :angry:

[suppafly]

If i were you, i`d wait for paypals resolution. If they say you have to refund.....i would refund and give VERY negative feedback to the user.

You sound like a very honest person and maybe i`ll buy from you ;) whats your ebay nick?

[mcgrail0007@netzero.net]

Without a tracking number you are pretty much screwed. At least it is only $15. I would recommend refunding the money because if you don't PayPal will take the $15 out of your account (provided that you have money in your account) and an additional $10 fee for the chargeback. In addition to this, it is possible that they could lock your account and then you won't be able to accept PayPal. For a long time now, I have purchased delivery confirmation for each and every package that I send out and I will only ship to confirmed addresses. It is better to be safe than sorry.

[Buyatari]

How did you mail the item?

If you mailed it at the PO and you have a receipt. You can use the number on the receipt for your tracking number.

You will get a reply that proof of delivery was sent but you could not prove it was mailed to a "confirmed address" or something like that. Tracking on this item is not available and as we investigate please try to clear this up on your own etc etc etc.

After that you SHOULD (many months later) get an email stating the investigation is concluded and you should be off the hook.

You don't need to purchase insurance you just need to keep your receipt.

Adam

[Tritoch]

So you've actually done that before? I didn't think that would be considered valid proof. I have every receipt for everything I've mailed at the post office in the last 1.5 years, in order by date. :o

I've forwarded a copy of the receipt to PayPal, but I think it might be too late as I've already refunded the guy's money. If nothing else, this has been a valuable and relatively inexpensive lessoned learned. :-D

PS: Buyatari rules!

[Buyatari]

Let us know how it turns out.

Adam

[Buyatari]

Did you send a seperate paypal payment?

or did you just reverse the charges?

If you sent a second paypal payment I'd contest it. Give him a dose of his own medicine.

Say you offered a refund if he returned the item and he never did return it. Either way if you have the reciept don't give up yet.

Adam

[Tritoch]

Did you send a seperate paypal payment?

or did you just reverse the charges?

If you sent a second paypal payment I'd contest it. Give him a dose of his own medicine.

Say you offered a refund if he returned the item and he never did return it. Either way if you have the reciept don't give up yet.

Adam

I reversed the charge. Wish I would've sent a separate payment...that'd be hilarious. :)

I emailed the buyer a copy of the receipt too...should be interesting to hear his reply. Of course, he could say that I sent something else to someone else in his tiny town on the exact same day... LOL

[Buyatari]

If he bought a copy of Stadium Events and you sent him Oreos it doesn't matter he isn't covered.

The only way he would have been covered for "item received not as described" would be if he paid for that service. I don't know what happens then, nobody ever pays for that.

I'd give paypal a call and if you have their fax # I'd fax the receipt over. Along with following the normal procedure for this.

Then I'd calmly explain to the bidder that you have found your receipt and have proof it was mailed. It may take a few days but he will get it if not already. Tell him things will get ugly if he does not return the money or the item he stole.

If things need to get ugly you can do one or more of the following.

File a Non Paying Bidder alert with eBay. Doesn't mater if you left positve feedback already.

File postal fraud with the USPS. (you 1st sent item and later refunded purchase for return of item and he never returned it)

You may be able to file fraud with Paypal under these same guidelines but since you refunded payment you'll have to do it over the phone. Stick with the story above.

File a petetion with squaretrade. It is free as long as you don't have feedback removed. They can't really do anything but most people don't know this and get scared when they see you are serious.

File internet fraud with the US government at http://www1.ifccfbi.gov/index.asp

Contact the police in his home town YES they will knock on his door.

If all these fail file negative feedback if you can for PAYPAL BACKCHARGE FRAUD and call it a day.

Adam

[Arkan]

Tritoch wtch your private message

[Oobgarm]

If things need to get ugly you can do one or more of the following.

File a Non Paying Bidder alert with eBay. Doesn't mater if you left positve feedback already.

File postal fraud with the USPS. (you 1st sent item and later refunded purchase for return of item and he never returned it)

You may be able to file fraud with Paypal under these same guidelines but since you refunded payment you'll have to do it over the phone. Stick with the story above.

File a petetion with squaretrade. It is free as long as you don't have feedback removed. They can't really do anything but most people don't know this and get scared when they see you are serious.

File internet fraud with the US government at http://www1.ifccfbi.gov/index.asp

Contact the police in his home town YES they will knock on his door.

If all these fail file negative feedback if you can for PAYPAL BACKCHARGE FRAUD and call it a day.

Remind me to never try and screw you over. :D LOL

[BigBoogie]

I quite often send thing uninsured. And untrackable. Im in Canada, so to send even just an NES game to the US insured it costs about $14. Paypal are bastards. If the auction says there is no insurence, the buyer shouldnt have a case, unless they show they paid extra for it.

[Buyatari]

If the auction says there is no insurence, the buyer shouldnt have a case, unless they show they paid extra for it.

They don't.

As long as you have SOME type of proof. Be it a receipt or whatever.

Adam