How are you feeling about the Wii U future

[Tanooki]

I'm curious what peoples take on this either as owners or not. Clearly they lack third party releases, in particular on discs. The stories were if they could move millions of systems opinions and development would change. Mario Kart is moving a heap of systems and games in buzz words 'over night' pretty much. How do you all feel about the future of the system with this and also Smash Bros a little later on? Not much was shown at E3 which causes some concern, but there were a couple solid second party things on the plate like Bayonetta. I own the system and I wish I had more options from outside of Nintendo. I have stuff like COD Ghosts, DuckTales, Rayman and Resident Evil but they're all also on other systems too, nothing unique which is a shame. Bayonetta will be, and it's the only system of that horsepower that will see late year the Cars project, and there's the Xenoblade title too, but I feel there just should be more to keep the system a focal point of use and not just a casual box to use every now and again.

[Tupin]

I think with Miyamoto's latest comments about the "Nintendo genre" and how they "don't want to be 'cool'" kind of shows Nintendo's attitude towards it. They've basically given up on third parties, at least traditional ones. They're going for indies.

Even if Nintendo had produced a system on par technologically with the PS4/XB1, third parties would still snub their noses at it because they don't want to compete with Nintendo. Nevermind that stuff like Halo and Infamous always sell better on their respective systems than third party games. It's just this bias that Western developers have had for decades and it's not going away.

That being said, I'd expect a new system to come out probably Winter 2016, early reveal at next E3 and more information at E3 2016. That's about as early as I think they could push another system out. And they'd definitely have a 3DS successor ready by then, could work with their new ideas of integration of handhelds and consoles. Even with mobile competition, Nintendo can still hold its own. The Vita is basically dead.

As an owner who bought it on launch day, 2013 was not fun. 2014 is looking better even if it is mostly Nintendo titles and I kind of have to paraphrase the movie Frozen despite my dislike for it: "I never needed third parties anyway."

[Az]

The wife picked me one up as a birthday gift a few months ago, prior to that I was kicking around the idea of picking a used one up if the price was right so I could play NSMBU.

At this point I'm totally satisfied with the system. Just like the 3DS, there's going to be game types unique to the system and there's going to be types you'll never see. Right now I own a handful of games for it,all are a ton of fun and even if they pulled the plug this year I'd still be content with what I have. Full on hardware and software backwards compatibility also helps tremendously to enjoy the handful of Wii exclusive releases I really like.

My only complaint is that I wish they would just integrate the regular Wii shop into the Wii U shop. I'm sure having it separated into the dedicated Wii mode only hinders potential buyers and you can bet that a lot of people don't even know it's there. Throw all that VC content from there onto the Wii U shop and be done with it!

[Leo_A]

I think it's a great system, I just wish it had GameCube compatibility (Including a USB adapter to interface a Game Boy Player to it) and that Wii U specific controllers could substitute as Wii Classic Controllers in Wii mode. And it's not a Wii U issue, but an account based DRM scheme for DLC is also long overdue and the lack of such a thing is damaging to both the Wii U and the 3DS.

If the Wii U ended today though, I'd still be pretty happy with it. But I think its days are numbered and anticipate that it could be replaced as early as Fall 2015 and no later than Fall 2016 (The latter of which is what I'm betting on). I'd be very surprised if there's a major exclusive next year other than Zelda as they change gears to developing next generation software and I suspect that 2015 will be its last year for halfway decent support.

Frankly, I think their 3DS and Wii U lineups right now already indicate that such a process is well underway. Zelda will again be the Nintendo console swan song for the third generation in a row (Twilight Princess closed out the GameCube and Skyward Sword closed out the Wii for major 1st party releases).

[PizzaKat]

I'm quite surprised that a couple of posts here think a new system is coming in a couple of years. I believe they will ride it out. It will make a profit but will probably finish behind the XBox One. The third parties other than a few titles here and there are pretty much gone from this generation. They have no one to blame but themselves and I hope they learn from this. I enjoy mine as the PS4 has nothing interesting. Super Mario 3D World is one of the best games that Ive played in awhile. its just too bad it didn't sell consoles.

For their next console I hope they can get third parties, I don't want have to buy another console to get third party offerings. If they can be like the SNES they'd do a lot of sales. People saying "I don't care for third parties etc." can't realize that many other people such as myself do. More powerful system, Nintendos first party plus third party support whether it be boring FPS, fighters, and the like will most likely equal much more sales and more games for people to buy while they wait for Nintendo's own games.

[WCP]

I'm quite surprised that a couple of posts here think a new system is coming in a couple of years. I believe they will ride it out.


Here's the thing...


You'd think that if Nintendo really felt like they should do their damnedest to make a legit go of it with the Wii U, that they would have lowered the price by now (significantly), and then maybe they could legitimately get back into the mix.

The fact that the price is still ridiculously high, tells me that Nintendo is going to "let this one die on the vines". In other words, I see them sticking it out with the Wii U for the next couple of years, but not actually trying to really bend over backwards to try to make the Wii U a market share contender. If they really wanted to try to get the Wii U back into the mix, they need a bundle for $199 that includes Mario 3D World. Or even a $199 bundle that includes Mario Kart 8.

I know some people would say... "Are you F'ing crazy ? Mario Kart 8 in a bundle for $199 ? The Mario Kart 8 bundle is $329.99, how are they going to drop the price $130 ? "


Well, I don't know how they are going to do it, I just know that if they were serious about actually having the Wii U legitimately compete, that is exactly what they would need to do, along with a new marketing campaign promoting it. For me, the fact that it hasn't happened yet is very telling.

[Leo_A]

I'm quite surprised that a couple of posts here think a new system is coming in a couple of years. I believe they will ride it out. It will make a profit but will probably finish behind the XBox One.

There is absolutely no reasonable chance that this system will ever be profitable and the Xbox One will most certainly sell several consoles for every Wii U system that is sold.

Nintendo has no incentive to push this generation any longer than need be since it's a lost cause with their only goal being to minimize the losses and hopefully change their momentum somehow so they can regain profitability with their next generation hardware. They're not even anywhere close to GameCube style sales performance here as they close in on the Wii U's two year anniversary (A system that was never sold at a loss, I might add).

They will let it stay around just long enough to provide some semblance of a reasonable lifespan to placate their dedicated fans. Fall 2016 which I'm betting on will mark the 4 year anniversary which is reasonably close to the 5 year or so average folks expect from Nintendo systems. Once that happens, they will quickly phase it out once their next generation hardware is ready to go just like Microsoft did with the Xbox.

And with all this hybrid handheld/console talk, the age of the 3DS, and the downward momentum of the system and its greatly diminished software calendar, it might happen even earlier with a Fall 2015 or spring 2016 date at the latest since the 3DS will be ripe by then. If a hybrid platform of some sort is indeed the course they're taking, it's going to be the timing for the need of a 3DS replacement that they're going to key off for deciding when to launch their next generation platform rather than keeping the failed Wii U going a while longer just to keep up appearances.

[Tanooki]

I think both sides are right on this. They're holding out at this rate and keeping quiet about it standing their ground and just running the PR re-run about stuff while doing a fade with the Amiibo stuff. One thing most people don't ever bring up is something I've been saying over a year now and Nintendo around E3 finally said themselves which got me thinking I'm not that far off the mark. Going forward now they're an one internal entity and just a year ago they ran like two companies split for console and handheld. They merged them after a years worth of horrid failures and losses even the 3DS couldn't prop up due to the WiiU tanking which sucks. I was saying next go around since they refuse to do what third parties want in a system to get their support and because they like to stand out and play the unique card, they need to just take the merger to the next logical step.

All in one device. Think of like the Neo-Geo X. You have the entire system in an expensive handheld, and then you have a dock with an HDMI cable and controllers that go with it for multiple players, yet you can undock the console and keep it going. The WiiU in essence is kind of just that already with their off-TV play which all but an extreme few games support because no one wants to uniquely use the tablet for play like ZombiU did. Think if they could do a $300 all in one box that you can carry anywhere, then when you want, toss into a dock and play on your big old TV at home. The system could have pretty beefy capabilities given what the most top of the line tablets do these days. Since they seem to still be asininely resistant to having a touch panel from the 21st century like on Android and Apple devices they got the cost down there a lot, so they'd have more room for the CPU/GPU, ram and the rest and with how relatively cheap larger sized mini cards (think 3DS) are you could get a lot of game into such a little thing. They'd have just one source of revenue and they downright own and still own the home dedicated gaming device portable market. Third parties rush enough to make games for their handheld and they do get good dough out of it for a minimal cost versus what console games for and we've seen the general quality the 3DS can push.

[brainerdrainer]

I feel great about the future! I'll always love my Wii U!

[Buyatari]

Personally, I like the WiiU better than the PS4 or the Xbox One.
Not sure how it will do. Sales seem to be slow. No one ever asks for it at my store.

Nintendo is long overdue for the next NEW blockbuster title. You can't just hash the same games over and over. No matter how good the next installment of Mario Kart 32,Pokemon 54a and 54b or Super Smash Bros 27 might be it gets old.

[Rickstilwell1]

They should make a 3D perspective console version of Mole Mania where you can even tunnel further underground and explore the underground tunnels in addition to the overworld.

[Tupin]

Personally, I like the WiiU better than the PS4 or the Xbox One.
Not sure how it will do. Sales seem to be slow. No one ever asks for it at my store.

Nintendo is long overdue for the next NEW blockbuster title. You can't just hash the same games over and over. No matter how good the next installment of Mario Kart 32,Pokemon 54a and 54b or Super Smash Bros 27 might be it gets old.
I think Splatoon is going to be pretty big.

[Tanooki]

They should make a 3D perspective console version of Mole Mania where you can even tunnel further underground and explore the underground tunnels in addition to the overworld.

I never played the GB game much but it did show Miyamoto's charm in design, and I think what you're getting at there actually could be fun enough that I'd even buy it.

[Zthun]

Personally, I like the WiiU better than the PS4 or the Xbox One.
Not sure how it will do. Sales seem to be slow. No one ever asks for it at my store.

Nintendo is long overdue for the next NEW blockbuster title. You can't just hash the same games over and over. No matter how good the next installment of Mario Kart 32,Pokemon 54a and 54b or Super Smash Bros 27 might be it gets old.

Yeah, but innovation is not what people want. There's a small minority of gamers that want new stuff but sales show that people would rather buy the same stuff over and over again.

Corporations make decisions that are in the best interest of their shareholders, not their consumers.

[WCP]

Nintendo still has that Disney-esque magic touch.

They bring it out every once in awhile...


Super Mario 3D Land for the 3DS is absolutely overflowing with that Nintendo Magic. I don't have a Wii U, but I'm guessing both Mario Kart and the 3D Mario World on Wii U are both overflowing with that Nintendo magic. Luigi's Mansion on the 3DS. The recent Zelda on the 3DS. Nintendo can still bring it.

The Toad game on Wii U looks interesting.

I'd love to get a Wii U, but Nintendo needs to make it extremely hard for me to resist, and right now they are making it very easy for me to resist. If they can put a package together with either the 3D Mario World or Mario Kart packed in, and get the whole package at $199.99, then I'd actually jump on the bandwagon. We are still talking about like $218 after tax. Not exactly chump change. But I'd really spend the full $218, but I gotta get Mario Kart or 3D World thrown in the box, and it has to be brand new. Nintendo just can't seem to lower the price much, which tells me they are paying WAY too much for the parts they put in the box. It doesn't make any sense. They should be able to sell a package at $200 and break even by now.

[Rickstilwell1]

Yeah, but innovation is not what people want. There's a small minority of gamers that want new stuff but sales show that people would rather buy the same stuff over and over again.

Corporations make decisions that are in the best interest of their shareholders, not their consumers.

I think the main problem is that gamers are lazier than before and instead of researching games they just go "well I know Mario, those are always fun." ditto with Zelda, Pokémon, etc. And so those are always the ones that sell. Video games have just been around so long that the older casual gamers have gained a comfort zone and have a harder and harder time stepping outside of it as they get more real life responsibilities.

I'm kind of guilty of it myself, but I do step out of that zone by saying I also want to try all the new RPGs. That should get me a lot of unknown franchises right? The problem is that RPGs usually aren't ready for consoles in large quantities until later in the systems' lives. I'm sure they helped boost the PS3 a lot in later years.

[Zthun]

I think the main problem is that gamers are lazier than before and instead of researching games they just go "well I know Mario, those are always fun." ditto with Zelda, Pokémon, etc. And so those are always the ones that sell. Video games have just been around so long that the older casual gamers have gained a comfort zone and have a harder and harder time stepping outside of it as they get more real life responsibilities.

I'm kind of guilty of it myself, but I do step out of that zone by saying I also want to try all the new RPGs. That should get me a lot of unknown franchises right? The problem is that RPGs usually aren't ready for consoles in large quantities until later in the systems' lives. I'm sure they helped boost the PS3 a lot in later years.

I disagree with you about gamers are lazier than before. I really think it boils down to two factors: social status and money.

People want to play what their friends are playing, so they continue to buy the same things over and over again, regardless if the games are good or not. They want to be a part of a group. The Wii gave accessibility to a lot of people that weren't gamers before and now there's millions upon millions of people that are playing modern consoles. Most of the are casual gamers that have very small libraries thorughout the life span of the console.

Even though $60 is cheaper today than it was 20 years ago when adjusted for inflation, America especially has thrown the majority of the money supply at the top and it's not trickling down to the middle class. That big recession in 2008 burned a lot of people and most just aren't willing to drop $60 on an unknown when they can play it safe and buy something that has a high chance of them liking it.

[Leo_A]

I really doubt that the Wii has brought many people into the console fold that wouldn't of been here otherwise. Most of the people that were Wii owners that have transitioned to the Xbox One, Playstation 4, and so on would've been here Wii or no Wii. The people that wouldn't of given this world a second thought had the Wii not been a casual hit largely didn't stay around.

[8-Bit Archeology]

My thoughts on the Wii U.

Professor Layton
Animal Crossing
And Minecraft

Where the hell are they already!!!

[8-Bit Archeology]

My thoughts on the Wii U.

Professor Layton
Animal Crossing
And Minecraft

Where the hell are they already!!!

[RCM]

I own the Zelda edition Wii U and generally like the system. If you enjoy the narrow selection of software (stuff from Nintendo, Sega, Platinum) you'll probably be OK with the system, but Wii U will more than likely go down as a failure in the eyes of the public. Nintendo heavily benefited from the success of Wii and did well in the short term, but there were serious cracks showing up early on in the Wii's cycle that Nintendo failed to correct (such as their third party problem). Then they released a largely unnecessary and underpowered successor to Wii that everyone knew was dead in the water. The success of Mario Kart 8 is an anomaly that sold more to the preexisting base vs. new customers.

[retroman]

I am happy with mine, and not worried at all. Same song and dance we all have heard before. Heard it with the N64, and that was a great system. Then we heard it with the Gamecube, and that turned out ok as well.

[Gamevet]

Personally, I like the WiiU better than the PS4 or the Xbox One.
Not sure how it will do. Sales seem to be slow. No one ever asks for it at my store.

Nintendo is long overdue for the next NEW blockbuster title. You can't just hash the same games over and over. No matter how good the next installment of Mario Kart 32,Pokemon 54a and 54b or Super Smash Bros 27 might be it gets old.

I'm pretty much burned out on platformers. I've played that style of game for nearly 30 years and really don't have a lot of want to continue playing them on a regular basis. I have no desire to play Tropical Freeze, the latest installments of Super Mario Bros. or Rayman Legends. I'd be more interested in the Wii U if it had a new version of Pilot Wings, Wave Race, Star Fox and F-Zero. Star Fox is coming out, but I need more than that one title to even consider dropping $300 on a Wii U.

I've held back on buying a PS4 or Xbox One, because most of the titles on those consoles can be played on my PC. I have no doubts that I will eventually get one of those consoles within the next year though, because I know that the 3rd party titles will eventually start flowing for those systems by this fall.

[frogofdeath]

Just reiterating what has already been mentioned, but the price is what is keeping me from purchasing a WiiU. Get it down to that magical $200 mark, with game, and I'd probably take the plunge. There are plenty of games, already out and in the near future, that hold my interest but the console price is still a deterrent.

[Richter Belmount]

The death of wii u has been greatly exaggerated. Alot of the people who like to say the Wii u is doomed are the people who don't understand video games. All of those people are the people who only see the quick turn around for mobile games and call of duty , they are all about a quick turn around selling and buying shares for game companies. Shareholders dont want to stick with Nintendo because they dont see the fast turn around like you would see at the other game companies like ubisoft , activision and EA , but betting against Nintendo is stupid because they do have all the franchises and properties that do make money they just take longer to develop like any other higher quality game should , they always prove themselves when their innovations when they do pay off and with their dominating portable market. Nintendo is always all about the long term but they earn the ire of fly by night shareholders. Its prob best Nintendo keeps playing smart than listen to their shareholders...

Quote of a Nintendo Stock Holder at Share holders meeting. (they really dont understand games..)
''Q9: I don't know about games, and don't care about game-related questions, but your shareholders haven't said anything about the stock price dropping. What kind of a shareholder meeting is this? Tell me about the business administration. (audience applause)
A9: Thank you for your pointed opinion. Shareholder meetings are for us to communicate with shareholders. It's important for shareholders to know what we as a company are doing, and what kind of entertainment we are providing.''

This my own theory and I guess their is some half truths there considering Miyamoto himself said thought the Wii U wasnt doing to well , but I like to think that the industry all around isnt doing to hot in sales , business is just down at the moment but I still feel Nintendo is at a advantageous time. They kicked ass at E3 , the sales are a bit up from Mario Kart 8 , they have money in the bank for any down times and have some of the most anticipated titles for the holiday season. Business is down all around and other companies dont have much to offer atm but Nintendo has plenty to offer.

[Tanooki]

Well I don't feel it's doomed, as it they won't just pull the rug out from under it. My beef is the lack of non-Nintendo made games to give the system variety, more shelf real estate at retail, and in general any form of respect from the dicks in the media and the trolling game producers who go on file saying really dumb crap instead of keeping it to themselves.

I don't hate it, hell compared to the Wii I love it, but all the downing on it has wrecked my motivation to turn it on much at all along with the lack of something I want to play on it. I've got a few games I need to finish but I always get side tracked. I'm hoping Bayonetta 1/2 among a few others turn out solid as that would be helpful. You're right, part of the problem is the me me entitlement want instant gratification crowd which Nintendo has not shot for really much at all and third parties are those kinds of fools that go in hard, fast and expensive and want it back fast, not wanting it back over a year. You're right the industry on the whole isn't doing really well and hasn't for awhile, it's more and more volatile due to their dumb fascination with hollywood sized budgets and trying to cash in as fast as movies at the theater do as well, they just don't plan to make that dough over a year or even six months, and they shoot way large and tend to try and play it safe leaving a lot of creativity overlooked or forced into the digital rental(download) format. Nintendo is doing fine at the moment, thanks to Mario Kart 8, but when you compare it against the multiconsole tripe that Sony and MS gets, it's the same kind of scale of sales and profit that comes in bursts with an expected huge seller. You'll get the boom in console and game sales around those, just like you do at a system launch mostly, but overall things have been stinking for a few years now if you remove those outlier given big safe sellers.

[LaughingMAN.S9]

I just bought 2 wii u's, one for me and one for my nephew and while I like it a lot, I can already tell that once I get sick of mario kart this thing is going to be collecting dust as the worlds most expensive paper weight, same as the original wii.


You know what would save the wii u in my eyes? Releasing a 3ds adapter much like the og gameboy player for the gamecube that would let me play upscaled 3ds games on my tv and gamepad. That by itself would justify the 300 I spent/threw away for me. So many great 3ds titles that I will never experience because I don't give a shit about handheld gaming (vita excluded)

[Tanooki]

I would use the WiiU somewhat regularly if you had your wish of the 3DS/2DS adapter device. It would be cool to use the WiiU tablet along with my LED TV while saving the battery of the XL I have.

I can not remember the last time I turned the thing on which saddens me as I do have games unfinished but I just have zero motivation to play it. It has fallen into a valley like the Vita where I loved the hardware but nothing comes out on it I want and it has such a lack of developer support the grimness of the situation demotivates my usage of it to a dust collector. I got a PS4 a couple days ago, and the time alone on Wolfenstein so far (I think around 6 hours~) is more than I've put on the WiiU probably most of the year.

[Gameguy]

You know what would save the wii in my eyes? Releasing a 3ds adapter much like the og gameboy player for the wii u that would let me play upscaled 3ds games on my tv and gamepad. That by itself would justify the 300 I spent/threw away for me. So many great 3ds titles that I will never experience because I don't give a shit about handheld gaming (vita excluded)
There is a type of adapter for the 3DS like that, but it's not from Nintendo and it's very expensive.

http://www.3dsvideocapture.com/product/24

[LaughingMAN.S9]

There is a type of adapter for the 3DS like that, but it's not from Nintendo and it's very expensive.

http://www.3dsvideocapture.com/product/24

:eek 2: :eek 2: :eek 2:


Jesus!


Lol I don't think I want it THAT bad

[otaku]

I'll buy one for mario kart alone just like I did the wii everything else is gravy and I got plenty of play out of my wii given how little it cost me I'm sure given nintendos deep pockets and great series it will do just fine.

[PreZZ]

Well, nintendo deserves to crash and burn this generation, this is long overdue... they need to LISTEN to what WE want. No more kiddy branding (wii u, seriously?), good online network, and machine specs on par or better than the competition, good controller design and get rid once and for all of the wiimotes, and no cheesy marketing bullshit like the gamepad, and also put some decent multimedia features like streaming.No more WAGGLING! I own wii u and i do like it occasionally, but i play all my other systems a lot more. Playing fps with the pro controller is terrible, so are driving games with no analog, and when i played mk8 online i was so pissed off by the awful online lobbys and options, the servers were better than this on dreamcast in 2000. If nintendo had released a console as powerful as ps4, i could have all the third party games i want PLUS the first party nintendo games I could live with only one console. Wii u will get sales spike once in a while when they release zelda, smash bros and mario but thats it, people want to invest in a console that kids and parents will like, and sony and ms are doing it.

[Leo_A]

I don't agree that much of that is an issue.


machine specs on par or better than the competition

I don't think they need to compete on horsepower. They tried that with the GameCube and look what good it did, they lost yet again to a brand new competitor for the 2nd generation in a row and dropped to 3rd in the marketplace.

They essentially made it work on the Wii until the couple of years prior to the Wii U when the HDTV revolution finally overwhelmed the Wii and the lack of 1st party releases, Wii's bread and butter, dried up as Nintendo prepared for the Wii U.

I think it would've been foolish to abandon the concept of tailoring their hardware to the level that they felt they needed for their own game visions and return to competing on horsepower to draw away a small minority of the sports, FPS, and GTA crowds. Nintendo's return to prominence needs to be on the merits of what it does that the competition doesn't, not a late last ditch desperate attempt to just copy them.


good online network

Their online infrastructure seems to be fine. Maybe a few enhancements here and there, but it performs well and accomplishes most of what's asked of it. All I really want to see here is an account based DRM solution for DLC.


and get rid once and for all of the wiimotes

Wii remotes as a secondary option are fine. If anything, one should've been packed in to encourage more use of it where appropriate since we're not getting much of anything tailored for it. On the Wii, it was often utilized inappropriately. But it shined in specific areas like arcade style light gun shooters and other limited instances.

But nobody, even Nintendo, seems interested in utilizing it for much more than just an option or to fill out multiplayer with. A consequence I presume of it not being a standard part of the bundle. Despite the ubiquitous nature of the Wii, there is a proportion of Wii U owners that lack a sensor bar and Wii controllers (And I'm sure a decent percentage that does have the equipment, lacks Motion Plus capabilities for all or a portion of their Wii remotes). That knowledge that it's not universal is a deterrent for publishers.


good controller design

The gamepad is fine. They shouldn't of put so much emphasis on the screen as being their innovation for this generation without ideas and games to justify it (I think they rather amateurishly decided to bring their DS innovation to consoles, a feature that really was never what it was cracked up to be that has all but dried up now that the casual segment has moved to their phones), but it's still a fine controller even if the screen is of little use beyond for off-screen play.

Only adjustments I'd make is making the high capacity battery standard and the triggers should've been analog. And it really needs to be sold standalone at stores or at least at Nintendo's own online store. Not for multiplayer, but so it could be replaced by the customer when necessary. It should be on store shelves for about $80 even if Nintendo is taking a loss at that price.

A non-replaceable controller that's integrated into many critical functions (They're slowly patching requirements out, but you still can't do many things like adjusting system settings or hitting the okay prompt after a firmware update without it not to mention a selection of the game lineup also mandates it) is a very bizarre move as far as I'm concerned.


No more kiddy branding (wii u, seriously?)

The branding stunk from day 1, I think. But I know what they were after. They were so desperate to bring that value forward (100 million Wii's, after all) that I think they lost their way and let it strangle their new system rather than benefit it.

Ideally, they should've found a way to continue identifying a line of next gen software tailored for the Wii remote and multiplayer with that brand, but named their system something else. Or at least make it clearer and more obvious that this was their next gen hardware rather than a Wii add-on if they absolutely were convinced that they needed those three letters as part of their system's name.

Even Wii 2 would've been a better name than this.

[Tanooki]

LeoA the gamecube was gimped from the get go despite the guts of it being right for once. They went with a 1.5GB mini-dvd versus a full size DVD player, and they also went with the goofy controller that lacked a vital top button the other two guys offered up too, plus they didn't take online seriously even to the weaker effort Sony did compared to MS. Between the two doing ports (I know this first hand with Defender on Gamecube as it was my last game at Midway) and the storage, kept a lot of titles off the system. Despite that tough the GC got the most third party support past and present since the SNES era which is sad. Sure the Wii bucks that, but it was a disruptive tech that pandered largely to the non-normal gaming audience, and you can't keep disrupting and win, it just doesn't work.

I agree though that Nintendo needs to fail, and fail hard to get hopefully enough sense to get a reality check and do it right the next generation. In another thread on here yesterday stuff came up and I went into a description of why the WiiU is where it is now and all thanks to not third parties one bit but entirely Nintendo. My brother is a producer for Pipeworks (formerly worked for Rockstar, EA, Sega-Sammy, and THQ-Volition and has lots of connections who talk) and third parties approached Nintendo with a slick opportunity along with Sony and MS this generation asking for specific needs for CPU power, GPU capabilities, memory, storage, online capabilities for what they wanted to do over what PS3/360 could handle. Nintendo basically told them off in nice terms basically stating they make hardware around their plans for their games and ideas along with staying within a budget. They had that tablet in the works, they had a $300~ budget to work with at retail to sell for, and to meet those goals with the tablet they could only pull of a moderate boost over the PS3/360 capabilities by using/reusing modified parts while having a CPU that's tricky to code for to eek out more oomph. As a result most third parties told them to fuck off, some others tested the waters with limited support, and others tried and well with effort put to it. Ubisoft/Activision went sloppy with COD and AC3 with older games with framerate/visuals problems, and EA went all in doing boosts of old games or best versions with Most Wanted and sold for crap. EA quit, the others stunted their development and left them with nearly no one left all because of them thumbing the nose at the hardware requests. Had they done it, they had it promised to them to get the games Sony and MS would, all the ports shared between the three and potential for unique stuff too.

Nintendo did themselves in and they and they alone deserve what happens or not with WiiU. Sure the name didn't help with the confusion it causes, but it's the hardware stubbornness and brushing off a free pass on the past to get all the goodies this time. THey know how to handle handhelds quite well, look at the 3DS but for some reason they're brainless and stubborn on consoles. Personally I think Iwata needs to be taken out back and shot, and anyone else lock step with him as they're burying the company under ignorance. Some if not most the board needs to be fired and replaced with people who know what needs to be done before it's too late.

[Leo_A]

LeoA the gamecube was gimped from the get go despite the guts of it being right for once. They went with a 1.5GB mini-dvd versus a full size DVD player, and they also went with the goofy controller that lacked a vital top button the other two guys offered up too, plus they didn't take online seriously even to the weaker effort Sony did compared to MS.

I really doubt that the lack of a shoulder bumper was significant.

And I don't believe that storage was a major issue for the GameCube during the height of that generation back around 2002/2003. The wide variety of 3rd party releases, typically including almost everything that was released to both the PS2 and the Xbox (Along with its share of exclusives and also often being the only other console to receive a project that otherwise would've been exclusive to either the Xbox or the PS2), attest to that.

I'm sure it would've increasingly become a problem and could partially explain why the GameCube seemed to start to fade slightly earlier than the Xbox well in advance of the release of its successor (Despite having sold in similar numbers). But it doesn't really change the point that in many ways, the GameCube represented Nintendo's last attempt to go head to head against the competition in the videogame arms race yet it didn't get anywhere despite capable hardware and strong software support.

And while Nintendo didn't take online seriously and I'm not about to argue that point, it wasn't due to a hardware deficiency. Sure, it would've been nice to see a broadband modem be built in. But the hardware itself was fully capable of online multiplayer. Developers, Nintendo themselves topping the guilty list, simply didn't take advantage of that asset.

Plus, online multiplayer really wasn't a major factor that generation. The Xbox was popularizing it for consoles, but even there, support was rather infrequent and few titles that had it really thrived with a healthy sized online community. And the figures for its subscription base, floating around somewhere at this forum, was just a fraction of its total install base.

Xbox 360 and Playstation 3 are really where it became the norm and was the generation where Nintendo's lackluster online support, despite decent offerings like Mario Kart Wii rather than the near total lack of support the GCN saw, was most evident.

[Tanooki]

It was significant as an excuse for a few people. When it came to Midway and doing Defender, they had initially decided because of the lack of a second L button on top they would just let it go and leave out a function of flight the game is in desperate need of in the later stages of the game to fight correctly, strafing. Being a bit of a sneak because it pissed me off, despite the 'design' being locked into a milestone I went behind their backs and contacted the company we farmed it out to and did something about it. Inspired by a mix of the N64 Starfox and Turok controls I whipped up a design with a painless button combo so that controls would be fully restored and emailed it straight to the developer. They were impressed with it and added it into the game, but due to Midway meddling it ended up as alternative control C (and D where it mirrors, A/B do that too.) I know that some FPS games specifically were not released over the controller as well as some sandbox (gta like) stuff.

I'm not trying to be rude here, don't take it that way, but it's not really what you or anyone buys. I didn't buy it either in that era, kind of blinded with my care for the Big N then far more than I do now, but that's really what happened. The storage issue like the controller was a problem. When you have a large game that needs to pull data from this or that, breaking it over various discs can make it daunting with heaps of wasted space having mirrored data on each disc to function, or they just say fuck it and quit because it can't be done. 1.5GB vs 4.6GB on a disc was a big issue to some and is a reason why you saw some entire genre's almost entirely skipped like RPGs. I know the system itself wasn't deficient with the online, but even with the BBA Nintendo didn't send out proper support or guidance with it to developers and such the support was just not added in. Even after putting it out there they made the thing, they didn't even bother to send out the 'how to' guide on it until it was basically up for sale which is why basically no games supported it. It wasn't a huge thing that generation, but the media wanted people to think it was as did developers which is why you always saw those stories and reviews where developers would bitch abou the Gamecube not having support and reviews of identical games minus multiplayer getting sold 1pt(on a 10pt scale) or worse lower for excluding it, even if the game was superior other than that.) You are right at first the storage issue wasn't much of one because those earlier PS2 and XB games hardly filled the discs and stuff that filled more than what a GC disc could do could easily be compressed (FMVs, audio) nicely without a killer loss on the GC. That's why for the first couple years you saw a lot of ports from developers, some even listed as the 'best version' like Beyond Good and Evil, but in time more and more sequels and new games were dropped for the Cube and the space was the problem along with the controller in some cases. That's as you said just like why you saw more and more of the GC fading away faster than the XB.

The gamecube was the last home console of Nintendo's I really loved and thought had a lot going for it. I didn't even have any intent on buying another system as it kept me busy with all the third party games around their stuff and had it not been for my entry into the industry back in 2001-2 and then the media after that for a stretch it would have stayed that way. I remember all this stuff very well and it was depressing at the time to see it happen but it really did keep games off the system over stuff as simple as a button, the disc size, and the total lack of support or care about online with the BBA.

You got no argument out of me as far as online goes, they have been and stay a generation behind up to date. The PS3/360 era really made it clear with their shitty bound to system pre-Nintendo Network setup where nothing look at an account or tied to anything but hardware and the conversion to that NN setup of theirs made that clear when the lights got flipped off on a heap of DS and Wii games that needed that crap network like Mario Kart. Sure they kind of tried but not really, it was almost like the non-PSN account era of the PS2 with their Final Fantasy game and little else. Then this generation now is like a large step towards the PSN(PS3 era) setup with the Nintendo Network, but still bound to the machines with their ignorance but at least with a unified setup. Yet now Sony and MS are fairly well equals in the PS4/One era because they at Sony learned their lesson. Nintendo still takes online not entirely seriously with that setup since it causes headaches for the end user.

[Leo_A]

I'm not trying to be rude here, don't take it that way, but it's not really what you or anyone buys.

It really doesn't matter if anyone bought into it or didn't, regardless if it was a developer, a publisher, or just a lowly customer. I wasn't putting forth the GameCube as the top console of that generation where its technical capabilities were concerned or was out to ignore its issues. I just suggested that it was very much a legitimate contender technically (Unlike the Wii or Wii U that essentially were a generation out of date with what innovation there was centered around the controllers themselves), yet it still didn't get Nintendo very far.

I think Nintendo screwed up their implementation of it, but I think they had the general idea correct by deciding to go their own way instead of directly competing against Sony and Nintendo. I don't think re-entering the videogame arms race is going to be some magic elixir that will cure their woes.

I almost find it difficult to even picture a way out of this. Folks aren't just buying Xbox and Playstation hardware as a stopgap until the day Nintendo releases the most powerful hardware of its generation, they're still going to have to be won over. I almost think they need to just forget it, release hybrid hardware so all their eggs are in one basket instead of this two front war they're fighting, and relegate themselves to a Nintendo specific platform.

They have enough development resources to provide a steady stream of releases to a single hardware platform and who knows, if it appeals to customers enough, maybe it will naturally change the tide for 3rd party releases. Even if it requires extra effort on their part, 3rd parties ultimately are going to chase their customers.

If those consumers are on a Nintendo system and they want to buy their 3rd party releases there rather than on the Xbox or Playstation, publishers will be left with little choice.

[Tanooki]

I understand that as a consumer you didn't. It was a contender, that's for sure, for awhile it was most definitely. Other than the few issues I listed, it got a good supply of support in stark difference compared to the N64 or the systems since too. It really was in a way Nintendo's last good hurrah of third party gaming which gets kind of overshadowed. It just didn't get them far because of the disc size storage, the lack of the button, and the lack of their willingness to step up to the level at least of what Sony did with their BBA that killed the support. Instead of learning that lesson, they decided to play disruptive tactics and cheapskating with the Wii and then WiiU again and it's causing them a heap of pain once the fun of the Wii disruption wore off. They're now realizing the Wii profits weren't from gamers but families looking for a cheap everybody box to play the pack-in game and little else with because those who did game did buy the WiiU and those who parties family style did not and we wee where that put them.

I think they blew it where you don't on doing their own thing. Implementation is entirely it. Personally I've been saying for a few years now (not here) that what they needed to do was combine their handheld and console R&D and make something as an all in one. I saw a shimmer of it with the WiiU but damn they did it badly. I think if they decided to just support one box, one stand alone system like the 3DS but had in a way like the Neo-GeoX or various Android things where you had a powerful in your hands portable that had a TV support subsystem so you could run it either way, they'd be far better off. Imagine if there was not WiiU sequel in 3 years, but one bitching $300-400 handheld that had a neo-geo-x like TV dock that you could pop it into and use a wiiu pro controller like pad to sit on the couch. An all in one device that uses still perhaps proprietary mini memory cards like 3DS and uses some fairly potent HD level parts. We see doing that on 3DS so far with cheap development costs with high output quality has kept many third parties in love with them on that front, maybe that's their way out if they refuse to match part for part potential on a console. Nintendo needs a find a way to bring non-Nintendo first party only buyer gamers into their fold again and maybe a box like that would do it, and if not that, they need another strategy because their appeal to the fanboy only designs aren't cutting it anymore.

[Leo_A]

It just didn't get them far because of the disc size storage, the lack of the button, and the lack of their willingness to step up to the level at least of what Sony did with their BBA that killed the support.

Like I said, I really don't think disc capacity was a significant factor. If a game was on the Xbox and the PS2, chances were excellent that there was also a GameCube version. And then we had games that were either exclusive to the GameCube, appeared here first before their success led to their publishers porting them elsewhere, or a fair number of efforts that otherwise would've been a PS2 or a Xbox exclusive had there also not been a GameCube version.

GameCube wasn't hurting technically, although like any system, it obviously wasn't without some drawbacks as you've stated. And it also wasn't hurting for software support (At least compared to the Xbox... PS2 obviously saw many exclusives due to its dominance), yet it still managed to lose to a complete newcomer in the market that was also all but a non-factor in Nintendo's traditional home market. The 2nd such loss in a row.

Going their way definitely was a good plan, I believe. Look at the DS for an example if you think the Wii's early success (before HDTV's became so widespread and Nintendo wasn't supporting it much with software, leaving it left to wither) doesn't count and isn't relevant. It's roughly the equivalent of a mid 1990's home console where horsepower is concerned compared to the competition that wasn't far removed for the console generation that was just about to be replaced.

Yet it sold nearly double the hardware that the competition did.



I think they blew it where you don't on doing their own thing.

I still think they screwed it up terribly, business wise (I'm personally having far too much fun with it to throw it under the bus where entertainment is concerned and think that the masses overlooking it are missing something worthwhile).

I just don't think the general concept was a bad one, they just messed up the details. You're essentially agreeing with me with your idea of where they should go from here which is anything but following the Xbox One and the Playstation 4 or leapfrogging them technically. To keep portability with common hardware, I'm sure the tv experience won't be much different than what the Wii U/360/PS3 could provide.


Implementation is entirely it.

It doesn't matter how well done something is without a plan to back it up and allow it to shine.


Personally I've been saying for a few years now (not here) that what they needed to do was combine their handheld and console R&D and make something as an all in one.

This, I subscribe to fully.

Not only do I think this is all but mandatory if they want a chance to succeed again and save their console line and protect their rapidly shrinking handheld market, but I also agree that they waited a generation too long to try it. Even if the console and the handheld were two difference pieces of hardware along the lines of the Vita and the Vita TV, just the common hardware core and the advantages that brings to the table like reduced cost and most of all, all of Nintendo's development efforts going towards one platform, would be a lot of help for Nintendo.

And they better be doing just that. It's easy to forget since it's considered a success and games like Super Mario 3D Land are keeping it busy for its fans, but the 3DS has been a pretty weak performer. The casuals are mostly gone, 3rd parties aren't doing much with it, it got off to a very slow start and needed a quick and drastic price drop to change its momentum, sales are already on the decline, it's selling far below what the DS did while going up against a very successful competitor (Where as the 3DS is facing the Vita), it's failing by considerable margins at meeting their sales projections, it isn't propping up Nintendo's balance sheet which its handhelds have done in the past in the face of softness in the console business, etc.

If they don't reinvent themselves, their handheld side could soon be in the situation their console line is today. They need a merger to save both if they're to survive against Sony, Microsoft, and smartphones as an independent hardware manufacturer. If they're going at it largely alone, they simply can't afford to be waging war on two different fronts.

[Tupin]

Expecting both a new console and a new handheld to be revealed at E3 2015 for Nintendo. Probably a Fall 2016 release for the console, four years after the Wii U. The bare minimum number of years they have to support something without having to call it a failure. As for a handheld, maybe Fall 2015 or Spring 2016.

[Leo_A]

I don't think they'd announce it that early if they were releasing it in the Fall of 2016, a date that I also subscribe to. I'd expect a spring 2016 announcement and perhaps even a return to the old days with a full fledged E3 presentation a few weeks later, along the lines of the timetable both Microsoft and Sony used year for their new systems.

I don't see what they'd gain announcing it next summer well over a year in advance of release. Wii U, 3DS, and Nintendo's balance sheet need all the help they can get and all that would do is encourage folks to wait and see instead of doing things like purchasing Wii U's, Zelda U, and so on. Plus, they need to give the Wii U some semblance of a normal lifespan to not annoy their diehard customers that did support them this generation, which also supports holding off on the announcement (Wii U will only be about two and a half next summer).

And since it's relevant to this thread, I just read that Call of Duty 2015 won't release on the Wii U. Not unexpected, but still unfortunate since Activision was one of the better supporters for Nintendo in recent years. Other than Modern Warfare 2 missing the Wii (Wii belatedly got Call of Duty 4 that Fall in its place), this huge franchise has been there on the Wii and now the Wii U since the start.

I wouldn't of bought it here (Maybe on the PS4 someday years down the road to play through the campaign), but there's no good way to spin that even for those of us that look down upon this franchise.

[Leo_A]

Came across a post I made elsewhere a couple of years ago and thought I'd update it with the past two year's worth of information and post it here.

Nintendo's cash and deposits:
2002: 7.2 billion USD
2003: 6.2 billion USD
2004: 6.9 billion USD
2005: 7.4 billion USD
2006: 5.3 billion USD
2007: 5.8 billion USD
2008: 9.0 billion USD
2009: 7.7 billion USD
2010: 9.5 billion USD
2011: 9.8 billion USD
2012: 5.6 billion USD
2013: 5.1 billion USD
2014: 4.7 billion USD

Not disastrous, but clearly going the wrong way now that they've gone a while since launching new hardware. At this point in year's past, it should now be climbing again. But now, they have less than half of what they had in the bank at the end of the 2011 fiscal year.

Could get pretty darn low before it starts to get better since they're facing another round of heavy investment first before having a prayer of turning their financial picture around.

[Tanooki]

I get your argument hell I'd likely agree with it, but again I got this more or less from developers who worked on the thing and around it in the period. You are right in part though, up front, the first few years it wasn't an issue. Most games until you got into FF10 and GTA3 like stuff in size would have fit fine not dicing it up or scaling it back on a GC disc. As time progressed you can see the fewer ports that happened did have cuts, poorly rendered FMV with artifacting or lower quality audio, and other corner cutting so it became a factor in the back half of its existence. The button issue, admittedly lazy for sure, but it was one for some people so they just didn't bother as a convenient excuse, much like Rockstar and their infantile excuses on Nintendo being a kiddie box, then making GTA for the GBA of all things which other than them (GTA and Max Payne) had no M games! Going their own way has been smart and stupid depending on the approach, and you're right, the DS and earlier era Wii is proof, but as I said, they did the 'disruption' tactic which they got hailed for as it caught anyone by surprised and sucked them in. The WiiU didn't do this, it's just a tablet/controller meld, and the GC didn't either nor did the N64, they just went with a wonky format that didn't line up with the other guys and paid for it.

You know expanding on it. I think you're right, this generation since they appeared on track for it and the timing fit too, had they done the WiiU as the WiiDS or something of the sort, took the groups they merged (and had off paper for a time before publicly saying so), and just did the 3DS+WiiU as one box they'd be in damn better shape right now. The 3DS sales would have driven even further grabbing up console NIntendo lovers too, and technophile types who got wood over stuff like the Ouya, NVidia Shield, and the other me-too boxes we have now or coming. I think it's true, in time, maybe a decade...handheld will be in trouble. While they could sustain one alone as a niche, without big change in that front developers will just say screw them and go with the 99 cent to 15 dollar downloads on tablets as it's more profitable. Nintendo would have to open up to ugly IAP tactics perhaps being allowed and not controlling the prices people sell stuff on their eshop, while still having 3DS like game cards for larger more potent projects better suited not as a download. The answer again to that to me is the handheld-console hybrid box in that $300-350 range WiiU dropped for. They'll I think ignorantly keep going it alone, so this idea is about all they have, merging their packages and doing one war, not two as you put it. Many zealots and tyrants in war have learned that lesson well and to the death like Hitler just 70 years ago. Nintendo needs to learn from history and not be crushed by it doing a bad re-run of stupid tactics.

I think on the reveal front, they won't ditch the WiiU until a minimum of five years, even if the last half of the 5th is like the N64 where it was a trickle of a piss coming out of the thing with a game every few months. I could see them if they were really losing cash and desperate to cut it earlier in 2016 ,but i would not be surprised if they used E3 2016 to show what's coming, then roll it out either in 2017 or speed it up in a panic like those fools have done before to have no games with a launch that holiday year too. The money is definitely vanishing and their cash on hand will keep going as their pokemon play park, toy franchises of that and the rest, and so on can only rake in so much against the damage and looking at them cutting their cash in half between 2011 and 2014 is NOT good.

[Leo_A]

I think on the reveal front, they won't ditch the WiiU until a minimum of five years

They're in a desperate spot here, though.

Wii U isn't selling anywhere even close to the level that the Nintendo 64 and the GameCube did (33 million and 22 million units, respectively). And they were never sold at a loss and Nintendo was always profitable each year during their lifespans without fail.

Wii U on the other hand is happening during a time where Nintendo is bleeding money, has sold less systems to date overall than they initially projected to sell during just the previous fiscal year alone. And it's projected only to get to approximately 10 million by next spring when this current year concludes (Just ~3 million systems projected to be sold over the next three quarters).

I think they're going to decide that 4 years, the same span the GameCube lasted before the Wii was introduced, is close enough to the unwritten 5 year standard for respectability to appease their fans that supported them, then will quietly drop it.



I could see them if they were really losing cash and desperate to cut it earlier in 2016 ,but i would not be surprised if they used E3 2016 to show what's coming, then roll it out either in 2017 or speed it up in a panic like those fools have done before to have no games with a launch that holiday year too.

Don't forget about the 3DS and Nintendo's handheld side in our scenario of a combined Nintendo ecosystem.

Look at how 3DS sales are going. The latest disappointment in what is becoming a steady decline came with their Q1 sales performance; hardware went from 1.4 million in sales last year to 820k and software from 11 million to 8.5 million. I don't know if they can stretch it out as far as late 2017 if our hybrid theory holds true. It's going to be ripe for replacement at this rate by the end of next year and it will be pretty slow going dragging it out to just late 2016.

That timing (When the 3DS is ready for a successor), since it has at least been a mixed success rather than an outright failure, is what I suspect Nintendo is more concerned about getting right with their next generation hardware rather than keeping up appearances with the Wii U to the 5 year mark.

[Tanooki]

4 years on gc to wii? I thought it was 2001 -> 2006(wii) Either way I know Nintendo is desperate but all they can live off now anymore on consoles are the few that actually will buy them for their games and to kill it early would alienate the few that still care and that would possibly be an even worse situation so they're screwed.

I wouldn't call the 3DS a mixed story, just one that had a bad start is all because of the price. Once it was corrected a heap of games have steadily come out from people who ditched Nintendo hardware wise awhile ago along with their usual supporters too. It has been out awhile though so it makes sense that hardware sales would decline as more people have the thing, and against the rising tablet/phone market too. I think the hybrid system is a good bet, problem is I doubt their smarts in taking that route and I'd even dare think them dumb enough to do another niche system again too because they're creative control freaks.

[Leo_A]

You're right, I was thinking 2005 but that was when the Xbox 360 launched. PS3 and Wii came a year later. That said, I still think that 4 years quite likely will be viewed as good enough.


I wouldn't call the 3DS a mixed story, just one that had a bad start is all because of the price.

I would...

*Slow start as you said which required a large and very early price cut to change its momentum.
*It's selling a mere fraction of the DS.
*It isn't going up against a major dedicated gaming handheld like the PSP was for the DS.
*Smartphones are the dominant platform this generation for portable gaming.
*Nintendo is losing bucketloads of cash, 3DS isn't compensating for it like the old days.
*The casuals seem to have flown the coop to their cell phones.
*3rd party publishing has nosedived.
*3DS is regularly failing to meet its sales projections these days.
*Sales have been declining for quite a while despite it not even being 3 and a half years old.
*Nintendo's over eager sales projections of recent years predict stagnant 3DS sales this year.
*Quarter 1's performance is way down casting doubt that they'll meet even that forecast.
*Disappointing 3DS showing at the last E3, just three years into its life, leaving it without a heck of a lot on the horizon at this time other than Super Smash Brothers.

Systems Sold (In Ten Thousands)
Fiscal Year 1 527 DS 361 3DS
Fiscal Year 2 1,146 DS 1,353 3DS
Fiscal Year 3 2,358 DS 1,395 3DS
Fiscal Year 4 3,031 DS 1,224 3DS
Fiscal Year 5 3,118 DS 1,200 3DS (Projection)

Software Sold (In Ten Thousands)
Fiscal Year 1 1,049 DS 943 3DS
Fiscal Year 2 4,995 DS 3,600 3DS
Fiscal Year 3 12,355 DS 4,961 3DS
Fiscal Year 4 18,562 DS 6,789 3DS
Fiscal Year 5 19,731 DS 6,700 3DS (Projection)

Fiscal Year 4 Quarter 1 Results vs. Fiscal Year 5 Quarter 1 Results (In Ten Thousands)
Systems 140 FY4 82 FY5
Software 1,100 FY4 857 FY5

It's well liked, well built, appears to be profitable, and it's chuck full of quality 1st party releases and the occasional 3rd party gem. Definitely not a failure, but compared to Nintendo's past and what it says about its future here, I don't see any other way to describe it besides a mixed success.

I don't think they can get away with a separate dedicated gaming handheld again and make it work. They barely have managed it this time. Not the legacy a runaway success leaves behind when the 3DS is likely the final chapter in a 25 year story. Nintendo won't leave handhelds behind, but no longer will it be something tailored from the ground up specifically for it since the market and Nintendo can't support it any longer.

Mixed success describes it to a tee.

[Tanooki]

I think the WiiU is a good bit of the problem along with asinine projections they should have never made without doing honest (not japanese yes man bootlicking) analysis to project future sales. If the WiiU wasn't cutting them so deep they put out overly hopeful numbers to then have them miss hard that would help. If the WiiU sales weren't so sorry that 3DS is considered the crutch, and the one that can't even make up the gap (not just last year but the one before when it sold like mad against those insanity numbers NCL put up.) I know they've lost third party support to a point but it still has steady solid releases, and the price is cheap enough especially with 2DS it's moving nicely still. Sure not as nice as the DS, but the smart phones quite weren't there yet, and now they are and despite that it still pulls those numbers is kind of amazing. The deck is stacked, yet it does very well all things considered, and if WiiU wasn't leaving a cloud over it no one would even notice as it would just be a number, not an oh damn even the good one isn't quite there type story. 3DS had no chance to catch the DS, just like the GBA wasn't going to catch the GB. Timing, potential, competition from all angles...it was just fated really in the big full picture. The E3 showing this year though, it was notably disturbing. I'm not sure what I"m still going to buy on the thing this year other than Smash Bros since it has so much added to keep it from being boring for a single player. I did pre-pay on that FF Theaterhythm game because of the massive pile of extras for little added coin and that came through a giftcard. :D I know there's other stuff, just been lazy looking, and I still need to do Kirby and Yoshi which I got in that best buy sale recently for buy one get one a couple months back.

[brainerdrainer]

It's only getting better

[AceAerosmith]

My feeling is it'll become the fanboy collector's item. A sign of failure for everyone else.

Anyone who loves the Mario/Luigi/Donkey Kong will stick with it but people looking for good games that don't involve the same tired old shit Nintendo has been cranking out for years will look elsewhere. I have a Wii U but hate all the same shitty Mario platform/kart/star collecting games. To me, they are just retreads of old ideas. Yeah, he's an icon of their corporation, but how many more fucking games do we need?

I bought the system because I had the impression there would be good games beyond the same repackaged dreck they've always had but I'll be lucky if I ever buy 15 games for it. I think I have 6 now and it would only be 5 if NintendoLand hadn't been a pack-in.

Personally, I think they should stop selling hardware like Sega and just sell software to the other 2 systems.

[ReaXan]

I dont think its strong enough to be an adults primary gaming system. Besides that I feel its great for kids with alot of Wii games already or good if you can snag one around 200 bucks and want to play Mario Kart or the Nintendo exclusives from time to time. I dont think its worth getting over a PS4/ONE however.

I also see Wii U games/accessories on deep liquidation at Toys R Us and its suppose to be a current gen system in its prime. I dont ever remember seeing that with the PS3/360 that early in its lifespan.

I got a Wii U Pro controller thinking I could play some adults titles on it only to find out that you pretty much will have a better experience on the PC or the older PS3 playing FPS games...

This guy pretty sums up most peoples sentiments if you listen to his entire video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1HUmaPqXfW0

[Bojay1997]

I dont think its strong enough to be an adults primary gaming system. Besides that I feel its great for kids with alot of Wii games already or good if you can snag one around 200 bucks and want to play Mario Kart or the Nintendo exclusives from time to time. I dont think its worth getting over a PS4/ONE however.

I also see Wii U games/accessories on deep liquidation at Toys R Us and its suppose to be a current gen system in its prime. I dont ever remember seeing that with the PS3/360 that early in its lifespan.

I got a Wii U Pro controller thinking I could play some adults titles on it only to find out that you pretty much will have a better experience on the PC or the older PS3 playing FPS games...

This guy pretty sums up most peoples sentiments if you listen to his entire video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1HUmaPqXfW0

I agree with most of what you've said, but in fairness, a number of the launch Xbox One and PS4 games are already available for bargain prices. Killzone and Knack have both been down as low as $20 in recent weeks and several of the Xbox One titles like Ryse and COD Ghosts have hit similar lows. Retailers are just a lot more impatient now and games tend to get clearanced quick if they don't continue to sell steadily.

[ZeroCool]

I personally enjoy the Wii U. Super Mario 3D World is an amazing game. Mario Kart 8 is great. Super Mario Bros U is great too. But I can see why people don't like it. It'll finish with lowest sales but Nintendo is to prideful to drop it. Hopefully next gen they get smart and make changes.

[T2KFreeker]

My thought is that I am more excited about the WiiU because the One and 4 seem to mainly be releasing lots of FPS or games that play just like them just in 3rd person. The WiiU seems to have more variety right now. I could care less about what's more powerful and what has the better graphics, I just want to play fun games.

[josekortez]

I have one and I hadn't turned it on for several weeks until my free game from the Mario Kart 8 giveaway, which was Zelda: Wind Waker, had to be downloaded before the code expired. Even now, I haven't felt the need to turn it on nor have I actually booted up Wind Waker yet. That said, I will probably buy Bayonetta 2 the first week just to prove to Nintendo that it should continue to release games and that there are still Wii U owners out there that they need to provide content for, but I'm really unhappy with the system in general. I will probably buy Smash Bros for the same reason. I am looking forward to Splatoon, but other than those three games, I can't say there is much that I want to buy for the system.

The Wii U Shop sales are relatively decent, so there's that. I just bought a game called Swords & Soldiers for $1.99, and I plan to try that out because the price was so cheap. I've also gone back and bought a few retro-style WiiWare games (Alien Crush Returns, Arkanoid Plus, Bubble Bobble Plus, Castlevania Rebirth, Contra Rebirth) that I missed the first time around, but I'm really not happy with the system as it stands. Maybe if they release more retro-style games?

[Tanooki]

Don't you find it kind of sad you want to buy a game just to make some point to Nintendo they likely won't take notice of just in the sliver of a chance of getting more third party games they publish or third parties publish for the WiiU? I'm seriously asking that, it's not sarcasm.

I can't remember when I last used it other than to update the firmware. And when I did that when 5.2.0 came out, it bricked my goddamn system. I mailed it off last week and it arrived at the repair center on Friday in NY. Nintendo is paying for it since their system update broke it and as such it gets a new 1yr warranty on it when it comes back to me. I honestly can't remember why I turned it on, maybe I wanted to try out more of the second world of DKC Tropical Freeze. My issue with the system isn't the system itself, it's the lack of support and day in day out perpetual shitting it takes in the public from all sides. It has demotivated my interest out of using it pretty much entirely. I did way Bayonetta1+2 but now I'm just not sure, and same to be said with Hyrule Warriors which is out and I"m not that big on 'warriors' games but it was bordering on a pity purchase for the reason the post above seems to be to get noticed. Project Cars I'm no longer interested in at all, if I do get it it would be on PS4 as WiiU has nothing on it with its release.

At this rate I see almost nothing left to buy on it which is awful. :( Toad Tracker before Christmas, Xenoblade maybe next year if I decide I'd be into it as it looks solid, and then there's the big maybe on Bayonetta but I'm not really into that style of game. Mario Kart 8 I'd buy, but only if I could find it for $30 as I know I'll get bored of it pretty quick and refuse to take it online so that'll happen eventually. The NES Remix pack looks interesting, but it's so pick up and play and also to be on 3DS I'd get it there (same price too.) I know in 2015 there's Zelda of some form, may buy it or not depending how it turns out.

That's my current state of mind on it. I really don't know what to do.

[LordsOfSkulls]

I hinted at my friends as a gift for me and my wife to just buy us "Wii U" or like just put some money towards it.

=) the hint clicked, they all chiped in about 2/3 of the consoles and i had enough money to get like 4-5 games total with it.

My wife and i we love mario alot so Mario Kart made us feel like okay time to get it, + with everything that poping up in near future. (Open World Zelda For Me)

I feel like Wii U will get replaced or new version of it come out in next 2-4 years.

But in the end i feel like Playstation 4 will be on top, Wii U second, and Xbox One in third spot. (Microsoft shot themselves too many times in the foot, for trying to change gaming world that didnt need changing just leave us gamers and are physical copies alone)

The Wii U is awesome as well. Instead of one of us hogging TV. Either i remote play to my PS Vita my PS4 games (like Destiny) and let my wife play her games on TV.

Or she remote play on tablet on WII U, and even if she goes to are bedroom which is above the gameroom. She still gets the siginal from console and she can play without any issues.

So ya PS4/PS Vita and Wii U/Tablet rock and my marriage a happy place.

[Tanooki]

I'd love to agree with you as I detest MS's entry into consoles as they've done everything just wrong to make things worse for everyone, but they unlike Nintendo get third party support in mass, and unless that changes Nintendo is going to sit dead last.

I agree with the rest of your post, and I too really love the off-screen play as it does save the TV for others.

[Rickstilwell1]

As nice as Smash Bros. for 3DS looks, I believe the 3DS title will really hype up the upcoming console version. It might sell another slew of consoles for people who are into fighters more than they are into racers. Or people who don't jump on board until a console has x number of games they want.

[Tanooki]

Definitely it will, Mario Kart proved that much. Sure there's overlap but each has their rabid base, perhaps Smash even more even if it's a lesser seller than Kart has been. Nintendo has gone far enough with it they're having a USB controller jack with a wannabe gamecube controller to get tournament quality play. You didn't see a first party Mario Kart usb steering wheel.

[ZeroCool]

I have one and I hadn't turned it on for several weeks until my free game from the Mario Kart 8 giveaway, which was Zelda: Wind Waker, had to be downloaded before the code expired.

Ah, damnit. Forgot about that. Ah well the only game I was going to get was Pikmin but that looked boring anyways

[ProjectCamaro]

If I could only have one console this generation it wouldn't be the Wii U because of the lack of games. With that said and as someone who owns all three current generation consoles I love the Wii U for the Nintendo 1st party games. No matter how old I get I will always be a fan of the Mario games (and the two for the Wii U are amazing!), Zelda (Obviously), and Mario Kart. I also like having a console that appeals to a younger generation so when my brothers' kids come over there is something they can play and both enjoy and not worry about the content.

I do hope their sales pick up and the Wii U can become a major contendor but I highly doubt it.

[josekortez]

Don't you find it kind of sad you want to buy a game just to make some point to Nintendo they likely won't take notice of just in the sliver of a chance of getting more third party games they publish or third parties publish for the WiiU? I'm seriously asking that, it's not sarcasm.

No, you're right. It's pretty sad. Considering that I still haven't finished the first Bayonetta on Xbox 360, buying a sequel to a game that I haven't beaten just to prove to Nintendo that it made a good move getting an obscure game as an exclusive does sound pretty crazy. But, the Wii U's library needs a serious shot in the arm, and buying Nintendo games seems to be the only way to prove that the system should continue to be supported. Of course, since it is an M-rated title that doesn't include the words "Call of Duty" in its name, it will sell poorly because the general public still looks at Nintendo systems as being for kids, and Bayonetta 2 isn't something that families will buy to play together.

I read somewhere recently that Ubisoft is sitting on a finished Wii U game that it isn't sure when to release because the company is playing a wait and see game to see if and when the Wii U's install base will get bigger. More than likely, that game will become multiplatform since there's no way that a game like that will just disappear forever, assuming that it's that far along.

But, compared to the other current-gen consoles, Wii U still has more games that I would want to play. I own Xbox One, and I only like Dead Rising 3 so far. If I owned a PS4, the only game I would want to own for that would be the Pinball Arcade disc. So, Wii U still wins out in my personal book.

[LaughingMAN.S9]

In my eyes nintendo fucked this up in all corners, from every angle. Today I turned my wii u on for the first time in like a month which isn't so crazy until you consider that my wii u is. Barely 2 months old and I dload a demo of wonderful 101, Only THEN to realize that for some fucking reason I can't even fathom, that theres a goddamn limit on how many times I can play the game before it locks me out. I'm fucking speechless.


WHY-IN-THE-FUCK Would nintendo think this was a good idea! Is there some Harvard study showing people don't buy games when they can get the same exact experience from playing a 10 minute demo over and over again until the end of time?


I also just realized that the wii u came with its own pseudo sequel to wii u sports preinstalled and it even had online support, I was having a fucking blast thinking to myself, why doesn't nintendo advertise this, this is incredible, another pack in game one that could probably move some units....and then I saw why I had never heard of it. Because this to was also a glorified demo with a limited amount of tries before im again locked out and have to buy it.

For the record. Wii sports was fun and wii u is equally as fun but let's be serious, neither one are worth more than 5 dollars when you consider what 50 or 60 dollars can get you on other platforms. Everytime I turn this piece of shit on I find another reason to hate it and justify why I never play it, the friends list is a mess, the gamepad range is shit, no hdmi cec protocol which is crazy because even my 360 and PS3 have this standard, limited demo tries, the price of nintendo games never coming down even years after release, no third party support, barely any first party support, wii backwards compatibility isn't a 1 to 1 conversion, graphics are somehow worse, Jaggies everywhere, they still treat online like a joke but at least it's free, they squandered their first year lead and did nothing, the battery on the gamepad sucks, list goes on and on.

The wii u in better hands has so much potential, but nintendo is still operating like its the 90s and their monopoly is still intact so they can do whatever they want like we don't have options, if nintendo fucks up their next system I don't know what they're going to do

[josekortez]

In my eyes nintendo fucked this up in all corners, from every angle. Today I turned my wii u on for the first time in like a month which isn't so crazy until you consider that my wii u is. Barely 2 months old and I dload a demo of wonderful 101, Only THEN to realize that for some fucking reason I can't even fathom, that theres a goddamn limit on how many times I can play the game before it locks me out. I'm fucking speechless.


WHY-IN-THE-FUCK Would nintendo think this was a good idea! Is there some Harvard study showing people don't buy games when they can get the same exact experience from playing a 10 minute demo over and over again until the end of time?


I also just realized that the wii u came with its own pseudo sequel to wii u sports preinstalled and it even had online support, I was having a fucking blast thinking to myself, why doesn't nintendo advertise this, this is incredible, another pack in game one that could probably move some units....and then I saw why I had never heard of it. Because this to was also a glorified demo with a limited amount of tries before im again locked out and have to buy it.

For the record. Wii sports was fun and wii u is equally as fun but let's be serious, neither one are worth more than 5 dollars when you consider what 50 or 60 dollars can get you on other platforms. Everytime I turn this piece of shit on I find another reason to hate it and justify why I never play it, the friends list is a mess, the gamepad range is shit, no hdmi cec protocol which is crazy because even my 360 and PS3 have this standard, limited demo tries, the price of nintendo games never coming down even years after release, no third party support, barely any first party support, wii backwards compatibility isn't a 1 to 1 conversion, graphics are somehow worse, Jaggies everywhere, they still treat online like a joke but at least it's free, they squandered their first year lead and did nothing, the battery on the gamepad sucks, list goes on and on.

The wii u in better hands has so much potential, but nintendo is still operating like its the 90s and their monopoly is still intact so they can do whatever they want like we don't have options, if nintendo fucks up their next system I don't know what they're going to do

Wii U Sports Club was just released as a full retail game for $39.99, so they're probably trying to steer people towards that. I think you can buy each sport for $9.99 separately, but it's crazy that they thought that re-releasing a game that pretty much everybody owns or has owned at this point was a good idea.

[LaughingMAN.S9]

Wii U Sports Club was just released as a full retail game for $39.99, so they're probably trying to steer people towards that. I think you can buy each sport for $9.99 separately, but it's crazy that they thought that re-releasing a game that pretty much everybody owns or has owned at this point was a good idea.

Exactly, it's fun and if they had marketed it same as they did the original wii sports I could have seen the wii u maybe moving an extra 1 or 2 hundred thousand units if it was a pack in game. Yeah you can buy each game for 10 dollars but that price is still insane considering we all basically already played this game already on the wii. Whoever is running that company is delusional.

[Tanooki]

Laughing you're preaching to the choir man, and funny coincidence I hadn't turned mine on for a couple months or so too and even then that last play was with another gap in time before that too. The sick thing, the one time I do turn it on, it bricks itself partially (the system 'wrench' menu) so it had to go in for repair. I just got an email earlier today saying it was now back to me which is pretty fast as they got it end of day Friday and put it out today and it's USPS (was UPS label on them outgoing.) I'm sure they probably just flashed whatever, doubt my data is gone but the sad sad sad thing is, if it is I actually wouldn't get upset about it despite the fact I really should.

Nintendo with the WiiU blew it in many ways as you put it speechless and delusional to their handling and that's both public and private. Internally they were awarded third party support on a silver platter had they gone with hardware on the level of the other two and they gave the industry the bird and said do tablet controller games or suck it...and they gave em the finger back and consistently still do by the week. Then you have the asinine naming and branding matching the Wii with a U on it confusing the shit out of most people including retail where I bumped into enough people trying to call it an addon tablet for WII! Combo all that greatness with running absolutely no advertising at all other than last Christmas season to then pull it right after the new year and it was setup to die the death of a thousand ignorant red tape papercuts.

On the bright side if you're a fan of digital long term rental software, they probably have the most interesting set of indie game titles going for them on the eshop. Which again is another failure, they do not advertise it or the virtual console at all which would be their most easiest source of cheap mass revenue since no physical media or packaging/shipping is involved there either. That plays into that Wii Sports HD rehash as I bet you're right it would lure in some people just as it did before, but again you know, they don't advertise.

I hope when I get it back in a few more days they at least put the new firmware on there since my luck caused it to brick out the first time. :) Honestly I really do want to make some time and start using it again as I really should put some time on the stuff I left unfinished.

[Leo_A]

Mine was gone about three weeks and just got back. Not too impressive for a variety of reasons (I didn't even get a tracking number at my repair status page until after it had arrived, for instance), although hopefully it's fixed (Haven't had a chance to test it or even open the box).

[Haoie]

Here in NZ, retailers have stopped advertising for it several months ago both on TV and in flyers etc.

Not even sure if the major stores still stock it anymore after all the discounting a while ago, getting rid of stock.

What a shame! I encourage competition.

[Tanooki]

Wow 3 weeks is terrible.

Mine shows that the USPS picked it up 20min ago from the repair center so I'm guessing Mon/Tues of next week.


Haoie, that's pathetic. To think if theyd advertise they'd have a few less problems but it seems like they've given up down there retail and all which is a bad sign.

[LaughingMAN.S9]

Laughing you're preaching to the choir man, and funny coincidence I hadn't turned mine on for a couple months or so too and even then that last play was with another gap in time before that too. The sick thing, the one time I do turn it on, it bricks itself partially (the system 'wrench' menu) so it had to go in for repair. I just got an email earlier today saying it was now back to me which is pretty fast as they got it end of day Friday and put it out today and it's USPS (was UPS label on them outgoing.) I'm sure they probably just flashed whatever, doubt my data is gone but the sad sad sad thing is, if it is I actually wouldn't get upset about it despite the fact I really should.

Nintendo with the WiiU blew it in many ways as you put it speechless and delusional to their handling and that's both public and private. Internally they were awarded third party support on a silver platter had they gone with hardware on the level of the other two and they gave the industry the bird and said do tablet controller games or suck it...and they gave em the finger back and consistently still do by the week. Then you have the asinine naming and branding matching the Wii with a U on it confusing the shit out of most people including retail where I bumped into enough people trying to call it an addon tablet for WII! Combo all that greatness with running absolutely no advertising at all other than last Christmas season to then pull it right after the new year and it was setup to die the death of a thousand ignorant red tape papercuts.

On the bright side if you're a fan of digital long term rental software, they probably have the most interesting set of indie game titles going for them on the eshop. Which again is another failure, they do not advertise it or the virtual console at all which would be their most easiest source of cheap mass revenue since no physical media or packaging/shipping is involved there either. That plays into that Wii Sports HD rehash as I bet you're right it would lure in some people just as it did before, but again you know, they don't advertise.

I hope when I get it back in a few more days they at least put the new firmware on there since my luck caused it to brick out the first time. :) Honestly I really do want to make some time and start using it again as I really should put some time on the stuff I left unfinished.

No you're right, generally nothing im saying is new, it's just new to me lol

When I bought the wii u, I thought I had a firm grasp on how badly they were doing and how idiotic some of their choices have been and I accepted it. I already accepted that 3rd parties had long abandoned it and the wii u was overpriced for what it was and that their online infrastructure was still a joke, but I said fuck it, I need my mario kart fix.

What I didn't expect was limits on demo trials and the backwards compatibility to make wii games look worse. I also didn't account for nintendo first party game prices probably never going down in price which admitedly was my own fault on that one, but the first 2 are still valid in my eyes since I don't think anyone's ever really mentioned them or they've gotten drowned out in the myriad of other clusterfucks nintendo has allowed on the Wii u.

It's just sad all around because this system really should be better than the Wii for playing games, all the pieces are there, for as much shit as the Wii has gotten, it's still the system that led me to play masterpieces like no more heroes 2, mad world and silent hill origins and even trauma center. House of the dead overkill and resident evil umbrella chronicles were also exclusively theirs for a while so even if that system did eventually become a paperweight, it took a while for it to get their, my wii u didn't even last me a month before I got sick of it. Only game on the horizon that has even peaked my interest is the upcoming Starfox. Zelda is zelda, I find it hard to get excited for it anymore but I still love the franchise and will probably buy the game just to justify owning the Wii u, but after that, what's left for me?

That's why I'm upset

[Tanooki]

I am not seeing much on the Wii U I want either going forward. Starfox is one for sure, but after that, it's all about a small handful of maybes. Xenoblade may be worth it for me, Bayonetta would be like a pity screw to buy so I doubt I will, Hyrule Warriors is out and I'm just not motivated by it, Smash I can do fine for less on 3DS since i detest online play with children, Kart is out too but overpriced for me as I'd just do 1P race so I'd buy it at 1/2 off, Project Cars I don't want on there now that I have PS4, and Captain Toad isn't a rush to buy system seller either. Zelda, the fact they're showing and saying nearly nothing other than it's the most open world game yet is a HUGE turn off to me. I have zero interest in Link running around in Skyrim like Hyrule to do whatever, that just sucks and if it's like that I'm saving my time and money not buying it. I just don't see much going forward but as it's a Nintendo system, and the new one, I feel more dirty thinking about selling it than keeping it at this point still at least. The Wii was just fucking terrible other than few shimmering gaming moments, so much so bad it turned me off I had to sell it to get it out of my sight earlier this year and I hate to think the WiiU is going that way too.

I agree the demo thing is pure crap, I hate it too so I mostly will not bother except if a demo gives the main game I know I'll buy some perks like Bravely Default on 3DS did. Timed use demos are garbage. I really didn't think the Wii games I did run looked worse on the WiiU but it wouldn't surprise me, yet I rarely used it because it was annoying as hell having to boot, then re-boot the system from the WiiU menu to play Wii stuff so I let it rot. I got mine when it came out, so I got more burned at full price, thinking they'd follow their word and blow the thing out with the level of push they did the Wii and that they'd have a nice line up of games going forward given the new/ported-remix third party stuff shown. Instead they decided they were above bothering advertising to the peasants, pissed off third parties, won't help people develop off their control freak covered eshop, and have bungled even getting the name out there so it isn't viewed as a Wii tablet addon with its own blue boxed games. The 3DS they did and have done so much right beyond the original price, and that system they do run game ads for, but the console...argh.

[Dr. BaconStein]

I have an overwhelming feeling of indifference toward it. I think it was poorly marketed from the start and while it has had some glimmers of brilliance such as DKC: TF and Mario Kart 8, nothing so far has really compelled me to get one. A part of it is just my changing tastes, but a part of it is also Nintendo. They're not the same company they used to be, and neither are their "fans".

It really boggles my mind how one company can screw up so much, and rather than encouraging them to do better, people only enable them to do worse. A good majority of the Wii U owners I've spoken to are ridiculously defensive and only seem to play first-party Nintendo games. It feels awkward trying to converse with them and not being able to connect on any level because they don't play anything else.

Or maybe I've only met the worst of the bunch, it's hard to tell with such a niche system.

[LaughingMAN.S9]

I have an overwhelming feeling of indifference toward it. I think it was poorly marketed from the start and while it has had some glimmers of brilliance such as DKC: TF and Mario Kart 8, nothing so far has really compelled me to get one. A part of it is just my changing tastes, but a part of it is also Nintendo. They're not the same company they used to be, and neither are their "fans".

It really boggles my mind how one company can screw up so much, and rather than encouraging them to do better, people only enable them to do worse. A good majority of the Wii U owners I've spoken to are ridiculously defensive and only seem to play first-party Nintendo games. It feels awkward trying to converse with them and not being able to connect on any level because they don't play anything else.

Or maybe I've only met the worst of the bunch, it's hard to tell with such a niche system.

You don't even want to know what would happen to you if you mentioned this on the wii u subreddit. That entire reddit suffers from a persecution complex, anything that isn't "hey I just bought 8 wii u's and gave them to starving Guatemalan families and we love it, fuck Sony!" Will get you immediately downvoted into oblivion.

It's one thing to love everything nintendo makes and it's another to not even acknowledge where nintendo fucked up and pretend like every move they make is flawless. It's almost like a fucking cult over there

[Leo_A]

There are forums and fanboys for every system. Nintendo might have a few more passionate, but ignorant, fans. But only because it has a much longer history than the competition has.

And an awful lot of Wii U fans love the system and love Nintendo, but also wish that it was also the place to go to play the latest and greatest 3rd party releases so that owning just a Nintendo console would be a viable choice. There's still a lot to love here, but the situation is obvious and doesn't need to constantly be front and center. Not only is the Wii U well stocked with exclusives that deserve attention, but constantly focusing on the problems simply doesn't make for very lively forum discussions.

It doesn't mean that Wii U owners, such as those around here like myself, are all oblivious to the problems or trying to minimize them. It just means that we're having fun, problems and all, and prefer to talk about what we're enjoying rather than constant doom and gloom. I personally went in with full knowledge of the situation and Nintendo has largely delivered on my expectations (Minus Fatal Frame 5 and a few more minor things).

What sense would it make to just complain? I knew about the 3rd party situation already, and frankly even if I had bought it at launch, one could see this coming from a mile away with Nintendo's past, lack of a clear direction to go in after the oddity that the Wii was, and as PS3/360 support erodes and development becomes more and more focused on the higher horsepower XB1 and PS4 where the Wii U simply can't compete due to its more modest capabilities.

Wii U was never going to be the place to be for sports, first person shooters, open world games of a variety of types, etc. So why hold it against it?

[Tanooki]

Bacon well said.

Leo...I was that, the love is gone, I just don't hate them, somewhere between like and indifferent now as the 3DS is still handled well so I know they have some brain cells amonst themselves, somewhere. For what the WiiU is I love it, it should be treated much better, ideally had Nintendo not pissed off third parties it should be receiving anything the PS3 and 360 get while they still get games, and after that, whatever comes due to the base the system should have.

I think the ones who have every right to be down and complain are those like myself who bought it out of the gate or within the first 6-9 months. The writing wasn't quite yet on the wall, all the hatred and canceled projects weren't piling up. It was just the usual burst of support any new system gets followed by the development lull for the next titles, and yet those never really came other than from Nintendo. It's fair for those who ran into the brick wall to get mad, but those whining now who bought it after a year thinking it would turn around or not care thinking it would improve were just deluding themselves.