Dreamcast VGA on a projector with RGBHV inputs (problem)

[Tristashio]

I am not sure why, I went though hours of checking and spent a lot of money; in order to play my Sega Dreamcast though to my Sony VPL-VW10HT projector. The projector's manual suggests I can use a VGA signal however, the only inputs for this would be the RGBHV(RCA) connections. I had spoken to the people who made the Kuro Dreamcast VGA box, and the people who made the custom "VGA to RGBHV" cable for me; both parties assured me victory in the set-up; to no avail. I tried the 4 different video setting on the projector's menu screen…the best I can get is a faint green or green and blue picture for a few seconds upon startup(the swirl)…then it cuts out; I should state that, respectively, this is while only attaching the green or green and blue cables to the projector…if I attach the red, horizontal sync, and or the vertical sync: I get nothing.

I have pictures of the components, as well as a link for the manual to the projector.

- Dreamcast is confirmed to function properly
- Projector is confirmed to function properly
- Kuro is new and the "blue LED" functions properly when turned on
- The cable(VGA to RGBHV), I think is obviously the problem, but anyway, it's brand new(custom made) over $60 dollars and had better function properly! ^o^

The last thing I want to state is that there is a switch on the Kuro box, going from VGA to RGB…I believe I only got that faint picture if it was in VGA mode.

This is the Manual for the projector:
http://pdf.crse.com/manuals/4074835141.pdf

…… I dunno' I can't post the images…I'm not sure why…anyway..it's the:

- Kuro from BBS:
http://www.beharbros.com/#!kuro/c1dcu

and the cable is really:

- VGA to RGBHV(like this one)
https://www.digitalconnection.com/Products/Cables/usage_vgam_rgbhvrca.asp

If any other information is needed, please ask; I really want to know what the problem is…how am I suppose to use the RGBHV? this is such a simple connection, it should work!! *.*

[kai123]

The only thing I can think of to check is to see if the Kuro has all pins connected on the VGA side. If they have only used the ones that are needed for VGA and your adapter needs a seperate sync that may not be needed normally for it to work. I hope that makes some sense? Also try another computer with a VGA connector and see if it works most laptops seem to keep them around these days or an adapter can be bought for next to nothing. I would also try switching a bunch of the cables around to see what works. Maybe they are mislabled or something. You could also get a pinout of your cable and a multimeter to check the signal and if it is the correct one. Good luck!

[Tristashio]

The only thing I can think of to check is to see if the Kuro has all pins connected on the VGA side. If they have only used the ones that are needed for VGA and your adapter needs a seperate sync that may not be needed normally for it to work. I hope that makes some sense? Also try another computer with a VGA connector and see if it works most laptops seem to keep them around these days or an adapter can be bought for next to nothing. I would also try switching a bunch of the cables around to see what works. Maybe they are mislabled or something. You could also get a pinout of your cable and a multimeter to check the signal and if it is the correct one. Good luck!



…..Thank-you for your time, Kai123. I had tried a laptop with VGA out to no avail; the screen on the laptop enlarged, as it normally does when sending it's image through, so…yes, and nothing on any of the four projector's input settings: Computer, Component, and the two RGB settings.

I did contact the BSS company about their product(they are so pleasant to communicate with), I confirmed with them that the whole set-up doesn't function; that something is off'(not necessarily their unit). They assured me that sync is sent through, quote "It outputs both H and V Sync signals" -BSS. I'm not certain it is sent through separate pins or all together with sync on green or something like that…VGA is suppose to be separated(everything), no?…rrr.. Originally they told me that it would be alright with the VGA-RGBHV cable, they went out of their way to check the manual for my Sony VPL-VW10HT projector as well.

So……it's either a problem with: the quality of one or more items(though I'm quite sure they are all ok; the projector does everything els including component, and the other items are brand-new), or it is an error in the theory of this set-up's actual viability.

Yeah'…well…I guess this is quite technical, I at least want to know why; perhaps someone els has experience with this.

[celerystalker]

This may be useless, but what game are you using? Not all Dreamcast games support VGA output. Have you tried multiple games?

[kai123]

This may be useless, but what game are you using? Not all Dreamcast games support VGA output. Have you tried multiple games?

I didn't even think of the most obvious answer. haha

[Tristashio]

This may be useless, but what game are you using? Not all Dreamcast games support VGA output. Have you tried multiple games?

…Thank-you, celerystalker, it is a fair shot; yes the game is called "首都高バトル(Shutokou Batōru)" other wise known as "Tokyo Extreme Racer"!..one of my favorites^^

..I checked before, and I checked again(actually it was what first intrigued me); this game does support VGA.

The BSS company are so nice, they told me that they would refund everything including shipping(because they originally said it would be fine)…they told me that they could deduce that this projector is in fact not compatible with the resolution…I am not going to return it, however, the Kuro is to pretty !! and it's really not their fault…if the manual is read:

Sony VPL-VW10HT:
http://pdf.crse.com/manuals/4074835141.pdf

..it clearly confirms that is would be supported(Dreamcast outputs a 640x480 signal with VGA)

So…I think...it's either the cable, or Sony; probably Sony! they are so big and overlook' things like this I'm sure.

Please, any other info. would be appreciated… though, I guess it's not easy…

P.S. The BSS company told me I would have to select the PC setting for input options in the projector's on-screen menu, I had; I had tried all four…

[Tristashio]

..I wonder if it has something to do with the Hz…Dreamcast outputs at around 60Hz for most games, including the one in subject, I believe; but the manual shows "59.940"..so it should be ok..

[Tristashio]

…mmaybe I can send the signal through a VGA to Component cable(sync on green); it may be able to use it. I wouldn't have perfection then, though, I should be able to sync through H and V with the cable I have now…

…it's not easy to find a VGA to RCA RGB(component)…I'm going to have to try it, I guess.

[Tristashio]

.Yeep, thats what I'm going to do! as defeating as it is. I have no choice, the projector just won't take the signal as it is(there's nothing wrong with any of the items, they just simply don't like each other; even though the projector talks big') hmm!

I shall update as soon as I try it; have to special order a VGA - Component cable first(they are typically unusable as few systems can break the signal apart, but I think this massive projector can(it's like a little child in my home^^))

[celerystalker]

Instead of a custom cable, you can easily get converter circuits for these signals on ebay for about $20 or so. I use items like that from time to time when I build someone a supergun, and then you can use existing cables. It's a pretty easy workaround.

[Tristashio]

Instead of a custom cable, you can easily get converter circuits for these signals on ebay for about $20 or so. I use items like that from time to time when I build someone a supergun, and then you can use existing cables. It's a pretty easy workaround.


..Thank-you, celerystalker, I am aware of that, yes; there are a couple of reasons why I don't want to do that: first of all, it's ugly, the VGA box is already big and out of the way, but it passes, jest because it's so sleek..^^ another box would be…mm. The second reason is that those sometimes add lag, I'm quite sure that they do(I hate that, the most, more than when people were tuques(thick wool or cotton caps) in the middle of summer for fashion). The third, sort of, reason is that I may be able to send it though a VGA to Component cable…it already accepts component, I'm sure…and the manual shows it takes all kinds of VGA, SVGA…etcetera signals.

Those boxes, for a good one are pricy, I think, the cheap ones come with lag, maybe…I don' wanna' take a chance.

I'm going to try a cable first:

VGA to Component cable:
http://page10.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/m144095553

and if that's not happening…I'm going to cry..for a while…and then think. maybe a box..man, though, thats a heavy set; I should just play the other games on whatever…maybe one day I can use the VGA box with…oh..but it's be soooo nice on the projector…and I've got an XRGB-3, I guess thats not going to function either..it only has VGA and DVI out..how am I suppose to get that to the RGBHV on the projector?(maybe I should save that for another thread)…

..please wait for my update about the VGA-component set. or..if anyone can shed light on why this projector isn't able to display the Dreamcast with the original set; please, leave a message.

[Tristashio]

Instead of a custom cable, you can easily get converter circuits for these signals on ebay for about $20 or so. I use items like that from time to time when I build someone a supergun, and then you can use existing cables. It's a pretty easy workaround.


ps..sorry..I might have made it more than it was…it's not custom, just a special one, I can't get it at a regular electric shop…the VGA-RGBHV one, mind, was…one can order the VGA-BNC5 cables almost anywhere, but to RCA connectors, almost none…you should see this cable, it's gorgeous…it weighs like 2kg!

[Tristashio]

Well, that's it…I tried using a component cable with sync on green(i think)…anyway, the one I showed in an earlier post(web-link).

no dice'. I know that it must be an issue with the projector. I have a Playstation 3 with a D-terminal cable that is attached to a D-sub-Component(RGB) cable; and it performs perfectly on the projector. I also use a Japanese DVD player with the same set. I also use an Xbox 360 with component(RGB+audio,vidioRCA) on the projector; no problem.

The best I can get is using an SNES through an xrgb3 and then from VGA-component to the projector…the s\projector screen reads:

"frequency can't read!" or something like that, it even has an exclamation mark^^

at least it's funny! ^o^

So that's it…game-over…here is the manual link one more time, I wish someone could figure out why a Dreamcast can't function on this projector…I have used every possible set up, so it must be the projector(VGA…no..hmm..)

http://pdf.crse.com/manuals/4074835141.pdf

I appreciate the time, people had spent replying, and even just reading this; thank-you.

[theclaw]

Did you try a Dreamcast s-video cable?

Component, RGBHV (VGA), and RGBs (21pin RGB or SCART), are three different formats.
A passive cable just sends the video directly, without performing a conversion, and in most cases won't work.

This projector appears similar to Sony PVM monitors, by using a shared input that can be switched between component and RGB, though I've never used such a monitor to be very helpful.
Check the settings menu. The projector may not automatically detect whether you're using component or RGB. (this is how the Playstation 2 and Playstation 3 work, they need to be told which format to output)

[Niku-Sama]

Very similar setup on my pvm. It's most likely a setting missed. It won't auto set to sing on green or internal, the same with rgb and component.

I'd take the h and v lines, take one of those adapters with 2 female rca on one side and 1 male on the other and combine h and v with it and plug it into sync and see if it changes. It should be a cheap part

Edit:
Or you could use your composite video out, if you still have access to it and plug it into sync that would be easier if you still have a yellow composite out available still with your vga box hooked up.

Combining h and v has long term out put driver blowing problems i guess..... Says the internet

[Tristashio]

Thank-you: The Claw, and Niku-Sama.

I'm sure I tried every setting, spent hours, and now feel depressed every time I go to try something els^^*, tried so many things…and, to Niku-Sama, I'm sorry, I'm not sure I get that…? combining the Vertical and Horizontal sync..and putting them where?…there is not a single sync input, so I'd need to send it to either the H or the V…as for the composite video…if I sent it to that..what benefit would there be? I'd still not have any video..no?? perhaps I mis-took what it was…anyway…

The projector should take the signal, without any extra device, it states it in the manual and there is no other way to send it other than with the RGBHV connections on the side…oh man'..it's otherwise a gorgeous projector..how difficult would it've been to add a bleeding' VGA port on the side?..? hmm..

p.s.
I've not tried the S-vido, I'm not sure the Dreamcast even has an S-video cable(natively)..it would probably work though..however, I want the VGA..especially for the XRGB-3…I'd quite fancy have it with the Saturn, line doubling with no lag ^^.. maaa…

..I'm still waiting for me geek in shining armor to correct my projection problems.. *^^*

[Niku-Sama]

maybe this will help

8376

the reason I am thinking this way is it sounds like to me that its looking for a composite sync signal instead of individual H and V signals.

[theclaw]

Since we're talking about it, Sega released the s-video cable in Japan. HKT-8000.

http://auctions.c.yimg.jp/images.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/image/ra176/users/8/8/9/4/casa_primeproject-img600x600-1438210894qa5ypc14862.jpg

[Tristashio]

Thank-you, Niku-Sama, I am going to try this; I dunno' if it would do the trick, but it's inexpensive to try, so…. please wait a day or two for the results

ps. I'm sorry for the late reply(really really late)…I've more or less given up' ^^



maybe this will help

8376

the reason I am thinking this way is it sounds like to me that its looking for a composite sync signal instead of individual H and V signals.

[Tristashio]

Thank-you, theclaw, however I am specifically trying to get the Dreamcast to be viewed through VGA. I am getting to RCA Y splicer soon(in the mail). It's true, when checking the panel, indeed, it reads "Sync/HD" and "VD", as if the first one had more than one function, is it possible it can accept the full sync? oh my, why did they make this so confusing…I guess they had their reasons (^^*)…I shall post up' if when I get the cables and try it out. (^^)/

[Tristashio]

That was the fix, I guess the Dreamcast was trying to send a combined signal….or the projector…actually, I don't know why..and after such a long battle, 2.5 years..I'd like to know exactly what it is..

anyway, I can now play Dreamcast on my projector using RGB and Sync(H input) (combining the two H and V signals)

I appreciate everyone's help, and I can state, I did succeed!

I can also now play Sega Saturn through an XRGB3 !!!!


maybe this will help

8376

the reason I am thinking this way is it sounds like to me that its looking for a composite sync signal instead of individual H and V signals.

[Niku-Sama]

Glad it worked. And sorry again on the replies on the PM's this week. I'm in Vegas not at EDC and pissed off because i have the feeling daft punk, the only people in concert I'd ever see, will probably be there.

It was a shot in the dark to, i wasn't sure it was going to work like that but i knew it was looking for composite sync on the projector so i figured jam the 2 signals together and see what happens

[theclaw]

Ah. Composite sync @ 480p or greater is unusual, to say the least. I can hardly name anything common that inputs or outputs it in any official sense.