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Edmond Dantes
10-01-2019, 06:38 AM
So I just got a Switch (YAY!) and went looking up games for it (I only have Dragon Quest Builders 2 right now) and... well...

It made me realize some things I thought were dead somehow still live.

It's not necessarily that these are bad... its more I always thought they were so niche and unprofitable that surely they would be something only an old man like myself would vaguely remember.

Nobunaga's Ambition, for example. I remember a time when these were the NES games I most wanted to play, and everyone else I talked to--both IRL and online (this being back near the dawn of emulation)--were like "Dude what the hell even is that?"

Somehow the series has a new installment on the freaking Switch. Also there was a crossover with Pokemon, apparently?

I mean what's next, a version of Blaster Master where you can opt to play as Shantae well speak of the devil (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DxRgI2-4OeQ) .

Another shocker that I saw when I was looking for Switch games is there's apparently a Raiden V. You guys remember Raiden, right? Those arcade shmups that are arguably the grand daddy's of the danmaku genre? I used to have the first on the TG16 of all things. Somehow, each generation has a Raiden. And yet its a series I almost never hear anyone talk about, despite its undying nature.

And yeah I know lately crowdfunding has led to a lot of banking-on-nostalgia revivals of old brands, but I'm more shocked at the things that seemingly never went anywhere in the first place despite it logically seeming like they would... and more importantly, sometimes they seem to be getting more prominent.

Like how many people remember the original Dragon Slayer: Legend of Heroes? I had a friend who is playing its distant sequel, Trails of Cold Steel, and was shocked that the franchise not only began in the early 90s but its actually a spinoff of a longer franchise.

Anyway, you guys got any personal examples of "wow, that's still around?"

nb4 someone nominates Bubsy.

Aussie2B
10-01-2019, 09:18 AM
Falcom keeps most of their series going, though they often evolve to the point that their connection to the older games is unrecognizable. I mean, Tokyo Xanadu is in the same franchise as Faxanadu.

With stuff like Nobunaga's Ambition and Raiden, I think it's more a matter that they're more popular and better known in Japan, so that's why they're still around. But they get localized by smaller companies who budget the releases around the assumption they'll be niche in the West.

It's not a series, but what really perplexes is me is why there's all these remasters of cheesy 90s FMV games (Night Trap, Double Switch, Corpse Killer). In the past, I only ever saw people making fun of and trashing these sorts of games, yet now there's actually a lot of excited fervor behind the remasters. I don't get it.

Gameguy
10-02-2019, 01:19 AM
With FMV games it's the same reason why old 80's and 90's movies are now watched for the "so bad it's good" thing. I don't really get it either, I just assume that it's a mix of nostalgia and compared to a lot of modern releases these old pieces of crap are actually much better than what's produced today.

I think the most recent Switch release that surprised me is when I heard that the old Genesis Lion King and Aladdin games are getting ported. Most of the games that sound great for the switch are ports or remakes of games that we've already played 25 years ago.

Tron 2.0
10-03-2019, 12:16 AM
Ys series in general falcom has manage to keep it going still and a part nine is coming soon as well.

Edmond Dantes
10-03-2019, 02:16 AM
I think the most recent Switch release that surprised me is when I heard that the old Genesis Lion King and Aladdin games are getting ported. Most of the games that sound great for the switch are ports or remakes of games that we've already played 25 years ago.

And in that case especially, I was like "Why? Those games weren't even particularly good."

Genesis Aladdin fans are gonna kill me for that comment I know but I honestly never thought it was so great.

Also apparently there's a new version of Namco Museum for the Switch. Which okay, compilations are nothing new but seriously this particular compilation has become its own series. The Switch one includes Rolling Thunder 1 and 2 and Galaga 88 so its probably worth a pickup.

Gameguy
10-05-2019, 11:35 PM
And in that case especially, I was like "Why? Those games weren't even particularly good."

Genesis Aladdin fans are gonna kill me for that comment I know but I honestly never thought it was so great.
I do like the game quite a bit, I never beat it though. I'm not going to say it's better than the SNES version as I like that too but I personally do prefer the Genesis version. I guess it depends if you really like platform games, it's pretty good but still not as great as the best platform games ever made. The visuals are just excellent though. I prefer it over The Lion King but I do still like that game too. I just wouldn't buy a new console just to replay them.


Also apparently there's a new version of Namco Museum for the Switch. Which okay, compilations are nothing new but seriously this particular compilation has become its own series. The Switch one includes Rolling Thunder 1 and 2 and Galaga 88 so its probably worth a pickup.
Of course there's a new Namco Museum, there's always a new one. How many consoles post PS1 have multiple versions too? I like compilations of classic games but I just never get excited for this anymore as it's become dirt common and mostly repeat the same games.

WulfeLuer
10-08-2019, 10:01 PM
Yeah, nobody even knows what Raiden is locally except for the one cabinet (and that one's for the Raiden Fighters spinoff). I looked it up once and got III for the PS2, then was shocked at the time because V was being quietly announced.

I think the one series that I keep expecting to quietly die is Atelier, but here they are announcing another one, plus some Deluxe thingamajig set for the previous trilogy. As far as surprises overall is Mana making something of a lurching comeback, despite Square Enix's best efforts.

Nz17
10-09-2019, 01:02 AM
It's not a series, but what really perplexes is me is why there's all these remasters of cheesy 90s FMV games.

Memes, "legendary statuses," and YouTube "video gaming" personalities: These are the reasons that the FMV games have been remade. When you combine famous YouTubers making videos about these infamous games and the "GIF's" that circulate as well as the ability to create HD transfers from the original films to create HD editions with much cleaner video than the originals, this is what happens.


And in that case especially, I was like "Why? Those games weren't even particularly good."

Genesis Aladdin fans are gonna kill me for that comment I know but I honestly never thought it was so great.

They remade the movies so they ported the games as cash-ins. However, they are well done cash-ins, as they have not just HD graphics, but multiple versions of the games across various consoles and handhelds, playable prototypes, gameplay rewind and autoplay, a jump-to-any-section feature, video filters, music sound tests, and making-of sketch and picture scans.

Aussie2B
10-09-2019, 09:24 AM
I could understand people liking the FMV games ironically, but I've also noticed a lot of people talking as if they genuinely love the games and have always felt that way, going back to the original releases, yet I never saw people talking that way prior to the remasters.

Edmond Dantes
10-09-2019, 03:06 PM
I could understand people liking the FMV games ironically, but I've also noticed a lot of people talking as if they genuinely love the games and have always felt that way, going back to the original releases, yet I never saw people talking that way prior to the remasters.

Its probably just because people forgot. I see the same stuff with old cartoons... for decades all they get is trashed online but when a DVD set comes out its suddenly "this thing was a classic and I'm glad its back."

I remember loving Mad Dog Macree on MS-DOS and would love to play a non-grainy version of Who Shot Johnny Rock.

gbpxl
10-12-2019, 08:32 PM
People talk about FMV games being scorned the same way Waterworld was supposedly a critical (not just commercial) flop.. yet most people will say they liked both.

The PS1 was the only console around that time that did FMV well. The video was shrunk down on earlier consoles and was very poor quality. Im glad games like Night Trap are getting ported to new consoles but for me Id rather just enjoy them on the original consoles, albeit worse quality

Fox Hunt is one of the first FMV games I saw in action and I was blown away at the time

WulfeLuer
10-12-2019, 09:08 PM
Waterworld has defenders now? Next up, Surf Ninjas. I love that show, mostly because its the equivalent of a demolition derby. One long glorious car crash, where everybody gives in and enjoys themselves anyway. It's still crap, don't get me wrong.

When the PS1 rolled up and got going, yes it had some nifty FMV cutscenes, but I can't say I saw a full-on FMV game that I liked back then. The closest contenders I can even think of were the old Area 51/Maximum Force arcade games, and those seem to be pretty arguable. Got dragged into a war on some chat or other few years back about whether they count.

gbpxl
10-14-2019, 12:25 AM
Waterworld had a massive budget and so when it didnt make profit in its initial theatrical run, critics deemed it to be a failure. It has a massive following if you go to any physical media or movie forum. From what I read, the film eventually did turn a profit when factoring rentals, TV airings, DVD sales, etc.

Gameguy
10-14-2019, 03:06 AM
When the PS1 rolled up and got going, yes it had some nifty FMV cutscenes, but I can't say I saw a full-on FMV game that I liked back then.
It really depends on the platform you're looking at. There were several good FMV games released on the PC, mostly adventure games like Gabriel Knight 2 or the Tex Murphy games. Going way back earlier there was Dragon's Lair which still has some charm. I still don't fully get why the bad FMV games like Sewer Shark are becoming popular, besides making fun of them on youtube.

BubsyFan1
10-16-2019, 06:54 PM
nb4 someone nominates Bubsy.

Dude. You didn't even give me a chance. :\

Edmond Dantes
10-17-2019, 12:52 AM
Dude. You didn't even give me a chance. :\

Sorry bobcat. For what its worth I honestly thought the games got more hate than they deserved.

It's just too bad my personal favorite forgotten mascot--Aero the Acro-Bat--died in the 1990s.

Aussie2B
10-17-2019, 09:59 AM
If you're a fan of a series, wouldn't you expect the series to still be around?

Edmond Dantes
10-17-2019, 10:45 AM
If you're a fan of a series, wouldn't you expect the series to still be around?

I don't understand this question. My personal fanhood has no bearing on whether a thing is still around, and its illogical to assume something is still a thing just because I liked it. It would be like thinking a thing disappeared because I didn't like it.

Lots of people liked Chrono Trigger for example, but when was the last brand-new (not a re-release) game in that series?

Aussie2B
10-17-2019, 11:15 AM
I mean in terms of what BubsyFan1 posted. If they're a fan of Bubsy and thinks it's a quality series, wouldn't then it be a natural thing to revive a quality series? What would be shocking about that?

I wouldn't say it applies to the reverse scenario. There are plenty of reasons why somebody could understand why a series is no longer around even if they're a fan, if the sales were low, it's been dormant for a long time, the developer/publisher no longer exists, etc.

Edmond Dantes
10-19-2019, 11:42 PM
I mean in terms of what BubsyFan1 posted. If they're a fan of Bubsy and thinks it's a quality series, wouldn't then it be a natural thing to revive a quality series? What would be shocking about that?

Again I kinda think you're placing the cart before the horse here. The shock/surprise is generated from the fact that it HAS been dormant for so long and suddenly people thought to revive it. One's own personal fandom or lack thereof have no bearing on what you can observe with your own two eyes.

To put it another way, think about jumpscares. Horror fans often say the most effective ones come in movies or games that only had one or two because you've gotten into a mindset that they're not gonna happen, so its more shocking when they actually do (vs stuff like FNAF where guys like Pewdiepie stopped reacting to the scares because they became so predictable). There's a similar thing at work here: Bubsy coming back is a shock because he's been dormant since the mid-1990s, whereas, say, a new Sonic game comes out every year.

Gameguy
10-20-2019, 12:21 AM
The shock/surprise is generated from the fact that it HAS been dormant for so long and suddenly people thought to revive it.
It could have been a cheap license that just happened to be available. Someone wanted to make a game fueled by nostalgia and it was one of the few licenses available within their budget, as anything remembered more fondly was too expensive or not for sale. It's still a bit surprising when it happens and gets announced, but it's still understandable as to why it happened.


To put it another way, think about jumpscares.
Good horror films shouldn't have many if any jumpscares, psychological horror is far more meaningful. Jumpscares are just startling someone and you can be startled by anything even if it's not something actually scary. A lot of "horror" films are just lazy.

Aussie2B
10-20-2019, 09:47 AM
Again I kinda think you're placing the cart before the horse here. The shock/surprise is generated from the fact that it HAS been dormant for so long and suddenly people thought to revive it. One's own personal fandom or lack thereof have no bearing on what you can observe with your own two eyes.

To put it another way, think about jumpscares. Horror fans often say the most effective ones come in movies or games that only had one or two because you've gotten into a mindset that they're not gonna happen, so its more shocking when they actually do (vs stuff like FNAF where guys like Pewdiepie stopped reacting to the scares because they became so predictable). There's a similar thing at work here: Bubsy coming back is a shock because he's been dormant since the mid-1990s, whereas, say, a new Sonic game comes out every year.

*shrugs* Maybe I'm just getting blase about things, but so many series have been revived after dormancy that I don't find it particularly shocking or surprising unless the revived IP was trash to begin with. If it's something good, my reaction is more like "It's about time." For example, Konami has a lot of franchises they've barely touched in a long time. If, say, a new TwinBee or Goemon were announced, I'd just say it's long overdue, rather than a shock.

Edmond Dantes
10-21-2019, 05:13 PM
@Aussie2B admittedly I'm getting that way as well, except a bit worse... whenever I hear revival (tho moreso cartoons than video games) I tend to think they're gonna f--- it up somehow rather than being any sort of pleased.

Just in my experience, revivals always miss whatever it is you liked in the first place.

But most people aren't as cynical as I am or as informed (or conditioned) as either of us, so I can understand where shock is coming from.

Aussie2B
10-21-2019, 06:32 PM
Yeah, I'm pretty pessimistic about revivals/reboots/remakes/etc. too. Newer isn't always better, or even as good.

Edmond Dantes
10-23-2019, 03:42 AM
And now I just remember the ending of the short story The Monkey's Paw.

Which kinda makes me wonder if there's any people here who were excited for a new game or a sequel in a series but then it wound up sucking?

I can only think of two, only one of them is a video game (the other is Quantum of Solace, the movie which made me stop following James Bond. I liked them all up until the Craig era).

The video game one is Chrono Cross, which I found such an offense I like to pretend it doesn't exist. There is no Chrono Cross.

Aussie2B
10-23-2019, 09:57 AM
I had a similar experience with Chrono Cross. As a huge fan of Chrono Trigger, I was super hyped for it (hard not to be when it was being promoted with its FMV intro, which both looked great and has one of the best songs used in a video game ever, in my opinion), preordered it, picked up the game on launch day with the preorder bonus clock and strategy guide, and started racing other people online I talked to to see who could beat it first. I started petering out around 20 or 30 hours in and stopped caring about keeping up with the others. I wanted to force myself to like the game, but in the end, I just didn't enjoy playing it. I love the music, art, and graphics, but the story and gameplay are a mess. Now I best enjoy Chrono Cross by pulling out my OST or artbook.

Edmond Dantes
10-30-2019, 04:05 PM
Mainly, I remember the gameplay being abysmal. Like, I don't recall all the specifics, but early game is like "If you attack while tapping your foot, you'll do an attack which has a high chance of missing but can instakill red-butted baboons. If you attack while doing a handstand it'll heal your party and force vampires to do a striptease. If you use magic A on a full moon it'll be much stronger against rules lawyers. Oh, and when you go shopping for items, you have to actually bring the store's damn inventory to them so they can make an item out of it."

It was kinda silly when one of the things that made CT so great was how straightforward it was.

ScourDX
11-01-2019, 11:29 AM
I am surprise Baldur Gate 1/2, Neverwinter Night, Ice Wind and Torment got release for switch. I thought it was PC exclusive for longest time and most of the newer console gamers never heard of these title. Glad it did.

Also other game that make a surprise comeback would be the River City ransom with the newest entry River City Girls.

Ze_ro
11-10-2019, 07:28 PM
Sonic the Hedgehog.

Don't get me wrong, the Genesis games were fantastic, and every once in a while they accidentally make a decent one (like Sonic Colors)... but how is there still such a strong demand for more Sonic games? Is it all 40 year old men who remember the originals, or are there new young Sonic fans who inexplicably got hooked on Sonic Heroes or Sonic and the Black Knight?

--Zero

Aussie2B
11-11-2019, 09:52 AM
or are there new young Sonic fans who inexplicably got hooked on Sonic Heroes or Sonic and the Black Knight?

Definitely. My 10-year-old nephew was obsessed with Sonic. Between the cartoons, toys, games, and so on, the franchise has been pretty good at attracting new fans. It also probably doesn't hurt that a lot of those 40-year-old men have kids of their own and will pick up new Sonic games for their kids just because they remember the originals.

Edmond Dantes
11-12-2019, 10:23 PM
The thing that annoys me about Sonic is that he's become the face of the Sega Genesis, one of my favorite consoles.

Like seriously, whenever you see people need a representative of "best of the Genesis," they almost invariably go to Sonic... because he's the only Sega Genesis character they know. Like, hello? Shinobi III? Splatterhouse 2? The Phantasy Star and Shining Force games? Nope its just Sonic Sonic Sonic. For these people Sonic might as well be the only game Sega ever released.

Super Nintendo doesn't seem to have this problem--you can discuss that without it all being about Mario. That kind of irks me.

Aussie2B
11-12-2019, 11:49 PM
The problem there is Sega hasn't been as good as Nintendo about keeping the memory of their old franchises alive. They've either been abandoned, evolved into something barely resembling the Genesis games (like modern Shining and Phantasy Star games), and/or the new entries just plain aren't very good.

That said, I think most people's favorites for SNES are pretty samey. It's almost always Mario, Zelda, Metroid, Final Fantasy, Chrono Trigger, etc.

Edmond Dantes
11-13-2019, 12:01 AM
The problem there is Sega hasn't been as good as Nintendo about keeping the memory of their old franchises alive. They've either been abandoned, evolved into something barely resembling the Genesis games (like modern Shining and Phantasy Star games), and/or the new entries just plain aren't very good.

That said, I think most people's favorites for SNES are pretty samey. It's almost always Mario, Zelda, Metroid, Final Fantasy, Chrono Trigger, etc.

That's true but at least Chrono Trigger and Earthbound are non-core franchises that aren't constantly being milked, showing that people do remember even the non-core stuff.

Part of me wonders if this is why the TurboGrafx is rarely remembered at all--nobody remembers Bonk, and his major thing was the TG16/PC-Engine. Kinda sad really that nobody remembers that gem of a console.

Aussie2B
11-13-2019, 07:30 AM
The PC Engine is well-known and fondly remembered in Japan. But probably less so for Bonk (PC Genjin) and more for stuff like Tengai Makyo. In the West, the availability of the TG-16 was too limited to begin with to be remembered well. I don't think I even knew it had ever existed until the late 90s. I don't recall it being at any of the stores I went to, and I definitely didn't know anyone who had one. And since I wasn't getting any gaming magazines back then, I just never heard about it.

Edmond Dantes
11-17-2019, 08:43 AM
I learned about the TG16 because my uncle had a friend who had one. Seeing Splatterhouse when you're only like, nine or so years old is quite the experience I must say.

I wish I could talk to that guy and see if he still has his games (I think he had pretty much every hucard in North America at the time)

Ze_ro
11-24-2019, 10:07 AM
Like, hello? Shinobi III? Splatterhouse 2? The Phantasy Star and Shining Force games? Nope its just Sonic Sonic Sonic.
Yeah, but none of those games have recognizable characters... Joe Musashi is just a regular ninja guy, Phantasy Star and Shining Force don't have consistent character rosters, and Splatterhouse isn't a Sega property. Sega was all about the arcade games, and you never really got any story or character there anyways, so the closest thing you got to a mascot was Ax Battler. If anything, they were relying more on licensed celebrities like Michael Jackson and Buster Douglas.

They did make some more memorable characters later on that they could have done more with... like the Streets of Rage crew, Vectorman, Ecco, and ToeJam & Earl. They did try some spinoffs with the Eternal Champions characters, but those went pretty badly.

--Zero

Edmond Dantes
11-27-2019, 11:13 PM
Yeah, but none of those games have recognizable characters...

... Not sure why that matters when the issue is people only recognizing one franchise. I mean, NES fans remember Tetris and that sure don't have recognizable characters.

For that matter, you mentioned Phantasy Star not having a consistent roster, but isn't that true for Final Fantasy as well?

Aussie2B
11-28-2019, 09:36 AM
I mean, NES fans remember Tetris and that sure don't have recognizable characters.

I dunno about that. The L-Block won GameFAQs's most popular character battle years ago, haha.

Edmond Dantes
11-30-2019, 12:47 AM
I dunno about that. The L-Block won GameFAQs's most popular character battle years ago, haha.

I always liked the straight line best. That set of squares has a sharp wit.

gbpxl
12-08-2019, 09:13 AM
The thing that annoys me about Sonic is that he's become the face of the Sega Genesis, one of my favorite consoles.

Like seriously, whenever you see people need a representative of "best of the Genesis," they almost invariably go to Sonic... because he's the only Sega Genesis character they know. Like, hello? Shinobi III? Splatterhouse 2? The Phantasy Star and Shining Force games? Nope its just Sonic Sonic Sonic. For these people Sonic might as well be the only game Sega ever released.

Super Nintendo doesn't seem to have this problem--you can discuss that without it all being about Mario. That kind of irks me.

this is true and with people waxing nostalgiacally in generally, 99% of the time the only game I will hear mentioned is "Super Mario Bros." thats not even an exaggeration