Flawed PS2 hardware?

[lendelin]

In a thread ("new Zelda bonus disc") a debate came up how flawed the PS2 hardware is compared to the GC and Xbox. Is it actually true, or a rumor spread by game mags, retailers, and gamers?

Participate in the other polls for Xbox and GC if you own more than one of the current systems.

[nesuser2]

i'm not going to vote because my experiences weren't first hand. but alot of people come to me with electronics and video game stuff and i have seen a few of the DRE bs and.......i haven't had the problem.......knock on wood. but it does appear to be a widespread problem. don't know if it's been fixed in the newer consoles or not but it is a serious problem.

-Mark

[cheesystick]

My friends and I have a stick of broken ps2s. I think we have a total of 4 broken ones all in a pile. Its not that they, or myself for that matter, were hard on the systems. Its just that they were not built to last. Thats a lot of spare money that went to sony due to poor durability. I have had first hand expierence with it, and i can honestly say that durability wise, the ps2 is a piece of shit.
what? 60 million sold worldwide?
I wonder how many were re-purchases....
-crispy

[john_soper]

Can't complain myself about gaming, but ours sometimes has a problem and skips a few minutes when playing dvd movies

[zmeston]

In a thread ("new Zelda bonus disc") a debate came up how flawed the PS2 hardware is compared to the GC and Xbox. Is it actually true, or a rumor spread by game mags, retailers, and gamers?

Has this rumor been spread in gaming mags? I've missed those articles, but if someone can point 'em out to me, I'd be most appreciative. And which retailers have spread the rumor that PS2 hardware is flawed? Seems an odd way to conduct business.

-- Z.

[Duncan]

Its just that they were not built to last. Thats a lot of spare money that went to sony due to poor durability. I have had first hand expierence with it, and i can honestly say that durability wise, the ps2 is a piece of shit.
what? 60 million sold worldwide?
I wonder how many were re-purchases...

Throw in evil tech support (something that's not unique to Sony, by the way) and you get a lot of frustrated people who buy another PS2 just to avoid repair hassles.

In short, I too have wondered what percentage of Sony's annual PS2 sales can be chalked up to replacement of faulty equipment. You see, when your VCR breaks, you can always switch to another brand and try again. But when your PS2 breaks...well, your options are kinda limited, huh?

My brother's PS2 has been fine ever since early 2001, with the only possible issue arising mainly from Blockbuster's shitty rental discs and a tray that's starting to make squeaky sounds on occasion.

Then again, we tend to treat our stuff very well -- I've had the same NES "toaster" deck since 1987, and the same red-top Genesis since 1991.

Duncan :D

[Duncan]

And which retailers have spread the rumor that PS2 hardware is flawed? Seems an odd way to conduct business.

I have worked for a major discount retail chain on a non-commission basis for the last five years, which is more than long enough to have seen a certain pattern of failure with PS2 decks.

Right after the initial PS2 launch in 2000, we got a lot of returns for both the known cooling fan issue and some more mysterious "total failure" sort of problems. Most of these units were well within our usual 90-day return policy, too, which is kind of sad for a company as hardware-driven as Sony. And though it happens less frequently, we still get a fairly good number of returns for the same reasons these days.

To be fair, we also had a quick bout of problems with early Xbox decks that refused to play DVDs, but that cleared up relatively quickly. (Supposedly, Microsoft upgraded the software to fix it -- can anyone confirm this?) And there are no issues that I can think of regarding the GameCube or Game Boy Advance systems, at least at present.

Having given these examples, I'd hesitate to say that the PS2's shaky reputation is based solely on rumors -- a lot of it is based on fact, it would seem. I know I don't speak for every retailer, but I'd venture to say that other employees like me might be able to relate similar experiences.

Duncan :D

[Oobgarm]

I've been through a couple of systems with the infamous Disc Read Error problem, and I know a ton of people who have as well.

Working at Gamestop, I see a lot more PS2s returned than Xboxes or GCNs, and the DRE is usually the problem.

[digitalpress]

I feel like I've just been one of the lucky ones with this - I have a LAUNCH PS2, BOTH a US and JAPANESE one, and neither have ever given me any trouble. It may be that they're perfectly stored, in a dust-free, cool temperature environment but no complaints here.

[maxlords]

I have a launch PS2 as well, bought it the day they came out, and I haven't had TOO many problems, but it's got some oddly buggy hardware, that's for sure! Now, I'm incredibly careful with my hardware (except my Cube, which got bounced a few times totally by accident) and I've never dropped or mishandled my PS2, nor done anything to it at all other than play games on it. No CDs in it, no DVDs in it, nothing. And still I get occasional problems. The other day, I turned it on....NO SOUND AT ALL! I hit reset, same problem. Turned it off, then back on, works fine again. Very odd. Occasionally, it also doesn't autoboot my games, instead just going to the main browser menu. Sometimes (though this has only happened to me a handful of times since I bought it) it freezes during a game and I have to turn it off and back on. It's obviously got some hardware issues, and I suspect that the only reason mine still works is that I treat it so carefully. Oh, and I've stored mine on it's side since the day I got it.

As for seeing PS2s break down, I've seen about a 33% failure rate on release PS2s, and I'm told it's higher than that. And out of people I talk to about 1 in every 3-4 people that has a PS2 has had to replace one. There are serious problems with the quality of Sony's hardware, and Sony is still keepping it under wraps publicly. When the PS2s came out they flat out denied it publicly even though people bought brand new systems and had them fail (a LOT of them fail!) within the 90 day warranty. Also, a lot of problems go unreported because it's so hard to deal with Sony's repair people and so expensive as well. But still, they deny ANY problems with any of their hardware. I don't understand it. I'd say that yes, there are VERY serious hardware problems with the PS2 units. Unfortunately, the majority of next gen games I want come out only for the PS2. Go figure.

[GrandAmChandler]

I feel like I've just been one of the lucky ones with this - I have a LAUNCH PS2, BOTH a US and JAPANESE one, and neither have ever given me any trouble. It may be that they're perfectly stored, in a dust-free, cool temperature environment but no complaints here.

where is this dust free environment, and where can I get one? I had a PS2 Launch unit, and it broke in 95days. I MADE them take it back for free. 120 days later on my newly refurbished system, I got the disc read error again, but this time ONLY on DVD games. I also used the PS2 as my primary DVD player. I am conivnced by playing DVDs on your system strains the lens, and causes it to not read games any more due to miscalibration.

[sisko]

I feel like I've just been one of the lucky ones with this - I have a LAUNCH PS2, BOTH a US and JAPANESE one, and neither have ever given me any trouble. It may be that they're perfectly stored, in a dust-free, cool temperature environment but no complaints here.

I thought I was a lucky person as well because I hadn't experienced nearly as many problems as my fellow launch buyers.

Mine lasted about a year before it started to give me problems. I cleaned it out and it worked for another year with only sporatic problems.

I kept mine as dust free as possible (its really hard to do in Phoenix...I'm sure anyone from there knows), and kept it in a well cooled and well ventilated area. I never moved the unit except for once, when I walked it across the room when I was remodeling.

At least I was smart enough to buy a 2 year replacement warranty on my new unit :/

[Oobgarm]

I feel like I've just been one of the lucky ones with this - I have a LAUNCH PS2, BOTH a US and JAPANESE one, and neither have ever given me any trouble. It may be that they're perfectly stored, in a dust-free, cool temperature environment but no complaints here.

where is this dust free environment, and where can I get one? I had a PS2 Launch unit, and it broke in 95days. I MADE them take it back for free. 120 days later on my newly refurbished system, I got the disc read error again, but this time ONLY on DVD games. I also used the PS2 as my primary DVD player. I am conivnced by playing DVDs on your system strains the lens, and causes it to not read games any more due to miscalibration.

Just wanna jump back in here and say that I use my PS2 as my DVD player. My launch system crapped out-but my most recent one, bought in the GT3 bundle, has not had problems yet. *knocks on wood desk*

[Raedon]

It is a known fact that the first two versions of the PS2 had a DVD-ROM drive that failed but if you sent them in the Sony they replaced them.

The last version for the PS2 (in the base form) is the V7 and it has a extremely nice DVD-ROM that can read - +RW DVD's.

Personally I tore my V7 ps2 all the way down, modded the hell out of it and put it back together over a year ago and have not had one hickup. I burn insense, most of my friends smoke, I leave my windows open if it's cool..

My sister has had a launch unit and she uses it as a DVD player and not one problem..

This is the breakdown:

V1-V2: DVD-ROM that is known to fail won't read DVD-R or DVD+R..
V3: First PS2 with new drive Will play DVD-R and +R but no RW's
V5-6: Newer PS2 DVD-ROM
V7: Latest PS2, extremely strong DVD-ROM will read DVD-+R/RW and really crappy CD-R media.

[GrandAmChandler]

It is a known fact that the first two versions of the PS2 had a DVD-ROM drive that failed but if you sent them in the Sony they replaced them.

The last version for the PS2 (in the base form) is the V7 and it has a extremely nice DVD-ROM that can read - +RW DVD's.

Personally I tore my V7 ps2 all the way down, modded the hell out of it and put it back together over a year ago and have not had one hickup. I burn insense, most of my friends smoke, I leave my windows open if it's cool..

My sister has had a launch unit and she uses it as a DVD player and not one problem..

This is the breakdown:

V1-V2: DVD-ROM that is known to fail won't read DVD-R or DVD+R..
V3: First PS2 with new drive Will play DVD-R and +R but no RW's
V5-6: Newer PS2 DVD-ROM
V7: Latest PS2, extremely strong DVD-ROM will read DVD-+R/RW and really crappy CD-R media.

Can you tell the difference by looking at a system box or unit?

[Gamereviewgod]

No trouble at all with mine. It wouldn't play a few budget DVD's, but neither would my stand-alones.

[jonjandran]

Yea , since I sell games I've had a couple of every version. And the first couple were crap. I've got the latest (v7) , and it's da bomb. It'll read anything you throw at it and it doesn't do the freeze and reboot thing.

On a side note. Was the problem on the first couple of versions the laser? Because dust getting into the system shouldn't cause a laser to weaken. And for most people cleaning it doesn't help. So was it more like a voltage problem , like some have said trying to read DVD's hurt the laser somehow ?

[Raedon]

Look on the back of your PS2..

SCPH-10000/15000 or SCPH-18000 (V1)
SCPH-30003 (V2)
SCPH-3000X (V4)
SCPH-3000XR (V5/V6)
SCPH-37000/3900X (V7/V8/V9) I think 8 and 9 are those progressive scan models.. not sure though.

[Chunky]

I'm on my 2nd one, it stopped reading CDROM Games but played DVDs fine, then i fricken dropped it, had it fixed, tried to mod it, and screw it, it's now parts.

but as far as it breaking more often....to me i play my PS2 about 80 times more than my GC, so i would guess it wold have a 80% more chance of breaking. and it did.

[buttasuperb]

Hmm, I'll have to check what version I got, but I got my PS2 a couple months after launch and have not had one single problem with it. I even dropped it a couple times.

[GrandAmChandler]

Look on the back of your PS2..

SCPH-10000/15000 or SCPH-18000 (V1)
SCPH-30003 (V2)
SCPH-3000X (V4)
SCPH-3000XR (V5/V6)
SCPH-37000/3900X (V7/V8/V9) I think 8 and 9 are those progressive scan models.. not sure though.

Ah ha! I have been looking for that info forever now! thanks!!

[zmeston]

It is a known fact that the first two versions of the PS2 had a DVD-ROM drive that failed but if you sent them in the Sony they replaced them.

The last version for the PS2 (in the base form) is the V7 and it has a extremely nice DVD-ROM that can read - +RW DVD's.

Personally I tore my V7 ps2 all the way down, modded the hell out of it and put it back together over a year ago and have not had one hickup. I burn insense, most of my friends smoke, I leave my windows open if it's cool..

My sister has had a launch unit and she uses it as a DVD player and not one problem..

This is the breakdown:

V1-V2: DVD-ROM that is known to fail won't read DVD-R or DVD+R..
V3: First PS2 with new drive Will play DVD-R and +R but no RW's
V5-6: Newer PS2 DVD-ROM
V7: Latest PS2, extremely strong DVD-ROM will read DVD-+R/RW and really crappy CD-R media.

Great, GREAT info. Thank you! This is why I come to these forums -- to be educated.

-- Z.

[lendelin]

@zmeston and everyone:

1. Game mags: The blue-disc error problem and DVD playing problems were often reported and discussed in Game mags, in EGM, GI, and GamePro. One interesting reader letter can be found in GamePro, vol. 166, July 2002, p.22 (referring to GamePro April 2002). A store manager went to a conference with Sony reps, asked them Qs about the "rampant" blue disc scratching prob, they euphemistically discarded it with blah blah, he asked the other (around 100) store managers in the room if they experienced similar probs in their stores, and the guy reports that almost everyone in the room raised their hands.

I also remember a sarcastic comment by an editor in GamePro who said ‘no wonder there are so many PS2s out there, a lot of us have to buy TWO.'

2. retailers: of course it's not an official retailer announcement, it would be bad for business. I meant retailer employees, sorry for that. (see above and below)

I talked to some guys who own a PS2, and also two employees at Best Buy and Gamestop whom I know well, and they both reported that they get much more PS2s than Xbox' and GCs returned (taking into account that there are more PS2s out there!!!); plus, so they told me, PS2s come often in for repair after they were purchased a year or two years ago. They told me also that they have hardly friends who own a PS2 who didn't have severe probs (dust problems, fooling around with lil' vacuum cleaners, disc read error probs for DVDs, blue disc scratching prob)

"Anecdotal evidence" has always be taken with two question marks; but I found it always interesting to ask employees in game stores (if they are open enough) because they are the ones who experience the probs first hand and know about it; sometimes this is the only way to get some information considering that firms are in intentional denial first as a policy. If it adds up across gamers and retailers, there might be something to it.

This is not a scientifically designed poll :). It's not representative with randomly chosen units of analysis, and the Qs aren't broken down into categories (time of purchase and occurrence of prob, playing time, kind of prob and what else not); but I think it will give an indicator of hardware reliability. Statistically it will even out if more than 500 people participate, which will be the case, of course. :) At least we can say that X percentage of PS2 owners who visit the DP website and were willing to participate in the poll had serious probs with their PS2s compared to Y and Z percentages of GC and Xbox owners. Let's see how the results work out.

Personally, I didn't have any probs so far with the three systems. I once had a problem with my PS2, but it turned out that it was actually my component video cable from Monstercable.

[sisko]

Personally, I didn't have any probs so far with the three systems. I once had a problem with my PS2, but it turned out that it was actually my component video cable from Monstercable.

I had the same problem :hmm:

At least Monster offers a lifetime warranty on all their cable products.

[Anonymous]

My launch PS2 stopped reading CDs after about 2 years, and the Sony Rep set me up for a free warranty without any hassle. As a fellow rep, I could hear the annoyance that goes along with getting the same call over and over again. I wish there was a Sony rep around here, but I'd be willing to bet that there is an internal rule to cover those situations outside of warranty as a general rule.

[zmeston]

@zmeston and everyone:

1. Game mags: The blue-disc error problem and DVD playing problems were often reported and discussed in Game mags, in EGM, GI, and GamePro.

Thanks for the heads-up! I only recently started getting GI, and I don't get GamePro, but I'll track 'em down. And thanks for the clarification about the retail thing.

-- Z.

[evilmess]

SCPH-39000 here and no problems since purchasing 10 months ago. Altho I did purchase an extra 1 year warranty thru EB just incase my PS2 takes a dump on me.

FYI the SCPH-50000 is the latest and greatest PS2 with the progressive scan, remote control on/off and tray open/close plus other new features. It's not available in the US yet but should be out in the next month or so according the IGN

http://ps2.ign.com/articles/450/450228p1.html?fromint=1

[jaydubnb]

I had the absolute worst experience when I bought my ps2. I bought the system home along with a game, it wouldnt boot the disc. I went to my neighbors and plopped my game in his deck, it worked fine. Returned the system to my local hobby shop, got an exchange...same damn problem. After that I had given up on the system, although I kept the game. Months later I bought a new ps2 and bingo! It worked!

Between that and the skipping on the ps1, Sony's really gotten over.

[Neil Koch]

I've had mine for about 2 years and haven't had any problems, and I live in a pretty small dusty environment and use it occasionally to play DVDs. I've had to replace a few controllers (the PS2 dual shocks seem a bit more flimsy than the PS1's) but the hardware has never given me a problem.

I sure the hardware is faulty to some degree, but I think a lot of it is due to how people take care of their system and games.

[spoon]

Hmm, I'll have to check what version I got, but I got my PS2 a couple months after launch and have not had one single problem with it. I even dropped it a couple times.

Just try not to piss on it. LOL

Anyhow, I have had to return 4 PS2. I now currently do not own one for that reason.

1.Drive stopped opening.
2.Stopped reading DVD games/movies.
3.Stoppped reading blue/black backed games.
4.Just stopped working.

I used to work at Wal-Mart (finished just this week). We had atleast one Ps2 returned, or a call about one not working atleast once a week this whole year.

[Duncan]

I had the absolute worst experience when I bought my ps2. I bought the system home along with a game, it wouldnt boot the disc. I went to my neighbors and plopped my game in his deck, it worked fine. Returned the system to my local hobby shop, got an exchange...same damn problem. After that I had given up on the system, although I kept the game. Months later I bought a new ps2 and bingo! It worked!

Rules of thumb when buying electronic items or media...

1) MAKE SURE YOU KEEP YOUR RECEIPT. This is key. Hang onto that sucker for at least a month; longer if you won't be using the item(s) for a while. Hang onto it even after the initial "I put it in X player and it works okay" phase. Without a receipt, store return policies offer many unique ways to screw you over and keep your money.

2) If you end up with faulty hardware right out of the box, take the item and your receipt (which, of course, YOU KEPT) back to the store in question -- but ask only for a refund. DO NOT take an instant replacement; if you're forced to take a store credit, do so. You'll find a way to use it later, I'm sure. :)

The reason for not taking an instant replacement? If your unit had a certain flaw, chances are that most of the other units in that store's current batch also have the same problem and are likely to do exactly the same thing all over again. Why go through repeated hassles? Take your refund or store credit and go to A) another store entirely or B) another location of the same store to ensure that you get to sample from a different batch.

3) In the case of faulty games, DVDs or CDs, most places won't allow you to do anything but an even exchange thanks to copyright laws (some places are slightly more lenient, so long as you return the item promptly). When this is the case, do your best to be patient and wait a week or two before returning the item if you can. This will allow the store's stock on hand to either exhaust itself or (if a known quality issue arises) to be returned as damaged product.

4) Don't buy third-party accessories in general. Just make this a law in your mind. :)

Duncan :D

[sisko]

Rules of thumb when buying electronic items or media...

1) MAKE SURE YOU KEEP YOUR RECEIPT. This is key. Hang onto that sucker for at least a month; longer if you won't be using the item(s) for a while. Hang onto it even after the initial "I put it in X player and it works okay" phase. Without a receipt, store return policies offer many unique ways to screw you over and keep your money.


Keep your box and manuals too! Believe it or not boxes, packing materials, and manuals cost a lot of money! Without those, you can expect to pay hefty restocking fees, or not to return it at all!

[Videogamerdaryll]

Yes I had a problem with 2 of the 4 PS2's I bought..

I sent them 2 in for free repair.

[lendelin]

Thanks guys for participating so nicely! The more participate, the better. Really interesting results so far.

Very interesting reads about the specific probs or no probs. These are really nice indicators of potential problems, weaknesses and strenghts of hardware.