Sony needs to be Tengened! [Archive] - Retrogaming Roundtable

ManekiNeko

10-11-2003, 12:01 PM

I was thinking about SNK's battle with Sony to release Metal Slug 3 for the Playstation 2. I can't help but wonder why they're wasting all that time and effort to earn Sony's blessing when they could just release it on their own, without Sony's authorization. There have been unlicensed third parties before, the most famous being Tengen. If the NES and Genesis can be reverse engineered to run games that weren't specifically authorized by the systems' respective manufacturers, why not the Playstation 2?
Perhaps if unlicensed games were released in large quantities for the PS2, Sony would get their heads out of their asses and start treating their licensees with respect. After all, why would anyone want to deal with Sony when they could release games on their own, and keep all the money for themselves?

JR

Phosphor Dot Fossils

10-11-2003, 12:11 PM

Distribution-wise, Sony could pull a Nintendo and strong-arm the dealers and distributors into not touching an unlicensed title. But that's really an example that could only have worked in the lat e 80s - with the power of the web, you don't really necessarily need the official distribution channels.

Kid Fenris

10-11-2003, 12:40 PM

An independent release really wouldn't work for Metal Slug 3, since SNK's Japanese parent company would have to approve it, and they'd want to preserve their working relationship with Sony. If the American branch of SNK went behind Sony's back in America, it'd have adverse effects in Japan as well.

However, I could see some gray-market company going for it. Maybe they could release a compilation of "Sachen Classics."

Half Japanese

10-11-2003, 01:48 PM

ManekiNeko

10-11-2003, 02:23 PM

Sylentwulf

10-11-2003, 02:44 PM

Problem is, as much as we all like to think we're the majority, we're not. And as much as we all like to think "Sony is stupid" for not releasing a game, they probably DO know better than us :)

Yes, you would get a TON of rabid fans buying it the first day. But that's more than likely it, and not enough to pay for everything required to have it distributed over here. I curse Square and Sony daily for not releasing a plethora of games that haven't come stateside, and it still pisses me off, and I AM convinced that it would sell a million copies, but deep down, I know I'm probably wrong.

Metal slug probably WOULDN'T sell too well. I'd buy it in a heartbeat, you'd buy it in a heartbeat, but would marie-sue buy it for little jimmy? hell no. And little jimmy wouldn't want the damn game anyways with "uber-metal tank 3-D 500 megapixel death move" sitting on the same shelf, would he?

<steps down from soapbox>

hezeuschrist

10-11-2003, 03:48 PM

Bah, I was looking for the picture of some guy I know who took a crap on an enemies car, and suggest you do the same if MS3 doesn't get released here but I've exhausted my searching.

ventrra

10-11-2003, 04:07 PM

Problem is, as much as we all like to think we're the majority, we're not. And as much as we all like to think "Sony is stupid" for not releasing a game, they probably DO know better than us :)
Not nessicerily. There are quite a few instances of "sleeper" hits (i.e. Ladybug) as well as ones that were expected to be "BIG HITS" (i.e. E.T.). These sorts of things have happend throughout the history of video games and will certainly continue well into the future. The only real way to know whether or not a certain game is going to be a hit or not is to release it and see if it is.

Jorpho

10-11-2003, 04:51 PM

Was it not recently established that initial reports were inaccurate, and that PS2 MS3 will be released in the US after all?

zmweasel

10-11-2003, 06:54 PM

N/A

zmweasel

10-11-2003, 07:01 PM

N/A

zmweasel

10-11-2003, 07:12 PM

N/A

Jorpho

10-11-2003, 08:39 PM

Was it not recently established that initial reports were inaccurate, and that PS2 MS3 will be released in the US after all?

SNK stated that it hasn't given up trying to get MS3 through Sony Computer Entertainment America's "concept approval" process. MS3 hasn't been greenlit for a U.S. release, and it won't be unless SNK goes with a budget or bundle release.

I was looking at this story (http://www.gamespot.com/ps2/action/metalslug3/news_6076513.html), but I guess that doesn't give the complete picture.

maxlords

10-11-2003, 10:19 PM

What I think is interesting is that it wouldn't cost Sony to put it out, it only costs SNK. Why WOULDN'T Sony let em do it if it's a high quality game? That seems kinda odd to me. I assume that Sony must be going by Metal Slug X sales figures to judge this, but I still don't understand the logic.

kai123

10-11-2003, 10:32 PM

They already have figured out how to get stuff to work without sony's approval. Look at the Gamesharks and Action Replays. They seem to be doing quite well.

thegreatescape

10-11-2003, 11:04 PM

Was it not recently established that initial reports were inaccurate, and that PS2 MS3 will be released in the US after all?

SNK stated that it hasn't given up trying to get MS3 through Sony Computer Entertainment America's "concept approval" process. MS3 hasn't been greenlit for a U.S. release, and it won't be unless SNK goes with a budget or bundle release.

-- Z.

What about PAL regions, like Australia and Europe ? Im totally guessing here, but isnt their "quality control" a little more relaxed 2d wise. I mean, here in Aus we got Vib ribbon (didnt come to america right?) and my local K-mart was selling it. Or is SNK not bothering at all with a PAL release ?

-SMi

zmweasel

10-12-2003, 11:29 AM

N/A

zmweasel

10-12-2003, 11:44 AM

N/A

zmweasel

10-12-2003, 12:00 PM

N/A

kai123

10-12-2003, 04:42 PM

If it is a game they decided wasn't worthy of a release and someone released it any way I don't see how that would hurt them at all. If it sold well maybe they wouldn't be so picky.

zmweasel

10-12-2003, 05:32 PM

N/A

ventrra

10-12-2003, 05:53 PM

The majority of Sony's profits are from third-party licensing fees. Unlicensed games mean no licensing fees, which means no reason for anyone to manufacture hardware, which means no videogame market.
Funny, I didn't see Nintendo go under because of Color Dreams, AGCI, Tengen, Camerica, etc. in the NES era. :roll:

zmweasel

10-12-2003, 06:07 PM

N/A

ventrra

10-12-2003, 08:47 PM

This is true. Then again, all those long-defunct publishers were (excepting Tengen, which was nursing a corporate grudge) fly-by-night companies of the Games by Apollo variety, publishing shitty games to cash in on a fad, whereas every legitimate publisher and retailer of the era worked with Nintendo, not against it.
Wisdom Tree is still in business today. I'd dare say that I heard enough publishers complain about Nintendo's practices in that era. (And for that matter, I'd say that the current era in gaming isn't that far different.
Another interesting note is that Nintendo's biggest seller has no protection for companies not being licenced.

Sotenga

10-12-2003, 08:54 PM

I don't care if MS3 needs to be bootlegged. I WANT IT ON THE PS2, DAMMIT!!! :angry:

Captain Wrong

10-12-2003, 09:18 PM

I know it's a longshot....but why doesn't SNK go for another market with Metal SLug 3? I'm sure Nintendo or Microsoft would LOVE to have it. If Sony fucks me up on this deal and makes me have to purchase a MVS or AES system to play this then I'll take a shit on their current CEO's grave.

Meeeh...I dunno about that. Think about it, it's a 3 or 4 year old game, running on 12+ year old hardware in a style of game that is many years past being popular. I'm guessing that PSX Metal Slug X didn't exactly burn up the sales charts, which would make a sequel quite a bit less appealing. Keep in mind, I'm a huge MS fan, but the reality is this isn't a title most people are going to buy.

I don't know why one side doesn't blink on this though. I don't see how it's any skin off Sony's ass to let SNK release it, and I don't see why they couldn't consider a budget release or bundle like the upcoming KOF release.

Trust me Justin, it's a lot less frustrating to just bite the bullet and buy a Neo and not be at the mercy of Sony's approval departement.

zmweasel

10-12-2003, 09:19 PM

N/A

Bratwurst

10-12-2003, 09:27 PM

Another interesting note is that Nintendo's biggest seller has no protection for companies not being licenced.

I don't understand what this means. Could you rephrase?

The Gameboy Advance has no lockout/territory restrictions in place to speak of. Come to think of it I kinda wonder about this myself. Why haven't we seen a Tengen company clone come out yet?

EDIT: Although, I remember something about in order for a game to play on the hardware it needed some kind of proprietary code, right?

zmweasel

10-12-2003, 09:38 PM

N/A

Kid Ice

10-12-2003, 10:35 PM

I don't know why one side doesn't blink on this though. I don't see how it's any skin off Sony's ass to let SNK release it, and I don't see why they couldn't consider a budget release or bundle like the upcoming KOF release.

Yeah, I don't see what Sony's motive is here. Sure it's not a guaranteed best seller, but it would be a gesture of good faith to the hardcore crowd; after all, we've seen Gungrave, Gradius 3 +4, Stretch Panic, Contra, and two Guilty Gears on this system.

I think Metal Slug 3 is sort of awkward to begin with though, as most casual gamers haven't played the first one. I'd like to see SNK go with a compilation on this one.

ventrra

10-12-2003, 10:37 PM

Of course, there is one more argument about Sony's policies on MS or any other game: Didn't they licence/allow the publishing of a lot of Acclaim's stuff? (Or is Acclaim actually publishing a lot of quality stuff these days?)

zmweasel

10-14-2003, 01:26 AM

N/A

Half Japanese

10-14-2003, 01:58 AM

There are so many games that shouldn't have gotten passed through, period. The only thing holding me back from the Neo Geo MVS is a lack of space and a lack of funds. I need some Metal Slug besides the NGPC ones damnit! And about Acclaim, they're still pretty terrible, but they do have Burnout 2, which is pretty good I hear. They also have.....uh....what's the name of it....huh? you say that Sega made that? Oh. Nevermind. They've got Burnout 2....

Jive3D

10-14-2003, 02:09 PM

12345

ManekiNeko

10-14-2003, 04:30 PM

Acclaim isn't publishing utter crap these days, but they're not churning out triple-A stuff, either, and the new NBA Jam is a sad attempt to recapture lightning in a bottle. The company will never have a serious problem with Sony, however, because it's a top-20 publisher in terms of revenue.

Don't listen to Zach! EVERYTHING Acclaim releases is crap!
(OK, the Game Boy Advance version of Turok: Evolution would have been all right if it hadn't been for its ludicrous difficulty...)

In fact, from what I heard through the grapevine, Sony forcing Acclaim to censor BMX XXX was corporate punishment. Acclaim had promised Sony it would iron out the bugs in Turok: Evolution before shipping, but failed to do so, and the PS2 version was notably inferior to the Xbox and GCN versions, which caused Sony not a little embarrassment. Quite possibly untrue, but a tasty gossip-nugget nonetheless.

"Stupid Acclaim! You made me look bad! (pulls out mask) OOGA-BOOGA!"
That's one of the most pathetic things I've ever heard Sony do. Someone needs to just throw a bib and a diaper on the president of SCEA and get it over with.

JR

Nature Boy

10-14-2003, 04:31 PM

Why haven't we seen a Tengen company clone come out yet?

I'd be willing to guess it's the costs involved. There's a *much* higher barrier to entry in the field today compared to the NES years.

If it ever did happen, besides (obviously) suing the company in question, I woudn't be suprised if Sony builds future units to close the loophole anyway. Then you're trying to sell a game nobody can play (i.e. no revenue) and are in court all the time (i.e. *lots* of costs).

As for MS3 specifically - I'd be willing to bet you'd see it, potentially anyway, released once PS3 is out there. Similar to stuff like Final Fantasy Origins seeing the light of day for PSone.