@Everyone: Does Size Matter?

[digitalpress]

How do you like my misleading topic to get you to read this? :evil:

Actually it's semi-relevant. This forum has seen steady growth in member participation and usage for well over a year now, beginning with our humble days on EZboard and now onto this privately owned and operated community which you are now a part of. If I could show you a graph displaying number of users online at any given time and number of posts per day, it would be a steadily rising line with peaks (usually around "events") and valleys (server crashes).

And this will only continue to grow, since I am actively pimping the forum in many subtle and not-so-subtle ways. Most of you probably found us as a result of that.

My question to you, who are here NOW, is this: do you prefer a small community where you recognize a majority of the posters, or a larger community where there are too many "regulars" to keep track of on a daily basis?

Before you answer, consider this: the service would not change, and the moderating staff might increase with people chosen by the existing team, ie "like-minded with regards to the rules". At one time I wanted a classic gaming forum similar to gaming-age.com, a veritable CITY of gamers, though I always feared it would turn into gamefaqs.com, a great site with just no community "feel" to it at all.

I'm asking because I'm considering backing off of the heavy promotion. I'm rather fond of the pace and content we get at present, knowing that when a few people leave, a few more will always enter.

Your opinions, as always, are welcome.

[Gamereviewgod]

I can see the Gamefaqs scare coming true, but I think the mods would prevent that from happening. The idiots would be shut out rather quickly. There might be some small problems for a bit (tons of "How rare is this" questions), but I think a majority of people will catch on rather quickly.

[Ed Oscuro]

Not to put down the mad-DP pimpage efforts, but I always assumed people more or less stumbled across this place like I did (member 1009, joined the same day Oobgarm did).

I don't see any complete idiots here...sometimes people don't make the smartest statements, but I don't see anybody here who's always wasting our time or who's just spamming the place up (which reminds me...those very few times when somebody's dropped off an advert, yeah, any links they leave need to be deleted) on a regular basis. People who're "troublemakers" here sound like just about anybody on the CastleVania Dungeon's forum (heh) and I think that people really try hard to stay on-topic here.

Good question, certainly. And yes, I expected a topic about size of consoles, and if I was solely running in on-topic mode I would've left it in search of posts to satisfy my unending gaming information hunger.

I think that the site's a comfortable size, but as with any other forum, the folks who've posted most and have been here longest tend to rise above the rest in terms of credibility. If the site starts to lose focus, that'll eventually be dealt with as well.

[jaydubnb]

The community feel is important, but I don't think it has much to do with the number of participants as a particular vibe. The gamefaqs boards, even if I try to put it nicely, are loaded with "It bE cO0lZZ duDez!!@!!!" mutants. Here, I've seen intelligent gaming conversation non-stop and have met some pretty cool people here that I converse with away form the boards. So perhaps its an age issue.

Okay, I may have strayed a bit from the topic, but as long as the vibe is kept,I have no probs with expansion. New posters can offer new ideas and viewpoints and thats a great thing...as long as it isn't 'XtreeMez!!@1!"

[GrandAmChandler]

I like the way we are now. I recognize a lot of names, and I hope myself to become one of the names that is easilly recognized as a "regular" :-)

[maxlords]

I have nothing against growth as long as we the number and quality of mods up ;) I don't see why DP can't keep getting bigger, because we invariably manage to get rid of the people that cause trouble. And with the number of people already here, that's damned impressive. I say that expansion is good...as long as you keep control over the DP denizens!

[christianscott27]

if it gets bigger and keeps the classic games/collector focus its all good. if it turns into yet another board where everybody rants on about the latest PS2 and xbox titles, not good. i like to think of this community as a breed apart from the mainstream game world and i hope that will always be the case. there are dozens of places to go and talk about tony hawk or devil may cry but only here can you find a good conversation about obscure systems and games. so in short keep the community focused on collecting 8-)

[thegreatescape]

I'd have to agree with maxlords (and pretty much everyone else so far)- In the short time ive been here, the modding has been great LOL LOL
So long as the Mods dont go mad with power (gamefaqs style), the digitpress forums can only get better 8-)

kinda reminds me of my old Business management class, and endless lessons about change, and adapting to change @_@

[MarioAllStar2600]

I like the board big! ALot of people posting though don't say mucha bout Video Ggames, and that's annoying. But on another note this board is also a very knowledgable place.

[omnedon]

Bigger is better, as long as it's moderated to stay on topic (within reason), and the signal to noise ratio is favourable.

I came here from Ars Technica forums http://arstechnica.infopop.net/OpenTopic/page?a=cfrm&s=50009562 and they are VAST (look at how many are online at any given moment!), but they are still a tight knit community, with a very high signal to noise ratio. They are so big, they had to start charging subscriptor fees to certain fora to pay for the bandwidth. The result- no pop ups, huge community, more signal than noise in all forums (well moderated), and neato perks for subscriptors, like picture hosting!

Any way, my point is you can be BIG and good. It just requires some vision, and some rules that benefit all who enjoy the community.

[christianscott27]

side note, i guess i could use the "view new posts since your last visit option" but theres a feature i like on some of the other boards i use. next to each topic line theres a little "new" button. when you click that button it takes you to the point in the thread where the new posts start. very nice to have esp. in the long, long threads where it gets tiring to keep scrolling down.

[Sega Hitman]

I personally think that the site getting bigger would be a problem. It's not that I hate newbie's, but I do hate collecting becoming mainsteam. The more people come here, the more popular the guide will get. If the guide starts selling like crazy, it'll be treated like the Beckett of our hobby. Granted I'm a selfish, greedy bastard, but I don't want finds in the wild to completely stop because everybody knows how much stuff is worth.

Heavy promotion might bring in the wrong element as well. I personally don't like the type of person who thinks Atari and NES are "old school" and "hip". If people like this come here, we're going to be flooded with PS2 and XBox posts. Don't get me wrong, I don't have a problem with newer systems, but if I want to see hundreds of threads on brand new games, this isn't the place I look.

That being said, people that a truly interested should have no problem finding this site. Years and years ago I was struggling to find a SNES rarity list on yahoo, which sent me to a thread in the old EZboard. I haven't stopped coming since. If you type in anything like "rarity" or "collecting" or "classic gaming" on google, you'll be sent here. It's not hard to find. Also, on most classic gaming message boards, people plug DP all the time. It'll be like this for years to come. Spending time on heavy promotion is a waste, considering people will keep on coming if it's there or not.

I'm going to end my rant, but if this site gets flooded with people, it's going to discourage a lot of us from coming back. If this board gets filled with thousands of "rate my collection" threads or "wats a toploader?" kind of topics, then we'd be nothing more than a well moderated Gamefaqs.

-Hitman-

[digitalpress]

side note, i guess i could use the "view new posts since your last visit option" but theres a feature i like on some of the other boards i use. next to each topic line theres a little "new" button. when you click that button it takes you to the point in the thread where the new posts start. very nice to have esp. in the long, long threads where it gets tiring to keep scrolling down.

We've got that.

It's on the upper right side, just above the "last post" column on the opening page. Check it out.

[ddockery]

I see no problem at all with getting bigger. For the most part, I don't think the L33T GAmeRz would be attracted much to this site anyway, and once here the mods would take care of them fairly swiftly. If "dumb" questions pop up too often, we could start maintaining a couple of FAQS up top (stickied posts) that detail what questions are deemed annoying and/or inappropriate, and where to find the relevant information.

Drew

[digitalpress]

I personally think that the site getting bigger would be a problem. It's not that I hate newbie's, but I do hate collecting becoming mainsteam. The more people come here, the more popular the guide will get. If the guide starts selling like crazy, it'll be treated like the Beckett of our hobby. Granted I'm a selfish, greedy bastard, but I don't want finds in the wild to completely stop because everybody knows how much stuff is worth.

Since the entire DP staff wants the guide to be the "Beckett for our hobby", I can tell you we're heading in opposite directions on this issue, you and I. Sorry.


Heavy promotion might bring in the wrong element as well. I personally don't like the type of person who thinks Atari and NES are "old school" and "hip". If people like this come here, we're going to be flooded with PS2 and XBox posts. Don't get me wrong, I don't have a problem with newer systems, but if I want to see hundreds of threads on brand new games, this isn't the place I look.

The focus here will always be "classics" and "collecting". But the promotion has been going on for over a year - are we worse now than we were then? If not, I see no reason why it would change direction as long as we keep our charter and focus as is.


Spending time on heavy promotion is a waste, considering people will keep on coming if it's there or not.

I have to do something with my time :) but that IS the point of my question, so thanks for your candid and honest answer.


I'm going to end my rant, but if this site gets flooded with people, it's going to discourage a lot of us from coming back. If this board gets filled with thousands of "rate my collection" threads or "wats a toploader?" kind of topics, then we'd be nothing more than a well moderated Gamefaqs.

I agree. At what point is it "flooded", in your opinion - double the current activity? Ten times?

[Oobgarm]

As of this posting, we are one member shy of 2800. I find it funny that Ed Oscuro mentioned we signed up on the same day, as I just noticed that recently.

I fully understand the fears of becoming a "GameFAQS". I despise getting on their message boards, since most of their "community" is juvenile, and it's just not worth the time to try and have a civil conversation with them. A few nuggets of truth slip through the cracks every now and again, though. IGN's boards are kinda similar, but they're much more regulated. Still, the garbage post count is rather high, despite efforts to cull it.

Keep in mind, though, that the vast majority of the members on those boards are young and they're there to talk about the current generation of hardware. Retrogaming is a very uncommon subject there.

DP, on the other hand, tends to lean more towards an older demographic, and retrogaming is the big topic(hence the forum name). New games are starting to permeate the forums, but they've got a long way to go before they take over. It's also much more laid-back, allowing members to speak their minds(to a degree, of course) and not get "ToS'ed" like they would on other boards. People here seem to catch on to the "unspoken forum rules" about rarity postings and other things that could easily be found by searching the forum.

Those other forums seem to have that "Cold Machine™" feel to them, and they're not all that welcoming to outsiders or newbies. That kind of thing turns of folks immediately.

DP is more close-knit due to the fact that a lot of the members personally know each other outside of the forum. A majority of the folks here are friendly to newbies and to each other-and that makes a huge difference in the online world.

So anyway.

I personally enjoy the feel of a smaller community. I like to think that I really "know" most of the people here. However, given the way that this forum conducts itself, I think that the same feel can be obtained no matter how large it gets.

Funny thing is, like previously mentioned, I think a lot of people surf right on in, rather than intending to come here. I can't remember how many times I came across the old EZboard forums when I was Googling for things. Granted, I never took part in any of the discussions until the move to our current home here. :)

[chadtower]

I agree. At what point is it "flooded", in your opinion - double the current activity? Ten times?

When the signal to noise ratio gets too low and/or when the load starts to affect server performance and/or when the volume becomes too difficult to moderate well.

[Mayhem]

In terms of the individual on a message board (any community message board here), smaller is always better. Less hassle, easier to get to know people and remember their proper names, likes, dislikes etc. More spirit, more involvement and less people lurking heh.

I've seen changes over on NTSC-UK, from its small village like community beginnings into something wholly a lot more massive. Several longtime people have left there because they felt it had gotten TOO big and had lost some of the magic that had been there before, simply because of the dilution. I wouldn't want the same to happen here, but it could.

[Flack]

I've only been here a couple of months now, but for what it's worth ...

When I walked through these "virtual doors" for the first time, I felt like I was on one of those talk shows where they reunite long lost relatives.

For years I've been collecting old systems and games ... the most I've ever gotten from anyone visiting my house is a "oh, that's neat" or "yeah, I used to have one of those and I threw it away" or "nice junk pile, pack rat." Ok, that last one came from my mother, but still, you get the idea.

When I found this forum, I couldn't BELIEVE there were that many people out there who valued the "golden days" as much as I do. Finally, I had found people who understood that "Top Gun (PS2)" is a worse game than River Raid. I found other people who still have Commodore 64s set up. Without getting TOO mushy, I found people who I could relate to.

There are probably other people out there like me, people who love vintage gaming but just haven't run across this site yet. Most of the "I n33d Thrill Kill d00d NOW" kids will come and go. Those of us with Laser Blast patches on our jean jackets will stay a while. We'll staaaaaaaaaaaaaaay forevah!

(The above person who just made an Impossible Mission reference was just sacked.)

Flack

[Sega Hitman]

"Since the entire DP staff wants the guide to be the "Beckett for our hobby", I can tell you we're heading in opposite directions on this issue, you and I. Sorry. "

I made my point sound confusing. What I meant was that every card store in the country has price guides up the wazoo. It's nearly impossible to go into a card store and have an amazing score, where as with video games, I can still walk into stores and find great stuff, at great prices. If every game store and every flea market guy has a DP guide, that will take a lot of the fun out of collecting. This post wasn't necessarilly about the guide though, so I'm probably going off on another rant. The guide is a great tool though, and it is the Beckett of video game collecting. I just can't type and make sense today. :)

As to the other stuff, what kind of promotion has been going on? The only stuff I've noticed are the magazine articles and such. I'd consider that good promotion, seeing as an everyday gamer probably won't go out of there way to a site like this unless they really had an interest in classiscs. I guess I wasn't reading the original post carefully enough. When I first read it, it sounded like you were planning something huge.

-Hitman-

[digitalpress]

"As to the other stuff, what kind of promotion has been going on? The only stuff I've noticed are the magazine articles and such. I'd consider that good promotion, seeing as an everyday gamer probably won't go out of there way to a site like this unless they really had an interest in classiscs. I guess I wasn't reading the original post carefully enough. When I first read it, it sounded like you were planning something huge.

Some of the things I've been doing to drive traffic here.

1) any and all of my freelance work credits this forum, so that "Joe magazine reader" who didn't realize there WAS a collecting or retrogaming community finds us.

2) every email I reply to has a direct link to the forum.

3) every eBay auction I participate in (usually video game relate) whether as a buyer or seller, has a direct link to the forum.

4) practically every PAGE on the DP site (which, trust me, is where Google finds its stuff) links directly to the forum.

5) I keep a healthy supply of little business cards around, colorful "JOIN US" cards with the Space Fury guy and link to the forum. These go everywhere I go and get mailed every time there's mail to send. If you haven't seen these it's because I already know you're a member here.

Again, I brought this topic up because I could simply close the floodgates by cutting off one or more things from the list above.

The responses here are very insightful so far, please speak up if you have not already! Thanks all.

[ChuckthePlant]

As a new member I agree with most of the posts so far. The key is to establish a good moderated signal to noise ratio. The mods here do an excellent job in keeping the posts on topic and not unnecessarily censoring.

I have left many boards in the past as they have experienced rapid growth and a breakdown in their usefulness. I do not think it is a function of the growth per se but of the swamping of the culture of the board. The more successful boards combine a light hand with moderation with a strong culture of ignoring or shunning problematic posts with out reverting to all out flame wars. This board for the most part does it very well. As long as that can be maintained, and it can be swamped very easily, go for it. I would hate to see a breakdown in civility and a need to wade through interminable posts of ongoing pissing matches.

[Oobgarm]

"As to the other stuff, what kind of promotion has been going on? The only stuff I've noticed are the magazine articles and such. I'd consider that good promotion, seeing as an everyday gamer probably won't go out of there way to a site like this unless they really had an interest in classiscs. I guess I wasn't reading the original post carefully enough. When I first read it, it sounded like you were planning something huge.

Some of the things I've been doing to drive traffic here.

1) any and all of my freelance work credits this forum, so that "Joe magazine reader" who didn't realize there WAS a collecting or retrogaming community finds us.

2) every email I reply to has a direct link to the forum.

3) every eBay auction I participate in (usually video game relate) whether as a buyer or seller, has a direct link to the forum.

4) practically every PAGE on the DP site (which, trust me, is where Google finds its stuff) links directly to the forum.

5) I keep a healthy supply of little business cards around, colorful "JOIN US" cards with the Space Fury guy and link to the forum. These go everywhere I go and get mailed every time there's mail to send. If you haven't seen these it's because I already know you're a member here.

Again, I brought this topic up because I could simply close the floodgates by cutting off one or more things from the list above.

The responses here are very insightful so far, please speak up if you have not already! Thanks all.

I think that having a link to the main DP site is a better idea when pimping, rather than a link directly to the forums. That allows the reader to see the wares, so to speak. Let them do a bit of looking and investigating before they join the forums.

That kinda segues into the forum link on all of the DP site pages, which I think is an excellent idea.

[Raccoon Lad]

I'm all for it, as long as we can flame (or possibly ban :evil: ) any annoying Noob's that come along.

"No, I don't give a crap about the rarity of Mario cart 64!!!!!" -BAN! :evil:

"No, I don't know where to get PS2 ISO's" -BAN :evil:

"STFU Noob!!!!" -BAN :evil:

Ok, some n00bs are halfway decent, but some just irritate the hell out of me. :angry:

[ClubNinja]

The thing about these here forums is that we're a community - and a unique one at that. We've got our quality content, and then we've got our Thanksgiving-dinner bickering. But just like those holiday dining rooms, these forums contain a family. Every other forum or newsgroup or whatever that I've ever frequented (gaming and otherwise) was just a place where people discussed a similar topic, but nothing beyond that. I've made friends here, I've taken interest in people's lives outside of video games here, and I've always looked forward to visiting.

With that in mind, a family always welcomes its newest members with open arms. Even if you were expecting one and got two hundred. You get the idea. I'm all for expansion as long as the atmosphere that makes Digital Press so unique remains. Otherwise, we boot the new crowd!

[pokobocket]

Personally, I don't really think that Digital Press could degrade into a GameFAQs playpen. What makes GameFAQs so crappy is that it caters mainly to the new systems, and of course, younger players with less maturity. From past experience, I think that there is no danger of retro-gaming becoming a fad. IE - On the last day of school a few years back, we brought a 2600 in. Polite and intelligent folks said it was cool and asked to play. Students who were GameFAQy said "lame, etc, let me go back to playing my ps2".

So basically I think that heavier duty moderating can keep any problems like that in check.

The one suggestion I DO have is to split up the Video Game Forum into a few sub forums. Not even 5 - maybe just into two...

-Classic Gaming Forum
-Modern Gaming Forum

Of course, I guess there is a reason to have it all rolled into one, but at some point, it will get out of hand. It would be a lot easier to be able to stay strictly with discussion of one era or another. Anyway, that's just my take on it, hope it is helpful. ;)

[Gamereviewgod]

I also don't like the idea of sending out links to just the forum....there's so much stuff on this site. How many times do we see a question "Whats this worth?" when all they need to do is look over to the left frame. If they only know about the forums, then their missing most of thise site. And of course, we have this really well written review page.... :P

[Kid Ice]

if it gets bigger and keeps the classic games/collector focus its all good. if it turns into yet another board where everybody rants on about the latest PS2 and xbox titles, not good. i like to think of this community as a breed apart from the mainstream game world and i hope that will always be the case. there are dozens of places to go and talk about tony hawk or devil may cry but only here can you find a good conversation about obscure systems and games. so in short keep the community focused on collecting 8-)

I agree 100%. If the focus is on classic gaming, it can only get so big.

[hydr0x]

i'm not in the mood to read the whole topic right now but i'll add my 2 cents:

i think you should stop promoting the site for various reasons or at least only promote it carefully. why? well:

- you've got to think about one thing, how many serious collectors are there (and i don't count kids getting 50-100 ps2 games per year from their parents because they are so rich as collectors) worldwide?? you only want serious collectors or at least great fans of retro gaming in this community and there are already 3000 registered users (though half of them have never posted), so how many collectors are left??

- what kind of people do u want to have here? i stumbled over this site (and i think many others also did) while searching google about some classic gaming stuff, ALL people who are seriously interested in this topic will find DP through google sooner or later, do u really want any other people here?

- i've already noticed signs that the board is drifting towards a gamefaqs like thing (veeeeeery slow drifting though), more and more people are getting to lazy to search the forum for old topics and just ask what they want to know! the same things get asked over and over again! more nonsense posts then a year ago and so on and so on ;)

- the percentage of (joining) people that really add some knowledge to the community is falling

imho IF you really want to grow further YOU have to decide somehow what people will join the community, there will always be the google searchers, and those are mostly a addition to the board, but what people do u want to join us due to your promotion? i'd say the people already on the board cover 95% of the knowledge about US-Games that exists :) what is missing imho are: people who know everything about the south-american pirate scene, our argentinian friend can't do everything alone ;) people from japan, GOD it just can't be true how little we know about japanese gaming! people from africa knowing their pirate scene, the same goes for china and hong-kong! and we are still to few european and australian gamers, lots of mysteries still left about PAL gaming :)

[Ed Oscuro]

Hmm, this thread filled up fast, and now it's dead again.

I think the DigitPress way is the correct one. I don't understand how having a guide hurts anyone--if you find something in the wild that's rare, it's usually 'cause it's being sold by somebody who doesn't know better. On the other hand, stores that have guides can make more money and stay around longer, and it's also a hedge against usurious pricing. If the seller's got a guide they can always choose to overlook it, but the more people that know their stuff, the less people will pay outrageous prices for common SNES carts.

As for sending links, yeah, it helps to have a FAQ or something, or link people to the actual page before the Forums. This place is a lot more SNES friendly than that ugly Space Fury guy (I cringe every time I accidentally load up digitpress.com, the sound is ALWAYS too high) than it lets on, but there's stuff on here like the Rarity Lists that let people know how much stuff's worth.

Actually, it might be a good idea to have a rephrase by each link on the page, say "How much is it worth?" right under "Rarity Lists." People would be more likely to go there if it was spelled right out that way; the words "Rarity Lists" don't really stand out much.

[IntvGene]

I fear for this place turning into Gamefaqs just as much as the next person. Having an open forum is great as it allows fresh new ideas to flow in and new people. Even since I've joined, I've noticed newcomers both good and bad. One thing that might be helpful is a posting of the rules or expectations of forum members... like how to use the Search button.

Even since after the summer, I've been finding the number of quality posts to have generally dropped. I generally just scan titles and look for the names that I know, because I know there's good discussion to be had in that thread. My biggest fear is the immaturity. It's something that is difficult to mod and it's something that people in their thirties (like me!) generally don't have the patience for.

Also, just the number of posts is overwhelming. I have to use the "View posts since last visit" button, but it is still getting overwhelming.. there are a couple of new pages every six hours, and it's tough to surf through. I agree that it might be time to examine splitting up the Video Game Forum, because I am generally only interested in the classic gaming discussion, but its getting harder to find.

I don't think that it is really necessary to keep pimping this place. I found it via google and that's the best way. People who are seriously into classic gaming will find this place without your pimping.

[Raccoon Lad]

There should be some new rules:

1) ask 2 stupid questions in a row, get a warning. Do it again, instant banishment from DP

2) Dis on the SMS (even in jest) INSTANT banishment :evil: :angry:

3) all new members should be required to give me $5

4) Raccoon Lad (aka Capn' AWESOME) gets first dibs on any Master System stuff. Those who bid against the mighty Raccoon Lad shall be banned.

5) tuesday shall from now on be known as "Taco Tuesday"

that is all.

[Ed Oscuro]

^ I'm with smartass ;P

In all seriousness, though, the forums getting hard to read (partly my fault really) concerns me, especially since some of our most knowledgeable people can't find topics they're interested in very easily.

Personally I think we don't have much bloat at all, especially considering how many members we have! My little CV Dungeon Forum (well, it's Kurt's really but I help mod it along with Jorge) has about a third of the posters here but have been able to keep it going along almost as strongly at times. Not recently, but sometimes we've had as many topics go by.

Keeping on track is certainly a good idea, no doubt about that. I used to love the GameSpy Forums "Game Discussion" forum but it's become totally awful.

[Gunstarhero]

I don't really care how many people come here, but to keep the Game Discussions focused, I want to also put in my recomendation for a split of the Video Gamer Forum into
-Classic Gaming
-Modern Gaming

[ManekiNeko]

I've never been a catalyst for change, so you probably won't be surprised when I tell you that I like the forum the way it is and feel that even more members aren't really all that necessary. I wouldn't actively discourage people from joining, but at the same time I don't think you need to promote the forum any more than you already have.

JR

[o2william]

I think it all goes back to hydr0x's question about who you want on these boards. Nobody wants GameFAQs "l33t d00dz." Mature newbies are OK, but nobody wants idiot n00bs who will never grow beyond being idiot n00bs. Nobody wants price guide profiteers who view games ONLY as a commodity. I think everyone would welcome folks who can intelligently discuss the modern systems, but nobody wants to see the classics lost in the noise. So, we want serious, reasonably mature gamers and collectors who at least respect the classics even if they don't have any real interest in them.

I'm with the "promote the site, not the forums" idea. Potential forum members are interested in the kind of material on the DP site, and they'll find it through Google, links on other sites, Usenet, etc. Since they'll actually read stuff on the site, they'll see the forum links, and if they're interested in participating in a discussion, they'll click through. By contrast, most l33t d00dz will see that the site covers retro games and immediately head off to GameFAQs or IGN. But if they come directly to the forums, they'll just see lots of posts about video games and think it's OK to start spouting off the kind of stuff we don't want cluttering up the forum.

One suggestion: since this forum is a fairly tight community, it might be intimdating to new arrivals (they might feel they're "intruding"). A "Welcome to new comers" sticky might be a good idea, just to let new people know they're free to start chiming in. This could also be the place to stick a FAQ to answer the common questions new posters would have (regarding rarity, value, reviews, etc.).

[christianscott27]

i know it'll just sound like grumpy gramps to say it but yeah sometimes the "classic content" of this board drops way down, and the "hey check out whats new at EB" content goes thru the roof. to a large extent it doesnt bother me, i'm every bit as involved in modern gaming as i am classic but that does not seem to the case with a lot of posters here. sometimes i'll surf over to atari age and read a thread about some amazing classic gaming news, lots of people posting on it and then drift over here and see nary a mention of it. its not a huge deal but it makes me wonder if i'm part of a dying breed here.

mostly i just miss the old RGVC scene, it had a really geeky almost scholarly devotion to the classics. something about newgroups seemed to weed out dumb posts, that is until the last year or so when rgvc became dead to me. i remember a few of you fellow old timers from the rgvc scene- sniderman, russ perry, ianoid, clubninja even santulli himself. i kind of miss having that resource, it was like aging nerds united. yeah small is better, lets institute a classic gaming trivia test as part of joining the forums

[digitalpress]

I appreciate everyone's opinion but to stay on-topic, let's not get too into this discussion about splitting forums, creating classic vs. modern, etc...

That's another topic for another day.

[Sotenga]

I'm more partial to a small community myself. I'm just a somewhat secretive individual. But I like these forums the way they are now, and I like you guys. You haven't kicked me out yet. :evil:

No, I'm joking. I've never been thrown out of any forum... yet. :evil: :evil: :evil:

No, seriously, I'm not trying to get tossed out. I don't mind if these forums remain titanic in the size of posters. I think that they were meant to be that way for this site, which has no doubt attracted millions of people. I bet that there are many who surf this site, but they haven't joined the forums. And I wouldn't be surprised if they did join all of the sudden. While I'm more used to slightly more private boards, DP was not meant to remain private. It needs all of the press it can get. So, bring 'em on. :D

[Phosphor Dot Fossils]

Promote the heck out of it, I say. I've spent quite a pit of time pimping my site as well (some of that time here), and it's been paying off in some ways. And overdoing it in some ways: I have to switch hosting services soon because I'm now exceeding my bandwidth on a regular basis - too many people showing up! But I'm not complaining, just looking for ways to make it possible for that growing number of folks to keep visiting without killing myself financially in "over-use" charges. LOL

Go for it. But promote the DP "brand" in the process, not just the forums: the newsletter, the guide, the Tony Fox CD, the official Space Fury prophylactics (y'know, the ones with "my huge armada will conquer your tiny planet!" emblazoned on them), and the forums. The complete DP experience.

[Zaxxon]

I don't think promoting it is a good idea. I think classic gamers are able to find it on their own. Almost every classic gaming site I've seen has a link to DP on it. Last year there was a flood of noob's, only posting about the NES, SNES, Genesis -_- boooriiinng! I stopped coming here for months after that. There's a million better websites devoted to that, if that's what we wanted to read.

[Raccoon Lad]

Yeah, we need more posts about the SMS and other not-quite mainstream consoles!

[Phosphor Dot Fossils]

But the thing is...DP is billed as a "classic" site, a "retro" site. What's "classic" or "retro" to us may be the 2600, dedicated Pong consoles, or Intellivision. What's "classic" or "retro" to someone else may indeed be the Genesis or SNES. I wasn't into those machines myself, but they're old-school to the players who grew up with 'em. In a mere matter of years, Playstation 1 will be "retro."

But the thing is, there's so much crossover even now - i.e. the Pac-Man multiplayer bonus disc for Gamecube (something, so help me, has finally sold me on that system) - I'm not sure there's any point in segregating the forums by "era." Maybe a subject header system should be strictly enforced for topics on a specific title, something like:

[GBA] WarioWare rarity?

[2600] Swordquest: Landfillworld proto FOUND!!!

So you know exactly what the basis of that thread is. Not that it won't mutate from there.

*shrug* Just a thought.

[Raccoon Lad]

That would certainly make filtering content to ones preferences alot easier

[Phosphor Dot Fossils]

Now, there are always exceptions, like threads where someone's seeking advice on the best home console port of XXX: Extreme Teletubbies Foosball, but for system specific stuff, maybe a prominent marker like that would help.

Maybe once we've been at it for a while like that, anything 90 days or older could be moved to a read-only archive for that specific system. I say read-only because otherwise you'd be implying the very sort of system-segregation that should be avoided.

I think I'm just rambling at random at this point.

[Half Japanese]

I love the forums just the way they are. It's a place "to go and know," so to speak. I don't, see any problem with heavy promotion though. I know the feeling you get when something you started thrives and gets praise from others, and I expect that the DP staffers get that same sort of thrill from it all at times. I've had two friends sign up here (although, to be honest, they're more into new stuff), one stayed, one didn't. One seems to prefer the GameFAQs boards, and more power to him, but I don't like my posts getting buried under "rate my collection" or "omg XXXXX game is f'n great!!11!!" withing five minutes.

I think the board has a great group of mods who are very active and shut down and shuffle inappropriate or out of place topics if the need be in a very timely manner, so it's chances of becoming another Gamefaqs seems a bit slim to me. Also, the buying/selling forums is just fantastic, I've only been here about 3~4 months, but in that time I've already had about a half-dozen trades go through with no problems (other than a shipping mishap, which was quickly resolved), When someone gets screwed they let the others know about it, sticking up in a way you only find in a family or tight-knit community.

On another note, I'd have to say that keeping ONE game board for both classic and retro is best, because then you have to draw lines as to what's retro and what's new, and that always rubs someone the wrong way it seems, plus having both kinds of discussions on one board means more activity, which is a must for those that visit here several times a day (almost religiously). Then again, I haven't been here all that long, but I do try to contribute and help out whenever I can!

[zmweasel]

And this will only continue to grow, since I am actively pimping the forum in many subtle and not-so-subtle ways. Most of you probably found us as a result of that.

I found this site (partially) as a result of your big pimpin', and so I naturally feel you should continue to work your publicity beeotches. These forums have the best ratio of signal-to-noise I've ever found on a free website, and I've learned a LOT in my short time here. I've also engaged in a host of great debates with very intelligent people. This site has made me a more informed gamer and a better game journalist. I'm very happy to be here, and I feel everyone should have the opportunity to be DPed.

-- Z.

[Zaxxon]

But the thing is...DP is billed as a "classic" site, a "retro" site. What's "classic" or "retro" to us may be the 2600, dedicated Pong consoles, or Intellivision. What's "classic" or "retro" to someone else may indeed be the Genesis or SNES. I wasn't into those machines myself, but they're old-school to the players who grew up with 'em. In a mere matter of years, Playstation 1 will be "retro."

Yeah, I understand that but is DP going to define what DP considers classic or let every site visitor define it. If we're going to make the definition broad enough to include all but the latest generation of systems it's a meaningless term. I don't mind post-crash systems being discussed if they're not sooo mainstream and boring and the same info is available all over the net (game.com,Jaguar,SMS, Saturn vs. NES, Genesis)

[digitalpress]

It doesn't have to be old to be classic.

[Half Japanese]

It doesn't have to be old to be classic.

Word. :rocker:

I have some older games, but I find myself buying new titles on a more regular basis. Video games didn't stop in 1984! Although they didn't start in 1985 either. I think a lot of people are taking this simply as how THEY want to see DP, and that's not necessarily what's being asked. Suggestions, not demands! I like everything about the DP site, from the rarity lists to the reviews to Ariel Andrews :snuggle: !

[Raccoon Lad]

@zaxxon
While SMS info IS all over the net, MOST of it is out of date(circa 1997!), and alot of it is just plain WRONG.

*edit*
Wait, never mind, I read your post wrong.

[Raedon]

The only problem with getting bigger is every week or two someone will come in and ask the same questions over and over.

[Zaxxon]

@zaxxon
While SMS info IS all over the net, MOST of it is out of date(circa 1997!), and alot of it is just plain WRONG.

Yeah, there also used to be a bunch of good Saturn and TG-16 pages all over the net but most all seem to be now gone or long, long abandoned.

[maxlords]

But the thing is...DP is billed as a "classic" site, a "retro" site. What's "classic" or "retro" to us may be the 2600, dedicated Pong consoles, or Intellivision. What's "classic" or "retro" to someone else may indeed be the Genesis or SNES. I wasn't into those machines myself, but they're old-school to the players who grew up with 'em. In a mere matter of years, Playstation 1 will be "retro."

Exactly. I don't collect ANYTHING pre-NES at all myself. i don't even LIKE most pre-NES games, with the exception of a few fondly remembered C64 games. But I try to contribute where I can, with only the occasional outburst of stark raving lunacy. It's almost impossible to divide the site, and on top of that, if DP decides to stop pimping the site, then we won't NEED to. I think that's more of a "help, we have 10,000 registered posters" problem. But I think that if Dp grows exponentially, we'll HAVE to have heavy-handed modding....deleting "Game X RoX0R!!!!" threads completely and such. That sort of thing could be really crippling to the DP forums.

[tabbs]

I've been posting at www.neilgaiman.com now for years. I knew the owner of the site before Neil Gaiman actually owned it himself and jumped onto the boards there shortly after them going up and I had spent some time lurking.

After about 1 1/2 to 2 years, it started booming, alot of people drifted away, including me..

Those of us who drifted were part of the original crew.
Too many topics is something I noticed kills alot of boards, because it's just so much to keep up with . . .

www.neilgaiman.com has alot of members, but it's still a pretty tight knit community . . . Most of the core posters now are names I myself am just starting to learn of, a few remember me and are pleased with the return. Saddly however, I missed alot of history and feel a bit detached . . .

A growing board isn't a bad thing, www.neilgaiman.com has kept its worth.
Most of that however is due to our wonderful MODs, I can't say how important is it to have good MODs . . . honestly . . .

So, to all of you MODs here . . . even though I'm fresh meat and barely have a voice of my own yet . . . I'd like to thank you for obviously keeping this place a pleasant one to visit . . rock on!

[Balloon Fight]

It doesn't have to be old to be classic.
I like everything about the DP site, from the rarity lists to the reviews to Ariel Andrews :snuggle: !

Hell Yeah! :cheers: :-P :-P :-P
I actually like how it is right now, and i dont think it will ever turn into a spammers paradise. The mods are always on, and do a great job of keeping everyone under control. Plus i like seeing new faces occasionally and always seeing the oldies. :)

[RetroYoungen]

I like a big forum, that would mean more interesting people to talk to. But a small one is good too, that way it's a close-knit community where everybody knows everybody. Where is the middle ground? I have no idea. But I do like it a bit smaller, when it gets big you get people like on the GameFAQ boards, so big can be quite bad.

[Phosphor Dot Fossils]

One thing I'd like to see nipped in the butt is folks who just got here and go straight to the Battlezone. I don't know if there's any fair way to do it, but I'd suggest something akin to a "trial period" for the new folks, where, of all the non-game-related forums here, only Off-Topic is accessible. No BZ, no Pub, etc., ya know? Let 'em show that they can conduct themselves maturely before being given access to those areas. Generally, if they're goobers off the bat, they're probably going to be goobers permanently - though some of our very own have proven that axiom wrong.

I know this idea swerves dangerously close to being a bit elitist, and like I said, I'm not sure if it'd be fair. But if a total stranger enters your house, do you sit them down in the living room and talk to them first? Or just let them rummage through all your stuff?

Just a thought. I can think of as many reasons to implement it as I can to avoid it, so I'm sure everyone else will be at least as "iffy" as I.

[kainemaxwell]

This place is like Cheers- we all know each other's names and have grown over the years like a family too.

[punkoffgirl]

On the topic of promotion, I say why stop? It hasn't created an overwhelming wave of new members that we haven't been able to manage yet (I think the "Spring Cleaning" was worse :P ). And, taking into account the ways you're promoting it, I think it's aimed at the "right" people. People buying games/systems/etc off you get the card, people emailing you (maybe about games?) get the link, people buying things on eBay from you (almost certainly game related!), etc.
Yes, we've had problems with posters in the past, but nothing we couldn't handle! So I say, keep up the good work :)

[scooterb23]

I'm all for the forum growing as it has since I got here...I like it when new people come in, especially when they can be a positive force.

But the real reason I'm posting here...


XXX: Extreme Teletubbies Foosball

I am so there!!! When does this go on pre-order OMG WTF!!1!!!11

;)

Keep it up...I like it here :)

[calthaer]

As long as the overall tone & atmosphere remains the same, I don't care how many people there are here. Inherent in that statement is my opinion that the tone and atmosphere is not directly correlated to the number of people - just the type.

The problem with other message boards is either that they have too few mods or the fact that the mods are restricted by some sort of very broad, very far-reaching inclusiveness. This open-armed inclusiveness, IMO, prohibits them from being too aggressive in cutting down on the "noise" (incredibly stupid posts, personal attacks, etc.). They're trying to be everything to everyone and don't want to step on any toes so "teh kiddiez" rule the roost because nobody wants to put them in a playpen so that the adults can have a serious conversation.

I don't see that here.

[Dirty Tiger]

Ban any members who use numbers in their username......or animal names.

[vincewy]

Too many replies but I'll give me 2 cents.

Joe, keep the current size and there's no need to promote this forum any more, people at this point, who are really into classic and neo-classic (where I am) will find the way here. I've seen a few threads related to Neo-Geo degererated to NG.com types of flames, we all need to watch these out.

Else just let this forum grow at natural pace.

[Jorpho]

This place remains a madhouse when compared to the Classicgaming.com forums.

[jaydubnb]

Ban any members who use numbers in their username......or animal names.

Or DBZ or FFVII names LOL

[Dire 51]

Ban any members who use numbers in their username......or animal names.

And just why would I deserve a banning for having a number in my username, especially when it's related to a great shmup? Well?!?

Anyway, I think the place is great the way it is now. I've drifted away once or twice in the past, yet when I show up again, I was remembered and welcomed back. I like the close-knit, "family"-type atmosphere and I hope it never changes. :)

[Sotenga]

ALESTE FOREVER!!! :rocker:

I'm sure you guys would remember me if I were to take a hiatus right now. Not that I ever would. I'm here all the time. Everyone on here is such a nice guy... excluding the Battlezone, of course. I know I was a little bit of a jackass when I was still new, but you gotta admit that my behavior has improved. I'm just not the type of guy anyone could forget, and there's no way I'm forgetting anyone on here. Welcome to the DP family. :)

[Goodwill Hunter]

Hey Joe,

I know if I had created something this cool, I would want everyone and their brother to check it out, so I say promote away! I like seeing new people and the Mods don't seem to have any trouble keeping on top of the junk and double posts.

I remember the feeling of finding RGVC all those years ago and realizing I wasn't the only geek out there scouring thrifts and rummages for games. And as RGVC started to fade, I had a similar thrill finding the community here at DP.

I didn't realize how important this site was to me untill it crashed for a few days last month. I had phantom limb syndrome for a while, constantly checking back to a site that wasn't there. I think DP is an indispensible resource for people who are serious classic (and modern) gamers.

I think it would be a shame to hide all that DP has to offer from people just discovering this hobby now. So just go with your instincts Joe, they've obviously served you well so far.

Rich

[lendelin]

Size doesn't matter so much for the posters and readers becasue they are less interested in the quantity of posts and more in their character and quality; size matters much more for the management of the site.

Size doesn't matter as long as
a) the moderators stay reasonable
b) the age structure of the members doesn't change; since this is predominantly a game collector site, chances for changing the age structure with bigger size are slim.
c) b) is important for the qulaity and nature of the posts; guys with a good overview of games and experience discuss more intelligently present games and probs of the current videogame industry and address very different problems than young gamers.

If the age structure would change significantly and with it the emphasis on collecting, then you're in trouble; then you'll end up unintentionally with a gradually changing site.

If you advertise, target to 50% retro-gamers, and to 50% normal gamers of all ages; the nature of the site makes sure that that the amount of potential new "normal" gamers are much less than the potential ne retro-gamers; this way the age structure of the site won't change.