Sega Master System Versus Nintendo Entertainment System.

[UK WOMBLE]

I'll have to go SMS , same as a few others have said, I preferred it over the NES when I was a kid, some of my favourite games are on that system. :)

Now Im an adult (kind of.. :o ) and I have both , and its still the SMS , wins hands down ! :D

Without couting up its obvious theres more votes for the NES, and I understand that, the software catalogue for it is huge, but what I wonder is how a vote would break down just for us pal people, as the SMS was far far bigger over here than in the US.

Si

[Pedro Lambrini]

I know that the NES has tons more games in the world and I know that it has Mario and Metroid and Zelda (yadda, yadda, blah...). But my heart is with the SMS. After years of abuse my machine still isn't yellow and the boxes for the games are still immaculate. I can plug the games into my GameGear and take them wherever I like (with lots of batteries, of course!). My collection looks much better on the shelves and it warms my cockles just to look at! The carts are wee and dinky and I very rarely have to blow on them. And even if I lost all my games I could still switch on my SMS II and play Alex Kidd! :D

As for the games themselves, well over here there were masses of them (including things like the Ultima series) and I have lost years to them. The very first game I ever completed was Mickey and the Castle of Illusion on the SMS - you can't ever get that again from another machine...

I love Nintendo to bits but I have to say that I have never felt much for the ol' NES. Don't get me wrong, I do like it but I do get pissed off when the thing doesn't work 80% of the time when I just want a quick blast of something - my SMS is always there for me just waiting quietly for me to take a quick fix before I go to catch the bus somewhere :lovin:

[SegaAges]

dude, the sms rocks. i need another, but i still enjoyed it while i had it.

[TRM]

But let us look at the following:

Does the Sega Master System have the following:

-A keyboard with teaching software
-Capabilities to have modem play
-Capabilities for the internet
-Pseudo 16 bit graphics

I don't know much about the Sega Master System's unreleased projects, but there was some really cool shit being developed for the NES. When pushed to the max, the NES could do some really amazing things.

Then there are games like Ultimate Stuntman and Crossbow...those games had awesome graphics...

[TRM]

People always use the software excuse as a reason why the NES did better then the SMS over in the US. It should be the quality of the software not the quantity of it. I mean, there were around 100 some unlicensed NES games, plus all of the licensed crap (Color a dinosaur) for the NES...this quickly adds up. If you only count the good games, the NES library of titles quickly gets cut in half.

The Sega Master System has less games, so they should be better, right? Umm...wrong...

[ApolloBoy]

I like 'em both.

'Nuff said.

[Wavelflack]

But let us look at the following:

Does the Sega Master System have the following:

-A keyboard with teaching software
-Capabilities to have modem play
-Capabilities for the internet
-Pseudo 16 bit graphics


"Pseudo 16 bit graphics"? Would that be the same as "8 bit graphics"? The only thing I've ever heard of that was supposed to approach the "16 bit look" was some Color Dreams title with a coprocessor onboard. The story is that the chip made the game too expensive, and the NES was in it's waning days anyway, and the project was scrapped. I think most people can agree that SMS graphically outperformed NES.

As for "Does the Sega Master System have the following:

-A keyboard with teaching software
-Capabilities to have modem play
-Capabilities for the internet"

No, it doesn't have a keyboard with teaching software. And???
The NES also didn't have 3D glasses (with 3D software), a trackball, or a cool looking lightgun that is black. SMS also didn't have the Power Pad! It wasn't powerful enough to handle it! :)

I didn't realize that a system's peripherals were an indication of it's power.

Concerning the modem and internet: Nothing was developed for the SMS, but if you look underneath te system, you'll see a covered port. The access was there, but Sega was probably amazed and overwhelmed by the tremendous success of Nintendo's modem and online banking network (ya-HOO!), and decided not to bother.

Finally, in reference to the next post, no one argues that the number of games is what made NES beat the SMS. It's the number of developers, and their exclusivity agreements to Nintendo. Look what happened in the next phase of the console wars--developers were unleashed, and Sega won (or tied, depending on who you talk to).

[anagrama]

I love these entirely unresolvable arguements.
Anyway, I'm right and anyone who disagrees with me is wrong. Simple.

[Raccoon Lad]

FYI, the sms had an unreleased disc drive peripheral, and the PREDECESSOR to the SMS had an optional Keyboard and educational software.

Did the NES have an optional drawing tablet?

No, case closed, the NES is weaker than the Channel F.



LOLZ! LOL

I hate this thread, it just brings out the fan boi's.

More facts have been skewed in this thread by fan boys than by the entire Republican party.

[TRM]

But let us look at the following:

Does the Sega Master System have the following:

-A keyboard with teaching software
-Capabilities to have modem play
-Capabilities for the internet
-Pseudo 16 bit graphics


"Pseudo 16 bit graphics"? Would that be the same as "8 bit graphics"? The only thing I've ever heard of that was supposed to approach the "16 bit look" was some Color Dreams title with a coprocessor onboard. The story is that the chip made the game too expensive, and the NES was in it's waning days anyway, and the project was scrapped. I think most people can agree that SMS graphically outperformed NES.

As for "Does the Sega Master System have the following:

-A keyboard with teaching software
-Capabilities to have modem play
-Capabilities for the internet"

No, it doesn't have a keyboard with teaching software. And???
The NES also didn't have 3D glasses (with 3D software), a trackball, or a cool looking lightgun that is black. SMS also didn't have the Power Pad! It wasn't powerful enough to handle it! :)

I didn't realize that a system's peripherals were an indication of it's power.

Concerning the modem and internet: Nothing was developed for the SMS, but if you look underneath te system, you'll see a covered port. The access was there, but Sega was probably amazed and overwhelmed by the tremendous success of Nintendo's modem and online banking network (ya-HOO!), and decided not to bother.

Finally, in reference to the next post, no one argues that the number of games is what made NES beat the SMS. It's the number of developers, and their exclusivity agreements to Nintendo. Look what happened in the next phase of the console wars--developers were unleashed, and Sega won (or tied, depending on who you talk to).

In reference to the "Hellraiser" cartridge. 1991 was the waning year for the Nintendo? I don't think so...


In regards to the peripherals. Nintendo didn't have a black light gun, but they did have a western six-shooter.

Rad Racer had glasses for 3-D games ;)

True, peripherals do not measure the total power of a system. However, they do show a system being pushed to the max.

I remember the TMNT demo for the NES, that some guy made, had a near perfect copy of the TMNT theme from the TV show..vocals and all, if I can recollect correctly.

I was not refering to their banking network. I was refering to Baton's Teleplay modem, which allowed cross-platform network gaming between NES, Sega Genesis, and Super Nintendo.

The graphics on the Sega Master System may look better then the graphics on some of the earlier Nintendo games...however, toward the end, things even out a bit. I may have to do a full comparison of Sega Master System, NES, and Atari 7800.

[TRM]

When I said keyboard, I am refering to musical keyboard, not typing. I don't think Master System had Miracle piano, did it? I know SNES, NES, PC, and Genny did.

[ApolloBoy]

I hate this thread, it just brings out the fan boi's.

More facts have been skewed in this thread by fan boys than by the entire Republican party.

Can anyone say hypocrasy? x_x

[Jasoco]

I hate this thread, it just brings out the fan boi's.

More facts have been skewed in this thread by fan boys than by the entire Republican party.

Can anyone say hypocrasy? x_x
I can, and I can spell it correctly too.

[Wavelflack]

But let us look at the following:

Does the Sega Master System have the following:

-A keyboard with teaching software
-Capabilities to have modem play
-Capabilities for the internet
-Pseudo 16 bit graphics


"Pseudo 16 bit graphics"? Would that be the same as "8 bit graphics"? The only thing I've ever heard of that was supposed to approach the "16 bit look" was some Color Dreams title with a coprocessor onboard. The story is that the chip made the game too expensive, and the NES was in it's waning days anyway, and the project was scrapped. I think most people can agree that SMS graphically outperformed NES.

As for "Does the Sega Master System have the following:

-A keyboard with teaching software
-Capabilities to have modem play
-Capabilities for the internet"

No, it doesn't have a keyboard with teaching software. And???
The NES also didn't have 3D glasses (with 3D software), a trackball, or a cool looking lightgun that is black. SMS also didn't have the Power Pad! It wasn't powerful enough to handle it! :)

I didn't realize that a system's peripherals were an indication of it's power.

Concerning the modem and internet: Nothing was developed for the SMS, but if you look underneath te system, you'll see a covered port. The access was there, but Sega was probably amazed and overwhelmed by the tremendous success of Nintendo's modem and online banking network (ya-HOO!), and decided not to bother.

Finally, in reference to the next post, no one argues that the number of games is what made NES beat the SMS. It's the number of developers, and their exclusivity agreements to Nintendo. Look what happened in the next phase of the console wars--developers were unleashed, and Sega won (or tied, depending on who you talk to).

In reference to the "Hellraiser" cartridge. 1991 was the waning year for the Nintendo? I don't think so...


In regards to the peripherals. Nintendo didn't have a black light gun, but they did have a western six-shooter.

Rad Racer had glasses for 3-D games ;)

True, peripherals do not measure the total power of a system. However, they do show a system being pushed to the max.

I remember the TMNT demo for the NES, that some guy made, had a near perfect copy of the TMNT theme from the TV show..vocals and all, if I can recollect correctly.

I was not refering to their banking network. I was refering to Baton's Teleplay modem, which allowed cross-platform network gaming between NES, Sega Genesis, and Super Nintendo.

The graphics on the Sega Master System may look better then the graphics on some of the earlier Nintendo games...however, toward the end, things even out a bit. I may have to do a full comparison of Sega Master System, NES, and Atari 7800.




This sort of thing is so much fun!

A. "In reference to the "Hellraiser" cartridge. 1991 was the waning year for the Nintendo? I don't think so..."

I didn't say 1991 was the waning year for NES, but that it was in it's waning days. In other words, it was nearing the end of it's life, as opposed to the beginning or middle. 1985-1993 is eight years (U.S. life). 1991 would be 3/4 of it's lifespan stateside, or 4/5 of it's total life. Waning days. SNES was right there waiting to happen, and there was no sense in adding expensive hardware to the cart in an attempt to create "16 bit graphics" when the real thing was right around the corner. This was the justification I remember hearing, like it or not. Of course, CD collapsed into Wisdom Tree and made the whole thing academic anyway. Religious idiots don't need fancy graphics or technology to impress them into purchases.

B. "In regards to the peripherals. Nintendo didn't have a black light gun, but they did have a western six-shooter."

I was being facetious here (among other places). Trying to illustrate how meaningless the Miracle keyboard is when debating which system is more powerful.

C. "Rad Racer had glasses for 3-D games ;)"

Indeed! Worldrunner as well! Every once in awhile, you can count on Nintendo for state of the art technology. :)

BM. "I remember the TMNT demo for the NES, that some guy made, had a near perfect copy of the TMNT theme from the TV show..vocals and all, if I can recollect correctly."

I remember a game called Quadrun. Anyway, I have not heard or seen this, but sampled sound does not really impress me. Particularly so if this is a recent project, in the age where efficient compression routines have been developed. Not to be a killjoy or anything...

VX.- "I was not refering to their banking network. I was refering to Baton's Teleplay modem, which allowed cross-platform network gaming between NES, Sega Genesis, and Super Nintendo."

Oh, yes! TERRAN WARS!
Nothing ever came of this, did it? The one game that was designed for it never came out (to my knowledge). Do you think that the exclusion of the SMS from the lineup was due to technical limitations? Or perhaps, just maybe, the SMS was simply not a viable platform anymore? I think I saw the Teleplay ads in EGM in 1993 or so. I don't think SMS was even in Visions at that point.

B-12.- " I may have to do a full comparison of Sega Master System, NES, and Atari 7800"

I hope you don't suffer a heart attack and seizure from surprise when you learn that you already established the order of superiority.


Fun fun FUN!

[Ed Oscuro]

FYI, the sms had an unreleased disc drive peripheral, and the PREDECESSOR to the SMS had an optional Keyboard and educational software.
Aye, the SK-1100 (matches the SG-1000 ][ unit in style), and the SC-3000. I've bought one of each, incidentially :P

There's also a SG-1000 "base station" for all your programming needs.

These peripherals are great for a collector like me, but aren't - strictly speaking - meant for gaming.

On the whole, the other SMS peripherals strike me as being counterparts to the Nintendo stuff - but they didn't sell all the pretentious garbage (DDR mats without the rythmn or music? Hello Bandai!) Nintendo did. No NES Advantage counterpart either, though.

[CRV]

[quote=Raccoon Lad]On the whole, the other SMS peripherals strike me as being counterparts to the Nintendo stuff - but they didn't sell all the pretentious garbage (DDR mats without the rythmn or music? Hello Bandai!) Nintendo did. No NES Advantage counterpart either, though.

One thing that WAS better on the SMS was the Light Phaser and most of the games for it. Try convincing me that Duck Hunt's better than Safari Hunt...

[CRV]

Sorry about the previous quote being screwed up...

[TRM]

But let us look at the following:

Does the Sega Master System have the following:

-A keyboard with teaching software
-Capabilities to have modem play
-Capabilities for the internet
-Pseudo 16 bit graphics


"Pseudo 16 bit graphics"? Would that be the same as "8 bit graphics"? The only thing I've ever heard of that was supposed to approach the "16 bit look" was some Color Dreams title with a coprocessor onboard. The story is that the chip made the game too expensive, and the NES was in it's waning days anyway, and the project was scrapped. I think most people can agree that SMS graphically outperformed NES.

As for "Does the Sega Master System have the following:

-A keyboard with teaching software
-Capabilities to have modem play
-Capabilities for the internet"

No, it doesn't have a keyboard with teaching software. And???
The NES also didn't have 3D glasses (with 3D software), a trackball, or a cool looking lightgun that is black. SMS also didn't have the Power Pad! It wasn't powerful enough to handle it! :)

I didn't realize that a system's peripherals were an indication of it's power.

Concerning the modem and internet: Nothing was developed for the SMS, but if you look underneath te system, you'll see a covered port. The access was there, but Sega was probably amazed and overwhelmed by the tremendous success of Nintendo's modem and online banking network (ya-HOO!), and decided not to bother.

Finally, in reference to the next post, no one argues that the number of games is what made NES beat the SMS. It's the number of developers, and their exclusivity agreements to Nintendo. Look what happened in the next phase of the console wars--developers were unleashed, and Sega won (or tied, depending on who you talk to).

In reference to the "Hellraiser" cartridge. 1991 was the waning year for the Nintendo? I don't think so...


In regards to the peripherals. Nintendo didn't have a black light gun, but they did have a western six-shooter.

Rad Racer had glasses for 3-D games ;)

True, peripherals do not measure the total power of a system. However, they do show a system being pushed to the max.

I remember the TMNT demo for the NES, that some guy made, had a near perfect copy of the TMNT theme from the TV show..vocals and all, if I can recollect correctly.

I was not refering to their banking network. I was refering to Baton's Teleplay modem, which allowed cross-platform network gaming between NES, Sega Genesis, and Super Nintendo.

The graphics on the Sega Master System may look better then the graphics on some of the earlier Nintendo games...however, toward the end, things even out a bit. I may have to do a full comparison of Sega Master System, NES, and Atari 7800.




This sort of thing is so much fun!

A. "In reference to the "Hellraiser" cartridge. 1991 was the waning year for the Nintendo? I don't think so..."

I didn't say 1991 was the waning year for NES, but that it was in it's waning days. In other words, it was nearing the end of it's life, as opposed to the beginning or middle. 1985-1993 is eight years (U.S. life). 1991 would be 3/4 of it's lifespan stateside, or 4/5 of it's total life. Waning days. SNES was right there waiting to happen, and there was no sense in adding expensive hardware to the cart in an attempt to create "16 bit graphics" when the real thing was right around the corner. This was the justification I remember hearing, like it or not. Of course, CD collapsed into Wisdom Tree and made the whole thing academic anyway. Religious idiots don't need fancy graphics or technology to impress them into purchases.

B. "In regards to the peripherals. Nintendo didn't have a black light gun, but they did have a western six-shooter."

I was being facetious here (among other places). Trying to illustrate how meaningless the Miracle keyboard is when debating which system is more powerful.

C. "Rad Racer had glasses for 3-D games ;)"

Indeed! Worldrunner as well! Every once in awhile, you can count on Nintendo for state of the art technology. :)

BM. "I remember the TMNT demo for the NES, that some guy made, had a near perfect copy of the TMNT theme from the TV show..vocals and all, if I can recollect correctly."

I remember a game called Quadrun. Anyway, I have not heard or seen this, but sampled sound does not really impress me. Particularly so if this is a recent project, in the age where efficient compression routines have been developed. Not to be a killjoy or anything...

VX.- "I was not refering to their banking network. I was refering to Baton's Teleplay modem, which allowed cross-platform network gaming between NES, Sega Genesis, and Super Nintendo."

Oh, yes! TERRAN WARS!
Nothing ever came of this, did it? The one game that was designed for it never came out (to my knowledge). Do you think that the exclusion of the SMS from the lineup was due to technical limitations? Or perhaps, just maybe, the SMS was simply not a viable platform anymore? I think I saw the Teleplay ads in EGM in 1993 or so. I don't think SMS was even in Visions at that point.

B-12.- " I may have to do a full comparison of Sega Master System, NES, and Atari 7800"

I hope you don't suffer a heart attack and seizure from surprise when you learn that you already established the order of superiority.


Fun fun FUN!

Wow, wow, super wow. The NES's lifetime was until 1995. 1994 if you only count licensed releases.

Anyway, the Teleplay Modem had 3 games actually developed for it, and they were all much better then they looked in the magazine adverts.

Nah, the comparison rate will go like this: NES, SMS, A7800.

Super Nintendo pretty much kicked the Sega Genesis out of the water, too. I remember buying a SNES title, then buying the SG counterpart. I would always be so disapointed. See, Sega had this problem. They would create advanced technology, but when Nintendo would come to match it, the technology would look so dated that they(Sega) didn't have a chance.

[Cauterize]

...this discussion is gonna end in tears!!! i stay neutral!

[anagrama]

Wow, wow, super wow. The NES's lifetime was until 1995. 1994 if you only count licensed releases.


Wow, wow, super wow - there were European SMS games released until 1996 and it's still available in Brazil NOW! :D

[Cauterize]

Wow, wow, super wow. The NES's lifetime was until 1995. 1994 if you only count licensed releases.


Wow, wow, super wow - there were European SMS games released until 1996 and it's still available in Brazil NOW! :D

hehe i love your enthusiasm mixed with sarcasm/piss taking!

[anagrama]

Super Nintendo pretty much kicked the Sega Genesis out of the water, too.

That is an even more spurious arguement, and one for a different thread entirely.
What exactly are you basing that on anyway? Worldwide sales? System lifetime? Obviously not, since you claim the SNES kicked the Genesis out of the water.



I remember buying a SNES title, then buying the SG counterpart. I would always be so disapointed.

One word: FIFA.

[Hep038]

And I will add one form this side of the pond..... Madden. Sports on the SNES were not even close to the Genny. Its like the players on the SNES were running in mud.

Waiting for the post that say sports games dont count because HARDCORE GAMERS dont play sports games they play RPG's!!!!!!! LOL

[Habeeb Hamusta]

Hmm...I like them both. NES has many great games...but so does SMS. Although SMS is a better system and i give points to SEGA for making a better system than Nintendo at that time.

[Jasoco]

From now on, could you people STOP QUOTING HUGE FREAKING POSTS!? Just TRIM them. There's no reason to keep every quoted message from the start. Just quote the most recent and delete the rest as you two are the only ones even fighting about it. The rest of us don't need to scroll down past your huge posts and the server could benefit from the space saved by not including the other stuff. PLEASE! :o

[Algol]

From an American standpoint, NES wins on both quality and quantity. I know there were much more SMS games in Europe, but if you were trying to decide which to buy new 15 years ago, NES would most likely win.

[Black_Tiger]

I think that too many people know the NES better than the SMS and dismiss the SMS 'cuz it had less good games' or 'only has a few great titles'...

-when in fact they simply don't know enough about the SMS and it's HUGE library stacked with quality titles.

I don't hate the NES or think its bad. I love it and the Famicom.

But the SMS will always be one of my very fav consoles(along with PCE, INTV & SATURN -go figure).

There are just too many more games that are more memorable for me.

Games like Fantasy Zone's, Miracle Warriors, Vanished Omes, Zillion, Ultima IV, Wonderboy, Miracle World, Monster Land, WBIII, R-Type, etc...

I love the SMS much more than Megadrive/Genesis and it defined SEGA to me(even more than the arcades I frequented).

Alex Kidd MW will always stick with me more than any Mario title(I like them too).

And I was one of the few lucky bastards to get to enjoy pretty much every title for both platforms from the get go all the way through each system's life span.

[cyberfluxor]

Personally, and by living in the USA, the Master System is really nice and blows the NES away but with it easier than cutting through jellow with a hot knife to find great, cheap NES games, I feel it has won on the long run for replay value. It's rough finding SMS games, although they are on Ebay and other online auctions and stores. I can go to any store that sells used games and come across a NES cart. But don't get me wrong, I grew up on a SMS and love it to death and it's games, just the NES is so much easier to get things for now in days.

[7th lutz]

In Games in the United States, I have to say nes.

If imports count I say sms. The sms had great games overall and so did the nes. The amount of games the nes is bigger then the sms in the u.s in terms of more games and great games.


I have so many favorite sms games that I could create a top 25 easy.

[Dr. Morbis]

IIf imports count I say sms. The sms had great games overall and so did the nes.
If imports count, Famicom blows euro sms out of the water. Not...even...close.

[7th lutz]

IIf imports count I say sms. The sms had great games overall and so did the nes.
If imports count, Famicom blows euro sms out of the water. Not...even...close.

I was going by what I have. I don't have any Famicom games. I have about 5 to 10 euro sms games. I over 100 nes games.

[TheGam3r]

NES Rocks like this smiley band : :band:

[Sinnbox]

Can you guys help me with some info...When I was young all my friends had NES's I had never heard of a SMS untill I got one in a box of Atari's at a garage sale last year. Was the SMS not in some stores? I remember seeing NES stuff at stores, but Genesis was the first time i ever saw a SEGA.

[Zap!]

I am backwards, since I always prefered the Sega Master System, then switched and favored the SNES over the Genesis.

[Zap!]

Can you guys help me with some info...When I was young all my friends had NES's I had never heard of a SMS untill I got one in a box of Atari's at a garage sale last year. Was the SMS not in some stores? I remember seeing NES stuff at stores, but Genesis was the first time i ever saw a SEGA.

Maybe not "some" tiny mom and pop stores, but I got my SMS in 1987 and got new games all the time in Toys R' Us and Crazy Eddie. Kay Bee too.

[WelcomeToTheNextLevel]

Here's the thing, SMS is more advanced technically than NES, especially in some foreign countries where they got FM sound. SMS had more colors, more memory on the carts, higher resolution graphics, and real 3D graphics with Sega Scope 3D. The game library PERCENTAGE wise was better - Sega had Alex Kidd in Miracle World, which was better than Mario 1, Out Run, Thunder Blade, Phantasy Star and many other triple A titles. They had duds too (many say the "Great" sports games were not great). In the early 3rd gen (pre 1989), they were neck and neck on how good they were.

NES had a huge library of games, and the graphics and sound eventually caught up to how good the SMS games were. Not to mention the countless Nintendo and third party titles that were great and made the system what it was. That said there was a lot of crap that made it onto the NES. Silver Surfer, Simon's Quest, Milon's Secret Castle... the list goes on and on. Still in 1989 and later the NES beats SMS by sheer volume of good games.

[CharlesE17]

Never really played SMS... One day maybe?

I will say the NES is better because I own one and I love it. :ass:

[theclaw]

Let's not forget the video output lines. In terms of US hardware SMS provides RGB. Compared to NES having composite.
Sure SMS2 and NES2 are exceptions. But both were at the tail end of their system's life.

How was retail SMS distribution though?
We know systems like TG16 were practically sent to the slaughterhouse for much-needed nationwide recognition, through focus on urban areas.

[Zap!]

The game library PERCENTAGE wise was better - Sega had Alex Kidd in Miracle World, which was better than Mario 1..

I said the same exact thing here (http://forum.digitpress.com/forum/showthread.php?118781-Super-Mario-Bros-vs-Alex-Kidd-in-Miracle-World&p=1393494&viewfull=1) several years ago, and kinda got blasted for it. I still stand by it, however. AKIMW is the better game.

[Peonpiate]

Mario bros 3 by itself sets the NES as the better system imo. There are great games and then theres THAT game, a stroke of magic if there ever was one, and especially for its time to have been released.

[Greg2600]

There was also Zelda, which was so popular SEGA essentially copied it with Golden Ax Warrior. SMS distribution was initially handled by SEGA in 1986, and it was available. However, they had a pittance to spend on marketing. They turned it over to Tonka, who did a hideous job. Ironically, SEGA probably did best with SMS after the Genesis struck big. At that point, retailers were friendly with them, and they released quite a few downgraded Genesis hits on SMS (Sonic, Mikey Mouse, Joe Montana, etc.). SMS had issues though, their peripherals (controllers, light gun, 3D glasses) were not durable. And of course, the game labels and boxes were pathetically void of artwork.

[Zap!]

Mario bros 3 by itself sets the NES as the better system imo. There are great games and then theres THAT game, a stroke of magic if there ever was one, and especially for its time to have been released.
A fatal flaw however is the lack of a save feature like Super Mario World. Phantasy Star to me gives the SMS the edge.

[Tanooki]

Agreed with SMB3, it's too long for its own good so I tend to lean on using the SNES version, or the NES via the Retron5 or PC emulator to save as I go. YOu just can't get the time to experience SMB3 without just whistle hopping. I don't think a battery in a RPG of all things gives the SMS the edge at all, that's just personal preference. I've had both, I really still prefer PStar1 over the others too, but the SMS has some annoying holes only high price UK and ugly priced Brazilian games can fill. Either way both are nice, both have some forms of weaknesses, one realistically more than the other, and in preference that too.

[Peonpiate]

A fatal flaw however is the lack of a save feature like Super Mario World. Phantasy Star to me gives the SMS the edge.


True, but I always considered the warp whistles sort of a compromise for that. A real save feature would have been great though and you would figure that a AAA title like that would have had it.

[Greg2600]

A fatal flaw however is the lack of a save feature like Super Mario World. Phantasy Star to me gives the SMS the edge.

They had warp zones though. Phantasy Star is great, but RPGs don't sell systems.

[bb_hood]

SMB3 is not too long, if anything its not long enough. The whistles are easy to get, in a few minutes you can warp to any level in the game.
The NES has way more and way better RPGs than the sms.

[7th lutz]

While the NES has way more RPGs than the SMS, Not a lot RPGs on the NES you can say are better than Phantasy Star. Phantasy Star is considered one the greatest rpgs from the 8 bit era. I consider it stronger than the first two Dragon Warrior games at least. Dragon Warrior 3 and 4 does come close to Phantasy Star and Final Fantasy, but nothing else to me that was released in the united states on the NES in terms of turn based RPGS.

[Tanooki]

I agree that Phantasy Star was one of the absolute best of the 8bit RPGs, perhaps it's unfair, but I think Dragon Warrior IV trumps it and Final Fantasy. The game was a very late release, easily could and should have been a near launch SNES title (like FF2/4j was.) There's so much in that one RPG between all those mini RPGs that make up the first four chapters, then the huge one where the parties combine.

[Zap!]

The only 8-bit console RPG that is better than Phantasy Star is Ys: Book 1 and 2 for the Turbo Grafx CD-ROM, and it's stretching it a bit to call it 8-bit.

[Tanooki]

If Ys were an RPG I might agree with that, but it isnt. Its as much an RPG as Zelda or Golden Axe Warrior is. I mentioned DW4 because it is designed like a 16bit earlier 90s RPG, it just happened to be stuck on old hardware. I never did understand why that never was on the SFC like 5 and 6.

[bb_hood]

In my opinion, Final Fantasy, DW2,3,4 and Sweet Home are all better RPGs than Phantasy Star.

[Tanooki]

I think Master System fans hang off that as it was the only good/great RPG franchise Sega had in the 8/16bit era. It's a good series, but it's not without its flaws, though I don't agree that Dragon Warrior 2 is better as that game is just rough.

[7th lutz]

I think Master System fans hang off that as it was the only good/great RPG franchise Sega had in the 8/16bit era. It's a good series, but it's not without its flaws, though I don't agree that Dragon Warrior 2 is better as that game is just rough.

I agree that Phantasy Star series has flaws since there was translation issues and other issues with the series. I actually don't think any the Genesis Phantasy Star Games is in the same league as Chrono Trigger, Final Fantasy 6. I didn't say Super Mario Rpg since I never played it.

To me Phantasy Star 3 is the biggest flawed game of the series although I loved the multiple Generations concept. That needs to be blamed on the fact there was different Development team for Phantasy Star 3 compare to Phantasy Star 1,2 and 4. Phantasy Star 3 the development responsible for the Golden Axe port on the Genesis and the team for Phantasy Star 3 only 1 person from that time that worked with Phantasy Star 2.

My issue with 2 is the encounter rates although the character development outside the main character was about non exist. Phantasy Star 2 end was a bigger shocker and the first game console RPG that had a death from a member in your party.

Phantasy Star 4 was great in Character development, good graphics, and good battle system. The only issues that game had having the same boss multiple times in one game despite its past as a final boss in the first Phantasy games, and the other issue is the game to me seemed easier than Phantasy Star 1 and 2.

[Greg2600]

Even if SMS has better RPG's, it's library doesn't stand up to NES in other genres. Sega knew this, they couldn't get the publishers on their side due to Nintendo's exclusivity agreements. Additionally, SEGA tried to counter with arcade ports primarily of their own stuff. Those attempts were often not good. For every Fantasy Zone, you had Altered Beast or Thunderblade. The SMS was just not powerful enough for those titles. Something only Tengen seemed to screw up on the NES, unlicensed of course.

[Tanooki]

I've only played the first two Phantasy Star games enough, the third was awful to the point I quit pretty quickly on it. I used to have this package on the GBA that had all 3 titles and it blew, the other two I've owned originals of, never had the 4th one. I always liked PS1 over PS2 because as you said, the encounter rate -- it just gets infuriating, much like the DC/GC game Skies of Arcadia, it was so overkill every few steps they fixed it on the GC due to all the complaints. I heard PS4 was fantastic and really a nice topper to the series for the hardware, just like DW4 was for NES. I thought it was entirely unreasonable for them to leave that off that GBA collection.

[celerystalker]

I just read this thread, and I'm a little stunned that anyone would objectively try to say the SMS is better than NES in game library comparison. I have just about the entire US library. It's weak.

Phantasy Star was a marvel in its time, but have you played it lately? Those first-person dungeons with one wall set are pretty rough if you don't go online and print out maps. As a kid, I would never have graphed that all out when Final Fantasy was out just a little later. I like the game. I even played through the PS2 Sega Ages remake. It's not as good as Final Fantasy or Dragon Warrior III or IV. I actually think Miracle Warriors is as good on SMS.

Alex Kidd better than any of the three main NES Marios? No way. As a kid, the Janken match bosses were such a random thing it was ridiculous. When I came back to it later and finished, I still really like it, but seriously, have you finished it? The difficulty curve jump in the last level is an absurd departure. The game is wildly unbalanced.

Light guns... that is where SMS rocks the NES. 2 player Gangster Town shames anything NES. Freedom Force, Hogan's Alley, Wild Gunman, Mechanized Attack, and To the Earth combined can't touch it. Safari Hunt whoops Duck Hunt, Shooting Gallery is better than Barker Bill's Trick Shooting, and Rescue Mission, Rambo III, and Missile Defense are entertaining as well.

Shooters-in the US, Power Strike and Fantasy Zone are about all that don't suck. Give me Gradius, Life Force, Gun Nac, Zanac, Guardian Legend's shooter areas, etc.

Adventure: I love Golvellius. I like the 2 NES Zeldas better. Golden Axe Warrior is OK, but I'll take Crystalis. Aztec Adventure sucks, so I'll take Legacy of the Wizard and Faxanadu. Zillion is NOT Metroid. It's Impossible Mission II at best. Goonies II, Battle of Olympus, Dr Chaos, Rygar, and Milon's Secret Castle widen the gap to distances Spellcaster and Alf can't bridge. Wonder Boy III does rule. I just like Kid Icarus, Spiritual Warfare (I do like it... what? I can like it...), Simon's Quest, and Faria, too.

The best of the best SMS games can compare somewhat well to some of the best NES games, but there are just too manymore on NES to keep it fair. Even if Alex Kidd's games were as good as Mario's, and they aren't, Kirby, Kid Klown, Kiwi Kraze, Toki, Castlevanias, Contras, Rush 'n Attack, Adventure Islands, Bonk, and dozens more overload the scale. You could take the "pound for pound" position, but personally, I wouldn't want to be betting on Penguin Land, James Buster Douglas, and Lord of the Sword to carry me into a fight that makes Captain Skyhawk start to look good.

I like my Master System, but there's a reason it never sold great. Complaining about Nintendo's unfair practices at the time won't make Mega Man retroactively appear on the System. History is what it is, and it left the system's library too soft to compete. These two aren't in the same league, and the Master System is no Genesis. I think if someone posted an SNES vs CD-i thread, some people would pop out to back the CD-i. I can imagine it now... "CD-i has three Zeldas to the SNES' one! Hotel Mario is better than Super Mario World. Math Blaster and Mario's learning games are schooled by CD-i's edutainment software!"

I'd love a consolation prize thread, like 3DO vs Jaguar or CD-i vs LaserActive. Jaguar CD vs 32X... I wanna see somebody arguing BattleMorph vs Shadow Squadron, damn it!

[7th lutz]

I just read this thread, and I'm a little stunned that anyone would objectively try to say the SMS is better than NES in game library comparison. I have just about the entire US library. It's weak.

Phantasy Star was a marvel in its time, but have you played it lately? Those first-person dungeons with one wall set are pretty rough if you don't go online and print out maps. As a kid, I would never have graphed that all out when Final Fantasy was out just a little later. I like the game. I even played through the PS2 Sega Ages remake. It's not as good as Final Fantasy or Dragon Warrior III or IV. I actually think Miracle Warriors is as good on SMS.


I bought the Sega Master System around 2000 when I was a college student. I first played Phantasy Star 1 in the early 2000's. I last played the game around 2010. I had no problems with the game since I have my computer. I always depended on a map for Phantasy Star the SMS and Phantasy 2 for the Genesis.

During the 8 bit era, I played Atari 2600 and Atari 7800 games. The SMS game library is way better than the 7800's game library without counting the homebrew Atari 7800 games.

I got a NES in 1991 and a Genesis in 92. The NES is one of the best game libraries to me, but the SMS to me is underrated since I looked at the European and Brazil SMS games. The SMS being region free helps out for European and Brazil games that the US didn't in terms of making my game library bigger.

You don't have tell me that the NES has the better game library in the United States because it the worst kept secret as a person that owns a 7800,NES, and SMS. I own US, European, and Brazil SMS games. I am still after more oversea games for the SMS.

The European and Brazil SMS Library is stronger than US. In terms of Imports right now for the SMS from Europe and Brazil, I have Aladdin, Baku Baku, Ariel the Little Mermaid, Asterix, Asterix the Secret mission, Bonkers Wax Up, Cheese Cat-Astrophe Staring Speedy, Gauntlet, Jurassic Park, Klax, Mercs, Mortal Kombat 2, Pacmania, Scramble Spirits, Sonic 2, The incredible Hulk, The Lucky Duck Caper Starring Donald Duck, The Simpsons: Bart Vs the World, The Smurfs, Ultima IV, X-Men: Mojo World. My favorites from an import side are Aladdin, Baku Baku, the 2 asterix games, Gaunlet, Klax, Mercs, Pacmania, and The Lucky Duck Caper Starring Donald Duck.

[Tanooki]

I've had 2 SMS systems before. One was in the early 2000s and lasted about 3 years (victim of unemployment/underemployment great collection die off) with a load of games everything all CIB and pretty and the system too. Prior to that I had never seen one except at one friends house and used it a few times to play some Sega arcade ports like Shinobi, Afterburner, and Fantasy Zone. I then got another and kept it for nearly 2 years but sold it too as with the kid keeping so much around was a bad idea with no time for it. I don't have kiddy nostalgia tingles about the system and never did. THat's why I know I believe what I do that the system was a fairly quality piece of hardware with some nice games, but at the same time it had some seriously glaring problems on the system from the dumb pause/start button on the deck to the multitude of poor games it had outside of Sega entries in a lot of cases. It's not entirely fair though to say poor because we in the US got screwed by Tonka and Sega while the PAL market and Brazil by far more got some stunning stuff. I wasn't even aware with my first system that PAL games worked on the thing and I had like 30-40 games I loved for it, the second go around I bought the stuff that still played well but had a good healthy split of some fantastic UK releases which kept things fresh.

The SMS was deservedly the second best system on the market, and I agree the 7800 sucked compared to the SMS and was a floundering joke against the NES as far as what it offered. The SMS was only underrated if you understood what we did not get at retail, but that is fair as most people wouldn't think to look overseas to games that normally would NOT work on a NTSC TV due to being PAL. We have a LOT of info out there now from more places than even are necessary to exist, but back in the early 2000s that little fact probably was largely less obvious if you didn't hang at Sega16, Eidolons Inn and other dedicated spaces. Pound for pound the SMS library was loaded with so much crap in the US only market it was just tragic against the NES which was no slouch in shoveling turds too but due to quantity had so much more going right both 1st and 3rd party. Had Sega put the full PAL lineup here, I think it would have been them still in second, but a much stronger one. Even they realized it far too late rebadging 5-6 solid UK releases with US barcode stickers because those titles were just that too good to miss.

[celerystalker]

You know, for years I've been hearing about the vaunted Brazilian and European MasterSystem lineup, and it's frankly just not there. Yeah, there are quite a few exclusives, but this isn't some stash of Phantasy Stars and Castlevanias. It's Game Gear ports, hacks to change games like Wonder Boy to popular Brazilian characters like Monica and Xule, and interesting ambitious but failed attempts to port arcade games like Street Fighter II, Mortal Kombat 3, Virtua Fighter, and Golden Axe to a system that just couldn't handle it. Yes, there is a sloppy Streets of Rage that is choppy and only supports one player (like Golden Axe), and yes, Sonic's conversions are about as good as their Game Gear counterparts. Battle Outrun is a nice idea, but it doesn't run well. I mean, I had a little fun with games like Speedball from Bitmap Brothers, but it's nothing special.

Believe me, I want there to be more, better games out there. If there are, please, tell me, because I'd love to have something new worth hunting for. I want the Master System versions of Alien Syndrome and Alien Storm to be awesome, but they aren't. I don't want the Master System to be as lacking as it is to me. I'm just a little disinclined to buy repackaged Game Gear games. Baku Baku's always been a Saturn game to me, but the SMS version is a Game Gear port. Most of the Sonics-Game Gear ports. X-men? Game Gear. Little Mermaid? Mickey's games? Bonkers? Game Gear ports. These all came out late in the '90s after the NES had long since retired.

The thing with Tec Toy... They weren't these wizards putting out gem upon gem and making waves. What they did was closer to what Majesco tried to do in the late '90s in the States: put out dated hardware and software at a budget price, marketed at low-income consumers. Brazil's economy has been for the longest time horribly divided into the super-rich and poverty with little in between on a national scale. In 1997, they weren't buying Playstations. That is the year that Virtua Fighter came out. 1997. The Genesis had come and gone by then, and the Saturn was dying. We were buying Nintendo 64s and Playstations. They were getting Master System games still, and Virtua Fighter wasn't the last one, and it's a bad port of a bad Game Gear game based on a bad cartoon based on a good Arcade game.

I don't mean to be overly aggressive in comparing systems, but as it is what the topic is about, I want to get to the bottom of it. I love 'em both, but I just can't believe some of the stuff I've read trying to make it seem like there is more to this comparison than there is.

So, please, and I mean this in earnest and not condescent, let me know what I'm missing, because my spending, ordering, and research has left me scratching my head, but I keep hearing about the brilliant overseas games. What are they? Power Strike II looks pretty good... Please don't say Mickey's Ultimate Challenge.

[Koa Zo]

I enjoy playing my Master System. I enjoy playing my NES.
Looks like I win this "vs." battle!

[Tanooki]

Celery I think you're being a bit overly hard on the 'vaunted' Brazilian and UK marketed games. You're correct though it's mostly just ported Game Gear and a few Genesis games too, but they're very well done games despite that and do add missing variety and quality depth to the system. I know stuff like the rebadged Brazilian mascots onto other games are junk and that SF2 is barely if at all passable, but they did have some solid games they only got just as the UK market did too. The largest issue with the market down south though, the stuff they uniquely got people have been scamming hard on the prices and it's just not there in quality, but if you could get them for a flatter to reality price with your normal UK or even US SMS releases they're good. Dynamite Headdy, Battletoads and some others were solid works down there. The UK though I think really brought it with the Genesis ports of the first two Streets of Rage games and then the other stuff like the Castlevania clone(forget name and I owned it), the Mickey 'Illusion' title, the Donkey Duck game, the 2 Sonic GG conversions, Strider, Golden Axe Warrior, and the rest. Sure they're not really 'something special' but if you're a SMS owner they are whether you agree or not. Sure they came out far too late to matter as these were like SNES/Genesis era conversions but it kept that old system alive in areas outside the US.

There isn't more comparison really on how the SMS is better, it wasn't, but they did have a lot of variety to choose from if you could get outside of what the US was sadly only given.

[celerystalker]

I may be being a little tough on the system, but I do really enjoy it. I've bought a lot of those exclusives, though, and at the time there wasn't as much info readily available, so I was super let down to find out I already had a lot of them on my Game Gear. I really did kinda secretly hope maybe you or 7th Lutz knew something I didn't though, I wasn't just trying to be a jerk. It's been years since I bought anything new to play on Master System, and I kinda miss the days when it felt like a new frontier to me. I do think that the Brazilian games are really over-hyped, though. They're almost all games readily available for a couple bucks a piece domestically on Game Gear, but fans tend to misrepresent them as exclusives, and that's where I take exception. I think potential buyers need to know what they're getting into, because a lot of these go for upwards of $100 anymore at auction.

Side note, though, I'd like to try a Castlevania clone on SMS. The only one I'm familiar with is Kenseiden, though I've heard a few people make the comparison with Lord of the Sword and Spellcaster.

Anyhow, sorry if I rubbed anyone the wrong way, there. I do think the quality of the overseas library is somewhat of a myth, but I don't mean to be rude about it.